Kolb-List Digest Archive

Sun 05/10/09


Total Messages Posted: 18



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 08:24 AM - Generac V-twin questions for Jimmy (2danglico)
     2. 01:04 PM - Monument Valley Video Clip (John Hauck)
     3. 03:12 PM - MV (russ kinne)
     4. 03:27 PM - Re: MV (John Hauck)
     5. 03:34 PM - Fw: MV (russ kinne)
     6. 04:36 PM - The further adventures of HKS Firestar (Larry Cottrell)
     7. 05:02 PM - Re: MV (Dave Rains)
     8. 05:44 PM - Need Rotax 912 (mark rinehart)
     9. 05:53 PM - Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar (russ kinne)
    10. 06:08 PM - Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar (John Hauck)
    11. 06:17 PM - Re: Need Rotax 912 ()
    12. 06:18 PM - Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar (frank.goodnight)
    13. 06:34 PM - Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar (frank.goodnight)
    14. 07:38 PM - Re: MV (b young)
    15. 07:49 PM - Re: MV (John Hauck)
    16. 07:52 PM - Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar (Larry Cottrell)
    17. 09:02 PM - Which Monument valley? (Ron)
    18. 10:39 PM - Re: Which Monument valley? (John Bickham)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 08:24:58 AM PST US
    Subject: Generac V-twin questions for Jimmy
    From: "2danglico" <john.tempest@basf.com>
    Jimmy, I have been reading your previous posts regarding your 4-stroke endeavor with great interest. I fly a Firestar 1 with a 447. I have two Culver props (climb and cruise) that Larry and Gene sold and service, so I know the guys at Valley Eng, and they do enjoy my trust and confidence. I was reading about you experimenting with a prop swap. You posted that the larger wood prop that Valley supplied gave alot more static thrust than the IVO and you were optimistic about improved flight performance. But I couldn't find a post regarding your impressions of the big wood prop in flight. Are you still using the big prop or did you go back to the IVO? Did the higher static thrust translate to better climb performance? Sorry if you have already addressed these things and I missed them. Also thanks for posting all the info and data on your engine swap. John Tempest Firestar 1 447 Future V-twin flyer? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243391#243391


    Message 2


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    Time: 01:04:37 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Monument Valley Video Clip
    Here is a good video clip of Monument Valley. Although a Kolb was not the camera platform, it will give those of you who have not flown in the valley a good idea of what it looks like. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPAM10V8rkE&feature=channel_page john h mkIII


    Message 3


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    Time: 03:12:17 PM PST US
    From: russ kinne <russ@rkiphoto.com>
    Subject: MV
    SAFE TO READ -- REQUIRES NO ANSWER John Have a ball at MV. I know you will. Fair winds, happy days, happier nights Russ


    Message 4


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    Time: 03:27:50 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: MV
    > John > Have a ball at MV. I know you will. > Fair winds, happy days, happier nights > Russ Thanks. We are all looking forward to a great little flyin. Arizona Dave and John Williamson won't be there in body, but I think I can count on them being present in spirit. Both were charter members of a very select group of enthusiasts that love to build, fly, and share our experiences with Homer Kolb's little airplanes. We'll also miss Bill Herren, who was lucky enough to fulfill his dream of flying his airplane over a lot of the lower 48. I encourage everyone that has a true interest in Kolbs to make the effort to join us. Come as you are: fly, drive, or walk. john h mkIII - One day and a wake up!


    Message 5


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    Time: 03:34:50 PM PST US
    From: russ kinne <russ@rkiphoto.com>
    Subject: MV
    Sorry, list but I screwed up. That msg was meant for John, not the List My apologies Russ


    Message 6


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    Time: 04:36:37 PM PST US
    From: "Larry Cottrell" <lcottrell@fmtcblue.com>
    Subject: The further adventures of HKS Firestar
    Well it appears that I finally have a handle on my heating problems with the HKS. If you remember I put some shrouds? over the cylinders to pull and route some more air to the heads. This resulted in a reduction of about 20 to 30 degrees which was great, but the OAT was 40 degrees at the time. The weather finally warmed up to the mid to low 70's and I was back up bumping max CHT's temps with any rpm's that were significant enough to keep me clear of the sage. The problem was that the muffler and oil cooler were mounted on top of the tube above the wing and was blocking a lot of air flow. The carbs are mounted just behind them so the air was really screwed up coming around all that crap in front of the cylinders. The oil cooler had at least half of its surface blocked by my little shorty gap seal. With all that stuff up there, and all the oil hoses running everywhere, I just cut off the gap seal even with the oil cooler. You can see what a tortured route the air has to go through to get to the cylinder heads. This is what it looks like with the cooler moved. You can see where the gap seal ended. With the rerouting of the oil hoses this time I made sure that they were as close to the root tube as I could get them and I added some lexan to enclose as much of that area as I could. I ended up with two pieces since I still had to allow for the muffler stand, but I got most of it covered up. I had noticed when I first flew it after installing the HKS that I had lost about 5 MPH on my stall speed. (yes I do have VG's) It went from about 29-31 MPH to 36-39 MPH. I knew that I had added weight and that was what I had attributed the loss to. Well after I moved the oil cooler I took it for a test flight with the old gap seal in it. (test one thing at a time) The OAT was 71 degrees. This was my EIS reading at (I am guessing since my RPM's weren't working due to a loose wire) 53-5400 rpms. (top line RPM-left EGT-Right EGT. Bottom line- Oil temp-oil pressure-left CHT-Right Cht) The last time I flew over this same spot at this same OAT temp. I was bumping max CHT. I never got within 30 degrees of max with the oil cooler moved. OK, back on the ground and I start working on the gap seal and take off again after installing it. Now the weather had changed and the wind had come up. The air was pretty bumpy with the thermals and I was getting good climb in the 6-700 FPM range. 350 was about the best I could do with the 503. I decided to do some stalls to see if there was any difference. I was back down to 31-32 MPH and my max CHT was 271. I had fixed the wire to the rpm's and found that I was actually able to fly at 4900 RPM's, which I had not been able to do before. As I say the air was bumpy and very squirrelly, so I am not going to draw any hard and fast conclusions other than CHT temps until I get a chance to test it on a calmer day. However it does appear that installing the rest of the gap seal has improved my performance significantly as well as lowering my temps. This eases my mind significantly, as it get really hot here and with my prior set up would be limited as to when I could fly. I still only have 26 hours on the engine so when it breaks in, it may lower more still. Larry C Firestar II 467 hours see you in MV- Driving!


    Message 7


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    Time: 05:02:07 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: MV
    From: "Dave Rains" <RangeFlyer72@yahoo.com>
    Due to a forced auto rotation today, I will not be arriving with my helo, no, no injuries or damage. I will be flying in my C175 and will make it available for flights around the monuments, beer runs to Page, flying local Navajo kids etc. Looking forward to seeing the gang. Dave -------- Dave Rains N8086T Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243453#243453


    Message 8


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    Time: 05:44:39 PM PST US
    From: mark rinehart <capt_riney@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Need Rotax 912
    I'm looking for a low time Rotax 912UL or ULS for my Kolb MarkIII project. I'm also watching Barnstormers.com. If you have a Rotax 912 for sale or know someone who might please let me know. Thanks. Mark Rinehart


    Message 9


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    Time: 05:53:21 PM PST US
    From: russ kinne <russ@rkiphoto.com>
    Subject: Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar
    Larry Do I read oil temp as 151F? Isn't that still too high? Russ Kinne


    Message 10


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    Time: 06:08:32 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar
    Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne <russ@rkiphoto.com> > > Larry > Do I read oil temp as 151F? > Isn't that still too high? > Russ Kinne I can't reply for Larry C and his HKS, but just for info the minimum oil temp on the 912 series engines is 190F. Reason: To burn off condensation and contaminents. My oil temp normally runs 230F and as high as 250F during long full throttle climb outs. Red line is 285F for 912UL. 266F for 912ULS. john h mkIII


    Message 11


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    Time: 06:17:03 PM PST US
    From: <apilot@surewest.net>
    Subject: Re: Need Rotax 912
    I know a fellow who has one and may want to sell it. Call me for info. Vic Gibson Sacramento area 916, 722-9692 NOTE: I fly a Kolb Mark III Classic with a Geo Metro Suzuki G10 engine.


    Message 12


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    Time: 06:18:49 PM PST US
    From: "frank.goodnight" <frank.goodnight@att.net>
    Subject: Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar
    Larry, Glad to hear you have fixed your heat problems. I don't use any type of air scoop and use the cloth gap seal that came with my kit. My oil cooler is mounted just below the root tube.My temps are in line with what you are now finding even on a 100 degree day. I just don't have temp problems ,cht-egt-or oil.I do like the looks of where you mounted your oil cooler I may change mine just because it cleans up the front end so nice. I did find that my engine started to run better at about 50 hrs , a really noticable differance. I do fly from sea level fields, and don't know to expect when I fly from a 5000 ft field. nothing bad I hope! see You at M.V. I will be trailering in. You sure did post some good photos. Frank Goodnight Firestar 2 HKS On May 10, 2009, at 6:29 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote: > Well it appears that I finally have a handle on my heating problems > with the HKS. If you remember I put some shrouds? over the cylinders > to pull and route some more air to the heads. This resulted in a > reduction of about 20 to 30 degrees which was great, but the OAT was > 40 degrees at the time. The weather finally warmed up to the mid to > low 70's and I was back up bumping max CHT's temps with any rpm's > that were significant enough to keep me clear of the sage. > > The problem was that the muffler and oil cooler were mounted on top > of the tube above the wing and was blocking a lot of air flow. The > carbs are mounted just behind them so the air was really screwed up > coming around all that crap in front of the cylinders. The oil > cooler had at least half of its surface blocked by my little shorty > gap seal. With all that stuff up there, and all the oil hoses > running everywhere, I just cut off the gap seal even with the oil > cooler. > <DSCF0606 (2).JPG> > > You can see what a tortured route the air has to go through to get > to the cylinder heads. > > This is what it looks like with the cooler moved. > <DSCF0663 oil cooler.jpg> > > You can see where the gap seal ended. With the rerouting of the oil > hoses this time I made sure that they were as close to the root tube > as I could get them and I added some lexan to enclose as much of > that area as I could. I ended up with two pieces since I still had > to allow for the muffler stand, but I got most of it covered up. > > <DSCF0669.JPG> > > I had noticed when I first flew it after installing the HKS that I > had lost about 5 MPH on my stall speed. (yes I do have VG's) It went > from about 29-31 MPH to 36-39 MPH. I knew that I had added weight > and that was what I had attributed the loss to. Well after I moved > the oil cooler I took it for a test flight with the old gap seal in > it. (test one thing at a time) The OAT was 71 degrees. > <DSCF0668.JPG> > > This was my EIS reading at (I am guessing since my RPM's weren't > working due to a loose wire) 53-5400 rpms. (top line RPM-left EGT- > Right EGT. Bottom line- Oil temp-oil pressure-left CHT-Right Cht) > The last time I flew over this same spot at this same OAT temp. I > was bumping max CHT. I never got within 30 degrees of max with the > oil cooler moved. > > OK, back on the ground and I start working on the gap seal and take > off again after installing it. Now the weather had changed and the > wind had come up. The air was pretty bumpy with the thermals and I > was getting good climb in the 6-700 FPM range. 350 was about the > best I could do with the 503. I decided to do some stalls to see if > there was any difference. I was back down to 31-32 MPH and my max > CHT was 271. I had fixed the wire to the rpm's and found that I was > actually able to fly at 4900 RPM's, which I had not been able to do > before. As I say the air was bumpy and very squirrelly, so I am not > going to draw any hard and fast conclusions other than CHT temps > until I get a chance to test it on a calmer day. However it does > appear that installing the rest of the gap seal has improved my > performance significantly as well as lowering my temps. > > This eases my mind significantly, as it get really hot here and with > my prior set up would be limited as to when I could fly. I still > only have 26 hours on the engine so when it breaks in, it may lower > more still. > > Larry C > Firestar II 467 hours > see you in MV- Driving! >


    Message 13


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    Time: 06:34:50 PM PST US
    From: "frank.goodnight" <frank.goodnight@att.net>
    Subject: Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar
    Hi Russ, The HKS ops manual says max oil temp is 230F for 5w30. Frank Goodnight HKS Firestar2 On May 10, 2009, at 7:53 PM, russ kinne wrote: > > Larry > Do I read oil temp as 151F? > Isn't that still too high? > Russ Kinne > >


    Message 14


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    Time: 07:38:37 PM PST US
    From: "b young" <by0ung@brigham.net>
    Subject: MV
    I encourage everyone that has a true interest in Kolbs to make the effort to join us. Come as you are: fly, drive, or walk. john h mkIII - One day and a wake up! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't think I would encourage walking,,, long way between watering holes. Boyd Do not archive.


    Message 15


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    Time: 07:49:31 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: MV
    > Don't think I would encourage walking,,, long way between watering holes. > > Boyd Yep! You're right. It is a long ways between watering holes. Course, I never had to walk it. Hope I don't. A lot easier in the Kolb. john h mkIII


    Message 16


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    Time: 07:52:22 PM PST US
    From: "Larry Cottrell" <lcottrell@fmtcblue.com>
    Subject: Re: The further adventures of HKS Firestar
    Yes the oil temps are a bit low, but I am sure they will come up when summer gets here. I may tape the cooler until then. We had one of those really strange days here in that the wind actually died down instead of the normal increase in wind as the day goes along. I rolled Dart back out of the hanger and departed Crooked Creek Itl, at about 6:45 or 1845 for John Hauck, and for a change the air was nice, I was flying in a tee shirt and it felt nice. The OAT was 73 degrees. I am still having intermittent trouble with my RPM's so I flew the first part of the flight at 70 MPH,(GPS) which should have been about 5400, and the temps stayed down to about 284. I stayed low this evening since the wind was so stable. After checking the ranch next door at the pot hole field, (cows get stuck in the potholes, so I check it for them every time I fly) I headed for the Owyhee River, just following my nose. I first took a trip down Crooked Creek where it goes into a small canyon about 50 feet deep, flying just above the sage and under the rim. The turns are steep enough to be pretty exciting. Then I then had a race with a Motor cycle on the Hwy, he lost! I reaffirmed that at full throttle I can exceed max speed. Still down on the deck went through all the pinnacles and pillars at Rome checking for hawks and falcons, finding two. Next was the River Canyon. There was a bunch of rafters camped on the river at a sandy spot down in the canyon. My next job was to check the posibility of landing at one of my fishing holes. I would have to thread my way down a small canyon, make a sharp left turn, chop the power dropping onto the two track road in the sage. There is plenty of room to land and stop, but take off would entail threading my way down a deep canyon to climb out the 700 or so feet to get on the plateau. Beside having to grub out a large amount of sage to get enough room for a runway, not too sure I want to do the canyon climb on a hot summer day. Not to mention the fact that the BLM would not be happy if they caught me. My RPM's had come back up and were reading steady enough and matching closely enough with airspeed and ground speed for me to believe them. On the climb out at full throttle max CHT's was 324 and I pushed it for the full three minutes that HKS recomends as max. After I crested the plateau, I cut it back to 5360 and was showing 68 MPH. I flew for one hour and 4 minutes and burned 2.6 gallons of fuel. Happy at last Larry C


    Message 17


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    Time: 09:02:59 PM PST US
    From: Ron <captainron1@cox.net>
    Subject: Which Monument valley?
    There are 3 Monument valleys that Google Earth shows, two are in Arizona close to me and one is in Utah. Can someone tell me where is the Fly-In? If its in AZ then I can get there easy with my Beech Sierra. Now if the question is silly for whatever reason I apologize in advance. I always thought it was in Utah but now I ain't sure, after seeing the video that John linked us to.


    Message 18


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    Time: 10:39:57 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Which Monument valley?
    From: "John Bickham" <gearbender@bellsouth.net>
    Captain Ron, This answer is both. The airport is at Goulding's Trading Post which has its own runway. There is a hotel, camping area, restaurant, resort, and gas/covenience store. Identifier is UT25. Goulding's is located just north of the state line. You cross the the main highway to the access road to the actual MV entrance. You cross into Arizona on the access road. See if this link works: http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=109382781684764239070.00046888291f1d812053d&ll=34.705493,-97.646484&spn=13.115717,28.476562&t=h&z=6 http://www.airnav.com/airport/UT25 Note: land to south, TO to north (up against butte) Been there by car. This will be first time by air. Excited! Hope this is helpful. -------- Thanks too much, John Bickham Mark III-C w/ 912UL St. Francisville, LA Landing a plane and being married - a few smooth moments mixed with a lot of rough ones. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=243499#243499




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