Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 08:34 AM - Re: Re: slow flying MkIII's (b young)
2. 08:48 AM - Re: slow flying MkIII's (Thom Riddle)
3. 11:26 AM - Re: safety pins (racerjerry)
4. 11:44 AM - Re: Re: safety pins (Mike Welch)
5. 11:47 AM - Re: Re: safety pins (Richard Girard)
6. 02:35 PM - Re: Re: safety pins (frank goodnight)
7. 04:02 PM - Safety pins (lhaggerty)
8. 05:23 PM - Re: Re: safety pins (russ kinne)
9. 06:29 PM - Re: Re: safety pins (chris davis)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: slow flying MkIII's |
My question for you (and/or others) is this. The static (at rest) thrust
line of the my engine is pointing upwards 3.5 degrees relative to the
bottom of the wing. Is this about right, assuming my mounts are plenty
hard? Note that the axis of the motor mount bolts is not vertical like
on the Rotax but parallel to the longitudinal axis of the airplane.
However I can still raise one side/end vs the other because this mount
bolts to the Kolb engine tube. Not sure this shows in the attached
photo, but that is all I have right now and my camera keeps quitting on
me. Guess it is time for a new one.
--------
Thom Riddle
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
not sure about the sling shot..... the bottom of the mkIII wing has
9 deg positive incidence in flight. if I read your post correctly you
would add 3.5 deg to that, assuming the SS has the same 9 deg in
flight (plus or minus), adding the 3.5 would make the front of the
engine pointing up at 12.5 deg in flight. guess I am going to have to
measure my mike this week... guess in my mind I would think the engine
should have less incidence than the bottom of the wing. making the
prop more perpendicular to the line of travel.
or am I missing something?
Boyd Young
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: slow flying MkIII's |
Boyd,
That is my thought too. I would think that at cruise, the thrust line should be
fairly closely aligned with the relative wind.
BTW, I measured the angles again yesterday and came up with a little different
numbers but still seems the thrust line is pointing too far up. The reason for
the difference in measurement was I used the prop hub this time instead of the
top of the engine.
My Slingshot wing bottom chord has an incidence of 7.5 degrees relative to the
boom tube and horizontal stabilizer (parallel to boom tube). The thrust line (static)
is 9.5 degrees relative to the HS & boom tube, so the engine is point
up only 2 degrees rather than 3.5 degrees. But it still seems to me that it should
be more aligned with relative wind at cruise AOA.
If my SS flies at cruise with an AOA of 7.5 degrees (guess) then the thrust line
(very hard mounts so not perceptible tilting under power) is not parallel to
relative wind by about 9.5 degrees.
ON THE OTHER HAND...
Perhaps this is by design to help offset the effect of the high position of the
thrust line. Still waiting to hear back from Travis on this question.
--------
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)
Kolb Slingshot SS-021
Jabiru 2200A #1574
Tennessee Prop 64x32
I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do
it.
- Pablo Picasso
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=300213#300213
Message 3
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RALPH B. HAS IT RIGHT. Round rings do not snag on tall grass - had it happen once
during taxi IN. NOT A GOOD THING. The round stainless wire safety rings
are referred to by West Marine as "Stainless-Steel Cotter Rings." They have proven
to be very effective as well as quick & easy to install/remove. They also
don't poke holes in fingers. West Marine on-line shows 5 sizes available.
Regardless of what they say, I was using as large a wire size as I could fit
through the clevis pin hole (made me feel better). The ones I used on my Firestar
II 5/16 clevis pins were 1 3/16 OD (not ID) and made from .065 wire.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=300228#300228
Message 4
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Jerry=2C and others=2C
I had this conversation about pins/rings recently with someone=2C althoug
h I can't remember who at the moment.
Maybe in some applications on a plane=2C a latching type pin would work.
Maybe they could be installed on a plane where there is zero chance of eve
r popping loose. Okay=2C fine.
But=2C for me=2C on my plane=2C I choose to ONLY use the stainless steel
rings...period. I make enough mistakes in life=2C to not have to worry abo
ut some life-altering pin snapping loose and falling out!!
When my life can depend on something as simple as the manner in which cle
vis pins are secured=2C why use something that "may" snag on something and
pop loose=2C when something so easy is available... namely stainless steel
rings.
When you secure a ring in place=2C that sucker ain't NEVER coming loose
=2C until you want it to!!
Mike Welch
MkIII
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: safety pins
> From: gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us
> Date: Sun=2C 6 Jun 2010 11:26:34 -0700
> To: kolb-list@matronics.com
>
>
> RALPH B. HAS IT RIGHT. Round rings do not snag on tall grass - had it hap
pen once during taxi IN. NOT A GOOD THING. The round stainless wire safety
rings are referred to by West Marine as "Stainless-Steel Cotter Rings." The
y have proven to be very effective as well as quick & easy to install/remov
e. They also don't poke holes in fingers. West Marine on-line shows 5 sizes
available. Regardless of what they say=2C I was using as large a wire size
as I could fit through the clevis pin hole (made me feel better). The ones
I used on my Firestar II 5/16 clevis pins were 1 3/16 OD (not ID) and made
from .065 wire.
>
> --------
> Jerry King
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=300228#300228
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>
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Message 5
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McMaster Carr calls then cotter rings.:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#pins/=7f0r1z
<http://www.mcmaster.com/#pins/=7f0r1z>They're available in four diameter
s,
three wire sizes, regular and stainless steel.
Rick Girard
Stainless Steel =97 Plain
3/16"-1/4".048"5/8"95390A316<http://www.mcmaster.com/param/asp/psearch.asp?
FAM=Pins&FT_1611=66910&FT_1554=67516&FT_147=60652&FT_137=60708&FT
_1131=69895&FT_184=13416&FT_1782=71482&ppe=8&session=Pins;1611=
66910;1554=67516;M;I>$9.73
per Pack of 100
1/4"-5/16".048"3/4"95390A317<http://www.mcmaster.com/param/asp/psearch.asp?
FAM=Pins&FT_1611=66910&FT_1554=67516&FT_147=60652&FT_137=60708&FT
_1131=69896&FT_184=13416&FT_1782=71483&ppe=8&session=Pins;1611=
66910;1554=67516;M;I>10.23
per Pack of 100
3/8"-7/16".060"1"95390A318<http://www.mcmaster.com/param/asp/psearch.asp?FA
M=Pins&FT_1611=66910&FT_1554=67516&FT_147=60652&FT_137=60708&FT_1
131=69900&FT_184=69968&FT_1782=71484&ppe=8&session=Pins;1611=66
910;1554=67516;M;I>7.00
per Pack of 50
7/16"-1/2".072"1-1/8"95390A319<http://www.mcmaster.com/param/asp/psearch.as
p?FAM=Pins&FT_1611=66910&FT_1554=67516&FT_147=60652&FT_137=60708&
FT_1131=69916&FT_184=6459&FT_1782=71485&ppe=8&session=Pins;1611
=66910;1554=67516;M;I>9.98
per Pack of 50
On Sun, Jun 6, 2010 at 1:26 PM, racerjerry <gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us> wrote:
>
> RALPH B. HAS IT RIGHT. Round rings do not snag on tall grass - had it
> happen once during taxi IN. NOT A GOOD THING. The round stainless wire
> safety rings are referred to by West Marine as "Stainless-Steel Cotter
> Rings." They have proven to be very effective as well as quick & easy to
> install/remove. They also don't poke holes in fingers. West Marine on-l
ine
> shows 5 sizes available. Regardless of what they say, I was using as lar
ge
> a wire size as I could fit through the clevis pin hole (made me feel
> better). The ones I used on my Firestar II 5/16 clevis pins were 1 3/16
OD
> (not ID) and made from .065 wire.
>
> --------
> Jerry King
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=300228#300228
>
>
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>
>
Message 6
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Hi All,
Been a mechanic for over 40 years and STILL learn something new almost every day.
Cotter rings sound great , if for no other reason
than the spring pins that came with my firestar2 often hurt my fingers , am going
to order some cotter rings soon as McMaster carr opens.
Thanks .
Frank Goodnight
Brownsville, TX
PS: Got my airplane back together again , Flew 1.5 hrs today Can't wait to get
back out to the high country so I can get in some high density
altitude practice. The plane will have shed about 75 lbs ( extra fuel and camping
gear) Hope for better results this time around. Should be
at Los Lumas , New Mexico middle of next week.
________________________________
From: racerjerry <gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Sent: Sun, June 6, 2010 1:26:34 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: safety pins
RALPH B. HAS IT RIGHT. Round rings do not snag on tall grass - had it happen once
during taxi IN. NOT A GOOD THING. The round stainless wire safety rings
are referred to by West Marine as "Stainless-Steel Cotter Rings." They have proven
to be very effective as well as quick & easy to install/remove. They also
don't poke holes in fingers. West Marine on-line shows 5 sizes available.
Regardless of what they say, I was using as large a wire size as I could fit
through the clevis pin hole (made me feel better). The ones I used on my Firestar
II 5/16 clevis pins were 1 3/16 OD (not ID) and made from .065 wire.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=300228#300228
Message 7
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Here is a tip to use when you use cotter rings in lieu of cotter pins,
take a pair of needle nose pliers and bend the leading edge of the ring
1/4" 15 degrees back. this will make them easy to put on and off. Pete
Message 8
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FWIW, and IMHO: Cotter rings are a huge improvement over cotter pins/
clips in every case. I'm amazed the whole world/industry hasn't
totally adopted them long ago. You won't be disappointed; use the
Stainless ones.
McMaster-Carr is a great outfit.
do not archive
Russ K
On Jun 6, 2010, at 5:34 PM, frank goodnight wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Been a mechanic for over 40 years and STILL learn something new
> almost every day. Cotter rings sound great , if for no other reason
> than the spring pins that came with my firestar2 often hurt my
> fingers , am going to order some cotter rings soon as McMaster carr
> opens.
> Thanks .
> Frank Goodnight
> Brownsville, TX
>
> PS: Got my airplane back together again , Flew 1.5 hrs today Can't
> wait to get back out to the high country so I can get in some high
> density
> altitude practice. The plane will have shed about 75 lbs ( extra
> fuel and camping gear) Hope for better results this time around.
> Should be
> at Los Lumas , New Mexico middle of next week.
>
>
> From: racerjerry <gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
> To: kolb-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Sun, June 6, 2010 1:26:34 PM
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: safety pins
>
>
> RALPH B. HAS IT RIGHT. Round rings do not snag on tall grass - had
> it happen once during taxi IN. NOT A GOOD THING. The round
> stainless wire safety rings are referred to by West Marine as
> "Stainless-Steel Cotter Rings." They have proven to be very
> effective as well as quick & easy to install/remove. They also
> don't poke holes in fingers. West Marine on-line shows 5 sizes
> available. Regardless of what they say, I was using as large a
> wire size as I could fit through the clevis pin hole (made me feel
> better). The ones I used on my Firestar II 5/16 clevis pins were 1
> 3/16 OD (not ID) and made from .065 wire.
>
> --------
> Jerry King
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
>
Message 9
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Mike/all , i used stainless saftey rings-for the last 8 years=0A-I flew
my KXP after finding one of the Kolb issued pins unhooked and hanging on m
y lift strut-!Never a problem with the rings as you say a simple cure for
a problem with my butt in the wager.Chris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider
Pilot=0ADisabled from crash building Firefly =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A______________
__________________=0AFrom: Mike Welch <mdnanwelch7@hotmail.com>=0ATo: kolb-
list@matronics.com=0ASent: Sun, June 6, 2010 2:44:24 PM=0ASubject: RE: Kolb
-List: Re: safety pins=0A=0AJerry, and others,=0A-=0A- I had this conve
rsation about pins/rings recently with someone, although I can't remember w
ho at the moment.=0A-=0A- Maybe in some applications on a plane, a latc
hing type pin would work.- Maybe they could be installed on a plane where
there is zero chance of ever popping loose.- Okay, fine.=0A- But, for
me, on my plane, I choose to ONLY use the stainless steel rings...period.
- I make enough mistakes in life, to not have to worry about some life-al
tering pin snapping loose and falling out!!=0A-=0A- When my life can de
pend on something as simple as the manner in which clevis pins are secured,
why use something that "may" snag on something and pop loose, when somethi
ng so easy is available... namely stainless steel rings.=0A-=0A- When y
ou secure a ring in place, that sucker ain't NEVER coming loose, until you
want it to!!=0A-=0AMike Welch=0AMkIII=0A-=0A=0A-=0A> Subject: Kolb-Li
st: Re: safety pins=0A> From: gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us=0A> Date: Sun, 6 Jun 20
10 11:26:34 -0700=0A> To: kolb-list@matronics.com=0A> =0A> --> Kolb-List me
ssage posted by: "racerjerry" <gki@suffolk.lib.ny.us>=0A> =0A> RALPH B. HAS
IT RIGHT. Round rings do not snag on tall grass - had it happen once durin
g taxi IN. NOT A GOOD THING. The round stainless wire safety rings are refe
rred to by West Marine as "Stainless-Steel Cotter Rings." They have proven
to be very effective as well as quick & easy to install/remove. They also d
on't poke holes in fingers. West Marine on-line shows 5 sizes available. Re
gardless of what they say, I was using as large a wire size as I could fit
through the clevis pin hole (made me feel better). The ones I used on my Fi
restar II 5/16 clevis pins were 1 3/16 OD (not ID) and made from .065 wire.
=0A> =0A> --------=0A> Jerry King=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> Read this topic o
nline here:=0A> =0A> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=300228#3
00228=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A>===============
========0A>================
=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A=0A________________________________=0AHotmail is redefini
ng busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. See how. =0A
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