---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 08/26/09: 63 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:06 AM - Re: Wingtips (dalewhelan) 2. 03:17 AM - Re: Message to Matt (planecrazzzy) 3. 03:31 AM - Re: Just plain ol' Waycross (planecrazzzy) 4. 04:24 AM - Re: Firestar questions (frank.goodnight) 5. 05:06 AM - Re: Wingtips (Thom Riddle) 6. 05:13 AM - Re: Sunday breakfast (Thom Riddle) 7. 05:18 AM - Re: Sunday breakfast (Thom Riddle) 8. 05:18 AM - Re: Sunday breakfast (Thom Riddle) 9. 06:59 AM - Re: Re: Sunday breakfast (zeprep251@aol.com) 10. 07:04 AM - Re: Sunday breakfast (Thom Riddle) 11. 07:21 AM - Fw: Photo (zeprep251@aol.com) 12. 07:38 AM - Re: Wingtips (JetPilot) 13. 07:39 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (Jack B. Hart) 14. 07:48 AM - Re: Wingtips (Thom Riddle) 15. 07:51 AM - Re: Wingtips (Thom Riddle) 16. 07:58 AM - Re: Wingtips (JetPilot) 17. 08:08 AM - Re: Re: Message to Matt (Richard Girard) 18. 08:16 AM - Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List (JetPilot) 19. 08:18 AM - Re: Re: Message to Matt (robert bean) 20. 08:30 AM - Re: Wingtips (Thom Riddle) 21. 08:51 AM - Wingtips RE Jack's posting of NACA 140 (Richard Girard) 22. 09:09 AM - Re: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List (Jim Hauck) 23. 09:12 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (pj.ladd) 24. 09:22 AM - Peace hat (Jim Hauck) 25. 09:32 AM - PLEASE STOP!! (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 26. 09:37 AM - World's cheapest static port (Richard Girard) 27. 09:37 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (Dana Hague) 28. 09:47 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Filter Failure (pj.ladd) 29. 09:54 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Filter Failure (pj.ladd) 30. 10:14 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Filter Failure (Robert Laird) 31. 10:22 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (Jack B. Hart) 32. 10:39 AM - Making a working static port (Richard Girard) 33. 10:40 AM - Re: Wingtips (Richard Pike) 34. 11:09 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (Jack B. Hart) 35. 11:23 AM - Re: PLEASE STOP!! (daniel myers) 36. 11:27 AM - Re: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List (JetPilot) 37. 11:53 AM - Re: PLEASE STOP!! (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 38. 11:53 AM - Re: The crazy guy is retiring from The List... (Blumax008@aol.com) 39. 12:08 PM - Re: Re: First Flight follow-up, (Eugene Zimmerman) 40. 12:22 PM - Mark III Value (Kirby, Dennis CTR USAF AFMC MDA/AL) 41. 01:10 PM - Re: Re: Sunday breakfast (zeprep251@aol.com) 42. 01:14 PM - Re: Re: Sunday breakfast (zeprep251@aol.com) 43. 01:16 PM - Re: Re: Sunday breakfast (zeprep251@aol.com) 44. 01:29 PM - Re: Sunday breakfast (Thom Riddle) 45. 02:09 PM - Re: Re: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List (russ kinne) 46. 02:36 PM - Re: Re: Sunday breakfast (zeprep251@aol.com) 47. 02:48 PM - Re: Re: First Flight follow-up, (Dana Hague) 48. 02:51 PM - Re: Firestar questions (Dana Hague) 49. 03:21 PM - Re: Re: Fuel Filter Failure (zeprep251@aol.com) 50. 03:22 PM - Re: Re: Sunday breakfast (Richard Girard) 51. 03:38 PM - Re: Firestar questions (Richard Girard) 52. 04:05 PM - Carb Tuning (John Hauck) 53. 04:36 PM - Re: Carb Tuning (Richard Girard) 54. 05:20 PM - Warp props and Rotax 582 (mark rinehart) 55. 06:37 PM - Re: Warp props and Rotax 582 (Richard Girard) 56. 07:04 PM - Re: Carb Tuning (dalewhelan) 57. 07:10 PM - Re: Warp props and Rotax 582 (Ellery Batchelder Jr) 58. 07:50 PM - Re: Warp props and Rotax 582 (Gary) 59. 07:50 PM - Re: Warp props and Rotax 582 (Gary) 60. 08:20 PM - Re: Warp props and Rotax 582 (Larry Cottrell) 61. 08:44 PM - Re: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List (DAquaNut@aol.com) 62. 08:54 PM - Re: Re: Carb Tuning (robert bean) 63. 10:42 PM - Re: Fw: Photo (albertakolbmk3) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:06:58 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "dalewhelan" Richard Girard was unfortunately correct. A lot of heat but I have not even seen the wing tip designs and was unable to use the link provided. I will look through previous posts. -------- Dale Whelan 503 powered Firestar II Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259652#259652 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:17:22 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Message to Matt From: "planecrazzzy" Hi Charlie, Thanks for your help... I don't read the Kolb list everyday like I used to ( JP ) Now... I'm building a different plane , and I'm busy helping others at that site....( my own ) But I still Fly my Kolb , and I check in.... So I have to sorta "manually" skip over his comments.... But reading "others" .... I see the plague.... and after all this time... it doesn't change... and it runs off some good/decent people , that have VERY GOOD info for the list.... One guy made a comment.... A "November" protest might get results. .. Gotta Fly... Mike & "Jaz" the Flying Dog .. .. .. -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259658#259658 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/jaz__mutt_muffs_009_132.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/hpim0175_173.jpg ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:31:45 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Just plain ol' Waycross From: "planecrazzzy" I saw your plane "more" in the July address... When I clicked on the UTube.... after , there was another clip by those "good ol Boys" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZ4m2qudqvs&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fbtconline%2Enet%2F%7Esportpilot%2Fbums%2Fcake%2Fjuly2009%2Ehtml&feature=player_embedded#t' Your plane was in there alot.... Flying also... .. .. Clean looking plane , very nice. .. .. Gotta Fly... Mike & "Jaz" the Flying Dog .. .. .. -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259659#259659 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:24:18 AM PST US From: "frank.goodnight" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Firestar questions I had a heavy wing on my firestar , and after talking to kolb and Bryan Melborn a fix is to weld up the hole and reposition it up or down in the wing tab. Doing this changes the angle of atack of the wing. It {MAY} be that if you fly the plane you'll find that the hole is where it should be for that particular A/C. Moveing the hole 1/2 the hole width made a difference in the way my plane flys. On Aug 25, 2009, at 7:52 PM, Dana Hague wrote: Good luck Frank Goodnight firestar 2 Brownsville , TX > > At 04:43 PM 8/25/2009, b young wrote: > >> Just food for thought,,,,, drill to the next oversize then weld >> in a >> bushing,,, that would give far more surface area for wear. > > Problem is, one of them is already drilled out larger (3/8 vs 5/16) > and not on center, so it's already too close to the edge of the > fitting. > > My thought is to weld the holes up, then weld plates on over the > originals, and redrill (to the original size) in the proper place. > > -Dana > -- > It's only premarital sex if you're going to get married. > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:06:09 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "Thom Riddle" Richard Pike, Well done! -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259664#259664 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:13:42 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: "Thom Riddle" Gary, Nice photos of a nice Aussie powered Kolb. In the second photo I see something foreward of the engine that is white in color that looks to be a fairing of some sort. Can you tell us what that is? Also noticed your extended exhaust system. That surely gets the carbon off the prop. Have you noticed any other difference with the exhaust extension? -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259665#259665 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:18:18 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: "Thom Riddle" Gary, Nice photos of a nice Aussie powered Kolb. In the second photo I see something foreward of the engine that is white in color that looks to be a fairing of some sort. Can you tell us what that is? Also noticed your extended exhaust system. That surely gets the carbon off the prop. Have you noticed any other difference with the exhaust extension? -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259666#259666 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:18:31 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: "Thom Riddle" Gary, Nice photos of a nice Aussie powered Kolb. In the second photo I see something foreward of the engine that is white in color that looks to be a fairing of some sort. Can you tell us what that is? Also noticed your extended exhaust system. That surely gets the carbon off the prop. Have you noticed any other difference with the exhaust extension? -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259667#259667 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:19 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: zeprep251@aol.com Thom, ?? The fairing covers completely the aft end of the engine enclosing the distributors, coils and the upper half of the carb.It also directs a smooth air flow to the cooling shrouds.I can't take any credit for the design for it was installed when I purchased the Mark from Will Tatham . I will get some pictures that show it's design clearly,for it is easily removed with 3 an3 bolts in less than a minute.I don't beleive it weighs a pound. ??????? The exhaust is strictly home brewed.Noise abatement in the cabin was the motivation for this.That part worked well,no power loss BUT,if you have ever felt the air movement coming out of the cabin end of the fuselage tube, just add exhaust to the mix.Had to make a 4" foam gasket in the tube to keep from getting gassed.The chrome tail pipes are VW and they quiet things down OK but after 150 hrs the baffles are gone and I need to unweld the pipes and replace them. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: Thom Riddle ? Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 8:13 am Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast Gary, Nice photos of a nice Aussie powered Kolb. In the second photo I see something foreward of the engine that is white in color that looks to be a fairing of some sort. Can you tell us what that is? Also noticed your extended exhaust system. That surely gets the carbon off the prop. Have you noticed any other difference with the exhaust extension? -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259665#259665 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:04:31 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: "Thom Riddle" Thanks, G. I'd very much like to see the photos of the fairing. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259679#259679 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:21:38 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Fwd: Photo From: zeprep251@aol.com ? Thom, ? Here is a couple from Geo.Alexander. -----Original Message----- From: George T. Alexander, Jr. Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 8:34 am Subject: Photo Gary: I'm sure you have many, but attached?are a couple of photos?showing your?engine w/cowling that I took at Buchan.? In case you wanted to?share with Riddle/Kolb List. Hope all is well. George Alexander http://gtalexander.home.att.net ? ? ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:38:22 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "JetPilot" Thom Riddle wrote: > Richard Pike, > > Well done! Thom, You have also flip flopped on this issue just to impress your friends in your little clique. Two days ago you posted: Thom Riddle wrote: > I can't say what the Hoerner style wingtips will do for a Kolb wing but can tell you they make a world of difference on a Cherokee 140. Can't tell much difference at high cruise but slow flight lateral control and stability were much improved over the standard Cherokee wingtips. Now you tell Richard Well done for posting bad and false information, and support him in posting some of the worst attacks ever seen on this forum. Very typical of a looser that just goes along with whatever his friends do, the same type of mentality you see with little street punks and their gangs. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259688#259688 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:39:13 AM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips Kolbers, Way back NACA was interested in different wing tip configurations. In a 1923 study, they compared three different wing profiles using three different wing tip rake angles. You can see it at: http://naca.central.cranfield.ac.uk/reports/1923/naca-report-140.pdf In all cases, the lift to drag ratio improved with increased rake angles for low angles of attack with increased tip rake angle. Some of the most up to date work on this subject has been done by http://www.winggrid.ch/ where they make a short fat wing act like a high aspect ratio wing. It would be interesting to see a FireFly with this wing. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:48:26 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "Thom Riddle" MikeBigblow: Wrong again. My "Well done" was for the art work Richard did, which had zero, nothing, zilch, nada to do with the subject of wing tips and EVERYTHING to do with you. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259693#259693 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:51:49 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "Thom Riddle" Jack, Could you check the link you posted http://www.winggrid.ch/ ? When I click on it, it does not go to what I think you meant it to go to. I'm very interested in the study. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259694#259694 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:58:18 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "JetPilot" Thom Riddle wrote: > MikeBigblow: Wrong again. My "Well done" was for the art work Richard did, which had zero, nothing, zilch, nada to do with the subject of wing tips and EVERYTHING to do with you. Lets see, you support Richard posting some of the worst things ever seen on this list, and then you criticize me. Double standards, hypocrisy, call it what you want, what I said about you is true. You are a the type of loser that does not care about right or wrong, or anything except fitting in with you little gang. Typical street punk behavior, you are a very impressive man Thom, I wonder if you teach your kids the same values ? Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259700#259700 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:08:17 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Message to Matt From: Richard Girard Mike, Should you ever decide to write a book, may I suggest a title? "Dog is my Co Pilot". :-) Rick Girard do not archive On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:16 AM, planecrazzzy wrote: > > Hi Charlie, > Thanks for your help... > > I don't read the Kolb list everyday like I used to ( JP ) > > Now... I'm building a different plane , and I'm busy helping others > > at that site....( my own ) But I still Fly my Kolb , and I check in.... > > So I have to sorta "manually" skip over his comments.... > > But reading "others" .... I see the plague.... and after all this time... > > it doesn't change... and it runs off some good/decent people , that > > have VERY GOOD info for the list.... > > One guy made a comment.... A "November" protest might get results. > > > . > Gotta Fly... > Mike & "Jaz" the Flying Dog > . > . > . > > -------- > . > . > . > . > . > Do Not Archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259658#259658 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/jaz__mutt_muffs_009_132.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/hpim0175_173.jpg > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 08:16:27 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List From: "JetPilot" I provide a lot of good and educated information about Kolbs on this forum, and in response I get a lot of questions and comments about what people have done to their planes in email and private messages. One of the most common comments I see is that people want to improve their Kolbs, or have done so, but are afraid to post a report or ask a question that might be deemed " Unpopular " with a certain little group here. They see the constant harassment I get when posting good information about fuel filters, VG's, or any other subject here, always by the same little gang of guys. These guys do a disservice to the Kolb community by offering up one liners with zero factual information, and try to mislead people and attempt to discredit good and factual information I post about Kolbs here. It take a pretty small man that is so threatened by someone else posting good information here, that they need to mislead and distract other members of this forum away from important information about their Kolbs. People do notice the way this small group of guys act, and either directly, or indirectly attack anything I post on this list: JAMESBEARD305(at)msn.com wrote: > > Being a newbie myself, lurking for years, I have not had the experience of being ridiculed, but instead ignored... > For every person that speaks up, there are many more that are driven away from this list by this constant hostile attitude by a small group of guys. The few of you doing this, you are a disservice to this list and to the Kolb community. This little group claims to be " Offended " by some of the things I have said, yet they post the worst things ever seen on this list, both by volume and content. We all know people will do far worse things when in a gang than alone, and we see this street punk gang type mentality in action here. There is no excuse for their behavior, and just because a few of their friends are egging them on does not make it OK. This forum has some of the worst examples of hypocritical behavior and double standards I have ever seen anywhere. Those of you participating in this, you are killing your own forum, and doing a disservice to the the people that come here for safety and other information on how to improve their Kolbs. Putting your own personal vendettas above the posting much safety information here is a disservice to everyone that reads this list. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259706#259706 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 08:18:11 AM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Message to Matt All this time I thought Hannibal Lecter was a fictional character... BB do not archive On 26, Aug 2009, at 11:00 AM, Richard Girard wrote: > Mike, Should you ever decide to write a book, may I suggest a > title? "Dog is my Co Pilot". :-) > > Rick Girard > do not archive > > On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:16 AM, planecrazzzy > wrote: > > > Hi Charlie, > Thanks for your help... > > I don't read the Kolb list everyday like I used to ( JP ) > > Now... I'm building a different plane , and I'm busy helping others > > at that site....( my own ) But I still Fly my Kolb , and I check > in.... > > So I have to sorta "manually" skip over his comments.... > > But reading "others" .... I see the plague.... and after all this > time... > > it doesn't change... and it runs off some good/decent people , that > > have VERY GOOD info for the list.... > > One guy made a comment.... A "November" protest might get results. > > > . > Gotta Fly... > Mike & "Jaz" the Flying Dog > . > . > . > > -------- > . > . > . > . > . > Do Not Archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259658#259658 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/jaz__mutt_muffs_009_132.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/hpim0175_173.jpg > > > ========== > arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > ========== > http://forums.matronics.com > ========== > le, List Admin. > ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ========== > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:30:25 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "Thom Riddle" OK Mike, you win. Through your extreme powers of persuasion, I finally must admit that each and EVERYONE else on the list is a scum bag. Only YOU are worth anything at all. I now see the error of my ways. I shall go into rehabilitation, if YOU think that there is any chance at all for me. If you do please advise me where to get the help I need, for it is obvious that I don't have the mental capacity to figure it our for myself. If YOU don't think I have any chance at all, please advise me of that too. That way I will no beyond a shadow of a doubt because the great one has said it is so. Until then, bite me. El Fin -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259711#259711 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 08:51:55 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Wingtips RE Jack's posting of NACA 140 From: Richard Girard Thanks for the post Jack. What is old will become new. http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2002/photorelease/q4/pr_021001h.html Rick Girard do not archive ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 09:09:25 AM PST US From: "Jim Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List Mrs. Jet Pilot; Please give Lil Mike his pacifier so he will shut the hell up. Jim Hauck Do not archive ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 09:12:03 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips Lets see, you support Richard posting some of the worst things ever seen on this list, and then you criticize me. Double >> C`mon you guys. Cool it. One of the drawbacks of e-mail is that you can make an instant response. I have found over the years that when I am in a real rage over something (which is pretty regularly)it is a great thing to write a letter venting my spleen on the cause of my anger. You then keep it until the next morning. Tear it up, write a reasoned reply. This achieves two things. One) It gets all your anger out of your system. two) It enables you to refute, with reasoned argument, whatever has upset you. We are all on the same side here. There are no enemies, there are just things on which we disagree. Thats life, no need to go ballistic. Cheers Pat (with peacemaker hat on) ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 09:22:11 AM PST US From: "Jim Hauck" Subject: Kolb-List: Peace hat Dang Pat; The last time you Brits brokered a peace we ended up in WWII, so put the peace hat back in the closet:) Jim H ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 09:32:14 AM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Kolb-List: PLEASE STOP!! OK OK OK This has gone on way too long. Please stop it right now. If you have something useful to say PLEASE do so now. A couple of people have introduced web sites that have given us some good information. If there are other sites that refute that information PLEASE post them. Responding with personal attacks is not a way to get your message across. If you really want to win a argument give us facts backed up with documentation. Have you ever noticed the people that are the least right are the loudest and most forceful. We all know that some people blow with little provocation so why push their buttons. If you must attack do it elsewhere. Take it off list, back copy what ever just don't do it here. There maybe one more to blame but there is enough blame to go around so all of you just stop. Please we don't want Matt to have to become your mothers. Let Matt do his job. ONE LAST THING........ Do not archive Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIC ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thom Riddle" Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 11:30 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips > > OK Mike, you win. > > Through your extreme powers of persuasion, I finally must admit that each > and EVERYONE else on the list is a scum bag. Only YOU are worth anything > at all. I now see the error of my ways. I shall go into rehabilitation, if > YOU think that there is any chance at all for me. If you do please advise > me where to get the help I need, for it is obvious that I don't have the > mental capacity to figure it our for myself. If YOU don't think I have any > chance at all, please advise me of that too. That way I will no beyond a > shadow of a doubt because the great one has said it is so. Until then, > bite me. > > El Fin > > -------- > Thom Riddle > Buffalo, NY > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > Jabiru 2200A #1574 > Tennessee Prop 64x34 > > A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a > simple system that works. > - John Gaule > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259711#259711 > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 09:37:02 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: World's cheapest static port From: Richard Girard One of the last things I did before hanging the wings again was redo the pitot static system based upon comments from folks here who said the airspeeds I was seeing were rather optimistic. As I was casting about for ways to make static ports I hit upon this idea and it seems to work.Take a 3/16" aluminum pop rivet with 1/8" to 1/4" grip range and pull the ball just part way into the rivet body. Knock out the stem leaving the rivet hollow. Grip in a pair of pliers and drill out with # 30 drill bit. Use an 1/8" aluminum rivet to attach the larger rivet to the inside of the fuselage pod. I had an existing hole about 4" in front of the instrument panel and level with the door strut on my Mk III. so I used it and matched it on the opposite side. Hook up with vinyl hose or primer line via a Tee fitting to the ASI. I made the pitot out of 1/4" tubing poked straight out of the nose cone about 2" and then made a removable extension about 8" long attached with 1/4" ID fuel line. I learned the hard way that the fat lady who hasn't seen her shoes while standing in years will not see a low mounted pitot tube, either. :-) It seems to work and the numbers I get are in line with the factory quoted stall speed and those that others have quoted here for a 582 powered Mk III. Rick Girard ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 09:37:37 AM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips At 11:43 AM 8/26/2009, Jack B. Hart wrote: > >Way back NACA was interested in different wing tip configurations. In a >1923 study, they compared three different wing profiles using three >different wing tip rake angles.... >In all cases, the lift to drag ratio improved with increased rake angles.. Interesting Jack, kind of like the "power tip" mod you made to your propeller (as did I on one of my paramotors). >Some of the most up to date work on this subject has been done by >http://www.winggrid.ch/ ... Bad link. -Dana -- New Yorkers like to boast that if you can survive in New York, you can survive anywhere. But if you can survive anywhere, why live in New York? ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 09:47:04 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fuel Filter Failure Even 50 klicks on a tiny, narrow English country road can be hair-raising!>> Hi Robert, I guess you just have to be born here. I can remember Yank convoys driving round here during the war. They knocked down more miles of wall than you would believe. Some of it had been on the edge of falling down for a couple of hundred years. The army only had to drive by and they suddenly fell . Farmers were rebuilding walls on the insurance pay out for years. Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 09:54:44 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fuel Filter Failure You forgot to mention the cell phone...Mike...unbelievable the number of idiots on the road with them stuck in their ears while driving.. Hi Herb, Is driving while using the phone illegal in the US? It is here, but it doesn`t seem to make much difference. I don`t believe that the `hands free` system should be allowed either. No matter how easy it is supposed to be, it IS distracting. Fancy being killed just because some guy is so important that he must be in constant touch. Cant be very difficult to design a phone that shuts down when the ignition is turned on. Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 10:14:10 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fuel Filter Failure From: Robert Laird [Sorry: off-topic; delete now] A couple of decades ago, I visited England and Scotland. The small town we stayed in, in Scotland, was Lockerbie, before the big jet came crashing down on it, and became known to the world. As I struggled to find the country manor -- this is also pre-GPS -- the roads got narrower, and narrower, and then the grass or grain or whatever it was in the fields got taller and taller. After 30 minutes of getting closer and closer to the manor we were looking for, I ended up having to stand on top of the car to see where it was. I swear to you, the road was only barely wider than that tiny car, and the grass was definitely taller. So, I do have a tiny bit of experience of which I speak! :-) BTW, despite what you may think, I consider this an endearing quality and memorable experience, so there's no disrespect at all! -- Robert [do not archive] On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 11:41 AM, pj.ladd wrote: > Even 50 klicks on a tiny, narrow English country road can be > hair-raising!>> > > Hi Robert, > I guess you just have to be born here. > > I can remember Yank convoys driving round here during the war. They knocked > down more miles of wall than you would believe. > Some of it had been on the edge of falling down for a couple of hundred > years. The army only had to drive by and they suddenly fell . Farmers were > rebuilding walls on the insurance pay out for years. > > Cheers > > Pat > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 10:22:10 AM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips May be we should ask Matt to start a "bitchlist" where anyone could go to vent their spleen. Just a thought, as it may help to keep the kolblist on target. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 10:39:03 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Making a working static port From: Richard Girard It won't work worth a darn if you don't drill an .05" hole in the mandrel of the 1/8" after it's pulled. THEN install the line. Sorry about that. Rick ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 10:40:02 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: "Richard Pike" Quote: jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2009 6:39 am Post subject: Wingtips Reply with quote Kolbers, Way back NACA was interested in different wing tip configurations. In a 1923 study, they compared three different wing profiles using three different wing tip rake angles. You can see it at: http://naca.central.cranfield.ac.uk/reports/1923/naca-report-140.pdf In all cases, the lift to drag ratio improved with increased rake angles for low angles of attack with increased tip rake angle. Some of the most up to date work on this subject has been done by http://www.winggrid.ch/ where they make a short fat wing act like a high aspect ratio wing. It would be interesting to see a FireFly with this wing. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ********************************************** Really interesting article on that first link Jack, my old Maxair Hummer had that sort of wingtips, don't know how much difference they made in how it flew, but it did fly quite well. Could you resubmit that second link? It's not working. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259746#259746 ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 11:09:52 AM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips At 07:51 AM 8/26/09 -0700, you wrote: > >Jack, > >Could you check the link you posted http://www.winggrid.ch/ ? When I click on it, it does not go to what I think you meant it to go to. I'm very interested in the study. > >-------- Thom, I apologize for shooting a blank. I copied a jump out of my bookmarks without checking it. After googling I found that most references seem to have disappeared from the web. It may be due to copyright due to the fact that NASA partially funded the research. The jump that I found was: http://www.allstar.fiu.edu/aero/winggrid6.html The following is a table reproduced from the jump. It indicates that if this technique is applied to light aircraft there will be a significant reduction in induced drag possible. Aircraft Aspect Induced % wing Reduction Total drag type ratio drag % span with of induced reduction geom. of total WING-GRID drag DC-9-80 9.62 30% 5% 10% 3% by retrofit elliptic wing Maule 6.2 50% 5% 50% 25% by retrofit MXT-7-180 rectangular wing UL-plane 6 60% 20% 70% 42% by retrofit estimate rectangular wing By the way, this is just not theory, aircraft are flying using this technology. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 11:23:30 AM PST US From: daniel myers Subject: RE: Kolb-List: PLEASE STOP!! How do I get off this list? I don't even have a Kolb anymore and I'm sick o f getting 40 emails perday from a bunch of old grumpy men... Daniel Myers age 19 SeaRey N790AJ flown home last week from illinois...1150miles > From: NeilsenRM@comcast.net > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kolb-List: PLEASE STOP!! > Date: Wed=2C 26 Aug 2009 12:28:38 -0400 > mcast.net> > > OK OK OK > > This has gone on way too long. Please stop it right now. > > If you have something useful to say PLEASE do so now. > > A couple of people have introduced web sites that have given us some good > information. If there are other sites that refute that information PLEASE > post them. Responding with personal attacks is not a way to get your mess age > across. If you really want to win a argument give us facts backed up with > documentation. > > Have you ever noticed the people that are the least right are the loudest > and most forceful. > > We all know that some people blow with little provocation so why push the ir > buttons. If you must attack do it elsewhere. Take it off list=2C back cop y > what ever just don't do it here. There maybe one more to blame but there is > enough blame to go around so all of you just stop. > > Please we don't want Matt to have to become your mothers. Let Matt do his > job. > > ONE LAST THING........ Do not archive > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW powered MKIIIC > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Thom Riddle" > To: > Sent: Wednesday=2C August 26=2C 2009 11:30 AM > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips > > > > > > OK Mike=2C you win. > > > > Through your extreme powers of persuasion=2C I finally must admit that each > > and EVERYONE else on the list is a scum bag. Only YOU are worth anythin g > > at all. I now see the error of my ways. I shall go into rehabilitation =2C if > > YOU think that there is any chance at all for me. If you do please advi se > > me where to get the help I need=2C for it is obvious that I don't have the > > mental capacity to figure it our for myself. If YOU don't think I have any > > chance at all=2C please advise me of that too. That way I will no beyon d a > > shadow of a doubt because the great one has said it is so. Until then =2C > > bite me. > > > > El Fin > > > > -------- > > Thom Riddle > > Buffalo=2C NY > > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > > Jabiru 2200A #1574 > > Tennessee Prop 64x34 > > > > A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a > > simple system that works. > > - John Gaule > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259711#259711 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get back to school stuff for them and cashback for you. http://www.bing.com/cashback?form=MSHYCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHYC B_BackToSchool_Cashback_BTSCashback_1x1 ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 11:27:26 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List From: "JetPilot" Jim Hauck, Out of respect for your brother John H, who is one of the finest people I have ever met, I have never disrespected you in any way. Your above post was way out of line and uncalled for. Don't even try to excuse your post because you " just want this to stop, " because you have ignored much worse posts from all the others over the past few days, and not said a word. Double standards, and jumping in with the gang don't do much for your credibility. You may feel you are " IN " with the little gang now, comfortable that your little friends are backing you up, but you know better. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259756#259756 ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 11:53:19 AM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: PLEASE STOP!! Dan Congratulations on the searey. Most of us are older but the grumpy seems to be primarily from those closer to your age. Please note the links at the end of each post. Follow the instructions. You need to remove yourself. I would have sent this off list but the address wasn't there. Do not archive Rick Neilsen ----- Original Message ----- From: daniel myers To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 2:20 PM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: PLEASE STOP!! How do I get off this list? I don't even have a Kolb anymore and I'm sick of getting 40 emails perday from a bunch of old grumpy men... Daniel Myers age 19 SeaRey N790AJ flown home last week from illinois...1150miles > From: NeilsenRM@comcast.net > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kolb-List: PLEASE STOP!! > Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:28:38 -0400 > > > OK OK OK > > This has gone on way too long. Please stop it right now. > > If you have something useful to say PLEASE do so now. > > A couple of people have introduced web sites that have given us some good > information. If there are other sites that refute that information PLEASE > post them. Responding with personal attacks is not a way to get your message > across. If you really want to win a argument give us facts backed up with > documentation. > > Have you ever noticed the people that are the least right are the loudest > and most forceful. > > We all know that some people blow with little provocation so why push their > buttons. If you must attack do it elsewhere. Take it off list, back copy > what ever just don't do it here. There maybe one more to blame but there is > enough blame to go around so all of you just stop. > > Please we don't want Matt to have to become your mothers. Let Matt do his > job. > > ONE LAST THING........ Do not archive > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW powered MKIIIC > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Thom Riddle" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 11:30 AM > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips > > > > > > OK Mike, you win. > > > > Through your extreme powers of persuasion, I finally must admit that each > > and EVERYONE else on the list is a scum bag. Only YOU are worth anything > > at all. I now see the error of my ways. I shall go into rehabilitation, if > > YOU think that there is any chance at all for me. If you do please advise > > me where to get the help I need, for it is obvious that I don't have the > > mental capacity to figure it our for myself. If YOU don't think I have any > > chance at all, please advise me of that too. That way I will no beyond a > > shadow of a doubt because the great one has said it is so. Until then, > > bite me. > > > > El Fin > > > > -------- > > Thom Riddle > > Buffalo, NY > > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > > Jabiru 2200A #1574 > > Tennessee Prop 64x34 > > > > A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a > > simple system that works. > > - John Gaule > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259711#259711 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _============== > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Get back to school stuff for them and cashback for you. Try BingT now. ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 11:53:21 AM PST US From: Blumax008@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: The crazy guy is retiring from The List... This is Bill Catalina of Tallahassee, Florida...actually Ochlockonee Bay but nobody knows where that is. Anywho, I'm sure some if not most (or all) of you will be happy to hear that I am retiring from the list effected as soon as someone tells me how to do it...get off the list that is. I know I cause too much crap with my Old World Ways of doing things, no BRS, no $80 fuel filter, no techy talk, 503 six times beyond recommended overhaul & a myriad of other things you whippersnappers of today...and yesterday...hate to hear. I was just trying to let the new people know that they don't have to spend enough money to launch the Space Shuttle to get into this sport, they don't have to buy $100 fuel filters & they don't have to be an aeronautical engineer. Hell, I flew without any instruments at all for many years...just relied on my eyesight, feeling & hearing & just knowing what things were supposed to sound & feel like. For you Trike riders out there...YES...you can fly with a severely bent keel tube that's been blown over by a storm...not too far I might add but far enough to get you back to your airport. You'll know you've gone too far when your wing ribs start flapping loose & falling out of their pockets...remember where they drop off. KISS...Keep It Simple S----- So long & goodbye Mrs. Calabash...wherever you are! ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 12:08:54 PM PST US From: Eugene Zimmerman Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: First Flight follow-up, On Aug 24, 2009, at 5:29 PM, Jack B. Hart wrote: > Gene, > > Just some thoughts. There a couple of other factors that may help > you. Your > lateral cg is centered and this puts equal load on each wing. Also, > you > engine and propeller combination may weigh less than John's so your > vertical > cg is lower. Both of these factors will promote increased lateral > stability > given equal dihedral. > > > Jack B. Hart FF004 > Winchester, IN Jack, The position of the cg does have a significant effect on roll performance. However on my plane with the modified hoerner type wing tips the cg is significantly lower than on my Mark II. giving it more pendulum effect which works to resist rolling. To roll out of a bank angle with rudder only the hoerner type tips must over power this greater pendulum stability. My Firestar with the hoerner modified tips will pick up a wing with rudder only. On my Mark II will not, But The Mark II does have a noticeably quicker aileron roll response, I believe primarily because the cg is closer to the center of the wing's roll axis. Gene ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 12:22:57 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Mark III Value From: "Kirby, Dennis CTR USAF AFMC MDA/AL" << What price would be fair for my Mark III Classic? It flies great and matches performance of a Rotax 582 with it's Geo Metro G10 engine and electric Ivo 3 blade prop. Vic Gibson >> Vic - As always, the "fair" price is whatever a buyer is willing to pay. (That was no help, I know!) In looking at the prices posted for Kolb Mark-IIIs on Barnstormer's over the past year, I've seen Mark-IIIs listed there, priced from the mid-teens (503-powered), to upper-teens (582-powered), and up to the low-twenties for a few 912-powered ones. Of course, these were asking prices - who knows what the final sale prices ended up at. Perusing Barnstormer's will likely give you the best comparable price references. Good luck - Dennis Kirby Mark-III, 912ul, "Magic Bike" Cedar Crest, NM ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 01:10:17 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: zeprep251@aol.com -----Original Message----- From: Thom Riddle Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 10:04 am Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast Thanks, G. I'd very much like to see the photos of the fairing. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259679#259679 ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 01:14:15 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: zeprep251@aol.com Hope it helps -----Original Message----- From: Thom Riddle Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 10:04 am Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast Thanks, G. I'd very much like to see the photos of the fairing. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259679#259679 ________________________________ Message 43 ____________________________________ Time: 01:16:33 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: zeprep251@aol.com Thom, Attached,3 at a time -----Original Message----- From: Thom Riddle Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 10:04 am Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast Thanks, G. I'd very much like to see the photos of the fairing. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259679#259679 ________________________________ Message 44 ____________________________________ Time: 01:29:27 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: "Thom Riddle" Thanks again. The photos are a great help. That fairing sure cleans up that area nicely. Do you suppose the carb inlet is getting relatively low pressure air aft of the fairing? I know Bing says not to subject the air inlet to high ram air pressure, presumably due to its potential affect on automatic mixture control. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259785#259785 ________________________________ Message 45 ____________________________________ Time: 02:09:44 PM PST US From: russ kinne Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List Mike Please grow up. And shut up. HAVE SOME FEAR! -- if you're flying so fast you scare yourself, maybe you're just showing off. On Aug 26, 2009, at 2:27 PM, JetPilot wrote: > > Jim Hauck, > > Out of respect for your brother John H, who is one of the finest > people I have ever met, I have never disrespected you in any way. > Your above post was way out of line and uncalled for. > > Don't even try to excuse your post because you " just want this to > stop, " because you have ignored much worse posts from all the > others over the past few days, and not said a word. Double > standards, and jumping in with the gang don't do much for your > credibility. You may feel you are " IN " with the little gang > now, comfortable that your little friends are backing you up, but > you know better. > > Mike > > -------- > "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast > as you could have !!! > > Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259756#259756 > > ________________________________ Message 46 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:38 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: zeprep251@aol.com Thom. ?I don't even want to think about pressure problems.It's bad enough I have to twist the Bing 20 degrees to even up the EGT's.Took a week of sorting it out at first,but all is good now.1390-1400egt 290 cht. I'm afraid to touch it again. ?G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: Thom Riddle Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 4:29 pm Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast Thanks again. The photos are a great help. That fairing sure cleans up that area nicely. Do you suppose the carb inlet is getting relatively low pressure air aft of the fairing? I know Bing says not to subject the air inlet to high ram air pressure, presumably due to its potential affect on automatic mixture control. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259785#259785 Thom' I don't ________________________________ Message 47 ____________________________________ Time: 02:48:16 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: First Flight follow-up, At 03:06 PM 8/26/2009, Eugene Zimmerman wrote: >My Firestar with the hoerner modified tips will pick up a wing with >rudder only. On my Mark II will not, But The Mark II does have a >noticeably quicker aileron roll response, I believe primarily because >the cg is closer to the center of the wing's roll axis. That makes sense. The slanted underside of he Hoerner tips probably gives a little dihedral effect, and it's dihedral (which stock Kolbs have little or none of) that's necessary for rudder to induce roll. -Dana -- Lie ? Me ? Never! No, no, no, the truth is far too much fun! ________________________________ Message 48 ____________________________________ Time: 02:51:02 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Firestar questions At 07:17 AM 8/26/2009, frank.goodnight wrote: >I had a heavy wing on my firestar , and after talking to kolb and >Bryan Melborn a fix is to weld up the hole and reposition it up or >down in the wing tab. Doing this changes the angle of atack of the wing. > >It {MAY} be that if you fly the plane you'll find that the hole is >where it should be for that particular A/C. That may well be, but as it is the hole in the fuselage side is so oversized, and so close to the edge (and not even straight!), that I wouldn't want to fly it. I think the best thing is to weld up and redrill the holes in the fuselage fittings, then fly it, and then weld and redrill the hole in the wing tab (where there's a lot more room for adjustment) if necessary. -Dana -- Most politicians aren't crooks, but the ones that are sure are making the other 10 percent look bad. ________________________________ Message 49 ____________________________________ Time: 03:21:15 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fuel Filter Failure From: zeprep251@aol.com Pat' ?Can't be that difficult .We have people over here whose brain shuts down when their mouths open.Could use the same technology on their cell phones I'd think.Just a thought,no offense..... ?? G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: pj.ladd Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 12:52 pm Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fuel Filter Failure ? You forgot to mention the cell phone...Mike...unbelievable the number? of idiots on the road with them stuck in their ears while driving..? ? Hi Herb,? Is driving while using the phone illegal in the US?? It is here, but it doesn`t seem to make much difference. I don`t believe that the `hands free` system should be allowed either. No matter how easy it is supposed to be, it IS distracting. Fancy being killed just because some guy is so important that he must be in constant touch.? ? Cant be very difficult to design a phone that shuts down when the ignition is turned on.? ? Cheers? ? Pat ? ? ? ________________________________ Message 50 ____________________________________ Time: 03:22:57 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast From: Richard Girard At Rotax classes I even asked Eric Tucker about my idea to put ram air into the carb throat and vent the float bowl to static pressure. Nope, can't do that either. Unfortunately we went to lunch about then and I never got to follow up and ask why it wouldn't work. It seems you can't have pressure compensation and screw around with the pressure.While it's a bit more radical, Zenith makes carbs for Harleys that have an adjustable main jet. Now you're just talking some kind of mechanical linkage to hook it up. Just a thought. Rick Girard On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 4:20 PM, wrote: > Thom. > I don't even want to think about pressure problems.It's bad enough I have > to twist the Bing 20 degrees to even up the EGT's.Took a week of sorting it > out at first,but all is good now.1390-1400egt 290 cht. I'm afraid to touch > it again. > G.Aman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Thom Riddle > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 4:29 pm > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Sunday breakfast > > > > Thanks again. The photos are a great help. > > > That fairing sure cleans up that area nicely. Do you suppose the carb inlet is > > getting relatively low pressure air aft of the fairing? I know Bing says not to > > subject the air inlet to high ram air pressure, presumably due to its potential > > affect on automatic mixture control. > > > -------- > > Thom Riddle > > Buffalo, NY > > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > > Jabiru 2200A #1574 > > Tennessee Prop 64x34 > > > A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple > > system that works. > > - John Gaule > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259785#259785 > > > Thom' > I don't > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 51 ____________________________________ Time: 03:38:54 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Firestar questions From: Richard Girard Dana, If the bad hole is in the fuselage tabs might it not be easier to remove and replace them. After you weld up the holes and anneal you still have to drill them accurately. If it were mine, I'd prefab the tabs holes and all, tack, check and finish weld. Rick Girard do not archive On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 4:47 PM, Dana Hague wrote: > > At 07:17 AM 8/26/2009, frank.goodnight wrote: > > I had a heavy wing on my firestar , and after talking to kolb and >> Bryan Melborn a fix is to weld up the hole and reposition it up or >> down in the wing tab. Doing this changes the angle of atack of the wing. >> >> It {MAY} be that if you fly the plane you'll find that the hole is >> where it should be for that particular A/C. >> > > That may well be, but as it is the hole in the fuselage side is so > oversized, and so close to the edge (and not even straight!), that I > wouldn't want to fly it. I think the best thing is to weld up and redrill > the holes in the fuselage fittings, then fly it, and then weld and redrill > the hole in the wing tab (where there's a lot more room for adjustment) if > necessary. > > -Dana > -- > Most politicians aren't crooks, but the ones that are sure are making the > other 10 percent look bad. > > ________________________________ Message 52 ____________________________________ Time: 04:05:10 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Kolb-List: Carb Tuning Richard/Gang: Took the liberty to change the subject line to reflect what you all are talking about. If we do that, when it comes time to search the Kolb List Archives for information, maybe we can find what we are looking for. I assume you are talking about 912 carbs. These carbs operate on two static port sensors, one is the float chamber vent and the other is a port in the lip of the carb. These two ports compare static pressure and assist in positioning the piston in the vacuum chamber. I use air filter covers with the float chamber vent tube stuck in between the cover and the filter. Works pretty good. If you have ram air impacting that port in the carb lip, it probably will upset the ability to read and compare static pressure correctly. That's the way I understand it. john h mkIII At Rotax classes I even asked Eric Tucker about my idea to put ram air into the carb throat and vent the float bowl to static pressure. Nope, can't do that either. Rick Girard ________________________________ Message 53 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:53 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Carb Tuning From: Richard Girard That seems like a reasonable explanation to me. Rick Girard do not archive On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 6:04 PM, John Hauck wrote: > Richard/Gang: > > Took the liberty to change the subject line to reflect what you all are > talking about. If we do that, when it comes time to search the Kolb List > Archives for information, maybe we can find what we are looking for. > > I assume you are talking about 912 carbs. These carbs operate on two > static port sensors, one is the float chamber vent and the other is a port > in the lip of the carb. These two ports compare static pressure and assist > in positioning the piston in the vacuum chamber. I use air filter covers > with the float chamber vent tube stuck in between the cover and the filter. > Works pretty good. > > If you have ram air impacting that port in the carb lip, it probably will > upset the ability to read and compare static pressure correctly. > > That's the way I understand it. > > john h > mkIII > > > At Rotax classes I even asked Eric Tucker about my idea to put ram air into > the carb throat and vent the float bowl to static pressure. Nope, can't do > that either. > Rick Girard > > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 54 ____________________________________ Time: 05:20:44 PM PST US From: mark rinehart Subject: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 I just bought a 66" 3 blade warp prop for my Mark III / Rotax 582. For those of you flying 582's, do I need a prop extension or will I have plenty of clearance? Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Mark Rinehart ________________________________ Message 55 ____________________________________ Time: 06:37:31 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 From: Richard Girard The blades on the Warp Drive is pretty stiff. You should be fine. I've run tapered and straight blades and never had a clearance problem EXCEPT with poorly installed flap bellhorns. When I set them up per plans that problem went away. Rick Girard do not archiveaq On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 7:14 PM, mark rinehart wrote: > > I just bought a 66" 3 blade warp prop for my Mark III / Rotax 582. For > those of you flying 582's, do I need a prop extension or will I have plenty > of clearance? Thanks in advance for your thoughts. > > Mark Rinehart > > ________________________________ Message 56 ____________________________________ Time: 07:04:49 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Carb Tuning From: "dalewhelan" There are several ram air motorcycles with carbs that act the same way as the Bings on the 912. In the motorcycle world they are called Constant Velocity carbs (CV) Velocity in the venturi creates low pressure, there is a hole in the bottom of the slide (Piston) The low pressure lifts the slide against a spring pushing it down. Here is the basics of the system. The venturi and float bowls are both pressurized. The fuel system normally uses a pump One system pressurizes the fuel tank and then a throttles position sensor activates a solenoid to relieve tank pressure when the throttle is closed Neatest systems I have seen have the whole carb in the airbox. The power increase is not likely to be noticeable at 70 mph or so. You are unlikely to see positive pressure at the speed we fly at but less negative pressure still does the trick. Some drag race motorcycles (not sure of the class) use data acquisition and monitor Intake absolute Pressure. Not much happening till the speed gets pretty high. Really only makes a difference at high speed high throttle opening. -------- Dale Whelan 503 powered Firestar II Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259869#259869 ________________________________ Message 57 ____________________________________ Time: 07:10:21 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 From: Ellery Batchelder Jr Mark I don't have an extension on my prop and I have a MK3 Classic with a warp drive prop Ellery in Maine -----Original Message----- From: mark rinehart Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 8:14 pm Subject: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 I just bought a 66" 3 blade warp prop for my Mark III / Rotax 582. For those of you flying 582's, do I need a prop extension or will I have plenty of clearance? Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Mark Rinehart ________________________________ Message 58 ____________________________________ Time: 07:50:09 PM PST US From: "Gary" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 Mark, I also have a Mark IIIc with Warp Drive (3 bladed). It has a 582 with B gearbox and no extension. Clearance has not been a problem. Gary Siegrist From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ellery Batchelder Jr Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:04 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 Mark I don't have an extension on my prop and I have a MK3 Classic with a warp drive prop Ellery in Maine -----Original Message----- From: mark rinehart Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 8:14 pm Subject: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 I just bought a 66" 3 blade warp prop for my Mark III / Rotax 582. For those of you flying 582's, do I need a prop extension or will I have plenty of clearance? Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Mark Rinehart ________________________________ Message 59 ____________________________________ Time: 07:50:09 PM PST US From: "Gary" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 Mark, I also have a Mark IIIc with Warp Drive (3 bladed). It has a 582 with B gearbox and no extension. Clearance has not been a problem. Gary Siegrist From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ellery Batchelder Jr Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:04 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 Mark I don't have an extension on my prop and I have a MK3 Classic with a warp drive prop Ellery in Maine -----Original Message----- From: mark rinehart Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 8:14 pm Subject: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 I just bought a 66" 3 blade warp prop for my Mark III / Rotax 582. For those of you flying 582's, do I need a prop extension or will I have plenty of clearance? Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Mark Rinehart ________________________________ Message 60 ____________________________________ Time: 08:20:18 PM PST US From: "Larry Cottrell" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 I have a 66 inch warp on my Firestar mounted on an HKS motor. I first used it without an extension, I can't remember how many hours, but the drumming from the prop ended up cracking the Poly fiber paint on the right wing. Little spider cracks. Granted the fabric is not quite as tight as it could have been, but I put an extension on it and the reduction in noise was worth it. There was enough clearance and the wrap is stiff enough you aren't going to have any trouble, but If you have one handy, I personally would put it on. Larry C ----- Original Message ----- From: mark rinehart To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 6:14 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Warp props and Rotax 582 I just bought a 66" 3 blade warp prop for my Mark III / Rotax 582. For those of you flying 582's, do I need a prop extension or will I have plenty of clearance? Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Mark Rinehart ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 08/26/09 12:16:00 ________________________________ Message 61 ____________________________________ Time: 08:44:20 PM PST US From: DAquaNut@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Gang Mentality, And A Few driving many away from Kolb List Jet pilot, I have been a member of this list for several years and have gotten a lot of good info from the list. Ive not had anyone be ugly to me that I recall. Sometimes I dont get as much response as I would like, but that's just the way it goes. Maybe You could name the ones in this group or gang as You call it ,so I can steer clear of them. I certainly hope Im not one of those youre talking so harshly about! Ed Diebel FF# 66 ( 132 hours) Do Not Archive I n a message dated 8/26/2009 10:17:10 A.M. Central Daylight Time, orcabonita@hotmail.com writes: One of the most common comments I see is that people want to improve their Kolbs, or have done so, but are afraid to post a report or ask a question that might be deemed " Unpopular " with a certain little group here. ________________________________ Message 62 ____________________________________ Time: 08:54:37 PM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Carb Tuning My early experimentation with the suzuki included attempts to make a mikuni CV carb work with it. I spent too much time with poor results. I tried to educate myself and varied as many elements as I could but gave up and stuck the solex on. Too bad, it was (and still is) a nice looking and lightweight contraption. I never thought about fuel pressure requirements. ?????? BB On 26, Aug 2009, at 10:04 PM, dalewhelan wrote: > > > There are several ram air motorcycles with carbs that act the same > way as the Bings on the 912. > In the motorcycle world they are called Constant Velocity carbs (CV) > Velocity in the venturi creates low pressure, there is a hole in > the bottom of the slide (Piston) The low pressure lifts the slide > against a spring pushing it down. > Here is the basics of the system. > The venturi and float bowls are both pressurized. > The fuel system normally uses a pump > One system pressurizes the fuel tank and then a throttles position > sensor activates a solenoid to relieve tank pressure when the > throttle is closed > Neatest systems I have seen have the whole carb in the airbox. > The power increase is not likely to be noticeable at 70 mph or so. > You are unlikely to see positive pressure at the speed we fly at > but less negative pressure still does the trick. > Some drag race motorcycles (not sure of the class) use data > acquisition and monitor Intake absolute Pressure. Not much > happening till the speed gets pretty high. > Really only makes a difference at high speed high throttle opening. > > -------- > Dale Whelan > 503 powered Firestar II > Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259869#259869 > > ________________________________ Message 63 ____________________________________ Time: 10:42:27 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Fwd: Photo From: "albertakolbmk3" Where did you get that fairing at the wing fuselage junction? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259906#259906 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.