Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:37 AM - Re: Rotax 503 Running Rough (lucien)
2. 05:51 AM - Re: old Kolb promo videos (lucien)
3. 06:26 AM - Re: old Kolb promo videos (Thom Riddle)
4. 06:56 AM - Re: old Kolb promo videos (lucien)
5. 08:08 AM - Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (lucien)
6. 08:21 AM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (robert bean)
7. 08:33 AM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Bob Kravis)
8. 08:36 AM - Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (lucien)
9. 08:52 AM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Herb)
10. 09:04 AM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Bob Kravis)
11. 09:07 AM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (John Hauck)
12. 09:28 AM - Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Richard Pike)
13. 09:59 AM - Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Thom Riddle)
14. 10:02 AM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Bob Kravis)
15. 11:02 AM - Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (lucien)
16. 11:53 AM - air restart... (Herb)
17. 02:05 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Dana Hague)
18. 02:56 PM - Keeping the Firefly part 103 legal (Lanny Fetterman)
19. 05:45 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (John Hauck)
20. 05:54 PM - In flight Adjustable Trim (Ellery Batchelder Jr)
21. 06:03 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Ellery Batchelder Jr)
22. 06:51 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (John Hauck)
23. 08:53 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Dana Hague)
24. 09:11 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (John Hauck)
25. 09:51 PM - Re: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase (Bob Kravis)
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Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 Running Rough |
gliderx5 wrote:
> Update on the 503. I took everything apart again, tweaked the timing, put in
2 new resistor plugs, and it runs like new. I'm not sure what the issue was,
but I suspect it may have been a condenser. I now have good timing, new points,
condensers, and plugs. I did reseat the wires on the coils, which could have
been an issue also. Now, I just need some nice flying weather. I did a quick
flight today just to check out the engine, but it was windy and bumpy.
>
> Malcolm Morrison
> ---
Well, as you've discovered by now, ;), the older points 503's are a little bit
like our old cars used to be regarding the points. Pretty much the same maintenance/trouble-shooting
steps hold there that used to hold on our old Fords etc....
A couple things to keep in mind on the points motors. With new points, be aware
that the cam lobe on the points will wear a little quickly when they're new (this
is of course reduced if you lube the cam when you install the new points).
So expect the dwell to reduce and the timing to retard a little bit at first.
Once they wear in, tho, they'll stay put. I didn't have to adjust the timing
on my points 503 at all after the points wore in.
Another possible trouble spot is overtightening the fan belt. There's a caution
against this in the manual for the points motors. this can actually pull the
crank out of position slightly which can goof up the timing.
Otherwise, the points 503's are remarkably reliable, unlike our old cars' points
which we were kind of always fiddling with. Once worn in and set, the motor
should run a long time with no maintenance to the points....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
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Subject: | Re: old Kolb promo videos |
Boy now these are some vids you can't ever get tired of watching.... Thanks for
posting these links.
Watching the slingshot fly I don't see why there's not a whole bunch of these.
Which is my next question - how many SS's did there end up being built? Seems
like it should be a pretty popular model? How's the handling on the ground?
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
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Subject: | Re: old Kolb promo videos |
Lucien,
My SS is serial #021 and it was built in 2000 but I don't know how many more have
been built since then. I know there is one under construction in Wellsboro,
PA.
With the very long main gear legs, the weight on the tail is pretty heavy. I think
mine is about 105 lb. in flight level mode, empty. In three point it is closer
to 120 lb. empty and a bit more with fuel. The relatively heavy tail means
it behaves more like GA tail draggers on the ground than most Kolbs. On grass
it is still easy to handle but a little more challenging on pavement.
By way of comparison, it is less squirrelly than the PA-11 (90 hp Cub) that I
got my initial tail wheel training in, but a bit more likely to swap ends than
the RAN S6 tail dragger that I used to fly. It is not hard to handle but you
should have some REAL taildragger experience before going from a short leg Kolb
to an SS on pavement.
In the air, it has wonderfully light controls and quick aileron response compared
to the big wing Kolbs. It does not float at all with the short (22') 110 sqft
wings so when you cut power to idle it comes down right now which makes for
great pinpoint touchdown. Also on the plus side, compared to big wing Kolbs,
is that it has more energy for flare and less drag to kill that energy during
flare.
--------
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY
Kolb Slingshot SS-021
Jabiru 2200A #1574
Tennessee Prop 64x32
An honest politician is one who, when he is bought, will stay bought.
- Simon Cameron
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Subject: | Re: old Kolb promo videos |
Thom Riddle wrote:
> Lucien,
>
> My SS is serial #021 and it was built in 2000 but I don't know how many more
have been built since then. I know there is one under construction in Wellsboro,
PA.
>
> With the very long main gear legs, the weight on the tail is pretty heavy. I
think mine is about 105 lb. in flight level mode, empty. In three point it is
closer to 120 lb. empty and a bit more with fuel. The relatively heavy tail means
it behaves more like GA tail draggers on the ground than most Kolbs. On grass
it is still easy to handle but a little more challenging on pavement.
>
> By way of comparison, it is less squirrelly than the PA-11 (90 hp Cub) that
I got my initial tail wheel training in, but a bit more likely to swap ends than
the RAN S6 tail dragger that I used to fly. It is not hard to handle but you
should have some REAL taildragger experience before going from a short leg Kolb
to an SS on pavement.
>
> In the air, it has wonderfully light controls and quick aileron response compared
to the big wing Kolbs. It does not float at all with the short (22') 110
sqft wings so when you cut power to idle it comes down right now which makes
for great pinpoint touchdown. Also on the plus side, compared to big wing Kolbs,
is that it has more energy for flare and less drag to kill that energy during
flare.
Ok, thanks Thom. And here I was thinking I did have "real" TW time in my FS II
;). But seriously, understood on the handling, I've heard on here on the list
that the SS is more like a traditional TW plane.
If my Kolb plans come together in a few years I'll likely be doing the more docile
FS II or FF, but was just curious about the SS.
Once I get the pickup paid off here in a few months I'll be a little closer to
being able to make a decision....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286535#286535
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote:
> Bob
>
> Just looked at the pics on Barnstormers... Does it come in at pt
> 103 wt? Herb
>
> I like the extra leg brace...good luck...
>
>
I spotted this one the other day too. it has a (mag end) electric start on it so
I doubt it makes weight if the basic FF is within 20lbs of 254.
But I don't know that figure - anyone know offhand what the typical empty weight
is on the FF in basic form intended for 103?
--------
LS
Titan II SS
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286541#286541
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
You might be able to mount a dummy ballistic chute (featherweight) and make weight.
:)
BB
do not archive
On 15, Feb 2010, at 11:07 AM, lucien wrote:
>
>
> herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote:
>> Bob
>>
>> Just looked at the pics on Barnstormers... Does it come in at pt
>> 103 wt? Herb
>>
>> I like the extra leg brace...good luck...
>>
>>
>
>
> I spotted this one the other day too. it has a (mag end) electric start on it
so I doubt it makes weight if the basic FF is within 20lbs of 254.
>
> But I don't know that figure - anyone know offhand what the typical empty weight
is on the FF in basic form intended for 103?
>
> --------
> LS
> Titan II SS
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286541#286541
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
Hal, the owner says it's current weight is 280#. With the Part 103
allowance for a chute it needs to be 278#. So without the battery and
starter it should make legal weight.
bk
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 11:07 AM, lucien <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote:
> > Bob
> >
> > Just looked at the pics on Barnstormers... Does it come in at pt
> > 103 wt? Herb
> >
> > I like the extra leg brace...good luck...
> >
> >
>
>
> I spotted this one the other day too. it has a (mag end) electric start on
> it so I doubt it makes weight if the basic FF is within 20lbs of 254.
>
> But I don't know that figure - anyone know offhand what the typical empty
> weight is on the FF in basic form intended for 103?
>
> --------
> LS
> Titan II SS
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286541#286541
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
slyck(at)frontiernet.net wrote:
> You might be able to mount a dummy ballistic chute (featherweight) and make
weight.
> :)
> BB
> do not archive
>
>
Getting rid of the electric start would be the #1 thing I'd do. that's a lot of
dead weight that you don't really need. You could put on the Rotax pull start
and a Key West regulator (if you really wanted to do away with the battery altogether)
and lose a good 20lbs right off the bat.
With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to pull through that
you could probably start it up in the seat without a lot of trouble.....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286545#286545
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
Hey!!! You are stealing my idea!!! :-) Herb
At 10:14 AM 2/15/2010, you wrote:
>
>You might be able to mount a dummy ballistic chute (featherweight)
>and make weight.
>:)
>BB
>do not archive
>
>On 15, Feb 2010, at 11:07 AM, lucien wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote:
> >> Bob
> >>
> >> Just looked at the pics on Barnstormers... Does it come in at pt
> >> 103 wt? Herb
> >>
> >> I like the extra leg brace...good luck...
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > I spotted this one the other day too. it has a (mag end) electric
> start on it so I doubt it makes weight if the basic FF is within 20lbs of 254.
> >
> > But I don't know that figure - anyone know offhand what the
> typical empty weight is on the FF in basic form intended for 103?
> >
> > --------
> > LS
> > Titan II SS
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286541#286541
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>02/15/10 07:35:00
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
>From what I've seen at http://www.compactradialengines.com/mz201.html this
engine has an additional 5 hp and saves 13 lbs. with a gearbox and elec.
start. Saves 29 lbs. with a belt drive. What I have not been able to find
is any owner comments about this engine. Has anybody heard any reports or
have an opinion (whoops, now I did it! Should start a new thread if you
respond.)
bk
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Herb <herbgh@nctc.com> wrote:
>
> Hey!!! You are stealing my idea!!! :-) Herb
>
>
> At 10:14 AM 2/15/2010, you wrote:
>
>>
>> You might be able to mount a dummy ballistic chute (featherweight) and
>> make weight.
>> :)
>> BB
>> do not archive
>>
>> On 15, Feb 2010, at 11:07 AM, lucien wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote:
>> >> Bob
>> >>
>> >> Just looked at the pics on Barnstormers... Does it come in at pt
>> >> 103 wt? Herb
>> >>
>> >> I like the extra leg brace...good luck...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > I spotted this one the other day too. it has a (mag end) electric start
>> on it so I doubt it makes weight if the basic FF is within 20lbs of 254.
>> >
>> > But I don't know that figure - anyone know offhand what the typical
>> empty weight is on the FF in basic form intended for 103?
>> >
>> > --------
>> > LS
>> > Titan II SS
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286541#286541
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> 02/15/10 07:35:00
>>
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
> With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to pull
through that you could probably start it up in the seat without a lot of
trouble.....
>
> LS
Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
seat.
It is very difficult to do with a warmed up engine. I always started my
Firestar from outside the aircraft. Everyone else I know did the same
thing.
With the pull start located over the right shoulder, it is located in the
most difficult position to pull start. If you think about it, it is push
start, not pull start from the seated position. I'm sure you already were
aware of this.
I was 47 years old when I built my Firestar and I had a hard time starting a
warm engine. I could not start it cold. I was in fair shape back then.
Kolb advertised the Fire Fly as a Part 103 ultralight. However, one would
have to be extremely careful, do without brakes, and more, to be truly 103
legal.
john hauck
mkIII
Woodville, Florida
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
John Hauck wrote:
> > With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to pull
> through that you could probably start it up in the seat without a lot of
> trouble.....
>
> >
> > LS
> >
> >
>
>
> Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
> seat.
>
> It is very difficult to do with a warmed up engine. I always started my
> Firestar from outside the aircraft. Everyone else I know did the same
> thing.
>
> With the pull start located over the right shoulder, it is located in the
> most difficult position to pull start. If you think about it, it is push
> start, not pull start from the seated position. I'm sure you already were
> aware of this.
>
> I was 47 years old when I built my Firestar and I had a hard time starting a
> warm engine. I could not start it cold. I was in fair shape back then.
>
> Kolb advertised the Fire Fly as a Part 103 ultralight. However, one would
> have to be extremely careful, do without brakes, and more, to be truly 103
> legal.
>
> john hauck
> mkIII
> Woodville, Florida
Amen. My Hummer had the recoil starter cable routed down the main tube, around
a big pulley by the feet, and then the handle out in front, so that you could
pull it towards you. Maxair Drifters likewise. I did my J-6 the same way, the
pull starter was located with the handle at the base of the panel, and if the
532 was not being obstinate, you could start it from the pilot's seat without
regretting it the next day.
Rigging something like that in a Firefly (or any Kolb) will require some creative
mods around the front end of the cage...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldpoops)
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
I could not start my early FS w/ 447 from the seat when cold but could easily do
so when warm. I'm not strong and have bad shoulders. It probably depends somewhat
upon how the starter rope is routed and how easy your particular engine
is to turn over. Mine had a very light weight 2-blade PowerFin prop so the strength
required to overcome the inertia was minimized.
--------
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY
Kolb Slingshot SS-021
Jabiru 2200A #1574
Tennessee Prop 64x32
An honest politician is one who, when he is bought, will stay bought.
- Simon Cameron
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
The owner just emailed me with a description of the LG mod on the plane. He
said,
"The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor Mr.
Andrew
Johnson EAA CH. 492. There has always been some discussion about the
whipping action of KOLB gear when landing and he thought that the
addition of that part would help with that. I can say that having put
the same thing on my FIRESTAR II and having a whole bunch of landings
on it I am pretty impressed with his idea. He is a retired BOEING
engineer that worked on numerous BOEING airframe designs. I did bend 1
rt side gear leg on my FIRESTAR II by hitting an unseen hole in a field
but even then the support leg prevented the gear leg from folding back
and I was able to taxi back to the apron. The legs are mounted by MIG
welding 4130 steel tabs to the outside of the frame at a location that
will transfer any loads to the most tubes and on the axel support
bracket. They are readily removable if deemed unneeded. I spoke about
this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't think
it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them. In retrospect,
having the same parts installed on my FIRESTAR II, I wish that they
would include something like this on their kits. It does do the job
for me very nicely and adds very little weight. The only un-removable
parts are the 4 small tabs welded to the frame and axel support
brackets. Those part might go a couple of ounces but I feel the gain is
worth the weight."
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 12:05 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
>
> > With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to pull
> through that you could probably start it up in the seat without a lot of
> trouble.....
>
>>
>> LS
>>
>
>
> Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
> seat.
>
> It is very difficult to do with a warmed up engine. I always started my
> Firestar from outside the aircraft. Everyone else I know did the same
> thing.
>
> With the pull start located over the right shoulder, it is located in the
> most difficult position to pull start. If you think about it, it is push
> start, not pull start from the seated position. I'm sure you already were
> aware of this.
>
> I was 47 years old when I built my Firestar and I had a hard time starting
> a warm engine. I could not start it cold. I was in fair shape back then.
>
> Kolb advertised the Fire Fly as a Part 103 ultralight. However, one would
> have to be extremely careful, do without brakes, and more, to be truly 103
> legal.
>
> john hauck
> mkIII
> Woodville, Florida
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
John Hauck wrote:
>
> Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
> seat.
>
>
I do, tho, have a lot of time pull-starting 447's overhead with with the starter
rope (on a different plane) - as Thom said, contributing factors on how easy/hard
it is are the prop used and how the handle is routed.
It's a lot harder regardless of engine with a heavier prop, the 3 blade IVO can
put you to task getting the works up to the required 300 rpm especially in the
seat pulling overhead. Also, if the rope is too far back or things are in the
way when you're pulling that won't help either.
My starter rope on my FS II for example was routed a little too far back to have
any hope of starting from the seat. Well, it was a 503 also which is pretty
stiff even with the clutch....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286560#286560
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|
If one has altitude when the engine goes quiet, then the prop could
assist the pull start by putting the plane in a bit of a dive... Low
and slow...better fly the plane..:-) Herb
At 01:01 PM 2/15/2010, you wrote:
>
>
>John Hauck wrote:
> >
> > Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
> > seat.
> >
> >
>
>
>I do, tho, have a lot of time pull-starting 447's overhead with with
>the starter rope (on a different plane) - as Thom said, contributing
>factors on how easy/hard it is are the prop used and how the handle is routed.
>
>It's a lot harder regardless of engine with a heavier prop, the 3
>blade IVO can put you to task getting the works up to the required
>300 rpm especially in the seat pulling overhead. Also, if the rope
>is too far back or things are in the way when you're pulling that
>won't help either.
>
>My starter rope on my FS II for example was routed a little too far
>back to have any hope of starting from the seat. Well, it was a 503
>also which is pretty stiff even with the clutch....
>
>LS
>
>--------
>LS
>Titan II SS
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286560#286560
>
>
>Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>02/15/10 07:35:00
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
At 12:34 PM 2/15/2010, Bob Kravis wrote:
>The owner just emailed me with a description of the LG mod on the
>plane. He said,
>"The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor...I
>spoke about
>this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't think
>it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
>plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them...
Without seeing the details of the installation I can't pass judgement, but
sometimes strengthening the gear legs isn't such a great idea. Often the
gear is the mechanical "fuse" in the system... the gear leg bends in a hard
landing, whereas a stronger gear leg transfers the force (and the damage)
to the much more expensive to repair fuselage.
-Dana
--
Place a half full glass of water before a pessimist, optimist and an
engineer:
The pessimist says the glass is half empty.
The optimist says the glass if half full.
The engineer says the glass is too large.
Message 18
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Subject: | Keeping the Firefly part 103 legal |
When I was trying to decide if I should build a FSII or a Firefly, I
asked Dennis Soulder how difficult it was to keep the Firefly part
103 legal. His answer was "keep it stock and don`t put too much paint
on it if you want to stay below 254 lbs." When I heard it was that
easy to make the Firefly into a fat ultralight, I figured if I was
going to be illegal, I may as well build a FSII. I flew the FSII as a
fat ultralight until I got my Sport Pilot license. Lanny N598LF
Message 19
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
Do you have a url for the gear leg mod on your FF?
I have been on the road and missed that one.
john hauck
mkIII
hauck's holler, alabama
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Kravis
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase
The owner just emailed me with a description of the LG mod on the
plane. He said,
"The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor
Mr. Andrew
Johnson EAA CH. 492. There has always been some discussion about the
whipping action of KOLB gear when landing and he thought that the
addition of that part would help with that. I can say that having put
the same thing on my FIRESTAR II and having a whole bunch of landings
on it I am pretty impressed with his idea. He is a retired BOEING
engineer that worked on numerous BOEING airframe designs. I did bend
1
rt side gear leg on my FIRESTAR II by hitting an unseen hole in a
field
but even then the support leg prevented the gear leg from folding back
and I was able to taxi back to the apron. The legs are mounted by
MIG
welding 4130 steel tabs to the outside of the frame at a location that
will transfer any loads to the most tubes and on the axel support
bracket. They are readily removable if deemed unneeded. I spoke about
this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't
think
it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them. In retrospect,
having the same parts installed on my FIRESTAR II, I wish that they
would include something like this on their kits. It does do the job
for me very nicely and adds very little weight. The only un-removable
parts are the 4 small tabs welded to the frame and axel support
brackets. Those part might go a couple of ounces but I feel the gain
is
worth the weight."
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 12:05 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
wrote:
> With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to
pull through that you could probably start it up in the seat without a
lot of trouble.....
LS
Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the
pilot's seat.
It is very difficult to do with a warmed up engine. I always
started my Firestar from outside the aircraft. Everyone else I know did
the same thing.
With the pull start located over the right shoulder, it is located
in the most difficult position to pull start. If you think about it, it
is push start, not pull start from the seated position. I'm sure you
already were aware of this.
I was 47 years old when I built my Firestar and I had a hard time
starting a warm engine. I could not start it cold. I was in fair shape
back then.
Kolb advertised the Fire Fly as a Part 103 ultralight. However, one
would have to be extremely careful, do without brakes, and more, to be
truly 103 legal.
john hauck
mkIII
Woodville, Florida
==========
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
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le, List Admin.
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Message 20
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Subject: | In flight Adjustable Trim |
Has anyone on the list ever thought of designing something to adjust the
horizontal stabilizers like on a cub to trim a Kolb it just makes more se
nse to me because it would be a positive trim and not make more drag , the
spring system just doesn't work as great as it should for me the air temp
s change so much the springs are not consistent enough for me.
I rebuilt the elevators on my old firestar a few years ago and built a inf
light trim tab into one of the elevators with great results, but that wou
ld make more drag than a stabilizer trim system what are your opinions ?
The reason I ask, I am working on a electric project to do just this on a
Kolb Mk3 it might be a waste of my time but I have to try it anyway than
ks for your time and input.
Ellery Batchelder Jr.
Kolb Mk3C
N213, 582 Rotax
Garmin AERA
-----Original Message-----
From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net>
Sent: Mon, Feb 15, 2010 4:52 pm
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase
At 12:34 PM 2/15/2010, Bob Kravis wrote:
The owner just emailed me with a description of the LG mod on the plane.
He said,
"The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor...I
spoke about
this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't think
it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them...
"The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor...I
spoke about
this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't think
it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them...
Without seeing the details of the installation I can't pass judgement, but
sometimes strengthening the gear legs isn't such a great idea. Often the
gear is the mechanical "fuse" in the system... the gear leg bends in a ha
rd landing, whereas a stronger gear leg transfers the force (and the damag
e) to the much more expensive to repair fuselage.
-Dana
--
Place a half full glass of water before a pessimist, optimist and an engi
neer:
The pessimist says the glass is half empty.
The optimist says the glass if half full.
The engineer says the glass is too large.
========================
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Message 21
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
john This is the link to the firefly with Gear mod
http://www.barnstormers.com/listing_images.php?id=407976&ZOOM=b9e91f59
1b3a8e07d790803c287cbe4d
Ellery Batchelder Jr.
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Sent: Mon, Feb 15, 2010 8:41 pm
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase
Do you have a url for the gear leg mod on your FF?
I have been on the road and missed that one.
john hauck
mkIII
hauck's holler, alabama
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Kravis
Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase
The owner just emailed me with a description of the LG mod on the plane.
He said,
"The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor Mr.
Andrew
Johnson EAA CH. 492. There has always been some discussion about the
whipping action of KOLB gear when landing and he thought that the
addition of that part would help with that. I can say that having put
the same thing on my FIRESTAR II and having a whole bunch of landings
on it I am pretty impressed with his idea. He is a retired BOEING
engineer that worked on numerous BOEING airframe designs. I did bend 1
rt side gear leg on my FIRESTAR II by hitting an unseen hole in a field
but even then the support leg prevented the gear leg from folding back
and I was able to taxi back to the apron. The legs are mounted by MIG
welding 4130 steel tabs to the outside of the frame at a location that
will transfer any loads to the most tubes and on the axel support
bracket. They are readily removable if deemed unneeded. I spoke about
this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't think
it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them. In retrospect,
having the same parts installed on my FIRESTAR II, I wish that they
would include something like this on their kits. It does do the job
for me very nicely and adds very little weight. The only un-removable
parts are the 4 small tabs welded to the frame and axel support
brackets. Those part might go a couple of ounces but I feel the gain is
worth the weight."
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 12:05 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
> With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to pull thr
ough that you could probably start it up in the seat without a lot of trou
ble.....
LS
Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
seat.
It is very difficult to do with a warmed up engine. I always started my
Firestar from outside the aircraft. Everyone else I know did the same th
ing.
With the pull start located over the right shoulder, it is located in the
most difficult position to pull start. If you think about it, it is push
start, not pull start from the seated position. I'm sure you already wer
e aware of this.
I was 47 years old when I built my Firestar and I had a hard time starting
a warm engine. I could not start it cold. I was in fair shape back then
.
Kolb advertised the Fire Fly as a Part 103 ultralight. However, one would
have to be extremely careful, do without brakes, and more, to be truly 10
3 legal.
john hauck
mkIII
Woodville, Florida
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
http://forums.matronics.com
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
ref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
ref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
========================
===========
-= - The Kolb-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
-
-========================
========================
===========
-= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums!
-
-= --> http://forums.matronics.com
-
-========================
========================
===========
-= - List Contribution Web Site -
-= Thank you for your generous support!
-= -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-========================
========================
===========
Message 22
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
I do, tho, have a lot of time pull-starting 447's overhead with with the
starter rope (on a different plane) - as Thom said, contributing factors on
how easy/hard it is are the prop used and how the handle is routed.
LS
Titan II SS
Lucien/Gang:
I don't doubt that one bit. However, we are talking about Kolb Aircraft on
the Kolb List.
My US could not be started unless you were standing beside it. The US would
do beautiful hammerhead stalls, but the engine would quit before I could get
the nose pointed back down hill. I'd have to shoot a dead stick landing,
get out, restart, get back in to take off and try it again. It was a quirk
of the Cuyuna. Did not idle with the nose stuck up in a vertical position.
When I got my FS flying, it would do beautiful hamerhead stalls, rotate 180
degrees and never complain. Just sit there and idle. Now I didn't need an
in air restart capability.
One of my dreams was to be able to soar the FS, do an in air restart, climb
back up and do it again. Second day I flew my newly built FS I climbed to
3,000 AGL, shut down the engine, glided to 1,500 feet, reached up, restarted
with a big smile on my face. That worked so good I climbed up to 6,000 feet
AGL, shut down and glided back to 1,500 feet. This time the engine had
chilled right down from 50 to 60 mph wind blowing through it. No way I
could restart, so I did my first engine out landing in my brand new FS, into
a big old hay field. I did have enough sense to do my experiementing over
this large hay field.
I had engine outs because I failed to turn on my aux tank at two hours
flight time with the same FS. On one occassion I got a restart and the
other one I ended up on a dirt road in the middle of a swamp somewhere
between Perry, FL, and Brandford, FL.
That was more than 20 years ago. I wouldn't think of even trying an in air
hand restart now.
Safest way to go is the electric starter. It can save your bacon if you
lose your engine at idle or any other time, especially two strokes, while on
short final. It is also much safer to start the engine while seated in the
aircraft than standing along side it. Lots of horror stories on aircraft
accidents, both UL, Experimental, and GA, from hand starts with no one in
the seat.
john hauck
MKIII
hauck's holler, alabama
Message 23
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
At 09:11 PM 2/15/2010, John Hauck wrote:
>My US could not be started unless you were standing beside it. The US would
>do beautiful hammerhead stalls, but the engine would quit before I could get
>the nose pointed back down hill. I'd have to shoot a dead stick landing,
>get out, restart, get back in to take off and try it again. It was a quirk
>of the Cuyuna...
How was the cord routed? Mine goes through a pulley mounted under the LH
universal joint, and I can start it while sitting in the seat, in flight or
on the ground.
-Dana
--
Why is it called tourist season if we can't shoot at them?
Message 24
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
The cord wasn't routed on the 1984 Ultrastar. It came directly out of
the recoil starter.
john hauck
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
How was the cord routed? Mine goes through a pulley mounted under
the LH universal joint, and I can start it while sitting in the seat, in
flight or on the ground.
-Dana
Message 25
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Subject: | Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase |
john,
The leg is clearly visible in the pictures on the
Barnstormers<http://www.barnstormers.com>listing, you'll have to
search for "firefly" and you'll find Hal Mason's
blue FF.
bk
P.S. Wish me luck!
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 8:41 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
> Do you have a url for the gear leg mod on your FF?
>
> I have been on the road and missed that one.
>
> john hauck
> mkIII
> hauck's holler, alabama
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Bob Kravis <bob.kravis@gmail.com>
> *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com
> *Sent:* Monday, February 15, 2010 11:34 AM
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: Re: Crossed Fingers on purchase
>
> The owner just emailed me with a description of the LG mod on the plane.
> He said,
> "The extra tube is a modification recommended by my EAA tech councilor Mr.
> Andrew
> Johnson EAA CH. 492. There has always been some discussion about the
> whipping action of KOLB gear when landing and he thought that the
> addition of that part would help with that. I can say that having put
> the same thing on my FIRESTAR II and having a whole bunch of landings
> on it I am pretty impressed with his idea. He is a retired BOEING
> engineer that worked on numerous BOEING airframe designs. I did bend 1
> rt side gear leg on my FIRESTAR II by hitting an unseen hole in a field
> but even then the support leg prevented the gear leg from folding back
> and I was able to taxi back to the apron. The legs are mounted by MIG
> welding 4130 steel tabs to the outside of the frame at a location that
> will transfer any loads to the most tubes and on the axel support
> bracket. They are readily removable if deemed unneeded. I spoke about
> this to the KOLB people before doing it and of course they didn't think
> it was necessary. Their approach to the issue was to always have
> plenty of gear legs on hand for people that bend them. In retrospect,
> having the same parts installed on my FIRESTAR II, I wish that they
> would include something like this on their kits. It does do the job
> for me very nicely and adds very little weight. The only un-removable
> parts are the 4 small tabs welded to the frame and axel support
> brackets. Those part might go a couple of ounces but I feel the gain is
> worth the weight."
>
> On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 12:05 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> > With the pull start located overhead, the 447 is easy enough to pull
>> through that you could probably start it up in the seat without a lot of
>> trouble.....
>>
>>>
>>> LS
>>>
>>
>>
>> Obviously you have not tried starting a 447 powered Kolb from the pilot's
>> seat.
>>
>> It is very difficult to do with a warmed up engine. I always started my
>> Firestar from outside the aircraft. Everyone else I know did the same
>> thing.
>>
>> With the pull start located over the right shoulder, it is located in the
>> most difficult position to pull start. If you think about it, it is push
>> start, not pull start from the seated position. I'm sure you already were
>> aware of this.
>>
>> I was 47 years old when I built my Firestar and I had a hard time starting
>> a warm engine. I could not start it cold. I was in fair shape back then.
>>
>> Kolb advertised the Fire Fly as a Part 103 ultralight. However, one would
>> have to be extremely careful, do without brakes, and more, to be truly 103
>> legal.
>>
>> john hauck
>> mkIII
>> Woodville, Florida
>>
>> ==========
>> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>> ==========
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> le, List Admin.
>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c*
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
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