---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 09/09/14: 5 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 10:25 AM - Anti Flutter idea.... (Nick Cassara) 2. 11:54 AM - Re: Anti Flutter idea.... (jimbaker@npacc.net) 3. 12:12 PM - Re: Anti Flutter idea.... (b young) 4. 12:27 PM - Re: Anti Flutter idea.... (The Kuffels) 5. 08:53 PM - Re: Anti Flutter idea.... (Richard Pike) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 10:25:42 AM PST US From: "Nick Cassara" Subject: Kolb-List: Anti Flutter idea.... Hello Kolbers, I had a though about aileron flutter.I have these heavy counter weights that I will be installing on the outboard ends of my ailerons soon. Disclaimer. I am a True "amateur" so please tell me why this idea is a bad one! If the idea of these weight is to apply resistance to keep the aileron from fluttering, could this function not also be accomplished by install a fiberglass rod running along the bottom of the end wing rib, and continuing out to the end of the aileron. The rod would flex up or done through the movement on the aileron, but would dampen the aileron movements. Ok, what do you think? Has this ever been tried..did the pilot live? Thanks, Nick Cassara Palmer, Alaska Fulltime Amateur! 607AK ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:54:46 AM PST US From: jimbaker@npacc.net Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Anti Flutter idea.... 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Nick it is not a resistance,,,, it is a MASS counter balance a rod from the rib to under the aileron, would increase the working load on the stick, pilot, linkages,,, and make a somewhat heavy aileron near im possible to maneuver,,, IMHO in my humble opinion. boyd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If the idea of these weight is to apply resistance to keep the aileron from fluttering, could this function not also be accomplished by install a fiberglass rod running along the bottom of the end wing rib, and continuing out to the end of the aileron. The rod would flex up or done through the movement on the aileron, but would dampen the aileron movements. Ok, what d o you think? Has this ever been tried..did the pilot live? Thanks, Nick Cassara --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protec tion is active. http://www.avast.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:27:36 PM PST US From: "The Kuffels" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Anti Flutter idea.... Nick, << fluttering, could this function not also be accomplished by install a fiberglass rod running along the bottom of the end wing rib, and continuing out to the end of the aileron. The rod would flex up or done through the movement on the aileron, but would dampen the aileron movements >> I agree with Jim Baker, this is a bad idea. While I'm no expert in aerodynamics either, I use to do flutter and spin testing so have some experience with the issues. A simple thought experiment may help explain why this is a bad idea. Consider one wing as it goes through a thermal. As the wing enters the thermal, the trailing edge of the aileron will want to go down, on leaving the trailing edge will want to go up. With the counterweight, inertia will resist the entering downward movement and inertia and momentum will resist the exiting upward movement. With the rod, on entering the rod is flexed upward, on leaving this flex will increase the upward movement of the aileron trailing edge. Doesn't take too much imagination to suspect things could get very bad, very fast. This ignores the mechanical complexity of some sort of flexible mounting to accommodate the different effective length of the rod as the aileron moves. We have almost 100 years of experience with mass balancing of control surfaces to eliminate flutter. Believe it is best in this case to stick with what is known to work. Tom Kuffel, CFI etc. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:53:25 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Anti Flutter idea.... From: "Richard Pike" Use the tried and true counterweight method. Your proposal is (quite frankly) a good way to disassemble your Kolb in a remarkably instantaneous fashion.. -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kingsport, TN 3TN0 My soul shall be joyful in the LORD; It shall rejoice in His salvation. Psalm 35:9 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430270#430270 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.