---------------------------------------------------------- LycomingEngines-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 11/06/17: 2 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:24 AM - Re: Re: LycomingEngines-List Digest: 0 Msgs - 11/04/17 (FLYaDIVE) 2. 06:00 AM - Re: Engine temps (Kelly McMullen) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:24:56 AM PST US From: FLYaDIVE Subject: Re: LycomingEngines-List: RE: LycomingEngines-List Digest: 0 Msgs - 11/04/17 Ray: What contradictions? I was not contradicting anything till now. Did you read! The second sentence reads: "Now, to keep things simple,...". What is your point? We all know that there is a variance in temperature reading due to probe, probe placement and between gauge manufactures. We are NOT talking about differences between planes and equipment. You MUST be a Gauge Watcher with your head down all the time. Very few training aircraft have EGT/CHT or Fuel Flow. Leaning was taught by FEEL! THEN! If you have a engine monitoring system you cross check against that. NOT the other way around. And - How do you know - "but once you know how your engine feels" if you don't feel things like vibration? Engines were flown decades before engine monitoring equipment was installed. As I said: I feel the vibration in my feet first. I feel it there before it gets to the stick or the gauges. AND, since many planes are going the way of glass panels, you are loosing the instrument vibration as a monitoring point, also many panels are vibration dampened so it takes more vibration before it shows up. Barry "If you wash your hands before going to the bathroom you may have the making of a Crew Chief." On Sun, Nov 5, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Ray Eaker wrote: > Lots of contradictions there, Barry. > > EGT temps are relative. The value itself (eg 1400) is mostly meaningless > but can be meaningful for troubleshooting a problem. The value relative t o > PEAK is what matters (and it matters) for lean operations. The feel of yo ur > feet, not so much, but once you know how your engine feels using the engi ne > monitor values, it might help. > > > On Nov 5, 2017, at 2:06 PM, FLYaDIVE wrote: > > Hi Paul, > > If you have FUEL INJECTION, you have an IO-360, not an O-360. > > Now, to keep things simple, don=99t even look at the EGT. Use your ears and > the vibrations you feel. My feet are closest to the engine so I feel > things through my toes. Lean till the engine runs rough and then give a > slight twist to rich. THEN! If you want to cross check against EGT go > ahead. There are no max limits to EGT, NONE in any manuals, but my > personal limit is 1400 F. > Now, cross check your CHT. There are limits there. LYCOMING says max of > 450 F. I use 400 F as my max. REMEMBER! Temperature gauges are a LAGIN G > instrument. By the time you SEE your temp, it is beyond that point. > > Barry > > On Sunday, November 5, 2017, Paul Collins wrote: > >> To the =9CEngine-Smart=9D and experienced group, >> >> I have an 0-360 - fuel injection, magneto and Lightspeed >> electronic ignition, all four cylinders monitored by EGT and CHT, >> compression boosted to 10.2 by Ly-Con. >> >> So, how would this experienced group set the fuel-flow? >> What limits/measurements would you use?? >> >> 1. Run by EGT? If so, what limits?? >> 2. Run by CHT? If so, what limits?? >> 3. Run by fuel flow vs % power setting? If so, what limits?? >> 4. Run by congressional budget? If so, what limits?? >> >> >> >> Weather is changing out here is Idaho, so it is a good time to start >> thinking about these things =93 and shovel snow. >> >> >> >> Thanks for your consideration, >> >> Paul Collins >> >> N8ZV >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> >> >> *From: *LycomingEngines-List Digest Server >> *Sent: *Sunday, November 5, 2017 1:13 AM >> *To: *LycomingEngines-List Digest List >> *Subject: *LycomingEngines-List Digest: 0 Msgs - 11/04/17 >> >> >> >> * >> >> >> >> ======================== >> >> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive >> >> ======================== >> >> >> >> Today's complete LycomingEngines-List Digest can also be found in either >> of the >> >> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatte d >> >> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes >> >> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version >> >> of the LycomingEngines-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text >> editor >> >> such as Notepad or with a web browser. >> >> >> >> HTML Version: >> >> >> >> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&V >> iew=html&Chapter 17-11-04&Archive=LycomingEngines >> >> >> >> Text Version: >> >> >> >> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&V >> iew=txt&Chapter 17-11-04&Archive=LycomingEngines >> >> >> >> >> >> ====================== >> >> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive >> >> ====================== >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------- >> >> LycomingEngines-List Digest Archive >> >> --- >> >> Total Messages Posted Sat 11/04/17: 0 >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> >> Today's Message Index: >> >> ---------------------- >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > -- > Barry > "Chop'd Liver" > If you wash your hands before you go to the bathroom you may have the > makings of a Crew Chief. > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:00:27 AM PST US Subject: Re: LycomingEngines-List: Engine temps From: Kelly McMullen You argue for engine mixture adjustment by feel. Sorry, engine feel will not get you close to where you want to be on an engine with well balanced injection. Yes, it works for carbureted engines and injected engines with poor mixture distribution, which just tells you you are in the ball park in a very crude way. You do not know whether you are in a danger zone or not. The engine will be smooth until just before it quits. On the rich side, 50 ROP feels exactly like it does at 200 or 300 ROP. One does NOT need heads down. With fuel flow you can simply pull the mixture to a flow known to be lean of peak for a given power, and then fine tune a twist or two at a time. A glance at EGT once in a while is all that is needed. Once level in cruise it might take a couple minutes to get mixture exactly where you want it, after that a glance once in awhile will tell you it is holding where desired. Yes, I would advise a safety pilot for the first few flights of finding the boundaries of mixture you want to use, but that is to simply learn what your engine wants and what numbers will get you there in the future. On 11/6/2017 5:22 AM, FLYaDIVE wrote: > Ray: > > What contradictions? I was not contradictinganything till now. > Did you read! The second sentence reads: "Now, to keep things > simple,...". What is your point? We all know that there is a > variancein temperature reading due to probe, probe placement and > between gauge manufactures. We are NOT talking about differences > between planes and equipment. > > You MUST be a Gauge Watcher with your head down all the time. Very few > training aircraft have EGT/CHT or Fuel Flow. Leaning was taught by > FEEL! THEN! If you have a engine monitoringsystem you cross check > against that. NOT the other way around. > > And - How do you know - "but once you know how your engine feels" if you > don't feel things like vibration? Engines were flown decades before > engine monitoring equipment was installed. As I said: I feel the > vibration in my feet first. I feel it there before it gets to the stick > or the gauges. AND, since many planes are going the way of glass > panels, you are loosing the instrumentvibration as a monitoring point, > also many panels are vibration dampenedso it takes more vibration > before it shows up. > > Barry ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message lycomingengines-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/LycomingEngines-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/lycomingengines-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/lycomingengines-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.