---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 01/30/20: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:16 AM - Re: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions (Richard Pike) 2. 06:54 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions (Pfatchantz) 3. 09:56 AM - Re: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions (Gary Aman) 4. 10:08 AM - Re: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions (Jay Dub) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:16:11 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions From: "Richard Pike" Don't know if I can answer all your questions, but I can answer some. Back in 2017 I bought a wrecked original Firestar, 1985 vintage, 5 rib wings. Wings and tail and boom tube undamaged, fuselage was totaled. Herb of this list gave me an upper fuselage tube and a front end off a Firefly. The Firestar wings mated perfectly to the Firestar upper fuselage. The original Firestar wings are longer than the Firefly wings, so probably a bit heavier. Simuntaneously with this I also had a FSII that had been dismantled and was being sold. The original Firestar had Kolb's original tail folding mechanism, which was cumbersome to say the least. The FSII had the current quick fold mechanism. Did a lot of measuring and could not find any difference between the two, so swapped them out. Went to the Kolb factory and took lots of pictures of Firefly fuselages and rebuilt our Firestar cage to conform to the current Firefly setup. Short version; with bicycle disc brakes, a 9 pound hand deployed parachute, and a Rotax 277, it does make legal weight. And flies very well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?vcfoOJJDpg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulIJ_WHLMfY -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Kolb Firefly Part 103 legal Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494525#494525 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:54:52 AM PST US From: Pfatchantz Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions Richard, Good to see that you turned that wrecked fuselage into a nice looking Firefly...I rebuilt the wings that you gave me and they are sitting the barn along with tail feathers and tail boom tube . I can see that you like a little extra dihedral..:-) The story that developed around the rebuilding of that firefly is sad. I met a fellow from Southern Va. at the Kolb Factory , for he was buying a new cage for his Firefly...so he brought his bent cage and sold it to me..Needed very little repair..taxiing accident.. He discussed the desire for flight training which I tried to reinforce...Said he was going to Fla and would check there...Some time later and back in Va...He took off on his maiden flight never to return...likely stalled in...around Staunton as I recall? By the way...I need some photo's of the 750 Brs canister install on a Firestar II...I took it off of mine and now have a jumble cords from several BRS models and the manual seems to be a bit short of diagrams or pics of the install.. so do not know which is which.. by the way..I have BRS 950 for sale..needs rocket and repack...came off of a challenger..I hear that unit needs factory repack using a hydraulic press..?? Herb Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email. Original Message On Thursday, January 30, 2020 8:15 AM, Richard Pike wrote: > > Don't know if I can answer all your questions, but I can answer some. Back in 2017 I bought a wrecked original Firestar, 1985 vintage, 5 rib wings. Wings and tail and boom tube undamaged, fuselage was totaled. > Herb of this list gave me an upper fuselage tube and a front end off a Firefly. The Firestar wings mated perfectly to the Firestar upper fuselage. The original Firestar wings are longer than the Firefly wings, so probably a bit heavier. > > Simuntaneously with this I also had a FSII that had been dismantled and was being sold. The original Firestar had Kolb's original tail folding mechanism, which was cumbersome to say the least. The FSII had the current quick fold mechanism. Did a lot of measuring and could not find any difference between the two, so swapped them out. > Went to the Kolb factory and took lots of pictures of Firefly fuselages and rebuilt our Firestar cage to conform to the current Firefly setup. > Short version; with bicycle disc brakes, a 9 pound hand deployed parachute, and a Rotax 277, it does make legal weight. And flies very well. > https://www.youtube.com/watch?vcfoOJJDpg > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulIJ_WHLMfY > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Richard Pike > Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > Kolb Firefly Part 103 legal > Kingsport, TN 3TN0 > > Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494525#494525 > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:56:49 AM PST US From: Gary Aman Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions Fire star 1and2 are physicaly similar more ribs in the 2 but firefly is all by itself,dimensional and tubing size Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 29, 2020, at 9:25 AM, jaydub wrote: > > > I posted the following at HBA but thought I'd ask here too because of the specialized nature of this list. > > I've read the history of Kolb pdf and gathered some info but there are some blurry parts in my mind. > > I know the Firestar started out as a UL with a 277. Then they made them heavier with a 447 and 503 in the "fat ultralight" years. Then they differentiated between Firestar 1 & 2. Then, to make a legal UL Kolb did something to lighten them again and made the Firefly model to hit legal weight with a 447. > > Does anyone know if the early Firestar fuselages (and even later ones) are the same dimensions and tubing thicknesses as the Firefly? IIRC I read somewhere the weight was reduced in the wings for the Firefly but that might not be true so I'm seeking advice. > > What brings about all my strange questions is that I have a lead on everything for an earlier Firestar with everything included but the fuselage. Without a fuselage and serial number I can't determine much as the current owner is at least the 2nd or 3rd owner or even later. I'm wondering if the wing has the same chord between the Firefly/star models or not and would it connect up just fine? In other words, can Firestar wings, tailboom, tail, etc fit on a Firefly fuselage or do I have to stick with the Firestar fuselage? I want to keep it light and under 254 lbs if possible. It comes with a 447 so it's possible it could already be a Firefly but how would I be able to tell? Is the tailboom a different dia or thickness on the Firestar 2? I'm just trying to figure out which of the Firestary/Firefly fuselages would work with the parts I may pick up. > > And lastly, does anyone have or know of someone who has a fuselage with landing gear they'd like to part with that will fit the Firestar wings and tail? I have experience cutting out bent tubes and welding in new ones on certificated and homebuilt planes so a wrecked/bent fuselage is OK as I can repair one as long as it's not rusted badly. If you know of one please contact me as I'm interested. > > Thanks, > Jay Dub > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494521#494521 > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:08:12 AM PST US From: Jay Dub Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions Hi All, Thanks for the info. Good to know the Firefly is it=99s own design w ith different dimensions and different tubing sizes. I talked with the 2nd owner yesterday and found out the wings are the large r spar and 7 rib design like from a Firestar. That means I=99ll have to LSA whatever I do with the wings and all the other parts. If I have to LSA maybe I=99ll try to do a F2. Which that thought leads me to ano ther question, would a Firestar 2SS fuselage be possible with the 7 rib win gs and tail from a Firstar since I=99m going to have to get a fuselag e no matter what? Thanks, Jay Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Gary Aman Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2020 10:59 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Kolb Firefly/Firestar fuselage questions Fire star 1and2 are physicaly similar more ribs in the 2 but firefly is all by itself,dimensional and tubing size Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 29, 2020, at 9:25 AM, jaydub wrote: > > > I posted the following at HBA but thought I'd ask here too because of the specialized nature of this list. > > I've read the history of Kolb pdf and gathered some info but there are so me blurry parts in my mind. > > I know the Firestar started out as a UL with a 277. Then they made them h eavier with a 447 and 503 in the "fat ultralight" years. Then they differen tiated between Firestar 1 & 2. Then, to make a legal UL Kolb did something to lighten them again and made the Firefly model to hit legal weight with a 447. > > Does anyone know if the early Firestar fuselages (and even later ones) ar e the same dimensions and tubing thicknesses as the Firefly? IIRC I read so mewhere the weight was reduced in the wings for the Firefly but that might not be true so I'm seeking advice. > > What brings about all my strange questions is that I have a lead on every thing for an earlier Firestar with everything included but the fuselage. Wi thout a fuselage and serial number I can't determine much as the current ow ner is at least the 2nd or 3rd owner or even later. I'm wondering if the wi ng has the same chord between the Firefly/star models or not and would it c onnect up just fine? In other words, can Firestar wings, tailboom, tail, et c fit on a Firefly fuselage or do I have to stick with the Firestar fuselag e? I want to keep it light and under 254 lbs if possible. It comes with a 4 47 so it's possible it could already be a Firefly but how would I be able t o tell? Is the tailboom a different dia or thickness on the Firestar 2? I'm just trying to figure out which of the Firestary/Firefly fuselages would w ork with the parts I may pick up. > > And lastly, does anyone have or know of someone who has a fuselage with l anding gear they'd like to part with that will fit the Firestar wings and t ail? I have experience cutting out bent tubes and welding in new ones on ce rtificated and homebuilt planes so a wrecked/bent fuselage is OK as I can r epair one as long as it's not rusted badly. If you know of one please cont act me as I'm interested. > > Thanks, > Jay Dub > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=494521#494521 > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.