Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:33 AM - Fund Raiser List of Contributors - Please Make A Contribution Today! (Matt Dralle)
1. 02:53 AM - Re: For Sale Samsung I8000 Omnia II 16GB Unlocked Gsm Phone. (pj.ladd)
2. 03:51 AM - Re: Trim System Question (Richard Girard)
3. 04:53 AM - Re: solid vs fabric leading edge (Thom Riddle)
4. 06:54 AM - Re: For Sale Samsung I8000 Omnia II 16GB Unlocked Gsm Phone. (Charlie England)
5. 09:06 AM - Re: Trim System Question (Richard & Martha Neilsen)
6. 09:19 AM - Re: Re: solid vs fabric leading edge (Richard Girard)
7. 09:42 AM - Re: Trim System Question (HGRAFF@aol.com)
8. 10:03 AM - Re: Trim System Question (Richard Girard)
9. 01:21 PM - Re: Trim System Question (Richard Pike)
10. 04:58 PM - Re: Trim System Question (chris davis)
11. 05:14 PM - Re: Trim System Question (zeprep251@aol.com)
12. 05:16 PM - Re: Trim System Question (zeprep251@aol.com)
13. 05:53 PM - Pulling a Kolb Trailer (Richard & Martha Neilsen)
14. 06:07 PM - Re: Re: Trim System Question (Richard Girard)
15. 06:22 PM - Re: Trim System Question (HGRAFF@aol.com)
16. 06:54 PM - Re: Trim System Question (HGRAFF@aol.com)
17. 08:12 PM - Re: Trim System Question (chris davis)
18. 11:05 PM - "Starved horse" or "Solid"...... (Nick Cassara)
Message 0
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Subject: | Fund Raiser List of Contributors - Please Make A Contribution |
Today!
Each year at the end of the List Fund Raiser, I post a message acknowledging everyone
that so generously made a Contribution to support the Lists. Its my way
of publicly thanking everyone that took a minute to show their appreciation for
the Lists.
Won't you take a moment and assure that your name is on that List of Contributors
(LOC)? As a number of members have pointed out over the years, the List seems
at least - if not a whole lot more - valuable as a building/flying/recreating/entertainment
tool as your typical magazine subscription!
Please take minute and assure that your name is on this year's LOC! Show others
that you appreciate the Lists. Making a Contribution to support the Lists is
fast and easy using your Credit card or Paypal on the Secure Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
or by dropping a personal check in the mail to:
Matt Dralle / Matronics
PO Box 347
Livermore CA 94551-0347
I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution thus
far in this year's List Fund Raiser! Remember that its YOUR support that keeps
these Lists going and improving! Don't forget to include a little comment about
how the Lists have helped you!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: For Sale Samsung I8000 Omnia II 16GB Unlocked Gsm Phone. |
Outstanding Promo: Buy 2 Products And Get 1 Free Product.>>
Is Matte letting adverts in now? Can things be that bad?.
Pat
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Herb, What engine are you running?
Rick Girard
do not archive
On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 12:43 AM, <HGRAFF@aol.com> wrote:
>
> With about 3 hours of initial test flying completed on a plans built Kolb
> Mark III, trim seems to be OK, at least in 2 axes. When I let go of the
> control stick, the kolb flies nice and level and the long yarn from the
> front mounted antenna flies perfectly straight. I can let go for about a
> good 3 seconds. This was achieved with both Aileron and Rudder trim tabs.
>
> Except there is a slight pitch control problem. With pitch settings all the
> way to the front, (at which point some slack just started in the spring
> system), the nose wants to go pitch down.. When set to the first notch, now
> the nose wants to pitch up. I seem to need some setting in between.
>
> I'm thinking the simplest fix, is to replace the two hefty springs with
> slightly weaker ones, as well make them a smitchen longer to get more into
> the center of the operating settings.
>
> So my question: Is there anything wrong with this approach, or are there
> better (simpler?) ways to achieve the desired result.
>
> I will appreciate your comments.
>
> Herb Graff
> Kolb Mark III 246KT
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: solid vs fabric leading edge |
Rick,
Did the 1932 study indicate the nature of the slight difference in performance?
I.E., stall slower/higher, cruise speed slower higher, etc.
--------
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY
Kolb Slingshot SS-021
Jabiru 2200A #1574
Tennessee Prop 64x31
Life is pleasant. Death is peaceful. It's the transition that's troublesome.
- Isaac Asimov
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=271877#271877
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: For Sale Samsung I8000 Omnia II 16GB Unlocked Gsm Phone. |
pj.ladd wrote:
>
>
> Outstanding Promo: Buy 2 Products And Get 1 Free Product.>>
>
> Is Matte letting adverts in now? Can things be that bad?.
>
> Pat
Highly likely that it just slipped past his spam filters. It happens so
rarely that it really stands out when you see one. Big contrast with
lists on sites like Yahoo, where the ads take up more room than the emails.
Charlie
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Herb
Kolbs are by definition unstable, easy to control but but need to be
flown all the time. First try adjusting the trim cable to find that
point where your plane will fly more level in a notch. It would really
be nice to be able to fold maps in flight on cross countries. So far I
have been able to trim the plane for 3-5 seconds but that has been it.
Even with good stability thermals tend to upset things a bunch. As with
any design there are trade offs and stability is one that falls short.
Try the softer springs and let us know. I have also seen a really good
elevator trim tab system that was purchased from Rans Aircraft that
might also help. Maybe Steve Spence could share his success with his
Rans trim system.
In Florida for the winter with my airplane.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: HGRAFF@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 1:43 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Trim System Question
With about 3 hours of initial test flying completed on a plans built
Kolb Mark III, trim seems to be OK, at least in 2 axes. When I let go of
the control stick, the kolb flies nice and level and the long yarn from
the front mounted antenna flies perfectly straight. I can let go for
about a good 3 seconds. This was achieved with both Aileron and Rudder
trim tabs.
Except there is a slight pitch control problem. With pitch settings
all the way to the front, (at which point some slack just started in the
spring system), the nose wants to go pitch down.. When set to the first
notch, now the nose wants to pitch up. I seem to need some setting in
between.
I'm thinking the simplest fix, is to replace the two hefty springs
with slightly weaker ones, as well make them a smitchen longer to get
more into the center of the operating settings.
So my question: Is there anything wrong with this approach, or are
there better (simpler?) ways to achieve the desired result.
I will appreciate your comments.
Herb Graff
Kolb Mark III 246KT
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: solid vs fabric leading edge |
No, it was a wind tunnel investigation.
Rick
On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 6:53 AM, Thom Riddle <riddletr@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Rick,
>
> Did the 1932 study indicate the nature of the slight difference in
> performance? I.E., stall slower/higher, cruise speed slower higher, etc.
>
> --------
> Thom Riddle
> Buffalo, NY
> Kolb Slingshot SS-021
> Jabiru 2200A #1574
> Tennessee Prop 64x31
>
> Life is pleasant. Death is peaceful. It's the transition that's
> troublesome.
> - Isaac Asimov
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=271877#271877
>
>
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Rick, I'm running with a 2 cycle, forced air cooled, 65 HP, dual magneto
type ignition, Hirth engine, that so far with 12 hours on it (because of
run-in time etc), is purring (screaming?) away without a hitch. Lubrication
is with the recommended 100:1 mix with Blue Max oil. Had to upgrade the
Battery from 160 to 310 CCA so the starter would always go through the
compression. Now cranking speed may be enough to taxi with. Yeah, I would rather
fly with the older four-stroke Revmaster VW, that was first mounted, but
which badly put the A/C out of CG. (Yes, I know about the VW powered Kolbs)
Too bad, the sound of the Revmaster at idle very much matched a P51 taxiing
by. I have a video with that marvelous sound and could upload it, if I
find out how to do that.
Herb Graff
Mark III 246KTdo
In a message dated 11/9/2009 6:51:53 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
aslsa.rng@gmail.com writes:
Herb, What engine are you running?
Rick Girard
do not archive
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Herb, I have a Rotax 582. When I rebuilt the airplane I incorporate a mix of
the 582 and 618 mounts to get the thrust line down as low as I could get it
while running a 66" prop (the original factory recommendation). Then I added
a 1/4" spacer at the rear to change the angle of the thrust line to the
wing. I have about 1 1/2" of clearance from prop tip to boom. Seems to work
for me. I'll send you pics if you'd like.
Rick Girard
On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 11:29 AM, <HGRAFF@aol.com> wrote:
> Rick, I'm running with a 2 cycle, forced air cooled, 65 HP, dual magneto
> type ignition, Hirth engine, that so far with 12 hours on it (because of
> run-in time etc), is purring (screaming?) away without a hitch. Lubrication
> is with the recommended 100:1 mix with Blue Max oil. Had to upgrade the
> Battery from 160 to 310 CCA so the starter would always go through the
> compression. Now cranking speed may be enough to taxi with. Yeah, I would
> rather fly with the older four-stroke Revmaster VW, that was first mounted,
> but which badly put the A/C out of CG. (Yes, I know about the VW powered
> Kolbs) Too bad, the sound of the Revmaster at idle very much matched a P51
> taxiing by. I have a video with that marvelous sound and could upload it, if
> I find out how to do that.
>
> Herb Graff
> Mark III 246KTdo
>
> In a message dated 11/9/2009 6:51:53 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> aslsa.rng@gmail.com writes:
>
> Herb, What engine are you running?
>
> Rick Girard
> do not archive
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
[quote="rickofudall"]Herb, I have a Rotax 582. When I rebuilt the airplane I incorporate
a mix of the 582 and 618 mounts to get the thrust line down as low as
I could get it while running a 66" prop (the original factory recommendation).
Then I added a 1/4" spacer at the rear to change the angle of the thrust line
to the wing. I have about 1 1/2" of clearance from prop tip to boom. Seems
to work for me. I'll send you pics if you'd like.
Rick Girard
Rick, I am also using a 582 but with the stock thrust line. So you have raised
the aft end 1/4" and the changes you have noticed are...? Details please? And
the 582 and the 618 mounts differ how?
Thanks,
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=271969#271969
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Herb ,I had the Rans elevator trim on my KXP and it would fly straight and
level for several minuets but the bank trim -would have to be controlled
by my Knees the Kolbs are unstable -and need to be flown all the time but
the pitch can be trimmed I was using the elevator trim to take pictures an
d it worked well.Just my 2cents .-Chris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider
Pilot=0ADisabled from crash building Firefly =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_______________
_________________=0AFrom: "HGRAFF@aol.com" <HGRAFF@aol.com>=0ATo: kolb-list
@matronics.com=0ASent: Mon, November 9, 2009 1:43:23 AM=0ASubject: Kolb-Lis
t: Trim System Question=0A=0A=0A=0AWith about 3 hours of initial test flyin
g completed on a plans built Kolb Mark III, trim seems to be OK, at least i
n 2 axes. When I let go of the control stick, the kolb flies nice and level
and the long yarn from the front mounted antenna flies perfectly straight.
I can let-go for about a good 3 seconds. This was achieved with both Ail
eron and Rudder trim tabs.=0A=0AExcept there is a slight pitch control prob
lem. With pitch settings all the way to the front, (at which point some sla
ck just started in the spring system), the nose wants to go pitch down.. Wh
en set to the first notch, now the nose wants to pitch up. I seem to need s
ome setting in between.=0A=0AI'm thinking the simplest fix, is to replace t
he two hefty springs with slightly weaker ones, as well make them a smitche
n longer to get more into the center of the operating settings.=0A=0ASo my
question:- Is there anything wrong with this approach, or are there bette
r (simpler?) ways to achieve the desired result. =0A=0AI will appreciate-
==== =0A=0A=0A
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Herb,
Pitch trim sensitivity really should not be a problem.As you burn off fuel
or when you add a passenger,the trim requirements will change.It also cha
nges with power settings due to the high thrust line.Under certain conditi
ons you may even add 1 notch of flap to bring the nose down as I have done
when heavy with fuel and light with passengers.Some times just releasing
the flap handle from it's fully retracted notch and letting it float has
a trimming effect.The effort required to maintain level flight with stick
pressure is very light.
You can make those changes to the spring system or even a trim tab on
the elevator,but I would wait until you can carry a passenger or put a sa
nd bag in the right seat and see how it affects the trim before making any
mods to the system.
G.Aman MK-3 C Jabiru 2200A 490hrs
-----Original Message-----
From: HGRAFF@aol.com
Sent: Mon, Nov 9, 2009 1:43 am
Subject: Kolb-List: Trim System Question
With about 3 hours of initial test flying completed on a plans built Kolb
Mark III, trim seems to be OK, at least in 2 axes. When I let go of the co
ntrol
stick, the kolb flies nice and level and the long yarn from the front moun
ted
antenna flies perfectly straight. I can let go for about a good 3 seconds.
This was achieved with both Aileron and Rudder trim tabs.
Except there is a slight pitch control problem. With pitch settings all th
e
way to the front, (at which point some slack just started in the spring sy
stem),
the nose wants to go pitch down.. When set to the first notch, now the nos
e
wants to pitch up. I seem to need some setting in between.
I'm thinking the simplest fix, is to replace the two hefty springs with
slightly weaker ones, as well make them a smitchen longer to get more into
the
center of the operating settings.
So my question: Is there anything wrong with this approach, or are
there better (simpler?) ways to achieve the desired result.
I will appreciate your comments.
Herb Graff
Kolb Mark III 246KT
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Rick,
4 weeks and counting till departure.How did the van handle the trip with
the trailer?
G.Aman
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard & Martha Neilsen <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
Sent: Mon, Nov 9, 2009 11:50 am
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Trim System Question
Herb
Kolbs are by definition unstable, easy to control but but need to be flown
all the time. First try adjusting the trim cable to find that point where
your
plane will fly more level in a notch. It would really be nice to be able
to fold
maps in flight on cross countries. So far I have been able to trim the pla
ne for
3-5 seconds but that has been it. Even with good stability thermals tend
to
upset things a bunch. As with any design there are trade offs and stabilit
y
is one that falls short. Try the softer springs and let us know. I have al
so
seen a really good elevator trim tab system that was purchased from Rans
Aircraft that might also help. Maybe Steve Spence could share his success
with
his Rans trim system.
In Florida for the winter with my airplane.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From:
HGRAFF@aol.com
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 1:43
AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Trim System
Question
With about 3 hours of initial test flying completed on a plans built Kolb
Mark III, trim seems to be OK, at least in 2 axes. When I let go of the
control stick, the kolb flies nice and level and the long yarn from the
front
mounted antenna flies perfectly straight. I can let go for about a good
3
seconds. This was achieved with both Aileron and Rudder trim tabs.
Except there is a slight pitch control problem. With pitch settings all
the way to the front, (at which point some slack just started in the spr
ing
system), the nose wants to go pitch down.. When set to the first notch,
now
the nose wants to pitch up. I seem to need some setting in between.
I'm thinking the simplest fix, is to replace the two hefty springs with
slightly weaker ones, as well make them a smitchen longer to get more in
to the
center of the operating settings.
So my question: Is there anything wrong with this approach, or are
there better (simpler?) ways to achieve the desired result.
I will appreciate your comments.
Herb Graff
Kolb Mark III 246KT
href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com
href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com
href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/ch
ref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?Kolb-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
Rick
Message 13
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Subject: | Pulling a Kolb Trailer |
Gary
I have a Toyota Sienna (van) pulling my VW powered MKIIIC from Michigan
to Florida in a enclosed custom trailer. It went very well. At times I
would forget the trailer was there. I had to slow to 60-65 and lock the
transmission in forth gear (no over drive). The main issue is wind if it
gets strong the trailer gets pushed around bad. With the winds Ida is
kicking up right now it would be no fun at all and might even have to
stop. We normally take two days but with the trailer we did it in just
over two and a half. My wife drove about 1/3 of the trip and was
surprised how well it went.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: zeprep251@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Trim System Question
Rick,
4 weeks and counting till departure.How did the van handle the trip
with the trailer?
G.Aman
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard & Martha Neilsen <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Mon, Nov 9, 2009 11:50 am
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Trim System Question
Herb
Kolbs are by definition unstable, easy to control but but need to be
flown all the time. First try adjusting the trim cable to find that
point where your plane will fly more level in a notch. It would really
be nice to be able to fold maps in flight on cross countries. So far I
have been able to trim the plane for 3-5 seconds but that has been it.
Even with good stability thermals tend to upset things a bunch. As with
any design there are trade offs and stability is one that falls short.
Try the softer springs and let us know. I have also seen a really good
elevator trim tab system that was purchased from Rans Aircraft that
might also help. Maybe Steve Spence could share his success with his
Rans trim system.
In Florida for the winter with my airplane.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: HGRAFF@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 1:43 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Trim System Question
With about 3 hours of initial test flying completed on a plans built
Kolb Mark III, trim seems to be OK, at least in 2 axes. When I let go of
the control stick, the kolb flies nice and level and the long yarn from
the front mounted antenna flies perfectly straight. I can let go for
about a good 3 seconds. This was achieved with both Aileron and Rudder
trim tabs.
Except there is a slight pitch control problem. With pitch settings
all the way to the front, (at which point some slack just started in the
spring system), the nose wants to go pitch down.. When set to the first
notch, now the nose wants to pitch up. I seem to need some setting in
between.
I'm thinking the simplest fix, is to replace the two hefty springs
with slightly weaker ones, as well make them a smitchen longer to get
more into the center of the operating settings.
So my question: Is there anything wrong with this approach, or are
there better (simpler?) ways to achieve the desired result.
I will appreciate your comments.
Herb Graff
Kolb Mark III 246KT
href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com
href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com
href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
ric.com">www.aeroelectric.com
w.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com
thelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com
ibution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
ator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
Rick
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Sorry, I guessed I missed that part about the difference. It seems to take a
lot of the pitch change with throttle out of it. The big difference I
remember without getting the plans out is the the vibration dampers are
mounted with the deep side up on the 618 mount and the short side is up with
the 582.
Okay, I got the plans out and checked. Originally my plane had a version of
the mount that was a bastardized version of the 618 mount, short side of the
isolator up, a 2" spacer tube and shim plates. Now it just has the isolators
long side up and no tubes. The overall effect was to lower the engine about
2", although it is still about 1" higher than the plans call out for the
582.
I seem to remember it was John H. who mentioned changing the thrust line by
putting shims between the engine plate and the aft isolators, but my memory
could be playing tricks there, too.
Rick
On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org> wrote:
>
> [quote="rickofudall"]Herb, I have a Rotax 582. When I rebuilt the airplane
> I incorporate a mix of the 582 and 618 mounts to get the thrust line down as
> low as I could get it while running a 66" prop (the original factory
> recommendation). Then I added a 1/4" spacer at the rear to change the angle
> of the thrust line to the wing. I have about 1 1/2" of clearance from prop
> tip to boom. Seems to work for me. I'll send you pics if you'd like.
>
> Rick Girard
>
> Rick, I am also using a 582 but with the stock thrust line. So you have
> raised the aft end 1/4" and the changes you have noticed are...? Details
> please? And the 582 and the 618 mounts differ how?
> Thanks,
>
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=271969#271969
>
>
Message 15
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|
Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Yes Rick,
I'd surely would like to see your engine setup. Please send direct to my
Email. Our Kolb, (a small club project, though I'm the only one flying it so
far), uses a 3/8 interposer plate to translate the hole patterns, for an
otherwise standard engine mount. This plate also has heat bent tabs to mount
the muffler to. It took two MAP Gas torches to apply enough heat for the
bending operation. A not very good picture of our engine arrangement is here:
If I get a chance I'll take a better close-up of the mount, though there is
really nothing extraordinary about it.
Herb Graff
Kolb Mark III 246KT
In a message dated 11/9/2009 1:05:08 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
aslsa.rng@gmail.com writes:
Herb, I have a Rotax 582. When I rebuilt the airplane I incorporate a mix
of the 582 and 618 mounts to get the thrust line down as low as I could get
it while running a 66" prop (the original factory recommendation). Then I
added a 1/4" spacer at the rear to change the angle of the thrust line to
the wing. I have about 1 1/2" of clearance from prop tip to boom. Seems to
work for me. I'll send you pics if you'd like.
Rick Girard
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Chris,
Thanks for your input on the trim. Hey, several minutes with hands free is
the very most one can expect. I can just see myself with a bunchie cord
around the stick and my right knee, my arms crossed and a silly smile on my
face. That Rans elevator trim is intriguing. Have you pictures of you
installation or basic references to it. The Kolb is back under roof for the
winter and there could be time for an appropriate mod.
Herb Graff
Kolb Mark III 246KT
In a message dated 11/9/2009 7:58:45 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
capedavis@yahoo.com writes:
Herb ,I had the Rans elevator trim on my KXP and it would fly straight and
level for several minuets but the bank trim would have to be controlled
by my Knees the Kolbs are unstable and need to be flown all the time but
the pitch can be trimmed I was using the elevator trim to take pictures and
it worked well.Just my 2cents .
Chris Davis
KXP 503 492 hrs
Glider Pilot
Disabled from crash building Firefly
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Trim System Question |
Herb , did not take any pics of my installation--- but you can see th
e product athttp://www.shoprans.com/ElevatorTrim.asp-I think the trim tab
was 24 inches and I cut it down to 12 inches the trim wheel was just like
the "old cessna" trim wheel I mounted the wheel just ahead of-the throttl
e-it was an easy and quick-job and worked well for me for a few years u
ntill I sold the KXP. probably still isChris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlid
er Pilot=0ADisabled from crash building Firefly =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A____________
____________________=0AFrom: "HGRAFF@aol.com" <HGRAFF@aol.com>=0ATo: kolb-l
ist@matronics.com=0ASent: Mon, November 9, 2009 9:40:14 PM=0ASubject: Re: K
olb-List: Trim System Question=0A=0AChris,=0A=0AThanks for your input on th
e trim. Hey, several minutes with hands free is the very most one can expec
t. I can just see myself with a bunchie cord around the stick and my right
knee, my arms crossed and a silly smile on my face.-That Rans elevator tr
im is intriguing. Have you pictures of you installation or basic -referen
ces to it.-The Kolb is back under roof for the winter and there-could b
e time for an appropriate mod.=0A=0AHerb Graff=0AKolb Mark III 246KT=0A=0AI
n a message dated 11/9/2009 7:58:45 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, capedavis@y
ahoo.com writes:=0AHerb ,I had the Rans elevator trim on my KXP and it woul
d fly straight and level for several minuets but the bank trim -would hav
e to be controlled by my Knees the Kolbs are unstable -and need to be flo
wn all the time but the pitch can be trimmed I was using the elevator trim
to take pictures and it worked well.Just my 2cents .-Chris Davis=0A>KXP 5
03 492 hrs=0A>Glider Pilot=0A>Disabled from crash building Firefly =0A _
-========================
==== =0A=0A=0A
Message 18
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Subject: | "Starved horse" or "Solid"...... |
Hello Kolbsters,
I am not an engineer of any type, but it is hard for me to believe that if
the numbers were run that the solid wing would not out lift the starved
horse wing. It is my understanding that the thickness of the wing is one of
the factors that affect how much a wing can lift. That said, the different
may not be that great.
Clear skies,
Nick Cassara
Proto-type Kolbra Under reconstruction
Palmer, Alaska
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