Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:37 AM - Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (Richard Girard)
2. 07:22 AM - Re: Re: flight to Michigan (Richard Girard)
3. 08:30 AM - Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (Ralph B)
4. 08:50 AM - Re: Re: flight to Michigan (John Hauck)
5. 08:56 AM - Re: Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (robert bean)
6. 09:26 AM - Re: Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (John Hauck)
7. 10:37 AM - Re: Please help a newbie with fabric patches. (henry.voris)
8. 11:38 AM - Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (Richard Pike)
9. 12:26 PM - Re: Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (robert bean)
10. 02:45 PM - Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (GeoB)
11. 05:04 PM - Re: Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (b young)
12. 06:32 PM - Re: Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (robert bean)
13. 07:48 PM - Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (Richard Pike)
14. 11:53 PM - Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) (GeoB)
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
George, Legality. It's your experiment, you can do as you want. Cover it
with toilet tissue if you want (extreme humorous example).
Your description of the latex "system" is exactly the problem with it. All
evidence of the relative "goodness" of latex are entirely anecdotal. No one
has documented how well the "system" works to protect the polyester fabric
from ultraviolet radiation, to my knowledge, which is the only function
(okay, sealing the fabric is a function, too) for which a coating is used.
Nothing sticks to polyester, period. The Polyfiber system works by using
Polybrush, a vinyl compound to encapsulate the fabric (incidentally, the
exact same fabric is used for peel ply in composite structures for exactly
this reason, the epoxy won't stick to it) and the following coatings of Pol
y
Spray, which contains aluminum powder to protect the fabric from said UV
uses the same solvent and reducers as the Polybrush so that it melts into
the Poly Brush, and Poly Tone, the color coat to make the job purty. :-}
Same solvent, same method of attachment to previous layers.
How well does the PolyFiber system, an honest to God real system, work? The
fellow who lives across the runway from me has a Cub that was covered 25
years ago using the PolyFiber system. It looks as good as if it were done
last week and passes every annual slick as a whistle. The same for the A &
P's T-craft next door. Looks like a museum piece after 7 years.
Repairability: PolyFiber has detailed instructions for fixing everything
from the inevitable hangar rash to major airframe damage. Latex, again, who
knows.
Those are some of the cons to the use of latex which is all done by myth,
legend and rumor.
Incidentally, again, I owned a Minimax for a couple of years that used the
latex system. I kept it hangared at all times unless I was flying it. I
fixed one small abrasion hole with adhesive backed insignia cloth, made a
log book entry of the repair and promptly sold it.
Again, your experiment, do as you wish.
Beauford's Rule.
Rick Girard
LSARM 3178721
Rick Girard
On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 10:25 PM, George Bearden <gab16@sbcglobal.net>wrote
:
> Hey! I need to cover my Kolb. I am new to aircraft, particularly Kolbs.
I
> can=92t learn to fly in this one till I get it recovered.
>
>
> I have been researching the different covering systems. I have also been
> spending a lot of time in the archives here. We have had a lot of posts o
n
> the latex house paint idea. While I haven=92t sensed a consensus on it, I
> haven=92t yet read a well-constructed rebuttal either.
>
>
> One more time, would ya=92ll give me your opinion on this =91system=92?
>
>
> Also- how would I go about using it? It sounds like I would buy the
> aircraft Dacron from whomever, then glue it on with whatever (suggestions
> here?) then shrink it like normal. Then next it seems like folks just app
ly
> two or more coats of a good white (Titanium dioxide) latex house paint an
d
> call it good. Yes, I know many people have used black paint first with wh
ite
> on top of that.
>
>
> Do you suppose I would have trouble getting approved with this, at my nex
t
> airworthiness inspection? Is it =91legal=92? Or is it up to the whim of t
he
> inspector?
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> GeoB
>
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
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Subject: | Re: flight to Michigan |
Ralph, Knowing the allowable emergency operating parameters for the 912 with
a coolant loss is fairly important, especially if you're flying an S-LSA.
After a loss of coolant (LOC) incident, the heads should be Rockwell
hardness inspected for annealing of the heat treatment. If they test soft,
the heads must be replaced (S-LSA) which at current prices is a $12,000+
bill for parts + labor. Almost better to just get a new engine, which is why
I'm always suspicious of used 912's.
Before someone writes in asking where Rick gets his crazy ideas, please
review the Line Maintenance Manual, Section 5-50-00, page 11 and Heavy
Maintenance Manual Section 72-00-00, pages 55 to 74.
Rick Girard
LSARM 3178721
On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Ralph B <ul15@juno.com> wrote:
>
> John and others,
>
> I haven't checked the manual for the 912, but I think it can run for about
> an hour without coolant. The max CHT (I think) is 330F. My buddy's CHT was
> at 300F and he said there was no engine damage. I wouldn't want to be miles
> from nowhere without coolant.
>
> It's a good idea to check all clamps and hoses anyway ...
>
> Ralph
>
> --------
> Ralph B
> Original Firestar 447
> N91493 E-AB
> 1000 hours
> 23 years flying it
> Kolbra 912UL
> N20386
> 2 years flying it
> 120 hrs
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308738#308738
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
I know of a Firestar that was painted with latex house paint. It's still doing
well with no peeling after 12 years. I believe there are several aircraft that
have been painted the same way. My Firestar tail was painted with automotive
paint and it's still as good as the polytone painted on the wings in which I rolled
on with a paint roller.
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000 hours
23 years flying it
Kolbra 912UL
N20386
2 years flying it
120 hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308783#308783
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Subject: | Re: flight to Michigan |
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Girard
Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2010 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: flight to Michigan
Ralph, Knowing the allowable emergency operating parameters for the 912 with
a coolant loss is fairly important, especially if you're flying an S-LSA.
After a loss of coolant (LOC) incident, the heads should be Rockwell
hardness inspected for annealing of the heat treatment. If they test soft,
the heads must be replaced (S-LSA) which at current prices is a $12,000+
bill for parts + labor. Almost better to just get a new engine, which is why
I'm always suspicious of used 912's.
Before someone writes in asking where Rick gets his crazy ideas, please
review the Line Maintenance Manual, Section 5-50-00, page 11 and Heavy
Maintenance Manual Section 72-00-00, pages 55 to 74.
Rick Girard
LSARM 3178721
Rick G/Gang:
If I exceeded 356F after coolant loss, I'd do a RC hardness check of the
heads.
As long as the CHT and Eng Oil Temp stayed in the green or high yellow, I
wouldn't worry about it.
912 series engines experience a dramatic drop in operating temps as soon as
power is reduced from cruise power settings. With a good oil cooler, I
doubt you could get above CHT redline as long as you were turning 4,000 rpm
or less and had a decent oil cooler, especially the 912UL which runs quite a
bit cooler than the 912ULS.
I believe the pilot would have to be asleep at the stick to get 356F CHT.
If that was the case, he deserves to buy new heads.
john h
mkIIIK
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
I have used vinyl spray can paint on small non critical areas like the cabin fabric
with excellent results.
Of course it was white and easy to match.
BB
On 14, Aug 2010, at 11:29 AM, Ralph B wrote:
>
> I know of a Firestar that was painted with latex house paint. It's still doing
well with no peeling after 12 years. I believe there are several aircraft that
have been painted the same way. My Firestar tail was painted with automotive
paint and it's still as good as the polytone painted on the wings in which I
rolled on with a paint roller.
>
> Ralph
>
> --------
> Ralph B
> Original Firestar 447
> N91493 E-AB
> 1000 hours
> 23 years flying it
> Kolbra 912UL
> N20386
> 2 years flying it
> 120 hrs
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308783#308783
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
I have used vinyl spray can paint on small non critical areas like the
cabin fabric with excellent results.
Of course it was white and easy to match.
BB
Bob B/Gang:
I go the certified route for fabric and installation. Makes me feel a
little more confident I will make it back home safely.
Little holes get stickers or packing tape, except on the wings, then I go
ahead and do approved fabric repair.
My fabric has been on the MKIII for 19 years/3,000.0+ hours, except the left
wing, aileron, flap, and upper and lower vertical stabilizers. I have some
paint cracks (aerothane) on the back side of some of the leading edge tubes
on the tail section caused by bending (vibration from the prop), but is
still in good shape and serviceable for a few more years.
Finally got some rain at hauck's holler and Gantt International Airport.
The airstrip grew a foot this morning. ;-)
Love to mow grass and bush hog after a good rain.
john h
mkIII
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Subject: | Re: Please help a newbie with fabric patches. |
14aug10
Dylan,
I was in you position a few months ago... I had holes to patch and no experience...
You owe it to yourself to buy the Polyfiber manual. There are two pages on "patching",
but the entire manual will give you important insights on how the entire
system works...
I had a bad rip from the wing's leading edge, straight back, about 18" long, between
the wing ribs. Bad spot to patch. I had some cloth but no chemicals and
no one will ship them to Hawaii without a $300.00 HazMat fee...
The smart guys on this list told me what chemicals I could use as substitutes and
I proceeded.
The Polyfiber system works very well. Any screw-ups (before you get to the point
where you want to paint) are easy to clean up with MEK and start over. Because
of the compound curves, around the ribs at the leading edge, it took me four
tries to get the patch right. Each screw-up cleaned up no problem...
Small holes and punctures are easily covered with stickers... You know... "VISIT
THE GRAND CANYON", "Hello Kitty" etc. I covered a puncture on the underside
of the wing with clear packing tape four years ago. It looks as good as it did
four years ago.
I admit that Five-Charlie_Bravo looks like a bit of a ratter with all the odd patches
and stickers. But in reality, it now matches the pilot.
Good Luck... Contact me off list if you would like me to eMail you a scan of the
two pages in the Polyfiber manual that cover patching. But as I said... you
owe it to yourself to buy a copy for reference...
Aloha,
--------
Henry
Firefly Five-Charlie-Bravo
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308801#308801
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
I discarded the original slip-on sails of my Maxair Hummer in 1994, recovered it
with Ceconite and painted it with Latex. Why, what are the advantages? It is
typically lighter in weight than the other systems. Durability is good, I saw
a picture of my old Hummer on Youtube last week, it is still going strong in
NC with the same covering after 16 years. If you damage it, MEK dissolves the
latex enough to reattach or glue on fabric patches. Best reason, it is cheap.
To use it, you have to thin the latex enough for your first coat that it will penetrate
and encapsulate the fabric like Polybrush does, or like nitrate dope
does. Contrary to some opinions, nitrate dope works on dacron fabric to penetrate
and encapsulate it, that is why the FAA approves it, check out the Certified
Coatings or Randolph section of the Aircraft Spruce catalog. Stits is good,
but other methods are approved and work well also.
You still have to apply all your tapes to the fabric with nitrate or Poly-Brush,
and I used Certified Coatings Sure-Seam fabric cement to attach the fabric to
the airframe, and Certified Coatings blue-tinted nitrate to attach the coverings
to each other at the overlap and similar places.
I am in the last stages of painting the FSII that I am rebuilding, it is covered
with Ceconite and painted with latex for a cost of $180 for the latex purchased
locally, $150 for 2 gallons of nitrate plus 2 quarts of fabric cement plus
shipping.
Of all the systems I have done, I like using Randolph & Certified Coatings best
because they dry the fastest, Stits second, and latex third in terms of ease,
latex is somewhat of a pain, because you have to wait a long time to mask off
and shoot the trim coats, it is thick and you need a special gun, and it takes
several days to harden up between colors so you can't mask it off as quickly
as with the others. In terms of cost, latex wins hands down, Certified Coatings
and Randolph second, and Stits last.
I have a fabric sample of Dacron that was painted with latex and left out in the
sun for several years, the paint still sticks good and the fabric beneath it
is still good.
So to answer your question, if cost is very important, go with latex and get a
decent HVLP spray gun to shoot it with. If you can afford to step up a notch but
cost is still important, go with Certified Coatings or Randolph. If cost is
no object, go with Stits, it is pretty much the Acura of Kolb-style paint systems.
As far as how to do it - attach the dacron of your choice to the airframe with
any dacron-approved fabric cement and then dope the tapes on using either Poly-brush
or any nitrate dope. Prepare it just like you were planning to use Stits
coatings, except that you quit when you get to the open areas.
I then spray the upper surfaces, vertical surfaces, and fuselage with black, thinned
with with a mix of polypropylene glycol and water, AKA windshield washer
fluid so that the paint is thinned and watery, it has to penetrate and encapsulate
the fabric. If it runs, just blot it carefully with a paper towel. Don't
let it drip through to the opposite side, that is too much. Lay the fuselage
over so that the paint won't run on the vertical surfaces. Why black? It blocks
out all light, and presumably the UV as well. The Hummer was black, and 16 years
later...
Then lay a thicker coat or two on to seal the weave and make it look nice, let
it dry for a couple days so the paint won't soften and stick to your sawhorses,
and then shoot the lighter of your unmasked color coats, you may want to shoot
a coat of white first to make the color pop out nice, I know I will. Let it
dry for at least a week and then mask it off and shoot your darker colors. For
your final coats use Latex X-tender instead of windshield washer fluid, it is
clear instead of blue, & it makes the paint flow out and gives it more gloss.
Your local paint store probably sells it.
One thing to keep in mind: never let two latex painted surfaces lay on each other,
or you will come back later and find that they have glued themselves together,
and when you pull them apart, you will mess something up.
Bottom line, latex is an acceptable system, but it has it's limitations and quirks.
If cost and light weight were not priorities, I would be using aircraft dope
instead and not fooling with it and I would already be done instead of having
to wait to shoot the final coats next week. (On the other hand, it has been
in the 90's for weeks, and I didn't have to fool with retarder this time to
keep it from spiderwebbing on me like the Stits I used to paint the MKIII with
did. Hmmm....)
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308808#308808
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
Richard, your recommended source or brand of latex is....?
Regarding nitrate. It has a bonding strength that is hard to beat. The original
airplane glue.
The original fabric cement was just a thick version of nitrate. Almost impossible
to peel off.
Even planes that were coated with butyrate (sorta like latex) would be preferably
coated first with nitrate for
adhesion and for surface tape attachment. Where nitrate got a bad rap was when
it was coated
on too thick as a color coat and eventually showed flex cracks and "ringworm".
BB
On 14, Aug 2010, at 2:37 PM, Richard Pike wrote:
>
> I discarded the original slip-on sails of my Maxair Hummer in 1994, recovered
it with Ceconite and painted it with Latex. Why, what are the advantages? It
is typically lighter in weight than the other systems. Durability is good, I saw
a picture of my old Hummer on Youtube last week, it is still going strong in
NC with the same covering after 16 years. If you damage it, MEK dissolves the
latex enough to reattach or glue on fabric patches. Best reason, it is cheap.
>
> To use it, you have to thin the latex enough for your first coat that it will
penetrate and encapsulate the fabric like Polybrush does, or like nitrate dope
does. Contrary to some opinions, nitrate dope works on dacron fabric to penetrate
and encapsulate it, that is why the FAA approves it, check out the Certified
Coatings or Randolph section of the Aircraft Spruce catalog. Stits is good,
but other methods are approved and work well also.
>
> You still have to apply all your tapes to the fabric with nitrate or Poly-Brush,
and I used Certified Coatings Sure-Seam fabric cement to attach the fabric
to the airframe, and Certified Coatings blue-tinted nitrate to attach the coverings
to each other at the overlap and similar places.
>
> I am in the last stages of painting the FSII that I am rebuilding, it is covered
with Ceconite and painted with latex for a cost of $180 for the latex purchased
locally, $150 for 2 gallons of nitrate plus 2 quarts of fabric cement plus
shipping.
>
> Of all the systems I have done, I like using Randolph & Certified Coatings best
because they dry the fastest, Stits second, and latex third in terms of ease,
latex is somewhat of a pain, because you have to wait a long time to mask off
and shoot the trim coats, it is thick and you need a special gun, and it takes
several days to harden up between colors so you can't mask it off as quickly
as with the others. In terms of cost, latex wins hands down, Certified Coatings
and Randolph second, and Stits last.
>
> I have a fabric sample of Dacron that was painted with latex and left out in
the sun for several years, the paint still sticks good and the fabric beneath
it is still good.
>
> So to answer your question, if cost is very important, go with latex and get
a decent HVLP spray gun to shoot it with. If you can afford to step up a notch
but cost is still important, go with Certified Coatings or Randolph. If cost
is no object, go with Stits, it is pretty much the Acura of Kolb-style paint systems.
>
> As far as how to do it - attach the dacron of your choice to the airframe with
any dacron-approved fabric cement and then dope the tapes on using either Poly-brush
or any nitrate dope. Prepare it just like you were planning to use Stits
coatings, except that you quit when you get to the open areas.
>
> I then spray the upper surfaces, vertical surfaces, and fuselage with black,
thinned with with a mix of polypropylene glycol and water, AKA windshield washer
fluid so that the paint is thinned and watery, it has to penetrate and encapsulate
the fabric. If it runs, just blot it carefully with a paper towel. Don't
let it drip through to the opposite side, that is too much. Lay the fuselage
over so that the paint won't run on the vertical surfaces. Why black? It blocks
out all light, and presumably the UV as well. The Hummer was black, and 16
years later...
>
> Then lay a thicker coat or two on to seal the weave and make it look nice, let
it dry for a couple days so the paint won't soften and stick to your sawhorses,
and then shoot the lighter of your unmasked color coats, you may want to shoot
a coat of white first to make the color pop out nice, I know I will. Let
it dry for at least a week and then mask it off and shoot your darker colors.
For your final coats use Latex X-tender instead of windshield washer fluid, it
is clear instead of blue, & it makes the paint flow out and gives it more gloss.
Your local paint store probably sells it.
>
> One thing to keep in mind: never let two latex painted surfaces lay on each other,
or you will come back later and find that they have glued themselves together,
and when you pull them apart, you will mess something up.
>
> Bottom line, latex is an acceptable system, but it has it's limitations and quirks.
If cost and light weight were not priorities, I would be using aircraft
dope instead and not fooling with it and I would already be done instead of having
to wait to shoot the final coats next week. (On the other hand, it has been
in the 90's for weeks, and I didn't have to fool with retarder this time to
keep it from spiderwebbing on me like the Stits I used to paint the MKIII with
did. Hmmm....)
>
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308808#308808
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
Thanks for the feedback everybody! I'm all ears for more info.
> It is typically lighter in weight than the other systems.
> Durability is good, B
> Best reason, it is cheap.
The lightness and cost attracted me to the idea. But I am not committed to it-
I am seeking info and ppl's stories on the topic.
One feller emailed me private, and I will keep his privacy, but answer here.
I certainly appreciate the info. I don't mind dying in some non-specific, remote
point in the future, as long as I'm not there at the time, but I want to play
with my toys for a while first. Thanks.
> it sounds like someone's about to jump into something
I am a cautious person. I do NOT jump into things. I am not a proponent of the
latex covering, I am merely researching at this point. I am mindful of some tragic
deaths attributed to failure of the fabric. I pay VERY close attention to
these.
I know this can be a contentious issue but where else can I turn?
> but it *must* be done correctly, using all the adhesives, chemicals, procedures,
etc that are designed to be used together
I understand why this is necessary. On the other hand, latex may someday be considered
a 'system'. It *must* be put down on a *clean* surface before any other
layer, as my reading directs. Latex does not form a chemical bond with the fabric
and/or other layers (it has been said). It is a mechanical bond as the latex
permeates the fabric and 'wraps around' the fibers. But maybe this is all
bogus, I don't know yet.
This issue is technically different than the auto paint top-coat controversy which
has also been around a while. Each layer of the certified systems must bonded
to one below it. I have been told that these systems use the same solvent(s)
and that each successive layer sort of merges with the last. The solvents and
adhesives are designed to work with the materials also.
The way I see it, so far, is that with the fabric glued on and stretched, the only
real issues for a doping/sealing/UV are 1) being compatible with the fabric,
not 'dissolving it', 2) sealing the fabric and 3) protecting it from UV and
4) giving some degree of mechanical protection. According to GeoB anyway.
Just playing the devil's advocate.
GeoB
--------
GeoB
"Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers,
so we could identify their corporate sponsors"
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308832#308832
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
I understand why this is necessary. On the other hand, latex may someday
be considered a 'system'. It *must* be put down on a *clean* surface
before any other layer, as my reading directs. Latex does not form a
chemical bond with the fabric and/or other layers (it has been said). It
is a mechanical bond as the latex permeates the fabric and 'wraps
around' the fibers. But maybe this is all bogus, I don't know yet.
Regarding nitrate. It has a bonding strength that is hard to beat. The
original airplane glue.
The original fabric cement was just a thick version of nitrate. Almost
impossible to peel off.
Even planes that were coated with butyrate (sorta like latex) would be
preferably coated first with nitrate for
adhesion and for surface tape attachment. Where nitrate got a bad rap
was when it was coated
on too thick as a color coat and eventually showed flex cracks and
"ringworm".
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
okkkkk if the latex wraps around the fibers... but first the
"quoted from another post" the nitrate glue has already encapsulated
the fibers... what is there for the latex to adhere to?????
even though the latex may work for years..... but until it has faa
approval.... I will not use it and stick to a system that does...
when watching the Polly fiber video, some of the butyrate dope as
well as other approved system was flammable... and the Polly fiber
system was not.
my choice was easy. a few extra dollars,, and I am sure.
Boyd young mkIII
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
How about tar and feathers?
do not archive
On 14, Aug 2010, at 5:44 PM, GeoB wrote:
>
> Thanks for the feedback everybody! I'm all ears for more info.
>
>> It is typically lighter in weight than the other systems.
>> Durability is good, B
>> Best reason, it is cheap.
>
> The lightness and cost attracted me to the idea. But I am not committed to it-
I am seeking info and ppl's stories on the topic.
>
> One feller emailed me private, and I will keep his privacy, but answer here.
>
> I certainly appreciate the info. I don't mind dying in some non-specific, remote
point in the future, as long as I'm not there at the time, but I want to play
with my toys for a while first. Thanks.
>
>> it sounds like someone's about to jump into something
>
> I am a cautious person. I do NOT jump into things. I am not a proponent of the
latex covering, I am merely researching at this point. I am mindful of some
tragic deaths attributed to failure of the fabric. I pay VERY close attention
to these.
>
> I know this can be a contentious issue but where else can I turn?
>
>> but it *must* be done correctly, using all the adhesives, chemicals, procedures,
etc that are designed to be used together
>
> I understand why this is necessary. On the other hand, latex may someday be considered
a 'system'. It *must* be put down on a *clean* surface before any other
layer, as my reading directs. Latex does not form a chemical bond with the
fabric and/or other layers (it has been said). It is a mechanical bond as the
latex permeates the fabric and 'wraps around' the fibers. But maybe this is all
bogus, I don't know yet.
>
> This issue is technically different than the auto paint top-coat controversy
which has also been around a while. Each layer of the certified systems must bonded
to one below it. I have been told that these systems use the same solvent(s)
and that each successive layer sort of merges with the last. The solvents
and adhesives are designed to work with the materials also.
>
> The way I see it, so far, is that with the fabric glued on and stretched, the
only real issues for a doping/sealing/UV are 1) being compatible with the fabric,
not 'dissolving it', 2) sealing the fabric and 3) protecting it from UV and
4) giving some degree of mechanical protection. According to GeoB anyway.
>
> Just playing the devil's advocate.
>
> GeoB
>
> --------
> GeoB
>
> "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers,
so we could identify their corporate sponsors"
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308832#308832
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
Several good questions - The latex seems to stick to the nitrate covered fabric
just like latex paint sticks to your house - pretty darn well.
And yes - nitrate burns just dandy, even better than butyrate.
Brands? I like Sherwin-Williams and Sears Weatherbeater, but if you go with Lowe's
premium stuff, it works fine too.
And yes, I agree that using one proven system is the best way to get predictable
results. But GeoB was asking for an opinion and a functional technique, and
that is what I tried to give him. Anyway, we are building experimental airplanes,
and some of us enjoy experimenting.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308851#308851
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Latex paint (again???!!!!) |
> Anyway, we are building experimental airplanes, and some of us enjoy experimenting.
I don't think I would describe myself to someone as an experimenter. Oh, I always
change things and (technically) customize my ride- but generally I have researched
things deeply enough that it doesn't seem like an experiment to me when
I do it. I have been building my 4x4 for the last 14 years. Oh, it has been
my Daily Driver for this period too. I have another round of mods for it, and
a new engine. It is down now as I make the mods. It, and most of my other projects
have turned out very well. Far better than I ever hoped when I started.
I *know* aviation is now a very conservative slice of society, yet in even the
farthest-out cutting-edge forums I find criticism of people who ask questions
or want to try new things.
I appreciate folks being concerned about me- or maybe the sport- but I wish they
would flesh out their warnings with more details. Stuff like "You'll die if
you don't do things the way it has always been done!" isn't as useful as saying,
"If your glue fails you can lose the entire fabric from your wing in an instant".
I doubt any of us in this sport isn't aware that we can die. I can stay
at home and die too. I could quit 4x4ing on dangerous terrrain, I could quit
riding motorcycles- after hundreds of thousands of miles. I have risked my life
for years in one of the most dangerous professions in this country and I am
accustomed to assessing personal risk.
--------
GeoB
"Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers,
so we could identify their corporate sponsors"
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308857#308857
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