---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 09/24/09: 21 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:40 AM - Re: Rice King clutches (George Myers) 2. 06:22 AM - Re: Rice King clutches (Richard Girard) 3. 06:53 AM - Re: Rice King clutches (Jason Omelchuck) 4. 07:23 AM - Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra (pj.ladd) 5. 07:42 AM - Re: Rice King clutches (George Myers) 6. 07:51 AM - Re: Re: Rice King clutches (George Myers) 7. 10:28 AM - Re: Kolb homecoming (Rick Lewis) 8. 12:07 PM - Glide at idle power vs prop stopped (Thom Riddle) 9. 02:34 PM - Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra (russ kinne) 10. 02:43 PM - Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra (Richard Girard) 11. 05:11 PM - Re: Rice King clutches (possums) 12. 05:52 PM - Re: Crash (Dana Hague) 13. 06:05 PM - Re: Help please - can't take off (Dana Hague) 14. 06:22 PM - Re: What carb. inlet needle is best. (Dana Hague) 15. 06:44 PM - Re: Help please - can't take off (cristalclear13) 16. 06:57 PM - Re: Re: Help please - can't take off (John Hauck) 17. 07:32 PM - Re: Rice King clutches (George Myers) 18. 07:59 PM - Re: Rice King clutches (Richard Girard) 19. 08:06 PM - Re: Rice King clutches (jerb) 20. 08:28 PM - Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra (robcannon) 21. 09:40 PM - Re: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra (Larry Cottrell) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:40:07 AM PST US From: "George Myers" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches I run a RK400 / C box on a 582 & love it. Only problem is it makes a good drag chute when the engine stops. George Myers From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 9:58 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches Does anyone on the forum run the Rice King (RK 400) clutch with a "C" gearbox? I'm just interested in seeing if others have a similar experience to mine. Rick Girard do not archive ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:22:13 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches From: Richard Girard George, Pretty much my experience, except that it made me so nervous that I took it out. Yes, the engine doesn't idle as smooth as it did when it could disconnect from the prop, but the Mk III doesn't glide like the space shuttle anymore, either. What prop do you run? Rick On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 6:31 AM, George Myers wrote: > I run a RK400 / C box on a 582 & love it. Only problem is it makes a good > drag chute when the engine stops. > > > George Myers > > > *From:* owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto: > owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Girard > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 23, 2009 9:58 PM > *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Kolb-List: Rice King clutches > > > Does anyone on the forum run the Rice King (RK 400) clutch with a "C" > gearbox? I'm just interested in seeing if others have a similar experience > to mine. > > > Rick Girard > > do not archive > > * * > > * * > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://forums.matronics.com* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > ** > > * * > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:53:50 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Rice King clutches From: "Jason Omelchuck" I am running the RK400 clutch on my MKIII with the Yamaha engine. I have a 3.47 "C" gearbox and a 3 bladed IVO medium propeller. Even when my engine was connected directly to the prop, my MKIII still glided like the shuttle :) There was a 6 month gap between flying with no clutch and flying with a clutch and I did not do actual glide tests with no clutch, but my impression is that at my approach speed of 55, there is not that great of a difference in glide. I think as I push my nose down with the prop windmilling and speed increases, I really start to see a difference. The good news is that every landing I do (with the engine at idle) is just like landing with the engine not running, so I get lots of practice of what an engine out landing feels like. I will reserve my judgment on the clutch for when I pull it off this winter and inspect how it is holding up, but I have no problems with how it makes my airplane fly. Jason MKIII Yamaha Powered Portland, OR [quote="rickofudall"]Does anyone on the forum run the Rice King (RK 400) clutch with a "C" gearbox? I'm just interested in seeing if others have a similar experience to mine. Rick Girard do not archive > [b] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264690#264690 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:23:30 AM PST US From: "pj.ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra I have an HKS on a Mark I. It does fine on this but the gross weight is exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand the fellow who clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and would love to hear a flying report.>> Hi, Clipping the trees is nothing to do with power available. It is about getting the approach wrong. Cheers Pat ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:42:01 AM PST US From: "George Myers" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches Warp drive 3 blade 58". I practice shutting down the engine every now & again, mostly on purpose, and the glide ratio is more a trajectory than a glide, about 1 to 1. You have to point the nose at the ground all the way down to keep airspeed up and the prop sounds like a shop fan behind you. I'm currently flying a Quicksilver MXLII while my Twinstar is down for repairs but it has the same setup. I fly in flat country with lots of fields. Don't think I'd use the same setup in less forgiving terrain. From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 8:21 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches George, Pretty much my experience, except that it made me so nervous that I took it out. Yes, the engine doesn't idle as smooth as it did when it could disconnect from the prop, but the Mk III doesn't glide like the space shuttle anymore, either. What prop do you run? Rick On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 6:31 AM, George Myers wrote: I run a RK400 / C box on a 582 & love it. Only problem is it makes a good drag chute when the engine stops. George Myers From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 9:58 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches Does anyone on the forum run the Rice King (RK 400) clutch with a "C" gearbox? I'm just interested in seeing if others have a similar experience to mine. Rick Girard do not archive http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List a>http://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:51:22 AM PST US From: "George Myers" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Rice King clutches So long as my engine is running everything is fine. But the first time your engine stops you're in for a shock. If you decide to shut it off, be plenty high, over a good landing spot, and watch your airspeed. George -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jason Omelchuck Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 8:54 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Rice King clutches I am running the RK400 clutch on my MKIII with the Yamaha engine. I have a 3.47 "C" gearbox and a 3 bladed IVO medium propeller. Even when my engine was connected directly to the prop, my MKIII still glided like the shuttle :) There was a 6 month gap between flying with no clutch and flying with a clutch and I did not do actual glide tests with no clutch, but my impression is that at my approach speed of 55, there is not that great of a difference in glide. I think as I push my nose down with the prop windmilling and speed increases, I really start to see a difference. The good news is that every landing I do (with the engine at idle) is just like landing with the engine not running, so I get lots of practice of what an engine out landing feels like. I will reserve my judgment on the clutch for when I pull it off this winter and inspect how it is holding up, but I have no problems with how it makes my airplane fly. Jason MKIII Yamaha Powered Portland, OR [quote="rickofudall"]Does anyone on the forum run the Rice King (RK 400) clutch with a "C" gearbox? I'm just interested in seeing if others have a similar experience to mine. Rick Girard do not archive > [b] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264690#264690 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:28:38 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb homecoming From: "Rick Lewis" I was wondering also about the Home Coming so I called Travis. He said that they would NOT be able to have it this year, hopefully will next year. He said he realizes this will disappoint a lot of us but sales aren't all that good and they just had a huge exspence attending Sun-N-Fun and Oshkosh. I sure will miss this as I have been looking forward to it for months. Maybe next year. :( Rick Lewis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264729#264729 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:07:03 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Glide at idle power vs prop stopped From: "Thom Riddle" I don't want to beat the corpse any more but I did say that on my next flight I would do some glide testing, which is what I did earlier today. Glide with engine at idle power, NO FLAPS. 65 mph IAS - Descent rate approx 900 fpm 55 mph IAS - Descent rate approx 800 fpm 45 mph IAS - Descent rate approx 700 fpm Glide with engine at idle power, 1/2 FLAPS (my normal landing config) 65 mph IAS - Descent rate approx 1,500 fpm (See why I don't need full flaps?) Glide with prop stopped, NO FLAPS i.e. engine not running and no wind milling. 65 mph IAS - Descent rate approx 1,200 fpm Your results may differ, but that is what my airplane does. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x34 A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that works. - John Gaule Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264764#264764 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 02:34:06 PM PST US From: russ kinne Subject: Re: Kolb-List: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra Pat You're absolutely right about 'getting the approach wrong' causes a lot of accidents. BUT if you have sufficient power, you can stop a descent and even make a go-round. So IMHO power available does have something to do with clipping the trees. If enough power's available, hopefully at least, no tree-clipping. Russ do not archive On Sep 24, 2009, at 10:23 AM, pj.ladd wrote: > > I have an HKS on a Mark I. It does fine on this but the gross > weight is exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand > the fellow who clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and > would love to hear a flying report.>> > > Hi, Clipping the trees is nothing to do with power available. It is > about getting the approach wrong. > > Cheers > > Pat > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:43:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra From: Richard Girard Russ, Depends on which side of the power curve you're on. Get on the back side and you can't climb out with out lowering the nose first. If the trees are too close for that, you're going in no matter how much power you have. Rick Girard do not archive On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 4:31 PM, russ kinne wrote: > > Pat > You're absolutely right about 'getting the approach wrong' causes a lot > of accidents. > BUT if you have sufficient power, you can stop a descent and even make a > go-round. > So IMHO power available does have something to do with clipping the trees. > If enough power's available, hopefully at least, no tree-clipping. > Russ > do not archive > > On Sep 24, 2009, at 10:23 AM, pj.ladd wrote: > >> >> I have an HKS on a Mark I. It does fine on this but the gross weight is >> exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand the fellow who >> clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and would love to hear a >> flying report.>> >> >> Hi, Clipping the trees is nothing to do with power available. It is about >> getting the approach wrong. >> >> Cheers >> >> Pat >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:11:37 PM PST US From: possums Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches At 10:36 AM 9/24/2009, you wrote: >Warp drive 3 blade 58". I practice shutting down the engine every >now & again, mostly on purpose, and the glide ratio is more a >trajectory than a glide, about 1 to 1. You have to point the nose at >the ground all the way down to keep airspeed up and the prop sounds >like a shop fan behind you. I'm currently flying a Quicksilver MXLII >while my Twinstar is down for repairs but it has the same setup. I >fly in flat country with lots of fields. Don't think I'd use the >same setup in less forgiving terrain. > >From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com >[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard Mine must be set up different - or a single seat is a lot different. Shot with a wide angle lens - things look farther away than they really are and I look higher than I really am, etc. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n005ITFp9Q ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 05:52:08 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Crash At 12:15 PM 9/22/2009, Jim Kmet wrote: > >Message to me from Dan Patrick about mishap: > >Hi Jim I just got in from the field preping to get the plane out. Am fine >just a little back and neck stiff. Y ou know the old saying "low and slow" >on final 20o flaps rt.hand for flaps and stick to lt. hand, I went to >40obefore the tree line, ?little low, flaps to 20o switching hands I push >flap handle up and by accident other hand put slight forward pressure on >the stick. I added throttle and back on the stick. Landing gear caught >branches and went in. Poor judgement being that low. All is O K,will rebuild. Low and slow, dump the flaps and the plane's gonna settle. Proper procedure at that point would be add power first, then slowly lift the flaps as the plane accelerates. I'm in Conneticut but I don't know Dan; there are quite a few Kolbs around here... glad to hear he's OK. -Dana -- Aviation is like drugs: You go up, then you come down. You are out a big pile of money and have nothing to show for it but the experience. And you can't wait to do it again. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:05:01 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Help please - can't take off At 01:59 PM 9/19/2009, cristalclear13 wrote: > > >[Crying or Very sad] >I put new choke seals on my Bing carbs. I am still having the same >symptom...advance the throttle and I can't get over 3500-4000rpm. Cristal, different engine and carb, but I had a similar problem on my UltraStar. It would run OK at full throttle if you could get it there, but would be reluctant to get there from cruise. The problem turned out to be the needle clip position; it was running too rich at cruise power and the engine just bogged down and wouldn't accelerate. The day was much hotter and humider (is that a word? more humid, then) than the last time I'd flown it. I doubt it's a fuel delivery problem upstream of the carburetor; if that was the case the carb bowl would fill up at lower power settings and then it would run fine at WOT until the float bowl starved again (had that problem once too). -Dana -- Aviation is like drugs: You go up, then you come down. You are out a big pile of money and have nothing to show for it but the experience. And you can't wait to do it again. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:22:15 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: What carb. inlet needle is best. At 05:20 PM 9/23/2009, Carl Tosh wrote: > >Hi Gang, I am getting ready to replace the old Ultrastar mikuni needle and >seat. What works best with the fuel pump, the plain needle or viton tip? >It has the plain now just want to see what you all think and why. Both will work the same, as long as they're the same size. The Viton needle is supposed to last longer in a high vibration environment (which our planes definitely are, compared to the rigidly mounted engine in a snowmobile). What you do need to make sure of is that you get a 1.5mm needle which is used with a pump. Gravity feed installations use a larger needle. -Dana -- Aviation is like drugs: You go up, then you come down. You are out a big pile of money and have nothing to show for it but the experience. And you can't wait to do it again. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:44:35 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Help please - can't take off From: "cristalclear13" Mystery solved and I am in the air again! Yippee! Check her out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ci_AWK1MvIE It's a beautiful sound! Here's the story. After replacing my choke seals and cleaning my carbs I moved the throttle several times and saw that both slides were moving up and down in sync. I specifically remember checking this because I was alone and had to go from the front to the back checking it at intervals. Then when I went to test fly it, I had this problem that I requested help from you all. I decided to start with the easiest things...cleaning my air filter. Tuesday night while I had the air filter off and had my son with me I had him move the throttle...low and behold... one slide was not moving! Grr! The throttle cable was out of the slide. I went ahead and put the new style of the white cup in and put her back together. Had my son move the throttle several times and everything looked ok, but it was too dark to try her out! So this evening I went out and put on my clean air filters and cranked her up. She sounded so good! I ran it up a bit and still sounded good. I untied her and Took Off! It ran better than it ever has (which is what I was expecting after replacing that deteriorated choke seal). Next time I pull that plug I expect it to be the nice sandy brown that the other one has always been. -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264855#264855 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:57:42 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Help please - can't take off > So this evening I went out and put on my clean air filters and cranked her up. She sounded so good! I ran it up a bit and still sounded good. I untied her and Took Off! It ran better than it ever has (which is what I was expecting after replacing that deteriorated choke seal). Next time I pull that plug I expect it to be the nice sandy brown that the other one has always been. > > -------- > Cristal Waters Hi Cristal/Gang: I am happy for you. Glad you found your problem. Usually, I find my problems are something I have "messed" with, changed, adjusted, etc. john h mkIII Rock House, Oregon ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:32:57 PM PST US From: "George Myers" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches It is set up different, your clutch is stuck. From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of possums Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 7:09 PM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches At 10:36 AM 9/24/2009, you wrote: Warp drive 3 blade 58". I practice shutting down the engine every now & again, mostly on purpose, and the glide ratio is more a trajectory than a glide, about 1 to 1. You have to point the nose at the ground all the way down to keep airspeed up and the prop sounds like a shop fan behind you. I'm currently flying a Quicksilver MXLII while my Twinstar is down for repairs but it has the same setup. I fly in flat country with lots of fields. Don't think I'd use the same setup in less forgiving terrain. From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [ mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard Mine must be set up different - or a single seat is a lot different. Shot with a wide angle lens - things look farther away than they really are and I look higher than I really am, etc. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n005ITFp9Q ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:31 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches From: Richard Girard George is right, either your clutch has welded itself together or something is wrong with the gear drive itself. With the engine off the clutch should be completely disengaged leaving the prop to windmill. Can you spin the pro p freely when the engine is off? Rick Girard do not archive On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 9:32 PM, George Myers wrote: > It is set up different, your clutch is stuck. > > > *From:* owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto: > owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *possums > *Sent:* Thursday, September 24, 2009 7:09 PM > *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches > > > At 10:36 AM 9/24/2009, you wrote: > > Warp drive 3 blade 58=94. I practice shutting down the engine every now & > again, mostly on purpose, and the glide ratio is more a trajectory than a > glide, about 1 to 1. You have to point the nose at the ground all the way > down to keep airspeed up and the prop sounds like a shop fan behind you. I=92m > currently flying a Quicksilver MXLII while my Twinstar is down for repair s > but it has the same setup. I fly in flat country with lots of fields. Don =92t > think I=92d use the same setup in less forgiving terrain. > > *From:* owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-serv er@matronics.com] > *On Behalf Of *Richard Girard > > > Mine must be set up different - or a single seat is a lot different. > Shot with a wide angle lens - things look farther away than they really a re > and I look higher than I really am, etc. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n005ITFp9Q > > > * * > > * * > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://forums.matronics.com* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > ** > > * * > > * > =========== ronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List =========== =========== com/contribution =========== > * > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 08:06:10 PM PST US From: jerb Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Rice King clutches You guys with your clutches air getting soft - check this video out at the link below - a dead stick take off and landing over bad terrain. jerb http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z985xdXW-3w&NR=1 At 05:09 PM 9/24/2009, you wrote: >At 10:36 AM 9/24/2009, you wrote: >>Warp drive 3 blade 58". I practice shutting down the engine every >>now & again, mostly on purpose, and the glide ratio is more a >>trajectory than a glide, about 1 to 1. You have to point the nose >>at the ground all the way down to keep airspeed up and the prop >>sounds like a shop fan behind you. I'm currently flying a >>Quicksilver MXLII while my Twinstar is down for repairs but it has >>the same setup. I fly in flat country with lots of fields. Don't >>think I'd use the same setup in less forgiving terrain. >> >>From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [ >>mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard > > >Mine must be set up different - or a single seat is a lot different. >Shot with a wide angle lens - things look farther away than they really are >and I look higher than I really am, etc. > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n005ITFp9Q > > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List >http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:28:51 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra From: "robcannon" I was actually just looking to hear how the hks does on the Mark III extra. Will it climb with two aboard ? etc. I must have poorly worded my original post. Rob Cannon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264872#264872 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 09:40:30 PM PST US From: "Larry Cottrell" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra Just a guess on my part, since I have owned a Mark III with a 582. The weight of my Firestar is pretty close to what most of the lighter Mark III weigh. The wings on the 3 are larger so it would fly, but I wouldn't want to own one. Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: robcannon To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:28 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra I was actually just looking to hear how the hks does on the Mark III extra. Will it climb with two aboard ? etc. I must have poorly worded my original post. Rob Cannon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=264872#264872 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 09/24/09 18:00:00 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.