Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:12 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (Kayberg@aol.com)
2. 08:52 AM - Re: Lightning-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 03/17/10 (Jay Schmitt)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: spar/gear bracket |
In a message dated 3/17/2010 7:54:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
corky@hbci.com writes:
Doug
I usually get into trouble when I start thinking, but
it make me wonder, it this caused from landings or from shimmy
Dave McCorquodale
The plane was flown off a grass field for the previous 3 years, so doubt
that it was shimmy.
There was some history during that time of rough landings.
Doug
Message 2
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| Subject: | RE: Lightning-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 03/17/10 |
Thank you Dave and Clive and All: All information is appreciated=2C esp
ecially safety issues!! We Esqual owners are lucky to have the Lightning g
roup as a resource=2C research and development=2C and builder group. It is
to everyone's benefit to have so much interest in these wonderful airplane
s. I appreciate all of you as I continually try to improve the safety of m
y aircraft......Jay - Esqual 117DA
> Date: Wed=2C 17 Mar 2010 23:56:57 -0700
> From: lightning-list@matronics.com
> To: lightning-list-digest@matronics.com
> Subject: Lightning-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 03/17/10
>
> *
>
> ========================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> ========================
>
> Today's complete Lightning-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> of the Lightning-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&
Chapter 10-03-17&Archive=Lightning
>
> Text Version:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&C
hapter 10-03-17&Archive=Lightning
>
>
> ========================
=======================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ========================
=======================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Lightning-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Wed 03/17/10: 6
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 12:52 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (James=2C Clive R)
> 2. 01:46 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (Kayberg@aol.com)
> 3. 03:03 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (James=2C Clive R)
> 4. 03:51 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (Dave)
> 5. 04:54 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (Dave)
> 6. 08:23 AM - Re: Lightning-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 03/16/10 (Jay Schmitt)
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1 ______________________________
_______
>
>
> Time: 12:52:49 AM PST US
> Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> From: "James=2C Clive R" <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
>
>
> Dave there are lots of similarities and there is no Esqual group=2C Esqua
l
> owners are all on here.
>
> The guys at Arion know the Esqual inside out and have great knowledge
> for all Esqual owners.
>
> Several improvements in my aircraft have been through information from
> the guys at Arion.
>
> The changes they incorporated into the Lightning were based on
> shortcomings of the Esqual.
>
> Parallels will always exists between the two aircraft because of many
> things.
>
> The fact that the weak point on the central beam in one Esqual suggests
> that that could be the weak point in the design (there is always one)
> and therefore would be a good place to check the lightning in the event
> of a heavy landing or many landing and high hours=2C regardless of what
> it's made of or how it's welded.
>
> Where you put it is just right as far as I'm concerned.
>
> Thanks=2C Regards=2C Clive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
> Sent: 15 March 2010 23:34
> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
>
> Guys
> Has anyone had a problem with the spar bracket--NO do you have Esquals=2C
> NO.
> Do you think maybe this guy might have had some very bad landings? I
> guess yes.
> This was meant for Buz because he has an Esqual=2C sorry I put it out for
> the Lightning group=2C two different airplanes.
> Dave Mcc
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "James=2C Clive R" <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
> Sent: Monday=2C March 15=2C 2010 9:11 AM
> Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
>
> > <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
> >
> > I visited the Esqual factory is 2003 and viewed many kits on the
> > production line. The one thing that jumped out to us was the poor
> > quality welding on the metal parts. Francesc admitted they weren't
> > pretty and soon after they used a different company to weld up the
> > parts (or a different welder/technique). The two kits I've had in
> > England both had very tidy looking metal parts with what looks to be
> > good penetration and coverage at all the welds (#39+40).
> > The only stainless parts were the rudder pedals which seem adequate.
> > The replacement 'flute' is stainless but has a brace is quite heavy
> > wall and seems very solid.
> > Regards=2C Clive
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of selwyn
> > Sent: 15 March 2010 10:48
> > To: lightning-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> >
> > --> <selwyn@ellisworks.com.au>
> >
> > I wonder how many Esquals had stainless centre sections? Seems like a
>
> > particularly silly move to me.
> >
> > On the other hand=2C I'm familiar with one Esqual which has had a
> > particularly trying life including hitting the ground hard enough to
> > bend the main gear so as to resemble a pair of elephant tusks ( along
>
> > with other significant damage). The centre section on this one is
> > steel tube and it survived intact. The design appears the same as the
>
> > Lightning so I guess we can expect similar reserves of strength from
> > our machines.
> >
> > --------
> > Cheers=2C Selwyn
> > Kit 66
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290344#290344
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2 ______________________________
_______
>
>
> Time: 01:46:30 AM PST US
> From: Kayberg@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
>
> In a message dated 3/16/2010 10:44:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time=2C
> corky@hbci.com writes:
>
>
> Guys
> Has anyone had a problem with the spar bracket--NO do you have Esquals=2C
> NO.
> Do you think maybe this guy might have had some very bad landings? I gues
s
> yes.
> This was meant for Buz because he has an Esqual=2C sorry I put it out for
> the
> Lightning group=2C two different airplanes.
> Dave Mcc
>
>
> We replaced a spar box on an Esqual at Green Landings. The gear had
> broken lose on both sides and was a disaster waiting to happen. The small
> tubes had broken or cracked=2C the sockets were lose and floppy. I believ
e it
> was the stainless steel box. Not a good design.
>
> Yes=2C it could have been bad landings=2C but the gear did not bend. From
a
> design perspective=2C I think it is important that the gear bend and defo
rm
> long before damaging the box and cabin structure. Did not happen that way
> in the Esqual.
>
> FWIW
>
> Doug Koenigsberg
>
> ________________________________ Message 3 ______________________________
_______
>
>
> Time: 03:03:55 AM PST US
> Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> From: "James=2C Clive R" <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
>
>
>
> 'Did not happen that way in the Esqual'
> I ran mine off the runway last year and the gear legs + engine mount
> bent=2C nothing else is damaged=2C as I said though not sure on the herit
age
> of the parts.
> Certainly not stainless=2C you can see that=2C + like the engine mount a
> real bitch to drill.
> I will give it another inspection but the dimensional check showed no
> deformation.
>
> Thanks for the extra feedback Doug=2C Regards Clive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Kayberg@aol.com
> Sent: 16 March 2010 22:57
> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
> In a message dated 3/16/2010 10:44:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time=2C
> corky@hbci.com writes:
>
>
> Guys
> Has anyone had a problem with the spar bracket--NO do you have
> Esquals=2C NO.
> Do you think maybe this guy might have had some very bad
> landings? I guess
> yes.
> This was meant for Buz because he has an Esqual=2C sorry I put it
> out for the
> Lightning group=2C two different airplanes.
> Dave Mcc
>
>
>
> We replaced a spar box on an Esqual at Green Landings. The gear had
> broken lose on both sides and was a disaster waiting to happen. The
> small tubes had broken or cracked=2C the sockets were lose and floppy. I
> believe it was the stainless steel box. Not a good design.
>
> Yes=2C it could have been bad landings=2C but the gear did not bend. From
> a design perspective=2C I think it is important that the gear bend and
> deform long before damaging the box and cabin structure. Did not
> happen that way in the Esqual.
>
> FWIW
>
> Doug Koenigsberg
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 4 ______________________________
_______
>
>
> Time: 03:51:17 AM PST US
> From: "Dave" <corky@hbci.com>
> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
>
> Mine also is not stainless=2C I think I will plate mine to strengthen it
some.
> Dave
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "James=2C Clive R" <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
> Sent: Wednesday=2C March 17=2C 2010 4:31 AM
> Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
>
> > <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
> >
> >
> > 'Did not happen that way in the Esqual'
> > I ran mine off the runway last year and the gear legs + engine mount
> > bent=2C nothing else is damaged=2C as I said though not sure on the her
itage
> > of the parts.
> > Certainly not stainless=2C you can see that=2C + like the engine mount
a
> > real bitch to drill.
> > I will give it another inspection but the dimensional check showed no
> > deformation.
> >
> > Thanks for the extra feedback Doug=2C Regards Clive
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> > Kayberg@aol.com
> > Sent: 16 March 2010 22:57
> > To: lightning-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> >
> > In a message dated 3/16/2010 10:44:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time=2C
> > corky@hbci.com writes:
> >
> >
> > Guys
> > Has anyone had a problem with the spar bracket--NO do you have
> > Esquals=2C NO.
> > Do you think maybe this guy might have had some very bad
> > landings? I guess
> > yes.
> > This was meant for Buz because he has an Esqual=2C sorry I put it
> > out for the
> > Lightning group=2C two different airplanes.
> > Dave Mcc
> >
> >
> > We replaced a spar box on an Esqual at Green Landings. The gear had
> > broken lose on both sides and was a disaster waiting to happen. The
> > small tubes had broken or cracked=2C the sockets were lose and floppy.
I
> > believe it was the stainless steel box. Not a good design.
> >
> > Yes=2C it could have been bad landings=2C but the gear did not bend. Fr
om
> > a design perspective=2C I think it is important that the gear bend and
> > deform long before damaging the box and cabin structure. Did not
> > happen that way in the Esqual.
> >
> > FWIW
> >
> > Doug Koenigsberg
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5 ______________________________
_______
>
>
> Time: 04:54:10 AM PST US
> From: "Dave" <corky@hbci.com>
> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
> Doug
> I usually get into trouble when I start thinking=2C but
> it make me wonder=2C it this caused from landings or from shimmy
>
> Dave McCorquodale
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Kayberg@aol.com
> To: lightning-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Tuesday=2C March 16=2C 2010 5:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
>
>
> In a message dated 3/16/2010 10:44:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time=2C
> corky@hbci.com writes:
>
> Guys
> Has anyone had a problem with the spar bracket--NO do you have
> Esquals=2C NO.
> Do you think maybe this guy might have had some very bad landings? I
> guess
> yes.
> This was meant for Buz because he has an Esqual=2C sorry I put it out
> for the
> Lightning group=2C two different airplanes.
> Dave Mcc
>
>
> We replaced a spar box on an Esqual at Green Landings. The gear had
> broken lose on both sides and was a disaster waiting to happen. The
> small tubes had broken or cracked=2C the sockets were lose and floppy. I
> believe it was the stainless steel box. Not a good design.
>
> Yes=2C it could have been bad landings=2C but the gear did not bend.
> >From a design perspective=2C I think it is important that the gear bend
> and deform long before damaging the box and cabin structure. Did not
> happen that way in the Esqual.
>
> FWIW
>
> Doug Koenigsberg
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6 ______________________________
_______
>
>
> Time: 08:23:04 AM PST US
> From: Jay Schmitt <n1220j@msn.com>
> Subject: Lightning-List: RE: Lightning-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 03/16/10
>
>
> Hi=2C This is Jay Schmitt in Tijeras=2C New Mexico. I own Esqual N117
D
> A. My seat is out right now and my center section is beautiful. This is a
> 2004 completion. I haven't had any trouble with my rudder pedals either.
> I just put on the 6 ply tires=2C and new brakes. I'll report on my gear
s
> himmy soon. Good luck and clear skies to all. I hope to fly over to see G
> reg Hobbs in the next month or two. I love his canopy lock=3B I plan to
c
> opy it..................Jay
>
> > Date: Tue=2C 16 Mar 2010 23:56:48 -0700
> > From: lightning-list@matronics.com
> > To: lightning-list-digest@matronics.com
> > Subject: Lightning-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 03/16/10
> >
> > *
> >
> > =======================
>
> > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> > =======================
>
> >
> > Today's complete Lightning-List Digest can also be found in either of t
he
>
> > two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatte
d
>
> > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> > and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> > of the Lightning-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text edit
or
>
> > such as Notepad or with a web browser.
> >
> > HTML Version:
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=htm
l&
> Chapter 10-03-16&Archive=Lightning
> >
> > Text Version:
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt
&C
> hapter 10-03-16&Archive=Lightning
> >
> >
> > =======================
> ======================
> > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> > =======================
> ======================
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > Lightning-List Digest Archive
> > ---
> > Total Messages Posted Tue 03/16/10: 1
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > Today's Message Index:
> > ----------------------
> >
> > 1. 07:44 AM - Re: Re: spar/gear bracket (Dave)
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________ Message 1 ____________________________
__
> _______
> >
> >
> > Time: 07:44:31 AM PST US
> > From: "Dave" <corky@hbci.com>
> > Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> >
> >
> > Guys
> > Has anyone had a problem with the spar bracket--NO do you have Esquals
=2C
> NO.
> > Do you think maybe this guy might have had some very bad landings? I gu
es
> s
> > yes.
> > This was meant for Buz because he has an Esqual=2C sorry I put it out
for
> the
> > Lightning group=2C two different airplanes.
> > Dave Mcc
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "James=2C Clive R" <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
> > Sent: Monday=2C March 15=2C 2010 9:11 AM
> > Subject: RE: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> >
> >
> > > <clive.james@uk.bp.com>
> > >
> > > I visited the Esqual factory is 2003 and viewed many kits on the
> > > production line. The one thing that jumped out to us was the poor
> > > quality welding on the metal parts. Francesc admitted they weren't
> > > pretty and soon after they used a different company to weld up the pa
rt
> s
> > > (or a different welder/technique). The two kits I've had in England b
ot
> h
> > > had very tidy looking metal parts with what looks to be good penetrat
io
> n
> > > and coverage at all the welds (#39+40).
> > > The only stainless parts were the rudder pedals which seem adequate.
Th
> e
> > > replacement 'flute' is stainless but has a brace is quite heavy wall
an
> d
> > > seems very solid.
> > > Regards=2C Clive
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
> > > [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of selwy
n
> > > Sent: 15 March 2010 10:48
> > > To: lightning-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: Lightning-List: Re: spar/gear bracket
> > >
> > > --> <selwyn@ellisworks.com.au>
> > >
> > > I wonder how many Esquals had stainless centre sections? Seems like a
> > > particularly silly move to me.
> > >
> > > On the other hand=2C I'm familiar with one Esqual which has had a
> > > particularly trying life including hitting the ground hard enough to
> > > bend the main gear so as to resemble a pair of elephant tusks ( along
> > > with other significant damage). The centre section on this one is ste
el
> > > tube and it survived intact. The design appears the same as the
> > > Lightning so I guess we can expect similar reserves of strength from
ou
> r
> > > machines.
> > >
> > > --------
> > > Cheers=2C Selwyn
> > > Kit 66
> > >
> > >
> > > Read this topic online here:
> > >
> > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290344#290344
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
>
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