---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/24/10: 28 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:55 AM - Re: AD insurance (lucien) 2. 07:46 AM - tie downs (frank.goodnight) 3. 07:52 AM - Speaking of electric fuel pumps... (lucien) 4. 08:09 AM - Re: tie downs (russ kinne) 5. 08:29 AM - Re: tie downs (John Hauck) 6. 09:26 AM - Re: Speaking of electric fuel pumps... (John Hauck) 7. 09:27 AM - Re: tie downs (zeprep251@aol.com) 8. 11:49 AM - Posted photos unavailable (David Kulp) 9. 12:15 PM - Re: AD insurance (Ralph B) 10. 12:23 PM - Re: AD insurance (Ralph B) 11. 12:37 PM - Re: tie downs (Ralph B) 12. 12:45 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (John Hauck) 13. 12:52 PM - Re: Posted photos unavailable (John Hauck) 14. 12:54 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (Herb) 15. 01:04 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (John Hauck) 16. 03:47 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (Dana Hague) 17. 03:47 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (Dana Hague) 18. 04:08 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (Herb) 19. 05:11 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (Dana Hague) 20. 05:33 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (robert bean) 21. 05:34 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (John Hauck) 22. 05:34 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (John Hauck) 23. 05:44 PM - Herbs messages are blank...I communicate well with all other lists...yahoo , private emails etc... Matt?? Do not archive...:-) (Herb) 24. 05:55 PM - Re: AD insurance (lucien) 25. 06:01 PM - Re: Herbs messages are blank...I communicate well with all other lists...yahoo , private emails etc... Matt?? Do not archive...:-) (John Hauck) 26. 06:04 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (russ kinne) 27. 06:04 PM - Re: Re: AD insurance (John Hauck) 28. 08:22 PM - Re: AD insurance (Ralph B) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:55:10 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: "lucien" slyck(at)frontiernet.net wrote: > "There's just something about blasting off out of a field somewhere that you just don't quite capture when it's a big airport." -LS > > > I agree. especially nice if you own it and: > 1 always cleared number one for takeoff > 2. absolutely free, including hangar (pretentious name for old shed), farm rent pays taxes > 3. within view of my front window > 4. tires last forever > BB > do not archive > The place I flew my UL out of wasn't nearly this nice. But beggars couldn't be choosers so I flew with a good pint or so of leak-stop in the tires (lots of Mesquite thorns) and just became accustomed to the cow patties. Usually, a low pass over the runway was needed to scatter the cows so they'd let me land. Once or twice it didn't work so very very short field landings were needed. The owner eventually got tired (or scared) of flying and turned the field into a paint-ball park thing, kicking everyone out with only a month's notice. I had to move to one of the local public airports and unfortunately that was also the end of the real magical flying days. I've been trying to recapture that ever since, even tho I love all the planes I've flown since then. Another FSII or a firefly would really be the ticket if I could ever find another farm like that. The quicksilver was a not completely wonderful rough-field plane as the axle and associated structures boogered the bolt holes in pretty short order even with rather large baloon tires. The titan would be better than the quick especially with the titanium axles, but still probably not that great long-term. Nothing I could think of would be better for that kind of rough-field duty than a Kolb, as I remember how well my FSII worked on grass.... Do not archive LS -------- LS Titan II SS Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283208#283208 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:46:47 AM PST US From: "frank.goodnight" Subject: Kolb-List: tie downs Hi all, I realize that almost anything can be used to tie down a airplane, However I would like to find something light enough and compact enough to take with me , in an already over loaded overcrowded a/c, and good enough so that it will do the job in almost any situation. I seem to ask more questions than anyone else on the list . Thats because all this is new to me.Given enough time i hope I can answer questions as well as ask them. Anyone know a brand or type they would recommend?-- and where to buy them-- I hate to spend money on something and then find out that it was not what I really needed, then have to buy again. I had much rather pay a little more and get what I need the first time. I'm still gathering up --stuff-- to go A/C camping with , soon as the weather gets a little warmer ,Getting to be quite a pile. Frank Goodnight Firestar2 Brownsville , TX ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:52:11 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Speaking of electric fuel pumps... From: "lucien" ... I need to post a correction to my previous comments (Thom will probably pop my wrist for this) in the hopes this will be helpful to others. In going through the installation manual, it turns out Rotax does recommend the use of an auxiliary electric pump contrary to what I thought (when you're wrong, you're wrong). this is in 14.2, "Operating limits" on the fuel system. They also list the limits on the fuel pressure, etc. that's required for the overall system. There's also a diagram for the fuel system, tho it looks like it now reflects the new ASTM setup on the new motors which has the fuel distribution block attached to the crossover tube on the carburettors. Another mistake I've been unknowingly making is using 1/4" ID line on the draw side of the pump. That fitting is a 5/16" - you'd have thought I'd have gotten a clue with how hard it was to push that 1/4" line onto it all this time ;). So you're actually supposed to use 5/16" line there. Strange but true. I'm going to go ahead and replace mine with 5/16" soon as I get some in. LS -------- LS Titan II SS Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283220#283220 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:09:13 AM PST US From: russ kinne Subject: Re: Kolb-List: tie downs Frank There are some amazing fibres out there now. Look at the marine- supply places. Check out "Brait" - a woven super-strong rope that's not too expensive; you don't need much. Woven, good UV resistance, lightweight, etc. I'll send you separately a piece I wrote on cordage for one of the boating magazines. DON'T consider any polyesters; sunshine will weaken them. Enjoy your pile! Russ do not archive On Jan 24, 2010, at 10:46 AM, frank.goodnight wrote: > > > Hi all, > > I realize that almost anything can be used to tie down a airplane, > However I would like to find something light enough and compact > enough to take with me , in an already over loaded overcrowded a/ > c, and good enough so that it will do the job in almost any > situation. I seem to ask more questions than anyone else on the > list . Thats because all this is new to me.Given enough time i > hope I can answer questions as well as ask them. Anyone know a > brand or type they would recommend?--and where to buy them-- I hate > to spend money on something and then find out that it was not what > I really needed, then have to buy again. I had much rather pay a > little more and get what I need the first time. I'm still gathering > up --stuff-- to go A/C camping with , soon as the weather gets a > little warmer ,Getting to be quite a pile. > > Frank Goodnight > Firestar2 > Brownsville , TX > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:29:23 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: tie downs > However I would like to find something light enough and compact enough > to take with me , in an already over loaded overcrowded a/c, and good > enough so that it will do the job in almost any situation. > Frank Goodnight Frank G/Gang: I carry two sets of tie downs. One for dirt and softer conditions, and one set for rocky soil. For dirt I have titanium cork screw (doggy) tie downs. Kit comes with a cordura bag and a titanium rod to help twist the augers into the ground. Randy Simpson, Airtime Manufacturing, makes and sells them. He is the gentleman that flew with Arty Trost from Oregon to Lakeland last year. Arty may be able to provide contact info. For rocky conditions, which are predominant out West, I have some home made tie downs. We used 5/16" rebar, welded a chain loop on the side, just below the top so you wohn't beat up the loop with your hammer, and sharpened the bottom end. A small hatchet or hammer does a good job of driving them into rocky soil. I carry a small hatchet. Might come in handy for cutting firewood or killing bears. ;-) I use 3/8" braided rope. Many airports have rotten tie down ropes, or no ropes at all. If you land under extremely windy conditions, you won't be able to leave your airplane to search for ropes, unless you have someone hold the airplane for you. It is important to have enough rope to reach widely spaced tie downs at some airports. Gaining more scope, by placing tie downs further outboard and aft, provides additional holding capacity. If you want the dimension of my rebar tie down stakes let me know and I will go measure them. john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:26:49 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Speaking of electric fuel pumps... > ... I need to post a correction to my previous comments > > In going through the installation manual, it turns out Rotax does > recommend the use of an auxiliary electric pump contrary to what I thought > > Another mistake I've been unknowingly making is using 1/4" ID line on the > draw side of the pump. That fitting is a 5/16" > > I'm going to go ahead and replace mine with 5/16" soon as I get some in. > > LS Lucien/Gang: That's ok. Most of us have been using aux pumps in all kinds of aircraft for many years without experiencing pilot overload. ;-) We have beat this subject to death, over the years, on the Kolb List. Don't think it hurts anything though, because we have new folks come on board all the time, and they probably have not been subjected to this information. I've been using aux pumps since my Ultrastar days. I used two Mikuni pumps. The Cuyuna had two crankcase ports for that reason. The Pierberg fuel pump (used on Opel, Taunus, etc., automobiles for years) has always had a larger intake nipple than the outlet nipple. Won't hurt anything to use 5/16" fuel line on the intake side, however, I have always used 1/4" with success. My 912ULS is happy with the fuel provided by the engine driven pump, alone, sucking through a 1/4" line, at altitudes over 14,500 feet above sea level, for an hour and longer. That is good enough for me. This is backed up by nearly 3,000 912 hours operating with the same system. I am convinced it works well. I'd change my intake fuel line to 5/16", but it would require three new nipples and a lot of difficult work to access and replace. I don't bend like I used to. There are a lot of food Kolb builders and flyers on this List with many years and many hours of experience. We have learned a lot, over the years, about our little airplanes and engines. john h mkIII - Under tornado (not Titan) watch at hauck's holler, alabama. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:27:56 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: tie downs From: zeprep251@aol.com Frank, The Claw,a tie down system in a bag with a special hammer and ropes.8 lbs complete. G Aman -----Original Message----- From: frank.goodnight Sent: Sun, Jan 24, 2010 10:46 am Subject: Kolb-List: tie downs t> Hi all, I realize that almost anything can be used to tie down a airplane, However I would like to find something light enough and compact enough to take wi th me , in an already over loaded overcrowded a/c, and good enough so tha t it will do the job in almost any situation. I seem to ask more questions than anyone else on the list . Thats because all this is new to me.Given enough time i hope I can answer questions as well as ask them. Anyone kn ow a brand or type they would recommend?--and where to buy them-- I hate to spend money on something and then find out that it was not what I really needed, then have to buy again. I had much rather pay a little mo re and get what I need the first time. I'm still gathering up --stuff-- to go A/C camping with , soon as the weather gets a little warmer ,Getting to be quite a pile. Frank Goodnight Firestar2 Brownsville , TX ======================== ============ ======================== ============ ======================== ============ ======================== ============ ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:49:19 AM PST US From: David Kulp Subject: Kolb-List: Posted photos unavailable John and other Kolbers, I got Ralph's photos OK listed as attachments at the bottom. I never get to see yours, though I'd like to. Can you post them as attachments? I get the entire list for the day early the following morning, if that helps. BTW, I'm curious if you have English blood. Your wry sense of humor makes me chuckle from time to time, as in your one sentence explanation about cutting power in the video which covered everything from responsibility for new borrowed aircraft to life itself. If you take notice, Pat's understatements are similar at times. It's interesting to me to observe the different regional personality traits of many posters from all areas of the globe. As an OTR trucker for decades, I've seen those regional differences in person, and to see a post from our friend in ME, I can readily visualize the Mainiacs I've worked with delivering ceramic tile to construction sites and warehouses up there. Lebanon County, out where Dennis S. lives is worlds different from Philly - and they're less than 100 miles apart. I'd sooner deliver 50 loads to Lancaster Co. or Lebanon area than 1 to Philly! Going back up to Maine, the natives there can be as hard-headed as we Pennsylvania Dutch, read: Deutch, can be. Delivered 48K of tile to a tile-setter somewhere N of Portland. His worker had the Labor Readys stack the tile 7 ctns high in the second floor of his barn. I brought up the weight issue with the man, but he was sure it was OK. As we counted the tile, the floor caved in. Poor guy lost his job. It's cool, rainy, unKolb friendly, and few are flying. Please forgive me for musing off-Kolb and onto Kolbers. There IS much more to this list than the technical info available, though it's seldom mentioned save for the rebuke of a few nasties now and then. I've gotten to meet some posters at Homer's place, and I've only seen an expansion and a sharper focus of the man behind the pen on the list. To get back to the machine and it's purpose, before I go flying again when the weather is cooperative, I have a gascolator I'm going to install, and I'm going to buy a Kuntzleman SC103 strobe. There are 3 very active airports within 20 miles of where I fly out of, and my "flying toothpick", as my friend Jim, who flies for Continental calls my FF, is very hard to see. I would greatly appreciate any tips and/or cautions from any who have done these installs. Location, wiring, mounting, whatever. Your experience certainly trumps my logic and common sense, which is pretty much the extent of my resources at this point. My seed and nursery catalogs are streaming in. Makes me anxious for the approaching season of planting and to flying; both very serious loves of mine! Best to all, Dave Kulp Bethlehem PA FireFly 11DMK * * *e: * */07:40:57 PM PST US/* *From: * */"John Hauck" >/* *Subject: * /*_Re: AD insurance_*/ * > Here's what it looks like up here in the north country. These were taken on 1/13/10 in the Kolbra. > > Ralph > Forest Lake airport, MN Ralph/Gang: I landed there in 2000, but it didn'te look like that. Grass was lush and green. There was no one around. I kept heading north to Alaska. Enjoyed your photos. john h mkIII * ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:15:12 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: "Ralph B" ="slyck(at)frontiernet.net" > Ralph, I didn't realize MN is at sea level.. > BB > do not archive On 23, Jan 2010, at 8:49 PM, Ralph B wrote: I knew I was going to get a comment on this. I like to zero out my altimeter on the ground when I am flying locally because it's easier to see exactly how high I am (a carry over from my ultralight days). The actual field elevation at Forest Lake is 925'. Ralph -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 1000 hours 23 years flying it Kolbra 912UL N20386 2 years flying it 120 hrs Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283255#283255 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:53 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: "Ralph B" "John Hauck" > Forgot to ask how you are keeping your eng oil and CHT in the green in cold country? > john h > mkIII John, I bought some "residue-free" duct tape and taped off most of the coolant radiator (in front only) and half of the oil cooler all of the way around. If it's 20F or colder, I need to tape off all of the coolant radiator in front. I can easily remove layers of tape according to the temperature that day. On this particular day, the temp was 26F and I could have used a little more tape as the oil temps were in the 140's and 150's. I like to see them around 175F to 195F. Ralph -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 1000 hours 23 years flying it Kolbra 912UL N20386 2 years flying it 120 hrs Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283256#283256 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:37:05 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: tie downs From: "Ralph B" The claw is good only for medium to hard soil conditions. If it's too soft, they can pull right out. This is why John Hauck carries two sets. I tried to use the doggie corkscrew tiedowns this past year at Oshkosh and they broke trying to screw them into the rock-hard ground. I didn't carry my claws because I thought I wouldn't need them. I rented two stakes from the red barn for $20. They worked during a storm, but I would have felt better with the claws. Live and learn ... Ralph -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 1000 hours 23 years flying it Kolbra 912UL N20386 2 years flying it 120 hrs Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283258#283258 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:45:37 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance > John, I bought some "residue-free" duct tape and taped off most of the coolant radiator (in front only) and half of the oil cooler all of the way around. If it's 20F or colder, I need to tape off all of the coolant radiator in front. I can easily remove layers of tape according to the temperature that day. On this particular day, the temp was 26F and I could have used a little more tape as the oil temps were in the 140's and 150's. I like to see them around 175F to 195F. > > Ralph Hard to keep a 912UL warm, they run much cooler than the 912ULS. With the new Titan Exhaust System, I was flying in 60F OAT with two wraps of 2" tape on each side radiator. I have the oil cooler piggy backed on the radiator. Basically, it the tape covers the area on each side that is outside the width of the oil cooler. I find 5,000 rpm is an ideal speed to operate both the UL and the ULS. Anything below that and you will have to build a fire under the engine to get the engine oil temp up to 190-210F to boil off condensation and contaminants. On my UL, I bypassed the oil cooler in the winter and temps would remain in the normal range at 5,000 rpm and faster. Do you have the official name of the residue free duct tape? Once the glue gets on the hot radiator, it is very difficult to remove. john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:52:43 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Posted photos unavailable Dave K/Gang: If you missed the photos on the Digest Mode, go to the Kolb BBS and scroll down. I just checked to see if they were available. I have already deleted the two posts I attached the photos to. http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=67646&sid=3da1f6dc1a4ec3f 658f1d3e9346bf932 One of the reasons I enjoy flying around the Lower 48, Canada, and Alaska, is being able to enjoy the different cultures in different geographical areas. Of note is the fact that there are some really great folks out there every where I go. Eye ball to eye ball contact is so much better than email on the internet. It is very difficult to write an email and please everyone, or keep from hurting their feelings, or not get you point across the way it was intended. Pays to have tough skin and drive on. Yes, I have a lot of different breeds in me. I am 100% mongrel. Of all the dog breeds and classifications, I think mongrel is the best. The best dogs I have had over the years were mongrels. As far as my feeble attempts at humor, I have been hanging around Patrick Ladd to long. ;-) john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 12:54:51 PM PST US From: Herb Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:11 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance > I knew I was going to get a comment on this. I like to zero out my altimeter on the ground when I am flying locally because it's easier to see exactly how high I am (a carry over from my ultralight days). The actual field elevation at Forest Lake is 925'. > > Ralph Ralph/Gang: Yes, zero altitude at you home field is a carry over from UL training. Many UL trainers had no formal flight training or experience. They didn't know any better. They taught what they knew. This same attitude can be seen at the UL fields at Lakeland and Oshkosh. Zeroing the altimeter at your field elevation only works if you field is at sea level. It does not take long to learn to use the altimeter set at field elevation to fly. Then everything else works, like terrain height, antennas, smoke stacks, Talking to other pilots and control towers, etc. Another bad trait I observe in the UL area of aviation, and some experiemental and GA types, is not orienting the top of the map up as it is held. They attempt to fly with the map oriented to the ground. Same same orienting the moving map on the GPS. It takes a little bit of practice to get used to North Being UP. Makes cardinal directions much easier to work with instead of using up and down, left and right. john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:47:39 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance At 03:51 PM 1/24/2010, John Hauck wrote: >Yes, zero altitude at you home field is a carry over from UL >training. Many UL trainers had no formal flight training or experience... I always set to the field elevation... which, in my case, is sea level. Unless you fly in true flatlands, or never go anywhere, nothing else makes sense. >Another bad trait I observe in the UL area of aviation, and some >experiemental and GA types, is not orienting the top of the map up as it >is held. They attempt to fly with the map oriented to the ground. Same >same orienting the moving map on the GPS. It takes a little bit of >practice to get used to North Being UP. Makes cardinal directions much >easier to work with instead of using up and down, left and right. I don't know about that. When I learned to fly, even in a college flight school oriented to turning out airline pilots, I was taught to orient the map to the ground, not north up. Makes it easier to visualize terrain. Same for the GPS, though there's another reason there: on GPS screens that are taller than they are wide, you need (and get) a better view of where you're going than to to the sides. On my GPS, too, the cursor indicating where I am is displayed in the lower half of the screen, so it shows more of where I'm headed than where I've been. -Dana -- Diplomacy: Saying "nice doggy" until you find a rock. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:47:39 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance At 03:27 PM 1/24/2010, Herb wrote: > Hey Herb, I don't know what it is, but all of your messages show up blank, both in my email and on the forum view. -Dana do not archive -- Life is a sexually transmitted disease. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:08:48 PM PST US From: Herb Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance =======AVGMAIL-223A7870=======-- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 05:11:43 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance Still blank... do not archive At 07:03 PM 1/24/2010, Herb wrote: >=======AVGMAIL-223A7870=======-- -- Stupidity got us into this mess... why can't it get us out? ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 05:33:04 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: robert bean Herb is a man of few words.... heh heh On 24, Jan 2010, at 7:03 PM, Herb wrote: > =======AVGMAIL-223A7870=======-- > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 05:34:07 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance Same here. john h mkIII DO NOT ARCHIVE Still blank... ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:34:26 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: "Herb" In fact, Herb has been firing blanks since 18 Jan, the last six msgs he has sent to the Kolb List. john h mkIII DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:44:15 PM PST US From: Herb Subject: Kolb-List: Herbs messages are blank...I communicate well with all other lists...yahoo , private emails etc... Matt?? Do not archive...:-) ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 05:55:56 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: "lucien" [quote="Dana"]At 03:51 PM 1/24/2010, John Hauck wrote: > Yes, zero altitude at you home field is a carry over from UL training. Many UL trainers had no formal flight training or experience... I always set to the field elevation... which, in my case, is sea level. Unless you fly in true flatlands, or never go anywhere, nothing else makes sense. > Another bad trait I observe in the UL area of aviation, and some experiemental and GA types, is not orienting the top of the map up as it is held. They attempt to fly with the map oriented to the ground. Same same orienting the moving map on the GPS. It takes a little bit of practice to get used to North Being UP. Makes cardinal directions much easier to work with instead of using up and down, left and right. I don't know about that. When I learned to fly, even in a college flight school oriented to turning out airline pilots, I was taught to orient the map to the ground, not north up. Makes it easier to visualize terrain. Same for the GPS, though there's another reason there: on GPS screens that are taller than they are wide, you need (and get) a better view of where you're going than to to the sides. On my GPS, too, the cursor indicating where I am is displayed in the lower half of the screen, so it shows more of where I'm headed than where I've been. -Dana -- Diplomacy: Saying "nice doggy" until you find a rock. > [b] I also orient the chart to match the ground, or at least I was taught that way. I remember the CFI showing me how the outlines of lakes and towns along with landmarks like a RR or a canyon could be used for this. Still seems the easiest method to me when navigating by pilotage primarily, which I've done on my last couple of trips. I always set the altimeter to the local altimeter setting. This is what the other guys are using so if it's off, everyone's off by the same amount and are flying at the same altitudes. If I can't get an altimeter which is rare, I set to the field elevation and reset as soon as I can pick up a nearby AWOS or ATIS. Around here, we're indicating 6500' MSL on up before we even leave the ground, so our actual AGL can take a little bit of math. Definitely a tax on my 6th grade edeyukation. I'm slowly getting used to it, tho. 10,000'MSL is just a kick around the patch.... LS -------- LS Titan II SS Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283309#283309 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 06:01:37 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Herbs messages are blank...I communicate well with all other lists...yahoo , private emails etc... Matt?? Do not archive...:-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Herb" Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 7:38 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Herbs messages are blank...I communicate well with all other lists...yahoo , private emails etc... Matt?? Do not archive...:-) > > Herb, your subject line comes through, but nothing in the body. You'll never get in trouble sending blanks. ;-) john h mkIII DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 06:04:06 PM PST US From: russ kinne Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance Still blank! On Jan 24, 2010, at 7:03 PM, Herb wrote: > =======AVGMAIL-223A7870=======-- > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:04:19 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance ----- Original Message ----- From: "lucien" Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 7:55 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance > > [quote="Dana"]At 03:51 PM 1/24/2010, John Hauck wrote: > >> Yes, zero altitude at you home field is a carry over from UL training. >> Many UL trainers had no formal flight training or experience... > > I always set to the field elevation... which, in my case, is sea level. > Unless you fly in true flatlands, or never go anywhere, nothing else makes > sense. > > >> Another bad trait I observe in the UL area of aviation, and some >> experiemental and GA types, is not orienting the top of the map up as it >> is held. They attempt to fly with the map oriented to the ground. Same >> same orienting the moving map on the GPS. It takes a little bit of >> practice to get used to North Being UP. Makes cardinal directions much >> easier to work with instead of using up and down, left and right. > > I don't know about that. When I learned to fly, even in a college flight > school oriented to turning out airline pilots, I was taught to orient the > map to the ground, not north up. Makes it easier to visualize terrain. > Same for the GPS, though there's another reason there: on GPS screens > that are taller than they are wide, you need (and get) a better view of > where you're going than to to the sides. On my GPS, too, the cursor > indicating where I am is displayed in the lower half of the screen, so it > shows more of where I'm headed than where I've been. > > -Dana > -- > Diplomacy: Saying "nice doggy" until you find a rock. >> [b] > > > I also orient the chart to match the ground, or at least I was taught that > way. I remember the CFI showing me how the outlines of lakes and towns > along with landmarks like a RR or a canyon could be used for this. > > Still seems the easiest method to me when navigating by pilotage > primarily, which I've done on my last couple of trips. > > I always set the altimeter to the local altimeter setting. This is what > the other guys are using so if it's off, everyone's off by the same amount > and are flying at the same altitudes. If I can't get an altimeter which is > rare, I set to the field elevation and reset as soon as I can pick up a > nearby AWOS or ATIS. > > Around here, we're indicating 6500' MSL on up before we even leave the > ground, so our actual AGL can take a little bit of math. Definitely a tax > on my 6th grade edeyukation. I'm slowly getting used to it, tho. > 10,000'MSL is just a kick around the patch.... > > LS > > -------- > LS > Titan II SS > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283309#283309 > > > ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:23 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AD insurance From: "Ralph B" John, here in the flatlands the land elevation doesn't vary much. Local flights are safer with the altimeter zeroed on the ground. It's not just a UL thing. All aerobatic pilots do the same thing no matter where they are performing. Ralph -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 1000 hours 23 years flying it Kolbra 912UL N20386 2 years flying it 120 hrs Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=283322#283322 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.