---------------------------------------------------------- Lightning-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 07/21/13: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:52 AM - GRT Avionic (Stephen Behn) 2. 10:08 AM - Re: GRT Avionic (Matt Dralle) 3. 10:14 AM - Re: GRT Avionic (Matt Dralle) 4. 10:17 AM - Re: GRT Avionic (Mark Stauffer) 5. 10:32 AM - Re: New Owner Question (Bob Haas) 6. 12:11 PM - Re: New Owner Question (flyingchemist) 7. 01:09 PM - Re: New Owner Question (GARY BARNETT) 8. 02:09 PM - Re: Re: New Owner Question (Dennis W. Wilt) 9. 02:17 PM - Re: Re: New Owner Question (Dennis W. Wilt) 10. 03:19 PM - Re: Re: New Owner Question (Nick Otterback) 11. 03:45 PM - Re: Re: New Owner Question (Dwwilt) 12. 07:02 PM - Fw: Rudder travel (Bernard Melendez, Jr.) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:52:44 AM PST US From: "Stephen Behn" Subject: Lightning-List: GRT Avionic Hi All, I have purchased a Grand Rapid HXr system for my Lightning and am in the process of making mount brackets and positioning all the equipmen t. I was going to fit the AHRS/Air Data Computer under the baggage compartm ent but the harness supplied is only 4 feet long. I will have to build a lo nger harness or put it behind the instrument panel. GRT say the magnetomete r should be fitted in the wing tip again not easy especially when it has to be in the same orientation as the AHRS. I would appreciate any information and photos of the positioning of these pieces of equipment in a lightning. Thanks in anticpation Cheers Steve Behn Lightning 69 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:08:34 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Re: Lightning-List: GRT Avionic At 12:52 AM 7/21/2013 Sunday, you wrote: >Hi All, > I have purchased a Grand Rapid HXr system for my Lightning and am in the process of making mount brackets and positioning all the equipment. I was going to fit the AHRS/Air Data Computer under the baggage compartment but the harness supplied is only 4 feet long. I will have to build a longer harness or put it behind the instrument panel. GRT say the magnetometer should be fitted in the wing tip again not easy especially when it has to be in the same orientation as the AHRS. I would appreciate any information and photos of the positioning of these pieces of equipment in a lightning. Thanks in anticpation >Cheers >Steve Behn >Lightning 69 Hi Steve, I have an RV-8, but the installation for the GRT AHRS and Magnetometers might be similar. Attached are some pictures of my GRT AHRS installation behind the panel. Works great. I didn't want to run wires all the way out to the wing tip for the Magnetometers either so I mounted mine in the tail between the Horz and Vert stabs. Again, worked great. I'll send some pictures of that next. Best regards, - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen" http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap... RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer" http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log Status: 170+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode Matt's Livermore Airport Live ATC Stream! Check out the live ATC stream directly from my hangar at the Livermore Airport. Includes both Tower and Ground transmissions. Archives too! For entertainment purposes only. http://klvk.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:14:42 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Re: Lightning-List: GRT Avionic At 12:52 AM 7/21/2013 Sunday, you wrote: >Hi All, > I have purchased a Grand Rapid HXr system for my Lightning and am in the process of making mount brackets and positioning all the equipment. I was going to fit the AHRS/Air Data Computer under the baggage compartment but the harness supplied is only 4 feet long. I will have to build a longer harness or put it behind the instrument panel. GRT say the magnetometer should be fitted in the wing tip again not easy especially when it has to be in the same orientation as the AHRS. I would appreciate any information and photos of the positioning of these pieces of equipment in a lightning. Thanks in anticpation >Cheers >Steve Behn >Lightning 69 Steve, Here are some pictures of my installation of the GRT Magnetometers in tail of RV-8... - Matt Dralle RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen" http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap... RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer" http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log Status: 170+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode Matt's Livermore Airport Live ATC Stream! Check out the live ATC stream directly from my hangar at the Livermore Airport. Includes both Tower and Ground transmissions. Archives too! For entertainment purposes only. http://klvk.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:17:24 AM PST US From: "Mark Stauffer" Subject: RE: Lightning-List: GRT Avionic Hi Steve, We've installed a couple of HX systems with separate AHRS and have mounted them under the baggage floor. While GRT's suggestion of mounting the magnetometer in the wing tip works for RV's it's impractical for Lightnings unless you want to make a large access cover. In the 30-40 plus GRT SX systems we've installed we've mount the magnetometers in the tail cone. I'll see the GRT gang at Oshkosh and ask about the provided wire length for the AHRS. The wire bundle they provide for the magnetometer has always been sufficient. Best regards, Mark From: owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Behn Sent: Sunday, July 21, 2013 2:53 AM Subject: Lightning-List: GRT Avionic Hi All, I have purchased a Grand Rapid HXr system for my Lightning and am in the process of making mount brackets and positioning all the equipment. I was going to fit the AHRS/Air Data Computer under the baggage compartment but the harness supplied is only 4 feet long. I will have to build a longer harness or put it behind the instrument panel. GRT say the magnetometer should be fitted in the wing tip again not easy especially when it has to be in the same orientation as the AHRS. I would appreciate any information and photos of the positioning of these pieces of equipment in a lightning. Thanks in anticpation Cheers Steve Behn Lightning 69 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:32:59 AM PST US From: "Bob Haas" Subject: Re: Lightning-List: New Owner Question Greetings Dave. There is a great deal of P factor with the Lightning, how ever My rudder deflects 3 + inches neat the top of the rudder. You should not need any brake to keep it straight once it starts to roll. Check the manual for travel limits. Bob Haas N330BH. From: David Cole Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2013 8:00 PM Subject: Lightning-List: New Owner Question I recently purchased N166JG, a 2007 Lightning built by the previous owner at the factory. On take-off I have to give it full right rudder as well as some right brake to keep it going approximately straight down the runway. I would be hesitant to try a take-off from a runway less than about 70 ft wide. Is this normal? If not, is there a fix? I measured the rudder travel at the top of the rudder. It is 2 inches left or right from centered. It seems like it should be more. Thanks for any advice than can be provided. Dave@SRC ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 12:11:13 PM PST US Subject: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question From: "flyingchemist" Full rudder travel at the bottom of the rudder where it is the widest is 5 inches left or right - a good bit less than the 8 inches it should be. I am not a builder nor a mechanic. Is there an adjustment that will allow a little more rudder travel? Coming back from a fly-in the wind was 7-8 mph 80 degrees from the right. It took full left rudder to keep it aligned with the runway. It could not have handled another 2 miles an hour. Dave@SRC -------- Dave@SRC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=405017#405017 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 01:09:52 PM PST US From: GARY BARNETT Subject: RE: Lightning-List: New Owner Question Dave I generally follow what Nick said about applying power gradually during the start of the takeoff run. I line it up while slowly rolling down the cent er line then smoothly slide in the power over 2 or 3 seconds as I gradually bring in full rudder. At about 10 knots you have enough airspeed to make the rudder fully effective. As for staying on the centerline during takeoff a lot of the problem is in the forward cant of the pivot shaft for the nose wheel. As the wheel moves one direction or the other it creates a positive feedback. In other words the turning force increases the further it turns. The reverse of a bicycle front wheel. When you put in rudder to stop the turn and bring it back t o the centerline you will find you must decrease the rudder input in advanc e the straight ahead position or you overshoot to the other side. Most of us are not that fast so you inevitably weave down the runway a foot or two on either side of the centerline during takeoff. I noticed in the last new sletter Arion has come out with a vertical pivot shaft for the nose wheel w eldment similar the Lancair's and RV's. I will eventually change my nose w heel mount to that type. It will make takeoffs a lot smoother. Good luck with your new Lightning. Gary Barnett N335AL SN133 From: dbcole@sbcglobal.net Subject: Lightning-List: New Owner Question I recently purchased N166JG=2C a 2007 Lightning built by the previous owner at the factory. On take-off I have to give it full right rudder as well a s some right brake to keep it going approximately straight down the runway. I would be hesitant to try a take-off from a runway less than about 70 ft wide. Is this normal? If not=2C is there a fix? I measured the rudder travel at the top of the rudder. It is 2 inches left or right from centered. It seems like it should be more. Thanks for any advice than can be provided. Dave@SRC =0A =0A =0A ============0A ============0A ============0A ============0A =0A ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:09:36 PM PST US Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question From: "Dennis W. Wilt" If you are having the rudder hitting the edge of the vertical stabilizer, t hen there is an issue. 1. Look at the bottom bracket that connects the rudder to the vertical stab ilizer. 2. There should be two stop bolts in the bracket. If they are not there, th ey should be installed, look at the installation instructions on the flylig htning.net web site. 3. If they are there and the rudder is hitting the edge of the vertical st abilizer before the stop bolts hit their stops, then material needs to be s anded off the vertical stabilizer so you get full rudder travel. Again, look at the installation instructions that can be found here: http://www.flylightning.net/Owners.htm I hope this helps. Regards, Dennis W. Wilt, Aviation Consultant Communications, Navigation, and Surveillance Subject Matter Expert Program and Project Management 757-784-8113 N616DW (Arion Lightning S/N 132) -----Original Message----- From: flyingchemist Sent: Sun, Jul 21, 2013 3:11 pm Subject: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question > Full rudder travel at the bottom of the rudder where it is the widest is 5 inches left or right - a good bit less than the 8 inches it should be. I a m not a builder nor a mechanic. Is there an adjustment that will allow a little more rudder travel? Coming back from a fly-in the wind was 7-8 mph 80 degrees from the right. It took full left rudder to keep it aligned with the runway. It could not hav e handled another 2 miles an hour. Dave@SRC -------- Dave@SRC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=405017#405017 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 02:17:38 PM PST US Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question From: "Dennis W. Wilt" I directed you to the build manual and after looking at it, I can't find th e instructions I just gave you in the build manual. I built my plane at Gr een Landings Flight Center and I remember doing these steps when I did the rudder install. Maybe Mark or Nick can find the correct instructions, I di d not find them. The two stop bolts should be installed in the bracket and the rudder should not hit the vertical stabilizer at full travel. Regards, Dennis W. Wilt, Aviation Consultant Communications, Navigation, and Surveillance Subject Matter Expert Program and Project Management 757-784-8113 N616DW (Arion Lightning S/N 132) -----Original Message----- From: flyingchemist Sent: Sun, Jul 21, 2013 3:11 pm Subject: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question > Full rudder travel at the bottom of the rudder where it is the widest is 5 inches left or right - a good bit less than the 8 inches it should be. I a m not a builder nor a mechanic. Is there an adjustment that will allow a little more rudder travel? Coming back from a fly-in the wind was 7-8 mph 80 degrees from the right. It took full left rudder to keep it aligned with the runway. It could not hav e handled another 2 miles an hour. Dave@SRC -------- Dave@SRC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=405017#405017 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 03:19:36 PM PST US Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question From: Nick Otterback 166JG would not have the stops, it is to early of an airframe. The rudder ma y rub along the vertical tail skins but the skins shouldnt keep it from movi ng far enough, would mostly just rub the finish. It may be hard to explain o n an email so i will send a picture in the morning of where you may have to c heck for clearance and what to adjust. Nick Sent from my pocket On Jul 21, 2013, at 4:17 PM, "Dennis W. Wilt" wrote: > I directed you to the build manual and after looking at it, I can't find t he instructions I just gave you in the build manual. I built my plane at Gr een Landings Flight Center and I remember doing these steps when I did the r udder install. Maybe Mark or Nick can find the correct instructions, I did n ot find them. The two stop bolts should be installed in the bracket and the rudder should not hit the vertical stabilizer at full travel. > > Regards, > > Dennis W. Wilt, Aviation Consultant > Communications, Navigation, and Surveillance Subject Matter Expert > Program and Project Management > 757-784-8113 > N616DW (Arion Lightning S/N 132) > -----Original Message----- > From: flyingchemist > To: lightning-list > Sent: Sun, Jul 21, 2013 3:11 pm > Subject: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question > t> > > Full rudder travel at the bottom of the rudder where it is the widest is 5 > inches left or right - a good bit less than the 8 inches it should be. I a m not > a builder nor a mechanic. Is there an adjustment that will allow a little more > rudder travel? > > Coming back from a fly-in the wind was 7-8 mph 80 degrees from the right. It > took full left rudder to keep it aligned with the runway. It could not ha ve > handled another 2 miles an hour. > > Dave@SRC > > -------- > Dave@SRC > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=405017#405017 > > > > > > > > " target="_blank" saprocessedanchor="true">http://www.matronics.com/Na vigator?Lightning-List > processedanchor="true">http://forums.matronics.com > _blank" saprocessedanchor="true">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:45:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question From: Dwwilt Thanks Nick. Blue Skies, Dennis W. Wilt N616DW (Arion Lightning S/N 132) Sent from my iPad On Jul 21, 2013, at 6:18 PM, Nick Otterback wrote: > 166JG would not have the stops, it is to early of an airframe. The rudder m ay rub along the vertical tail skins but the skins shouldnt keep it from mov ing far enough, would mostly just rub the finish. It may be hard to explain o n an email so i will send a picture in the morning of where you may have to c heck for clearance and what to adjust. > > Nick > > Sent from my pocket > > On Jul 21, 2013, at 4:17 PM, "Dennis W. Wilt" wrote: > >> I directed you to the build manual and after looking at it, I can't find t he instructions I just gave you in the build manual. I built my plane at Gr een Landings Flight Center and I remember doing these steps when I did the r udder install. Maybe Mark or Nick can find the correct instructions, I did n ot find them. The two stop bolts should be installed in the bracket and the rudder should not hit the vertical stabilizer at full travel. >> >> Regards, >> >> Dennis W. Wilt, Aviation Consultant >> Communications, Navigation, and Surveillance Subject Matter Expert >> Program and Project Management >> 757-784-8113 >> N616DW (Arion Lightning S/N 132) >> -----Original Message----- >> From: flyingchemist >> To: lightning-list >> Sent: Sun, Jul 21, 2013 3:11 pm >> Subject: Lightning-List: Re: New Owner Question >> et> >> >> Full rudder travel at the bottom of the rudder where it is the widest is 5 >> inches left or right - a good bit less than the 8 inches it should be. I am not >> a builder nor a mechanic. Is there an adjustment that will allow a littl e more >> rudder travel? >> >> Coming back from a fly-in the wind was 7-8 mph 80 degrees from the right. It >> took full left rudder to keep it aligned with the runway. It could not h ave >> handled another 2 miles an hour. >> >> Dave@SRC >> >> -------- >> Dave@SRC >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=405017#405017 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> " target="_blank" saprocessedanchor="true">http://www.matronics.com/N avigator?Lightning-List >> processedanchor="true">http://forums.matronics.com >> _blank" saprocessedanchor="true">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> >> >> >> >> > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:02:35 PM PST US From: "Bernard Melendez, Jr." Subject: Lightning-List: Fw: Rudder travel I had the same question. Nick O. answered it thus. Hope this helps.=0ABerna rdo=0A=0A=0A----- Forwarded Message -----=0AFrom: Nick Otterback =0ATo: n45bm@yahoo.com =0ACc: mark@flylightning.net =0ASent: T hursday, March 15, 2012 3:10 PM=0ASubject: RE: Rudder travel=0A =0A=0A=0ABe rnardo,=0A=C2-=0AHope this helps.=0A=C2-=0ANick Otterback=0AArion Aircr aft LLC=0AR&D Technical Support=0A931-680-1781=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2- =0AFrom:Mark Stauffer [mailto:mark@flylightning.net] =0ASent: Thursday, Mar ch 15, 2012 2:30 PM=0ATo: n45bm@yahoo.com=0ACc: nick@flylightning.net=0ASub ject: RE: Rudder travel=0A=C2-=0AHi Bernardo,=0A=C2-=0AI=99m cc =99ing Nick for his response. I=99m 99% sure it=99s 70 de grees off the centerline for a total of 140 degrees of travel but please wa it for Nick=99s confirmation before drilling.=0A=C2-=0AThanks!=0A =C2-=0AMark=0A=C2-=0AFrom:Bernard Melendez, Jr. [mailto:n45bm@yahoo.com ] =0ASent: Thursday, March 15, 2012 9:49 AM=0ATo: Mark Stauffer=0ASubject: Re: Rudder travel=0A=C2-=0AHi Mark,=0AIs that 70 degrees total travel fro m the hinge bolt or at the center line where the aluminum meets the fiber g lass? In the newsletter, those lines appear to be about 90 degrees apart an d emanating next to the vertical 'glass. Just trying to get the correct pic ture in my head before I drill the aluminum. Thanks.=0ABernardo=0A=0A--- On Thu, 3/15/12, Mark Stauffer wrote:=0A=0AFrom: Mark Stauffer =0ASubject: Rudder travel=0ATo: "'Bernard Melendez, Jr.'" =0ACc: nick@flylightning.net=0ADate: Thurs day, March 15, 2012, 7:43 AM=0AHi Bernardo,=0A=C2-=0AThanks for the email s, I=99ll add a couple per month to the newsletters as space and time permit.=0A=C2-=0AI spoke with Nick and the rudder stops are placed 70 de grees off center and the center of the 3/16=9D hole is 3/8=9D i n from the edge.=0A=C2-=0AHope this helps!=0A=C2-=0ABest regards,=0A=C2 -=0AMark=0A=C2-=0AMark Stauffer=0AProduction Manager=0AArion Aircraft, LLC=0A2842 Highway 231 North=0AShelbyville, TN 37160=0A(931) 680-1781 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message lightning-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Lightning-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/lightning-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/lightning-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.