---------------------------------------------------------- M14PEngines-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 09/26/21: 2 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:22 AM - Re: M14P hot cylinders (Richard Goode) 2. 10:26 AM - Re: M14P hot cylinders (Anthony Savarese) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:22:08 AM PST US From: "Richard Goode" Subject: RE: M14PEngines-List: M14P hot cylinders Hello Dennis, One small point =93 was this sent to Matronics in the first place? Certainly I did not receive it! Then I would make the point that these temperatures are high =93 remember that maximum continuous cylinder temperature is 220=C2=B0C, and up to 240=C2=B0C for short periods. Then I would also say that the system of measurement is not that accurate, in my opinion, and the presence of very small amounts of dirt between cylinder head; sending washer and sparking plug can easily distort the figures. And I think another issue is that the Murphy Moose is a big aeroplane and with a standard M 14 P it does need to work pretty hard to climb in high ambient temperatures. Best wishes Richard RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129 e-mail: richard.goode@russianaeros.com www.russianaeros.com WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary. From: owner-m14pengines-list-server@matronics.com On Behalf Of Anthony Savarese Sent: 25 September 2021 21:55 Subject: Re: M14PEngines-List: M14P hot cylinders As a second test and disregarding the MGL instrument, immediately, and I mean immediately upon shutdown, using a laser temperature sensor point the laser at the exact same point on each cylinder and read the temps. I suggest at the flat surface around the base of each spark plug just outside the spark plug insert. Make note of the temps on each cylinder and compare them to the differences between the cylinder temps you=99re seeing from the MGL. DENNIS Sent from my iPhone On Sep 25, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Sylvain April > wrote: =EF=BB Hi, I have been helping a friend with a high temperature of the cylinder heads on his M14P engine, The engine is installed in a Murphy Moose and the upper cylinders are geting hoter than the lower cylinders. 25 to 30 Deg C. Hoter than the lower cylinders. The bafling is tight and there is no obstruction behind the cylinder heads to the passage of cooling air. We have added ample cheeks to the cowling and we have re centered the front of the cowling that was a little low and was providing a larger opening below the prop spinner than above it. It did improve the cooling of the upper cylinders but we still have a big difference between the upper cylinder heads and the lower cylinders head. Here are the reading from the MGL instrument that we bench checked with boiling water. #1 :224 C #2 :217 C #3 :208 C #4 :196 C #5 :193 C #6 :195 C #7 :201 C #8 :205 C #9 :201C On a warmer day after climbing. #1 :242C #2 :241C #3 :234C #4 :217C #5 :216C #6 :215C #7 :221C #8 :230C #9 :223C The oil temperature stay at 150 to 155 Deg F and the o=C3=AFl pressure is staying 75 to 80 PSI. >From another Moose I used to fly the o=C3=AFl temperature reach 185 Deg F to 195 F. And the o=C3=AFl pressure stay around 65 PSI. The upper cylinders where also warmer in that Moose but not as much difference with the lower cylinders. When I look at the cold oil temperature and relatively high o=C3=AFl pressure I Wonder if the o=C3=AFl is doing it=99job of removing the heat of the engine, I mean the oil jet on the crank not spraying the cylinders. All cylinders are geting dripping o=C3=AFl from the crank but the lower cylinders would Always get more o=C3=AFl due to the gravity and would be cooler. In cruse the temps are aceptable but there must be a reason for this 30 Deg C.difference. Any idea would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Sylvain April Envoy=C3=A9 =C3- partir de Courrier pour Windows ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:26:31 AM PST US From: Anthony Savarese Subject: Re: M14PEngines-List: M14P hot cylinders Hello Richard, Yes, this was posted to the Matronics list, on the M14 Engines list. Not the Yak list. I completely agree with your points about the CHT=99s and the accuracy of the instrument. That was the reason I suggested the laser temperature gu n/sensor. I was just trying to be low keyed about the instrument accuracy b y suggesting an alternative temperature test. Personally, I=99m not a proponent of any of the MGL equipment. Primarily because of my personal exp eriences with MGL stuff. If I had to put it in single crass word, that word w ould be =9Cjunk=9D. I think he=99s going to find the MGL instrument readings are nowhere c lose to the hand held laser gun. Great to hear from you and best regards, Dennis Sent from my iPhone > On Sep 26, 2021, at 10:24 AM, Richard Goode wrote: > > =EF=BB > Hello Dennis, > > One small point =93 was this sent to Matronics in the first place? C ertainly I did not receive it! > > Then I would make the point that these temperatures are high =93 rem ember that maximum continuous cylinder temperature is 220=C2=B0C, and up to 2 40=C2=B0C for short periods. > > Then I would also say that the system of measurement is not that accurate, in my opinion, and the presence of very small amounts of dirt between cylin der head; sending washer and sparking plug can easily distort the figures. > > And I think another issue is that the Murphy Moose is a big aeroplane and w ith a standard M 14 P it does need to work pretty hard to climb in high ambi ent temperatures. > > Best wishes > > Richard > > > RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS > Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK > Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129 > e-mail: richard.goode@russianaeros.com > www.russianaeros.com > WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES > In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary. > > From: owner-m14pengines-list-server@matronics.com On Behalf Of Anthony Savarese > Sent: 25 September 2021 21:55 > To: m14pengines-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: M14PEngines-List: M14P hot cylinders > > As a second test and disregarding the MGL instrument, immediately, and I m ean immediately upon shutdown, using a laser temperature sensor point the la ser at the exact same point on each cylinder and read the temps. I suggest a t the flat surface around the base of each spark plug just outside the spark plug insert. Make note of the temps on each cylinder and compare them to th e differences between the cylinder temps you=99re seeing from the MGL. > DENNIS > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Sep 25, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Sylvain April wrote: > > =EF=BB > Hi, > > I have been helping a friend with a high temperature of the cylinder heads on his M14P engine, > > The engine is installed in a Murphy Moose and the upper cylinders are geti ng hoter than the lower cylinders. > 25 to 30 Deg C. Hoter than the lower cylinders. > The bafling is tight and there is no obstruction behind the cylinder heads to the passage of cooling air. > We have added ample cheeks to the cowling and we have re centered the fr ont of the cowling that was a little low and was providing a larger opening b elow the prop spinner than above it. It did improve the cooling of the upper cylinders but we still have a big difference between the upper cylinder hea ds and the lower cylinders head. > Here are the reading from the MGL instrument that we bench checked with bo iling water. > > #1 :224 C > #2 :217 C > #3 :208 C > #4 :196 C > #5 :193 C > #6 :195 C > #7 :201 C > #8 :205 C > #9 :201C > > On a warmer day after climbing. > > #1 :242C > #2 :241C > #3 :234C > #4 :217C > #5 :216C > #6 :215C > #7 :221C > #8 :230C > #9 :223C > > The oil temperature stay at 150 to 155 Deg F and the o=C3=AFl pressure is staying 75 to 80 PSI. > =46rom another Moose I used to fly the o=C3=AFl temperature reach 185 Deg F to 195 F. And the o=C3=AFl pressure stay around 65 PSI. > The upper cylinders where also warmer in that Moose but not as much differ ence with the lower cylinders. > > When I look at the cold oil temperature and relatively high o=C3=AFl press ure I Wonder if the o=C3=AFl is doing it=99job of removing the heat of the engine, I mean the oil jet on the crank not spraying the cylinders. All cylinders are geting dripping o=C3=AFl from the crank but the lower cylinde rs would Always get more o=C3=AFl due to the gravity and would be cooler. > In cruse the temps are aceptable but there must be a reason for this 30 De g C.difference. > > Any idea would be greatly appreciated. > > Thanks > Sylvain April > > > > > Envoy=C3=A9 =C3- partir de Courrier pour Windows > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message m14pengines-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/M14PEngines-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/m14pengines-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/m14pengines-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.