Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:41 AM - Re: Aviating in Virginia (rickss)
2. 04:54 AM - Re: Panel #3 (Kayberg@AOL.COM)
3. 05:21 AM - Re: Re: condition inspection (Kayberg@AOL.COM)
4. 05:34 AM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Kayberg@AOL.COM)
5. 06:50 AM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (nick otterback)
6. 07:05 AM - Re: Lightning World Record (nick otterback)
7. 08:01 AM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (N1BZRich@aol.com)
8. 08:31 AM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Brian Whittingham)
9. 03:04 PM - Re: Panel #3 (Jim Langley)
10. 03:08 PM - Re: Lightning World Record (Jim Langley)
11. 03:12 PM - Re: Re: Aviating in Virginia (Jim Langley)
12. 03:52 PM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Kayberg@AOL.COM)
13. 03:59 PM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Kayberg@aol.com)
14. 04:07 PM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Kayberg@AOL.COM)
15. 04:28 PM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Rick Bowen)
16. 06:14 PM - Fire Protection (Jim Langley)
17. 06:34 PM - Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit (Laurie Hoffman)
18. 06:54 PM - Taildraggers forever....... (Rick Bowen)
19. 07:31 PM - Re: Taildraggers forever....... (Brian Whittingham)
20. 07:42 PM - Re: Taildraggers forever....... (Rick Bowen)
21. 07:50 PM - My wife's aircraft (Brian Whittingham)
22. 08:48 PM - Re: Flying to Mexico in the Lightning (Charles Dewey)
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| Subject: | Re: Aviating in Virginia |
Thanks guys, I just might do that. Lets see what the weather does.
--------
Cherokee driver, but feeling the need for speed!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=128429#128429
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In a message dated 8/9/2007 9:00:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
pequeajim@gmail.com writes:
Up for comments... Here=99s another preliminary stab at a panel for
my
Lightning.
I am on the waiting list for the Odyssey, (panel on left side),. I have no
t
purchased the Enigma, (or right). I=99m not quite sure what all I a
m going
to do with that panel space. I will probably fly with it blank for starter
s,
then decide if I want anything more than a glove box over there.
If I use both displays, they can interact in real time and either can
function as an EFIS, or GPS. This will give me a backup EFIS. MG Avionics
is
coming out with a slave unit for the Odyssey next year that is much lower i
n
price than the Enigma, but can provide me with the dual display setup that
I
would get with the Enigma.
As usual, comments are welcome.
This may reveal my ignorance, but Why do you have a "whisky compass" in th
e
panel?
The EFIS (either one) have built in compass which should satisfy the VFR
reg. The one you show in the panel is completly worthless because of
electrical interferance, not to mention they are worthless to start with if
the air is
rough.
Practically, if I were concerned with a total failure of the panel, I would
carry a handheld GPS for heading information, not try to fly a whisky.
doug koenigsberg
t
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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| Subject: | Re: condition inspection |
In a message dated 8/9/2007 9:49:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
empire.john@gmail.com writes:
I do agree with your conclusion, however, that it is better to build than
to buy.
Doug Koenigsberg
> [b]
Actually this is from 2 A&Ps from 2 different forums [Canardavaition and
VAF]. On VAF they guy told me he charges around 750 and cited another name that
charges $1,000 [both specifically for RVs and both are EAA counselors and
DARs]. The canard guy actually said 2-3k for the initial condition inspection
[~40 hours @ $75/hr] and then something north of $1k after that.
What have been your personal experiences?
thanks
John
Most of my personal experiences are vicarious. My conclusion, however, is
that certified mechanics are not a monolitic bunch.
We had an A & P who would come to Green Landings and do annual condition
inspections of ultra-light type, (Rans, SkyRanger) planes in about an hour and
charged $300-400, if he could see all the fittings. He took the owner's word
about the engine condition and the wheel bearings. He was very highly
experienced, both as a mechanic and pilot ( former airlines). He flew in,
inspected a couple planes, gave a couple BFR's and left. He was a bit sloppy,
but
cheap.
You mention a couple cases above. I have heard that of that type also.
To spend 40 hours doing a condition inspection on a Rutan type canard is just
anal. Especially if it has been flying. However, it is not a bad idea to
have that anal guy do your plane once every 5 years or so just for peace of
mind. If he says it is airworthy after 40 hours of work; it probably is!
One other consideration is your own mechanical expertise. If you built a
plane, you should be able to inspect it. If you have NEVER built a plane, or
overhauled a car engine, welded, assembled something other than a bicycle,
then a good inspector is worth whatever. If you already know everything about
your plane, then to pay $ to have someone inspect what you already know to b
e correct, is annoying.
The DAR we use at Green Landings told me about a recent airworthyness he did
for an engineer-type. The builder acted like it was an insult that such an
inspection should be performed. The DAR checked what he wanted anyway and
got to a fuel system check. "Turn on the boost pump" he told the owner. "Now
come and look" he said. A fitting in the fuel system was loose and a fine
mist of fuel was spraying directly on the exhaust pipe! "This is why we do
inspections!" said my DAR to the builder.
doug
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
In a message dated 8/9/2007 10:08:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
N1BZRich@aol.com writes:
Well, this next part is "TOP SECTET" from the Lightning "Skunk works": -
there is even more room for even more fuel for when Nick gets the time to
complete the design of the ULS model. No that is not an ultralight lightning
sport, it is the "Ultimate Lightning Storm" model that will be turbo prop
powered, with clipped wings and in the tail dragger configuration.
I was looking at Jim's Lightning build yesterday. It is sitting on the main
gear without the engine, tail on the ground.
It would appear that the forward visibility is near zero! Because of the
long nose of a Lightning, when the tail is lowered it blocks the forward view
considerably. If you flare a tri-gear hard now, you cant see for a second
or so and the tail is not that close to the ground.
Perhaps the insurance company would require a checkout in the Nemesis or
Pitts before insuring a turbine taildragger.
doug
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
we will be installing a pen cam in the chin of the cowl and adapt it to the EFIS
screen to have a video referance during landing...
nick
Kayberg@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 8/9/2007 10:08:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, N1BZRich@aol.com
writes:
Well, this next part is "TOP SECTET" from the Lightning "Skunk works": - there
is even more room for even more fuel for when Nick gets the time to complete
the design of the ULS model. No that is not an ultralight lightning sport,
it is the "Ultimate Lightning Storm" model that will be turbo prop powered, with
clipped wings and in the tail dragger configuration.
I was looking at Jim's Lightning build yesterday. It is sitting on the main
gear without the engine, tail on the ground.
It would appear that the forward visibility is near zero! Because of the long
nose of a Lightning, when the tail is lowered it blocks the forward view considerably.
If you flare a tri-gear hard now, you cant see for a second or
so and the tail is not that close to the ground.
Perhaps the insurance company would require a checkout in the Nemesis or Pitts
before insuring a turbine taildragger.
doug
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning World Record |
Mark and i have set the date...but now i have to find it again....
Nick
N1BZRich@aol.com wrote:
Way to go Earl and Seventeen Echo Fox. You have accomplished something
that very few people would even attempt to try and even fewer would have hung
in there to finish the task with the weather and other delays you experienced.
Congratulations, good buddy. Now if I might be so bold to suggest something
- I suggest you put together a presentation on your world record flight (power
point? covering the rules, preparation, flight planning, actual flight, and
possible lessons learned) and show it at the Lightning Fly-In whenever that
takes place. Hopefully this September in SYI, although I have not heard yet
as to the dates of that extravaganza. Hint - hint - to the SYI team - is it a
go?
Good on ya, Earl.
Blue Skies,
Buz
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha!
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
In a message dated 8/10/2007 8:35:36 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
Kayberg@AOL.COM writes:
Because of the long nose of a Lightning, when the tail is lowered it blocks
the forward view considerably. If you flare a tri-gear hard now, you
cant see for a second or so and the tail is not that close to the ground.
Doug,
You mentioned landing a Pitts, and yes on final, unless you throw in a
slip, not only does the runway disappear, but the entire airport disappears.
( I sure do miss my Pitts and all the exciting landings I had for over 29
years). But, with Nick's solution of mounting a camera in the Turbo Lightning's
nose and the EFIS display, it will be just another video game landing.
Piece of cake. However another positive for the camera mod is that in the
telephoto mode, it will be like the F-4 with the TISEO mod. Except instead of
using it for target acquisition, it can be used to made long distance photos of
the nearest nudist colony without ever over flying the actual real estate. I
am sure you can come up with other uses as well. Want to read someone's N
number from miles away? Yep, can do. Want to read the name of a town on a
water tower that is still some miles away? Yep, can do too. You see the
advantage I am sure. However, just to make sure you understand about the turbo
prop Ultimate Lightning Storm - "pull my finger while I am pulling your leg".
Blue Skies,
Buz
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
The NXT (only the first was called NEMISIS after the designers IF1 racer)
kitplane uses a lipstick cam to see forward while taxiing, but I think it's
on one of the gear. The Lightning does have a long nose anyhow, and
although you can see over it in landing, using flaps helps to get a better
view. Brian W.
_________________________________________________________________
Learn.Laugh.Share. Reallivemoms is right place!
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Message 9
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Doug:
I am assuming by your response that you mean a liquid compass? I know that
the compass that the EFIS has is legal to fly by, but I would like to have a
level of redundancy in regards to my heading and I prefer not to carry
ahandheld with me.
Jim!
On 8/10/07, Kayberg@aol.com <Kayberg@aol.com> wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/9/2007 9:00:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> pequeajim@gmail.com writes:
>
> Up for comments... Here's another preliminary stab at a panel for my
> Lightning.
>
> I am on the waiting list for the Odyssey, (panel on left side),. I have
> not purchased the Enigma, (or right). I'm not quite sure what all I am
> going to do with that panel space. I will probably fly with it blank for
> starters, then decide if I want anything more than a glove box over there.
>
> If I use both displays, they can interact in real time and either can
> function as an EFIS, or GPS. This will give me a backup EFIS. MG Avionics
> is coming out with a slave unit for the Odyssey next year that is much lower
> in price than the Enigma, but can provide me with the dual display setup
> that I would get with the Enigma.
>
> As usual, comments are welcome.
>
>
> This may reveal my ignorance, but Why do you have a "whisky compass" in
> the panel?
>
> The EFIS (either one) have built in compass which should satisfy the VFR
> reg. The one you show in the panel is completly worthless because of
> electrical interferance, not to mention they are worthless to start with if
> the air is rough.
>
> Practically, if I were concerned with a total failure of the panel, I
> would carry a handheld GPS for heading information, not try to fly a whisky.
>
> doug koenigsberg
>
>
> ------------------------------
> AOL.com.
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning World Record |
I think you may have left it in your flight box, next to your LiPo
charger...
On 8/10/07, nick otterback <vettin74@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Mark and i have set the date...but now i have to find it again....
>
> Nick
>
> *N1BZRich@aol.com* wrote:
>
> Way to go Earl and Seventeen Echo Fox. You have accomplished something
> that very few people would even attempt to try and even fewer would have
> hung in there to finish the task with the weather and other delays you
> experienced. Congratulations, good buddy. Now if I might be so bold to
> suggest something - I suggest you put together a presentation on your world
> record flight (power point? covering the rules, preparation, flight
> planning, actual flight, and possible lessons learned) and show it at the
> Lightning Fly-In whenever that takes place. Hopefully this
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Aviating in Virginia |
Hey Rick:
I hope you make it. We're having some fun here with the build. You could
drive it if you needed to. Guys were flying here today, so I'm sure you
could squeeze a flight in tomorrow.
Jim!
On 8/10/07, rickss <rickss@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
> Thanks guys, I just might do that. Lets see what the weather does.
>
> --------
> Cherokee driver, but feeling the need for speed!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=128429#128429
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
In a message dated 8/10/2007 9:51:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
vettin74@yahoo.com writes:
we will be installing a pen cam in the chin of the cowl and adapt it to the
EFIS screen to have a video referance during landing...
nick
Arn't you just a slick beotch.
doug
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
In a message dated 8/10/2007 11:03:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
N1BZRich@aol.com writes:
Doug,
You mentioned landing a Pitts, and yes on final, unless you throw in a
slip, not only does the runway disappear, but the entire airport disappears.
( I sure do miss my Pitts and all the exciting landings I had for over 29
years). But, with Nick's solution of mounting a camera in the Turbo Lightning's
nose and the EFIS display, it will be just another video game landing.
Piece of cake. However another positive for the camera mod is that in the
telephoto mode, it will be like the F-4 with the TISEO mod. Except instead of
using it for target acquisition, it can be used to made long distance photos of
the nearest nudist colony without ever over flying the actual real estate. I
am sure you can come up with other uses as well. Want to read someone's N
number from miles away? Yep, can do. Want to read the name of a town on a
water tower that is still some miles away? Yep, can do too. You see the
advantage I am sure. However, just to make sure you understand about the turbo
prop Ultimate Lightning Storm - "pull my finger while I am pulling your leg".
Blue Skies,
Buz
Of course,
but I did happen to think about the high nose angle if the Lightning was a
tail dragger. That thought has been kicked around before and it occured to
me that it just might be a handful to land. Not that that will stop the
diehard taildragger fans.
doug
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
In a message dated 8/10/2007 11:32:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
dashvii@hotmail.com writes:
The NXT (only the first was called NEMISIS after the designers IF1 racer)
kitplane uses a lipstick cam to see forward while taxiing, but I think it's
on one of the gear. The Lightning does have a long nose anyhow, and
although you can see over it in landing, using flaps helps to get a better
view. Brian W.
I just remember one early landing in our Lightning where I flaired with full
flaps and got goosed by a crosswind gust landing downhill on our grass strip
as I ran out of elevator and ideas all at the same time. With the nose
pointed to the moon, the runway disappeared and I braced for a crash. I
remember thinking , " this could be interesting!"
But it touched down gently and the nose came down slowly...no problem at all.
However, that moment of discomfort is etched in my mind. A taildragger
Lightning would be a hard sell to me.
doug
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
> That thought has been kicked around before and it occured to
>me that it just might be a handful to land. Not that that will stop the
>diehard taildragger fans.
>
>doug
>
Darn Right! 8-)
Rick
N727RB
_________________________________________________________________
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What are you all using on the firewall, (if anything) for fire protection?
Jim!
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| Subject: | Re: Lightning fiberglass factory visit |
And what's wrong with being a die hard taildragger
fan???? I sense another real aeroplane vs tricycle
undercarriage airplane discussion coming!
Laurie
Sydney
--- Rick Bowen <rollnloop@hotmail.com> wrote:
> <rollnloop@hotmail.com>
>
>
>
> > That thought has been kicked around before and it
> occured to
> >me that it just might be a handful to land. Not
> that that will stop the
> >diehard taildragger fans.
> >
> >doug
> >
>
>
> Darn Right! 8-)
>
> Rick
> N727RB
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
> More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB
> with Windows Live Hotmail.
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List
>
> Web Forums!
>
>
>
>
>
Laurie
02 46531233
0425 703226
Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
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| Subject: | Taildraggers forever....... |
>From: Laurie Hoffman <lozhoffman@yahoo.com>
>To: lightning-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Lightning fiberglass factory visit
>Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 18:34:41 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>And what's wrong with being a die hard taildragger
>fan????
Yup,
I gotta' tell ya Laurie....it took me a few tries at landing my Lightning
before I could get out of the "get the tail down and 3-point" mentality....
Nose rollers---ugh, I had to "re-learn" how to land a nose-roller!
Thanks for the help Nick!!(did I scare 'ya?)
Rick
_________________________________________________________________
A new home for Mom, no cleanup required. All starts here.
http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
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| Subject: | Taildraggers forever....... |
Rick,
I like to call them Nosedraggers, b/c that's how most people land them,
nosewheel first. I too am a tailwheel fan. I have access to a Pitts S2
here that I may take advantage of sometime.
I am finishing up my CFI right now and am back in nosedraggers. I'm flying
a Piper ArrowIII. I have to admit that that tapered wing makes it fly
better than an ArrowII, maybe like a brick with short wings with power at
idle. Landing that thing is as easy as it gets, like driving a Mack truck,
just keep it down the centerline and hold the approach speed and it just
rolls on. I did have a close one, almost took out a Sukoi.....input
roll.....wait 10 seconds......roll begins. I do miss the ability to just
roll the plane onto it's side like the Lightning.
Ah well, I can't complain too much, I'd pretty much fly anything with wings,
and some without. Brian W.
From: "Rick Bowen" <rollnloop@hotmail.com>
Subject: Lightning-List: Taildraggers forever.......
>From: Laurie Hoffman <lozhoffman@yahoo.com>
>To: lightning-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Lightning fiberglass factory visit
>Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 18:34:41 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>And what's wrong with being a die hard taildragger
>fan????
Yup,
I gotta' tell ya Laurie....it took me a few tries at landing my Lightning
before I could get out of the "get the tail down and 3-point" mentality....
Nose rollers---ugh, I had to "re-learn" how to land a nose-roller!
Thanks for the help Nick!!(did I scare 'ya?)
Rick
_________________________________________________________________
A new home for Mom, no cleanup required. All starts here.
http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
_________________________________________________________________
A new home for Mom, no cleanup required. All starts here.
http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
Message 20
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| Subject: | Taildraggers forever....... |
>From: "Brian Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
>To: lightning-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Taildraggers forever.......
>Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 21:31:09 -0500
>
><dashvii@hotmail.com>
>
>Rick,
> I like to call them Nosedraggers, b/c that's how most people land them,
>nosewheel first. ...................
>
>Ah well, I can't complain too much, I'd pretty much fly anything with
>wings, and some without. Brian W.
>
LOL,
I know what you mean Brian-----I know what you mean!!
Rick
N727RB
Do Not Archive
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Message 21
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| Subject: | My wife's aircraft |
As some of you know, my wife does like those pointy nosed planes without
wings. Just thought I'd post a link to a video of the launch of the
aircraft, Icarus, that she helped to design.
http://president.erfseds.googlepages.com/
She was responsible for much of the 2nd stage design. They had to go before
a NASA comittee and defend their reasoning. They did, and set a world
record with the launch on March 22nd of this year. Aircraft's max speed,
Mach 4.04, max altitude (approximately 200,000 feet!) 37.8 miles,
acceleration 13.2 G's, all verified by onboard telemetry and NASA radar
tracking. Although about 12 miles shy of space, this is a record for
highest altitude of a student built rocket. Just thought that was cool to
see something that she worked on in the design and conceptual stage make it
into reality. Brian W.
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| Subject: | Re: Flying to Mexico in the Lightning |
Can the Lightning safely make the 398 mile (346
nautical mile) journey from Key West Fl. to Cancun,
Mexico? Being that you would be flying accross the
Gulf of Mexico (entirely over water), would this be
something to try? Charles
--- Brian Whittingham <dashvii@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Whittingham" <dashvii@hotmail.com>
>
> The NXT (only the first was called NEMISIS after the
> designers IF1 racer)
> kitplane uses a lipstick cam to see forward while
> taxiing, but I think it's
> on one of the gear. The Lightning does have a long
> nose anyhow, and
> although you can see over it in landing, using flaps
> helps to get a better
> view. Brian W.
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
> Learn.Laugh.Share. Reallivemoms is right place!
> http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List
>
> Web Forums!
>
>
>
>
>
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