---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 10/08/11: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 08:31 AM - Re: Re: Strut Fairings (Richard Girard) 2. 08:42 AM - Re: Anyone check for carbon monoxide? (McCarthy Tom) 3. 09:01 AM - Re: Anyone check for carbon monoxide? (Thom Riddle) 4. 09:37 AM - Re: Possible MkIII accident in Missouri (Michael Welch) 5. 10:25 AM - Re: Re: Strut Fairings (b young) 6. 12:27 PM - Re: Re: Strut Fairings (Richard Girard) 7. 12:56 PM - Re: Re: Possible MkIII accident in Missouri (robert bean) 8. 02:34 PM - Re: Re: Strut Fairings (Larry Cottrell) 9. 03:48 PM - Re: Possible MkIII accident in Missouri (Dennis Thate) 10. 04:24 PM - Re: Re: Strut Fairings (robert bean) 11. 06:55 PM - Re: Off field landings (WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 08:31:43 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings From: Richard Girard I don't mean to be a wet blanket on Boyd's PBI, but styrofoam will not stand up to Poly Fiber chemicals whose major solvent is MEK. Instead, coat the styrofoam with a mix of epoxy resin and microballoons then wrap with polyester cloth. After the resin has cured, pull the cloth off. To fill any pinholes remaining, use pure resin applied with a brush and scrapped with a single edge razor blade. Repeat this last step as necessary (depending on how much of a perfectionist you are) until you get the finish you want. Take care with your selection of paints as any holes in the epoxy will allow the solvent to attack the foam. Polyurethane paints are usually safe. Rick On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 7:27 PM, Michael Welch wrote: > Boyd, > > I have all the ingredients you mentioned(foam, fabric, Poly stuff) I > think I'll give your suggestion a try. > > I'll get back to ya after I find out how it turns out. > > Mike Welch > > > On Oct 7, 2011, at 1:29 PM, b young wrote: > > Get yourself some of the plastic streamline fairing material that is > intended to fit over the lift struts and cut it to fit the landing ear legs. > You will be pleasantly surprised. It is worth the trouble. > > > Do not archive > > > * > > what if you cut some Styrofoam, or blue board,* > > * make it fit the axel, then carve it back to * > > *the airfoil shape you want, cover it with * > > *polly fiber, and paint it? light easy.* > > *the foam would have to be resistant to* > > *polly chemicals.* > > ** > > *just thinking outloud* > > ** > > *boyd young mkiii* > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > * > > > * > > * > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:42:16 AM PST US From: McCarthy Tom Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Anyone check for carbon monoxide? I just want to send a huge thank you out to all who responded to my carbon monoxide issue. I flew the other day to confirm that it was coming from the boom tube, and whoever likened it to a leaf blower was dead on. I make up a thick tight fitting closed cell foam piece, and inserted it from the cockpit side, and flew for an hour today, with the carbon monoxide detector was never reading over 0, and no more odors inside. I think the little Kidde battery operated digital display carbon monoxide detector that I have could be a life saver for others as well. This is important to me because I fly just as much in the winter as I do in the summer, and like to seal things up as much as possible. I recently finished adding my cockpit heat plenum to the oil cooler, and it works great. I am now ready to land on all the frozen lakes in comfort. Thanks again, Tom McCarthy Zenith 601HD Kolb Slingshot Kolb Firestar ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:01:02 AM PST US From: Thom Riddle Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Anyone check for carbon monoxide? Tom, Now that you have confirmed there is a big draft from the tube, even on Slingshots, I guess it is time to take a look at mine. As I said before, I never noticed any draft but that doesn't mean there is not one. Thanks for sharing your experience. Thom in Buffalo On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 11:40 AM, McCarthy Tom wrote: > I just want to send a huge thank you out to all who responded to my carbon > monoxide issue. I flew the other day to confirm that it was coming from the > boom tube, and whoever likened it to a leaf blower was dead on. I make up a > thick tight fitting closed cell foam piece, and inserted it from the cockpit > side, and flew for an hour today, with the carbon monoxide detector was > never reading over 0, and no more odors inside. I think the little Kidde > battery operated digital display carbon monoxide detector that I have could > be a life saver for others as well. This is important to me because I fly > just as much in the winter as I do in the summer, and like to seal things up > as much as possible. I recently finished adding my cockpit heat plenum to > the oil cooler, and it works great. I am now ready to land on all the frozen > lakes in comfort. > > Thanks again, > > > Tom McCarthy > Zenith 601HD > Kolb Slingshot > Kolb Firestar > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:37:29 AM PST US From: Michael Welch Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Possible MkIII accident in Missouri Rex, You are right, it sure isn't a Kolb. I just got home a few minutes ago from our monthly EEA chapter meeting, and one of the members said it is a KitFox (because he used to own one). OBVIOUSLY, it is either a KitFox, or an Avid (or a clone, if they made any). The following link has the story; http://www.missouriinjuryattorneysblog.com/2011/10/plane-crashes-in-rural-morgan.html Mike Welch ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:25:06 AM PST US From: "b young" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings I don't mean to be a wet blanket on Boyd's PBI, but Styrofoam will not stand up to Poly Fiber chemicals whose major solvent is MEK. Instead, coat the Styrofoam with a mix of epoxy resin and microballoons then wrap with polyester cloth. After the resin has cured, pull the cloth off. To fill any pinholes remaining, use pure resin applied with a brush and scrapped with a single edge razor blade. Repeat this last step as necessary (depending on how much of a perfectionist you are) until you get the finish you want. Take care with your selection of paints as any holes in the epoxy will allow the solvent to attack the foam. Polyurethane paints are usually safe. Rick >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rick and others that is why I mentioned Styrofoam, or other foam not affected by polly products, ( I figured Styrofoam would be affected by the polly juice, pun intended, not sure if it will even handle some epoxy resins) there are blue and green insulating foam boards, polystyrene??? I believe that some of the long easy, vary easy, and other fiberglass kits use foam, it may take a bit of research, but I am sure there is some type of combination that would work. open cell, closed cell, it does not have to be structural in nature. even if you made some aluminum ribs, glued them to the legs with jb weld or similar,,, and fitted them to a 5/16 trailing edge, you could cover it with fabric and iron it tight, then paint. I was just trying to think outside the box, and less weight than plastic strut cover, mike when you get the idea perfected, let us in on the possibilities. boyd young mkiii utah ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:27:17 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings From: Richard Girard Boyd, The Rutan canards and other aircraft that use a hot wire to cut out airfoil shapes use styrofoam (polystyrene foam) because it is produced with steam and releases water vapor when cut. It will handle epoxy resins as noted above, but not Polyester resin or any solvents. Gasoline also melts it. Urethane foam, which was used for the Varieze fuselage panels gives off cyanide gas when cut with a hot wire, definitely hazardous to your health. It does shape with sandpaper fairly easily. Divinycell foam is used for the LongEZE fuselage. It is compatible with Polyester, Vinylester, and Epoxy resins. I've not tried to hot wire it and it isn't listed on DIAB's website as a manufacturing method. It can be sanded to shape but it's a lot tougher than urethane. Rick On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 12:18 PM, b young wrote: > ** > I don't mean to be a wet blanket on Boyd's PBI, but Styrofoam will not > stand up to Poly Fiber chemicals whose major solvent is MEK. Instead, coat > the Styrofoam with a mix of epoxy resin and microballoons then wrap with > polyester cloth. After the resin has cured, pull the cloth off. To fill any > pinholes remaining, use pure resin applied with a brush and scrapped with a > single edge razor blade. Repeat this last step as necessary (depending on > how much of a perfectionist you are) until you get the finish you want. Take > care with your selection of paints as any holes in the epoxy will allow the > solvent to attack the foam. Polyurethane paints are usually safe. > > Rick > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > rick and others > > that is why I mentioned Styrofoam, or other foam not affected by polly > products, ( I figured Styrofoam would be affected by the polly juice, pun > intended, not sure if it will even handle some epoxy resins) there are > blue and green insulating foam boards, polystyrene??? I believe that > some of the long easy, vary easy, and other fiberglass kits use foam, it > may take a bit of research, but I am sure there is some type of combination > that would work. open cell, closed cell, it does not have to be structural > in nature. > > even if you made some aluminum ribs, glued them to the legs with jb weld > or similar,,, and fitted them to a 5/16 trailing edge, you could cover it > with fabric and iron it tight, then paint. I was just trying to think > outside the box, and less weight than plastic strut cover, > > mike when you get the idea perfected, let us in on the possibilities. > > boyd young > mkiii utah > > * > > * > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:56:03 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Possible MkIII accident in Missouri From: robert bean Wow!, no trees, flat terrain...... whazzup with that guy? maybe afraid of cow pies? He may not have been flying a Kolb but sure experienced his own version of "Kolb quit". BB MkIII, suzuki. On 8, Oct 2011, at 12:34 PM, Michael Welch wrote: > > Rex, > > You are right, it sure isn't a Kolb. > > I just got home a few minutes ago from our monthly EEA chapter meeting, > and one of the members said it is a KitFox (because he used to own one). > > OBVIOUSLY, it is either a KitFox, or an Avid (or a clone, if they made any). > > The following link has the story; > > http://www.missouriinjuryattorneysblog.com/2011/10/plane-crashes-in-rural-morgan.html > > Mike Welch > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:34:32 PM PST US From: "Larry Cottrell" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings Gang, I made some a few years ago and just covered them with the shrink fit stuff that they cover model airplanes with. You can get it in the colors that you want and it is easy to work with. Quick and easy, just not as durable as the plastic or metal ones. Larry Note: If you forward this email, please delete the forwarding history, which includes my email address. ----- Original Message ----- From: b young To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2011 11:18 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings I don't mean to be a wet blanket on Boyd's PBI, but Styrofoam will not stand up to Poly Fiber chemicals whose major solvent is MEK. Instead, coat the Styrofoam with a mix of epoxy resin and microballoons then wrap with polyester cloth. After the resin has cured, pull the cloth off. To fill any pinholes remaining, use pure resin applied with a brush and scrapped with a single edge razor blade. Repeat this last step as necessary (depending on how much of a perfectionist you are) until you get the finish you want. Take care with your selection of paints as any holes in the epoxy will allow the solvent to attack the foam. Polyurethane paints are usually safe. Rick >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rick and others that is why I mentioned Styrofoam, or other foam not affected by polly products, ( I figured Styrofoam would be affected by the polly juice, pun intended, not sure if it will even handle some epoxy resins) there are blue and green insulating foam boards, polystyrene??? I believe that some of the long easy, vary easy, and other fiberglass kits use foam, it may take a bit of research, but I am sure there is some type of combination that would work. open cell, closed cell, it does not have to be structural in nature. even if you made some aluminum ribs, glued them to the legs with jb weld or similar,,, and fitted them to a 5/16 trailing edge, you could cover it with fabric and iron it tight, then paint. I was just trying to think outside the box, and less weight than plastic strut cover, mike when you get the idea perfected, let us in on the possibilities. boyd young mkiii utah ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:48:27 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Possible MkIII accident in Missouri From: "Dennis Thate" Most likely Mental panic set in, that's why we should practice for the 'inevitable' sport plane engine out. Hope he heals up OK . -------- Both optimists and pessimists contribute to our society. The optimist invents the airplane and the pessimist the parachute. ~Gil Stern These flying machines are just a fad and will never catch on Unknown Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=354417#354417 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:24:56 PM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings Now that's a great idea. Thanks. BB On 8, Oct 2011, at 5:31 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote: > Gang, > I made some a few years ago and just covered them with the shrink fit stuff that they cover model airplanes with. You can get it in the colors that you want and it is easy to work with. Quick and easy, just not as durable as the plastic or metal ones. > Larry > > Note: If you forward this email, please delete the forwarding history, which includes my email address. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: b young > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2011 11:18 AM > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Strut Fairings > > I don't mean to be a wet blanket on Boyd's PBI, but Styrofoam will not stand up to Poly Fiber chemicals whose major solvent is MEK. Instead, coat the Styrofoam with a mix of epoxy resin and microballoons then wrap with polyester cloth. After the resin has cured, pull the cloth off. To fill any pinholes remaining, use pure resin applied with a brush and scrapped with a single edge razor blade. Repeat this last step as necessary (depending on how much of a perfectionist you are) until you get the finish you want. Take care with your selection of paints as any holes in the epoxy will allow the solvent to attack the foam. Polyurethane paints are usually safe. > > Rick > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > rick and others > > that is why I mentioned Styrofoam, or other foam not affected by polly products, ( I figured Styrofoam would be affected by the polly juice, pun intended, not sure if it will even handle some epoxy resins) there are blue and green insulating foam boards, polystyrene??? I believe that some of the long easy, vary easy, and other fiberglass kits use foam, it may take a bit of research, but I am sure there is some type of combination that would work. open cell, closed cell, it does not have to be structural in nature. > > even if you made some aluminum ribs, glued them to the legs with jb weld or similar,,, and fitted them to a 5/16 trailing edge, you could cover it with fabric and iron it tight, then paint. I was just trying to think outside the box, and less weight than plastic strut cover, > > mike when you get the idea perfected, let us in on the possibilities. > > boyd young > mkiii utah > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics .com/Navigator?Kolb-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c > > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:55:55 PM PST US From: WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Off field landings JohnT, Thanks for sharing the video. Good entertainment. But, just wondering how cold the water is (if one was to have an engine out and have to put down in it)? Bill Varnes Original Kolb FireStar Audubon NJ Do Not Archive In a message dated 10/7/2011 8:01:50 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, cheoah68@gmail.com writes: I've been having fun playing "Bush pilot" in my Firestar. Maybe too much fun.... John Tempest ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.