---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 05/31/17: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:19 AM - 3 axis control authority (M. Domenic Perez) 2. 10:28 AM - Re: 3 axis control authority (Bill Berle) 3. 10:53 AM - 3 questions on aileron authority (Bill Berle) 4. 11:07 AM - Re: 3 questions on aileron authority (william sullivan) 5. 11:20 AM - Re: 3 questions on aileron authority (Larry Cottrell) 6. 04:56 PM - Re: 3 questions on aileron authority (Richard Pike) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:19:52 AM PST US From: "M. Domenic Perez" Subject: Kolb-List: 3 axis control authority When I first got my Firestar II, my instructor test flew it first and commented that my ailerons "were crap". I had bought the plane used and was disappointed that I might have bought a poorly built one. However, simply disassembling the joystick mixer, cleaning the metal-to-metal surfaces that are in contact during control movements, lubricating and being careful not to overtighten the nuts putting it back together "made all the difference in the world", he said. So I never personally experienced the heavy aileron problem on my own plane, I'm just relaying what the instructor thought, before mixer maintenance and after. Bill Berle, something to think about on your friend's Mk III if you haven't already. Haven't contributed to the list or even flown for a while. Life can get complicated. M. Domenic Perez FS II 503 Vaughn, NM ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:28:00 AM PST US From: Bill Berle Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 3 axis control authority M. Domenic thank you for this information. We will make sure everything is lubricated and not over-tightened. I was informed that this particular Kolb had a center stick and then was changed to dual sticks. Perhaps something got over-tightened during that upgrade. Bill Berle www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 5/31/17, M. Domenic Perez wrote: Subject: Kolb-List: 3 axis control authority To: kolb-list@matronics.com Date: Wednesday, May 31, 2017, 9:19 AM When I first got my Firestar II, my instructor test flew it first and commented that my ailerons were crap. I had bought the plane used and was disappointed that I might have bought a poorly built one. However, simply disassembling the joystick mixer, cleaning the metal-to-metal surfaces that are in contact during control movements, lubricating and being careful not to overtighten the nuts putting it back together made all the difference in the world, he said. So I never personally experienced the heavy aileron problem on my own plane, Im just relaying what the instructor thought, before mixer maintenance and after. Bill Berle, something to think about on your friends Mk III if you havent already. Havent contributed to the list or even flown for a while. Life can get complicated. M. Domenic PerezFS II 503Vaughn, NM ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:53:03 AM PST US From: Bill Berle Subject: Kolb-List: 3 questions on aileron authority Last night I completed the structural repairs to the two wing ribs we bent on Saturday. It was possible to replace the damaged upper rear tube "rib cap" sections, without removing the rest of the rib form the spar. Internal sleeves were fabricated to allow the replacement section to be spliced in structurally with two rivets, yielding a continuous rib cap from leading to trailing edge. I'm almost ready to recover the wingtip and am deciding whether to patch the aileron fabric or recover the entire aileron. I have a few questions I want to ask the experienced Kolb owners... Jimmy and I are desperately trying to identify the root cause of the control problem we had. 1) Have any of you experienced a situation where the aileron controls have X amount of friction (or control authority) in one direction, and 3X in the other direction? What was the cause of this? 2) I located several photos online of Kolb Mark 3 aircraft that had no flaps. Did the versions of the Mk/3 without flaps suffer from the same heavy aileron forces as the versions with flaps? 3) The Kolb instructions/blueprints that I have seen (Firestar) show that you are supposed to install the hinges with the hinge axis in the center of the gap between the wing and aileron. They telly ou to put the hinge into a "V" shape and i nstall them, as opposed to the hinges being "flat". This particular Mark 3 has the hinge axis (pin) not exactly in the center of the gap. Does anybody know whether this would or would not make the ailerons more or less difficult? Bill Berle www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 5/31/17, M. Domenic Perez wrote: Subject: Kolb-List: 3 axis control authority To: kolb-list@matronics.com Date: Wednesday, May 31, 2017, 9:19 AM When I first got my Firestar II, my instructor test flew it first and commented that my ailerons were crap. I had bought the plane used and was disappointed that I might have bought a poorly built one. However, simply disassembling the joystick mixer, cleaning the metal-to-metal surfaces that are in contact during control movements, lubricating and being careful not to overtighten the nuts putting it back together made all the difference in the world, he said. So I never personally experienced the heavy aileron problem on my own plane, Im just relaying what the instructor thought, before mixer maintenance and after. Bill Berle, something to think about on your friends Mk III if you havent already. Havent contributed to the list or even flown for a while. Life can get complicated. M. Domenic PerezFS II 503Vaughn, NM ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:07:06 AM PST US From: william sullivan Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 3 questions on aileron authority Bill- While you have the aircraft down on the ground, check for the resistance right and left. Then disconnect pieces one at a time until you find the culprit. Yes, I have seen things that move freely in one direction and not the other. Disconnect the ailerons and see if it's a hinge doing it, too. It almost sounds like something is binding by going "over center", and you are trying to bend something to make it go back. Bill Sullivan ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:20:04 AM PST US From: Larry Cottrell Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 3 questions on aileron authority Bill I would suggest that you first make sure that the conversion to dual sticks was done correctly. Larry On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:06 PM, william sullivan wrote: > > Bill- While you have the aircraft down on the ground, check for the resistance right and left. Then disconnect pieces one at a time until you find the culprit. Yes, I have seen things that move freely in one direction and not the other. Disconnect the ailerons and see if it's a hinge doing it, too. It almost sounds like something is binding by going "over center", and you are trying to bend something to make it go back. > > Bill Sullivan > > -- The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others. If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:56:47 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 3 questions on aileron authority From: "Richard Pike" Don't know if this will be any help but here is how the ailerons are supposed to be attached and aligned: http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/Lexan%20rear%20enclosure.html Note especially pages 19 & 23. Also I reinforced the aileron pivots at the tip ends to keep everything aligned: http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg8.htm -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Forgiving is tough. Being forgiven is wonderful. 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