---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 01/18/13: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:15 AM - Re: Aileron trim-drag question (t41pilot) 2. 10:32 AM - Re: Aileron trim-drag question (t41pilot) 3. 11:46 AM - Re: Re: Aileron trim-drag question (Larry Cottrell) 4. 12:51 PM - Re: Aileron trim-drag question (t41pilot) 5. 01:19 PM - Re: Re: Aileron trim-drag question (Larry Cottrell) 6. 02:49 PM - Re: Re: Aileron trim-drag question (Dana Hague) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:15:00 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Aileron trim-drag question From: "t41pilot" My Firefly needed aileron trim as well. It was only a problem at full or cruise throttle settings so may be a P-Factor thing. At reduced throttle and approach speeds, the ailerons felt fine. I opted for a trim tab because I don't have much room in my cockpit area. I noticed an immediate improvement. The angle on the tab was a guess to start with and I just used test flights to get it dialed in. It's attached with #6 screws right now. I'm pretty much there now and it ended up at the same angle as my rudder tab. I think it's in the neighborhood of 22 to 25 degrees. I'll attach it permanently after I paint it....next spring. It's the dead of winter here right now. My tab is the width of 1 rib bay but a longer narrower tab could be used and would give more attach points if you so desired. I was scared while drilling the ribs that the drill bit would slip and I would ruin my cover job but managed without incident. Just slow and careful is the rule here with new bullet tip drill bit. In conclusion, I'm glad I did it. My only regret is that I needed a tab at all. Was it a building error or P-factor? I'm don't know but am not gointg to worry about it. The plane flies well now. It's possible I may have lost a mph or 2 but my firefly is so light and quick that I can't tell for sure since I'm affected by winds more than you. I have an install picture but am having trouble getting it small enough to post here. I'll work on that. Meanwhile, I can E-mail one to you if you are interested. -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392578#392578 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:32:37 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Aileron trim-drag question From: "t41pilot" Here's the pic of my Tab. I'll paint to match in the spring -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392594#392594 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pa270080_837.jpg ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:46:24 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Aileron trim-drag question From: Larry Cottrell Fireflies must be different than Firestars, Mine is pointed in the other direction. You probably should make sure that you need the elevator to go up or down before you fasten it in a permanent fashion. Larry On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 11:32 AM, t41pilot wrote: > > Here's the pic of my Tab. I'll paint to match in the spring > > -------- > Gregg Kaat > 2011 Firefly > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392594#392594 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/pa270080_837.jpg > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:51:25 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Aileron trim-drag question From: "t41pilot" Not sure what you meant by elevator up or down. This is an aileron trim tab. I determined what direction the ailerons needed to move before I made the tab to achieve the desired trim. The tab can be mounted up or down as long as the proper aileron side is chosen to do the type of mount you desire and the aileron deflects in the direction desired. In my case, I would achieve the same result with a downward pointing tab mounted on the opposite aileron. It may be a matter of what is more visually appealing to a person. The plane has already flown in the current configuration and my trim problem was solved. I just haven't got it mounted permanently yet. It's possible that a tab may work better in one configuration as compared with the other but an engineer would have to help with that. I don't know that answer. -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392599#392599 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:19:06 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Aileron trim-drag question From: Larry Cottrell Oops, I thought that it was an elevator. You are of course correct. ( The sun was shining on my computer screen and I couldn't see the screen clearly. You believe that?) Larry On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 1:51 PM, t41pilot wrote: > > Not sure what you meant by elevator up or down. This is an aileron trim > tab. I determined what direction the ailerons needed to move before I made > the tab to achieve the desired trim. The tab can be mounted up or down as > long as the proper aileron side is chosen to do the type of mount you > desire and the aileron deflects in the direction desired. In my case, I > would achieve the same result with a downward pointing tab mounted on the > opposite aileron. It may be a matter of what is more visually appealing to > a person. The plane has already flown in the current configuration and > my trim problem was solved. I just haven't got it mounted permanently yet. > It's possible that a tab may work better in one configuration as compared > with the other but an engineer would have to help with that. I don't know > that answer. > > -------- > Gregg Kaat > 2011 Firefly > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392599#392599 > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:49:09 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Aileron trim-drag question My Ultrastar was off in roll trim when I bought it. The top cross tube on the cage was visibly bent, not enough to be unsafe but enough to reduce the left wing incidence. I fixed it by making a new universal joint block (on the US the U-joint is at the main spar) with one hole offset about 1/8". Now the wings are even and the plane flies straight. My point in relating this is that if the roll trim is off, this is a simple way to fix it without adding a trim tab. -Dana -- The only correct outcome to an armed robbery attempt is a dead armed robber. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.