Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:45 AM - Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (racerjerry)
2. 04:55 AM - Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (Dana Hague)
3. 05:13 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (Ozarkflyer)
4. 05:24 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (william sullivan)
5. 05:29 AM - Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (FIRESTARII)
6. 06:36 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (Ozarkflyer)
7. 06:38 AM - Re: New Firefly owner looking for Mark III training in PA (racerjerry)
8. 06:55 AM - Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (Richard Pike)
9. 07:20 AM - Re: Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (b young)
10. 07:57 AM - Re: Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (Dana Hague)
11. 08:59 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (racerjerry)
12. 09:18 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (David Kulp)
13. 09:52 AM - Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (Richard Pike)
14. 10:28 AM - oil-- thanks (frank goodnight)
15. 11:30 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (chris davis)
16. 11:56 AM - Re: Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (Dana Hague)
17. 11:56 AM - Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) (Dana Hague)
18. 01:56 PM - Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (Eugene Zimmerman)
19. 03:28 PM - Re: New Firefly owner looking for Mark III training in PA (mburdge39)
20. 04:54 PM - Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 (John Hauck)
21. 05:43 PM - Re: Oil (API-TC) (SS568)
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| Subject: | Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
Yes, years ago I duplicated the Firefly flaperon design into my Firestar II during
construction. My main purpose was to qualify for FAR part 103; just as the
Firefly did with its shorter wings and not for a performance gain. I had shortened
my Firestar wings by eliminating the wing spar spliced in tube sections
toward the wingtips. The graph in Appendix 2 of AC 103-7 Determining Power Off
Stall Speed allowed a much better lift factor for a wing with flaps.
I was really a newbie pilot at the time and did not notice much difference in performance
with flaps or without. Also, I have not flown my Firestar in a very
long time, so I cannot give you much in the way of performance data. I suspect
that If I cleaned up the airplane with wing strut and gear leg fairings that
a difference may have been more noticeable. I did experiment once with the
flaperons adjusted to reflex them up in flight and that seemed to improve cruise
speeds somewhat but probably not worth the effort.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355087#355087
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| Subject: | Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
Here's a short video of two Kolbs and a gyro fying to a fly-in in eastern
Connecticut.
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjdVvGhiAmI&hd=1>
-Dana
--
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
Link doesn't work for me.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355093#355093
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
- Nice video.- I had no problem with the link.- Keep them coming.
-do not archive
-------------------------
--------------------- Bill Sulliv
an
--- On Sat, 10/15/11, Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net> wrote:
From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net>
Subject: Kolb-List: Kolbs in Connecticut (video)
Here's a short video of two Kolbs and a gyro fying to a fly-in in eastern C
onnecticut.
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjdVvGhiAmI&hd=1>
-Dana
--
Press any key to continue or any other key to quit...
le, List Admin.
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| Subject: | Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
:D Thanks for posting this as it is something I have put a great deal of thought
into and an even greater lack of effort! I once saw a FSII listed on Barnstormers
with flaps and the guys claim to fame was that it was the "slowest flying
Kolb in the US". I have no idea weather that is true or not. Most GA airplanes
I have flown show a significant improvement in lift with the flaps in
the 10 to 20 degree range and any thing more than that just increases drag to
allow for a steeper approach angle. I could be wrong but I am pretty sure thats
exactly what the Cessna POH's say. For me personally, based on my pseudo dangerous
grass strip I have at my farm I see a substantial benefit from both the
increased lift as well as the steeper approach angle! Simply because it's one
way in and one way out with trees on the west end and power lines on the other.
I have big plans of a full on restoration and re power of my FSII this winter
and I will be incorporating flaps if I can do so safely and legally. Can
you say 65HP Hirth :D I would be curious to hear from the Mark III guys and
any other Kolber's with flaps if they feel the flaps are a worth while addition
to an already great flying airplane. Fly safe everybody!
--------
Low and Slow FireStar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355096#355096
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
I couldn't hyper-link it the first time so I copy and pasted and it wouldn't link.
After I posted I came back and tried again and success. Best of all, what
a great video and music. Thanks for sharing.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355102#355102
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| Subject: | Re: New Firefly owner looking for Mark III training in PA |
Lots of good advice here, but I would much prefer for you to have dual training
in a Mark III. Just remember that because of the high thrust line, very light
weight and draggy airframe, when you chop power; be ready to get the stick FORWARD
or the nose will come UP and forward airspeed will go down IMMEDIATELY.
Do yourself a favor and fly the Firefly all the way to the ground with some
power, especially in the beginning, lest you retract the landing gear.
The Firefly is a sweet flying airplane but does not land like a Cub.
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355103#355103
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| Subject: | Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
FIRESTARII wrote:
> :D Thanks for posting this as it is something I have put a great deal of thought
into and an even greater lack of effort! I once saw a FSII listed on Barnstormers
with flaps and the guys claim to fame was that it was the "slowest flying
Kolb in the US". I have no idea weather that is true or not. Most GA
airplanes I have flown show a significant improvement in lift with the flaps in
the 10 to 20 degree range and any thing more than that just increases drag to
allow for a steeper approach angle. I could be wrong but I am pretty sure thats
exactly what the Cessna POH's say. For me personally, based on my pseudo dangerous
grass strip I have at my farm I see a substantial benefit from both the
increased lift as well as the steeper approach angle! Simply because it's
one way in and one way out with trees on the west end and power lines on the other.
I have big plans of a full on restoration and re power of my FSII this winter
and I will be incorporating flaps if I can do so safely and legally. Can
you say 65HP Hirth :D I would be curious to hear from the Mark III guys and
any other Kolber's with flaps if they feel the flaps are a worth while addition
to an already great flying airplane. Fly safe everybody!
IMO, the flaps lower the stall speed as much as VG's and can be used in combination
for best effect. However they also create a real change in lift distribution
on the wing and cranking in the flaps requires either retrimming the airplane
A LOT, or holding about twice as much stick back pressure. They do allow a
much steeper approach angle and shorten the roll out, as the airplane will not
float once you round out.
The best way to get out of the field better is obviously more power. However, I
am not terribly impressed with the 65 Hirth, the few we have had around here
have been pretty meh. One friend of mine has had to helicore the spark plug holes
because the thing has vibrated the originals out.
If you do go the 65HP route, Kolb says you ought to beef up the upper fuselage structure, it was not designed for the torque of a 65 hp engine. Here is how we did it on FS N582EF: http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/582%20Mods.html
If we had it to do over again, a dual carb 503 would have been simpler. On the
plus side, the skinny FSII cruises happily at 65 mph with the 582 loafing at 4800
rpm and burning under 3 gph. At which rpm it ought to go forever without needing
an overhaul. And it does pop off the ground quick and go up at an insane
climb angle.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
richard (at) bcchapel(dot)org
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Hebrews 11:1
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355105#355105
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| Subject: | Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
I would be curious to hear from the Mark III guys and any other Kolber's
with flaps if they feel the flaps are a worth while addition to an already
great flying airplane. Fly safe everybody!
--------
Low and Slow FireStar II
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
I did some experimenting with the flaps, my mkiii has 0, 20, 40 deg
settings, during take off 20 deg allowed a 100 ft shorter takeoff roll,
0 and 40 were about the same roll for takeoff, for landing 20 feels just
right for me, I have practiced 40 deg landings,,, and it would seem
that the steep approach would only be necessary in an emergency, with 20
deg and idle, I can scare most ga pilots with my approach angle with only
20 deg, if I were to redesign the flap handle set up, I think I would
build a multi position bracket, designed like the elevator trim in the
mkiiic. that way I could have more selections available, I would add 10
and 30 deg, and maybe experiment with reflex,
boyd young mkiii
utah
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
At 09:34 AM 10/15/2011, Ozarkflyer wrote:
>
>I couldn't hyper-link it the first time so I copy and pasted and it
>wouldn't link. After I posted I came back and tried again and
>success. Best of all, what a great video and music. Thanks for sharing.
After you posted I went back and made it clickable.
-Dana
--
Computers run on smoke. If it leaks out, they don't work.
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
Where is the Chester ultralight field located?
--------
Jerry King
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355116#355116
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
Looks like a fun day, Dana. What engine is in the gyro? He pretty much
changes the landscape when he does a to.
Some of the area I fly is pretty unforgiving, but yours wins the
prize!! Better keep that Cuyuna tuned up! Think you might fly around a
bit and take some vids in a couple of weeks. The colors should be
spectacular.
Thanks for posting it.
Dave Kulp
Bethlehem, PA
FireFly 11DMK
On 10/15/2011 7:52 AM, Dana Hague wrote:
>
> Here's a short video of two Kolbs and a gyro fying to a fly-in in
> eastern Connecticut.
>
> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjdVvGhiAmI&hd=1>
>
> -Dana
>
> --
> Press any key to continue or any other key to quit...
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
byoungplumbing(at)gmail.c wrote:
>
> I did some experimenting with the flaps, my mkiii has 0, 20, 40 deg
> settings, during take off 20 deg allowed a 100 ft shorter takeoff roll,
> 0 and 40 were about the same roll for takeoff, for landing 20 feels just
> right for me, I have practiced 40 deg landings,,, and it would seem
> that the steep approach would only be necessary in an emergency, with 20
> deg and idle, I can scare most ga pilots with my approach angle with only
> 20 deg, if I were to redesign the flap handle set up, I think I would
> build a multi position bracket, designed like the elevator trim in the
> mkiiic. that way I could have more selections available, I would add 10
> and 30 deg, and maybe experiment with reflex,
>
> boyd young mkiii
>
> utah
I am very pleased with being able to put the flaps in multiple positions, even
reflex. With the current setup, max is about 35 degrees, and that seems plenty.
Since my place is a very short strip with "go around" not being a good option
at all, I always land with full flaps. Actually, I always land everywhere with
full flaps, because that is what I am used to, and what you are used to doing
is what you do best.
Pictures and details here: http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/pg3.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
richard (at) bcchapel(dot)org
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Hebrews 11:1
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355123#355123
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Hi All,
Thanks to everyone that responded to my request for info about oil.
It's nice to know people on this list!!
Frank Goodnight
Firestar 2
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
Nice video thank you----- and--- I really liked the Music !
!!!!=0A=0A=0AChris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider Pilot=0ADisabled from c
rash building Firefly=0A=0AFrom: william sullivan <williamtsullivan@att.net
>=0ATo: kolb-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 8:21 AM
=0ASubject: Re: Kolb-List: Kolbs in Connecticut (video)=0A=0A- Nice video
.- I had no problem with the link.- Keep them coming.=0A=0A-do not ar
chive =0A----------------------
------------------------ Bi
ll Sullivan=0A=0A--- On Sat, 10/15/11, Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net> w
rote:=0A=0A=0A>From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net>=0A>Subject: Kolb-Li
st: Kolbs in Connecticut (video)=0A>To: kolb-list@matronics.com=0A>Date: Sa
turday, October 15, 2011, 7:52 AM=0A>=0A>=0A>--> Kolb-List message posted b
y: Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net>Here's a short video of two Kolbs and
a gyro fying to a fly-in in eastern Connecticut.<http://www.youtube.com/wat
ch?v=GjdVvGhiAmI&hd=1>-Dana--Press any key to continue or any other key
to qusp;----> http=================
========================
==
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
At 11:56 AM 10/15/2011, racerjerry wrote:
>
>Where is the Chester ultralight field located?
It's just south of the Chester-Hadlyme ferry, across from Gillette Castle
(both of which you can see in the video). Not on the chart.
-Dana
--
End rush hour traffic now! Legalize vehicular weaponry!
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| Subject: | Re: Kolbs in Connecticut (video) |
At 12:15 PM 10/15/2011, David Kulp wrote:
>
>Looks like a fun day, Dana. What engine is in the gyro? He pretty much
>changes the landscape when he does a to.
>
>Some of the area I fly is pretty unforgiving, but yours wins the
>prize!! Better keep that Cuyuna tuned up! Think you might fly around a
>bit and take some vids in a couple of weeks. The colors should be spectacular.
The gyro has a Subaru, and boy, is it loud!
Yeah, a lot of Connecticut is pretty unforgiving. I usually try to pick a
route that keeps me near some kind of field in case of trouble. Last year
was spectacular, color wise... this year is a bit muted due to the storms,
but still pretty nice.
-Dana
--
End rush hour traffic now! Legalize vehicular weaponry!
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| Subject: | Re: Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
On Oct 15, 2011, at 1:26 AM, SAILNROCK wrote:
>
> Hi All
> Has any one made flaps or done flaperons
> like on the firefly? On the Firestar 11
> And if so how did it come out and with what benefits?
> Thanks Bob
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355079#355079
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: New Firefly owner looking for Mark III training in PA |
I am very grateful to the previous owner for giving me a DVD of my Firefly in flight
& landings with the ASI and stick in the video frame. All of his landings
were at a fairly steep approach angle(compared to the Cub) and 60 with half
flaps(0, half, and full on the Firefly), his roundout would reduce his speed to
around 55, and the wheels would touch between 45-50. His landings were very
consistent with the airspeed. All landings and takeoffs he used the half flap
setting.
Once again this video he gave me is worth it's weight in gold to me as it confirms
everything everyone has said about flying it to the ground.
Thanks again,
Mike
--------
Mike
Firefly
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355151#355151
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| Subject: | Flaps or falparon on the Firestar 11 |
Gene Z/Gang:
The last photo was shot at Homer's, wasn't it.
Looks good.
john h
mkIII
Checotah, Oklahoma and heading for hauck's holler, alabama.
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Oil (API-TC) |
Thanks Bill for that article.
And thanks to all that responded.
I will use only API-TC. After all that is exactly what the manual says.
David d.
--------
Kolb Mark IIIX 582 Blue head
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=355161#355161
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