Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:41 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (Gary Aman)
2. 06:15 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (Lee)
3. 07:09 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (Richard Pike)
4. 07:24 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (Stuart Harner)
5. 08:00 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (John Hauck)
6. 09:04 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (Herb)
7. 09:55 AM - Re: Serenity flies! (Stuart Harner)
Message 1
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Serenity flies! |
Congratulations on your first flight! Just a thought on first flights if I may.Make
it a long flight,getting the feel at slower speeds
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 29, 2014, at 12:41 PM, "Airknocker" <airknocker@harnerfarm.net> wrote:
>
>
> Well guys, we finally did it. Last Saturday I took Serenity to the airport and
got to taxi her around a little. Found a couple of minor things to adjust,
then test again.
>
> Taxied around the ramp slowly, then went to the west end of the grass strip.
At this point, I have to say pavement SUCKS!
>
> The weather was warm and the breeze light and variable. Made several trips up
and down the runway at varying speeds, getting braver with each pass. Got the
tail up and was able to hold it there while keeping straight. No irregularities
at all. Engine running well with temps in the right range.
>
> A quick check of the radio, no other planes in the area, time to quit messing
around.
>
> Partial power up, tail up, glance at the windsock, limp and straight down the
runway. More power, getting light and bouncy. Oops, not going straight anymore,
glance at windsock, right crosswind, fed in some right aileron and left rudder.
She feels ready to fly, oh, oh, runway light in the cross-hairs! More
power and pull back, airborne well before edge of runway.
>
> Holy CRAP! I'm airborne!
>
> Left wing dropped, over corrected.
> Nose came up, over corrected.
> Nose went down, pulled off some power, got it level with elevator.
> Crap, right wing went down, over corrected, but not as much.
> Warning light on EIS, EGT or something out of whack.
> Wings have a mind of their own, tail does too...
>
> What the HE!! have I done? I won't die up here, it will be when I hit the ground
out of control. Panic setting in! Every time I touch something, EVERYTHING
changes. AAAGGGG!
>
> Wait, calm down and just fly. Whew, that is better, where am I? Why is that
warning light still on?
>
> Let go of throttle to hit button on EIS. Throttle shuts down and nose comes
up. HUH? Push nose down, grab throttle and start the PIO all over again. Wait,
calm down and fly.
>
> OK, not so bad, oops bumps in the air. Gee I must be above pattern altitude,
can't see the altimeter because the EIS on the warning page. Looks like high
EGT, but not too bad as I have the limits set kind of low.
>
> Turn crosswind before I get out of gliding range. Left wing drops, fixed, not
going the right way. Was that the plane or an air bubble? Mushed it around finally
pointing the right way. Looked for traffic, none seen nor heard. OK more
bumps and more PIO. Throttle up, down and everywhere in between.
>
> YIKES, what have I done? Wait, calm down and fly. Whew, better, time to turn
downwind. Glance at airspeed, somewhere north of 60, OK we probably won't stall
and spin in a gentle turn. This one went better. On downwind leg, getting
a grip and just flying.
>
> Turned base leg, more bumps, more PIO. Recovery was smoother and faster. Got
it around to final leg. Decided to just stay at that altitude, whatever it was
and just fly around the patch one more time keeping the runway slightly off
to my left so I can see if I am going straight.
>
> Some guy on the ground calls me on the radio and says "is it rough up there or
are you having problems?" WHAT? I am 90 seconds into my first flight and YOU
want to talk about it, NOW? Are you planning on coming up to help? Found
the transmit button and managed to squeak out "I think it's me". Managed to drop
the button, oh-oh, this thing is flapping every which way but loose again!
>
> OK, calm down and fly, OK better. Managed to get all the way around to base
leg again and only had a few "burbles and PIO's". OK, plan on making a standard
approach and fly the length of the runway, then go around and do it again.
Radio calls, someone 5 miles out, headed my way. That is a Champ, he will be
here before I can get out of the way.
>
> On final now, wishing I could find that transmit button to let him know my intentions.
Back off the throttle a little and push the nose down. Not so bad,
holding 50 MPH. Keeping lined up, still 50. OK. Hey, I am pointed at the numbers,
well, if there were numbers, that is where they would be. Still going 50,
all is well. Champ is getting close, better just set it down and get out of
the way.
>
> Wait, what? Landing? Man, that runway got here fast, backed of the throttle
and started to flair. How high am I? Where did the center of the runway go?
>
> Still pointed straight, slowing down. How low do I put the nose? I don't want
to nose over. I don't want to do a 3 point, do I flair anymore?
>
> Didn't matter, Serenity decided for me. We did a 3 point landing on 2 wheels.
Boing! One good hop of maybe 6", then all 3 wheels hit and stuck. Jerked
the last of the throttle off and was stopped in the middle of the runway in seconds.
>
> WOW! I am alive! Wow, I am still in the runway with traffic in the pattern,
somewhere.
>
> Powered up and taxied off the runway, just in time to hear the Champ on downwind
for the runway I was on, no problems there. Just reaching the taxiway when
something big and heavy with low wings comes screaming in on the main runway
and touches down. Right about where I would have been if I had done a go around.
If he used the radio, I certainly never heard it. It might have been a Cherokee
or something like it, I only saw a flash.
>
> That certainly was enough for me for the day. Looking at the windsock it was
halfway out and crosswise to all runways, good time to hang it up. Found my
transmit button and and announce "Down and clear". Taxiing back to the hangar,
I heard the Champ on final and clear of the runway. Never did see that other
plane again.
>
> Man, will I EVER have nerve enough to do THAT again? Really, really unsure at
this point.
>
> My wife who had been watching from the edge of the runway finally gets back to
the hangar and congratulates me. She didn't seem excited at all? She said it
looked great, but then again, she usually can't tell the difference between
a Cherokee and a Champ when they are in the air.....
>
> Got Serenity folded up and put away. Gee, will I ever get an appetite again?
Can I still drive? Should I just walk home? It is only 20 miles and walking
is probably safer.
>
> When I got home and looked at the videos my wife took, two things were obvious.
One, my wife can't run a camera, LOTS of blue sky and engine sounds. Two,
(she did manage to film the landing) my landing was not nearly as bad as I thought
while I was doing it, and in my mind afterward.
>
> Took two days of "digesting and analyzing" to begin to come to grips with what
happened.
>
> Lessons learned, or at least re-learned:
>
> Flights rarely go according to plan, have options.
>
> Basic instruction (if done right) is always with you, ie: calm down and fly,
and cut your corrections in half. Thank you Mr. Thomas, all the way back to 1973.
>
> If you didn't bend it, you did good.
>
> I am now ready to do it again. Well, not again, better next time.
>
> I tell this story partially for my own therapy, and for others to hopefully learn
from. If nothing else, maybe it will entertain some of you.
>
> One thing I have not been able to figure out, is why it veered right on take
off.
>
> Taxi testing showed no propensity to go anywhere but straight, so I don't think
is a landing gear problem. My prop turns clockwise (as viewed from behind),
so P-factor should turn it to the left. Dead bugs and oil droplets on the
tail would indicate the air is hitting the left side of the vertical stabilizer
more than the right side. That should push me left, not right. Maybe my old
Chief training took over and I was applying right rudder without knowing it.
>
> Only a re-try will tell for sure. Hopefully I will get some dead air time yet
this fall.
>
> Thanks for listening,
>
> Stuart
>
> --------
> "I don't care, I'm still free. You can't take the sky from me" - Josh
Wedon
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432479#432479
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 2
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Serenity flies! |
Stuart,
I had to laugh at this, it sounded like several of my first flights in a
newly rebuilt plane.
It seems like no matter how thorough you are, there is always something
that needs tweaking
to get it trimmed correctly and then add the fact that it may be an
aircraft that you have never flown.
Every plane that I have had was a rebuild so I have done this several
times.
My last one was going from a CGS Hawk trike gear with a 532 Rotax water
cooled to a Twinstar MKII with a 503 Rotax air cooled with oil
injection.
This was my first oil injection motor. Well I did not get all of the air
out of the injection line. On my first flight with the Twinstar, I
seized the engine and had to land in a real bad field and I had all of
the thoughts that you expressed in your flight and I may have added a
few more new swear words. On my landing, I bent one landing gear and the
tail wheel. Before the flight, on the ground my engine temps were fine,
the problem did not show up until I had lifted up. All is ok with it
now, I removed the injection and have it trimmed out pretty good. Anyway
thanks for a good story and I hope your next flights are less exciting.
Lee
Quicksilver mx, Vector, Goldwing, CGS Hawk, Twinstar MKII
Message 3
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Serenity flies! |
lmorgan100(at)charter.net wrote:
> Stuart,
>
> My last one was going from a CGS Hawk trike gear with a 532 Rotax water cooled
to a Twinstar MKII with a 503 Rotax air cooled with oil injection.
> This was my first oil injection motor. Well I did not get all of the air out
of the injection line. On my first flight with the Twinstar, I seized the engine
>
This brings up something else that would be good to pass along, a 2-stroke oil
injection system can be easily purged by rigging up a little spacer or clip that
will hold the oil pump lever at max. (Adding a little oil to the fuel can't
hurt during this time, just in case.) Tie the airplane down, bring it up to about
3,500 rpm and let it sit and run for a while. It will smoke like crazy, but
after 10 minutes or so you can be confident that you have safely purged all
the air out of the lines.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
My soul shall be joyful in the LORD; It shall rejoice in His salvation. Psalm 35:9
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432547#432547
Message 4
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Thanks, my original intent was to climb up and out of the way of the traffic
pattern and stay in close to the airport. Use the radio at least once per
circuit to announce where I was and my intentions.
Having the PPT button come loose and "disappear " on me, incoming traffic
and my difficulty in controlling myself, and the airplane caused me to go to
plan B, which was get down and out of the way.
On my next flight, after proving I can fly calmly, I will move out of the
area and climb up for the real test flying that needs to be done.
Having a new to me slightly used engine that I have only run for a little
over 2 hours, makes it seem prudent to stick close to a very nice grass
strip at the airport. Wish I could close the airport for an hour or so. :)
After getting my head wrapped around what happened, I am sure the EIS
warning was because I backed off the throttle and was operating in the
mid-range which runs slightly lean, causing high EGT's. I saw this during
the engine break in routine. My cure on the ground was to open the enricher
a little bit to cool it down. Unfortunately, I didn't think of that in the
air. Going to more throttle would have gotten me out of that RPM range as
well. Lesson learned.
During these windy days, I will fix the PPT button mounting and reset the
limits of the EIS slightly closer to the numbers in the Rotax manual. I had
purposely set them low for break in so that I would have time to evaluate
what was going on. Now that I am more familiar with the engine and the EIS,
I can set the limits up a little. I have already tightened the throttle
lever so it should stay put next time.
As I said, after reflection and watching the video of the landing, it really
wasn't as bad as it seemed at the time. On some advice from a friend, I
will try putting my elbow on my leg and fly with my fingertips. That should
help with the PIO problem. Of course, self-control is the most important
one to get a handle on.
Now that some time has passed, I am looking forward to the next flight. I
really do think this Firefly is going to be a lot of fun, once I get to know
it better.
Stuart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Aman
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2014 7:41 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Serenity flies!
Congratulations on your first flight! Just a thought on first flights if I
may.Make it a long flight,getting the feel at slower speeds
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 29, 2014, at 12:41 PM, "Airknocker" <airknocker@harnerfarm.net>
wrote:
>
> --> <airknocker@harnerfarm.net>
>
> Well guys, we finally did it. Last Saturday I took Serenity to the
airport and got to taxi her around a little. Found a couple of minor things
to adjust, then test again.
>
> Taxied around the ramp slowly, then went to the west end of the grass
strip. At this point, I have to say pavement SUCKS!
>
> The weather was warm and the breeze light and variable. Made several
trips up and down the runway at varying speeds, getting braver with each
pass. Got the tail up and was able to hold it there while keeping straight.
No irregularities at all. Engine running well with temps in the right
range.
>
> A quick check of the radio, no other planes in the area, time to quit
messing around.
>
> Partial power up, tail up, glance at the windsock, limp and straight down
the runway. More power, getting light and bouncy. Oops, not going straight
anymore, glance at windsock, right crosswind, fed in some right aileron and
left rudder. She feels ready to fly, oh, oh, runway light in the
cross-hairs! More power and pull back, airborne well before edge of runway.
>
> Holy CRAP! I'm airborne!
>
> Left wing dropped, over corrected.
> Nose came up, over corrected.
> Nose went down, pulled off some power, got it level with elevator.
> Crap, right wing went down, over corrected, but not as much.
> Warning light on EIS, EGT or something out of whack.
> Wings have a mind of their own, tail does too...
>
> What the HE!! have I done? I won't die up here, it will be when I hit the
ground out of control. Panic setting in! Every time I touch something,
EVERYTHING changes. AAAGGGG!
>
> Wait, calm down and just fly. Whew, that is better, where am I? Why is
that warning light still on?
>
> Let go of throttle to hit button on EIS. Throttle shuts down and nose
comes up. HUH? Push nose down, grab throttle and start the PIO all over
again. Wait, calm down and fly.
>
> OK, not so bad, oops bumps in the air. Gee I must be above pattern
altitude, can't see the altimeter because the EIS on the warning page. Looks
like high EGT, but not too bad as I have the limits set kind of low.
>
> Turn crosswind before I get out of gliding range. Left wing drops, fixed,
not going the right way. Was that the plane or an air bubble? Mushed it
around finally pointing the right way. Looked for traffic, none seen nor
heard. OK more bumps and more PIO. Throttle up, down and everywhere in
between.
>
> YIKES, what have I done? Wait, calm down and fly. Whew, better, time to
turn downwind. Glance at airspeed, somewhere north of 60, OK we probably
won't stall and spin in a gentle turn. This one went better. On downwind
leg, getting a grip and just flying.
>
> Turned base leg, more bumps, more PIO. Recovery was smoother and faster.
Got it around to final leg. Decided to just stay at that altitude, whatever
it was and just fly around the patch one more time keeping the runway
slightly off to my left so I can see if I am going straight.
>
> Some guy on the ground calls me on the radio and says "is it rough up
there or are you having problems?" WHAT? I am 90 seconds into my first
flight and YOU want to talk about it, NOW? Are you planning on coming up to
help? Found the transmit button and managed to squeak out "I think it's
me". Managed to drop the button, oh-oh, this thing is flapping every which
way but loose again!
>
> OK, calm down and fly, OK better. Managed to get all the way around to
base leg again and only had a few "burbles and PIO's". OK, plan on making a
standard approach and fly the length of the runway, then go around and do it
again. Radio calls, someone 5 miles out, headed my way. That is a Champ,
he will be here before I can get out of the way.
>
> On final now, wishing I could find that transmit button to let him know my
intentions. Back off the throttle a little and push the nose down. Not so
bad, holding 50 MPH. Keeping lined up, still 50. OK. Hey, I am pointed at
the numbers, well, if there were numbers, that is where they would be.
Still going 50, all is well. Champ is getting close, better just set it
down and get out of the way.
>
> Wait, what? Landing? Man, that runway got here fast, backed of the
throttle and started to flair. How high am I? Where did the center of the
runway go?
>
> Still pointed straight, slowing down. How low do I put the nose? I don't
want to nose over. I don't want to do a 3 point, do I flair anymore?
>
> Didn't matter, Serenity decided for me. We did a 3 point landing on 2
wheels. Boing! One good hop of maybe 6", then all 3 wheels hit and stuck.
Jerked the last of the throttle off and was stopped in the middle of the
runway in seconds.
>
> WOW! I am alive! Wow, I am still in the runway with traffic in the
pattern, somewhere.
>
> Powered up and taxied off the runway, just in time to hear the Champ on
downwind for the runway I was on, no problems there. Just reaching the
taxiway when something big and heavy with low wings comes screaming in on
the main runway and touches down. Right about where I would have been if I
had done a go around. If he used the radio, I certainly never heard it. It
might have been a Cherokee or something like it, I only saw a flash.
>
> That certainly was enough for me for the day. Looking at the windsock it
was halfway out and crosswise to all runways, good time to hang it up.
Found my transmit button and and announce "Down and clear". Taxiing back to
the hangar, I heard the Champ on final and clear of the runway. Never did
see that other plane again.
>
> Man, will I EVER have nerve enough to do THAT again? Really, really
unsure at this point.
>
> My wife who had been watching from the edge of the runway finally gets
back to the hangar and congratulates me. She didn't seem excited at all?
She said it looked great, but then again, she usually can't tell the
difference between a Cherokee and a Champ when they are in the air.....
>
> Got Serenity folded up and put away. Gee, will I ever get an appetite
again? Can I still drive? Should I just walk home? It is only 20 miles
and walking is probably safer.
>
> When I got home and looked at the videos my wife took, two things were
obvious. One, my wife can't run a camera, LOTS of blue sky and engine
sounds. Two, (she did manage to film the landing) my landing was not nearly
as bad as I thought while I was doing it, and in my mind afterward.
>
> Took two days of "digesting and analyzing" to begin to come to grips with
what happened.
>
> Lessons learned, or at least re-learned:
>
> Flights rarely go according to plan, have options.
>
> Basic instruction (if done right) is always with you, ie: calm down and
fly, and cut your corrections in half. Thank you Mr. Thomas, all the way
back to 1973.
>
> If you didn't bend it, you did good.
>
> I am now ready to do it again. Well, not again, better next time.
>
> I tell this story partially for my own therapy, and for others to
hopefully learn from. If nothing else, maybe it will entertain some of you.
>
> One thing I have not been able to figure out, is why it veered right on
take off.
>
> Taxi testing showed no propensity to go anywhere but straight, so I don't
think is a landing gear problem. My prop turns clockwise (as viewed from
behind), so P-factor should turn it to the left. Dead bugs and oil
droplets on the tail would indicate the air is hitting the left side of the
vertical stabilizer more than the right side. That should push me left, not
right. Maybe my old Chief training took over and I was applying right rudder
without knowing it.
>
> Only a re-try will tell for sure. Hopefully I will get some dead air time
yet this fall.
>
> Thanks for listening,
>
> Stuart
>
> --------
> "I don't care, I'm still free. You can't take the sky from
> me" - Josh Wedon
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432479#432479
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Did you have a problem with PIO when flying the Aeronca? If not, you
shouldn't have a problem with the FF.
You didn't mention stall speed. Way back in the Ultrastar Instruction
Manual, Homer recommended, on first flight, climb to at least 1,000 feet
AGL, check to see where the airplane stalls. Not safe to fly if one does
not know the stall speed.
I'd concentrate more on flying the aircraft than all those flashing lights,
EIS, radio communication, etc. From your msgs, seems you are having
difficulty flying. The only instrument I'd really be concerned with is the
ASI and stall speed, once you have determined what it is. Keep you work
load small as you can until you feel like you can fly the airplane
comfortably. Keep your eyes out of the cockpit toward the horizon. This
should help prevent over controlling the FF until you can fly by sight and
feel. The FF flies like the Aeronca, or any other small airplane, but a bit
more responsive to control input.
The above are my thoughts and how I'd approach the situation. I'm not
recommending you follow them.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
As I said, after reflection and watching the video of the landing, it really
wasn't as bad as it seemed at the time. On some advice from a friend, I
will try putting my elbow on my leg and fly with my fingertips. That should
help with the PIO problem. Of course, self-control is the most important
one to get a handle on.
Now that some time has passed, I am looking forward to the next flight. I
really do think this Firefly is going to be a lot of fun, once I get to know
it better.
Stuart
Message 6
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Serenity flies! |
That reminds me....We broke that engine in per the instructions...One
hour at the various speeds...all the time watching the temps...
After the break in...my buddy hopped from his wheel chair into the
trike and took off...The plan was to circle where I could see him in
case of trouble...for he was helpless on the ground...paraplegic..
Wouldn't you know...hard head Fred...took off and went out of
sight...to the point where I heard no engine noise....10 anxious minutes
later...he came for a flyby and disappeared for good. Now what do I
do?? Worried , I headed for the county airport about 5 miles away in
the hopes that some of our buddies could mount a search if necessary...
or fly to the strip, circle the area or see if he had come back...
Another 15 anxious minutes...and here he came ..on final at the
county airport...all smiles...no mention of the original plan to play it
safe...
thinking back...guess when your main parachute does not open and the
back up tangles with the main...and you hit the ground hard hard enough
to be in a wheel chair from 1969 til 2012...playing it safe is not in
the cards...so I forgave him...76 years old and having the time of his
life.. (he was supposed to cut the main chute away...! )
Ironically...the following spring he called a bud to meet him at the
airport..when he landed said to call 911...that he was having a heart
attack... he died a few hours later at the Cookeville Tenn hosp...
Herb
On 10/30/2014 09:24 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> Thanks, my original intent was to climb up and out of the way of the traffic
> pattern and stay in close to the airport. Use the radio at least once per
> circuit to announce where I was and my intentions.
>
> Having the PPT button come loose and "disappear " on me, incoming traffic
> and my difficulty in controlling myself, and the airplane caused me to go to
> plan B, which was get down and out of the way.
>
> On my next flight, after proving I can fly calmly, I will move out of the
> area and climb up for the real test flying that needs to be done.
>
> Having a new to me slightly used engine that I have only run for a little
> over 2 hours, makes it seem prudent to stick close to a very nice grass
> strip at the airport. Wish I could close the airport for an hour or so. :)
>
> After getting my head wrapped around what happened, I am sure the EIS
> warning was because I backed off the throttle and was operating in the
> mid-range which runs slightly lean, causing high EGT's. I saw this during
> the engine break in routine. My cure on the ground was to open the enricher
> a little bit to cool it down. Unfortunately, I didn't think of that in the
> air. Going to more throttle would have gotten me out of that RPM range as
> well. Lesson learned.
>
> During these windy days, I will fix the PPT button mounting and reset the
> limits of the EIS slightly closer to the numbers in the Rotax manual. I had
> purposely set them low for break in so that I would have time to evaluate
> what was going on. Now that I am more familiar with the engine and the EIS,
> I can set the limits up a little. I have already tightened the throttle
> lever so it should stay put next time.
>
> As I said, after reflection and watching the video of the landing, it really
> wasn't as bad as it seemed at the time. On some advice from a friend, I
> will try putting my elbow on my leg and fly with my fingertips. That should
> help with the PIO problem. Of course, self-control is the most important
> one to get a handle on.
>
> Now that some time has passed, I am looking forward to the next flight. I
> really do think this Firefly is going to be a lot of fun, once I get to know
> it better.
>
> Stuart
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Aman
> Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2014 7:41 AM
> To: kolb-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Serenity flies!
>
>
> Congratulations on your first flight! Just a thought on first flights if I
> may.Make it a long flight,getting the feel at slower speeds
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Oct 29, 2014, at 12:41 PM, "Airknocker" <airknocker@harnerfarm.net>
> wrote:
>> --> <airknocker@harnerfarm.net>
>>
>> Well guys, we finally did it. Last Saturday I took Serenity to the
> airport and got to taxi her around a little. Found a couple of minor things
> to adjust, then test again.
>> Taxied around the ramp slowly, then went to the west end of the grass
> strip. At this point, I have to say pavement SUCKS!
>> The weather was warm and the breeze light and variable. Made several
> trips up and down the runway at varying speeds, getting braver with each
> pass. Got the tail up and was able to hold it there while keeping straight.
> No irregularities at all. Engine running well with temps in the right
> range.
>> A quick check of the radio, no other planes in the area, time to quit
> messing around.
>> Partial power up, tail up, glance at the windsock, limp and straight down
> the runway. More power, getting light and bouncy. Oops, not going straight
> anymore, glance at windsock, right crosswind, fed in some right aileron and
> left rudder. She feels ready to fly, oh, oh, runway light in the
> cross-hairs! More power and pull back, airborne well before edge of runway.
>> Holy CRAP! I'm airborne!
>>
>> Left wing dropped, over corrected.
>> Nose came up, over corrected.
>> Nose went down, pulled off some power, got it level with elevator.
>> Crap, right wing went down, over corrected, but not as much.
>> Warning light on EIS, EGT or something out of whack.
>> Wings have a mind of their own, tail does too...
>>
>> What the HE!! have I done? I won't die up here, it will be when I hit the
> ground out of control. Panic setting in! Every time I touch something,
> EVERYTHING changes. AAAGGGG!
>> Wait, calm down and just fly. Whew, that is better, where am I? Why is
> that warning light still on?
>> Let go of throttle to hit button on EIS. Throttle shuts down and nose
> comes up. HUH? Push nose down, grab throttle and start the PIO all over
> again. Wait, calm down and fly.
>> OK, not so bad, oops bumps in the air. Gee I must be above pattern
> altitude, can't see the altimeter because the EIS on the warning page. Looks
> like high EGT, but not too bad as I have the limits set kind of low.
>> Turn crosswind before I get out of gliding range. Left wing drops, fixed,
> not going the right way. Was that the plane or an air bubble? Mushed it
> around finally pointing the right way. Looked for traffic, none seen nor
> heard. OK more bumps and more PIO. Throttle up, down and everywhere in
> between.
>> YIKES, what have I done? Wait, calm down and fly. Whew, better, time to
> turn downwind. Glance at airspeed, somewhere north of 60, OK we probably
> won't stall and spin in a gentle turn. This one went better. On downwind
> leg, getting a grip and just flying.
>> Turned base leg, more bumps, more PIO. Recovery was smoother and faster.
> Got it around to final leg. Decided to just stay at that altitude, whatever
> it was and just fly around the patch one more time keeping the runway
> slightly off to my left so I can see if I am going straight.
>> Some guy on the ground calls me on the radio and says "is it rough up
> there or are you having problems?" WHAT? I am 90 seconds into my first
> flight and YOU want to talk about it, NOW? Are you planning on coming up to
> help? Found the transmit button and managed to squeak out "I think it's
> me". Managed to drop the button, oh-oh, this thing is flapping every which
> way but loose again!
>> OK, calm down and fly, OK better. Managed to get all the way around to
> base leg again and only had a few "burbles and PIO's". OK, plan on making a
> standard approach and fly the length of the runway, then go around and do it
> again. Radio calls, someone 5 miles out, headed my way. That is a Champ,
> he will be here before I can get out of the way.
>> On final now, wishing I could find that transmit button to let him know my
> intentions. Back off the throttle a little and push the nose down. Not so
> bad, holding 50 MPH. Keeping lined up, still 50. OK. Hey, I am pointed at
> the numbers, well, if there were numbers, that is where they would be.
> Still going 50, all is well. Champ is getting close, better just set it
> down and get out of the way.
>> Wait, what? Landing? Man, that runway got here fast, backed of the
> throttle and started to flair. How high am I? Where did the center of the
> runway go?
>> Still pointed straight, slowing down. How low do I put the nose? I don't
> want to nose over. I don't want to do a 3 point, do I flair anymore?
>> Didn't matter, Serenity decided for me. We did a 3 point landing on 2
> wheels. Boing! One good hop of maybe 6", then all 3 wheels hit and stuck.
> Jerked the last of the throttle off and was stopped in the middle of the
> runway in seconds.
>> WOW! I am alive! Wow, I am still in the runway with traffic in the
> pattern, somewhere.
>> Powered up and taxied off the runway, just in time to hear the Champ on
> downwind for the runway I was on, no problems there. Just reaching the
> taxiway when something big and heavy with low wings comes screaming in on
> the main runway and touches down. Right about where I would have been if I
> had done a go around. If he used the radio, I certainly never heard it. It
> might have been a Cherokee or something like it, I only saw a flash.
>> That certainly was enough for me for the day. Looking at the windsock it
> was halfway out and crosswise to all runways, good time to hang it up.
> Found my transmit button and and announce "Down and clear". Taxiing back to
> the hangar, I heard the Champ on final and clear of the runway. Never did
> see that other plane again.
>> Man, will I EVER have nerve enough to do THAT again? Really, really
> unsure at this point.
>> My wife who had been watching from the edge of the runway finally gets
> back to the hangar and congratulates me. She didn't seem excited at all?
> She said it looked great, but then again, she usually can't tell the
> difference between a Cherokee and a Champ when they are in the air.....
>> Got Serenity folded up and put away. Gee, will I ever get an appetite
> again? Can I still drive? Should I just walk home? It is only 20 miles
> and walking is probably safer.
>> When I got home and looked at the videos my wife took, two things were
> obvious. One, my wife can't run a camera, LOTS of blue sky and engine
> sounds. Two, (she did manage to film the landing) my landing was not nearly
> as bad as I thought while I was doing it, and in my mind afterward.
>> Took two days of "digesting and analyzing" to begin to come to grips with
> what happened.
>> Lessons learned, or at least re-learned:
>>
>> Flights rarely go according to plan, have options.
>>
>> Basic instruction (if done right) is always with you, ie: calm down and
> fly, and cut your corrections in half. Thank you Mr. Thomas, all the way
> back to 1973.
>> If you didn't bend it, you did good.
>>
>> I am now ready to do it again. Well, not again, better next time.
>>
>> I tell this story partially for my own therapy, and for others to
> hopefully learn from. If nothing else, maybe it will entertain some of you.
>> One thing I have not been able to figure out, is why it veered right on
> take off.
>> Taxi testing showed no propensity to go anywhere but straight, so I don't
> think is a landing gear problem. My prop turns clockwise (as viewed from
> behind), so P-factor should turn it to the left. Dead bugs and oil
> droplets on the tail would indicate the air is hitting the left side of the
> vertical stabilizer more than the right side. That should push me left, not
> right. Maybe my old Chief training took over and I was applying right rudder
> without knowing it.
>> Only a re-try will tell for sure. Hopefully I will get some dead air time
> yet this fall.
>> Thanks for listening,
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>> --------
>> "I don't care, I'm still free. You can't take the sky from
>> me" - Josh Wedon
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=432479#432479
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 7
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
John,
No, the Chief and I got along just fine for many years. While the Chief and
the FF fly similarly, the FF is SOOOO much lighter on the controls. I
"Knew" it would be lighter, but I was not prepared for how much lighter,
thus the PIO. Not helping any, I think I was at the altitude where the
shear turbulence was. It was light, but when you only weight 500#, it does
not take much.
In the Chief, you led with some rudder, rolled in some aileron and there was
definite "push back" from the controls, as well as a bit of a lag before
anything happened. With the FF, there seemed (at least in my heightened
state of mind) that there were NO forces on the controls, and everything I
did happened instantly.
My friend with the elbow on the leg and fly with your fingertips advice said
it is probably like flying a helicopter, you don't move the controls, you
hold them and think about moving them, then you go where you were thinking
about. I have never flown a helicopter and he has never flown a FF, so it
is nothing more than advice offered in helpfulness.
If I left the impression that I was "head in the cockpit", please rest
assured that was not the case. I think I only saw the ASI twice in flight,
once in my first turn and then again on my final descent, I watched it
fairly closely. The rest of the time I was trying to fly straight and level
and figure out pitch and power.
My references to the EIS were no more than fleeting glimpses, thus I was not
exactly sure what it was telling me. I had looked to see what my altitude
was, but it was on the warning page and the one time I did look closely
enough, I saw EGT at 1229. I have the limit set at 1200 but know that 1250
is the redline.
In retrospect, I am fairly confident the plane is just fine, although I may
need to put a trim tab on somewhere, it was just my nerves that tried to get
the better of me a couple of times. There were some moments when we flew
straight and level with no problems. The fact that I was able to regain
control of myself and the airplane is a testament to my primary instructor.
Since I have to be student, test pilot, and instructor all at the same time
I have to rely on past training and experience as well as the words (and
videos) of others.
As for stall speed, agreed, I really need to do that learning ASAP, but not
at the expense of keeping the shiny side up. I am sure that will come on
the next flight, and would have on the last one, if I had stayed up like I
had planned.
This reminds me of an online discussion several years back. A fellow was
learning to fly a trike of some kind and could not get the hang of landings.
He asked at what speed I landed the Chief. My reply was, "I have no idea,
but somewhere under 40". I explained that once I crossed the fence, my eyes
are outside, divided between down the runway, and between the wheel and the
nose. Down the runway gives me direction and horizon, between the wheel and
nose gives me height. The hands and feet do what they need to. Repetition
makes the training. Readings on gauges have never been as important to me as
the readings I take with my backside. Well, except when doing instrument
work, but there is nothing to look out at anyway.
I very much appreciate the comments, advice, anecdotes, stories, etc. They
all go into the memory bank, hopefully to be recalled when needed.
I guess it is appropriate that I scared myself a little, after all it is
nearly Halloween!
Someone please send me some calm air, so I can try again.
Thanks,
Stuart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2014 10:00 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Serenity flies!
Did you have a problem with PIO when flying the Aeronca? If not, you
shouldn't have a problem with the FF.
You didn't mention stall speed. Way back in the Ultrastar Instruction
Manual, Homer recommended, on first flight, climb to at least 1,000 feet
AGL, check to see where the airplane stalls. Not safe to fly if one does
not know the stall speed.
I'd concentrate more on flying the aircraft than all those flashing lights,
EIS, radio communication, etc. From your msgs, seems you are having
difficulty flying. The only instrument I'd really be concerned with is the
ASI and stall speed, once you have determined what it is. Keep you work
load small as you can until you feel like you can fly the airplane
comfortably. Keep your eyes out of the cockpit toward the horizon. This
should help prevent over controlling the FF until you can fly by sight and
feel. The FF flies like the Aeronca, or any other small airplane, but a bit
more responsive to control input.
The above are my thoughts and how I'd approach the situation. I'm not
recommending you follow them.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
As I said, after reflection and watching the video of the landing, it really
wasn't as bad as it seemed at the time. On some advice from a friend, I
will try putting my elbow on my leg and fly with my fingertips. That should
help with the PIO problem. Of course, self-control is the most important
one to get a handle on.
Now that some time has passed, I am looking forward to the next flight. I
really do think this Firefly is going to be a lot of fun, once I get to know
it better.
Stuart
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|