---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 06/11/20: 2 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:17 AM - Re: Lithium Battery Update (Paul Littleton) 2. 08:20 AM - Re: Re: Lithium Battery Update (Rick Neilsen) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:17:21 AM PST US From: Paul Littleton Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Lithium Battery Update I would do more investigation before returning the battery. The Connection Break message was most likely caused by the battery management system tapering the charge current below what the charger needed to believe it was connected to a battery. I suspect the battery was still in the circuit. I would expect the battery management system to maintain 14.4 volts on the battery and drop the charging current to nil. If I ever saw 16 volts on a lithium battery I would be running away. They get really nasty and can explode if they get pushed to that kind of voltage. Most equipment that is designed for a 12 volt system is only rated to 15 volts maximum. Your electronic ignition system might not survive anything above 15 volts. My guess is that the batter is fine and the chargers error message is misleading. Best Regards, Paul Littleton tapped out on an iPad > From: Rick Neilsen > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Lithium Battery Update > > Ok one final update on my Lithium Iron Phosphate battery test /experience. > > I got the new Areovoltz LiFe battery a few days ago and charged the battery > as instructed. The manual said the battery was charged to 70% but with a 2 > amp charge rate it went to 14.4 volts in 10 minutes. When it got to 14.4 > volts the charger backed off and maintained 14.39 to 14.40 volts, after > just a few minutes I got a message "Connection Break". Wow if I had been > flying it would have been a second forced landing. The manufacturer said it > would not disconnect till it got to 16 plus volts and heated some but it > didn't, it disconnected at 14.4 volts! The charger was set for > safe charging LiFe batteries and it never exceeded the maximum safe > voltage. I can't live with that. I'm returning the battery. > > The new battery has a built in "Battery Management System" that protects > the battery and it seems to be doing that but the alternator regulator in > my plane regularly charges to about 14 volts in recharge mode then backs > off once the battery is charged. The Old LiFe battery without the BMS never > had a problem with it. I have an electronic ignition system that requires > battery filtered power to operate, it will NOT operate on alternator only > power so if the battery disconnects in flight the engine will quit. As the > old LiFe aged I would see voltages slightly above 14.0 volts on occasion so > having a BMS that disconnects the battery when the operating voltage is > just .4 volts away it is just too close. > > As usual worth what you paid for it. > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:20:18 AM PST US From: Rick Neilsen Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Lithium Battery Update Thanks for the input. First LiFe batteries don't normally explode. I'm sure there are exceptions even for lead acid but normally high voltage just causes a melt down. Was the battery still in the circuit? I took the battery to my volt meter and it showed 13.5 volts about 15 minutes later and when I tried charging the battery again the BMS had reset and I could charge it again. Was the battery still in the circuit enough to provide usable power to my electronic ignition system? I'm not willing to test that situation. I already purchased a replacement lead acid battery. Wow it is a good 12lbs heavier than the old LiFe with no where near the same power. Maybe in two - three years when this one dies I will find a better replacement. I had a forced landing with my current plane actually three in my flying years and walked away. I'm learning what not to do. I'm not going to press my luck. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC On Thu, Jun 11, 2020 at 10:21 AM Paul Littleton wrote: > > I would do more investigation before returning the battery. The > =9CConnection Break=9D message was most likely caused by the battery management > system tapering the charge current below what the charger needed to belie ve > it was connected to a battery. I suspect the battery was still in the > circuit. I would expect the battery management system to maintain 14.4 > volts on the battery and drop the charging current to nil. > > If I ever saw 16 volts on a lithium battery I would be running away. They > get really nasty and can explode if they get pushed to that kind of > voltage. Most equipment that is designed for a 12 volt system is only rat ed > to 15 volts maximum. Your electronic ignition system might not survive > anything above 15 volts. > > My guess is that the batter is fine and the charger=99s error messa ge is > misleading. > > Best Regards, > Paul Littleton > > tapped out on an iPad > > > From: Rick Neilsen > > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Lithium Battery Update > > > > Ok one final update on my Lithium Iron Phosphate battery test > /experience. > > > > I got the new Areovoltz LiFe battery a few days ago and charged the > battery > > as instructed. The manual said the battery was charged to 70% but with a > 2 > > amp charge rate it went to 14.4 volts in 10 minutes. When it got to 14. 4 > > volts the charger backed off and maintained 14.39 to 14.40 volts, after > > just a few minutes I got a message "Connection Break". Wow if I had bee n > > flying it would have been a second forced landing. The manufacturer sai d > it > > would not disconnect till it got to 16 plus volts and heated some but i t > > didn't, it disconnected at 14.4 volts! The charger was set for > > safe charging LiFe batteries and it never exceeded the maximum safe > > voltage. I can't live with that. I'm returning the battery. > > > > The new battery has a built in "Battery Management System" that protect s > > the battery and it seems to be doing that but the alternator regulator in > > my plane regularly charges to about 14 volts in recharge mode then back s > > off once the battery is charged. The Old LiFe battery without the BMS > never > > had a problem with it. I have an electronic ignition system that requir es > > battery filtered power to operate, it will NOT operate on alternator on ly > > power so if the battery disconnects in flight the engine will quit. As > the > > old LiFe aged I would see voltages slightly above 14.0 volts on occasio n > so > > having a BMS that disconnects the battery when the operating voltage is > > just .4 volts away it is just too close. > > > > As usual worth what you paid for it. > > > > Rick Neilsen > > Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC > > =========== =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.