---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/25/15: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:58 AM - Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (Tom Jones) 2. 06:01 AM - Re: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (John Hauck) 3. 06:17 AM - Re: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (jimbaker@npacc.net) 4. 08:24 AM - Re: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (Richard Girard) 5. 08:34 AM - Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (Tom Jones) 6. 09:09 AM - Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (racerjerry) 7. 09:11 AM - Re: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing (william sullivan) 8. 09:18 AM - Bourke engine (william sullivan) 9. 10:49 AM - Re: Bourke engine (Charlie England) 10. 11:09 AM - Re: Bourke engine (undoctor) 11. 03:06 PM - Re: Bourke engine (Richard Girard) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:58:02 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing From: "Tom Jones" Jim, thanks for those ideas. I have thought about your idea, "With a smaller ball one could forgo the fork and countersink the back of the bolt thru-cable hole to provide a seat for the ball". I am also wondering about the fit of the brass barrel being a little loose in the pump lever. The only place these parts seem to be available is from after market parts suppliers...not directly from Rotax. The suppliers all specify the barrel is 5/16. Every other part on my Rotax engine is metric. I was wondering about using an 8mm bolt for a better fit. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=437607#437607 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:01:53 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing I think Jim B is correct, vibration and not grit. I also think reinventing with bigger and different band aids won't fix the problem, which most likely is severe vibration. Had a 582 with oil injection on my MKIII initially. Flew it about 225.0 hours in six months before I removed it permanently and went to a 912. As far as I know there was zero wear on this cable component. Replacing every 20 hours isn't the solution I'd be looking at. Fix your vibration problem and most likely you will also fix your oil injection cable fitting problem. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jimbaker@npacc.net Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2015 9:28 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing I sure wouldn't settle for 20 hr replacement. Get inventive. The wear indicated, if truly from excessive vibration, would indicate that the barrel end had way too much room to move. The arm is, I believe, spring loaded...any thought to increasing that tension with an additional spring so the cable is under greater tension? I'd also think the grit induced wear theory is overblown. I would probably modify the cable end to the fork/swaged or soldered ball design and replace the brass barrel with a bolt. With a smaller ball one could forgo the fork and countersink the back of the bolt thru-cable hole to provide a seat for the ball. Any number of ways to modify. I'd also look at some large scale R/C aircraft fittings for ideas ( small all metal heim joint fittings come to mind ). http://store.rc4wd.com/High-Precision-Billet-Tie-Rod-End-M3-Silver_p_641. html Jim Baker 405.426.5377 -----Original Message----- From: Tom Jones Sent: Sat, 24 Jan 2015 7:11 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing Well, I guess I'll go back to brass and hope for the best. I ordered 4 brass swedges so I can replace them every 20 hours or so I guess. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=437583#437583 =========== =========== =========== =========== ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:17:49 AM PST US From: jimbaker@npacc.net Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing QWxsIHRoZXNlIGJhcnJlbHMgYXJlIHRocm93YmFja3MgdG8gbW90b3JjeWNsZXMgYW5kIHRoZWly IGFzc29jaWF0ZWQgY2FibGVzLiBBbGwgdGhlIHJlYWwgb2xkIGJpa2VzIHVzZWQgbm90aGluZyBi dXQgdGhpcyBraW5kIG9mIHRlcm1pbmF0aW9uLCBldmVuIGZvciBicmFrZXMuCgpUaGUgZWxlZ2Fu dCBzb2x1dGlvbiBhcmUgdGhlIGhlaW0gam9pbnQgZml0dGluZ3MuIENhbiByZW1vdmUgYWxsIHNs b3AgYW5kIHRoZSBhbmdsZSBvZiB0aGUgY2FibGUgdG8gdGhlIGFybSBiZWNvbWVzIGxlc3MgY3Jp dGljYWwgdW5sZXNzIGl0IGlzIHJ1YmJpbmcgZXhjZXNzaXZlbHkgb24gdGhlIG91dGVyIHNoZWF0 aC4gVGhlIGRlc2lnbiBiZWNvbWVzIHNlbGYgY2FwdHVyaW5nIHdpdGggdGplIG9ubHkgZmFpbHVy ZSBwb2ludCBiZWluZyB0aGUgYm9sdCB0aHJ1YnRoZSBoZWltIGJhbGwuIFRoZSBiaWxsIG9mIG1h dGVyaWFscyB3b3VsZCBiZSBvbmUgZmVtYWxlIHRocmVhZGVkIGhlaW0sIG9uZSBkcmlsbGVkIHRo cmVhZGVkIHNoYW5rIHRvIHdoaWNoIHRoZSBjYWJsZSBjb3VsZCBiZSBzb2xkZXJlZCwgYSBudXQg dG8gcHJldmVudCB0aGUgc2hhbmsgZnJvbSByb3RhdGluZyBpbiB0aGUgaGVpbS4gRG9uZS4KCkpp bSBCYWtlcgo0MDUuNDI2LjUzNzcKCi0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tCkZyb206IFRv bSBKb25lcyA8bmFoc2lraHNAZWxsdGVsLm5ldD4KVG86IGtvbGItbGlzdEBtYXRyb25pY3MuY29t ClNlbnQ6IFN1biwgMjUgSmFuIDIwMTUgODo1NyBBTQpTdWJqZWN0OiBLb2xiLUxpc3Q6IFJlOiA1 MDMgb2lsIHB1bXAgY2FibGUgZW5kIHdlYXJpbmcKCi0tPiBLb2xiLUxpc3QgbWVzc2FnZSBwb3N0 ZWQgYnk6ICJUb20gSm9uZXMiIDxuYWhzaWtoc0BlbGx0ZWwubmV0PgoKSmltLCB0aGFua3MgZm9y IHRob3NlIGlkZWFzLiAgIEkgaGF2ZSB0aG91Z2h0IGFib3V0IHlvdXIgaWRlYSwgIldpdGggYSBz bWFsbGVyIGJhbGwgb25lIGNvdWxkIGZvcmdvIHRoZSBmb3JrIGFuZCBjb3VudGVyc2luayB0aGUg YmFjayBvZiB0aGUgYm9sdCB0aHJ1LWNhYmxlIGhvbGUgdG8gcHJvdmlkZSBhIHNlYXQgZm9yIHRo ZSBiYWxsIi4KCkkgYW0gYWxzbyB3b25kZXJpbmcgYWJvdXQgdGhlIGZpdCBvZiB0aGUgYnJhc3Mg YmFycmVsIGJlaW5nIGEgbGl0dGxlIGxvb3NlIGluIHRoZSBwdW1wIGxldmVyLgoKVGhlIG9ubHkg cGxhY2UgdGhlc2UgcGFydHMgc2VlbSB0byBiZSBhdmFpbGFibGUgaXMgZnJvbSBhZnRlciBtYXJr ZXQgcGFydHMgc3VwcGxpZXJzLi4ubm90IGRpcmVjdGx5IGZyb20gUm90YXguICBUaGUgc3VwcGxp ZXJzIGFsbCBzcGVjaWZ5IHRoZSBiYXJyZWwgaXMgNS8xNi4gRXZlcnkgb3RoZXIgcGFydCBvbiBt eSBSb3RheCBlbmdpbmUgaXMgbWV0cmljLiAgSSB3YXMgd29uZGVyaW5nIGFib3V0IHVzaW5nIGFu IDhtbSBib2x0IGZvciBhIGJldHRlciBmaXQuCgotLS0tLS0tLQpUb20gSm9uZXMKQ2xhc3NpYyBJ Vgo1MDMgUm90YXgsIDcyIGluY2ggVHdvIGJsYWRlIFdhcnAKRWxsZW5zYnVyZywgV0EKCgoKClJl YWQgdGhpcyB0b3BpYyBvbmxpbmUgaGVyZToKCmh0dHA6Ly9mb3J1bXMubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS92 aWV3dG9waWMucGhwP3A9NDM3NjA3IzQzNzYwNwoKCgoKCgoKXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0KXy09ICAgICAgICAgIC0g VGhlIEtvbGItTGlzdCBFbWFpbCBGb3J1bSAtCl8tPSBVc2UgdGhlIE1hdHJvbmljcyBMaXN0IEZl YXR1cmVzIE5hdmlnYXRvciB0byBicm93c2UKXy09IHRoZSBtYW55IExpc3QgdXRpbGl0aWVzIHN1 Y2ggYXMgTGlzdCBVbi9TdWJzY3JpcHRpb24sCl8tPSBBcmNoaXZlIFNlYXJjaCAmIERvd25sb2Fk LCA3LURheSBCcm93c2UsIENoYXQsIEZBUSwKXy09IFBob3Rvc2hhcmUsIGFuZCBtdWNoIG11Y2gg bW9yZToKXy09Cl8tPSAgIC0tPiBodHRwOi8vd3d3Lm1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20vTmF2aWdhdG9yP0tv bGItTGlzdApfLT0KXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0KXy09ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgLSBNQVRST05JQ1MgV0VCIEZPUlVN UyAtCl8tPSBTYW1lIGdyZWF0IGNvbnRlbnQgYWxzbyBhdmFpbGFibGUgdmlhIHRoZSBXZWIgRm9y dW1zIQpfLT0KXy09ICAgLS0+IGh0dHA6Ly9mb3J1bXMubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbQpfLT0KXy09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0K Xy09ICAgICAgICAgICAgIC0gTGlzdCBDb250cmlidXRpb24gV2ViIFNpdGUgLQpfLT0gIFRoYW5r IHlvdSBmb3IgeW91ciBnZW5lcm91cyBzdXBwb3J0IQpfLT0gICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAtTWF0dCBEcmFsbGUsIExpc3QgQWRtaW4uCl8tPSAgIC0tPiBodHRwOi8vd3d3Lm1h dHJvbmljcy5jb20vY29udHJpYnV0aW9uCl8tPT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09CgoKCgo ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:24:29 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing From: Richard Girard Tom, There's .002" difference between 5/16 and 8 mm, .3125 vs .3145. I'd base the decision on which is cheaper, a brass cable stop or a steel oil pump bell crank. If it were me I'd rather the stop wear than the crank. Just a thought. Rick Girard do not archive On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 7:57 AM, Tom Jones wrote: > > Jim, thanks for those ideas. I have thought about your idea, "With a > smaller ball one could forgo the fork and countersink the back of the bolt > thru-cable hole to provide a seat for the ball". > > I am also wondering about the fit of the brass barrel being a little loose > in the pump lever. > > The only place these parts seem to be available is from after market parts > suppliers...not directly from Rotax. The suppliers all specify the barrel > is 5/16. Every other part on my Rotax engine is metric. I was wondering > about using an 8mm bolt for a better fit. > > -------- > Tom Jones > Classic IV > 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp > Ellensburg, WA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=437607#437607 > > -- Believe those who are seeking the truth, doubt those who find it. -Andre Gide ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:34:52 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing From: "Tom Jones" > Tom, There's .002" difference between 5/16 and 8 mm, .3125 vs .3145. I'd base the decision on which is cheaper, a brass cable stop or a steel oil pump bell crank. If it were me I'd rather the stop wear than the crank.Just a thought. > Rick Girard > Our EAA club technical councilor has the same thinking as you do Rick. I asked him why they didn't make the swedge out of steel instead of brass. His reply was "Probably so the swedge will wear and not wear out the pump lever. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=437617#437617 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:52 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing From: "racerjerry" How about making a new cable swivel (barrel) and using a new cable / splitter with a free end - no swaged fittings at oiler. Make a new barrel from brass rod cross drilled to snugly fit cable. Drill rod lengthwise and tap hole for machine screw thread - full length of barrel. Move adjuster to a better position where it is not trying to kink cable. Slide new barrel to best position and firmly tighten set screw to secure cable. I would make the barrel slightly longer at the outboard end (cable hole not centered) to provide more meat for thread engagement. I would also use a short Allen bolt in place of the set screw to enable better tightening - no tiny Allen keys. You can Locktite the set screw, but it's probably not necessary. Keep things clean and use a drop of oil - not WD-40 on the barrel. WD is primarily a moisture displacer with marginal lubricating properties. If you want a belt & suspenders approach, you can splay the back end of the cable strands and solder the wire ends, but this really works well only on zinc coated cables - not stainless. Unfortunately, solder wicking up the cable strands makes the cable rigid and almost guarantees eventual breakage at the stress concentration point where the solder wicking ends. Hope this helps. -------- Jerry King Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=437618#437618 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:11:38 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing I would be tempted to make one out of Oilite bronze. Self lubricating. Bill Sullivan -------------------------------------------- On Sun, 1/25/15, Tom Jones wrote: Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 503 oil pump cable end wearing To: kolb-list@matronics.com Date: Sunday, January 25, 2015, 11:34 AM "Tom Jones" > Tom, There's .002" difference between 5/16 and 8 mm, .3125 vs .3145. I'd base the decision on which is cheaper, a brass cable stop or a steel oil pump bell crank. If it were me I'd rather the stop wear than the crank.Just a thought. > Rick Girard > Our EAA club technical councilor has the same thinking as you do Rick. I asked him why they didn't make the swedge out of steel instead of brass. His reply was "Probably so the swedge will wear and not wear out the pump lever. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=437617#437617 Forum - - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - List Contribution Web Site - -Matt Dralle, List Admin. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:18:50 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Kolb-List: Bourke engine Click on various stuff in this link. My brother sent it to me, thinking I'd be interested. With Rotax dropping the small 2-strokes, there is a need for replacements. The weight to HP ratio looks pretty good. Does anyone have any experience/comments on this one? http://www.bourke-engine.com/ani Bill Sullivan ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:49:04 AM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bourke engine On 1/25/2015 11:18 AM, william sullivan wrote: > > Click on various stuff in this link. My brother sent it to me, thinking I'd be interested. With Rotax dropping the small 2-strokes, there is a need for replacements. The weight to HP ratio looks pretty good. Does anyone have any experience/comments on this one? > > http://www.bourke-engine.com/ani > > I'd suggest finding an independent engineering evaluation. My thoughts: Consider how severe the imbalance will be with both pistons moving the same direction, then how much the counterweight will weigh to counteract that force (without contributing any power). Then consider how long a sliding line-contact sliding bearing is going to last when subjected to those forces. The claim is 1/4 pound (0.25 lb) per hp/hr. This is better by about 30% than the most efficient internal combustion engine ever built, and it's still a 2 stroke engine. Isn't it a bit strange that a design that's been around long enough for the patents to expire, and is super clean, and beats the best tech out there by 30%, hasn't taken over every engine market on the planet? And it uses 'detonation' to extract more energy from the fuel? What happens to a piston when you have detonation in the combustion chamber? (Answer help: nothing good.) Current technology in 4 strokes can come pretty close to the same power/weight ratio as old tech 2 strokes. Just need someone to make them available at an affordable price. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:09:48 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bourke engine From: undoctor UmVtZW1iZXIgYmFjayBpbiB0aGUgNTBzIG9yIDYwcyB3aGVuIHRoZSBXZW5rZWwgUm90YXJ5IGVu Z2luZSB3YXMgaW50cm9kdWNlZD8gT25lIHRyaWFuZ3VsYXIgcGlzdG9uIHdpdGggcm90YXJ5IHJh dGhlciB0aGFuIHJlY2lwcm9jYXRpbmcgbW90aW9uIGFuZCB2ZXJ5IGZldyBtb3ZpbmcgcGFydHM/ CgpHb29kIGlkZWEgYW5kIGl0IGNvdWxkIHNwaW4gdmVyeSBoaWdoIHJldnMuIFByb2JsZW0gaXMs IHRoZXkgY2FuJ3Qga2VlcCB0aGUgdGlwcyBmcm9tIHdlYXJpbmcgb24gdGhlIHRyaWFuZ3VsYXIg cGlzdG9uLCBzbyB2ZXJ5IGxpbWl0ZWQgYXBwbGljYXRpb24gaW4gdGhlIHJlYWwgd29ybGQuwqAK CkFsc28gcmVtZW1iZXIgYSBjZXJhbWljIGVuZ2luZSBvbiB0aGUgZHJhd2luZyBib2FyZHMgd2hp Y2ggd2FzIHRvIHJpdmFsIHNsaWNlZCBicmVhZCBmb3IgZ3JlYXRuZXNzLiBIYXZlbid0IGhlYXJk IGFueSBtb3JlIGFib3V0IHRoYXQgb25lLiBUaGF0J3MgT0suIEp1c3Qga2VlcCBpbnZlbnRpbmcs IG1hbnkgb3V0IHRoZXJlIGlkZWFzIGhhdmUgYmVlbiBzdWNjZXNzZnVsLsKgCgpEYXZlIEt1bHAK 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Bourke engine From: Richard Girard Bourke built many examples of his engine for trucks, outboard motors, and aircraft. They all worked, ran for hundreds of hours with little wear to any parts, and produced the advertised horsepower. One of the aircraft engines is in the EAA museum. Like any engine the start up costs going into production would be astronomical and for an aircraft engine then there are certification costs. All for a small diminishing market. Sad to say it won't happen, but that's the way it is. Rick Girard do not archive On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 1:09 PM, undoctor wrote: > Remember back in the 50s or 60s when the Wenkel Rotary engine was > introduced? One triangular piston with rotary rather than reciprocating > motion and very few moving parts? > > Good idea and it could spin very high revs. Problem is, they can't keep > the tips from wearing on the triangular piston, so very limited application > in the real world. > > Also remember a ceramic engine on the drawing boards which was to rival > sliced bread for greatness. Haven't heard any more about that one. That's > OK. Just keep inventing, many out there ideas have been successful. > > Dave Kulp > Bethlehem, PA > > Do not archive > > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone > > > -------- Original message -------- > From: Charlie England > Date:01/25/2015 1:48 PM (GMT-05:00) > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bourke engine > > > On 1/25/2015 11:18 AM, william sullivan wrote: > williamtsullivan@att.net> > > > > Click on various stuff in this link. My brother sent it to me, > thinking I'd be interested. With Rotax dropping the small 2-strokes, there > is a need for replacements. The weight to HP ratio looks pretty good. > Does anyone have any experience/comments on this one? > > > > http://www.bourke-engine.com/ani > > > > > I'd suggest finding an independent engineering evaluation. My thoughts: > Consider how severe the imbalance will be with both pistons moving the > same direction, then how much the counterweight will weigh to counteract > that force (without contributing any power). Then consider how long a > sliding line-contact sliding bearing is going to last when subjected to > those forces. The claim is 1/4 pound (0.25 lb) per hp/hr. This is better > by about 30% than the most efficient internal combustion engine ever > built, and it's still a 2 stroke engine. Isn't it a bit strange that a > design that's been around long enough for the patents to expire, and is > super clean, and beats the best tech out there by 30%, hasn't taken over > every engine market on the planet? And it uses 'detonation' to extract > more energy from the fuel? What happens to a piston when you have > detonation in the combustion chamber? (Answer help: nothing good.) > > Current technology in 4 strokes can come pretty close to the same > power/weight ratio as old tech 2 strokes. Just need someone to make them > available at an affordable price. > > -- Believe those who are seeking the truth, doubt those who find it. -Andre Gide ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.