Kolb-List Digest Archive

Wed 07/11/18


Total Messages Posted: 6



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 05:00 AM - Re: Seized upon some blackberries... (Robert Lobdell)
     2. 11:32 AM - Re: Seized upon some blackberries... (Richard Pike)
     3. 11:43 AM - Re: Re: Seized upon some blackberries... (John Hauck)
     4. 01:21 PM - Re: Re: Seized upon some blackberries... (David Kulp)
     5. 03:58 PM - Re: Seized upon some blackberries... (Richard Pike)
     6. 04:09 PM - Re: Re: Seized upon some blackberries... (John Hauck)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 05:00:13 AM PST US
    From: Robert Lobdell <robpen5557@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Seized upon some blackberries...
    Glad your or the plane are fine. Thanks for sharing. Robert Lobdell Waskom, Texas Our goal as proficient Pilots is using superior planning to avoid situations which require superior skill. > On Jul 10, 2018, at 7:35 PM, John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote: > > > 4130 tubing did what it was supposed to do, protected the pilot. Had it > been aluminum it may have been a different story and done some damage to t he > pilot. You did a good job. Glad you have no more injuries than some bria r > scratches. > > Was that the intake or exhaust port in the photo? If it is the exhaust > port, I would venture to say you were running way too lean. I think you > should show soot and carbon, a little black and some brown on the piston a nd > the exhaust port. Through all these years I have come to realize that our > ultralight instruments are not precision instruments and not instantaneous . > I'd be more inclined to go with carb set up the way it comes from the > factory, prop correctly, and forget about the EGT gauge. Usually you neve r > get a warning until after the two stroke has seized. Only takes a micro > second when that slight film of oil breaks and the seizure takes place. > Fuel cools and oil lubricates. > > I have also heard free air two strokes don't cool well on pushers. > > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama - Remembering the interesting days of two strokes and Kolbs . > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike > Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2018 6:19 PM > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kolb-List: Seized upon some blackberries... > > > Sunday after church, Dave called and asked me to bring the Firefly over to > his place that evening, sounded like a great idea. Took off at 5:30, > beautiful day, light bumps, Firefly was flying great. Then the engine quit - > at the worst possible place, and Big Dummy Pike was flying too low to make > it to anywhere other than a giant blackberry patch on the side of a hill. > Only got one picture of the aftermath, the guy in the picture lived just > over the hill and came to help. Got it loaded on the trailer and home by > 9:15 that night. > > Piston was seized in two places, I am thinking that using a Free Air 277 i n > the pusher configuration is a bad idea. Since I have to taxi uphill before > takeoff, it probably gets the engine too hot and then you have to heat it u p > even more when you takeoff. Or something like that. The plug looks good, t he > EGT was staying between 1050 & 1100, fuel was fresh & had the right > amount/kind of oil, so - who knows? > > Bent the gear a little, we straightened them today. Bent the fuselage > forward tubes a little, will cut off some fabric and straighten them > tomorrow. Then will need to patch a few cracks in the nose fairing. > > Oh well, it actually turned out pretty good, I always ask the Lord to > protect me prior to each flight, and if I had not had my left hand still > wrapped around the throttle lever (like that was going to do any good!) I > wouldn't have even got a scratch. Instead, the back side of my left hand > found the blackberry bushes immediately upon arrival... ate me up! > > What was really funny, I had a Dr. appointment Monday morning with my > regular family Dr. that I have had for 25 years, he came in, took one look > at my left hand, and said "What have you done now?" > Me: "I landed the ultralight airplane in a blackberry patch." > Him: "Why did you do that?" We had a good time... [Laughing] > > -------- > Richard Pike > Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > Kingsport, TN 3TN0 > > Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is > amazing. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481531#481531 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/20180708_200133_medium_567.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1060860_medium_214.jpeg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1060866_medium_154.jpeg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1060867_medium_184.jpeg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1060868_medium_189.jpeg > > > > > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > > >


    Message 2


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    Time: 11:32:17 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Seized upon some blackberries...
    From: "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron@charter.net>
    The top edge of the intake port was not chamfered after the rebore, it is sharp enough to shave with, and that is apparently where the seizure started. The seizure is at the point where the ring locator pins are situated, although it does not really show in the picture, there is a hint of silver along that edge, apparently that is a minute amount of aluminum that was shaved from off the seized area. Once the seizure began, the piston then apparently begin to seize on the opposite (exhaust) side due to the increased pressure on the intake side of the piston from lack of clearance. The bottom side of the intake port was chamfered, as are both the top and bottom of the exhaust port. None of the transfer ports were chamfered, all of them are extremely sharp. And that might be OK, they are small and not near any ring ends. Need to do some more research on that one. I think in the future when I get an engine back from the shop, it might be a good idea to pull the head off and take a look inside before it goes back on the airplane... -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481570#481570 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/port_large_large_100.jpeg


    Message 3


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    Time: 11:43:23 AM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: Seized upon some blackberries...
    When the engine is running the rings are trying to expand in the cylinder, especially the Dykes ring. I wouldn't take a chance on not chamfering all the ports. Might save a lot of grief. Let us know what you turn up in your research. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2018 1:32 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Seized upon some blackberries... The top edge of the intake port was not chamfered after the rebore, it is sharp enough to shave with, and that is apparently where the seizure started. The seizure is at the point where the ring locator pins are situated, although it does not really show in the picture, there is a hint of silver along that edge, apparently that is a minute amount of aluminum that was shaved from off the seized area. Once the seizure began, the piston then apparently begin to seize on the opposite (exhaust) side due to the increased pressure on the intake side of the piston from lack of clearance. The bottom side of the intake port was chamfered, as are both the top and bottom of the exhaust port. None of the transfer ports were chamfered, all of them are extremely sharp. And that might be OK, they are small and not near any ring ends. Need to do some more research on that one. I think in the future when I get an engine back from the shop, it might be a good idea to pull the head off and take a look inside before it goes back on the airplane... -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481570#481570 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/port_large_large_100.jpeg


    Message 4


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    Time: 01:21:36 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Seized upon some blackberries...
    From: David Kulp <undoctor@rcn.com>
    Hello Pastor Pike, I didn't read your original post, so I'm hoping you did better with the blackberries than I did with the ready-to-harvest soybeans. I believed the soybeans to be about 6 - 7" high looking from above, but they were about 30" high with stems like thousands of ropes. Ended upside down when landing gear entered into the tangles of stems. My engine siezed first takeoff after overhaul at about 500'. The nature of the strip I flew out of (power lines near threshold, tall trees either side, etc.) required careful pilotage on normal landings, and doing a 180 and trying to land back at the strip was out of the question. I sold the plane without investigating the cause of the seizure and have since wished I didn't. I was so discouraged crashing the plane I loved to fly that I almost couldn't look at the wreckage. On a more pleasant subject, there may be interest list-wide on this. A long while back posting on a landing gear thread, I mentioned that according to a friend, the strength of a steel tube may be greater than a solid bar, depending upon the wall thickness. I felt a bit foolish when a number of Kolbers responded that steel tubing doesn't have surface tension and thought I had faith where it didn't belong. Well, guys, Frank knows a lot about everything from St. Paul's journeys and imprisonment, to MSM, the byproduct of wood processing and what MSM stands for, to VW bug engines are square, etc., although he can be overbearing at times. But it appears Frank may have been correct. https://www.nature.com/articles/srep14860 He also is a Tesla, the man, advocate and thinks of Einstein as a government shill. I tend to agree. Good to read your posts from time to time. I hope I'll have another Kolb - a 4 stroke! - soon. BTW, Rev. Pike, we're practically neighbors now. I recently bought a cabin in Wears Valley, just a tad SW of you. If anyone would like a wonderful vacation in the Smokies, go to beartootin.com click on 2 bedroom and book your stay at A Slice of Heaven. I spent a week there in April right after I bought it and that's how I came up with the name. Be safe everyone, and I hope to see some of you in the sky soon. Dave Kulp Bethlehem, PA On 7/11/2018 2:40 PM, John Hauck wrote: > > When the engine is running the rings are trying to expand in the cylinder, > especially the Dykes ring. I wouldn't take a chance on not chamfering all > the ports. Might save a lot of grief. > > Let us know what you turn up in your research. > > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike > Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2018 1:32 PM > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Seized upon some blackberries... > > > The top edge of the intake port was not chamfered after the rebore, it is > sharp enough to shave with, and that is apparently where the seizure > started. The seizure is at the point where the ring locator pins are > situated, although it does not really show in the picture, there is a hint > of silver along that edge, apparently that is a minute amount of aluminum > that was shaved from off the seized area. Once the seizure began, the piston > then apparently begin to seize on the opposite (exhaust) side due to the > increased pressure on the intake side of the piston from lack of clearance. > > The bottom side of the intake port was chamfered, as are both the top and > bottom of the exhaust port. None of the transfer ports were chamfered, all > of them are extremely sharp. And that might be OK, they are small and not > near any ring ends. Need to do some more research on that one. > > I think in the future when I get an engine back from the shop, it might be a > good idea to pull the head off and take a look inside before it goes back on > the airplane... > > -------- > Richard Pike > Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > Kingsport, TN 3TN0 > > Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is > amazing. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481570#481570 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/port_large_large_100.jpeg > >


    Message 5


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    Time: 03:58:56 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Seized upon some blackberries...
    From: "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron@charter.net>
    John Hauck wrote: > When the engine is running the rings are trying to expand in the cylinder, > especially the Dykes ring. I wouldn't take a chance on not chamfering all > the ports. Might save a lot of grief. > Let us know what you turn up in your research. > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama > -- Disclaimer: there is a boatload of videos on chamfering cylinder walls on YouTube; some seem to be pretty professional, some not so much. Spent the afternoon watching many of them. Sigh... But then thinking my way through, it seems to be pretty logical, here is how I see it: if you use a Dremel tool, use a very fine stone or fine diamond bit, because all you want to do is take off the sharp edge where the port transitions into the cylinder wall and turn it into a smooth radius. Some of the videos show some good techniques on how to do this. Seek and ye shall find... Your goal is to enable the ring to ease into the gap caused by the port and then ease back out as gently and as smoothly as possible. So you work your chamfering to include all the sides, top and the bottom of the port. Picture in your mind where the ring is going to want to push out, and then be put back in, and bevel as necessary. Apparently a little bit goes a long way. A light touch with a fine stone or diamond bit is plenty, followed by a careful application of a strip of emery cloth through the port and into the cylinder w/o touching the cylinder walls, with frequent rinsing with kerosene or mineral spirits to keep it all really clean. Use the emery cloth to take off any sharp edges or undesirable metal that the stone/diamond burr leaves. The goal is not to make the port any bigger because that changes the valve timing, but just to ease the rings expanding into the port and back out without any stress or damage. Apparently this is true whether you are working with the larger intake and exhaust ports, or the smaller transfer ports. Worth what ya paid fer it... -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481591#481591


    Message 6


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    Time: 04:09:37 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: Seized upon some blackberries...
    A carbide burr in a die grinder does a quick and easy job. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2018 5:59 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Seized upon some blackberries... John Hauck wrote: > When the engine is running the rings are trying to expand in the cylinder, > especially the Dykes ring. I wouldn't take a chance on not chamfering all > the ports. Might save a lot of grief. > Let us know what you turn up in your research. > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama > -- Disclaimer: there is a boatload of videos on chamfering cylinder walls on YouTube; some seem to be pretty professional, some not so much. Spent the afternoon watching many of them. Sigh... But then thinking my way through, it seems to be pretty logical, here is how I see it: if you use a Dremel tool, use a very fine stone or fine diamond bit, because all you want to do is take off the sharp edge where the port transitions into the cylinder wall and turn it into a smooth radius. Some of the videos show some good techniques on how to do this. Seek and ye shall find... Your goal is to enable the ring to ease into the gap caused by the port and then ease back out as gently and as smoothly as possible. So you work your chamfering to include all the sides, top and the bottom of the port. Picture in your mind where the ring is going to want to push out, and then be put back in, and bevel as necessary. Apparently a little bit goes a long way. A light touch with a fine stone or diamond bit is plenty, followed by a careful application of a strip of emery cloth through the port and into the cylinder w/o touching the cylinder walls, with frequent rinsing with kerosene or mineral spirits to keep it all really clean. Use the emery cloth to take off any sharp edges or undesirable metal that the stone/diamond burr leaves. The goal is not to make the port any bigger because that changes the valve timing, but just to ease the rings expanding into the port and back out without any stress or damage. Apparently this is true whether you are working with the larger intake and exhaust ports, or the smaller transfer ports. Worth what ya paid fer it... -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481591#481591




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