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1. 02:49 PM - Re: Re: Lightning-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/19/11 (FamilyGage@AOL.COM)
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Subject: | Re: Lightning-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/19/11 |
Nick: I am very distressed about this whole situation. My intention was
not to cause controversy or to deceive anyone. Your company has been very
good to me, and I love my Esqual. My medical status is the problem. I
called your offices while you where away to apologize. This person has a
mental problem.
Respectfully,
Ray Gage
In a message dated 9/20/2011 6:09:27 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
nick@flylightning.net writes:
My angry denunciations of your fictional concerns/ contributions are well
justified and seated in truth.
First for such an expert in the field of Lightning=99s or esqual
=99s to this
date you have never signed a Name, or the plane you may fly, maybe a seria
l
number or an number of your Lightning, LS-1, or esqual would be helpful.
However a doubt you will or can for that matter.
Secondly your wisdom on the matter of a 3300L data plate is misplaced.
Yes you can in-fact receive a data plate for the engine declaring a max
continuous power setting of 2850rpm. This is only by request to Jabiru pty
directly, they just don=99t slap them on, or hand them out. Your old
data plate
is returned to Jabiru Pty with a letter requesting the 3300L data tag, and
the engine will not be operated above 2850 for more than 15 minutes. But
this is only for engines used by homebuilders who did not build the engine
.
A builder of an experimental aircraft wishing to meet light sport, must
conform to the FAR=99s not the ASTM standards. Therefore they must u
se the
engine manufacturer=99s limitations for max continuous power, hence
the use of the
3300L engine in some homebuilts.
This is where the disconnect for you comes in to play.
The Manufacturer of an SLSA submits with each aircraft an 8130-15, or
=9C
Manufacturers Statement of Compliance=9D for each aircraft produced.
On this form the Manufacturer references ASTM standards and or FAA
regulations to which the aircraft is produced and meets the rule.
Of these is the need to define the aircraft as a whole, set design
limitations, have a compliant POH, Maintenance Manual, Quality assurance p
rogram
and so forth.
It is in the area of defining ones aircraft and its limitations, that
allows a manufacturer to set the limitations of everything about the aircr
aft
including the engine.
We are the Manufacturer of the aircraft as a whole, we are responsible for
its continued airworthiness, and the safety monitoring of that aircraft
for its life span.
The Manufacturer of the engine, Jabiru PTY LTD does not sign nor submit
any such documentation for the installation of its engine in any aircraft,
but that the engine=99s design and manufacturer meets the Requiremen
ts of ASTM
F2339.
In Short the Manufacturer of an SLSA aircraft can set the operational
limitations of an engine not manufactured by them, because by definition t
he
manufacturer is responsible for the Aircraft as a Whole thru the complianc
e
requirements of the ASTM.
The Builder of an experimental aircraft is subject only to the
requirements of the FARs. A builder can not use the ASTM standards as jus
tification
to meet the FARs. This is why a builder must use the engine manufacturer
=99s
limitations.
If you would care to be corrected further be my guest and type away. But I
would suggest that until than, go out and Start an SLSA production
facility it might shed some light on your fictional concerns.
Since you are not willing to sign a name to your posts, than it is the
duty of your fellow wingmen here to give a name to you, just like in the
military right?
I dub thee,
=9CStandup Philosopher=9D
Good Day.
Nick Otterback
Arion Aircraft
Builder of N233AL, N323AL, N324AL, N327AL, N106AL.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ...
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 2:40 PM
Subject: Lightning-List: Re: Lightning-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/19/11
SUBJECT: Hymenoplasty Part Three in three parts, plus PS
It is called "certification", fellas, not "certifiction".
1. Ref "geezer" > takes one to know one and i are 1, 2
2. Used car, err, plane salesman Maxim Gorky's own words in his initial
braggadocio post establish the subject aircraft is capable of operation (a
nd
was flown) outside SP limits. No going back. No apology.
3. As for the unsolicited apology from the new FamilyMan arrival, some
(perraps like MaximG) prefer and pretend to be unaware of the issue's
specifics. Did prior owner TELL you and prove to you somehow that it was
SP
eligible or just give numbers you now wishfully misinterpret to mean that?
If
anything, your oversize prop would make it cruise faster than the typical
Esqual or its plagiarized clone the Lightning. I am simpatico. You may h
ave
been misinformed and are now the victim of a typo or a claim that is
either irrelevant to the SP issue or strains credulity.
"At 1280 rpm it indicates 110 knots"
This is not a "how fast/slow can we go in fifth gear overdrive" contest
(although there are max stall speed SP rules also which might be blown by
some of these aircraft). If your fine bird is, as you confess, a standard
Esqual with standard 3300rpm Jab 3300 and standard (!) prop its maximum
sustained level cruise is WTF (WayTheFoch) too high to be legally or ethic
ally
operated by a junior birdman or reflexes-limited Sport Pilot
FAR 1.1 is clear. SP eligible
(2) A maximum airspeed in level flight with maximum continuous power (VH)
of not more than 120 knots CAS under standard atmospheric conditions at se
a
level.
(4) A maximum stalling speed or minimum steady flight speed without the
use of lift-enhancing devices (VS1) of not more than 45 knots CAS at the
aircraft's maximum certificated takeoff weight and most critical center of
gravity
Absent restrictions imposed, declared, placarded, tach-marked, and
documented for all posterity at the time of construction (which should be
ignored
by evaluators as a sham anyway when SP violations are considered), the
engine manufacturer (you did not build the engine from a kit did you... AN
Y of
you?) data plate specs apply and those currently shown on the website
"specifications" page
Power Rating of the 3300 is 120 hp @ 3300 rpm continuous
====
<<<POST SCRIPT>>>
IN THE INTEREST OF FULL DISCLOSURE (which you rarely get from a used car
salesman) there is an amusing twist here which Nick (for all his angry
denunciations of my factual concerns/contributions) and future LS buyers
better
be aware of. Recognizing their material quality, assembly tolerances, and
operational experience justified it, Jabiru increased the maximum
continuous to 3300rpm many years ago (check data plate or with them for se
rial
numbers affected) and still display that on their website now. But in res
ponse
to howls of protest from the increasing number of LSA manufacturers three
years ago, they have now joined the lying sham parade. They will... on th
e
identical production line engine... at the request of the buyer affix a
dataplate declaring it a "3300L" with a maximum continuous rpm of 2850 whic
h
with a finely pitched dinnerplate-diameter prop and absent speed mods allow
s
many aircraft (such as the Sonex) to be certified and test flown just
under the 120K Vh @2850.
If Nick shipped any LS-1 without this 3300L dataplate despite living next
door to JabUSA, well.... Make sure you don't accept one that way now. And
if you already have your bird, check the dataplate. 3300rpm max
continuous? Not a virgin, can't undo, not now or ever SP eligible. Less?
Maybe.
Fine tooth comb the certification paperwork, placards, and instrument
markings.
G'luck.
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