---------------------------------------------------------- Lightning-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 11/29/08: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 0. 12:23 AM - What Listers Have Been Saying (Matt Dralle) 1. 12:55 PM - air speeds (Tex Mantell) 2. 01:03 PM - Re: air speeds (N1BZRich@AOL.COM) 3. 02:31 PM - Re: air speeds (Brian Whittingham) 4. 03:54 PM - Re: air speeds (Jim Langley) 5. 04:01 PM - Re: air speeds (Brian Whittingham) 6. 04:16 PM - Re: air speeds (Jim Langley) 7. 04:46 PM - Re: air speeds (Brian Whittingham) 8. 04:48 PM - Happy Thanksgiving (Brian Whittingham) 9. 06:47 PM - The real truth... (Jim Langley) 10. 08:53 PM - Re: air speeds (N1BZRich@AOL.COM) ________________________________ Message 0 _____________________________________ Time: 12:23:50 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Lightning-List: What Listers Have Been Saying Wow! Many of the members making a List Support Contribution this year have been using the Comments field to leave a personal message about the Lists. Thank you! I have included a number of them below. Please read over a few and see if you perhaps can echo some of the same sentiments regarding the value of the Lists to you... There is only a couple more days left for this year's List Fund Raiser and we're still way behind previous years. If you've been waiting until the last minute to show your support, Now is the Time! Please make your Contribution and pick up a great gift at the same time! By Credit Card or Paypal: http://www.matronics.com/contribution or By Personal Check: Matronics / Matt Dralle PO Box 347 Livermore, CA 94550-7227 Thank you in advance!! Matt Dralle Email List and Forums Administrator Here is some of the great feedback members have been including along with their personal Contributions this year... Over the years, the info I have received from the RV-List has saved me thousands of dollars, and dozens of hours of time by helping me avoid bad purchases, pointing me at vendors with low prices and excellent support, and providing solutions to the typical head scratchers that you run into. Kevin H Valuable service. Best List(s) on the Internet! George A Please accept this token not as an indicator of what this list has been worth to me this past year. Lew G Great information and entertainment. Tim V Thanks again for another great year of service. This project would be beyond me if it were not for the list. Moreover, the friendships I have found are worth their weight in GOLD! Robert B Great support you provide to all the subscribers! Freddie H Read it every day. PF B Thanks for your excellent management of the Matronics Lists! Your services are head and shoulders above the rest. James M Without the "List", there would be no Kolb "community". Bill T Thanks, Matt, for a great service! I've been monitoring and using the lists since 1999. Richard D Thanks for such a terrific site and for all the work and effort you put into it. John R A great service year after year. John D ..another year of fantastic service. Jerry B This list is a great resource. Arden A Great list. James M Lists were a great help while building HRII N561FS. John S Great resources for both the beginner and experienced. George R Good service. Gary G The List is an invaluable resource! William C AeroElectric list is a great source of info and learning! Janice J Thank you, Matt for being there for us making it all happen on the List for so many years - Great JOB! Sam S Thank you for providing a great venue. You definitely hit the nail on the head with your solicitation asking if readers look forward to receiving the email digests. I certainly do and when I move from a dreamer to a builder, I expect the anticipation will only increase. Joe S Thanks for a Perfect working list. Hans-Peter R Great List Bryan K Such a great selection of valuable forums! David G Nice job! Walt E Good resource... Robert P Thank you for another great year! Scott S I could not do this without you... Robert D I believe I've been a list member for over a decade now. Thanks for the service! Tim L Great List Hendrik W ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:55:16 PM PST US From: "Tex Mantell" Subject: Lightning-List: air speeds I am trying to mark my air speed indicator with the proper color rings. What is the max speed to deploy flaps. Thanks Tex ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:03:06 PM PST US From: N1BZRich@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: air speeds Tex, I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down, and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz **************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW AOL.com. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:31:23 PM PST US From: Brian Whittingham Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds I used no more than 90 knots for the 1st 10 degrees of flaps and 75 for any thing more. For me it was easy to remember 85 knots for the first notch an d 75 knots for anything more. From: N1BZRich@aol.comDate: Sat=2C 29 Nov 2008 16:02:54 -0500Subject: Re: L ightning-List: air speedsTo: lightning-list@matronics.com Tex=2C I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down=2C and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz Life should be easier. So shoom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try th e NEW AOL.com. _________________________________________________________________ Proud to be a PC? Show the world. Download the =93I=92m a PC=94 Messenger t hemepack now. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:54:25 PM PST US From: "Jim Langley" Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds I was thinking today when I was flying N730AL, (which is back in the air now), about airspeeds, what to fly downwind, base, final, when to deploy flaps, etc. Flying a Cessna, or light sport, the airspeeds are quite different! Here is what I have for discussion, all in mph please. Entry into the pattern: 90-105 mph depending where you enter Downwind at the touchdown point, slow to 90 and 10 degrees of flaps Base leg, slow to 80 and 20 degrees of flaps Final leg, slow to 70 and 30 deg of flaps Cross numbers at 60-65 Bleed off speed and flare into the touch down at 50-55 This is my interpretation. I would love to hear some opinions. By the way, the airplane is flying really well and the MGL is incredible! Jim! N730AL From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 4:03 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: air speeds Tex, I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down, and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz _____ Life should be easier. So shoom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try the NEW AOL.com. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:01:33 PM PST US From: Brian Whittingham Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds Jim=2C That's exactlly how Nick taught me to do it! Brian W. From: pequeajim@gmail.comTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Light ning-List: air speedsDate: Sat=2C 29 Nov 2008 18:53:55 -0500 I was thinking today when I was flying N730AL=2C (which is back in the air now)=2C about airspeeds=2C what to fly downwind=2C base=2C final=2C when to deploy flaps=2C etc. Flying a Cessna=2C or light sport=2C the airspeeds are quite different! Here is what I have for discussion=2C all in mph please. Entry into the pattern: 90-105 mph depending where you enter Downwind at the touchdown point=2C slow to 90 and 10 degrees of flaps Base leg=2C slow to 80 and 20 degrees of flaps Final leg=2C slow to 70 and 30 deg of flaps Cross numbers at 60-65 Bleed off speed and flare into the touch down at 50-55 This is my interpretation. I would love to hear some opinions. By the way=2C the airplane is flying really well and the MGL is incredible! Jim! N730AL From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.comSent: Saturday=2C Nove mber 29=2C 2008 4:03 PMTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: Re: Lightni ng-List: air speeds Tex=2C I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down=2C and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz Life should be easier. So shoom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try th e NEW AOL.com. http://www.matronics.com/contributionhttp://www.matronics.c om/Navigator?Lightning-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com _________________________________________________________________ Access your email online and on the go with Windows Live Hotmail. http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_acce ss_112008 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:16:25 PM PST US From: "Jim Langley" Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds Hmmm, same instructor, same results I guess. That guy must be alright! From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Whittingham Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 6:59 PM Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds Jim, That's exactlly how Nick taught me to do it! Brian W. _____ From: pequeajim@gmail.com Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds I was thinking today when I was flying N730AL, (which is back in the air now), about airspeeds, what to fly downwind, base, final, when to deploy flaps, etc. Flying a Cessna, or light sport, the airspeeds are quite different! Here is what I have for discussion, all in mph please. Entry into the pattern: 90-105 mph depending where you enter Downwind at the touchdown point, slow to 90 and 10 degrees of flaps Base leg, slow to 80 and 20 degrees of flaps Final leg, slow to 70 and 30 deg of flaps Cross numbers at 60-65 Bleed off speed and flare into the touch down at 50-55 This is my interpretation. I would love to hear some opinions. By the way, the airplane is flying really well and the MGL is incredible! Jim! N730AL From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.com Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 4:03 PM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: air speeds Tex, I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down, and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz _____ Life should be easier. So shoom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try the NEW AOL.com. http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List http://forums.matronics.com ww.matronics.com/contribution st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List ronics.com _____ Access your email online and on the go with Windows Live Hotmail. Sign up today. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:46:29 PM PST US From: Brian Whittingham Subject: RE: Lightning-List: air speeds He was the first! I was only the third=2C I concede to the master. :-) Bri an W. From: pequeajim@gmail.comTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Light ning-List: air speedsDate: Sat=2C 29 Nov 2008 19:16:05 -0500 Hmmm=2C same instructor=2C same results I guess=85 That guy must be alright! From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian WhittinghamSent: Saturday=2C Nov ember 29=2C 2008 6:59 PMTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Lightn ing-List: air speeds Jim=2C That's exactlly how Nick taught me to do it! Brian W. From: pequeajim@gmail.comTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Light ning-List: air speedsDate: Sat=2C 29 Nov 2008 18:53:55 -0500 I was thinking today when I was flying N730AL=2C (which is back in the air now)=2C about airspeeds=2C what to fly downwind=2C base=2C final=2C when to deploy flaps=2C etc. Flying a Cessna=2C or light sport=2C the airspeeds are quite different! Here is what I have for discussion=2C all in mph please. Entry into the pattern: 90-105 mph depending where you enter Downwind at the touchdown point=2C slow to 90 and 10 degrees of flaps Base leg=2C slow to 80 and 20 degrees of flaps Final leg=2C slow to 70 and 30 deg of flaps Cross numbers at 60-65 Bleed off speed and flare into the touch down at 50-55 This is my interpretation. I would love to hear some opinions. By the way=2C the airplane is flying really well and the MGL is incredible! Jim! N730AL From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.comSent: Saturday=2C Nove mber 29=2C 2008 4:03 PMTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: Re: Lightni ng-List: air speeds Tex=2C I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down=2C and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz Life should be easier. So shoom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try th e NEW AOL.com. http://www.matronics.com/contributionhttp://www.matronics.c om/Navigator?Lightning-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com ww.matronics.com/co ntributionst">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-Listronics.com Access your email online and on the go with Windows Live Hotmail. Sign up t oday. http://www.matronics.com/contributionhttp://www.matronics.com/Navig ator?Lightning-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com _________________________________________________________________ Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious emai l. http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_safe ty_112008 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:48:10 PM PST US From: Brian Whittingham Subject: Lightning-List: Happy Thanksgiving Hope everybody had a very Happy Thanksgiving! Brian W. From: pequeajim@gmail.comTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Light ning-List: air speedsDate: Sat=2C 29 Nov 2008 19:16:05 -0500 Hmmm=2C same instructor=2C same results I guess=85 That guy must be alright! From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian WhittinghamSent: Saturday=2C Nov ember 29=2C 2008 6:59 PMTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Lightn ing-List: air speeds Jim=2C That's exactlly how Nick taught me to do it! Brian W. From: pequeajim@gmail.comTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Light ning-List: air speedsDate: Sat=2C 29 Nov 2008 18:53:55 -0500 I was thinking today when I was flying N730AL=2C (which is back in the air now)=2C about airspeeds=2C what to fly downwind=2C base=2C final=2C when to deploy flaps=2C etc. Flying a Cessna=2C or light sport=2C the airspeeds are quite different! Here is what I have for discussion=2C all in mph please. Entry into the pattern: 90-105 mph depending where you enter Downwind at the touchdown point=2C slow to 90 and 10 degrees of flaps Base leg=2C slow to 80 and 20 degrees of flaps Final leg=2C slow to 70 and 30 deg of flaps Cross numbers at 60-65 Bleed off speed and flare into the touch down at 50-55 This is my interpretation. I would love to hear some opinions. By the way=2C the airplane is flying really well and the MGL is incredible! Jim! N730AL From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N1BZRich@aol.comSent: Saturday=2C Nove mber 29=2C 2008 4:03 PMTo: lightning-list@matronics.comSubject: Re: Lightni ng-List: air speeds Tex=2C I have been using no more than 100 mph to start them down=2C and 87 mph or less for them to be full down. Buz Life should be easier. So shoom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try th e NEW AOL.com. http://www.matronics.com/contributionhttp://www.matronics.c om/Navigator?Lightning-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com ww.matronics.com/co ntributionst">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-Listronics.com Access your email online and on the go with Windows Live Hotmail. Sign up t oday. http://www.matronics.com/contributionhttp://www.matronics.com/Navig ator?Lightning-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com _________________________________________________________________ Get more done=2C have more fun=2C and stay more connected with Windows Mobi le=AE. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:47:41 PM PST US From: "Jim Langley" Subject: Lightning-List: The real truth... http://www.snopes.com/photos/airplane/onewing.asp ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:53:41 PM PST US From: N1BZRich@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Lightning-List: air speeds Because of my USAF flight training, I put the flaps full down (30 degrees for a normal Lightning landing) on downwind. This prevents ever being tempted to lower the flaps while in a turn. If you have never had split flaps - it can be a hand full, especially if it happens while in a bank/turn. I have had that once in F-4s and once in the 601XL that the local EAA chapter built. Thankfully, I was still on downwind at the time both occurred. Another reason I like putting the flaps full down while on downwind is that it allows me to fly a tighter pattern. Don't get me started on the huge patterns that most pilots fly. I am convinced that 90% of the pilots flying today would never have a chance of making the runway if they lost an engine while in the pattern because of the large airline or bomber type patterns that are flown. And the problem keeps getting worse because most of today's instructors teach them because that is what they were taught. Yea, I know, engines are pretty reliable today. But were we not taught that most engine failures happen when you change power settings - either powering up or down. Pulling the power back to land is where I had an engine failure in the Cub. Blue Skies, Buz **************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. 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