---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 09/05/09: 54 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:15 AM - Re: Re: Tail shaking (Tony Oldman) 2. 03:30 AM - Re: Aging Kolbers (Thom Riddle) 3. 03:42 AM - Re: Good chance you can't help but join in! (pj.ladd) 4. 04:46 AM - Re: Re: Aging Kolbers (pj.ladd) 5. 05:10 AM - Re: Re: Tail shaking (Jim Kmet) 6. 05:23 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (pj.ladd) 7. 05:43 AM - Posting on the forum (Richard Girard) 8. 05:43 AM - Attention: Just "Mike" (Mike Welch) 9. 05:54 AM - Re: Re: Tail wheel support and brace (John Hauck) 10. 05:54 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (Richard Girard) 11. 06:13 AM - Re: Re: Tail wheel support and brace (Mike Welch) 12. 06:13 AM - Re: spreadsheet (pj.ladd) 13. 06:20 AM - Re: Tail shaking (JetPilot) 14. 06:28 AM - Re: Re: Tail wheel support and brace (John Hauck) 15. 06:42 AM - Re: Attention: Just "Mike" (JetPilot) 16. 06:43 AM - Re: Re: Tail shaking (John Hauck) 17. 06:55 AM - Re: Re: Tail wheel support and brace (Mike Welch) 18. 07:05 AM - Re: Posting on the forum (JetPilot) 19. 07:06 AM - Bing carb cleaning (cristalclear13) 20. 07:14 AM - soldering tail wires (Mike Welch) 21. 07:25 AM - Re: Posting on the forum (JetPilot) 22. 07:46 AM - Re: Attention: Just "Mike" (JetPilot) 23. 08:03 AM - Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Contin (JetPilot) 24. 08:47 AM - Re: Aging Kolbers (pj.ladd) 25. 08:47 AM - Re: Re: Aging Kolbers (Thumb) 26. 08:51 AM - Kolb List Members: READ THIS (Matt Dralle) 27. 09:44 AM - Re: soldering tail wires (robert bean) 28. 09:46 AM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (Richard Girard) 29. 10:00 AM - Re: soldering tail wires (Mike Welch) 30. 11:18 AM - Re: Re: Wingtips (pj.ladd) 31. 12:03 PM - Re: Posting on the forum (dalewhelan) 32. 12:24 PM - Re: Posting on the forum (JetPilot) 33. 12:49 PM - Re: Re: Posting on the forum (Matt Dralle) 34. 12:52 PM - Re: Re: Wingtips (Richard Girard) 35. 01:22 PM - Re: The Kolb Poll To End All Polls (TKPTEAP) (Eddie) 36. 01:28 PM - Clearview fuel filters redux (Richard Girard) 37. 01:57 PM - Re: Tail shaking (Jim Kmet) 38. 02:29 PM - Re: Kolb gph fuel burn survey (gliderx5@comcast.net) 39. 02:43 PM - Re: Tail shaking (Richard Pike) 40. 04:04 PM - Age... (Bob Green) 41. 04:08 PM - Re: Aging Kolbers (Jody Morgan) 42. 05:10 PM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (zeprep251@aol.com) 43. 05:20 PM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (Beauford T) 44. 05:22 PM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (robert bean) 45. 05:31 PM - Re: Re: Tail shaking (zeprep251@aol.com) 46. 05:39 PM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (zeprep251@aol.com) 47. 07:13 PM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (dalewhelan) 48. 07:13 PM - Re: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Continue (Jack B. Hart) 49. 07:23 PM - Re: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Continue (Jim Kmet) 50. 09:12 PM - Re: Winching a Kolb (WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com) 51. 09:13 PM - Re: Re: Tail shaking (WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com) 52. 09:44 PM - Re: The Kolb Poll To End All Polls (TKPTEAP) (Robert Laird) 53. 10:06 PM - Re: Bing carb cleaning (cristalclear13) 54. 10:50 PM - Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Contin (henry.voris) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:15:04 AM PST US From: "Tony Oldman" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking I have the same out of ballance tyres . Jab on the brakes fixes the problem. Also have one that slowly goes down. A real pain taking the spats off to pump up, about every 6 months. TonyDownuder MK111c ----- Original Message ----- From: "planecrazzzy" Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 1:56 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking > > I don't tighten my wires THAT much.... they're tight ... but a dull twang > > My tail is steady.... I know I had a bad wiggle/shimmy ( still do) > > But I found out it's those cheap outa round tires I got ( Chin?) > > I hit my brakes after take-off and it solves it.... Once these wear > > a little more... I'll buy better tires... I like the ones I bought for > > my other plane... Same wheel size , but taller ( Still 6 X 6.00 ) > > . > Gotta Fly... > Mike & "Jaz" in MN > New Kolb Forum - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kolbaircraft/ > . > . > . > > -------- > . > . > . > . > . > Do Not Archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261517#261517 > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:30:30 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Aging Kolbers From: "Thom Riddle" I think we have enough responses to be statistically significant. 50 responses eldest 83 youngest 19 mean 59.7 median 60 14 at least 70 years old 12 in the 60s 12 in the 50s 9 in the 40s 3 younger than 40 do not archive -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 66x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261546#261546 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:42:51 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Good chance you can't help but join in! that guy is in for an exciting lifetime.>> Good grief, Poor guy! Fancy having to listen to a laugh like that for the rest of your life. I have seen a couple of weddings in the States which were pretty peculiar by Brit standards but this takes the biscuit. Try `JK wedding entrance dance` on the tube.` Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:46:01 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Aging Kolbers eldest still flying a Kolb 78>> Hi Thom, Your system must be slipping. 80 and still flying, well trundling around the patch on a nice evening. Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:10:56 AM PST US From: "Jim Kmet" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking I never mentioned a name, why did you did you take it personal? Jim Kmet ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 10:44 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking > > > jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net wrote: >> >> >> I`m posting this because there are a SEVERAL of Kolb Owner newbies that >> have been in touch with me & are reluctant to post to the list, because >> of all of the negative comments that have been thrown by a certain >> member of this list, & didn't want to stir up more crap. (Sad, Huh?) >> >> Jim Kmet >> Cookeville, TN >> 912 MK-3C >> >> > > > Its obvious from your comment that you just cant let your bitterness go or > even respect what Matt asked of us, and end this. Here, instead of just > post your question, you just had to take the opportunity to try to post a > negative comment even after everything had pretty much blown over. You > were so desperate to throw out some negative comments and insults that you > resorted to doing it in a new thread. You are nothing hypocrite that is > saying how sad it is to have crap stirred up, when you take every > opportunity to stir it up yourself. I am tired of bitter and vindictive > and bitter hypocrites like yourself blaming me for your bad behavior. > > As far as newbies on the list, I have been talking to a lot of them myself > and many are afraid to post because of the likes of yourself and your > little gang that try to intimidate and silence the opinions of those on > this list you don't like. What is really sad is that even after Matt > Dralle asked nicely, you are so bitter you have to try to start shit again > in a new thread. No is one responsible for you trying to stir up shit > and hard feelings on the list but yourself. > > Mike > > -------- > "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you > could have !!! > > Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261529#261529 > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:23:12 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips Almost every airplane in production today has properly designed wingtips on them, how do you compare that to a few sports cars with spoilers ??? This is not even close to valid comparison. >> Oh dear! Oh dear!, You do take things seriously don`t you. Loosen up .. I made the comparison because the difference in speeds between a 747 or even maybe a Comanche and our average flying speed is about the same as the difference in speed of a Formulae One car and the usual 80 mph of a sports car. I am sure that at 300 mph a designer tip is very efficient and well worth having. At 60/70 mph I m not convinced. I `ignored` the evidence of one report on the improvement in Challenger handling with new tips for the very simple reason that I didn`t read it. I am sorry, but I do have other interests and I find there are other things in life more important than reading every post on the list. Have a good day Pat ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:43:50 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Posting on the forum From: Richard Girard For those who are reluctant to post on the forum because of the rude behavior of JP, I would offer this with apologies to Edmund Burke: "All that is necessary for JP to triumph is good folks post nothing"....Ouch. This is the Kolb forum, not the personal property of a rude little man without the ability to play well with others. Ask yourself, what's the worst that could happen? You'll have to hit the delete key. You have no obligation to read anything he writes. If you give him the power to keep you from posting you essentially punish the rest of us for his sociopathic behavior. So I offer this idea. Do not respond to any post by JP. Do not read them. If one of his posts shows up along with others, simply skip over it and move on. If he gets no feed back he will most likely go away and pester some one else. Alternately, someone could collect all his screeds and send them to the FAA Aeromedical division. If, and I personally doubt it, he is in fact a jet pilot, perhaps they would like to reexamine his fitness to fly. At the very least they could notify his employer and give them that option. Bottom line; the rest of us do not have to put up with this and we don't need to bother Matt to fix it for us. We can exercise a very old idea and simply shun him. Rick ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:43:51 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: Kolb-List: Attention: Just "Mike" Just "Mike=2C I recently sent the list an email=2C addressed to you=2C that you identif y yourself properly. I take offense that you seem to think you are the "TH E Mike"=2C while all the rest of us Mikes identify who we are by using a la st name initial (or & Jaz). Not only did you ignore my post=2C you still think "just plain ol' Mike" is good enough to identify yourself. Maybe you are a fool=2C or stupid=2C or possibly just plain ignorant. These terms are familiar to you=2C I'm su re. In the last two weeks=2C we learned from you that=3B Vic (with the MkIIIX) is a "know nothing" Jack (who doesn't use a "Just Mike" approved fuel filter) is a fool Richard Pike is a hypocrite Gene Z. is a brown noser and "just plain stupid" Jim Kmet is not the brightest bulb in the bunch=2C and not able to grasp in tellect Thom (email #1) is a loser and has the mentality of a street punk (email #2) a loser who doesn't care about right or wrong=2C is a hy pocrite and now has become a street punk Jim H. "has a double standard" ooooouuuh! You really let him have it ! Rick G.=2C Mike P.=2C and a couple others were also insulted=2C but I could n't find the email with the insults. For the gentlemen that criticized "the group" for squabbling (Geoff=2C D ennis=2C Matt=2C Richard N)=2C it is NOT the group!!!!!!! It never is. It is ALWAYS "Just Mike"=2C insulting a host of pilot's tha t don't do it his way. Please don't ask "Can we all just get along?" It isn't "all". It is ALW AYS one person who begins an argument with an insult. ALWAYS!! (and=2C ab out every 4 months) When others on this list have disagreed=2C they are polite=2C or at least tolerant. (except in retaliation to a particular Mike=2C but we won't ide ntify which one here) I have been a member of this list almost three years . I have only read post from one person be rude. "Just One" Back to "Just Mike". You feel it is your obligation to point out peoples shortcomings. You=2C after all=2C are the authority on everything=2C exce pt spelling=2C of course. Let's see=2C in your recent rants=2C you use the ord "weather" incorrectly. It's "whether". BTW=2C the word is ridicule =2C not reticule. When you insult someone=2C spell it correctly=2C the wor d is loser!!! (pronounced luzer) Not looser=2C (pronounced loos er). "The ir" is spelled t h e i r=2C not thier!! Sheesh! Never mastered the correct usage of "to". We've had this little talk bef ore. When something is excessive=2C then it is "too". As in "too hot'=2C or "too fast". The second style of "too" is when is augments something=2C or adds to som ething. Like=3B "I am going outside=2C too." Or=2C "You=2C too=2C are a p ilot?" How can you profess to be such an authority on so much=2C yet=2C you don' t have a grasp on simple spelling and word usage? Maybe you missed that pa rt of elementary school. Someone recently asked you to provide your educational background regardi ng your aeronautical training. You ignored the request. Another recent request was for all Kolbers to identify their age. You ig nored that one=2C too. (notice proper spelling of "their"=2C and correct usage of "too". See=2C i t's easy.) Evidently=2C you did not even build your own Kolb. You bought it fully b uilt. Yet=2C you seem to know so much. Exactly what airplanes have you bu ilt? Designed? Test flown? Where do you get your expertise and authority ?? Really!!! Let us know your educational background!! "Just Mike"=2C you and I have had cordial=2C friendly=2C informative corr espondence on this list. But=2C that is difficult for me to do=2C when I k now you offend so many good gentlemen. Vic is NOT a "know nothing". Jack is NOT a fool. Richard Pike is NOT a hypocrite. Gene is NOT a brown noser and just plain stupid. Jim Kmet is N OT a dull bulb. Thom is NOT a loser. Rick G. is NOT a moron. Mike P. is NOT an idiot. I really think Jim H doe sn't have double standards=2C not do I think the rest of the many people yo u insult are as you describe. Mike=2C your contributions to the Kolb community are diminished by your n ature. You do have some valid ideas to offer=2C just your tolerance of oth ers needs work. I will identify myself now=2C so you know exactly who I am. Mike Welch MkIII _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail=AE is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-U S:WM_HYGN_faster:082009 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:54:27 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail wheel support and brace As far as your tail wires, I knew you did something better than most of us, but I don't remember what. I'm not a huge fan of the multi hole SS tangs especially after the AD, but am at a loss of what else to use. I bought some Stainless Steel single hole tangs from Aircraft Spruce, but they were extremely thin, and I could bend them with my fingers, they felt much weaker than my Multi hole tangs, so I did not use them. What type of tangs did you use on your MK III, and were can we get them ? I would be as happy as could be to get 1000 hours out of my next set, did you use Stainless Steel Cables also ? > > Mike Mike B/Gang: I think Scott has some photos of my tail wires. I don't have any with me. I just wrote a post describing my set up when this thread got started several days ago. I made up tangs from 4130 strap. I don't remember the dimensions. Used cable ferules that look like little pulley wheels instead of thimbles. 4 turnbuckles located top and bottom of each horizontal stab. I do not fold my airplane. I like my cables tight. The way I check for proper tension is grab the upper vertical stab leading edge near the top and the leading edge of a horizontal stab near the outboard end while standing in front of the tail section. I try to pull these to parts together. If I get any cable slack while going through this exercise, my cables are too loose. When I "twang" my cable I want it to sound like a guitar string. If cables are loose, the Kolb will not fly correctly. That goes for tail wires and elevator cables. Elevator cables can be checked by having someone hold the elevators in place while you try to move the control stick forward and aft. If there is fore and aft play the elevator cables are too loose. During flight the tail wires are constantly loosening. Tail wires exert inward force on the horizontal stablizers. The aluminum hinges are acting as thrust washers wearing away the sides of the hinge tangs where they rub against each other. To help reduce wear in this area I made some small nylon thrust blocks which I placed between the inboard rear edge of each horizontal stabalizer and the tailboom. These blocks help carry the inward force of the tail wires. These blocks also prevent folding the elevators up. john h mkIII - Drinking coffee in Rock Springs, Wyoming. A normal fuel stop when flying from Oregon to Alabama. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:54:47 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: Richard Girard Pat, You know the NACA report (#140) was interesting in that it compared a blunt ended wing to two with a wingtip and found wing tips were better. We have a guy in our EAA chapter who has an Airbike. Blunt wingtips haven't stopped him from flying it over 42,000 miles. It may not be the most efficient, but it sure is well traveled. Rick Girard do not archive On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 7:19 AM, pj.ladd wrote: > > Almost every airplane in production today has properly designed wingtips on > them, how do you compare that to a few sports cars with spoilers ??? This > is not even close to valid comparison. >> > > Oh dear! Oh dear!, > > You do take things seriously don`t you. Loosen up > .. I made the comparison because the difference in speeds between a 747 or > even maybe a Comanche and our average flying speed is about the same as the > difference in speed of a Formulae One car and the usual 80 mph of a sports > car. I am sure that at 300 mph a designer tip is very efficient and well > worth having. At 60/70 mph I m not convinced. > > I `ignored` the evidence of one report on the improvement in Challenger > handling with new tips for the very simple reason that I didn`t read it. I > am sorry, but I do have other interests and I find there are other things in > life more important than reading every post on the list. > > Have a good day > > Pat > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:13:57 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Tail wheel support and brace > To help reduce wear in this area I made some small > nylon thrust blocks which I placed between the inboard rear edge of each > horizontal stabalizer and the tailboom. These blocks help carry the inwar d > force of the tail wires. These blocks also prevent folding the elevators > up. > > john h > mkIII - Drinking coffee in Rock Springs=2C Wyoming. A normal fuel stop wh en > flying from Oregon to Alabama. Mornin' John=2C Regarding your nylon thrust blocks=2C if I understand their placement cor rectly=2C wouldn't the hor. stab. slide fore and aft against them? As we have discussed the hor. stab movement before=2C it moves fore and a ft with the elevator travel (about 1/8" to 3/16"=2C at maximum elevator up and down). Is this a lubricated thrust block? Soon=2C I hope=2C I will will be back to work on my plane=2C and I should not have to fold the wings=2C either. (more about this soon). Mike Welch MkIII _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you=92re up to on Facebook. http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL :ON:WL:en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:13:57 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: spreadsheet Great idea doing the spreadsheet on Kolb pilot ages. Would it be possible to do one with engine / gearbox / AC type / fuel burn / performance / hours on our Kolbs? > >> Gilding the lily a bit isn`t it? What about propellers? you could have a separate column for make/lenglh/number of blades/, pitch,. ground adj/ air adj.Wooden/fibreglass, how many bolts.... The age thing is of some use as it perhaps gives a wake up call that we do not have enough youngsters coming along to sustain growth. If I was building Kolbs I would be very interested and adjust the advertising accordingly. Is it really worth the work involved to know that someone, somewhere is getting better fuel burn than me. i am not going to rush out and start tearing carbs to pieces on that basis. All information is interesting of course but in varying degrees and it must reflect the work involved in collecting and collating it. Its like having 64 options on your watch. Not because you need them but because `its nice to have` Sorry, must go now. I see by my watch that the surfs up in Hawaii. Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:20:29 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking From: "JetPilot" jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net wrote: > I never mentioned a name, why did you did you take it personal? > > Jim Kmet > --- It is very obvious who this post was directed at, given you and your recent posts in other threads directed at myself. You authored a post and included negative comments that were uncalled for and designed stir up trouble again. Are you now trying to lie to everyone on this list ? Are you saying that posting negative and provocative crap is OK if you don't say a name ? Pretty sad people like you are giving the Kolb list a bad name. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261564#261564 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:28:14 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail wheel support and brace Mike W/Gang: If the elevator hinge pin is not centered on the center of the pivot point of the elevator control mechanism, the horizontal stabilizer on that side will have some fore and aft movement. The further the hinge pin is off center, the more movement in the horizontal stabilizer. My right horizontal stabilizer does not move, but the left moves about an 1/8th inch. Nylon blocks are somewhat self lubricating. john h mkIII Rock Springs, WY Regarding your nylon thrust blocks, if I understand their placement correctly, wouldn't the hor. stab. slide fore and aft against them? As we have discussed the hor. stab movement before, it moves fore and aft with the elevator travel (about 1/8" to 3/16", at maximum elevator up and down). Is this a lubricated thrust block? Soon, I hope, I will will be back to work on my plane, and I should not have to fold the wings, either. (more about this soon). Mike Welch MkIII ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:42:23 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Attention: Just "Mike" From: "JetPilot" What I have never done here is start threads like this that are that are designed to do nothing more than attack other members of this list as you and a couple others have just done. I have never mislead people on this list, and tried to suppress good information about Kolbs here just because I did not like who wrote it. Remember what I said about Gang mentality, you and your little friends have done far worse and posted far more offensive content than I ever have here on this list. You just published a bunch of misleading and downright false statements, taken out of threads where you and a couple of your friends have posted far worse and offensive things. Matt Dralle did ask you to stop this garbage, and I did honor his request, it was over. Other members of this list are tired of the bickering and vindictive behavior by a few bitter men such as yourself, and yet you just have to keep it going... You are so desperate to keep bad blood going here on the list you had to start a that was nothing but an attempt to start problems here on the list again. You own behavior shows what kind man you are, don't blame your bad behavior and problems here on the list on me when you go out of your way to start threads like this. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261567#261567 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:43:06 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking Got a suggestion. My suggestion does not have anything to do with this thread or the subject line. Neither does the personal messages that have overwhelmed the Kolb List in the past few days. If it ain't related to building and flying Kolbs, take it back copy. The majority of this List are not interested in a few of you acting like kids. Take time to pull up Matt Dralles commandments on how to conduct yourself on this List. Don't let someone else control your feelings. Every time you react, you are being controlled. Quit grading others and try to learn something or share some information about building and flying Kolbs. john h mkIII - Back to vacation mode. Rock Springs, WY ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 06:55:04 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Tail wheel support and brace John=2C On my MkIII C=2C I would estimate my hor. stabilizers move fore and aft a t least 1/8"=2C possibly 3/16". While I do not think this is excessive=2C it is clear there are minor fabrication differences between your elevator h inge and mine. One thing=2C for sure=2C is I will experience wear on the front sliding a ttach bolt=2C at the leading mount of the hor. stab. I will have plenty on hand=2C and replace as needed!! This location would also be a good candid ate for a shot of grease (just a tiny daub). Due to movement differences of my tailfeathers=2C compared to your's=2C I 'm probably precluded from doing the same reinforcement as you did=2C altho ugh I certainly see their value. Mike Welch MkIII From: jhauck@elmore.rr.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail wheel support and brace Mike W/Gang: If the elevator hinge pin is not centered on the center of the pivot point of the elevator control mechanism=2C the horizontal stabilizer on that side will have some fore and aft movement. The further the hinge pin is off ce nter=2C the more movement in the horizontal stabilizer. My right horizontal stabilizer does not move=2C but the left moves about an 1/8th inch. Nylon blocks are somewhat self lubricating. john h mkIII Rock Springs=2C WY Regarding your nylon thrust blocks=2C if I understand their placement co rrectly=2C wouldn't the hor. stab. slide fore and aft against them? As we have discussed the hor. stab movement before=2C it moves fore and a ft with the elevator travel (about 1/8" to 3/16"=2C at maximum elevator up and down). Is this a lubricated thrust block? Soon=2C I hope=2C I will will be back to work on my plane=2C and I should not have to fold the wings=2C either. (more about this soon). Mike Welch MkIII _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail=AE is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-U S:WM_HYGN_faster:082009 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:05:48 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Posting on the forum From: "JetPilot" There are a lot of people reluctant to post to this list, and it due more to a small group of bitter men such as yourself that attack and intimidate any idea or person on this list that you do not like. You have shown your desperation to attack any post I have made in the past, and now you are resulting to starting dedicated threads to satisfy your vindictive behavior. I wish you would not read my posts, because I give a lot of good information here, and everyone on this list would be better off if you would not try to suppress good and helpful safety advice just because you feel the need to attack me at every opportunity. Its sad that a few people like you are littering this group with nothing but bad blood, vindictiveness, and personal attacks and then trying to blame someone else for your bad behavior. Matt very nicely asked you and others to stop this, and so far, you and a couple others have just been unable to let go of your bitterness and personal grudges, and have kept this going by starting new threads. Your old worn out excuse of blaming your behavior and post just like the one you wrote here just does not cut it. You went to a lot of trouble to talk about me, but by writing garbage as you see above you are just showing what kind of bitter and vindictive man you are. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261571#261571 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 07:06:44 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning From: "cristalclear13" I'm going to clean my carbs while I have them off. Ronnie mentioned in class what to use to clean it, but I don't think I wrote it down and I doubt I can reach him on this holiday weekend. The outside of the carbs are cruddy and I've got to clean up the gunk that deteriorated choke seal left behind. Has anyone who has taken the 2 stroke or 4 stroke Rotax class got the information of what product is suggested for cleaning the Bing carbs? -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261572#261572 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 07:14:19 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: Kolb-List: soldering tail wires Kolb guys=2C In the latest copy of Sport Aviation Magazine=2C there is an article abou t securing the cable thimble with stainless steel wire=2C then soldered the wrapped wire (3 locations). This method of securing cable fittings allows for a very slender cable en d=2C rather than that annoying nodule of a Nico lug. If they are finished off with a covering of heat shrink=2C they look very professional. BTW=2C although I haven't read the complete article=2C yet=2C it appears as though the author also did some stress analysis tests (destructive testi ng). Has anyone fabricated their cables before with this kind of method? Real ly does look nice!! Mike Welch MkIII _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail=AE is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-U S:WM_HYGN_faster:082009 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:25:57 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Posting on the forum From: "JetPilot" Rick Girard, I would also like to quote Edmund Burke: "All that is necessary for Gang mentality to triumph is good folks to do nothing"....Ouch. You and a couple others have the mistaken idea that your bad behavior is acceptable, because you are doing it as a little gang. We see this mentality with street punks all the time, where kids are emboldened to do far worse with a group of friends than they would ever be willing do on their own. You and your little gang have posted far worse things on this list than I ever have. You are so desperate to continue this that you continue to write negative posts even after the problems were over. People are just not buying your tired old excuse of blaming me for your and your friends bad behavior and postings. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261574#261574 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 07:46:28 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Attention: Just "Mike" From: "JetPilot" List, I do get many emails and private messages from people that are afraid to report VG and other results here on the list, because of a few people that like to gang up and attempt to silence any opinion or person they do not like. The problems on this list were over, and a couple bitter and vindictive individuals are not willing to let them pass, and continue to write offensive posts as we see above. A couple of your have made it clear that your agenda is to drive me off this list, and that you will do anything, including continuing a problem that is long forgotten in order to do so. You might as well stop now, because I have been here for almost 4 years, and I am NOT going anywhere. And we are all getting tired of your little grudges, personal vendettas, and your need to continue to trash up the Kolb list with them. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261576#261576 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 08:03:05 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Contin From: "JetPilot" Possums wrote: > At 11:15 PM 9/3/2009, you wrote: > > I only know > of one person who was willing to tear the wings off of a Kolb in > flight - on purpose (not with sandbags on the ground) and > trust a chute to carry him down. This was done to find the weak link > in the design. The "weak link" was fixed years ago and > by weak - I mean more G's than you might ever do.. > Most of the stuff I have done is cosmetic or just for looks/comfort. > > Possums, You plane does look good, but some of your improvements are not cosmetic You say you mods were done for " looks/comfort ".... Are you suggesting that you put two sets of tail bracing wires on for looks ? Or that having two sets of tail wires somehow make your plane more comfortable ? You did a very nice job on your Kolb, it is disappointing to see you join in on the recent ugliness with your last post, and that you would even downplay your own improvements in in your kolb for the sake of fitting in with a few people that are intent on discrediting anything I post. You have done some really nice things to your Kolb, to downplay them to " Fit In " does a disservice to yourself and those that might think about similar improvements to their planes. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261582#261582 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 08:47:06 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Aging Kolbers Hey! I'm finally ready to "GET STARTED".>> At 70? Go girl! Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 08:47:41 AM PST US From: "Thumb" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Aging Kolbers Hi Gang.....Bill Futrell,,,,started flying back in 1968,,,got my license in a Cessna 150,,,,30 hrs in a 172....Got my helicopter rating an old G-47 and a little over a hundred hrs in it...and now I got a real fun plane to fly,,,,a MK111xtra-912...my age is 72 .. Bill Futrell Brooksville Fl ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thom Riddle" Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 4:29 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Aging Kolbers > > Oops! I went back over the posts and apparently I missed some responses. > > Current data > > 36 responders > > 8 @ 70 up > 9 in 60s > 8 in 50s > 8 in 40s > 3 under 40 > > Mean 57.7 > Median 59 > Max 83 > Min 19 > > ~ 53% under 60 > > -------- > Thom Riddle > Buffalo, NY > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > Jabiru 2200A #1574 > Tennessee Prop 66x34 > > A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a > simple system that works. > - John Gaule > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261381#261381 > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:51:57 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb List Members: READ THIS Dear Kolb Listers, I have been very disappointed in some of the dialog I have seen on the Kolb List the last few days. First and foremost, let me quote a bit from the Kolb List Usage Guidelines, that by the way were just posted 4 days ago: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. All of the personal attacks and he-said, she-said and frankly, just plain vulgar and unacceptable dialog MUST STOP NOW. I like to run a open, un-moderated forum where members should feel free to express their opinions about KOLB-related topics. I don't want to baby-sit members and feel like I have to read every message to make sure that someone isn't calling someone else names. That is just completely UNACCEPTABLE behavior, especially for the average age of the members of this List. I'm not going to name any names or point any fingers at this point. You know what you have posted and I'm sure that when you posted it you felt a twinge of guilt knowing that it had nothing to with Kolb activities and/or would be considered inflammatory by one or more other members. If there is any question, just delete it before you post it. I don't want to see ANYMORE messages with personal attacks, vulgar language, or posts that aren't directly related to Kolb building or flying. I also expect EVERYONE to treat EVERYONE on the List with *respect, kindness, and courtesy*. Did I make myself clear on that? Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 09:44:54 AM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: soldering tail wires I haven't seen the article, and it may be ok but Caution would have to be taken to avoid heating the cable (obviously) In A&P school they taught us how to do woven cable ends about the thimble. I had forgotten about it. We had to make our own fixture to hold the works while it was being woven. I'm not sure how small a diameter cable would be eligible but it is a secure method. At one time it was illustrated in the 43-13 literature. Restorers of authentic antique airplanes sometimes insist that all their cabling be done this way. BB On 5, Sep 2009, at 10:05 AM, Mike Welch wrote: > Kolb guys, > > In the latest copy of Sport Aviation Magazine, there is an > article about securing the cable thimble with stainless steel wire, > then soldered the wrapped wire (3 locations). > > This method of securing cable fittings allows for a very slender > cable end, rather than that annoying nodule of a Nico lug. If they > are finished off with a covering of heat shrink, they look very > professional. > > BTW, although I haven't read the complete article, yet, it > appears as though the author also did some stress analysis tests > (destructive testing). > > Has anyone fabricated their cables before with this kind of > method? Really does look nice!! > > Mike Welch > MkIII > > Hotmail=AE is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. > Try it now. > > ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 09:46:47 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning From: Richard Girard Any good carb cleaner in a spray can will work, they are all the same formulation. For cleaning the outside spray on a paper towel and wipe it down good. The little tube is handy for spraying through the passages. Be sure and get the idle bypass line as well as the idle passage. If you have crud or suspect crud in the idle jet a tiny sewing needle will help open it up. A carved down Popsicle stick with the end mushed out a bit will get down in the starting carburetor seat and clean out any debris without damaging the seat itself. Rick Girard do not archive On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 9:06 AM, cristalclear13 wrote: > cristalclearwaters@gmail.com> > > I'm going to clean my carbs while I have them off. Ronnie mentioned in > class what to use to clean it, but I don't think I wrote it down and I doubt > I can reach him on this holiday weekend. > > The outside of the carbs are cruddy and I've got to clean up the gunk that > deteriorated choke seal left behind. Has anyone who has taken the 2 stroke > or 4 stroke Rotax class got the information of what product is suggested for > cleaning the Bing carbs? > > -------- > Cristal Waters > Kolb Mark II Twinstar > Rotax 503 DCSI > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261572#261572 > > ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 10:00:45 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: RE: Kolb-List: soldering tail wires Hi Bob=2C I glanced at the article=2C too=2C and like I said=2C I haven't read it f ully. But=2C I did notice the author mentioned something about testing the soldered fittings. A quick scan of the products reveals he used 95% tin/4% silver matrix. I t melts and flows at 475 degrees. Not likely to do much damage to the cabl e at those temps. I'll read the entire article this evening=2C but it sure does look like a n interesting way to make your own custom cables. Mike Welch MkIII (Mike B. Sorry for the earlier email. Have a nice day.) From: slyck@frontiernet.net Subject: Re: Kolb-List: soldering tail wires I haven't seen the article=2C and it may be ok but Caution would have to be taken to avoid heating the cable (obviously) In A&P school they taught us how to do woven cable ends about the thimble. I had forgotten about it. We had to make our own fixture to hold the works while it was being woven. I'm not sure how small a diameter cable would be eligible but it is a secure method. At one time it was illustrated in the 43-13 lit erature. Restorers of authentic antique airplanes sometimes insist that all their ca bling be done this way. BB On 5=2C Sep 2009=2C at 10:05 AM=2C Mike Welch wrote: Kolb guys=2C In the latest copy of Sport Aviation Magazine=2C there is an article abou t securing the cable thimble with stainless steel wire=2C then soldered the wrapped wire (3 locations). This method of securing cable fittings allows for a very slender cable en d=2C rather than that annoying nodule of a Nico lug. If they are finished off with a covering of heat shrink=2C they look very professional. BTW=2C although I haven't read the complete article=2C yet=2C it appears as though the author also did some stress analysis tests (destructive testi ng). Has anyone fabricated their cables before with this kind of method? Real ly does look nice!! Mike Welch MkIII Hotmail=AE is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. Try it n ow. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics. com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/con tribution _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you=92re up to on Facebook. http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL :ON:WL:en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009 ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 11:18:21 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips You know the NACA report (#140) was interesting in that it compared a blunt ended wing to two with a wingtip and found wing tips were better.>> Hi Rick, they well may be. I have only questioned whether, with the sort of flying which most of us do, it makes much difference. If I was going to put in the sort of mileage that the Hauck does, or your friend with the Airbike(not familiar with that one) then I should probably be looking for the best performance possible. Doing flights around the block on a nice evening or a couple of hundred miles for a fly in (which is the sort of flying I do) I am not going to break into a sweat about putting in an extra extra gallon of fuel now and then or worry about the length of time I can fly hands off.. "Frankly my dear, I don`t give a damn" I haven`t said that one or the other wing tip is better or worse My plane flies pretty well, more or less as it came out of the box and I am not going to spend time in a freezing garage in the winter or waste flying time in the summer by trying to `improve` it. Some guys get their kicks flying, some by pulling the plane to pieces and experimenting with this and that. Thats great. We all love flying in our different ways. There is nothing to fall out with each other about. Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 12:03:42 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Posting on the forum From: "dalewhelan" This is not Kolb related, it seems Kolb list related. I was accused of fathering a child with a friends wife. I asked another friend how to deal with it. He said, "A fire left unfueled dies." -------- Dale Whelan 503 powered Firestar II Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261614#261614 ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 12:24:36 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Posting on the forum From: "JetPilot" dalewhelan wrote: > > He said, "A fire left unfueled dies." > > That is a good point, and this latest fire had died a couple days ago. Rick Girard was so anxious to reignite it, he posted negative comments in a thread last night, which did not get much attention, people just want this to be over. Rick Girard and Mike Welch are so desperate to keep this going, they started two new threads that were nothing but malicious attacks and attempts to keep problems alive on the list. This is not me causing problems as they claim, they authored these to threads today, they posted personal attacks, and they are doing everything in their power to keep this little fued alive. Yes I agree, this should have gone away a few days ago. Mike -------- "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261617#261617 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 12:49:21 PM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Posting on the forum Stop it, stop it, stop it. Didn't you fricken' read my post from 2 hours ago? Why do you insist on continuing this? One more post that isn't related to Kolbs and you will be permanently blocked. You have, in direct defiance of my request, posted more inflammatory text. This is your last chance. Unbelievable. Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator At 12:23 PM 9/5/2009 Saturday, you wrote: > > >dalewhelan wrote: >> >> He said, "A fire left unfueled dies." >> >> > > >That is a good point, and this latest fire had died a couple days ago. Rick Girard was so anxious to reignite it, he posted negative comments in a thread last night, which did not get much attention, people just want this to be over. > >Rick Girard and Mike Welch are so desperate to keep this going, they started two new threads that were nothing but malicious attacks and attempts to keep problems alive on the list. This is not me causing problems as they claim, they authored these to threads today, they posted personal attacks, and they are doing everything in their power to keep this little fued alive. Yes I agree, this should have gone away a few days ago. > >Mike ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 12:52:14 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Wingtips From: Richard Girard Pat, I love to fly, but I am budget limited. When I'm out of gas money, I tinker. As far as wingtips go, I have so many other places to look for improvement, it's pretty far down on the list. Not to mention that they require recovering the wings which is far outside my monetary capabilities right now.So far my list looks like this; 1. Wheel pants 2. Cowling 3. Gap seal 4. Tailcone 5. All intersections 6. Recover and fare fuselage In my book those are the big hitters for drag reduction on my airplane and I have the materials to carry them out with the exception of the last. If I want to really dream there's a four stroke engine, but that, too, is a ways down the road. Rick On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 12:56 PM, pj.ladd wrote: > You know the NACA report (#140) was interesting in that it compared a > blunt ended wing to two with a wingtip and found wing tips were better.>> > > Hi Rick, > > they well may be. I have only questioned whether, with the sort of flying > which most of us do, it makes much difference. If I was going to put in > the sort of mileage that the Hauck does, or your friend with the Airbike(not > familiar with that one) then I should probably be looking for the best > performance possible. Doing flights around the block on a nice evening or a > couple of hundred miles for a fly in (which is the sort of flying I do) I am > not going to break into a sweat about putting in an extra extra gallon of > fuel now and then or worry about the length of time I can fly hands off.. > "Frankly my dear, I don`t give a damn" > I haven`t said that one or the other wing tip is better or worse My plane > flies pretty well, more or less as it came out of the box and I am not going > to spend time in a freezing garage in the winter or waste flying time in the > summer by trying to `improve` it. > Some guys get their kicks flying, some by pulling the plane to pieces and > experimenting with this and that. Thats great. We all love flying in our > different ways. There is nothing to fall out with each other about. > > Cheers > > Pat > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 01:22:52 PM PST US From: "Eddie" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: The Kolb Poll To End All Polls (TKPTEAP) Thanks Beauford I have been lurking around the list for about five years and have quietly learned quite a bit about my aircraft here. A lot of stuff posted here cannot be done in the uk but is interesting anyway. I have a mk111 classic with the rotax 582 and will be 56 next month ----- Original Message ----- From: Beauford T To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 12:26 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: The Kolb Poll To End All Polls (TKPTEAP) Welcome aboard, Brother Eddie... How aged are ye...? and what Kolb are you flying, sir? beauford (he of the ancient liver) Firefly 076 Brandon, FL Do Not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Eddie Subject: Re: Kolb-List: The Kolb Poll To End All Polls (TKPTEAP) Is this poll for USA based kolbs or can us uk lurkers join the fun ? Eddie BAyliss Liverpool england (or uk if you prefer) mk111 c ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 09/04/09 17:51:00 ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 01:28:12 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Clearview fuel filters redux From: Richard Girard I was in O'reilly's this morning and while I was waiting for a counter person I noticed they were still carrying the Mr. Gasket brand of clearview filter so I stepped around the counter and took a look. They are, as near as I can tell without opening the package, back to the original design with a round center section and a knurled nut to secure the filter element. If you should happen to need a filter and this type fits your needs it appears that option is available again. Be careful to make sure you don't get stuck with one of the old flat center POJ models, though. The price is the same as I paid for the garbage (IMHO) version. Rick Girard do not archive ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:46 PM PST US From: "Jim Kmet" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tail shaking Daniel, BB, & all, , here`s my experience with the Tail shaking: Mine is comfortably solid, except the leading edges of both horizontal stabs.They do vibrate. I twist around to see when they are doing it the worst. Full power climb out , they are fine. low power , slow flying, they are fine. Seem to me they are the worst when I`m trying to cover ground, 5000 rpm & higher, in level flight, BUT, they will do it also, when I`m in a relatively high, (like cruise speed), descent with idle power. That makes me think it is more of a result of turbulent air coming around the cockpit, than of the thrust from the prop. Yea, the whole rear end of the plane will shake a little too., but so does the 182 I fly. When the Piper Tomahawk came out, that big visible tail scared alot of people when they saw it shaking. I do have a plan to try, but will take some time to do & I`ll report back on that later, after I see results. In the mean time, I`d like to hear more from pilots after they twist around in the coming weeks, & report back. Jim Kmet 912-MK3C Cookeville, TN ----- Original Message ----- From: daniel myers To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 8:58 PM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Tail shaking Jim, the first time I noticed mine it scared me so bad and called my friend Jack. He said it was normal, so I kept going. Is yours shaking? or swaying? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: slyck@frontiernet.net Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tail shaking Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2009 21:40:04 -0400 To: kolb-list@matronics.com Jim, my tail wires have never been very tight. They are more so now than originally but not "twangy" I have never noticed any problems with vibration or rudder flutter. The cable thimbles are starting to show a little wear and will have to be checked closely before next season. I'm still a little shy about picking up too much speed in a long power off dive because of the aileron flutter I once had. (pre-balancers) and pay close attention to what's going on. Seems good now. BB MkIIIc On 4, Sep 2009, at 5:14 PM, Jim Kmet wrote: Hi All, I was talking Offlist with a few fellow Kolbers about the tail wire tension, (and the Kolblist tension), and a question was posed to me about how much tailshaking is normal, so, if you guys don`t mind, how about looking over your shoulder the next time you fly & report back on this topic please? With all the talk about the wire attach tangs lately, What We`re specifically looking for is several things.: How much , if any, is the leading edges of the horizontal & vertical stabilizers vibrating in flight? And, If they are any worse or better at any power settings & or airspeeds? For instance, does power matter? or Airspeed in a descent with no power? I will chime in too, but later. I`m posting this because there are a SEVERAL of Kolb Owner newbies that have been in touch with me & are reluctant to post to the list, because of all of the negative comments that have been thrown by a certain member of this list, & didn't want to stir up more crap. (Sad, Huh?) The owners are MK-3C & MK-3X pilots, but I`m sure we all may learn. Of course, we will all have to understand that the tail wires are as tight as the owners are comfortable flying with, or they wouldn't` fly. I know this topics was touched on earlier, `cuz an archive search yielded John H`s response, but we`d like an up to date comment. Thanks in advance Jim Kmet Cookeville, TN 912 MK-3C href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ontribution ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ronics.com ww.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you=92re up to on Facebook. Find out more. ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 02:29:26 PM PST US From: gliderx5@comcast.net Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Kolb gph fuel burn survey Malcolm Morrison MKII, 503SCSI, 3 blade Ivo 5500 RPM, 60 MPH, 3.6 GPH ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eugene Zimmerman" Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:21:14 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb gph fuel burn survey All Kolbers, I'm curious what other kolb pilots are experiencing as their gallon per hour fuel burn? What is your sustained level flight absolute minimum gal, per hr? At what engine rpm? And at what cruise speed? What is your over all "average" gal. per hr. engine rpm, and cruise speed? Please specify the model of your plane and engine when you share your statistics. Statistic from flights of 2 hours or longer will likely be more accurate and reliable than shorter flights, but please share whatever you personally experience with your plane. Eugene Zimmerman ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 02:43:36 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking From: "Richard Pike" [quote="jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net"]Hi All, I was talking Offlist with a few fellow Kolbers about the tail wire tension, (and the Kolblist tension), and a question was posed to me about how much tailshaking is normal, Jim Kmet Cookeville, TN 912 MK-3C > [b] Jim, haven't had a chance to check mine recently, checked it years ago, and it did do some wiggling and shaking. Back in the days when I was flying a Hummer, which had a 5" boom tube like the FS, when you turned around and looked at the tail, it didn't look good, that thing wiggled and twitched around in the prop blast something fierce. Maxair Drifter was about the same way. But it never seemed to bother it. IMO, a certain amount of twitching and wiggling is normal. How about this: adjust your wires a tad looser than normal, tie the tail wheel to something secure and run the engine up full throttle and watch it for a while. Then tighten the wires up snug and try it again. Which ever you like the most, make that your normal. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261632#261632 ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 04:04:55 PM PST US From: Bob Green Subject: Kolb-List: Age... Will be 66 September 23rd. Flying as PP since 1967. Mostly factory built but now building a MKIIIX. Looking forward to flying it by next summer. Bob ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 04:08:53 PM PST US From: "Jody Morgan" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Aging Kolbers Thanks for the encouragement Pat. I'm hoping it won't be too long now before I can "GO" and be up there with the rest of you Kolbers. Minor correction.... It would seem like with the name Jody, one would be a girl, just doesn't happen to be true in my case. I was named after my dad so we were both Joes, thus the nick name Jody, which has stuck with me. In my mind it is a great step up from "Baby Joe" which is what they called me as a tot. :) Hoping to get the doors on my building this week so I can actually start messing with my Kolb project and maybe make some vroooom noises. Thanks, Jody -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pj.ladd Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 8:37 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Aging Kolbers Hey! I'm finally ready to "GET STARTED".>> At 70? Go girl! Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 05:10:14 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning From: zeprep251@aol.com A guy once told me that compressed air is what cleans a carb.I think he meant the inside passages and I agree.Many solvents will loosen things up but the compressed air removes it ? Just a thought. ? G.Aman. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Girard Sent: Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:40 pm Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning Any good carb cleaner in a spray can will work, they are all the same formulation. For cleaning the outside spray on a paper towel and wipe it down good. The little tube is handy for spraying through the passages. Be sure and get the idle bypass line as well as the idle passage. If you have crud or suspect crud in the idle jet a tiny sewing needle will help open it up. A carved down Popsicle stick with the end mushed out a bit will get down in the starting carburetor seat and clean out any debris without damaging the seat itself. Rick Girard do not archive On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 9:06 AM, cristalclear13 wrote: I'm going to clean my carbs while I have them off. ?Ronnie mentioned in class what to use to clean it, but I don't think I wrote it down and I doubt I can reach him on this holiday weekend. The outside of the carbs are cruddy and I've got to clean up the gunk that deteriorated choke seal left behind. ?Has anyone who has taken the 2 stroke or 4 stroke Rotax class got the information of what product is suggested for cleaning the Bing carbs? -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261572#261572 ========== arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== ________________________________ Message 43 ____________________________________ Time: 05:20:18 PM PST US From: "Beauford T" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning Miss Cristal: You can use just about any aerosol can labeled as "throttle body" and carb cleaner...without worrying about damaging anything on your Bings...if you use regular aerosol carburetor cleaner, take care that it does not contact any rubber, nylon or plastic parts like the floats, the anti-bubble screen over the mainjet, or the white plastic-looking throat slide part...Regular carburetor cleaner is for metal only. There is a fundamental difference between carb cleaner and "throttle body" carb cleaners... The former will likely soften and damage any non-metal parts. Throttle body carburetor cleaners and regular carbuerator cleaners are often stocked side by side in the auto parts stores. This can be dangerous.... They are different products. ...worth what ye paid fer it... beauford FF-076 Brandon, FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "cristalclear13" Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 10:06 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning I'm going to clean my carbs while I have them off. Ronnie mentioned in class what to use to clean it, but I don't think I wrote it down and I doubt I can reach him on this holiday weekend. The outside of the carbs are cruddy and I've got to clean up the gunk that deteriorated choke seal left behind. Has anyone who has taken the 2 stroke or 4 stroke Rotax class got the information of what product is suggested for cleaning the Bing carbs? -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261572#261572 ________________________________ Message 44 ____________________________________ Time: 05:22:54 PM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning Reminds me of a funny (but not for him) occurrence so long ago. A buddy brought his 4 bbl from his hot rod 55 chev into the barracks for a little work. After the top cover came off he inverted it. yep, those little ball check valves rolled out to who knows where. I think he ended up buying a new carb. Besides, how would he have known WHICH holes to drop them back in? :) He was my good buddy "skinny Greek" (world's best safety wire artist) BB On 5, Sep 2009, at 8:08 PM, zeprep251@aol.com wrote: > A guy once told me that compressed air is what cleans a carb.I > think he meant the inside passages and I agree.Many solvents will > loosen things up but the compressed air removes it > Just a thought. > G.Aman. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Richard Girard > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:40 pm > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning > > Any good carb cleaner in a spray can will work, they are all the > same formulation. For cleaning the outside spray on a paper towel > and wipe it down good. The little tube is handy for spraying > through the passages. Be sure and get the idle bypass line as well > as the idle passage. If you have crud or suspect crud in the idle > jet a tiny sewing needle will help open it up. A carved down > Popsicle stick with the end mushed out a bit will get down in the > starting carburetor seat and clean out any debris without damaging > the seat itself. > > Rick Girard > do not archive > > On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 9:06 AM, cristalclear13 > wrote: > > > I'm going to clean my carbs while I have them off. Ronnie > mentioned in class what to use to clean it, but I don't think I > wrote it down and I doubt I can reach him on this holiday weekend. > > The outside of the carbs are cruddy and I've got to clean up the > gunk that deteriorated choke seal left behind. Has anyone who has > taken the 2 stroke or 4 stroke Rotax class got the information of > what product is suggested for cleaning the Bing carbs? > > -------- > Cristal Waters > Kolb Mark II Twinstar > Rotax 503 DCSI > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261572#261572 > > > ========== > arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > ========== > http://forums.matronics.com > ========== > le, List Admin. > ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ========== > > ________________________________ Message 45 ____________________________________ Time: 05:31:51 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking From: zeprep251@aol.com Guys, ? I like them tight too.But if you fold and unfold you have some difficulty getting that little wing nut started if the tension is too high.Had to compromise on it some.The tangs on my MK-3 were all bent well past the holes, so far so good 470hrs and I lube the area where the tangs and thimble touch.Saw some red"smoke "there and thought lubing was in order ?G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: Richard Pike Sent: Sat, Sep 5, 2009 5:42 pm Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking [quote="jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net"]Hi All, I was talking Offlist with a few fellow Kolbers about the tail wire tension, (and the Kolblist tension), and a question was posed to me about how much tailshaking is normal, Jim Kmet Cookeville, TN 912 MK-3C > [b] Jim, haven't had a chance to check mine recently, checked it years ago, and it did do some wiggling and shaking. Back in the days when I was flying a Hummer, which had a 5" boom tube like the FS, when you turned around and looked at the tail, it didn't look good, that thing wiggled and twitched around in the prop blast something fierce. Maxair Drifter was about the same way. But it never seemed to bother it. IMO, a certain amount of twitching and wiggling is normal. How about this: adjust your wires a tad looser than normal, tie the tail wheel to something secure and run the engine up full throttle and watch it for a while. Then tighten the wires up snug and try it again. Which ever you like the most, make that your normal. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261632#261632 ________________________________ Message 46 ____________________________________ Time: 05:39:20 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning From: zeprep251@aol.com Bob, ?you gotta hate those WCFB Carters. G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: robert bean Sent: Sat, Sep 5, 2009 8:22 pm Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning Reminds me of a funny (but not for him) occurrence so long ago. ?A buddy brought his 4 bbl from his hot rod 55 chev into the barracks for? a little work. ?After the top cover came off he inverted it. ?yep, those little ball check valves rolled out to who knows where. I think he ended up buying a new carb. Besides, how would he have known WHICH holes to drop them back in? ?:) He was my good buddy "skinny Greek" ?(world's best safety wire artist) BB On 5, Sep 2009, at 8:08 PM, zeprep251@aol.com wrote: A guy once told me that compressed air is what cleans a carb.I think he meant the inside passages and I agree.Many solvents will loosen things up but the compressed air removes it ? Just a thought. ? G.Aman. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Girard To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:40 pm Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing carb cleaning Any good carb cleaner in a spray can will work, they are all the same formulation. For cleaning the outside spray on a paper towel and wipe it down good. The little tube is handy for spraying through the passages. Be sure and get the idle bypass line as well as the idle passage. If you have crud or suspect crud in the idle jet a tiny sewing needle will help open it up. A carved down Popsicle stick with the end mushed out a bit will get down in the starting carburetor seat and clean out any debris without damaging the seat itself. Rick Girard do not archive On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 9:06 AM, cristalclear13 wrote: I'm going to clean my carbs while I have them off. ?Ronnie mentioned in class what to use to clean it, but I don't think I wrote it down and I doubt I can reach him on this holiday weekend. The outside of the carbs are cruddy and I've got to clean up the gunk that deteriorated choke seal left behind. ?Has anyone who has taken the 2 stroke or 4 stroke Rotax class got the information of what product is suggested for cleaning the Bing carbs? -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261572#261572 ========== arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 47 ____________________________________ Time: 07:13:19 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Bing carb cleaning From: "dalewhelan" Just a note for cleaning jets. I run a fine wire through the jets to remove any film from the jet walls. I don't use torch tip cleaners as they will enlarge the jets and richen the mixture. My favorite wires are, Guitar string, single strand of throttle cable, single strand of wire brush you may use for cleaning a BBQ Saves me from cleaning twice or wrecking a two stroke motor -------- Dale Whelan 503 powered Firestar II Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261672#261672 ________________________________ Message 48 ____________________________________ Time: 07:13:52 PM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Continue Kolbers, Got to wondering what the loads would be on the upper tail cables and tangs. I scaled out the FireFly drawings for the horizontal stabilizer and elevator. By drawing this up and cutting out the combined profile for one side, I could find the centroid of the area. This is the spot that one could place all the load that is equivalent to the load being spread over the whole surface. I know this is not real but for purposes of finding the table tension under load it works. The triangle made up of the cable and tangs, the vertical tail post and stabilizer attachment points make up a right triangle of 25.5 inches high, 34 inches wide with a 42.5 inch long side. The load point turned out to be 15 inches from the inside hinge point. If one assumes that the FireFly horizontal tail surfaces must hold up 100 pounds in one G flight, then the load on one side would be 50 pounds. By summing moments and forces and applying a little trig, one can calculate the cable tension. In this case it turns out to be 37 pounds. If one pushes the load on up to six G's, the cable tension will increase to 222 pounds. This is far short of the 2,000 pound load carrying capability of 1/8 inch cable. The compression load on the horizontal stabilizer rear member will go from 29.4 to 176.4 pounds. The rudder post has to work a little harder because it must sustain the load of both sides, so it will go from 61.2 to 367 pounds at six G's. It looks like Dennis did a good job, in that, there is plenty of reserve in the design. The cables and the tangs should be adequate as long as one does not over tighten the cables. Pre-flight inspections are good. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 49 ____________________________________ Time: 07:23:34 PM PST US From: "Jim Kmet" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Continue NICE JOB ! Jim Kmet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack B. Hart" Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 10:23 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Continue > > Kolbers, > > Got to wondering what the loads would be on the upper tail cables and > tangs. > I scaled out the FireFly drawings for the horizontal stabilizer and > elevator. By drawing this up and cutting out the combined profile for one > side, I could find the centroid of the area. This is the spot that one > could place all the load that is equivalent to the load being spread over > the whole surface. I know this is not real but for purposes of finding > the > table tension under load it works. > > The triangle made up of the cable and tangs, the vertical tail post and > stabilizer attachment points make up a right triangle of 25.5 inches high, > 34 inches wide with a 42.5 inch long side. The load point turned out to > be > 15 inches from the inside hinge point. > > If one assumes that the FireFly horizontal tail surfaces must hold up 100 > pounds in one G flight, then the load on one side would be 50 pounds. By > summing moments and forces and applying a little trig, one can calculate > the > cable tension. In this case it turns out to be 37 pounds. If one pushes > the load on up to six G's, the cable tension will increase to 222 pounds. > This is far short of the 2,000 pound load carrying capability of 1/8 inch > cable. > > The compression load on the horizontal stabilizer rear member will go from > 29.4 to 176.4 pounds. The rudder post has to work a little harder because > it must sustain the load of both sides, so it will go from 61.2 to 367 > pounds at six G's. > > It looks like Dennis did a good job, in that, there is plenty of reserve > in > the design. The cables and the tangs should be adequate as long as one > does > not over tighten the cables. > > Pre-flight inspections are good. > > Jack B. Hart FF004 > Winchester, IN > > > ________________________________ Message 50 ____________________________________ Time: 09:12:51 PM PST US From: WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Winching a Kolb In a message dated 9/4/2009 5:12:45 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, donaho1@verizon.net writes: while the tail wheel bracket is very nicely done, I still feel it will pull rather hard on the strut. It`s not exactly the strut I`m worried about, it`s the tubing the strut slides into that seems to take a lot of stress when using the winch. Lanny, When running the break-in procedure for the Rotax engine, the FireStar builders manual instructed me to tie the tail to something solid, like a tree or an automobile, by threading the rope (or strap) around the tail post at the boom tube. Maybe that would be a point that you could attach your winch to. Bill Varnes Original Kolb FireStar Audubon NJ Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 51 ____________________________________ Time: 09:13:28 PM PST US From: WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Tail shaking In a message dated 9/4/2009 9:56:44 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, planecrazzzy@yahoo.com writes: But I found out it's those cheap outa round tires I got ( Chin?) I hit my brakes after take-off and it solves it.... Mike & Jazz, I had the same problem with cheap made ying yang chin tires. I also did the 'hit the brakes thing' to stop rotation and vibration after take-off. But then one day I got over excited and hit the brakes while still on the ground. Since I only have those go-kart drum brakes, there was no danger of nosing over, but it did get my attention. I have since used some home made lead weights to balance the wheel/tire assembly. Used double sided tape to attach to inner part of wheel rim. Tried to use auto weights but they wouldn't fit the wheel barrow rims. Bill Varnes Original Kolb FireStar Audubon NJ Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 52 ____________________________________ Time: 09:44:45 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: The Kolb Poll To End All Polls (TKPTEAP) From: Robert Laird Ok, the first 22 or so answers are now available from the poll: http://www.texas-flyer.com/kolb.htm I'll update it again tomorrow night. Thanks everyone! It's a very interesting compilation! -- Robert P.S. If you haven't filled it out yet, please, please do! ________________________________ Message 53 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:17 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Bing carb cleaning From: "cristalclear13" beauford wrote: > Miss Cristal: > You can use just about any aerosol can labeled as "throttle body" and carb > cleaner...without worrying about damaging anything on your Bings...if you use > regular aerosol carburetor cleaner, take care that it does not contact any rubber, > nylon or plastic parts like the floats, the anti-bubble screen over the mainjet, > or the white plastic-looking throat slide part...Regular carburetor cleaner is for > metal only. There is a fundamental difference between carb cleaner and "throttle > body" carb cleaners... The former will likely soften and damage any non-metal > parts. Throttle body carburetor cleaners and regular carbuerator cleaners are > often stocked side by side in the auto parts stores. This can be dangerous.... > They are different products. > > ..worth what ye paid fer it... > > beauford > FF-076 > Brandon, FL > > > --- Thanks Beauford and everyone for the advice. I found a friend today (who built his own Glasiar a few years ago). He had some Gumout Carb and Choke Cleaner. It cleaned it up real nice, and he used his air compressor to dry it off and blow out the bit of deteriorated choke seal that had almost plugged up the choke tube. Now I'm just waiting on my new "choke piston with gasket" part to get here. Hoping to get her running by Saturday so I can fly to the Vidalia EAA Annual Fly-In. -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261695#261695 ________________________________ Message 54 ____________________________________ Time: 10:50:24 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail Wire Tangs Breaking And other Tail Brace Issue Contin From: "henry.voris" Clear thinking... Thanks Jack. -------- Henry Firefly Five-Charlie-Bravo Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=261697#261697 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.