Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:55 AM - Mk3 C Clevis Pins (Norman)
2. 04:58 AM - Mk3 C Clevis Pins (Norman)
3. 06:53 AM - New Break-away Tail Wheel (KJ4CTZ)
4. 07:20 AM - Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel (william sullivan)
5. 07:24 AM - Re: Mk3 C Clevis Pins (B Young)
6. 07:35 AM - Re: Mk3 C Clevis Pins (william sullivan)
7. 08:11 AM - Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel (George Helton)
8. 08:58 AM - Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel (KJ4CTZ)
9. 09:13 AM - Re: Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel (william sullivan)
10. 03:01 PM - Fw: another video and flight (Larry Cottrell)
11. 03:37 PM - Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) info request (John Hauck)
12. 03:52 PM - Re: Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) (John Hauck)
13. 04:10 PM - Re: Fw: another video and flight (B Young)
14. 04:27 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (John Hauck)
15. 04:47 PM - Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) info request (John Hauck)
16. 04:53 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (Larry Cottrell)
17. 05:00 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (Russ Kinne)
18. 05:15 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (Larry Cottrell)
19. 05:25 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (Russ Kinne)
20. 05:50 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (John Hauck)
21. 06:03 PM - Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) info request (Charlie England)
22. 06:09 PM - Re: Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) (Charlie England)
23. 06:10 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (John Hauck)
24. 06:19 PM - Re: Baby's got some new shoes (Larry Cottrell)
25. 06:30 PM - Re: Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel (George Helton)
Message 1
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Subject: | Mk3 C Clevis Pins |
Hi again, could someone tell me the correct clevis pin sizes (ms20392
- xxxx), for the Kolb Twinstar Mk3 C please.
The current pins fitted bear no resemblance to the "picking list" I
have, which gives, (I presume I've got the correct ones), Aileron &
flaps - AN394-25 (3C25); wing strut top - AN395-17 (4C17); wing strut
at fuselage - AN395-29 (4C29); main wing - AN395-41 (4C41); elevator
bottom wires (not a through bolt but a mount on each side), AN393-17 (2C17).
The only pin I could find in "The Yellow Book" was the aileron, AN394-29.
The pins currently fitted are all 3C (1/4") instead of 5/16".
I'm a new owner and I want to change all the clevis pins.
Any help will be appreciated.
Norman
Message 2
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Subject: | Mk3 C Clevis Pins |
Hi again, could someone tell me the correct clevis pin sizes (ms20392
- xxxx), for the Kolb Twinstar Mk3 C please.
The current pins fitted bear no resemblance to the "picking list" I
have, which gives, (I presume I've got the correct ones), Aileron &
flaps - AN394-25 (3C25); wing strut top - AN395-17 (4C17); wing strut
at fuselage - AN395-29 (4C29); main wing - AN395-41 (4C41); elevator
bottom wires (not a through bolt but a mount on each side), AN393-17 (2C17).
The only pin I could find in "The Yellow Book" was the aileron, AN394-29.
The pins currently fitted are all 3C (1/4") instead of 5/16".
I'm a new owner and I want to change all the clevis pins.
Any help will be appreciated.
Norman
Message 3
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Subject: | New Break-away Tail Wheel |
Gentlemen,
I bought a new breakaway tail wheel from Kolb at Sun N Fun this year. Attempting
to replace my original wheel, It appears like the original is JB Welded to the
solid aluminum tail rod.
What is the recommended procedure for removing the original tail wheel assembly?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=468520#468520
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel |
If it's aluminum, heat from a propane torch will break the bond. A wet rag wrapped
around the aluminum will keep the heat from traveling up to the tail skeg.
Maybe try to twist a bit while heating, so you know when it lets go. It
shouldn't take much heat. Or, as suggested earlier this week, cut it off to shorten
it a bit.
Bill Sullivan
<Kj4ctz@gmail.com>
Gentlemen,
I bought a new breakaway tail wheel
from Kolb at Sun N Fun this year. Attempting to replace my
original wheel, It appears like the original is JB Welded to
the solid aluminum tail rod.
What is the recommended procedure for
removing the original tail wheel assembly?
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Mk3 C Clevis Pins |
Norman wrote "Hi again, could someone tell me the correct clevis pin
sizes (ms20392
- xxxx), for the Kolb Twinstar Mk3 C please"
My plans says
an395-17 for lift strut attach point to wing
An 395-29 for lift strut to cage
An394 - 29 flap arm attach and aileron linkage
Forward wing attachment an395-45
Wing attach at universal joint are 5/16 bolts
Note: AN 39 indicates the style the "5" in an395 is the diameter in
16ths the "dash number# is the length.
All clevis pins can be replaced with bolts and locknuts if you don't fold
the wings.
Disclaimer....... Some of the clevis pins as noted by the plans were very
slightly too short. In my humble opinion. If it were me,,, I would
measure the distance to be spanned add the thickness of the washers you
want to use. Plus a tiny bit so it is not to hard to get together.
Boyd Young
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Mk3 C Clevis Pins |
Norman- call Aircraft Spruce and get their catalog. Gull of information about
sizes, hardness, and strange stuff. Great reference book.
Bill Sullivan
--------------------------------------------
On Sun, 4/16/17, Norman <norm2mac@gmail.com> wrote:
Subject: Kolb-List: Mk3 C Clevis Pins
To: "Kolb List Posting" <kolb-list@matronics.com>
Date: Sunday, April 16, 2017, 7:54 AM
<norm2mac@gmail.com>
Hi again, could someone tell me the
correct clevis pin sizes (ms20392
- xxxx), for the Kolb Twinstar Mk3 C
please.
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel |
A propane torch should do the trick. Just heat it lightly all the way around. It
will break loose.Keep wet cloth with around to keep to much heat from transferring
to the tail post.
Have a great day!
> On Apr 16, 2017, at 9:52 AM, KJ4CTZ <Kj4ctz@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Gentlemen,
>
> I bought a new breakaway tail wheel from Kolb at Sun N Fun this year. Attempting
to replace my original wheel, It appears like the original is JB Welded to
the solid aluminum tail rod.
>
> What is the recommended procedure for removing the original tail wheel assembly?
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=468520#468520
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel |
Thanks guys,
I will try mild heat first. If no success I will cut off and put new assembly on.
Should it also be JB Welded back on? I assume so but open to suggestions.
This forum is great and I appreciate everyone's comments.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=468526#468526
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel |
I re-mounted my tail wheel on a very early Firestar because it was crooked.
I had the fiberglass rod. I used a 1/4" bolt through it. I was a truck equipment
mechanic, so I have a tendency to overdo things a bit.
Bill Sullivan
--------------------------------------------
On Sun, 4/16/17, KJ4CTZ <Kj4ctz@gmail.com> wrote:
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Date: Sunday, April 16, 2017, 11:57 AM
<Kj4ctz@gmail.com>
Thanks guys,
I will try mild heat first. If no
success I will cut off and put new assembly on.
Should it also be JB Welded back on? I
assume so but open to suggestions.
Message 10
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Subject: | Fwd: another video and flight |
------
Subject: another video and flight
The weather was still nice this morning so I put on a lot of clothes
and took off.
video- https://vimeo.com/213440748 password owyheeflyer
Larry
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.
Message 11
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Subject: | Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) |
info request
Actually, the two 5/16" tubes are fabric braces to keep the fabric from
pulling the aluminum rib nose inward. There is no lateral bracing of
the leading edge tube except a long 5/16 alum tube that is in
compression.
The bow tip doesn't do much for lateral bracing of the leading edge
tube. That's all you have to keep the rib noses in column. Once they
get pulled out of column, they will probably fail.
The small 5/16 tubes are flattened, bent, and riveted. They tend to
break at this point from vibration with not a whole lot of time on them.
I used two 1/2" alum tubes, one inboard and one outboard, diagonally
working with each other, attached to the leading edge tube and the main
spare. Wish I had a photo of my wing handy. If I can find one I will
share it.
I may be overly cautious, but it makes me feel more comfortable,
especially when I get caught in extremely rough air.
Sorry for the delay in responding. Just got home from a 4 day trip.
If you need more info, call me. 334-567-6280
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie
England
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2017 11:05 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original
version) info request
John,
You mentioned leading edge bracing. This is all I see in the Twinstar
I'm restoring. There's nothing along the rest of the leading edge that
triangulates/ braces the leading edge.
Would you consider this adequate? It's easy to add now, with the cover
coming off.
Thanks,
Charlie
Thanks, John. I wasn't sure about how rugged the tubes would be when
driving out mandrels, etc. I use similar tricks on the heavier
experimentals I've owned. I've got a spring loaded center punch that I
ground to a flat nosed, straight shaft, & use it to punch out driven
rivets after drilling the heads. I also use small, flush cutting 'dykes'
(diagonal wire cutters) to grab pop rivet heads
On 4/9/2017 5:58 PM, John Hauck wrote:
<mailto:jhauck@elmore.rr.com> <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Charlie E/Kolbers:
I have recovered a bunch of them. All that I tore up and a few I
didn't.
Drilling rivets can be accomplished once you have the mandrels removed.
It takes a 1/16" punch, or you can use a pulled mandrel, grind the end
flat, hold with vise grips, and knock out with a hammer. The rivet
needs to be held to prevent spinning. I grind a V in the end of a hack
saw blade with sharp beveled edges. Use that to push up under the rivet
to lock it in place while drilling.
4130 airframes should be tube sealed when fabricated. 99% of Kolbs
probably have never been tube sealed. Their builders probably never
heard of tube sealing. 4130 rusts from inside out if not sealed. That
would worry me with an old fuselage, especially a Twinstar. I can't
remember exactly what the fuselage looks like other that the root tube
that seats and stuff are attached to. This I would make sure is rust
free on the inside.
I helped Brother Jim rebuild Adriel Heisey's Twinstar, Navajo Nation
pilot that shot aerial photos published in Nat Geo and other pubs, that
he crashed in a wind storm. It was frightening when we started cutting
tubing. Most were rusted well beyond serviceability. Here are photos
of his Twinstar:
https://uanews.arizona.edu/story/aerial-photos-of-archaeological-sites-on
-exhibit-at-state-museum
I don't recall anyone flying a free air cooled Rotax on a Kolb
successfully. Yours may be an exception.
Don't know of any published updates for the Twinstar. It was not a
popular model and kits only produced a couple years.
Strong lateral bracing of the leading edge of the wing is extremely
important to me. Poor/weak lateral bracing can lead to leading edge
failure. This causes the Kolb to stop flying immediately.
Lower tail post bracing makes it last longer.
I don't know a whole lot about the Twinstar. The one Kolb model I never
flew.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie
England
Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2017 4:33 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Twinstar (original version) info request
<mailto:ceengland7@gmail.com> <ceengland7@gmail.com>
OK, now that I've got that short nose Kolb bit out of my system....
I'm now the proud owner of an N-numbered early Kolb Twinstar
(restoration project). IIRC, its serial number is in the low 20's range.
A little rusty, but we've peeled the fabric on one wing & the aluminum
seems to be in good shape, with very little corrosion, considering that
it spent its entire past life in central FL.
This one's got a Rotax 503 (converted from single to dual carbs, and to
free air cooling) that seems to be in great shape. The previous owner is
a close friend who was the builder. I trust what he tells me, and he
says that it always cooled fine running it free-air with some added
ducting.
I'll be replacing hardware, 'soft' parts, etc, but don't intend on doing
a showplane restoration; just a safe, nice flying 'after supper' flyer.
I've got the plans for the plane, but I'm hoping that you experienced
Kolbers can share any suggested mods to these early models, that will
make them safer/more durable/etc. Is there a published list of any/all
service bulletins or recommended updates? For instance, I've seen the
advice to add braces to the tailspring stinger. And I know that the
later Twinstars have mass balances on at least some of the control
surfaces; is it recommended to add them to the early models? This one
does not have any mass balances anywhere.
Who's recovered one? Any issues when you drilled out the rivets to
remove the ailerons, etc for recovering?
Any advice will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Charlie
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original |
version)
In addition to modifying and additional lateral bracing of the wing's
leading edge, I also reinforced my ribs. Makes for an extremely stiff wing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2017 9:18 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original
version)
--> <thegreybaron@charter.net>
I'm not John, but if you scroll down to page 21 in the MKIII Yellow Book,
you will see what Kolb though to be a very useful reinforcement.
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/Lexan%20rear%20enclosure.html
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
Forgiving is tough. Being forgiven is wonderful.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=468375#468375
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Fwd: another video and flight |
I like the video. Especially the short approach to the landing..
observation way to many dreaded 3 mile finals.
Boyd
On Apr 16, 2017 4:02 PM, "Larry Cottrell" <lcottrell1020@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> ------
> Subject: another video and flight
>
>
> The weather was still nice this morning so I put on a lot of clothes
> and took off.
>
> video- https://vimeo.com/213440748 password owyheeflyer
>
>
> Larry
>
> --
> The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of
> others.
>
> If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
> address before sending.
>
>
> --
> The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of
> others.
>
> If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
> address before sending.
>
>
Message 14
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Subject: | Baby's got some new shoes |
Sounds good.
Reckon sitting more nose high helped with your takeoff?
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2017 6:47 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Baby's got some new shoes
I finally got my new rims from Matco. They had been on back order for almost a
month, at least it seems that way. I had already ordered the
8.50 X 6 tundra tires and tubes.
Today dawned cold, 22 degrees but calm for a change. It eventually warmed up to
44 degrees and I went to the hanger to start my tire mounting. I drilled 6 holes
in the rims to screw the tires to the rims. The tires fit tight enough that
it takes about 20 lbs of air to make them pop out on the rims. That is unlike
the Azusa rims that depend on small flanges on the inside of the rims to keep
them from spinning. Since I want to run 5 lbs or less I am still not going to
take a chance on shearing off the valve stem, thus 6 screws per side.
Before I changed from the 8.00 X6 tires, I rolled the plane out and flew all four
corners of the compass with a vid camera to monitor my airspeed. The speed
averaged out to be about 66 MPH indicated. The same on the ground speed depending
on with or against the wind. There was little wind, and my ASI and Ground
speed are really close under those conditions.
I drilled and cut threads in the rims, and then mounted the tires.
Since the 8.00 x 6 tires are on Matco rims as well, I just changed the three bolts
that held the bearings in the other tires and changed them to the new tundras.
The wind was still holding its breath, so I rolled the plane back out to check
the difference. It seems to roll better with the tundra's on it. I taxiied to
the other end of the runway, and began my take off. I cannot be sure, but the
tires with 5 lbs of air, seemed to bounce a bit on take off, but I could not be
sure. When I pulled back on the stick it flew quickly. I tend to push the stick
forward to pick up speed, so it could have been trying to fly, while I was
pushing it back on the ground. I will be doing a lot more testing when the weather
again cooperates. My take off seemed to be quite a bit shorter than normal.
In essence there was no indication that my air speed suffered at all.
It was quite turbulent so I only made a circuit and half. While I seemed to bounce
a bit on take off, I bounced not at all on landing.
The tires at 5 lbs are really nice. They appear to not need balancing, unlike the
8.00X6's.
Larry
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before
sending.
Message 15
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Subject: | Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) |
info request
I left out the fact that the fabric braces are on the nose of the
inboard rib. Aft is 4130 and nose is alum tubing.
john h
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 5:36 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar
(original version) info request
Actually, the two 5/16" tubes are fabric braces to keep the fabric from
pulling the aluminum rib nose inward. There is no lateral bracing of
the leading edge tube except a long 5/16 alum tube that is in
compression.
The bow tip doesn't do much for lateral bracing of the leading edge
tube. That's all you have to keep the rib noses in column. Once they
get pulled out of column, they will probably fail.
The small 5/16 tubes are flattened, bent, and riveted. They tend to
break at this point from vibration with not a whole lot of time on them.
I used two 1/2" alum tubes, one inboard and one outboard, diagonally
working with each other, attached to the leading edge tube and the main
spare. Wish I had a photo of my wing handy. If I can find one I will
share it.
I may be overly cautious, but it makes me feel more comfortable,
especially when I get caught in extremely rough air.
Sorry for the delay in responding. Just got home from a 4 day trip.
If you need more info, call me. 334-567-6280
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie
England
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2017 11:05 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original
version) info request
John,
You mentioned leading edge bracing. This is all I see in the Twinstar
I'm restoring. There's nothing along the rest of the leading edge that
triangulates/ braces the leading edge.
Would you consider this adequate? It's easy to add now, with the cover
coming off.
Thanks,
Charlie
Thanks, John. I wasn't sure about how rugged the tubes would be when
driving out mandrels, etc. I use similar tricks on the heavier
experimentals I've owned. I've got a spring loaded center punch that I
ground to a flat nosed, straight shaft, & use it to punch out driven
rivets after drilling the heads. I also use small, flush cutting 'dykes'
(diagonal wire cutters) to grab pop rivet heads
On 4/9/2017 5:58 PM, John Hauck wrote:
<mailto:jhauck@elmore.rr.com> <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Charlie E/Kolbers:
I have recovered a bunch of them. All that I tore up and a few I
didn't.
Drilling rivets can be accomplished once you have the mandrels removed.
It takes a 1/16" punch, or you can use a pulled mandrel, grind the end
flat, hold with vise grips, and knock out with a hammer. The rivet
needs to be held to prevent spinning. I grind a V in the end of a hack
saw blade with sharp beveled edges. Use that to push up under the rivet
to lock it in place while drilling.
4130 airframes should be tube sealed when fabricated. 99% of Kolbs
probably have never been tube sealed. Their builders probably never
heard of tube sealing. 4130 rusts from inside out if not sealed. That
would worry me with an old fuselage, especially a Twinstar. I can't
remember exactly what the fuselage looks like other that the root tube
that seats and stuff are attached to. This I would make sure is rust
free on the inside.
I helped Brother Jim rebuild Adriel Heisey's Twinstar, Navajo Nation
pilot that shot aerial photos published in Nat Geo and other pubs, that
he crashed in a wind storm. It was frightening when we started cutting
tubing. Most were rusted well beyond serviceability. Here are photos
of his Twinstar:
https://uanews.arizona.edu/story/aerial-photos-of-archaeological-sites-on
-exhibit-at-state-museum
I don't recall anyone flying a free air cooled Rotax on a Kolb
successfully. Yours may be an exception.
Don't know of any published updates for the Twinstar. It was not a
popular model and kits only produced a couple years.
Strong lateral bracing of the leading edge of the wing is extremely
important to me. Poor/weak lateral bracing can lead to leading edge
failure. This causes the Kolb to stop flying immediately.
Lower tail post bracing makes it last longer.
I don't know a whole lot about the Twinstar. The one Kolb model I never
flew.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie
England
Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2017 4:33 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Twinstar (original version) info request
<mailto:ceengland7@gmail.com> <ceengland7@gmail.com>
OK, now that I've got that short nose Kolb bit out of my system....
I'm now the proud owner of an N-numbered early Kolb Twinstar
(restoration project). IIRC, its serial number is in the low 20's range.
A little rusty, but we've peeled the fabric on one wing & the aluminum
seems to be in good shape, with very little corrosion, considering that
it spent its entire past life in central FL.
This one's got a Rotax 503 (converted from single to dual carbs, and to
free air cooling) that seems to be in great shape. The previous owner is
a close friend who was the builder. I trust what he tells me, and he
says that it always cooled fine running it free-air with some added
ducting.
I'll be replacing hardware, 'soft' parts, etc, but don't intend on doing
a showplane restoration; just a safe, nice flying 'after supper' flyer.
I've got the plans for the plane, but I'm hoping that you experienced
Kolbers can share any suggested mods to these early models, that will
make them safer/more durable/etc. Is there a published list of any/all
service bulletins or recommended updates? For instance, I've seen the
advice to add braces to the tailspring stinger. And I know that the
later Twinstars have mass balances on at least some of the control
surfaces; is it recommended to add them to the early models? This one
does not have any mass balances anywhere.
Who's recovered one? Any issues when you drilled out the rivets to
remove the ailerons, etc for recovering?
Any advice will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Charlie
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Subject: | Re: Baby's got some new shoes |
On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 5:27 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
> Sounds good.
>
> Reckon sitting more nose high helped with your takeoff?
I think that it did, seems a lot shorter. I just went back and looked
at the video and as near as I can tell I lifted off at 34 MPH
indicated. Stall is 29-30 . With the taller tires it is sitting at the
angle that it is when it actually stalls, so it would appear to be at
optimum attitude.
I am experiencing some bouncing at the same time that it wants to fly.
Not sure if it is dribbling or, starting to bounce. Need more take
off's to tell. Actually an observer would be just the thing.
Larry
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Baby's got some new shoes |
Hey, Larry, you got an interesting problem. Id be gad to observe & photograph your
TOs
Just pay my travel from Maine!
Fair winds,
Russ K
> On Apr 16, 2017, at 7:53 PM, Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 5:27 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>> Sounds good.
>>
>> Reckon sitting more nose high helped with your takeoff?
>
>
> I think that it did, seems a lot shorter. I just went back and looked
> at the video and as near as I can tell I lifted off at 34 MPH
> indicated. Stall is 29-30 . With the taller tires it is sitting at the
> angle that it is when it actually stalls, so it would appear to be at
> optimum attitude.
>
> I am experiencing some bouncing at the same time that it wants to fly.
> Not sure if it is dribbling or, starting to bounce. Need more take
> off's to tell. Actually an observer would be just the thing.
>
> Larry
>
>
>
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: Baby's got some new shoes |
Hey, Larry, you got an interesting problem. Id be gad to observe &
photograph your TOs
Just pay my travel from Maine!
Fair winds,
Russ K
Sounds good, but after buying all those rims, tires and tubes, my
slush fund is a bit under the weather. However if you toss your stuff
in your plane and start out now, you could be here in a week or two.
Larry
Message 19
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Subject: | Re: Baby's got some new shoes |
Would love to fly out to you but I=99m plane-less at the mo.
Have made 6 coast-coast trips in Cessnas, GREAT fun &
would love to do another.
I=99ll work on the Lotto
Good luck,
Russ
> On Apr 16, 2017, at 8:15 PM, Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
wrote:
>
<lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
>
<russk50@gmail.com>
>
> Hey, Larry, you got an interesting problem. I=99d be gad to
observe &
> photograph your TO=99s
> Just pay my travel from Maine!
> Fair winds,
> Russ K
>
> Sounds good, but after buying all those rims, tires and tubes, my
> slush fund is a bit under the weather. However if you toss your stuff
> in your plane and start out now, you could be here in a week or two.
> Larry
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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Subject: | Baby's got some new shoes |
Maybe you are trying to make the airplane fly too soon. Keep the nose down until
you get well stall, then pull the nose up.
It gets light, but not light enough to fly. 5 psi in big tires have a lot of reflex.
Just the thoughts of a guy that has never flown anything bigger than an 8x6, which
seemed huge for a short time after upsizing from 6x6. Now they are just regular
tires.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Baby's got some new shoes
--> <lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 5:27 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
> Sounds good.
>
> Reckon sitting more nose high helped with your takeoff?
I think that it did, seems a lot shorter. I just went back and looked at the video
and as near as I can tell I lifted off at 34 MPH indicated. Stall is 29-30
. With the taller tires it is sitting at the angle that it is when it actually
stalls, so it would appear to be at optimum attitude.
I am experiencing some bouncing at the same time that it wants to fly.
Not sure if it is dribbling or, starting to bounce. Need more take off's to tell.
Actually an observer would be just the thing.
Larry
Message 21
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Subject: | Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original version) |
info request
You're right about the little tubes cracking. One of my wing leading
edge tubes had some corrosion & a big crack about half way around it
near the root rib. After drilling it free, the diagonal tube tying it to
the main spar showed cracks in the bends on both ends. I'll be adding
new diagonals, either of larger aluminum, or some 4130 tubes the same
size. (Easier to form safely, by using a little heat.)
Thanks for the addtl info. You may well get a call from me before this
project is finished. :-)
Charlie
On 4/16/2017 5:35 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Actually, the two 5/16" tubes are fabric braces to keep the fabric
> from pulling the aluminum rib nose inward. There is no lateral
> bracing of the leading edge tube except a long 5/16 alum tube that is
> in compression.
>
> The bow tip doesn't do much for lateral bracing of the leading edge
> tube. That's all you have to keep the rib noses in column. Once they
> get pulled out of column, they will probably fail.
>
> The small 5/16 tubes are flattened, bent, and riveted. They tend to
> break at this point from vibration with not a whole lot of time on them.
>
> I used two 1/2" alum tubes, one inboard and one outboard, diagonally
> working with each other, attached to the leading edge tube and the
> main spare. Wish I had a photo of my wing handy. If I can find one I
> will share it.
>
> I may be overly cautious, but it makes me feel more comfortable,
> especially when I get caught in extremely rough air.
>
> Sorry for the delay in responding. Just got home from a 4 day trip.
>
> If you need more info, call me. 334-567-6280
>
> john h
>
> mkIII
>
> Titus, Alabama
>
> *From:*owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Charlie
> England
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 13, 2017 11:05 AM
> *To:* kolb-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Kolb-List: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar
> (original version) info request
>
> John,
>
> You mentioned leading edge bracing. This is all I see in the Twinstar
> I'm restoring. There's nothing along the rest of the leading edge that
> triangulates/ braces the leading edge.
>
> Would you consider this adequate? It's easy to add now, with the cover
> coming off.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Charlie
>
> Thanks, John. I wasn't sure about how rugged the tubes would be when
> driving out mandrels, etc. I use similar tricks on the heavier
> experimentals I've owned. I've got a spring loaded center punch that I
> ground to a flat nosed, straight shaft, & use it to punch out driven
> rivets after drilling the heads. I also use small, flush cutting
> 'dykes' (diagonal wire cutters) to grab pop rivet heads
>
> On 4/9/2017 5:58 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
>
> Charlie E/Kolbers:
>
> I have recovered a bunch of them. All that I tore up and a few I didn't.
>
> Drilling rivets can be accomplished once you have the mandrels removed.
It takes a 1/16" punch, or you can use a pulled mandrel, grind the end flat, hold
with vise grips, and knock out with a hammer. The rivet needs to be held
to prevent spinning. I grind a V in the end of a hack saw blade with sharp beveled
edges. Use that to push up under the rivet to lock it in place while drilling.
>
> 4130 airframes should be tube sealed when fabricated. 99% of Kolbs probably
have never been tube sealed. Their builders probably never heard of tube
sealing. 4130 rusts from inside out if not sealed. That would worry me with
an old fuselage, especially a Twinstar. I can't remember exactly what the fuselage
looks like other that the root tube that seats and stuff are attached to.
This I would make sure is rust free on the inside.
>
> I helped Brother Jim rebuild Adriel Heisey's Twinstar, Navajo Nation pilot
that shot aerial photos published in Nat Geo and other pubs, that he crashed
in a wind storm. It was frightening when we started cutting tubing. Most were
rusted well beyond serviceability. Here are photos of his Twinstar:
>
> https://uanews.arizona.edu/story/aerial-photos-of-archaeological-sites-on-exhibit-at-state-museum
>
> I don't recall anyone flying a free air cooled Rotax on a Kolb successfully.
Yours may be an exception.
>
> Don't know of any published updates for the Twinstar. It was not a popular
model and kits only produced a couple years.
>
> Strong lateral bracing of the leading edge of the wing is extremely important
to me. Poor/weak lateral bracing can lead to leading edge failure. This
causes the Kolb to stop flying immediately.
>
> Lower tail post bracing makes it last longer.
>
> I don't know a whole lot about the Twinstar. The one Kolb model I never
flew.
>
> john h
>
> mkIII
>
> Titus, Alabama
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
> <mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie England
>
> Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2017 4:33 PM
>
> To:kolb-list@matronics.com <mailto:kolb-list@matronics.com>
>
> Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Twinstar (original version) info request
>
>
> OK, now that I've got that short nose Kolb bit out of my system....
>
> I'm now the proud owner of an N-numbered early Kolb Twinstar (restoration
project). IIRC, its serial number is in the low 20's range.
>
> A little rusty, but we've peeled the fabric on one wing & the aluminum seems
to be in good shape, with very little corrosion, considering that it spent
its entire past life in central FL.
>
> This one's got a Rotax 503 (converted from single to dual carbs, and to free
air cooling) that seems to be in great shape. The previous owner is a close
friend who was the builder. I trust what he tells me, and he says that it always
cooled fine running it free-air with some added ducting.
>
> I'll be replacing hardware, 'soft' parts, etc, but don't intend on doing
a showplane restoration; just a safe, nice flying 'after supper' flyer.
>
> I've got the plans for the plane, but I'm hoping that you experienced Kolbers
can share any suggested mods to these early models, that will make them safer/more
durable/etc. Is there a published list of any/all service bulletins
or recommended updates? For instance, I've seen the advice to add braces to the
tailspring stinger. And I know that the later Twinstars have mass balances on
at least some of the control surfaces; is it recommended to add them to the
early models? This one does not have any mass balances anywhere.
>
> Who's recovered one? Any issues when you drilled out the rivets to remove
the ailerons, etc for recovering?
>
> Any advice will be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Charlie
>
---
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Message 22
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Subject: | Re: Leading edge bracing; was: Kolb Twinstar (original |
version)
Thanks, Richard; I'll look at doing that mod, as well.
BTW, my plans just mention '1/8 x 1/8 pop rivets'. What's the rivet of
choice? Just a typical 18-8 stainless, or 304 stainless? the 316
stainless are pricey enough that enough to do the whole plane might
cost as much as the whole kit. :-)
Charlie
On 4/13/2017 9:17 PM, Richard Pike wrote:
>
> I'm not John, but if you scroll down to page 21 in the MKIII Yellow Book, you
will see what Kolb though to be a very useful reinforcement.
> http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/Lexan%20rear%20enclosure.html
>
> --------
> Richard Pike
> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
>
> Forgiving is tough. Being forgiven is wonderful.
>
---
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Message 23
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Subject: | Baby's got some new shoes |
I'm tired and can't type.
I meant to say "keep the nose down until you get well "above" stall."
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 7:51 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Baby's got some new shoes
Maybe you are trying to make the airplane fly too soon. Keep the nose down until
you get well stall, then pull the nose up.
It gets light, but not light enough to fly. 5 psi in big tires have a lot of reflex.
Just the thoughts of a guy that has never flown anything bigger than an 8x6, which
seemed huge for a short time after upsizing from 6x6. Now they are just regular
tires.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Baby's got some new shoes
--> <lcottrell1020@gmail.com>
On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 5:27 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
>
> Sounds good.
>
> Reckon sitting more nose high helped with your takeoff?
I think that it did, seems a lot shorter. I just went back and looked at the video
and as near as I can tell I lifted off at 34 MPH indicated. Stall is 29-30
. With the taller tires it is sitting at the angle that it is when it actually
stalls, so it would appear to be at optimum attitude.
I am experiencing some bouncing at the same time that it wants to fly.
Not sure if it is dribbling or, starting to bounce. Need more take off's to tell.
Actually an observer would be just the thing.
Larry
Message 24
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Subject: | Re: Baby's got some new shoes |
Maybe you are trying to make the airplane fly too soon. Keep the nose
down until you get well stall, then pull the nose up.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually it was the "bouncing" that prompted me to pull it up.
Something similar happened on the first take off, so I was prepared
for it. Just don't know what causes it. I am wondering if a bit more
air might clear it up. The first time I can fly, I will set another
camera up to film the take off as it happens from in front. It is
nothing more than a curious occurrence.
Larry
Message 25
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Subject: | Re: New Break-away Tail Wheel |
Heat will definitely break JB weld loose. I actually just replaced the tailw
heel on my Firestar 1 with the new Kolb breakaway unit. I had drill out the f
iberglass tail strut which was a real pain, but JB had failed at tailwheel a
ssembly. So I installed a new T7075 tail strut. I just locked it into lower
vertical stabilizer with a single bolt at both ends. Here's a couple of pic
tures.
I did coat the inside of both end with a liberal amount of white silicon to s
eal out moisture.
George H.
Firestar 1, #FS100
14GDH
Mesick, MI
Have a great day!
> On Apr 16, 2017, at 11:57 AM, KJ4CTZ <Kj4ctz@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Thanks guys,
>
> I will try mild heat first. If no success I will cut off and put new assem
bly on.
>
> Should it also be JB Welded back on? I assume so but open to suggestions.
>
> This forum is great and I appreciate everyone's comments.
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=468526#468526
>
>
>
>
>
>
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