Today's Message Index:
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1. 06:43 AM - Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Pilot Report - Lightning (Pete)
2. 01:59 PM - Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Pilot Report - Lightning (Dave)
3. 02:31 PM - Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Pilot Report - Lightning (Pete)
4. 05:27 PM - Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Pilot Report - Lightning (Dave)
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| Subject: | Re: Pilot Report - Lightning |
Dave,
You must have a problem with the pitot static system if you are reporting
only 126 mph at 2850 with all the fairings. Even the 2200 powered Esqual
with the fairings will do more than that at 2850. Have you done a pitot
static check or determined if there is a leak in the system that would
result in readings that low? Even at the pitch you have the prop set at you
will do more than 126 mph without fairings.
As far as the carb tuning - the carb must be tuned to the prop load on the
engine. If you are seeing 1450+ at cruise at that prop pitch you probably
have less prop load on the engine that the carb is tuned for. Less prop
load results in a lean mixture since less vacuum is delivered to the top
side of the carb dome. Less vacuum there results in the diaphragm not
pulling the needle up far enough out of the jet to provide the correct
mixture. First step - since the engine shakes at full rpm is to try a
larger main jet. If you had a 255 before try a 265. That should richen the
mixture at full throttle. If you are running rich instead of lean then the
condition will be worse. If it is rich then try a 245 main and see if it is
better.
Pete
_____
From: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com [mailto:esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:46 AM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Buz
Thanks for all the info. It sure helps
1. I do have the Vans wheel pants on
2. I have the Vans fairings also on
3. I am running the carbon Sensenich prop @ 19.5 at 12
inches in
4.My cruise at 2850 is at 126 mph indicated.
5. Last night at 5000 ft with oats of 68, the engine was
struggling at 3150 "missing"
Believe it or not, I showed no increase in speed with pants or fairings, I
still believe the engine is not putting out what it should, today I will
play with the float levels.
Stumped - Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: N1BZRich@aol. <mailto:N1BZRich@aol.com> com
Cc: lightning-list@ <mailto:lightning-list@matronics.com> matronics.com
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Dave,
Let me jump in here and ask a few questions. Do you have gear leg
fairings (Van's RV style)? Those alone are good for at least 10 mph if not
more. Do you have the latest style Van's RV wheel pants? Those will give
you at least another 10 mph - well 10 to 15 above not having any wheel pants
on. I am not sure what they would add over the stock Esqual pants, but
probably at least half of that. I never flew my airplane with Esqual pants
on. So if the answer to the above questions is no, they we have identified
at least 20 mph. Another thing that cleaning up the gear legs and wheels
will do it give your engine additional rpm. With the lower drag profile
with the fairings on, the engine does not have to work as hard. Besides the
20 plus mph increase in speed, you will probably pick up at least 200 rpm -
if not more.
My airplane will run an easy 150 TAS at 5000 feet on 2850 rpm. At 3250
I am seeing 180 mph TAS along now (hot outside - density altitude more like
6700' when at 5000 msl), but last winter I was seeing 185 mph TAS when at
5000.
The big unknown for my airplane is how many mph is the Lightning cowling
worth. Once again, I never flew it with an Esqual cowling. What I do
remember is that at 5000' (last winter - and with a fixed 53 inch pitch)
before I put on gear leg fairings or wheel pants my max speed was 165 mph
TAS. Based on what you are seeing, does that mean that the Lightning
cowling is good for 15 mph. Maybe it is, but without us both using the same
prop, it would be hard to say for sure.
As to your EGTs, do all six exhaust have probes? I do, and some of them
are slightly closer to the exhasut outlet just because of the way the
exhaust manifold is shaped. My hotest EGT at 5000' last winter (OAT 53
degrees F) was about 1450 at 2850 rpm. It went up to 1475 between 2900 and
2950 rpm, and then started down as rpm increased from that point. Remember,
I don't have a muffler, so that might have some impact.
Hope this helps some.
Blue Skies,
Buz
__._,_.___
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| Subject: | Re: Pilot Report - Lightning |
Pete
thanks for the help
I did a pitot static check and found no leaks or tight bends in lines.
I tried a 245, 250, 255 main. The 245 gave me redline egts having the
prop set at 20 degrees. All jets gave same result- engine shake at full
rpm.
Pete, could the timing advance at full rpm be affecting this and how
does one check this? It seems the engine is not putting out full power.
It is burning about 6 oz oil per hr.
stupid- I mean -stumped, Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Pete
To: lightning-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 8:42 AM
Subject: RE: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Dave,
You must have a problem with the pitot static system if you are
reporting only 126 mph at 2850 with all the fairings. Even the 2200
powered Esqual with the fairings will do more than that at 2850. Have
you done a pitot static check or determined if there is a leak in the
system that would result in readings that low? Even at the pitch you
have the prop set at you will do more than 126 mph without fairings.
As far as the carb tuning - the carb must be tuned to the prop load on
the engine. If you are seeing 1450+ at cruise at that prop pitch you
probably have less prop load on the engine that the carb is tuned for.
Less prop load results in a lean mixture since less vacuum is delivered
to the top side of the carb dome. Less vacuum there results in the
diaphragm not pulling the needle up far enough out of the jet to provide
the correct mixture. First step - since the engine shakes at full rpm
is to try a larger main jet. If you had a 255 before try a 265. That
should richen the mixture at full throttle. If you are running rich
instead of lean then the condition will be worse. If it is rich then
try a 245 main and see if it is better.
Pete
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com [mailto:esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:46 AM
To: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Buz
Thanks for all the info. It sure helps
1. I do have the Vans wheel pants on
2. I have the Vans fairings also on
3. I am running the carbon Sensenich prop @ 19.5 at 12
inches in
4.My cruise at 2850 is at 126 mph indicated.
5. Last night at 5000 ft with oats of 68, the engine was
struggling at 3150 "missing"
Believe it or not, I showed no increase in speed with pants or
fairings, I still believe the engine is not putting out what it should,
today I will play with the float levels.
Stumped - Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: N1BZRich@aol.com
To: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com
Cc: lightning-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report -
Lightning
Dave,
Let me jump in here and ask a few questions. Do you have gear
leg fairings (Van's RV style)? Those alone are good for at least 10 mph
if not more. Do you have the latest style Van's RV wheel pants? Those
will give you at least another 10 mph - well 10 to 15 above not having
any wheel pants on. I am not sure what they would add over the stock
Esqual pants, but probably at least half of that. I never flew my
airplane with Esqual pants on. So if the answer to the above questions
is no, they we have identified at least 20 mph. Another thing that
cleaning up the gear legs and wheels will do it give your engine
additional rpm. With the lower drag profile with the fairings on, the
engine does not have to work as hard. Besides the 20 plus mph increase
in speed, you will probably pick up at least 200 rpm - if not more.
My airplane will run an easy 150 TAS at 5000 feet on 2850 rpm.
At 3250 I am seeing 180 mph TAS along now (hot outside - density
altitude more like 6700' when at 5000 msl), but last winter I was seeing
185 mph TAS when at 5000.
The big unknown for my airplane is how many mph is the Lightning
cowling worth. Once again, I never flew it with an Esqual cowling.
What I do remember is that at 5000' (last winter - and with a fixed 53
inch pitch) before I put on gear leg fairings or wheel pants my max
speed was 165 mph TAS. Based on what you are seeing, does that mean
that the Lightning cowling is good for 15 mph. Maybe it is, but without
us both using the same prop, it would be hard to say for sure.
As to your EGTs, do all six exhaust have probes? I do, and some
of them are slightly closer to the exhasut outlet just because of the
way the exhaust manifold is shaped. My hotest EGT at 5000' last winter
(OAT 53 degrees F) was about 1450 at 2850 rpm. It went up to 1475
between 2900 and 2950 rpm, and then started down as rpm increased from
that point. Remember, I don't have a muffler, so that might have some
impact.
Hope this helps some.
Blue Skies,
Buz
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| Subject: | Re: Pilot Report - Lightning |
Dave,
Since the jetting does not seem to change the situation, then the next
possible culprit would be the air intake to the carb. The flow into the
carb must be as smooth as possible. Too tight a bend in the SCAT hose close
to the carb will result in turbulent air into the carb and at high rpms will
cause the diaphragm to bounce and richen the mixture. Carefully check the
intake routing to make the air go straight in for the last few inches of
Scat duct before the carb.
I still think there is an airspeed error. 2850 rpm with that prop will
propel a Jabiru aircraft faster than 126 mph. It is impossible for me to
believe that at 2850 rpm an Esqual would be slower than a Jabiru. 126 knots
might be in the relm of possibility but not 126 mph. It makes no sense. I
think you should fly it down here and we'll find a way to straighten it out.
Pete
_____
From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:59 PM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Pete
thanks for the help
I did a pitot static check and found no leaks or tight bends in lines.
I tried a 245, 250, 255 main. The 245 gave me redline egts having the prop
set at 20 degrees. All jets gave same result- engine shake at full rpm.
Pete, could the timing advance at full rpm be affecting this and how does
one check this? It seems the engine is not putting out full power. It is
burning about 6 oz oil per hr.
stupid- I mean -stumped, Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Pete <mailto:pete@flylightning.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 8:42 AM
Subject: RE: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Dave,
You must have a problem with the pitot static system if you are reporting
only 126 mph at 2850 with all the fairings. Even the 2200 powered Esqual
with the fairings will do more than that at 2850. Have you done a pitot
static check or determined if there is a leak in the system that would
result in readings that low? Even at the pitch you have the prop set at you
will do more than 126 mph without fairings.
As far as the carb tuning - the carb must be tuned to the prop load on the
engine. If you are seeing 1450+ at cruise at that prop pitch you probably
have less prop load on the engine that the carb is tuned for. Less prop
load results in a lean mixture since less vacuum is delivered to the top
side of the carb dome. Less vacuum there results in the diaphragm not
pulling the needle up far enough out of the jet to provide the correct
mixture. First step - since the engine shakes at full rpm is to try a
larger main jet. If you had a 255 before try a 265. That should richen the
mixture at full throttle. If you are running rich instead of lean then the
condition will be worse. If it is rich then try a 245 main and see if it is
better.
Pete
_____
From: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com [mailto:esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:46 AM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Buz
Thanks for all the info. It sure helps
1. I do have the Vans wheel pants on
2. I have the Vans fairings also on
3. I am running the carbon Sensenich prop @ 19.5 at 12
inches in
4.My cruise at 2850 is at 126 mph indicated.
5. Last night at 5000 ft with oats of 68, the engine was
struggling at 3150 "missing"
Believe it or not, I showed no increase in speed with pants or fairings, I
still believe the engine is not putting out what it should, today I will
play with the float levels.
Stumped - Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: N1BZRich@aol. <mailto:N1BZRich@aol.com> com
Cc: lightning-list@ <mailto:lightning-list@matronics.com> matronics.com
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Dave,
Let me jump in here and ask a few questions. Do you have gear leg
fairings (Van's RV style)? Those alone are good for at least 10 mph if not
more. Do you have the latest style Van's RV wheel pants? Those will give
you at least another 10 mph - well 10 to 15 above not having any wheel pants
on. I am not sure what they would add over the stock Esqual pants, but
probably at least half of that. I never flew my airplane with Esqual pants
on. So if the answer to the above questions is no, they we have identified
at least 20 mph. Another thing that cleaning up the gear legs and wheels
will do it give your engine additional rpm. With the lower drag profile
with the fairings on, the engine does not have to work as hard. Besides the
20 plus mph increase in speed, you will probably pick up at least 200 rpm -
if not more.
My airplane will run an easy 150 TAS at 5000 feet on 2850 rpm. At 3250
I am seeing 180 mph TAS along now (hot outside - density altitude more like
6700' when at 5000 msl), but last winter I was seeing 185 mph TAS when at
5000.
The big unknown for my airplane is how many mph is the Lightning cowling
worth. Once again, I never flew it with an Esqual cowling. What I do
remember is that at 5000' (last winter - and with a fixed 53 inch pitch)
before I put on gear leg fairings or wheel pants my max speed was 165 mph
TAS. Based on what you are seeing, does that mean that the Lightning
cowling is good for 15 mph. Maybe it is, but without us both using the same
prop, it would be hard to say for sure.
As to your EGTs, do all six exhaust have probes? I do, and some of them
are slightly closer to the exhasut outlet just because of the way the
exhaust manifold is shaped. My hotest EGT at 5000' last winter (OAT 53
degrees F) was about 1450 at 2850 rpm. It went up to 1475 between 2900 and
2950 rpm, and then started down as rpm increased from that point. Remember,
I don't have a muffler, so that might have some impact.
Hope this helps some.
Blue Skies,
Buz
__._,_.___
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| Subject: | Re: Pilot Report - Lightning |
Pete,
You are a genius, thanks so much for taking the time to baby-sit me. I
did a re-check of pitot line and it was ok. Before flight I removed
static line. All of the sudden I am doing 160 TAS. During flight I
reached down and reattached static line and went back to 125 mph, thanks
so much for help!
My scat tube has a sharp bend before the carb with excessive scat tube
prior to the clamp. I see in the 3300 manual an elbow is offered. Do you
offer this?
THANKS AGAIN - Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Pete
To: lightning-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:31 PM
Subject: RE: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Dave,
Since the jetting does not seem to change the situation, then the next
possible culprit would be the air intake to the carb. The flow into the
carb must be as smooth as possible. Too tight a bend in the SCAT hose
close to the carb will result in turbulent air into the carb and at high
rpms will cause the diaphragm to bounce and richen the mixture.
Carefully check the intake routing to make the air go straight in for
the last few inches of Scat duct before the carb.
I still think there is an airspeed error. 2850 rpm with that prop
will propel a Jabiru aircraft faster than 126 mph. It is impossible for
me to believe that at 2850 rpm an Esqual would be slower than a Jabiru.
126 knots might be in the relm of possibility but not 126 mph. It makes
no sense. I think you should fly it down here and we'll find a way to
straighten it out.
Pete
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:59 PM
To: lightning-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report - Lightning
Pete
thanks for the help
I did a pitot static check and found no leaks or tight bends in lines.
I tried a 245, 250, 255 main. The 245 gave me redline egts having the
prop set at 20 degrees. All jets gave same result- engine shake at full
rpm.
Pete, could the timing advance at full rpm be affecting this and how
does one check this? It seems the engine is not putting out full power.
It is burning about 6 oz oil per hr.
stupid- I mean -stumped, Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Pete
To: lightning-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 8:42 AM
Subject: RE: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report -
Lightning
Dave,
You must have a problem with the pitot static system if you are
reporting only 126 mph at 2850 with all the fairings. Even the 2200
powered Esqual with the fairings will do more than that at 2850. Have
you done a pitot static check or determined if there is a leak in the
system that would result in readings that low? Even at the pitch you
have the prop set at you will do more than 126 mph without fairings.
As far as the carb tuning - the carb must be tuned to the prop load
on the engine. If you are seeing 1450+ at cruise at that prop pitch you
probably have less prop load on the engine that the carb is tuned for.
Less prop load results in a lean mixture since less vacuum is delivered
to the top side of the carb dome. Less vacuum there results in the
diaphragm not pulling the needle up far enough out of the jet to provide
the correct mixture. First step - since the engine shakes at full rpm
is to try a larger main jet. If you had a 255 before try a 265. That
should richen the mixture at full throttle. If you are running rich
instead of lean then the condition will be worse. If it is rich then
try a 245 main and see if it is better.
Pete
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
From: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com [mailto:esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:46 AM
To: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report -
Lightning
Buz
Thanks for all the info. It sure helps
1. I do have the Vans wheel pants on
2. I have the Vans fairings also on
3. I am running the carbon Sensenich prop @ 19.5 at 12
inches in
4.My cruise at 2850 is at 126 mph indicated.
5. Last night at 5000 ft with oats of 68, the engine was
struggling at 3150 "missing"
Believe it or not, I showed no increase in speed with pants or
fairings, I still believe the engine is not putting out what it should,
today I will play with the float levels.
Stumped - Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: N1BZRich@aol.com
To: esqualtalk@yahoogroups.com
Cc: lightning-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: [esqualtalk] Re: Lightning-List: Pilot Report -
Lightning
Dave,
Let me jump in here and ask a few questions. Do you have gear
leg fairings (Van's RV style)? Those alone are good for at least 10 mph
if not more. Do you have the latest style Van's RV wheel pants? Those
will give you at least another 10 mph - well 10 to 15 above not having
any wheel pants on. I am not sure what they would add over the stock
Esqual pants, but probably at least half of that. I never flew my
airplane with Esqual pants on. So if the answer to the above questions
is no, they we have identified at least 20 mph. Another thing that
cleaning up the gear legs and wheels will do it give your engine
additional rpm. With the lower drag profile with the fairings on, the
engine does not have to work as hard. Besides the 20 plus mph increase
in speed, you will probably pick up at least 200 rpm - if not more.
My airplane will run an easy 150 TAS at 5000 feet on 2850 rpm.
At 3250 I am seeing 180 mph TAS along now (hot outside - density
altitude more like 6700' when at 5000 msl), but last winter I was seeing
185 mph TAS when at 5000.
The big unknown for my airplane is how many mph is the
Lightning cowling worth. Once again, I never flew it with an Esqual
cowling. What I do remember is that at 5000' (last winter - and with a
fixed 53 inch pitch) before I put on gear leg fairings or wheel pants my
max speed was 165 mph TAS. Based on what you are seeing, does that mean
that the Lightning cowling is good for 15 mph. Maybe it is, but without
us both using the same prop, it would be hard to say for sure.
As to your EGTs, do all six exhaust have probes? I do, and
some of them are slightly closer to the exhasut outlet just because of
the way the exhaust manifold is shaped. My hotest EGT at 5000' last
winter (OAT 53 degrees F) was about 1450 at 2850 rpm. It went up to
1475 between 2900 and 2950 rpm, and then started down as rpm increased
from that point. Remember, I don't have a muffler, so that might have
some impact.
Hope this helps some.
Blue Skies,
Buz
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