Lightning-List Digest Archive

Wed 01/24/07


Total Messages Posted: 37



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 02:21 AM - Re: Moving on... (IFLYSMODEL@aol.com)
     2. 03:17 AM - Re: Moving on... (Brian Whittingham)
     3. 03:21 AM - Re: Brian's move to Texas (Brian Whittingham)
     4. 05:41 AM - Re: Moving on... (N1BZRich@AOL.COM)
     5. 05:56 AM - Re: Enigma (N1BZRich@AOL.COM)
     6. 06:34 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Pete)
     7. 07:08 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Johnny Thompson)
     8. 07:29 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (N1BZRich@AOL.COM)
     9. 08:06 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (N1BZRich@AOL.COM)
    10. 08:17 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Jim Langley)
    11. 10:15 AM - Frapper Map (pequeajim)
    12. 11:20 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Pete)
    13. 11:42 AM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (nick otterback)
    14. 11:52 AM - Another sweet flying Lightning (nick otterback)
    15. 12:09 PM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Charles Dewey)
    16. 01:14 PM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Jim Langley)
    17. 01:17 PM - Re: Another sweet flying Lightning (Jim Langley)
    18. 01:37 PM - Re: Another sweet flying Lightning (Daniel Vandenberg)
    19. 02:04 PM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (IFLYSMODEL@AOL.COM)
    20. 02:31 PM - November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics (Brian Whittingham)
    21. 02:42 PM - Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics (IFLYSMODEL@AOL.COM)
    22. 02:46 PM - Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics (Brian Whittingham)
    23. 02:56 PM - Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics (Daniel Vandenberg)
    24. 03:01 PM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (Pete)
    25. 03:09 PM - Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics (Pete)
    26. 03:28 PM - Lightning exterior pics (Brian Whittingham)
    27. 03:45 PM - Re: Lightning exterior pics (Jim Langley)
    28. 03:46 PM - Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR (IFLYSMODEL@AOL.COM)
    29. 03:50 PM - Re: Lightning exterior pics (Daniel Vandenberg)
    30. 04:04 PM - Lightning Cockpit Photos (Brian Whittingham)
    31. 04:28 PM - Re: Lightning Cockpit Photos (Jim Langley)
    32. 04:32 PM - Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics (Kayberg@AOL.COM)
    33. 04:38 PM - Re: Microair (Laurie Hoffman)
    34. 04:53 PM - Re: Lightning Cockpit Photos (Brian Whittingham)
    35. 04:57 PM - Re: Lightning exterior pics (Brian Whittingham)
    36. 05:05 PM - Re: Re: Microair (Brian Whittingham)
    37. 07:08 PM - Re: Lightning Cockpit Photos **Correction** (Mark Stauffer)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 02:21:32 AM PST US
    From: IFLYSMODEL@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Moving on...
    Great answers Buzz: The insurance costs you quote are right in line with what it costs me to insure the Bonanza. Jim, it may pay you to check with someone besides Falcon. I found about 10 years ago that other agents may be several hundred dollars cheaper (and still are) Buzz, I was told at the Expo in Sebring that one could put a Lightning together for about $65,000. But from what you have said, it appears that it will cost at least 75 and probably closer to 85,000? It appears that I may be able to sell the Bonanza, but I will have a real problem if the cost is so high. I definitely like and want the Lightning, but cost is a real bugaboo! Lynn


    Message 2


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    Time: 03:17:16 AM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Moving on...
    Actually I think that the cost of the Hobbs machine I was told was closer to $56k. I think that Buz was saying that he insured it for more because if he were to resale the airplane now that it is complete and has the bugs worked out it'd be worth that much more. It really comes down to avionics in the longrun as you basically have one choice of engine and the airframe costs are the same. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ Search for grocery stores. Find gratitude. Turn a simple search into something more. http://click4thecause.live.com/search/charity/default.aspx?source=hmemtagline_gratitude&FORM=WLMTAG


    Message 3


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    Time: 03:21:44 AM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Brian's move to Texas
    Buz, I'll definately have to look that guy up! Kirsten's official job is ECOM which I can't remember what it stands for, but after the 5 years on the job training should be really intresting. Definately need to feel out the aviation community down there and trying to get as many contacts as possible. If he likes sports cars and if my flight tests show some good efficiency/performance gains maybe I can talk him into a Lightning with the speed options. Regardless it's always good to have somebody to help get me in the loop in aviation circles down there. Thanks, Brian W. From: N1BZRich@aol.com Subject: Lightning-List: Brian's move to Texas Brian, When you get to Houston look up Doctor Mike Duncan. He is a NASA flight surgeon and spends some of his time there and some of his time at Star City in Russia taking care of our astronauts. He is a long time friend and at one time had his Pitts and Bonanza in the hangar next to me with my Pitts and Bonanza here at Williamsburg. He has since sold this Pitts and replaced it with a Porsche and a sailboat. Still has the Bonanza. We just had breakfast together the other week and I think he could be talked into a Lightning - as least I had him interested. He also wants a Cub and a helicopter. Those doctors sure have a lot of money. Any way, get in touch with him to get the local "skinny" on aviation in that area and tell him you want a ride in his Bonanza. Tell him to sell the Porsche and get a real sports car - a Corvette. Blue Skies, Buz _________________________________________________________________ Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and more on your Live.com page. http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701


    Message 4


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    Time: 05:41:24 AM PST US
    From: N1BZRich@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Moving on...
    Lynn, Up until about two years ago, I had all of my airplanes insured with AVEMCO. When they opted out of insuring experimentals is when EAA went to Falcon as their "official" insurer. AVEMCO did continue to insure my Pitts since I had been with them for so long, but when I finished the Esqual they did not want to take on any other experimental aircraft. I still have my Cub with AVEMCO as they were much cheaper than Falcon on it. In fact over the years when I had three airplanes insured with AVEMCO they were normally at least a thousand dollars cheaper on the total insurance bill. My M-35 Bonanza was a past Oshkosh and Sun-N-Fun champion and I had it covered for $85K, the J-3 Cub Sport was a past antique champion as well and it was covered for $30K, and the Pitts was covered for $30. AVEMCO at the time had an EAA discount if you were a member, a chapter discount if you were in a local EAA chapter, and a multi-plane discount since you can only fly one at a time. With my flying time the total bill on all three was only around $2500 - a great price. Every few years I would try to get a quote from other companies and, as I said above, the other companies could never come close to AVEMCO's coverages and price. Too bad they don't still do experimentals. Falcon will actually give you two quotes, one with the EAA association benefits, and another without. I think the two numbers actually come from different providers. Remember, Falcon is an agency and look for coverages from other insurers. AVEMCO, on the other hand, is the insurer itself. You can certainly shop around and maybe find experimental coverage cheaper, but the Falcon agents do seem to understand the experimental market and the types of aircraft. Falcon is also the insurer for the American Bonanza Society and the International Aerobatic Club (division of EAA). One other thought on insurance. If possible, talk to others that have had claims with any company you are considering and see how they were treated. Over a period of 15 years or so, I had two bird strikes with the Bonanza. The first one was coming home from Oshkosh - hit a bird on the left nose gear door in the landing pattern in Ohio. The next, many years later, was in my local area and was a seagull hit on the nose bowl. AVEMCO was great in both cases, quick to be sure my airplane was brought back to original condition and that I was happy, and also covering other expenses that I had while it was being fixed. And no, I don't work for AVEMCO. Just a happy customer. Just my $.02, your mileage may vary. Lynn, as to cost to build, I think you can put an Lightning together for somewhere around $55K if you use "round dial" instruments and build it at home. Plan on the ball park figure of $65K if you use the builder assist. The price goes up from these numbers as you upgrade your instrument panel and add things like auto pilot, etc. My panel has all the bells and whistles with a great auto pilot, but it is all experimental equipment. If you go the certified equipment route it is easy to perhaps have more in the panel than you have in the engine/airframe. And remember my airframe has numerous mods that added time and dollars, and a really nice interior. All of these run the overall price up. The standard Lightning kit includes all of the mods that I did, so you are covered there when you buy the kit. (Note: the Lightning kit is at about $10K less than the Esqual kit and already includes all the mods I did to my Esqual.) I have not seen a completed standard Lightning interior (the prototype was basic) but when they finish their demonstrator, that will give you a good idea what the standard kit will include for that. Bottom line, I think the Lightning is the best bang for the buck in experimental aircraft kits that can be built quickly and have the overall performance envelope that it provides. It certainly meets every aspect of its design goals. Blue Skies, Buz


    Message 5


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    Time: 05:56:50 AM PST US
    From: N1BZRich@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Enigma
    In a message dated 1/24/2007 12:23:03 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, punga-iwi@netspace.net.au writes: http://www.lightflying.com.au/ Bill, I could not find the actual size of the Enigma, but I think you would need at least two of them because the display with all the flight, engine, and map data on it looks really crowded. It also seems to have lots of push buttons that can get really hard to hit accurately in "bumpy" air. Often knobs to turn are easier, but maybe you don't need to use the buttons in flight. I would want to see one in operation in order to judge brightness in sun light and display update rate - is it smooth or do you notice a jumpiness in the display while flying. And what is the price, how long has the company been in business, how many have been sold, and are other users happy? Blue Skies, Buz


    Message 6


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    Time: 06:34:49 AM PST US
    From: "Pete" <pete@flylightning.net>
    Subject: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    We have tried three different Dynon units - D10 & D10A - in Lightning and Esquals. We found that none of them would keep up with the aircraft when handled aggressively. Nick would make a low pass down the runway at 200 mph and pull up 30 and bank left 60 degrees and the Dynon showed him in a right turn. Bank the plane quickly from 45 left to 45 right and then back again and the Dynon would turn gray and have to "find" itself again. On the last trip to Sun N Fun Nick was flying along our Jabiru J250 at a constant altitude and the Dynon was showing a descent of several thousand feet and then a climb to a level above our altitude. Our back up altimeter did not do that. The Dynon tech reps had no idea how to fix. We tried many software fixes but did not find a solution. We've given up on Dynon and are exclusively GRT for our own aircraft. Pete _____ From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:14 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Charles, I have not flown the newest Dynon EFIS you describe, but it sounds like the GRT screens with their split screen options - all flight instruments, all engine instruments, or all GPS map, or any combination of the above on each screen. However, I will soon get to fly with the new Dynon as the EAA chapter airplane we are building has the Dynon (price consideration) and I will be making the initial flight in the airplane. At this point, I am sold on the Grand Rapids based on flying it for about 240 hours. I have a dual screen GRT panel. It does it all (with the built in GPS) to include a synthetic approach, terrain awareness, wind, G-meter, etc., etc. It will even do weather like the 396 and 496 if you spend an extra $1500 (less than buying a 396). I will likely do that sometime after Sun-N-Fun. GRT told me at Oshkosh if I would wait until SNF the weather option would also include XM radio. Wow, tunes while on a long cross country. Right now I have a CD player, but XM radio will be great. I have it in my hangar. I looked closely at the Dynon and chose the GRT for several reasons. One very important one, Pete and his guys are much more familiar with GRT having installed many of the units and they work closely with the factory. Dynon sent them several of their units to try, but they seemed to be slower to update - the display seemed to be jumpy in a fast pitch change or fast bank - and the units did not seem nearly as bright out in the sun when I looked at them at Oshkosh. The newer ones may be better, and as I said above, I will be flying behind one in the airplane the chapter built. By the way, all the features you mentioned for the Dynon sound just like the GRT EFIS. Suggest you find someone with each type and fly behind one of each. Or look at both at Sun-N-Fun and/or Oshkosh. Just my $.02 - your mileage may vary. Blue Skies, Buz


    Message 7


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    Time: 07:08:42 AM PST US
    From: "Johnny Thompson" <testpilot@wildblue.net>
    Subject: Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    I am setting up my Lightning for IFR flight but will be used for training and some light IFR to get in or out. GRT EFIS dual w/ internal GPS, fuel flow and fuel pressure. TruTrak Auto pilot Digiflight II VSGV Garman GMA 340 Audio panel w/marker Beacon GTX 330 Transponders w/ Traffic Information SL30 Comm/Nav SL40 Comm I went with Garman because it works with GRT EFIS as also TruTrak. Garman is small, light and low amps. Also used the Approach Fast Stack because I get full Garman warranty and it is much faster to install or remove avionics. Total cost has been around $28,000.+. Still have to get the antennas. Not cheap but I just sold my two Aztecs so will pay for the radios in about a years fuel saving.! The lighting is in build now but am waiting for parts not delivered by Arion to continue the build. Does anyone have pictures of how they mounted the TruTrak servos? Johnny Thompson, Sahuarita Az, 14AZ


    Message 8


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    Time: 07:29:13 AM PST US
    From: N1BZRich@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    Johnny, If you live in sunny Arizona you will not ever need to fly IFR - 3


    Message 9


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    Time: 08:06:33 AM PST US
    From: N1BZRich@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    Johnny, If you live in sunny Arizona you will not ever need to fly IFR - 364 &1/2 days of VFR weather with a 1/2 day dust storm. ;-) Having lived there for many years, I envy you. But to answer your question, I have sent photos of the servo install before directly to individuals, but will send them again if the list will accept that much data. If it does not go through the list, I will send to you directly. Blue Skies, Buz Rich As I was afraid of, file with pictures of servos was too large. I will send to you off list.


    Message 10


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    Time: 08:17:39 AM PST US
    From: "Jim Langley" <pequeajim@gmail.com>
    Subject: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    Buz: I would also like to see your photos as I would be heading in the same direction. Jim! _____ From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Johnny, If you live in sunny Arizona you will not ever need to fly IFR - 364 &1/2 days of VFR weather with a 1/2 day dust storm. ;-) Having lived there for many years, I envy you. But to answer your question, I have sent photos of the servo install before directly to individuals, but will send them again if the list will accept that much data. If it does not go through the list, I will send to you directly. Blue Skies, Buz Rich As I was afraid of, file with pictures of servos was too large. I will send to you off list.


    Message 11


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    Time: 10:15:08 AM PST US
    Subject: Frapper Map
    From: "pequeajim" <pequeajim@gmail.com>
    Here's something that might be useful... For those guys who own, are building, or about to build, the link below will take you to a Frapper map dedicated to Lightning Builders... http://www.frappr.com/?a=constellation_map&mapid=137439272225 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90143#90143


    Message 12


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    Time: 11:20:24 AM PST US
    From: "Pete" <pete@flylightning.net>
    Subject: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    The Grand Rapids actually does more for less. The cost of the Horizon Sport plus internal GPS plus EIS engine monitor is less than $4,000 and includes such things as terrain database, full GPS database, Synthetic GPS approaches, runway extensions, Flight plan, GPS Steering for an autopilot, three different GPS map screens, split screen with flight instruments on left and Map on right. Add the XM receiver and get weather right on the screen. To me it seems like the Dynon is quite expensive for what it does. But - to each his own. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charles Dewey Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:37 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Thanks all for the advice on the Grand Rapids vs Chelton vs. Dynon. I have already bought the Dynon and hope it works out ok. They claim it was used on Space Ship One. As far as I know it is just an artificial horizon and engine monitoring gauges all in one screen. My system only cost like 3500 if I remember correctly. I also have a 496 Garmin and hope to get XM weather through that. Why is the Grand Rapid system so expensive- it said 8900 starting price on the website? --- N1BZRi@aol.com wrote: > Charles, > I have not flown the newest Dynon EFIS you > describe, but it sounds like > the GRT screens with their split screen options - > all flight instruments, all > engine instruments, or all GPS map, or any > combination of the above on each > screen. However, I will soon get to fly with the > new Dynon as the EAA > chapter airplane we are building has the Dynon > (price consideration) and I will be > making the initial flight in the airplane. > At this point, I am sold on the Grand Rapids > based on flying it for > about 240 hours. I have a dual screen GRT panel. > It does it all (with the > built in GPS) to include a synthetic approach, > terrain awareness, wind, G-meter, > etc., etc. It will even do weather like the 396 > and 496 if you spend an > extra $1500 (less than buying a 396). I will > likely do that sometime after > Sun-N-Fun. GRT told me at Oshkosh if I would wait > until SNF the weather option > would also include XM radio. Wow, tunes while on a > long cross country. Right > now I have a CD player, but XM radio will be great. > I have it in my hangar. > I looked closely at the Dynon and chose the GRT for > several reasons. One > very important one, Pete and his guys are much more > familiar with GRT having > installed many of the units and they work closely > with the factory. Dynon > sent them several of their units to try, but they > seemed to be slower to update > - the display seemed to be jumpy in a fast pitch > change or fast bank - and > the units did not seem nearly as bright out in the > sun when I looked at them at > Oshkosh. The newer ones may be better, and as I > said above, I will be > flying behind one in the airplane the chapter built. > By the way, all the features > you mentioned for the Dynon sound just like the GRT > EFIS. Suggest you find > someone with each type and fly behind one of each. > Or look at both at > Sun-N-Fun and/or Oshkosh. > Just my $.02 - your mileage may vary. > Blue Skies, > Buz >


    Message 13


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    Time: 11:42:34 AM PST US
    From: nick otterback <vettin74@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    I have flown the smaller D10A in the lightning prototype and was very unhappy with it ,the unit would not keep up with the aircraft....we are not talking anything extreme either .....and despite numorous calls and shipping it back and forth to dynon the unit would never worked and eventually they told me it was installers error...now i was the installer and i don't have a problem beeing told i did sometheing wrong but the D10A is a plug and play unit it is self contained and other the installing it level there is nothing special about it........so i wonder about customer support? we all have opinions though. nick Charles Dewey <cdewey6969@yahoo.com> wrote: Thanks all for the advice on the Grand Rapids vs Chelton vs. Dynon. I have already bought the Dynon and hope it works out ok. They claim it was used on Space Ship One. As far as I know it is just an artificial horizon and engine monitoring gauges all in one screen. My system only cost like 3500 if I remember correctly. I also have a 496 Garmin and hope to get XM weather through that. Why is the Grand Rapid system so expensive- it said 8900 starting price on the website? --- N1BZRi@aol.com wrote: > Charles, > I have not flown the newest Dynon EFIS you > describe, but it sounds like > the GRT screens with their split screen options - > all flight instruments, all > engine instruments, or all GPS map, or any > combination of the above on each > screen. However, I will soon get to fly with the > new Dynon as the EAA > chapter airplane we are building has the Dynon > (price consideration) and I will be > making the initial flight in the airplane. > At this point, I am sold on the Grand Rapids > based on flying it for > about 240 hours. I have a dual screen GRT panel. > It does it all (with the > built in GPS) to include a synthetic approach, > terrain awareness, wind, G-meter, > etc., etc. It will even do weather like the 396 > and 496 if you spend an > extra $1500 (less than buying a 396). I will > likely do that sometime after > Sun-N-Fun. GRT told me at Oshkosh if I would wait > until SNF the weather option > would also include XM radio. Wow, tunes while on a > long cross country. Right > now I have a CD player, but XM radio will be great. > I have it in my hangar. > I looked closely at the Dynon and chose the GRT for > several reasons. One > very important one, Pete and his guys are much more > familiar with GRT having > installed many of the units and they work closely > with the factory. Dynon > sent them several of their units to try, but they > seemed to be slower to update > - the display seemed to be jumpy in a fast pitch > change or fast bank - and > the units did not seem nearly as bright out in the > sun when I looked at them at > Oshkosh. The newer ones may be better, and as I > said above, I will be > flying behind one in the airplane the chapter built. > By the way, all the features > you mentioned for the Dynon sound just like the GRT > EFIS. Suggest you find > someone with each type and fly behind one of each. > Or look at both at > Sun-N-Fun and/or Oshkosh. > Just my $.02 - your mileage may vary. > Blue Skies, > Buz > --------------------------------- Have a burning question? Go to Yahoo! Answers and get answers from real people who know.


    Message 14


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    Time: 11:52:36 AM PST US
    From: nick otterback <vettin74@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Another sweet flying Lightning
    Tuesday flight in 155LT confirms another great flying Lightning everything check out good and she will be going home to Crossville TN with John on thrusday....The interior from B+B upholstrey is stunning.....All engine systems are working perfectly. all heads under 310 in climb and under 290 in cruise so real good...... oil cooling is great with the scoop from prescott products... Nick Jim Langley <pequeajim@gmail.com> wrote: v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } Buz: I would also like to see your photos as I would be heading in the same direction. Jim! --------------------------------- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Johnny, If you live in sunny Arizona you will not ever need to fly IFR - 364 &1/2 days of VFR weather with a 1/2 day dust storm. ;-) Having lived there for many years, I envy you. But to answer your question, I have sent photos of the servo install before directly to individuals, but will send them again if the list will accept that much data. If it does not go through the list, I will send to you directly. Blue Skies, Buz Rich As I was afraid of, file with pictures of servos was too large. I will send to you off list. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List http://forums.matronics.com --------------------------------- Be a PS3 game guru. Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games.


    Message 15


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    Time: 12:09:17 PM PST US
    From: Charles Dewey <cdewey6969@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    I wish this info was available on Lightning's website prior to ordering my Dynon. This is the first discussion I have seen on avionics. --- Pete <pete@flylightning.net> wrote: > <pete@flylightning.net> > > The Grand Rapids actually does more for less. The > cost of the Horizon Sport > plus internal GPS plus EIS engine monitor is less > than $4,000 and includes > such things as terrain database, full GPS database, > Synthetic GPS > approaches, runway extensions, Flight plan, GPS > Steering for an autopilot, > three different GPS map screens, split screen with > flight instruments on > left and Map on right. Add the XM receiver and get > weather right on the > screen. > > To me it seems like the Dynon is quite expensive for > what it does. But - to > each his own. > > Pete > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] > On Behalf Of Charles > Dewey > Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:37 PM > To: lightning-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning > for IFR > > <cdewey6969@yahoo.com> > > Thanks all for the advice on the Grand Rapids vs > Chelton vs. Dynon. I have already bought the Dynon > and > hope it works out ok. They claim it was used on > Space > Ship One. As far as I know it is just an artificial > horizon and engine monitoring gauges all in one > screen. My system only cost like 3500 if I remember > correctly. I also have a 496 Garmin and hope to get > XM > weather through that. Why is the Grand Rapid system > so > expensive- it said 8900 starting price on the > website? > > > > --- N1BZRi@aol.com wrote: > > > Charles, > > I have not flown the newest Dynon EFIS you > > describe, but it sounds like > > the GRT screens with their split screen options - > > all flight instruments, all > > engine instruments, or all GPS map, or any > > combination of the above on each > > screen. However, I will soon get to fly with the > > new Dynon as the EAA > > chapter airplane we are building has the Dynon > > (price consideration) and I will be > > making the initial flight in the airplane. > > At this point, I am sold on the Grand Rapids > > based on flying it for > > about 240 hours. I have a dual screen GRT > panel. > > It does it all (with the > > built in GPS) to include a synthetic approach, > > terrain awareness, wind, G-meter, > > etc., etc. It will even do weather like the 396 > > and 496 if you spend an > > extra $1500 (less than buying a 396). I will > > likely do that sometime after > > Sun-N-Fun. GRT told me at Oshkosh if I would > wait > > until SNF the weather option > > would also include XM radio. Wow, tunes while on > a > > long cross country. Right > > now I have a CD player, but XM radio will be > great. > > I have it in my hangar. > > I looked closely at the Dynon and chose the GRT > for > > several reasons. One > > very important one, Pete and his guys are much > more > > familiar with GRT having > > installed many of the units and they work closely > > with the factory. Dynon > > sent them several of their units to try, but they > > seemed to be slower to update > > - the display seemed to be jumpy in a fast pitch > > change or fast bank - and > > the units did not seem nearly as bright out in the > > sun when I looked at them at > > Oshkosh. The newer ones may be better, and as I > > said above, I will be > > flying behind one in the airplane the chapter > built. > > By the way, all the features > > you mentioned for the Dynon sound just like the > GRT > > EFIS. Suggest you find > > someone with each type and fly behind one of > each. > > Or look at both at > > Sun-N-Fun and/or Oshkosh. > > Just my $.02 - your mileage may vary. > > Blue Skies, > > Buz > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > browse > Subscriptions page, > FAQ, > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List > > Web Forums! > > > > > Want to start your own business? http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/r-index


    Message 16


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    Time: 01:14:44 PM PST US
    From: "Jim Langley" <pequeajim@gmail.com>
    Subject: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    You know Pete, this is also what I am trying to figure out. I have some awareness of the different systems, but not enough to make an educated decision of what to put in the panel. Although I'm not looking for a Swiss Army Knife, I would think the unit would need to have at least the following advantages: - Strong software support without having to pay a yearly maintenance fee. - Bright display - Multi-pane screen - Ease of use - Mixed engine and flight functions Those are just some thoughts... -----Original Message----- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pete Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:20 PM Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR The Grand Rapids actually does more for less. The cost of the Horizon Sport plus internal GPS plus EIS engine monitor is less than $4,000 and includes such things as terrain database, full GPS database, Synthetic GPS approaches, runway extensions, Flight plan, GPS Steering for an autopilot, three different GPS map screens, split screen with flight instruments on left and Map on right. Add the XM receiver and get weather right on the screen. To me it seems like the Dynon is quite expensive for what it does. But - to each his own. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charles Dewey Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:37 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Thanks all for the advice on the Grand Rapids vs Chelton vs. Dynon. I have already bought the Dynon and hope it works out ok. They claim it was used on Space Ship One. As far as I know it is just an artificial horizon and engine monitoring gauges all in one screen. My system only cost like 3500 if I remember correctly. I also have a 496 Garmin and hope to get XM weather through that. Why is the Grand Rapid system so expensive- it said 8900 starting price on the website? --- N1BZRi@aol.com wrote: > Charles, > I have not flown the newest Dynon EFIS you > describe, but it sounds like > the GRT screens with their split screen options - > all flight instruments, all > engine instruments, or all GPS map, or any > combination of the above on each > screen. However, I will soon get to fly with the > new Dynon as the EAA > chapter airplane we are building has the Dynon > (price consideration) and I will be > making the initial flight in the airplane. > At this point, I am sold on the Grand Rapids > based on flying it for > about 240 hours. I have a dual screen GRT panel. > It does it all (with the > built in GPS) to include a synthetic approach, > terrain awareness, wind, G-meter, > etc., etc. It will even do weather like the 396 > and 496 if you spend an > extra $1500 (less than buying a 396). I will > likely do that sometime after > Sun-N-Fun. GRT told me at Oshkosh if I would wait > until SNF the weather option > would also include XM radio. Wow, tunes while on a > long cross country. Right > now I have a CD player, but XM radio will be great. > I have it in my hangar. > I looked closely at the Dynon and chose the GRT for > several reasons. One > very important one, Pete and his guys are much more > familiar with GRT having > installed many of the units and they work closely > with the factory. Dynon > sent them several of their units to try, but they > seemed to be slower to update > - the display seemed to be jumpy in a fast pitch > change or fast bank - and > the units did not seem nearly as bright out in the > sun when I looked at them at > Oshkosh. The newer ones may be better, and as I > said above, I will be > flying behind one in the airplane the chapter built. > By the way, all the features > you mentioned for the Dynon sound just like the GRT > EFIS. Suggest you find > someone with each type and fly behind one of each. > Or look at both at > Sun-N-Fun and/or Oshkosh. > Just my $.02 - your mileage may vary. > Blue Skies, > Buz >


    Message 17


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    Time: 01:17:56 PM PST US
    From: "Jim Langley" <pequeajim@gmail.com>
    Subject: Another sweet flying Lightning
    Nick/Pete: Are you guys going to put some pictures up on the site of the completion? I for one would like to see the interior. _____ From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of nick otterback Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:52 PM Subject: Lightning-List: Another sweet flying Lightning Tuesday flight in 155LT confirms another great flying Lightning everything check out good and she will be going home to Crossville TN with John on thrusday....The interior from B+B upholstrey is stunning.....All engine systems are working perfectly. all heads under 310 in climb and under 290 in cruise so real good...... oil cooling is great with the scoop from prescott products... Nick Jim Langley <pequeajim@gmail.com> wrote: Buz: I would also like to see your photos as I would be heading in the same direction. Jim! _____ From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Johnny, If you live in sunny Arizona you will not ever need to fly IFR - 364 &1/2 days of VFR weather with a 1/2 day dust storm. ;-) Having lived there for many years, I envy you. But to answer your question, I have sent photos of the servo install before directly to individuals, but will send them again if the list will accept that much data. If it does not go through the list, I will send to you directly. Blue Skies, Buz Rich As I was afraid of, file with pictures of servos was too large. I will send to you off list. the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games.


    Message 18


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    Time: 01:37:21 PM PST US
    From: Daniel Vandenberg <djvdb63@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Another sweet flying Lightning
    I second the motion...please post photo's of the new interior, upholstery, etc. Thanks. Dan Jim Langley <pequeajim@gmail.com> wrote: v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } Nick/Pete: Are you guys going to put some pictures up on the site of the completion? I for one would like to see the interior. --------------------------------- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of nick otterback Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:52 PM To: lightning-list@matronics.com Subject: Lightning-List: Another sweet flying Lightning Tuesday flight in 155LT confirms another great flying Lightning everything check out good and she will be going home to Crossville TN with John on thrusday....The interior from B+B upholstrey is stunning.....All engine systems are working perfectly. all heads under 310 in climb and under 290 in cruise so real good...... oil cooling is great with the scoop from prescott products... Nick Jim Langley <pequeajim@gmail.com> wrote: Buz: I would also like to see your photos as I would be heading in the same direction. Jim! --------------------------------- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 11:06 AM To: lightning-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Johnny, If you live in sunny Arizona you will not ever need to fly IFR - 364 &1/2 days of VFR weather with a 1/2 day dust storm. ;-) Having lived there for many years, I envy you. But to answer your question, I have sent photos of the servo install before directly to individuals, but will send them again if the list will accept that much data. If it does not go through the list, I will send to you directly. Blue Skies, Buz Rich As I was afraid of, file with pictures of servos was too large. I will send to you off list. the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games. --------------------------------- No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.


    Message 19


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    Time: 02:04:14 PM PST US
    From: IFLYSMODEL@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    Hey Pete: I agree that your answer sounds great. However, I just checked the Grand Rapids site, and apparently the prices have drastically changed. The Sport does not appear to be offered any more, (they are working hard to fill back orders) and the new one that does everything is 8995. Do you have an in with someone to order the stuff at a lesser price? Lynn Nelsen (Lightning Wannabee)


    Message 20


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    Time: 02:31:45 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics
    Ask and ye shall recieve: These are pics of the John Davis bird. Just took them today. This is the latest flier. I'll give you the phototour of the cockpits and planes in future emails, but this is the first installment. Love the stick grips! The interior matches the paint of the aircraft. This interior is actually pretty different than the Hobbs plane which was all cloth and kind of different shaped. That plane was more like the prototype interior. Enjoy. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ Get Hilary Duffs homepage with her photos, music, and more. http://celebrities.live.com


    Message 21


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    Time: 02:42:24 PM PST US
    From: IFLYSMODEL@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics
    Thanks for the pictures Brian. Is John's airplane being put together under the light sport rule? If so, did it all work out? I am interested in doing the same thing. Lynn


    Message 22


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    Time: 02:46:55 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics
    Lynn, John's plane is in compliance with the light sport rule. That's why there's no gear leg fairings or wheelpants. It's headed home this week and I haven't asked Nick, but I think that everything worked out fine speedwise. _________________________________________________________________ Invite your Hotmail contacts to join your friends list with Windows Live Spaces


    Message 23


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    Time: 02:56:25 PM PST US
    From: Daniel Vandenberg <djvdb63@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics
    Brian... Thanks for the pix. This is the kind of thing Arion needs to put forth for those of us considering the Lightning. When you get around to it I'd like some clear views of the finished baggage area (particularly the floor behind the seats) of 155LT. Also...the Lightning with yellow trim waaaaay in the back of the third photo looks like it just might be a beauty. Dan Brian Whittingham <dashvii@hotmail.com> wrote: Ask and ye shall recieve: These are pics of the John Davis bird. Just took them today. This is the latest flier. I'll give you the phototour of the cockpits and planes in future emails, but this is the first installment. Love the stick grips! The interior matches the paint of the aircraft. This interior is actually pretty different than the Hobbs plane which was all cloth and kind of different shaped. That plane was more like the prototype interior. Enjoy. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ Get Hilary Duffs homepage with her photos, music, and more. http://celebrities.live.com --------------------------------- Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question on Yahoo! Answers.


    Message 24


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    Time: 03:01:00 PM PST US
    From: "Pete" <pete@flylightning.net>
    Subject: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    The Sport is available. Lead times are getting shorter. Pricing is t http://www.grtavionics.com/documents/EFIS%20Flyer%20Sun%20n%20Fun%202006.pdf I agree that Greg needs to spend more time on the site but believe me - a great deal of effort is going into the Sport EFIS. Soon it will be able to interface with a Garmin 330 transponder to display traffic as well as weather, terrain, and GPS. We sell a lot of dual Sport installations. Dual Sport with GPS and engine monitoring is $6200.00. Pete _____ From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of IFLYSMODEL@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 4:04 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Equipping a Lightning for IFR Hey Pete: I agree that your answer sounds great. However, I just checked the Grand Rapids site, and apparently the prices have drastically changed. The Sport does not appear to be offered any more, (they are working hard to fill back orders) and the new one that does everything is 8995. Do you have an in with someone to order the stuff at a lesser price? Lynn Nelsen (Lightning Wannabee)


    Message 25


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    Time: 03:09:50 PM PST US
    From: "Pete" <pete@flylightning.net>
    Subject: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics
    I realize that we need more photos and info on the web site. I will get it done before too long but please realize that everyone involved with the Lightning project has been working long hours to get the aircraft and kit finalized and we just haven't had the time or energy to keep the site more up to date. Pete -----Original Message----- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Whittingham Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 4:47 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics <dashvii@hotmail.com> Lynn, John's plane is in compliance with the light sport rule. That's why there's no gear leg fairings or wheelpants. It's headed home this week and I haven't asked Nick, but I think that everything worked out fine speedwise. _________________________________________________________________ Invite your Hotmail contacts to join your friends list with Windows Live Spaces


    Message 26


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    Time: 03:28:13 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Lightning exterior pics
    Here's a few more pics. I can get you some baggage views, but probably of a different Lightning as that one might be gone. I also forgot to get a pic of the outside and inside of Duane Sorensons airplane. I also didn't get one that I can find of Earl's airplane. Here's some pics of completed and partly completed planes: Pic # 1: This is a picture that I photoshopped and hung on the wall of the FBO with all the info, the logo, the plane. I also did one of the Jabiru aircraft in the terminal. The plane is 233AL which is the prototype Pic # 2: This is not a Lightning at all, but in a way it was the first prototype. This is the "Frankensqual" N424EA, which is an Esqual body with an old 80hp Jabiru 4 cylinder on it and a much heavier, but same airfoil as on the Lightning. Handling was a little tricky, but this plane would do 160mph all out! The lines are similar to the Lightning, but trust me the Lightning is an all new design and they fly very differently. Pic # 3: N430GH, the second lightning flying. This is Greg Hobb's machine. He is the west coast distributor. This is what a soutwest style scheme for the Lightning logo might look like. Gregg's from Tucson. Pic #4: N396JC, this is Larry Joe Cooper's plane, it's wingless, but looking really nice already! Kind of reminds me of Buz's paint scheme only hunter green and silver instead of green and gold. Pic #5: N5622GH, This is Rick Bowen's plane, another favorite paint scheme of mine. Should be flying in February timeframe Pic #6: N59JL, This is Linda Mathia's airplane. Kind of a similar paint scheme to the prototype. I met Linda today, nice lady, pretty impressive cockpit layout. Pic #7: Finally, N31BZ, this is Buz's hybrid Esqual with many Lightning enhancements. He already posted panel pics, but this is the plane. Love the paint scheme. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ something more.


    Message 27


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    Time: 03:45:06 PM PST US
    From: "Jim Langley" <pequeajim@gmail.com>
    Subject: Lightning exterior pics
    Thanks Brian for posting all the pics. I'm getting really excited! I spoke with Ryan today, (Green Landings), and will be going back down there in a couple of weeks to try out his aircraft. That just might seal the deal for me! -----Original Message----- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Whittingham Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 6:28 PM Subject: Lightning-List: Lightning exterior pics Here's a few more pics. I can get you some baggage views, but probably of a different Lightning as that one might be gone. I also forgot to get a pic of the outside and inside of Duane Sorensons airplane. I also didn't get one that I can find of Earl's airplane. Here's some pics of completed and partly completed planes: Pic # 1: This is a picture that I photoshopped and hung on the wall of the FBO with all the info, the logo, the plane. I also did one of the Jabiru aircraft in the terminal. The plane is 233AL which is the prototype Pic # 2: This is not a Lightning at all, but in a way it was the first prototype. This is the "Frankensqual" N424EA, which is an Esqual body with an old 80hp Jabiru 4 cylinder on it and a much heavier, but same airfoil as on the Lightning. Handling was a little tricky, but this plane would do 160mph all out! The lines are similar to the Lightning, but trust me the Lightning is an all new design and they fly very differently. Pic # 3: N430GH, the second lightning flying. This is Greg Hobb's machine. He is the west coast distributor. This is what a soutwest style scheme for the Lightning logo might look like. Gregg's from Tucson. Pic #4: N396JC, this is Larry Joe Cooper's plane, it's wingless, but looking really nice already! Kind of reminds me of Buz's paint scheme only hunter green and silver instead of green and gold. Pic #5: N5622GH, This is Rick Bowen's plane, another favorite paint scheme of mine. Should be flying in February timeframe Pic #6: N59JL, This is Linda Mathia's airplane. Kind of a similar paint scheme to the prototype. I met Linda today, nice lady, pretty impressive cockpit layout. Pic #7: Finally, N31BZ, this is Buz's hybrid Esqual with many Lightning enhancements. He already posted panel pics, but this is the plane. Love the paint scheme. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ something more.


    Message 28


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    Time: 03:46:46 PM PST US
    From: IFLYSMODEL@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Equipping a Lightning for IFR
    Thanks Pete: That is great info. I've got to get up to Shelbyville and nose around. If I can get a demo flight and determine that the Lightning meets my needs, I hope to sell my Bonanza and move to the Lightning crowd. That dual Sport with engine monitoring and GPS sounds great. Were you at the Light Sport Expo? Do you have any sort of sun shade for those of us in the Florida (or other hot/sunny climate). I fly an Ercoupe a lot, and it is great with the windows open/down. But it is a 60 year old airplane and does not fill all my requirements. Lynn Nelsen


    Message 29


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    Time: 03:50:29 PM PST US
    From: Daniel Vandenberg <djvdb63@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Lightning exterior pics
    Allright, Brian...now Pete owes you something because you are doing his marketing for him! Thanks for the photo's. I look forward to more detail shots when you get the time. Dan Brian Whittingham <dashvii@hotmail.com> wrote: Here's a few more pics. I can get you some baggage views, but probably of a different Lightning as that one might be gone. I also forgot to get a pic of the outside and inside of Duane Sorensons airplane. I also didn't get one that I can find of Earl's airplane. Here's some pics of completed and partly completed planes: Pic # 1: This is a picture that I photoshopped and hung on the wall of the FBO with all the info, the logo, the plane. I also did one of the Jabiru aircraft in the terminal. The plane is 233AL which is the prototype Pic # 2: This is not a Lightning at all, but in a way it was the first prototype. This is the "Frankensqual" N424EA, which is an Esqual body with an old 80hp Jabiru 4 cylinder on it and a much heavier, but same airfoil as on the Lightning. Handling was a little tricky, but this plane would do 160mph all out! The lines are similar to the Lightning, but trust me the Lightning is an all new design and they fly very differently. Pic # 3: N430GH, the second lightning flying. This is Greg Hobb's machine. He is the west coast distributor. This is what a soutwest style scheme for the Lightning logo might look like. Gregg's from Tucson. Pic #4: N396JC, this is Larry Joe Cooper's plane, it's wingless, but looking really nice already! Kind of reminds me of Buz's paint scheme only hunter green and silver instead of green and gold. Pic #5: N5622GH, This is Rick Bowen's plane, another favorite paint scheme of mine. Should be flying in February timeframe Pic #6: N59JL, This is Linda Mathia's airplane. Kind of a similar paint scheme to the prototype. I met Linda today, nice lady, pretty impressive cockpit layout. Pic #7: Finally, N31BZ, this is Buz's hybrid Esqual with many Lightning enhancements. He already posted panel pics, but this is the plane. Love the paint scheme. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ something more. ---------------------------------


    Message 30


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    Time: 04:04:42 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Lightning Cockpit Photos
    Here's some cockpit photos: Pic 1: Gregg's cockpit with GRT EFIS and Lowrance 3000 GPS Pic 2: Mr. Davis's cockpit again, dual GRT EFIS, an autopilot, and a Garmain 396/496? docking port Pic 3: Mr. Cooper's plane Dual GRT EFIS displays I believe the radio and transponder are called Microair or something like that. I was a little worried about range because of their size, but they work beautifully Pic 4: This is Mr. Bowen's cockpit, singl GRT EFIS Pic 5: This was actually an old Esqual panel, but it is the Blue Mountain EFIS with Garmin radios. I think this could work in a Lightning, but the panel is put together and wired elsewhere and the guys at SYI specialize in the GRT, not the Blue Mountain system, so it could be harder if the Blue Mountain guys wired something wrong Pic 6: This is AL, the prototype panel. Steam gauges with an EIS. I am going to put a appareo data recorder in the plane when I do my testing. I'll still do the old pencil and paper routine, and will also video and audio record it. This device allows us to go view any performance variable in a 3D environment and refly it in realtime when we get back on the ground. It has an embeded GPS that is WAAS enabled to really give accurate readings. Pic 7: This is Linda's panel. Dual Chelton EFIS, Garmin radios, and steam gauge backups. Very pilot friendly layout there, real human factors type of stuff there. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline


    Message 31


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    Time: 04:28:34 PM PST US
    From: "Jim Langley" <pequeajim@gmail.com>
    Subject: Lightning Cockpit Photos
    Brian: It looks like the Esqual had a tube type of hinge for the canopy and the Lightning uses flat steel? Why did they get away from that? -----Original Message----- From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Whittingham Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 7:05 PM Subject: Lightning-List: Lightning Cockpit Photos Here's some cockpit photos: Pic 1: Gregg's cockpit with GRT EFIS and Lowrance 3000 GPS Pic 2: Mr. Davis's cockpit again, dual GRT EFIS, an autopilot, and a Garmain 396/496? docking port Pic 3: Mr. Cooper's plane Dual GRT EFIS displays I believe the radio and transponder are called Microair or something like that. I was a little worried about range because of their size, but they work beautifully Pic 4: This is Mr. Bowen's cockpit, singl GRT EFIS Pic 5: This was actually an old Esqual panel, but it is the Blue Mountain EFIS with Garmin radios. I think this could work in a Lightning, but the panel is put together and wired elsewhere and the guys at SYI specialize in the GRT, not the Blue Mountain system, so it could be harder if the Blue Mountain guys wired something wrong Pic 6: This is AL, the prototype panel. Steam gauges with an EIS. I am going to put a appareo data recorder in the plane when I do my testing. I'll still do the old pencil and paper routine, and will also video and audio record it. This device allows us to go view any performance variable in a 3D environment and refly it in realtime when we get back on the ground. It has an embeded GPS that is WAAS enabled to really give accurate readings. Pic 7: This is Linda's panel. Dual Chelton EFIS, Garmin radios, and steam gauge backups. Very pilot friendly layout there, real human factors type of stuff there. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ Valentine's Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcod e=wlmtagline


    Message 32


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    Time: 04:32:50 PM PST US
    From: Kayberg@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: November One Five Five Lima Tango Pics
    In a message dated 1/24/2007 5:34:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, dashvii@hotmail.com writes: These are pics of the John Davis bird. Just took them today. This is the latest flier. I'll give you the phototour of the cockpits and planes in future emails, but this is the first installment. Love the stick grips! The interior matches the paint of the aircraft. This interior is actually pretty different than the Hobbs plane which was all cloth and kind of different shaped. That plane was more like the prototype interior. Enjoy. Brian W. Flew today? Did the prop fall off? :) Doug


    Message 33


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    Time: 04:38:39 PM PST US
    From: Laurie Hoffman <lozhoffman@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Microair
    Brian, Microair radios and transponders are produced in the same city of Bundaberg, Queensland here in Oz as Jabiru. We have used the M760 radio for a few years now and its been excellent. Laurie --- Brian Whittingham <dashvii@hotmail.com> wrote: > Here's some cockpit photos: > > Pic 1: Gregg's cockpit with GRT EFIS and Lowrance > 3000 GPS > > Pic 2: Mr. Davis's cockpit again, dual GRT EFIS, an > autopilot, and a > Garmain 396/496? docking port > > Pic 3: Mr. Cooper's plane Dual GRT EFIS displays I > believe the radio and > transponder are called Microair or something like > that. I was a little > worried about range because of their size, but they > work beautifully > > Pic 4: This is Mr. Bowen's cockpit, singl GRT EFIS > > Pic 5: This was actually an old Esqual panel, but > it is the Blue Mountain > EFIS with Garmin radios. I think this could work in > a Lightning, but the > panel is put together and wired elsewhere and the > guys at SYI specialize in > the GRT, not the Blue Mountain system, so it could > be harder if the Blue > Mountain guys wired something wrong > > Pic 6: This is AL, the prototype panel. Steam > gauges with an EIS. I am > going to put a appareo data recorder in the plane > when I do my testing. > I'll still do the old pencil and paper routine, and > will also video and > audio record it. This device allows us to go view > any performance variable > in a 3D environment and refly it in realtime when we > get back on the ground. > It has an embeded GPS that is WAAS enabled to > really give accurate > readings. > > Pic 7: This is Linda's panel. Dual Chelton EFIS, > Garmin radios, and steam > gauge backups. Very pilot friendly layout there, > real human factors type of > stuff there. > > Brian W. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E > at MSN Shopping > http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline > The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php


    Message 34


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    Time: 04:53:53 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Lightning Cockpit Photos
    Jim, You're right, the Esqual had a tube type and the Lightning is more of a flat piece. I believe that the Lightning canopy is a thicker cast. So it would make sense that it was heavier. The Lightning hinges are spread out further to help support the weight and they're assisted by little hydraulic spring type of things like in the rear hatch of my Firebird. I believe this is actually a stronger arrangement. It saves room when folding the canopy down which allows for more space behind the panel. Also the Esqual would hit you in the head if you didn't watch it, the Lightning holds the canopy up. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ something more.


    Message 35


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    Time: 04:57:01 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Lightning exterior pics
    Dan, Sure thing. Any other shots that the list would be interested in seeing more detail of. Usually I see them wrapped up as I've never built a plane myself, but I do have access and can probably update quicker than Pete and his group (they really are extremely busy and there are a lot more people working there now than just a year ago, but that's a good sign) and reach the folks that are really interested better by posting them here. Brian W. From: Daniel Vandenberg <djvdb63@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Lightning exterior pics Allright, Brian...now Pete owes you something because you are doing his marketing for him! Thanks for the photo's. I look forward to more detail shots when you get the time. Dan Brian Whittingham <dashvii@hotmail.com> wrote: Here's a few more pics. I can get you some baggage views, but probably of a different Lightning as that one might be gone. I also forgot to get a pic of the outside and inside of Duane Sorensons airplane. I also didn't get one that I can find of Earl's airplane. Here's some pics of completed and partly completed planes: Pic # 1: This is a picture that I photoshopped and hung on the wall of the FBO with all the info, the logo, the plane. I also did one of the Jabiru aircraft in the terminal. The plane is 233AL which is the prototype Pic # 2: This is not a Lightning at all, but in a way it was the first prototype. This is the "Frankensqual" N424EA, which is an Esqual body with an old 80hp Jabiru 4 cylinder on it and a much heavier, but same airfoil as on the Lightning. Handling was a little tricky, but this plane would do 160mph all out! The lines are similar to the Lightning, but trust me the Lightning is an all new design and they fly very differently. Pic # 3: N430GH, the second lightning flying. This is Greg Hobb's machine. He is the west coast distributor. This is what a soutwest style scheme for the Lightning logo might look like. Gregg's from Tucson. Pic #4: N396JC, this is Larry Joe Cooper's plane, it's wingless, but looking really nice already! Kind of reminds me of Buz's paint scheme only hunter green and silver instead of green and gold. Pic #5: N5622GH, This is Rick Bowen's plane, another favorite paint scheme of mine. Should be flying in February timeframe Pic #6: N59JL, This is Linda Mathia's airplane. Kind of a similar paint scheme to the prototype. I met Linda today, nice lady, pretty impressive cockpit layout. Pic #7: Finally, N31BZ, this is Buz's hybrid Esqual with many Lightning enhancements. He already posted panel pics, but this is the plane. Love the paint scheme. Brian W. _________________________________________________________________ something more. --------------------------------- _________________________________________________________________ Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline


    Message 36


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    Time: 05:05:24 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Microair
    Laurie, I didn't realize that it was an Aussie product. I will say that first time I saw that I thought it was a toy, but had no problems flying locally and then flying out to Tucson we were picking up some ATIS reports from 50 miles away or so!? The Cherokee 140 with radios that are more massive than two or three modern garmin variety at the airport won't do that! First time that I saw a Jabiru I thought, now that looks like a futuristic version of a Cessna. Then I saw those fly and wow, I haven't ever seen anything with a small engine climb like that and takeoff in such short space. I loved the sound of that engine and the look of it too! So I first flew the Jabirus. That was my first experimental aircraft. Then I flew the Hybrid Esqaul Lightning and then they turned me loose in a normal Esqual which is a fun airplane. I figured that if I stuck around I'd get to fly the Lightning but Greg Hobbs made that dream come true quicker than I thought. The Lightning is so much more refined in feel, performance, and even looks when you compare them side by side. So I got my time in the Lightning there. I have a couple of more owners who want me to fly some of the first hours off their planes when done lined up and pitched the speed mod idea to Pete and Nick. Hoping to start on the actual flying on that soon. Still have a week to get my gizmo in though. Those Aussies make some good planes and radios and engines! The Arion guys really put some experience and good and relatively inexpensive products together to come up with a great plane. Thanks for the info. Brian W. From: Laurie Hoffman <lozhoffman@yahoo.com> Subject: Lightning-List: Re: Microair Brian, Microair radios and transponders are produced in the same city of Bundaberg, Queensland here in Oz as Jabiru. We have used the M760 radio for a few years now and its been excellent. Laurie --- Brian Whittingham <dashvii@hotmail.com> wrote: > Here's some cockpit photos: > > Pic 1: Gregg's cockpit with GRT EFIS and Lowrance > 3000 GPS > > Pic 2: Mr. Davis's cockpit again, dual GRT EFIS, an > autopilot, and a > Garmain 396/496? docking port > > Pic 3: Mr. Cooper's plane Dual GRT EFIS displays I > believe the radio and > transponder are called Microair or something like > that. I was a little > worried about range because of their size, but they > work beautifully > > Pic 4: This is Mr. Bowen's cockpit, singl GRT EFIS > > Pic 5: This was actually an old Esqual panel, but > it is the Blue Mountain > EFIS with Garmin radios. I think this could work in > a Lightning, but the > panel is put together and wired elsewhere and the > guys at SYI specialize in > the GRT, not the Blue Mountain system, so it could > be harder if the Blue > Mountain guys wired something wrong > > Pic 6: This is AL, the prototype panel. Steam > gauges with an EIS. I am > going to put a appareo data recorder in the plane > when I do my testing. > I'll still do the old pencil and paper routine, and > will also video and > audio record it. This device allows us to go view > any performance variable > in a 3D environment and refly it in realtime when we > get back on the ground. > It has an embeded GPS that is WAAS enabled to > really give accurate > readings. > > Pic 7: This is Linda's panel. Dual Chelton EFIS, > Garmin radios, and steam > gauge backups. Very pilot friendly layout there, > real human factors type of > stuff there. > > Brian W. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E > at MSN Shopping > http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline > The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php _________________________________________________________________ Invite your Hotmail contacts to join your friends list with Windows Live Spaces


    Message 37


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    Time: 07:08:29 PM PST US
    From: "Mark Stauffer" <mark.stauffer1@gmail.com>
    Subject: Lightning Cockpit Photos **Correction**
    Brian and others, The plane and panel identified as Rick Bowen's is actually Larry Mitchell's Esqual. I just wanted to clear that up before Rick has a heart attack thinking we re-painted his plane and took his panel!! Rick actually has a beautiful burgundy and black cherry paint scheme. If I get the chance I'll take a picture tomorrow and post it. Mark Mark Stauffer Arion Aircraft Builders Assist Program




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