Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:48 AM - Re: Re: Antioch, CA (Pat Ladd)
2. 03:54 AM - Re: Re: Antioch, CA (Pat Ladd)
3. 05:32 AM - Engines (alienwes)
4. 06:03 AM - Re: Engines (John Hauck)
5. 06:07 AM - Re: Engines (John Hauck)
6. 07:18 AM - Re: Engines (Dan)
7. 07:26 AM - Re: Engines (John Hauck)
8. 07:30 AM - Re: Engines (Richard Girard)
9. 07:43 AM - Re: Engines (Rick Neilsen)
10. 08:14 AM - Re: Engines (John Hauck)
11. 08:41 AM - Re: Re: Antioch, CA (Eddie)
12. 11:36 AM - Re: Engines (Rick Neilsen)
13. 12:33 PM - Re: Engines (John Hauck)
14. 02:07 PM - Re: Engines (alienwes)
15. 03:47 PM - Re: Re: Engines (Eddie)
16. 04:23 PM - Re: Engines (alienwes)
17. 04:42 PM - Viking/Honda Engines-Again! (alienwes)
18. 07:02 PM - Re: Re: Antioch, CA (Brad Nation)
19. 07:07 PM - (James Dustin)
20. 07:22 PM - Re: (Larry Cottrell)
21. 07:27 PM - Re: (James Dustin)
22. 07:48 PM - Re: (Larry Cottrell)
23. 07:52 PM - Re: (James Dustin)
24. 08:14 PM - Re: (Larry Cottrell)
25. 08:15 PM - Re: Viking/Honda Engines-Again! (Rick Neilsen)
26. 08:21 PM - Re: Viking/Honda Engines-Again! (Charlie England)
27. 08:57 PM - Re: (James Dustin)
Message 1
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they all run back to their nose wheel aircraft >>
Hi Eddie,
I still have a sticker on my car which says `Real pilots fly taildraggers`
Cheers
Pat
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Paul,
I suspect that you don`t want to come to the UK to look at my Kolb.
Sorry about that.
Of course if you DO. I am in the South of England and nowhere near
Liverpool.
Liverpool is in the uncouth Northern part of England where they talk funny
and put salt on their porridge.
(Sorry Eddie)
Pat
Message 3
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I am soliciting opinions on the engines for the Kolb. I know this is going to vary.
Do any of the engines have problems overheating in the pusher configuration of
the KOLB?
Which engine is the most reliable? 912?
Is the 582 a bit underpowered in the Mark III?
If you had a choice without consideration for the price differences, what engine
would you choose?
Wes
--------
Wesley Elliott
Sport Pilot-PPC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391641#391641
Message 4
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I am soliciting opinions on the engines for the Kolb. I know this is going
to vary.
Do any of the engines have problems overheating in the pusher configuration
of the KOLB?
Which engine is the most reliable? 912?
Is the 582 a bit underpowered in the Mark III?
If you had a choice without consideration for the price differences, what
engine would you choose?
Wes
--------
Wesley Elliott
Wes E/Kolbers:
I have never had an overheating problem with any of the Rotax or Cuyuna
engines on Kolb aircraft.
The 912 series engines are extremely reliable. I have been flying the 912
since 1994, before it was designated the 912UL. Presently flying with a
912ULS.
The 582 has plenty power to fly the MKIII. That was my initial power plant
on my MKIII. Lasted 220 hours before it seized. Suspected cold seizure.
Thermostat was probably the contributing factor.
I have flown well over 3,000 hours in front of the 912 series engines. That
is the engine I choose to fly with.
912 is low maintenance. Change the oil, spark plugs, and clean the air
filters, and you are good to go.
john h
Titus, Alabama
Message 5
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" I have been flying the 912 since 1994, before it was designated the
912UL "
Not enough coffee this morning. Been flying the 912's since 1992, 21 years
this coming March 15.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Message 6
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A cure for the cold-seize-on the 582... -Manual radiator shutters.
-You can even install a Vernier throttle cable to control them, then you
can eliminate the thermostat altogether.-http://www.ultralightnews.com/fe
atures/radshutters.htm
Cold seize story... -http://www.reocities.com/hester-hoptown/582Tips/582t
ips.html
You will have to hold the mouse button down and drag to make the text show
through the black "reocities" overlay...
--- On Sat, 1/5/13, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
From: John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Engines
I am soliciting opinions on the engines for the Kolb. I know this is going
to vary.
Do any of the engines have problems overheating in the pusher configuration
of the KOLB?
Which engine is the most reliable? 912?
Is the 582 a bit underpowered in the Mark III?
If you had a choice without consideration for the price differences, what
engine would you choose?
Wes
--------
Wesley Elliott
Wes E/Kolbers:
I have never had an overheating problem with any of the Rotax or Cuyuna
engines on Kolb aircraft.
The 912 series engines are extremely reliable.- I have been flying the 91
2
since 1994, before it was designated the 912UL.- Presently flying with a
912ULS.
The 582 has plenty power to fly the MKIII.- That was my initial power pla
nt
on my MKIII.- Lasted 220 hours before it seized.- Suspected cold seizur
e.
Thermostat was probably the contributing factor.
I have flown well over 3,000 hours in front of the 912 series engines.- T
hat
is the engine I choose to fly with.
912 is low maintenance.- Change the oil, spark plugs, and clean the air
filters, and you are good to go.
john h
Titus, Alabama
le, List Admin.
Message 7
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A cure for the coldseizeon the 582... Manual radiator shutters. You can
even install a Vernier throttle cable to control them, then you can
eliminate the thermostat altogether.
http://www.ultralightnews.com/features/radshutters.htm
Kolbers:
I cured the problem. After I rebuilt the 582, I traded it for an 80 hp 912.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Message 8
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Wes, The 582 has more than enough power for the Mk III C or X. I own a C
and flew the X for a bit while restoring it for the owner. The problem is
fuel cost. Even Rotax fuel comsumption graph shows a 5 gallon an hour fuel
burn at 5800 rpm. Mine burns that no matter what I do. Then add the cost of
oil, a bit less than a quart per hour and you're looking at $20 an hour to
fly as long gas remains in the low $3 a gallon range.
For cost and power, it's hard to beat the VW, although it's heavy compared
to the 912.
Having owned an HKS for seven years on my trike, that would be my engine of
choice for purchase cost, weight, and low operating cost, but I have not
tried it yet.
The most important thing with a Mk III is weight. Keep it below 550 lb and
performance with a 582 is great. Over 600 lb. and it is less.
Rick Girard
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 AM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
>
> " I have been flying the 912 since 1994, before it was designated the
> 912UL "
>
>
> Not enough coffee this morning. Been flying the 912's since 1992, 21 years
> this coming March 15.
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
>
--
Zulu Delta
Mk IIIC
Thanks, Homer GBYM
It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
- Groucho Marx
Message 9
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Wes
I was the first to fly a direct drive and now redrive VW on a Kolb. Its a
good engine but if money was no object I would have put a Rotax 912 on it.
Yes the VW has over heating problems on the ground. I have to limit run
time on the ground but get airborne where air is moving through the cooling
system there are no problems. But the VW is not sold as a engine package,
it is easy to built and run these engines at high power levels that will
overpower their ability to stay cool even in the air. Anything over 80-90
HP continuous is likely to over heat.
I have no doubt that I will get flamed for this but The old reliable 912
isn't completely without issues. I just found out that the 912 powered
Sport Cruisers that I normally rent in Florida have been sold because they
just required too much maintenance. It seems that the high frequency
vibration from these engines causes a bunch of metal fatigue issues
with exhaust systems and other systems on and around these engines. Talk to
any 912 driver that has any significant hours on their engines and they
will report similar problems. Compared to higher RPM 2 stroke engines the
issue is almost non existent. But compared to low RPM direct drive GA
engines it is a problem.
As usual worth what you paid for it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:32 AM, alienwes <elliott.wesley@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I am soliciting opinions on the engines for the Kolb. I know this is going
> to vary.
>
> Do any of the engines have problems overheating in the pusher
> configuration of the KOLB?
>
> Which engine is the most reliable? 912?
>
> Is the 582 a bit underpowered in the Mark III?
>
> If you had a choice without consideration for the price differences, what
> engine would you choose?
>
> Wes
>
> --------
> Wesley Elliott
> Sport Pilot-PPC
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391641#391641
>
>
Message 10
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I have no doubt that I will getflamedfor this but The old reliable 912
isn'tcompletelywithout issues. I just found out that the 912 powered Sport
Cruisers that I normally rent in Florida have been sold because they just
required too much maintenance. It seems that the high frequency vibration
from these engines causes a bunch of metal fatigue issues
withexhaustsystems and other systems on and around these engines. Talk to
any 912 driver that has any significant hours on their engines and they will
reportsimilarproblems.Comparedto higher RPM 2 stroke engines the issue
is almost nonexistent. Butcomparedto low RPM direct drive GA enginesit
is a problem.
As usual worth what you paid for it.
Rick Neilsen
Rick N/Kolbers:
I've been doing this a long time, both two and four stroke engines.
The old reliable 912 is just that. If the aircraft you reference had
vibration problems, it was caused by prop balance and/or engine mounts. Not
the engine, unless they let the carbs get excessively out of sync. As I
said in an earlier post, the 912 is a low maintenance engine.
Don't know if I am a high time 912 owner or not, but over 3,000.0 hours of
912 time in my MKIII, plus quite a few hours in Kolb Factory aircraft
powered by the 912, over the years, I have not experienced the problems you
describe.
This is the first time I have heard of this problem with the 912 series
engines.
Based on my experience, there is no comparison between a two and four stroke
Rotax.
I personally prefer the 912 over a GA recip engine, and that is based on
actual flight experience over some very hostile terrain in the Lower 48,
Canada, and Alaska.
You probably don't have a lot of actual experience flying a 912 powered Kolb
aircraft.
Because an engine is designed to operate at higher rpm's does not mean it is
going to tear itself apart. That is the mentality that a lot of GA types
have when comparing a slow turning Lycoming or Continental. The torsion
vibration of a 912 is controlled by a very effective system. GA recip
engines have no damper. Correct me if I am wrong, but your VW redrive
system uses slippage in the drive belt to dampen torsion vibration.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Message 11
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None taken Pat
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 11:54 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Antioch, CA
>
> Paul,
> I suspect that you don`t want to come to the UK to look at my Kolb.
>
> Sorry about that.
>
> Of course if you DO. I am in the South of England and nowhere near
> Liverpool.
>
> Liverpool is in the uncouth Northern part of England where they talk funny
> and put salt on their porridge.
> (Sorry Eddie)
>
> Pat
>
>
>
Message 12
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John
I don't think I said that there was engine reliability problem. I think it
can be safely said that the 912 series of engine are just as reliable as a
GA engine maybe more so.
But the high frequency vibration of these engines even when properly
maintained takes a toll on engine systems. It is fairly common to have a
GA exhaust system remain crack free to the engines TBO and well beyond. Can
you honestly say that about the exhaust systems on your airplane or others
we fly with? You talk about letting the carbs get out of sync, isn't
that maintenance, is this effected by vibration? How often does a GA engine
have to have its carbs synced. Seems like you guys frequently replace the
rubber carb sockets or what ever you call them.
My point was, it is all based on your point of reference. A two
stroke driver would think that a 912 is extremely reliable some would
say bullet proof. A aircraft rental FBO that is used to maintaining GA
airplanes would consider having to replace carb sockets, exahust systems,
syncing carbs and other things as unreliable even if the engine runs just
as long.
On my last check ride my instructor commented that my VW was smoother than
his 912. And yes my drive belts slip every minute my engine is running.
I inspect them every time I fly and adjust them after the first hour and
about every 40-80 hours. I can tell when the belts need adjusting when the
RPMs start increasing over my normal full throttle climb RPM. I replace
them every 100-200 hours or no more than two years. What was your point?
I will say it again if money was no object I would be flying a 912 or a GA
engine if they weren't so blessed heavy.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
Rick Neilsen
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 11:13 AM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
>
> I have no doubt that I will get flamed for this but The old reliable 912
> isn't completely without issues. I just found out that the 912 powered
> Sport
> Cruisers that I normally rent in Florida have been sold because they just
> required too much maintenance. It seems that the high frequency vibration
> from these engines causes a bunch of metal fatigue issues
> with exhaust systems and other systems on and around these engines. Talk to
> any 912 driver that has any significant hours on their engines and they
> will
> report similar problems. Compared to higher RPM 2 stroke engines the issue
> is almost non existent. But compared to low RPM direct drive GA engines it
> is a problem.
>
> As usual worth what you paid for it.
>
> Rick Neilsen
>
>
> Rick N/Kolbers:
>
> I've been doing this a long time, both two and four stroke engines.
>
> The old reliable 912 is just that. If the aircraft you reference had
> vibration problems, it was caused by prop balance and/or engine mounts.
> Not
> the engine, unless they let the carbs get excessively out of sync. As I
> said in an earlier post, the 912 is a low maintenance engine.
>
> Don't know if I am a high time 912 owner or not, but over 3,000.0 hours of
> 912 time in my MKIII, plus quite a few hours in Kolb Factory aircraft
> powered by the 912, over the years, I have not experienced the problems you
> describe.
>
> This is the first time I have heard of this problem with the 912 series
> engines.
>
> Based on my experience, there is no comparison between a two and four
> stroke
> Rotax.
>
> I personally prefer the 912 over a GA recip engine, and that is based on
> actual flight experience over some very hostile terrain in the Lower 48,
> Canada, and Alaska.
>
> You probably don't have a lot of actual experience flying a 912 powered
> Kolb
> aircraft.
>
> Because an engine is designed to operate at higher rpm's does not mean it
> is
> going to tear itself apart. That is the mentality that a lot of GA types
> have when comparing a slow turning Lycoming or Continental. The torsion
> vibration of a 912 is controlled by a very effective system. GA recip
> engines have no damper. Correct me if I am wrong, but your VW redrive
> system uses slippage in the drive belt to dampen torsion vibration.
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
>
Message 13
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I've sync'd the carbs on my present 912uls twice in 619.1 hours. The first
time was when I mounted the zero time engine.
When a 912 carb gets out of sync it is because cable stretch and normal
hardware wear. Not because of a high freq vibration. If there is
vibration, as I said in my last post, it is because of prop and engine
mounts.
How many GA engines have dual carbs? None that I know of right off hand.
I've never flown in your airplane. You have flown in mine at Monument
Valley, UT. You know which aircraft has the smoothest running engine and
prop.
I forgot what my point was, but seems ramped dogs and a slip clutch is a
better system for torsion vibration damping than a slipping belt.
I've replaced the carb sockets on my present 912uls once. I think that was
last year. Been flying that engine since 13 Apr 2007. On my second exhaust
system now. The initial system was designed by and manufactured for Rick
Thomason to fly on an enclosed tractor, the Starlite. Didn't realize it at
the time, but was poorly designed and built. John W and I both flew with
that system. They came apart, not because of high freq vibration, but poor
quality. Replaced with a Titan system that is working great.
If an engine has a high frequency vibration problem, it doesn't take long
for it to start showing up with cracked tubing in the airframe, especially
with the engine mount system we use on Kolb Aircraft.
I can see where carb sockets would not last as long on an enclosed tractor
compared to an open pusher. There is a lot of heat inside that cowling,
especially on the ground.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
But the high frequency vibration of these engines even when properly
maintained takes a toll on engine systems. It is fairly common to have a GA
exhaust system remain crack free to the engines TBO and well beyond. Can you
honestly say that about the exhaust systems on your airplane or others we
fly with? You talk about letting the carbs get out of sync, isn't that
maintenance, is this effected by vibration? How often does a GA engine have
to have its carbs synced. Seems like you guys frequently replace the rubber
carb sockets or what ever you call them.
My point was, it is all based on your point of reference. A two stroke
driver would think that a 912 is extremely reliable some would say bullet
proof. A aircraft rental FBO that is used to maintaining GA airplanes would
consider having to replace carb sockets, exahust systems, syncing carbs and
other things as unreliable even if the engine runs just as long.
On my last check ride my instructor commented that my VW was smoother than
his 912. And yes my drive belts slip every minute my engine is running. I
inspect them every time I fly and adjust them after the first hour and about
every 40-80 hours. I can tell when the belts need adjusting when the RPMs
start increasing over my normal full throttle climb RPM. I replace them
every 100-200 hours or no more than two years. What was your point?
I will say it again if money was no object I would be flying a 912 or a GA
engine if they weren't so blessed heavy.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
Rick Neilsen
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 11:13 AM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
I have no doubt that I will get flamed for this but The old reliable 912
isn't completely without issues. I just found out that the 912 powered Sport
Cruisers that I normally rent in Florida have been sold because they just
required too much maintenance. It seems that the high frequency vibration
from these engines causes a bunch of metal fatigue issues
with exhaust systems and other systems on and around these engines. Talk to
any 912 driver that has any significant hours on their engines and they will
report similar problems. Compared to higher RPM 2 stroke engines the issue
is almost non existent. But compared to low RPM direct drive GA engines it
is a problem.
As usual worth what you paid for it.
Rick Neilsen
Rick N/Kolbers:
I've been doing this a long time, both two and four stroke engines.
The old reliable 912 is just that. If the aircraft you reference had
vibration problems, it was caused by prop balance and/or engine mounts. Not
the engine, unless they let the carbs get excessively out of sync. As I
said in an earlier post, the 912 is a low maintenance engine.
Don't know if I am a high time 912 owner or not, but over 3,000.0 hours of
912 time in my MKIII, plus quite a few hours in Kolb Factory aircraft
powered by the 912, over the years, I have not experienced the problems you
describe.
This is the first time I have heard of this problem with the 912 series
engines.
Based on my experience, there is no comparison between a two and four stroke
Rotax.
I personally prefer the 912 over a GA recip engine, and that is based on
actual flight experience over some very hostile terrain in the Lower 48,
Canada, and Alaska.
You probably don't have a lot of actual experience flying a 912 powered Kolb
aircraft.
Because an engine is designed to operate at higher rpm's does not mean it is
going to tear itself apart. That is the mentality that a lot of GA types
have when comparing a slow turning Lycoming or Continental. The torsion
vibration of a 912 is controlled by a very effective system. GA recip
engines have no damper. Correct me if I am wrong, but your VW redrive
system uses slippage in the drive belt to dampen torsion vibration.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
==========
http://forums.matronics.com
==========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
==========
Message 14
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It is good to hear that the 582 has enough power for the Mark III. The 582 in my
Powered Parachute is OK, but would like more climb when I am 2 up. And mine
is considered a lighter PPC, with some of the heavier PPC's out there the climb
is even worse. I have the louvers on my grey head 582. It does help me feel
better about preventing a cold seizure.
--------
Wesley Elliott
Sport Pilot-PPC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391678#391678
Message 15
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Wesley
I fly a mk1111c with a 582 and an arplast 62" three blade prop Here in the
uk ( Liverpool) Our field is only about 10ft above sea level and When flying
at max weigth ( over here 395 kilos ) in reality usually 10 or so kilos more
with two heavyish people in her and full to the brim tanks I am off the
ground in well under half of our 390 metre shortest runway and can usually
get a climb rate of around 800fpm even in quite warm weather at about 55/60
mph airspeed .When in the cruise 55/60mph at about 5400rpm gets me in the
region of 14/15 litres per hour a well usuable aircraft
Eddie Bayliss mk111c 582 arplats prop liverpool uk
----- Original Message -----
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley@yahoo.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 10:07 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Engines
>
> It is good to hear that the 582 has enough power for the Mark III. The 582
> in my Powered Parachute is OK, but would like more climb when I am 2 up.
> And mine is considered a lighter PPC, with some of the heavier PPC's out
> there the climb is even worse. I have the louvers on my grey head 582. It
> does help me feel better about preventing a cold seizure.
>
> --------
> Wesley Elliott
> Sport Pilot-PPC
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391678#391678
>
>
>
Message 16
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Wow Eddie! Thats some good climb. I am used to only 300 fpm in my PPC on hot days
and 2 up. I am at 3000 msl but on summer evenings density altitude is around
7000.
--------
Wesley Elliott
Sport Pilot-PPC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391682#391682
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Viking/Honda Engines-Again! |
I know that this new engine has been talked about in the past, but it seems they
have been shipping out alot of them and it looks like they might be around for
the longterm. One the viking yahoo forum there is a guy who says he is seriously
considering mounting the Viking on a KOLB.
Jan-
I think it would be great if you looked at the integration of the engine on the
2 place KOLB's. I think it would be an excellent performance fit and I believe
the market, especially retrofit, would be at least as large as the SeaRay. I
could send you pictures or scanes of the drawings offline. The KOLB factory
guys could probably do even better. I am aware of these airplanes with mostly
912's Jabs and 582's, but also 618's, Hirths, Subarus, VW's, and BMW's. I am
not aware of any of them using a conventional welded tubing engine mount. They
bolted from a bottom framework on the engine essentially at the engine
longitudinal CG to 4 Berry/Lord mounts on about a 10 in square horizontal pad at
the aft end of the KOLB cage. If there is available structure for that on the
Viking it would probably be the most structurally efficient option...especially
for those of us with a finished cage and looking at a retrofit from the Rotax
configuration.
Bob
Might be another alternative to the costly 912?
--------
Wesley Elliott
Sport Pilot-PPC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391684#391684
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You are correct about coming to the UK. That's good that you don't live in the
uncouth part of the UK.
Brad
On Jan 5, 2013, at 4:54 , Pat Ladd wrote:
>
> Paul,
> I suspect that you don`t want to come to the UK to look at my Kolb.
>
> Sorry about that.
>
> Of course if you DO. I am in the South of England and nowhere near Liverpool.
>
> Liverpool is in the uncouth Northern part of England where they talk funny and
put salt on their porridge.
> (Sorry Eddie)
>
> Pat
>
>
>
>
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Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic?
I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it.
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't?
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin <jimd4414@hotmail.com> wrote:
> **
>
> Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic?
> I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it.
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In and
out of it.
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com<mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't?
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin
<jimd4414@hotmail.com<mailto:jimd4414@hotmail.com>> wrote:
Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic?
I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in
it.
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
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| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't have
any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it, than you
would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size. These little
wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be :-)
Good luck
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin <jimd4414@hotmail.com> wrote:
> **
> I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In and
> out of it.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
> *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List:
>
> how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't?
> Larry
>
> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin <jimd4414@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> **
>>
>> Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic?
>> I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it.
>>
>> *
>>
>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
> address before sending.*
>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c*
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| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
Thanks Larry
Are you close to Billings that I can take a look at yours?
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com<mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:48 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't
have any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it,
than you would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size.
These little wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be
:-)
Good luck
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin
<jimd4414@hotmail.com<mailto:jimd4414@hotmail.com>> wrote:
I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In
and out of it.
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com<mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't?
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin
<jimd4414@hotmail.com<mailto:jimd4414@hotmail.com>> wrote:
Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic?
I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will
fit in it.
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List<http://www.ma
tronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>
tp://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/>
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/co
ntribution>
--
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my
email address before sending.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List<http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List<h
ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>
href="http://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/>">http:/
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| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
No, I am in far Eastern Oregon, and I now have a Firestar II. If you are
looking at a specific Mark 3, why not go to the plane that you are thinking
of and have him take you for a ride. That way you can see how it works. If
you are looking at a kit from Kolb, call Travis and talk to him, he won't
steer you wrong. If you are just shopping for the type of plane, perhaps
someone will step up and take you for a ride.
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:52 PM, James Dustin <jimd4414@hotmail.com> wrote:
> **
> Thanks Larry
> Are you close to Billings that I can take a look at yours?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
> *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:48 PM
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List:
>
> Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't have
> any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it, than you
> would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size. These little
> wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be :-)
> Good luck
> Larry
>
> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin <jimd4414@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> **
>> I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In
>> and out of it.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
>> *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com
>> *Sent:* Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List:
>>
>> how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't?
>> Larry
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin <jimd4414@hotmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic?
>>> I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it.
>>>
>>> *
>>>
>>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
>> address before sending.*
>>
>> *
>>
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c*
>>
>> *
>>
>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
>
>
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> address before sending.*
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| Subject: | Re: Viking/Honda Engines-Again! |
Wes
You are asking a lot of interesting questions. That's good. A new engine on
a airplane is from personal experience a lot of time and effort. Seemed
like everything needed to be designed and built for that engine/air frame.
Check the engine weight closely, it is real tough to beat the power/weight
of a 912. Engine manufacturers are notorious for under reporting their
operational weight. Additional weight means less load carrying capacity so
you could end up with a single passenger airplane or worse. Engine mounts
and exhaust systems are a nightmare and don't expect to have a engine or
airplane manufacture to design one for you without a proven
market opportunity. Seemingly easy things like prop selection and reduction
ratios are very difficult to get right the first or second time. Bottom
line it is easy to spend more than the cost of a 912 and not have as good a
engine or worse.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 7:42 PM, alienwes <elliott.wesley@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I know that this new engine has been talked about in the past, but it
> seems they have been shipping out alot of them and it looks like they might
> be around for the longterm. One the viking yahoo forum there is a guy who
> says he is seriously considering mounting the Viking on a KOLB.
>
> Jan-
> I think it would be great if you looked at the integration of the engine
> on the
> 2 place KOLB's. I think it would be an excellent performance fit and I
> believe
> the market, especially retrofit, would be at least as large as the SeaRay.
> I
> could send you pictures or scanes of the drawings offline. The KOLB factory
> guys could probably do even better. I am aware of these airplanes with
> mostly
> 912's Jabs and 582's, but also 618's, Hirths, Subarus, VW's, and BMW's. I
> am
> not aware of any of them using a conventional welded tubing engine mount.
> They
> bolted from a bottom framework on the engine essentially at the engine
> longitudinal CG to 4 Berry/Lord mounts on about a 10 in square horizontal
> pad at
> the aft end of the KOLB cage. If there is available structure for that on
> the
> Viking it would probably be the most structurally efficient
> option...especially
> for those of us with a finished cage and looking at a retrofit from the
> Rotax
> configuration.
>
> Bob
>
> Might be another alternative to the costly 912?
>
> --------
> Wesley Elliott
> Sport Pilot-PPC
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391684#391684
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Viking/Honda Engines-Again! |
It's also good to take a very close look at the vendor. That particular
vendor has a long track record (that, with a different name, precedes
the Viking project & has a much longer record). Your mission, should you
choose to accept it, is to determine what that track record is.
Charlie
On 01/05/2013 10:15 PM, Rick Neilsen wrote:
> Wes
>
> You are asking a lot of interesting questions. That's good. A new
> engine on a airplane is from personal experience a lot of time and
> effort. Seemed like everything needed to be designed and built for
> that engine/air frame. Check the engine weight closely, it is real
> tough to beat the power/weight of a 912. Engine manufacturers
> are notorious for under reporting their operational
> weight. Additional weight means less load carrying capacity so you
> could end up with a single passenger airplane or worse. Engine mounts
> and exhaust systems are a nightmare and don't expect to have a engine
> or airplane manufacture to design one for you without a proven
> market opportunity. Seemingly easy things like prop selection and
> reduction ratios are very difficult to get right the first or second
> time. Bottom line it is easy to spend more than the cost of a 912 and
> not have as good a engine or worse.
>
> Rick Neilsen
> Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
>
> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 7:42 PM, alienwes <elliott.wesley@yahoo.com
> <mailto:elliott.wesley@yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> <elliott.wesley@yahoo.com <mailto:elliott.wesley@yahoo.com>>
>
> I know that this new engine has been talked about in the past, but
> it seems they have been shipping out alot of them and it looks
> like they might be around for the longterm. One the viking yahoo
> forum there is a guy who says he is seriously considering mounting
> the Viking on a KOLB.
>
> Jan-
> I think it would be great if you looked at the integration of the
> engine on the
> 2 place KOLB's. I think it would be an excellent performance fit
> and I believe
> the market, especially retrofit, would be at least as large as the
> SeaRay. I
> could send you pictures or scanes of the drawings offline. The
> KOLB factory
> guys could probably do even better. I am aware of these airplanes
> with mostly
> 912's Jabs and 582's, but also 618's, Hirths, Subarus, VW's, and
> BMW's. I am
> not aware of any of them using a conventional welded tubing engine
> mount. They
> bolted from a bottom framework on the engine essentially at the engine
> longitudinal CG to 4 Berry/Lord mounts on about a 10 in square
> horizontal pad at
> the aft end of the KOLB cage. If there is available structure for
> that on the
> Viking it would probably be the most structurally efficient
> option...especially
> for those of us with a finished cage and looking at a retrofit
> from the Rotax
> configuration.
>
> Bob
>
> Might be another alternative to the costly 912?
>
> --------
> Wesley Elliott
> Sport Pilot-PPC
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
I was hoping to find one locally so I could try one on for size before
making the trip to SC. Why did you go to a Firestar from a Mark lll
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com<mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 9:13 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
No, I am in far Eastern Oregon, and I now have a Firestar II. If you
are looking at a specific Mark 3, why not go to the plane that you are
thinking of and have him take you for a ride. That way you can see how
it works. If you are looking at a kit from Kolb, call Travis and talk to
him, he won't steer you wrong. If you are just shopping for the type of
plane, perhaps someone will step up and take you for a ride.
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:52 PM, James Dustin
<jimd4414@hotmail.com<mailto:jimd4414@hotmail.com>> wrote:
Thanks Larry
Are you close to Billings that I can take a look at yours?
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com<mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:48 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and
didn't have any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble
with it, than you would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on
for size. These little wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy
can be :-)
Good luck
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin
<jimd4414@hotmail.com<mailto:jimd4414@hotmail.com>> wrote:
I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble
getting In and out of it.
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
To: kolb-list@matronics.com<mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you
wouldn't?
Larry
On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin
<jimd4414@hotmail.com<mailto:jimd4414@hotmail.com>> wrote:
Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll
Classic?
I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I
will fit in it.
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List<http://www.ma
tronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>
tp://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/>
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/co
ntribution>
--
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my
email address before sending.
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