---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 03/27/10: 38 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:28 AM - Re: Warp Drive Propellers (Thom Riddle) 2. 05:41 AM - Re: Re: Warp Drive Propellers (John Hauck) 3. 05:49 AM - Re: Warp Drive Propellers (william sullivan) 4. 05:49 AM - Re: Warp Drive Propellers (Thom Riddle) 5. 06:02 AM - Re: Re: Warp Drive Propellers (John Hauck) 6. 06:05 AM - Re: Warp Drive Propellers (Thom Riddle) 7. 06:13 AM - Re: Re: Warp Drive Propellers (Vic) 8. 06:23 AM - Re: Re: Warp Drive Propellers (robert bean) 9. 06:58 AM - Re: Warp Drive Propellors (william sullivan) 10. 08:12 AM - prop nuts (robert bean) 11. 08:24 AM - Re: prop nuts (william sullivan) 12. 09:36 AM - Re: Re: prop nuts (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 13. 09:58 AM - Battery mounting options (timwarlick) 14. 10:10 AM - Re: Re: prop nuts (Mike Welch) 15. 10:33 AM - Re: Battery mounting options (Sky Biker Richardson) 16. 10:33 AM - Re: Battery mounting options (Larry Cottrell) 17. 10:52 AM - Re: prop nuts (Richard Girard) 18. 10:53 AM - Re: Battery mounting options (Mike Welch) 19. 10:55 AM - Kolb batteries (Mike Welch) 20. 11:24 AM - Re: prop bolts (william sullivan) 21. 11:24 AM - Re: Battery mounting options (Sky Biker Richardson) 22. 11:49 AM - Re: Battery mounting options (Richard Girard) 23. 11:49 AM - Re: Kolb batteries (Eddie) 24. 11:50 AM - Re: prop nuts (Bob) 25. 11:59 AM - Re: Re: prop bolts (Richard Girard) 26. 12:12 PM - Re: prop bolts (william sullivan) 27. 12:34 PM - Re: Battery mounting options (Fran Losey) 28. 01:02 PM - Re: Battery mounting options (Mike Welch) 29. 01:45 PM - Re: Re: Warp Drive Propellers (Jack B. Hart) 30. 02:17 PM - Re: Battery mounting options (robert bean) 31. 02:37 PM - Re: Warp Drive Propellers (Thom Riddle) 32. 03:02 PM - Fire Fly Winshield (lhaggerty) 33. 03:04 PM - Re: Battery mounting options (zeprep251@aol.com) 34. 04:59 PM - Re: Battery mounting options (Fran Losey) 35. 05:24 PM - Re: Battery mounting options (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 36. 06:32 PM - Re: Fire Fly Winshield (chris davis) 37. 06:48 PM - Re: Fire Fly Winshield (lhaggerty) 38. 06:51 PM - Re: Fire Fly Winshield (lhaggerty) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:47 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers From: "Thom Riddle" John Hauck wrote: ...Jabiru has never been able to successfully operate with a composite prop.... Don't tell Sensnich or Jabiru that because Sensenich makes a carbon fiber prop for Jabiru engines that Jabiru recommends, among others. See http://www.sensenich.com/products/browse/14/5/291/0 Don't tell the Titan Tornado dealer in Utah (Motion Aero) that since they've built and been flying for years both Jab 2200 and Jab 3300 Tornaods with Warp Drive props with no problems. They also have a 3300 with an IVO composite prop. See http://www.motionaero.com/Engines-Tornado.html and read captions under top two photos. Why would John Hauck make such a statement that is demonstrably false? -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x32 An ounce of action is worth a ton of theory. - Friedrich Engels Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291911#291911 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:41:04 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers Why would John Hauck make such a statement that is demonstrably false? -------- Thom Riddle Thom R/Gang: He was probably misinformed and made a mistake. john hauck Titus, Alabama ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:49:36 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers - Thom- I think the confusion is because of the Ultralight news article, and like John said it is very old news.- The photos shown in the article seemed to show the hub casting for the three blade prop.- I have a very o ld two blade with a hub like Larry's.- I has been in a storm-blown rollov er, plus my belly-up with the engine running.- Plus years of exposure to salt air.- I went and gave it a careful look-see after the initial report , and there is no visual sign of anything suspicious (no dis-assembly).- It might be interesting to get ahold of Ultralight News and find out why th ey published it.- Darryl at Warp Drive indicated that it may be from a pr oblem 20 years ago.- What kind of prop are you running?- Have you ever had one come apart? - ------------------------- ---------------------- Bill Sul livan ------------------------- ---------------------- Windsor Locks, ct. ------------------------- ---------------------- FS 447/W D 2 blade ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:49:57 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers From: "Thom Riddle" John, It happens to the best of us, which is why I try to not make absolute statements. I was just using a similar question you asked about ultralightnews. That website has been around a very long time and I'm sure the posting is very old and was probably accurate at the time it was made. As Larry noted, their hub design is quite different today. do not archive -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x32 An ounce of action is worth a ton of theory. - Friedrich Engels Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291914#291914 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:02:11 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers I was just using a similar question you asked about ultralightnews. That website has been around a very long time and I'm sure the posting is very old and was probably accurate at the time it was made. As Larry noted, their hub design is quite different today. do not archive -------- Thom Riddle Darryl told me the referenced failures were prop blades supplied by a subcontractor prior to Warp Drive fabricating their own blades, which was prior to 1986. Many years ago I cut a GSC blade root and Warp Drive blade root in half lengthways to compare the two, after I experienced blade failure on my GSC prop. The Warp Drive blade was destroyed when it tried to cut through a 10" yellow pine while mounted on a 912UL on a run away RANS S-12 at wide open throttle. I'll post it if I can find it again. john hauck Titus, Alabama ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:05:27 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers From: "Thom Riddle" Bill, I've owned and flown IVO, GSC, PowerFin, WoodComp and Tennessee props on experimental and light sport aircraft, but never a Warp Drive or Sensenich. Not because I wouldn't, just because those listed were on and working well on airplanes I've bought. Except for the plastic coating on the TN prop that started peeling when flown in the rain and the uneven pitch of the blades on that prop, both of which were fixed by TN free of charge, I've never had a problem with any of those props I've owned. Not many companies stay in the prop business long if their product self-destructs under normal use, does not perform well enough to get repeat business, or the customer support is poor. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x32 An ounce of action is worth a ton of theory. - Friedrich Engels Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291918#291918 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:13:47 AM PST US From: "Vic" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers Robert, I discovered early on that if you remove the larger prop bolts (Warp Hub) first, all that torque is transfered to the smaller bolts. Now I loosen them first. Vic in Maine "The only point I might make, and it may be nothing to worry about, is that once I was torquing the bolts and one of the little outboard fellas decided to strip. -no, I didn't overtorque it, maybe someone else did once? Anyway, since then I use a lower torque value for those. Not sure what the number is, I wrote it on the hub." ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:23:46 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers From: robert bean Good point Vic, I'll keep that in mind. Hope you thaw out ok this weekend. BB do not archive On 27, Mar 2010, at 9:13 AM, Vic wrote: > > Robert, > I discovered early on that if you remove the larger prop bolts (Warp Hub) first, all that torque > is transfered to the smaller bolts. Now I loosen them first. > > Vic in Maine > > > > > "The only point I might make, and it may be nothing to worry about, is that once I was torquing the bolts and > one of the little outboard fellas decided to strip. -no, I didn't overtorque it, maybe someone else did once? > Anyway, since then I use a lower torque value for those. Not sure what the number is, I wrote it on the hub." > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:58:23 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellors - The reason for my concern on this subject is that I have no idea of the age on my Warp Drive, just that it is probably in the mid- to late 1980's. - Larry's photo indicates that mine is a current design, and the only cas t portions are the blade retainers.- The photos showing the hub failures appear to be three blade, and much more complex in their design.- As long as this article seems to be old news, I will just relegate it to special a ttention on the check list.- Thanks to all. - ------------------------- -------------------- Bill Sullivan ------------------------- -------------------- Windsor locks, Ct. ------------------------- -------------------- FS 447/WD 2 bl ade ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:12:54 AM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Kolb-List: prop nuts Rick, I like the looks of the MS21042. I think it may have been the AN 365 nut that gave me the problem and not the bolt but I tossed both of them at the time. The AN363 is beefy but the cut slots may injure the bolt threads over time and repeated use. Those industrial packing nuts look pretty good too. :) BB DSCN2202 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:24:09 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Kolb-List: Re: prop nuts - Bob- I'd want to check with Darryl at Warp Drive before using any type of de-formed locknut.- The torque on that style nut is drastically differ ent than a nylock nut, without supplying adequate pressure to the secured p arts.- On some, you can exceed the recommended torque without the nut eve n pulling tight.- Nylocks have a limited service life, as they lose their drag if used a few times.- Some places recommend replacing nylocks after only a couple of uses.- Be careful, here. - ------------------------- ---------------------- Bill Sul livan ------------------------- ---------------------- Windsor Locks, Ct. ------------------------- ---------------------- FS 447 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:36:59 AM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: prop nuts Bob, Bill, All I use standard nuts on my prop bolts so that I can get a accurate torque setting. Then I add a Nylock locknut over the prop bolt to keep it safe. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC ----- Original Message ----- From: william sullivan To: kolb list Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 11:21 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: prop nuts Bob- I'd want to check with Darryl at Warp Drive before using any type of de-formed locknut. The torque on that style nut is drastically different than a nylock nut, without supplying adequate pressure to the secured parts. On some, you can exceed the recommended torque without the nut even pulling tight. Nylocks have a limited service life, as they lose their drag if used a few times. Some places recommend replacing nylocks after only a couple of uses. Be careful, here. Bill Sullivan Windsor Locks, Ct. FS 447 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:58:02 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options From: "timwarlick" My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I would like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcycle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? -------- Tim BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic Tucson, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:10:10 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: prop nuts Rick=2C Your method is pretty close to what I did. I used standard nuts=2C torqu ed with a 1/4" drive torque wrench=2C then a second standard nut=2C with a tiny daub of Locktite=2C so the first nut stays tight. (No Locktite on the first nut to affect torque setting=2C only on the sec ond one) Mike Welch From: NeilsenRM@comcast.net Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: prop nuts Bob=2C Bill=2C All I use standard nuts on my prop bolts so that I can get a accurate torque se tting. Then I add a Nylock locknut over the prop bolt to keep it safe. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC ----- Original Message ----- From: william sullivan Sent: Saturday=2C March 27=2C 2010 11:21 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: prop nuts Bob- I'd want to check with Darryl at Warp Drive before using any type of de-formed locknut. The torque on that style nut is drastically different than a nylock nut=2C without supplying adequate pressure to the secured par ts. On some=2C you can exceed the recommended torque without the nut even pulling tight. Nylocks have a limited service life=2C as they lose their d rag if used a few times. Some places recommend replacing nylocks after onl y a couple of uses. Be careful=2C here. Bill Sullivan Windsor Locks=2C Ct. FS 447 href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics. com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:33:09 AM PST US From: Sky Biker Richardson Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options What type battery are you using that only last a year? I have a Mark 3 C/91 2 also and use a sealed motorcycle battery and last 3-4 years. They cost mo re that the lead batteries but last longer. It is mounted in the nose alon g with a 3 fuel reserve tank also. > Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > From: tim.warlick@cox.net > Date: Sat=2C 27 Mar 2010 09:57:30 -0700 > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The ba ttery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I wou ld like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcy cle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. Wha t other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > -------- > Tim > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > Tucson=2C AZ > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:33:09 AM PST US From: "Larry Cottrell" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options I would first be curious as to why the battery only lasts "about a year". I get much better use out of mine, more in the range of two years. Larry C Note: If you forward this email, please delete the forwarding history, which includes my email address. ----- Original Message ----- From: timwarlick To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 10:57 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I would like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcycle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? -------- Tim BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic Tucson, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/21/10 07:33:00 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:52:40 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: prop nuts From: Richard Girard Bob, The 21042 you have pictured is the -L variant (lubed), the non-lubed version looks just like your packing nut. As for William's contention that a deformed lock nut requires a different torque than that of a nylock just isn't supported by 43.13-1B or anywhere else that I can find. Atached is the spec for the 21042. Note in the table on page 2 the minimum torque a -4 (1/4") nut must be capable of is 150 in lb., 20% more than the spec for the 1/4-28 blade bolts of the WD prop. Rick On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 10:07 AM, robert bean wrote: > Rick, I like the looks of the MS21042. I think it may have been the AN 365 > nut that gave me the problem and not the bolt > but I tossed both of them at the time. The AN363 is beefy but the cut > slots may injure the bolt threads over time and repeated use. > > Those industrial packing nuts look pretty good too. :) > BB > > > DSCN2202 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:53:09 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options Tim=2C I used the area behind the (right) passenger seat=2C up next to the right main gear socket tube. It fit there reasonably well. I can't vouch that this is a good location=2C especially since I haven't do ne my final weight and balance. Before I reinstall the battery=2C I will be doing my W & B=2C and then I can determine whether or not it will stay at that location=2C due to weight considerations. BTW=2C I also have the same problem with batteries dying early. When I d on't drive my Mercedes SL500 very much=2C the battery goes dead. It seems like everytime I want to drive my car=2C I have to charge the battery first !! And reset the clock=2C and recycle the windows=2C and reset the securit y alarm....pain in the butt!! After getting tired of this routine=2C I bought a battery tender about tw o ago. It's one of those dinky battery chargers things=2C that keep the ba ttery charged at all times. My SL500 fires right up every time!! I'd suggest running down to your local auto parts store and picking up one of those battery tenders. Plus=2C if you park your plane where there isn't any handy 110volt plug-i ns=2C get the solar powered one. From my experience (finally!!)=2C they are worth the effort. BTW=2C the reason a battery dies after only one year=2C is because they g o totally dead between charges. If if were kept charged at al times=2C it would last MUCH longer. In my opinion=2C your problem isn't where you have located a small batter y=2C it's that you don't keep the battery charged properly. Even a bigger battery will go dead=2C if not used very often=2C and the more often they g o dead=2C the sooner they die. Mike Welch > Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > From: tim.warlick@cox.net > Date: Sat=2C 27 Mar 2010 09:57:30 -0700 > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The ba ttery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I wou ld like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcy cle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > -------- > Tim > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > Tucson=2C AZ > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=2C chat and e-mail from your inbox .. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 10:55:31 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb batteries Tim=2C My mind moves quicker than my fingers. Two MONTHS ago=2C is when I bough t a battery tender. The question is simple=3B When your battery was new=2C would it start yo ur motor? If your answer is "yes"=2C then the problem isn't needing a bigg er battery=2C it's keeping the one you have charged!! Because like I said=2C a bigger battery will die=2C too. If your battery will start your motor when the battery is fully charged =2C the trick=2C then=2C is to make sure it is always fully charged!! Right now=2C I have a one year old battery in my motorcycle dieing. I do n't start it but about every 6 months or longer=2C lately. Before I ever b uy another one=2C I will also get the battery tender. This dead battery st uff is just getting old=2C and what's more=2C it's unnecessary!! Just my thoughts..... Mike Welch _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=2C chat and e-mail from your inbox .. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:48 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Kolb-List: Re: prop bolts - Rick- I have no documentation of the difference in torque on various ty pes of locknuts.- But I suggest you try it, and observe the difference. - Take a bolt and put it threads up in a vice.- The bigger the better. - Then use a beam type torque wrench and screw a nylock down.- Dot it a few times, and the torque resistance is a lot lower.- A grade 5 deformed nut has much more resistance, and a grade 8 is very difficult to turn- wit hout being bottomed out.- Using a 5/8" bolt, the deformed nuts can stall an impact wrench before bottoming out.- I spent almost 40 years as a truc k mechanic- the deformed ones can hurt.- - ------------------------- ----------------------- Bill Sullivan ------------------------- ----------------------- Winds or Locks, Ct. ------------------------- ----------------------- FS 44 7 ------------------------- ----------------------- ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:58 AM PST US From: Sky Biker Richardson Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options I have to agree with Mike about the maintainer. As I said mine last 3-4 yrs . I also have a battery solar charging panel mounted in the center gap seal so as to always be something trickling in to the battery. The panel is mou nt on the under side of the clear lexan center gap seal in front of the en gine. From: mdnanwelch7@hotmail.com Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options Tim=2C I used the area behind the (right) passenger seat=2C up next to the right main gear socket tube. It fit there reasonably well. I can't vouch that this is a good location=2C especially since I haven't do ne my final weight and balance. Before I reinstall the battery=2C I will be doing my W & B=2C and then I can determine whether or not it will stay at that location=2C due to weight considerations. BTW=2C I also have the same problem with batteries dying early. When I d on't drive my Mercedes SL500 very much=2C the battery goes dead. It seems like everytime I want to drive my car=2C I have to charge the battery first !! And reset the clock=2C and recycle the windows=2C and reset the securit y alarm....pain in the butt!! After getting tired of this routine=2C I bought a battery tender about tw o ago. It's one of those dinky battery chargers things=2C that keep the ba ttery charged at all times. My SL500 fires right up every time!! I'd suggest running down to your local auto parts store and picking up one of those battery tenders. Plus=2C if you park your plane where there isn't any handy 110volt plug-i ns=2C get the solar powered one. From my experience (finally!!)=2C they are worth the effort. BTW=2C the reason a battery dies after only one year=2C is because they g o totally dead between charges. If if were kept charged at al times=2C it would last MUCH longer. In my opinion=2C your problem isn't where you have located a small batter y=2C it's that you don't keep the battery charged properly. Even a bigger battery will go dead=2C if not used very often=2C and the more often they g o dead=2C the sooner they die. Mike Welch > Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > From: tim.warlick@cox.net > Date: Sat=2C 27 Mar 2010 09:57:30 -0700 > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The ba ttery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I wou ld like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcy cle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > -------- > Tim > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > Tucson=2C AZ > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > <====================== > > > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=2C chat and e-mail from your inbox . Get started. ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 11:49:17 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options From: Richard Girard Tim, Before going to the trouble of mounting a larger battery, moving it or both make sure you are using cables big enough to carry the current and that you have a ground cable going either very close to or directly to the starter motor. My battery is mounted just behind the right seat of my Mk III and I use 4 gauge welding cable to carry both positive and ground. You can find information on calculating voltage drop by size and length of cable on the Aeroelectric forum here on Matronics. Rick On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:34 PM, Mike Welch wrote: > Tim, > > I used the area behind the (right) passenger seat, up next to the right > main gear socket tube. It fit there reasonably well. > I can't vouch that this is a good location, especially since I haven't done > my final weight and balance. > > Before I reinstall the battery, I will be doing my W & B, and then I can > determine whether or not it will stay at that location, due to weight > considerations. > > BTW, I also have the same problem with batteries dying early. When I > don't drive my Mercedes SL500 very much, the battery goes dead. It seems > like everytime I want to drive my car, I have to charge the battery first!! > And reset the clock, and recycle the windows, and reset the security > alarm....pain in the butt!! > After getting tired of this routine, I bought a battery tender about two > ago. It's one of those dinky battery chargers things, that keep the battery > charged at all times. > My SL500 fires right up every time!! > > I'd suggest running down to your local auto parts store and picking up one > of those battery tenders. > Plus, if you park your plane where there isn't any handy 110volt > plug-ins, get the solar powered one. > From my experience (finally!!), they are worth the effort. > > BTW, the reason a battery dies after only one year, is because they go > totally dead between charges. If if were kept charged at al times, it would > last MUCH longer. > > In my opinion, your problem isn't where you have located a small battery, > it's that you don't keep the battery charged properly. Even a bigger > battery will go dead, if not used very often, and the more often they go > dead, the sooner they die. > > Mike Welch > > > > Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > > From: tim.warlick@cox.net > > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 09:57:30 -0700 > > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > > > > > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The > battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I > would like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the > motorcycle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the > nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > > > -------- > > Tim > > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > > Tucson, AZ > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > > > > <====================== > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. Get > started. > > * > > > * > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:49:20 AM PST US From: "Eddie" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Kolb batteries Hi all Eddie here from the UK. I have a mk111 c and my small motorcycle battery died after about 1 year ( hardly used over that winter ) . I replaced the battery with the same size , about 12 amp/hour I think and also at the time, bought a small solar charger panel on special offer, down from =A319.99 to =A39.99 from a place called maplins ( dont know if you have them over there but Im sure you can source one somewhere ) I also spliced into the battery charging lead from the solar panel and split the charge between my kolb and the old car battery I have for my small cheap winch to pull the kolb into the trailer/hangar . Three years later both batteries are still doing fine , the car battery will still winch the plane up into the trailer and as long as I remember to turn the master switch off the 582 spins up into life every time . As others have said batteris dont like to be neglected keep them used or charged or they seem to die. The solar charger is probably the smallest charge available but because it is trickle charging all the time it is daylight it keeps every thing topped up and working . while I am typing I would like to say that I read evrey post here and have learnt such a lot from all who post here . So thanks to all Eddie Bayliss Liverpool Uk mk111 classic Rotax 582 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 11:50:24 AM PST US From: "Bob" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: prop nuts A standard practice, at least at the two aircraft companies I worked at, was to measure the run on torque during initial tightening and add that number to the design torques for either elastic or mechanical locking fasteners. The torques came from Mil Hdkb-5 or the ASTM as I remember for all..MS, AN, NAS..whatever. The addition technique was company specific in there design manuals, but as memory serves was backed up by alot of testing using both bolt stretch or strain gaged bolt tests. Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Girard To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 10:49 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: prop nuts Bob, The 21042 you have pictured is the -L variant (lubed), the non-lubed version looks just like your packing nut. As for William's contention that a deformed lock nut requires a different torque than that of a nylock just isn't supported by 43.13-1B or anywhere else that I can find. Atached is the spec for the 21042. Note in the table on page 2 the minimum torque a -4 (1/4") nut must be capable of is 150 in lb., 20% more than the spec for the 1/4-28 blade bolts of the WD prop. Rick On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 10:07 AM, robert bean wrote: Rick, I like the looks of the MS21042. I think it may have been the AN 365 nut that gave me the problem and not the bolt but I tossed both of them at the time. The AN363 is beefy but the cut slots may injure the bolt threads over time and repeated use. Those industrial packing nuts look pretty good too. :) BB DSCN2202 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 11:59:13 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: prop bolts From: Richard Girard Bill, I don't use grade 5 or 8 anywhere on any aircraft I own. I use AN, NAS, or MS spec fasteners. Notice on the interchangeability table on page 2 that the 21042-4 can be used as a replacement for both the AN 365 Nylock and the AN 363. By definition interchangeability means there is no difference on installation. Rick On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 1:06 PM, william sullivan wrote: > Rick- I have no documentation of the difference in torque on various > types of locknuts. But I suggest you try it, and observe the difference. > Take a bolt and put it threads up in a vice. The bigger the better. Then > use a beam type torque wrench and screw a nylock down. Dot it a few times, > and the torque resistance is a lot lower. A grade 5 deformed nut has much > more resistance, and a grade 8 is very difficult to turn- without being > bottomed out. Using a 5/8" bolt, the deformed nuts can stall an impact > wrench before bottoming out. I spent almost 40 years as a truck mechanic- > the deformed ones can hurt. > > Bill Sullivan > Windsor Locks, Ct. > FS 447 > > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 12:12:13 PM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Kolb-List: Re: prop bolts - I don't have the interchange charts.--I am just issuing a caution b ased on experience with SAE and USS bolts.- Those deformed grade 8 nuts w ere nasty, and grade 5 was only a little easier.- Virtually guaranteed no t to loosen, though. - ------------------------- --------------- Bill Sullivan ------------------------- --------------- Windsor Locks, Ct. ------------------------- --------------- FS 447 ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 12:34:33 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options From: "Fran Losey" V2VsbCBzdGF0ZWQuDQoNCk9uZSBvdGhlciBpdGVtIGZvciBjb25zaWRlcmF0aW9uLiAgTGVhZCBB 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I've got a question for ya=2C since you sound like you know your stuff re : batteries. Is there an easy way to "fix" a dead battery....say=2C the on e that dies after only one year. Can you pour in some baking powder and eat away some of the sulphation=2C clean it out real good=2C and then pour in some new acid? Has anyone ever done this? I bought my MkIII battery about 10 months ago (dry) and then bought some acid at Auto Zone. I'm not pouring in the acid until I'm ready to start my motor. I'm not starting it's life until I'm ready to start it!! BTW=2C I got one of those Harbor Freight chinese battery maintainers for $10 at the store in Springfield=2C MO. Next time I think about it=2C I'll get about 4 more. Mike Welch Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options From: loseyf@comcast.net Well stated. One other item for consideration. Lead Acid Valve Regulated Batteries that sit without a float charge will sulfate. Sulfation lowers capacity as it in hibits the conversion from chemical to electrical energy. Caution must also be taken not to over charge=2C as this causes dry out (gasses leave batter y and cannot reconstitute internally=2C resulting in lower electrolyte leve l...again loss of capacity. How frequently you use the battery will have a big impact on this. My 2 cents. Fran Losey www.mykitlog.com/loseyf Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry From: Richard Girard Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options Tim=2C Before going to the trouble of mounting a larger battery=2C moving i t or= both make sure you are using cables big enough to carry the current and th= at you have a ground cable going either very close to or directl y to the st= arter motor. My battery is mounted just behind the right sea t of my Mk III = and I use 4 gauge welding cable to carry both positive a nd ground. You can = find information on calculating voltage drop by size and length of cable on= the Aeroelectric forum here on Matronics. Rick On Sat=2C Mar 27=2C 2010 = at 12:34 PM=2C Mike Welch wrote: Tim=2C - - I used the area behind the (right) passenger seat=2C up-next to -the r= ight main gear socket tube.- It fit there reasonably well .. I can't-vouch that this is a good location=2C especially since I haven& = #39=3Bt done my final weight and balance. - - Before I reinstall the battery=2C I will be doing my W & B=2C and the n = I can determine whether or not it will stay at that location=2C due t o weight= considerations. - BTW=2C I also have the same problem with batteries dying early.- When I= don't drive my Mercedes SL500 very much=2C the battery goes dead. - It = seems like everytime I want to drive my car=2C I have to charg e the battery f= irst!!- And reset the clock=2C and recycle the windo ws=2C and reset the secur= ity alarm....pain in the butt!! - After getting tired of this routine=2C I bought a battery tender abou t tw= o ago.- It's one of those dinky battery chargers things=2C that keep th= e battery charged at all times. - My SL500 fires right up every time!! - I'd suggest running down to your local auto parts store and picking up= o ne of those battery tenders.- - Plus=2C if you park your plane where there isn't any handy 110volt pl = ug-ins=2C get the solar powered one. - From my experience (finally!!)=2C they are worth the effort. - - BTW=2C the reason a battery dies after only one year=2C is because th ey go = totally dead between charges.- If if were kept charged at al times=2C it wo= uld last MUCH longer. - - In my opinion=2C your problem isn't where you have located a small ba = ttery=2C it's that you don't keep the battery charged properly.- Ev = en a bigger battery will go dead=2C if not used very often=2C and the m ore ofte= n they go dead=2C the sooner they die. - Mike Welch - - - - - - - - - > Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > From: tim.warlick@cox.net > Date: Sat=2C 27 Mar 2010 09:57:30 -0700 = > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Cla= ssic. Th e battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mor= ning s. I would like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than= the motorcycle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in th = e nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > -------- > Tim > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > Tucson=2C AZ > > > > > Read this topi= c online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/= viewtopic.php?p=3D291942#291942 > > > <=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=2C chat and e-m= ail from your i nbox. Get started. get=3D"_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D )=AD=E6=DF=A2{l=8B7=B6r=89h=AFM4=D3M=1Fi=C7=9C=A2=EAz=B9=DE=C1=CA.=AE' =ABN=17=8A=A2V=CB=8A=CBD=99=A8=A5=16=8A=EE=99K=1E=B6=17=8Cj=DA=E8=9E'=2C.+- =15=E6=AD=BA=B7=AC5=AB=81=ABh=AE=DA=1B=AE=8C=2Cz=D8^=99=A9=F2.+-=BA=D8 =A5=8A=D8=9E=B2=CB=9C=85=AB =8A=CBT=9F=AEn=C7+=8A=9Bb=A2p+r=18=AFy'=9A =AD=C8C=A3 =E5=A1=A7{ =AC=81=AE=8C=2Cx(Z=B4P=10>=1A-=A2=C8Z=AD=E6=A7vk=9C =86k=9C=86j+y=A8ky=F8m=B6=9F=FF=C3 &j=DA=E8=9E'=2Cr=895=AB=81=ABh=AC %l=B8=AC=B6=1Bm=A7=FF=F0=C3 =9A=B6=BA'=89=CB=1C=A2o=CDj=F8 j=DA+*=89[.+- =FD=A3�=3BM=13=8D $'=10=11NEC=12I=A9=9E=82=B7=9A=B5=CA'=B5=E9=EDj[(j=F6 =A2-=E5z=F8=9A=B6=17'y=B1h=AE=E9=ACj=1A=DE~=1Bm=A7=FF=DF=A2=BB=B2 f=AD=AE=89r=C7(=9A=1Bm=A7=FF=DF=A2=BB=B2f=AD=AE=89r=C7(=9B=F6=8B =8A=CBB=A2{k=89=BB=AD=8A=89=D6y=B4=A2=B5=E4=E1jy2=A2=E7=E8=AF*.=AE=07=A7z =BA.=B2=CB=A9=8A=ED1=ABm=0E=B6=A5-=B2=D0=1D=9A)=DA=86=B7=9F=86 =DBi=FF=FC0=C2f=AD=AE=89r=C7(=9B=F7(=9E=DAn=EBb=A2xm=B6=9F=FF=C3 &j =DA=E8=9E'=2Cr=89r=89=ED=AE&=EE=B6*'=FD=AF=DB=FD=FA'=B7=FAk{=F6=E8w/=E1 =B6i _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 01:45:51 PM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers At 05:28 AM 3/27/10 -0700, you wrote: > >Don't tell Sensnich or Jabiru that because Sensenich makes a carbon fiber prop for Jabiru engines that Jabiru recommends, among others. See http://www.sensenich.com/products/browse/14/5/291/0 > >Don't tell the Titan Tornado dealer in Utah (Motion Aero) that since they've built and been flying for years both Jab 2200 and Jab 3300 Tornaods with Warp Drive props with no problems. They also have a 3300 with an IVO composite prop. See http://www.motionaero.com/Engines-Tornado.html and read captions under top two photos. > Thom, It is worth noting that the Sensenich is a low inertia two blade propeller with diameters of 60 to 64 inches. The blades are hollow. Also the Warp Drive blades used on the Titan Tornado Jabiru engines provide a 62 inch diameter. Much lower inertia that a 70 to 72 inch Warp Drive propeller. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 02:17:35 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options From: robert bean Tim, do you have a volt meter on the panel? During run mine shows about 15V and I have no problems, including winter downtime. I use a lawn tractor battery from (walmart/autozone) wherever has the best price. They are available in various amp-hr capacities but all share the same dimension. Cranks right up every time. If the battery is low my aggressive charging circuit will squeal the belt for a minute or two. Mine is also located in a mount forward of the pedals. I can slip it out without removing the nose. BB On 27, Mar 2010, at 12:57 PM, timwarlick wrote: > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I would like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcycle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > -------- > Tim > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > Tucson, AZ > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:24 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Warp Drive Propellers From: "Thom Riddle" Jack, Yes indeed. Of course the primary reason for the shorter diameter is the high rpm prop shaft of the direct drive engines, but reducing the diameter reduces inertia too. Unless my Slingshot gets a lot faster due to my planned efforts to decrease drag, the current TN prop will suffice, and it is very low inertia. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY Kolb Slingshot SS-021 Jabiru 2200A #1574 Tennessee Prop 64x32 An ounce of action is worth a ton of theory. - Friedrich Engels Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291983#291983 ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 03:02:33 PM PST US From: "lhaggerty" Subject: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield I have a full windshield on the Fire Fly that I bought, living in Florida, I think that I would like to have the shorter windshield to use in the summer. Can some one send me a template for the shorter one, or hints on how to construct one. Thanks Pete ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 03:04:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options From: zeprep251@aol.com My Harley-Davidson battery cranks the Jabiru even when it's chilly.It's a bit larger than most cycle batteries G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: timwarlick Sent: Sat, Mar 27, 2010 11:57 am Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The bat tery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I would li ke to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the motorcycle batter y) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the nose. What other locat ions are builders using for a larger battery? -------- Tim BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic Tucson, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 04:59:40 PM PST US From: Fran Losey Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options Hey Mike, just finishing up the home chores.... Unfortunately once the battery has deteriorated there is not a lot you can do. If dry out is the issue, due to overcharging, and gasses have been expelled through the pressure relief valve, then if the battery has removeable caps they can be refilled. If not.....there is not much you can do. Lead acid batteries need to be maintained by charging, especially when long periods go by without use. Just like a car we drive all the time.....not an issue. Leave the lawn tractor for a few months...different story. As I had said previously sulfation is basically a buildup on the plates which inhibits the conversion process. Prevention is the best practice. http://www.batteryfaq.org/ This is a fairly good site for reading if anyone is interested, the second page is sectionalized, and there are some good bullets worth reading. Hope that helps. On 3/27/2010 4:01 PM, Mike Welch wrote: > Fran, > > Yup, that's what I was getting at. > > I've got a question for ya, since you sound like you know your stuff > re: batteries. Is there an easy way to "fix" a dead battery....say, > the one that dies after only one year. > > Can you pour in some baking powder and eat away some of the > sulphation, clean it out real good, and then pour in some new acid? > Has anyone ever done this? > > I bought my MkIII battery about 10 months ago (dry) and then bought > some acid at Auto Zone. I'm not pouring in the acid until I'm ready > to start my motor. I'm not starting it's life until I'm ready to > start it!! > > BTW, I got one of those Harbor Freight chinese battery maintainers > for $10 at the store in Springfield, MO. Next time I think about it, > I'll get about 4 more. > > Mike Welch > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > From: loseyf@comcast.net > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 19:16:57 +0000 > > Well stated. > > One other item for consideration. Lead Acid Valve Regulated Batteries > that sit without a float charge will sulfate. Sulfation lowers > capacity as it inhibits the conversion from chemical to electrical > energy. Caution must also be taken not to over charge, as this causes > dry out (gasses leave battery and cannot reconstitute internally, > resulting in lower electrolyte level...again loss of capacity. How > frequently you use the battery will have a big impact on this. > > My 2 cents. Fran Losey www.mykitlog.com/loseyf Sent from my Verizon > Wireless BlackBerry > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From: *Richard Girard > *Date: *Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:32:36 -0500 > *To: * > *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > > Tim, Before going to the trouble of mounting a larger battery, moving > it or= both make sure you are using cables big enough to carry the > current and th= at you have a ground cable going either very close to > or directly to the st= arter motor. My battery is mounted just behind > the right seat of my Mk III = and I use 4 gauge welding cable to carry > both positive and ground. You can = find information on calculating > voltage drop by size and length of cable on= the Aeroelectric forum > here on Matronics. > > Rick > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 = at 12:34 PM, Mike Welch > wrote: > > Tim, > - > - I used the area behind the (right) passenger seat, up-next > to-the r= ight main gear socket tube.- It fit there reasonably > well. > I can't-vouch that this is a good location, especially since I > haven&= #39;t done my final weight and balance. > - > - Before I reinstall the battery, I will be doing my W & B, and > then = I can determine whether or not it will stay at that > location, due to weight= considerations. > > - BTW, I also have the same problem with batteries dying > early.- When I= don't drive my Mercedes SL500 very much, the > battery goes dead.- It = seems like everytime I want to drive my > car, I have to charge the battery f= irst!!- And reset the > clock, and recycle the windows, and reset the secur= ity > alarm....pain in the butt!! > - After getting tired of this routine, I bought a battery tender > about tw= o ago.- It's one of those dinky battery chargers > things, that keep th= e battery charged at all times. > - My SL500 fires right up every time!! > - > I'd suggest running down to your local auto parts store and > picking up= one of those battery tenders.- > - Plus, if you park your plane where there isn't any handy > 110volt pl= ug-ins, get the solar powered one. > - From my experience (finally!!), they are worth the effort. > - > - BTW, the reason a battery dies after only one year, is because > they go = totally dead between charges.- If if were kept charged > at al times, it wo= uld last MUCH longer. > - > - In my opinion, your problem isn't where you have located a > small ba= ttery, it's that you don't keep the battery charged > properly.- Ev= en a bigger battery will go dead, if not used > very often, and the more ofte= n they go dead, the sooner they die. > - > Mike Welch > > - > - > - > - > - > - > - > - > - > > Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > > From: tim.warlick@cox.net > > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 09:57:30 -0700 > > > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Cla > ssic. The battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on > cold mor= nings. I would like to put in a small automotive battery > (still larger than= the motorcycle battery) but it will not fit > behind the rudder pedals in th= e nose. What other locations are > builders using for a larger battery? > > > > -------- > > Tim > > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > > Tucson, AZ > > > > > > > > > > Read this topi= c online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/= viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > > > > <============== > ======== > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-m= ail from > your inbox. Get started. > > * > > get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution * > > > * > > 3D============================================ > 3D============================================ > 3D============================================ > 3D============================================ > > * > ){l7rhM4Miz.'NVDKj',.+-5h,z^.+- > Tn+bp+ry'C { > ,x(ZP>-Zvkkj+ykym > &j',r5h%lm > 'oj j+*[.+-�M > $NECI'j[(jzyhj~mfr(mfr(B{kyjy2*. z.1m)i0fr((nbxm > &j',rr&*''k{w/i > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from > your inbox. Sign up now. > > > * > > > * -- Sincerely, Fran Losey www.mykitlog.com\loseyf ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 05:24:20 PM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options Tim I have a 12AH battery that that I mount in the nose of my MKIIIC that I use to start my VW. I also had issues with my battery dying about every year or sooner. I use a battery maintainer to keep it topped off year round. I just replaced the battery after three years (about normal now). I use a Batteries Plus, Wall mart etc. battery or what ever is convenient and cheep. Keep your plane light and get a battery maintainer/charger. Buy cheap batteries and replace them as necessary. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC ----- Original Message ----- From: "timwarlick" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:57 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Battery mounting options > > My motorcycle battery is mounted in the nose of my Mark 3 Classic. The > battery only lasts about 1 year and I have to jump it on cold mornings. I > would like to put in a small automotive battery (still larger than the > motorcycle battery) but it will not fit behind the rudder pedals in the > nose. What other locations are builders using for a larger battery? > > -------- > Tim > BMW powered Kolb Mk 3 Classic > Tucson, AZ > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291942#291942 > > > ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 06:32:28 PM PST US From: chris davis Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield Pete ,Where do you live in Fl.? I have a short windshield that I will never use as I am going to build a full enclosed windshield-- -want to tra de-? If not I will send you my shorty that Kolb sent me if you pay the sh ipping.=0A-Chris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider Pilot=0ADisabled from c rash building Firefly =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFro m: lhaggerty =0ATo: kolb matronics =0ASent: Sat, March 27, 2010 6:02:21 PM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: F ire Fly Winshield=0A=0A=0AI have a full windshield on the Fire Fly that I b ought, living in Florida, I think that I would like to have the shorter win dshield to use in the summer. Can some one send me a template for the short -======================== ============0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 06:48:33 PM PST US From: "lhaggerty" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield Chris, I would prefer to keep the long one for cold weather and have a short one for the hot Florida summers. I live in beautiful Down Town Homosassa Fl. I would be more than happy to pay shipping. Where are you located. Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: chris davis To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:25 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield Pete ,Where do you live in Fl.? I have a short windshield that I will never use as I am going to build a full enclosed windshield want to trade ? If not I will send you my shorty that Kolb sent me if you pay the shipping. Chris Davis KXP 503 492 hrs Glider Pilot Disabled from crash building Firefly ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: lhaggerty To: kolb matronics Sent: Sat, March 27, 2010 6:02:21 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield I have a full windshield on the Fire Fly that I bought, living in Florida, I think that I would like to have the shorter windshield to use in the summer. Can some one send me a template for the shorter one, or hints on how to construct one. Thanks Pete ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/27/10 19:32:00 ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 06:51:57 PM PST US From: "lhaggerty" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield Sorry to hear about your glider mishap, soaring is a skill that I have not honed, and as you know, the Fire Fly does not glide well. Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: chris davis To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:25 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield Pete ,Where do you live in Fl.? I have a short windshield that I will never use as I am going to build a full enclosed windshield want to trade ? If not I will send you my shorty that Kolb sent me if you pay the shipping. Chris Davis KXP 503 492 hrs Glider Pilot Disabled from crash building Firefly ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: lhaggerty To: kolb matronics Sent: Sat, March 27, 2010 6:02:21 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Fire Fly Winshield I have a full windshield on the Fire Fly that I bought, living in Florida, I think that I would like to have the shorter windshield to use in the summer. Can some one send me a template for the shorter one, or hints on how to construct one. Thanks Pete ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/27/10 19:32:00 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.