---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 06/09/03: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:21 AM - Re: questions (Gene Rambo) 2. 05:19 AM - Re: questions (Kip & Beth Gardner) 3. 05:58 AM - Re: questions (John Dilatush) 4. 06:14 AM - Longeron (Ken Rickards) 5. 06:16 AM - Re: questions (rambog@erols.com) 6. 06:38 AM - Re: Longeron (del magsam) 7. 07:00 AM - Re: Longeron (DJ Vegh) 8. 08:27 AM - C-85 temperature bulb adapter (Sayre, William G) 9. 10:05 AM - Re: Weld 4130 steel (cat_designs@juno.com) 10. 10:38 AM - Re: Longeron (cat_designs@juno.com) 11. 10:39 AM - Re: Longeron (Alex Sloan) 12. 12:03 PM - Travel Air Model A aero engine (rhartwig11@juno.com) 13. 01:32 PM - Re: Longeron (John Dilatush) 14. 01:36 PM - Re: Longeron (Ken Rickards) 15. 03:45 PM - Re: Longeron (Larry Neal) 16. 03:56 PM - Re: questions (Jack Phillips) 17. 05:30 PM - Re: Longeron (Ken & Lisa Rickards) 18. 08:19 PM - Re: modified the rudder bar with GREAT results (Brants) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:21:56 AM PST US From: "Gene Rambo" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gene Rambo" C'mon guys, I have been posting a number of questions on here with minimal responses! Here is the latest: Before I put saw to ash, has anyone with a Model A powered Piet had any reason to extend the engine mount forward? I have my engine mount bearers which are a couple of inches longer, and before I cut to the length given in the plans I want to make sure. As a side story, yesterday I was at a friend's house doing some Piet woodwork. He is doing trim work on his house (he builds wooden aircraft, too). He had some trim work he had glued together with Titebond glue. We took a scrap that was basically three 2" square pieces edge glued together, so the piece was 6" by 2". I tried to break it apart by hand, nothing doing. I placed it on the floor with a block under each end and stood on it, nothing (I weigh about 200). Only when I used the edge of my shoe and jumped up and down on it did I finally make it break . . . nowhere near a glue joint. We took another scrap and placed it in a vise and hit it with a hammer. Broke the wood, never the glue joint. We also found some scraps that had been out in the rain for several days . . .same result. This is some stuff! Gene ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:19:39 AM PST US From: Kip & Beth Gardner Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip & Beth Gardner At 7:21 AM -0400 06/09/03, Gene Rambo wrote: >As a side story, yesterday I was at a friend's house doing some Piet >woodwork. He is doing trim work on his house (he builds wooden aircraft, >too). He had some trim work he had glued together with Titebond glue. We >took a scrap that was basically three 2" square pieces edge glued together, >so the piece was 6" by 2". I tried to break it apart by hand, nothing >doing. I placed it on the floor with a block under each end and stood on >it, nothing (I weigh about 200). Only when I used the edge of my shoe and >jumped up and down on it did I finally make it break . . . nowhere near a >glue joint. We took another scrap and placed it in a vise and hit it with a >hammer. Broke the wood, never the glue joint. We also found some scraps >that had been out in the rain for several days . . .same result. > >This is some stuff! > >Gene Hi Gene, Was this the regular carpenter's Titebond, or the waterprooof polyurethane ('Pro-Bond' & 'Gorilla Glue') type? I've done spruce test pieces with both Pro-Bond & Gorilla Glue - if you coat both pieces, then clamp them lightly & let it cure at least 24 hrs, the joint breaks in the wood every time. I'm still not sure I'd use it for structural joints, but it's a cheap alternative to T-88 for elsewhere. I also used it to glue together parts of my daughter's sand box & after a year out in cold, wet Ohio weather (4 seasons full of mostly damp and/or frozen sand) the joints are still good. This may be a case where the technology has gotten ahead of anyone's inclination to put a seal of approval on it. One disclaimer, however - these glues claim to be 'gap-filling' & they are - as a non-structural foam. Don't trust it that way - it has bonding strength in tight joints only. Kip Gardner (making NO Piet progress - I'm up to my ass in Spring project alligators) North Canton, OH ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:58:27 AM PST US From: "John Dilatush" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Rambo" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gene Rambo" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Gene, I had some material that I had laminated with Titebond, knowing full well that it is not water proof, simply water resistant. Left some samples outside, and sure enough, the manufacturer is right! The samples delaminated in about 3 months! I would not use Titebond in a plane unless you could keep the part well protected with varnish etc. John ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > C'mon guys, I have been posting a number of questions on here with minimal > responses! Here is the latest: > > Before I put saw to ash, has anyone with a Model A powered Piet had any > reason to extend the engine mount forward? I have my engine mount bearers > which are a couple of inches longer, and before I cut to the length given in > the plans I want to make sure. > > As a side story, yesterday I was at a friend's house doing some Piet > woodwork. He is doing trim work on his house (he builds wooden aircraft, > too). He had some trim work he had glued together with Titebond glue. We > took a scrap that was basically three 2" square pieces edge glued together, > so the piece was 6" by 2". I tried to break it apart by hand, nothing > doing. I placed it on the floor with a block under each end and stood on > it, nothing (I weigh about 200). Only when I used the edge of my shoe and > jumped up and down on it did I finally make it break . . . nowhere near a > glue joint. We took another scrap and placed it in a vise and hit it with a > hammer. Broke the wood, never the glue joint. We also found some scraps > that had been out in the rain for several days . . .same result. > > This is some stuff! > > Gene > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:14:12 AM PST US From: Ken Rickards Subject: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards I will be getting into the fuselage within the next couple of months. Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a curve on it from the firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear cockpit. My question is: How many people did the bend dry and how did it work out. And for those that soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need to get this right, as I don't want to end up cracking the piece. Ken GN1 2992 Canada ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:16:54 AM PST US From: "rambog@erols.com" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "rambog@erols.com" I didn't mean to suggest that I am using Titebond, just that it is strong stuff, stronger than I would have thought. Name a glue that does not break down after several months outside without any protection. Aircraft plywood does not last through one good wetting without delaminating. I am, however, using titebond for small non-structural items like filler blocks. If it is well varnished, it could probably be used for everything NOT THAT I AM DOING IT. Gene Original Message: ----------------- From: John Dilatush dilatush@amigo.net Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Rambo" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gene Rambo" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Gene, I had some material that I had laminated with Titebond, knowing full well that it is not water proof, simply water resistant. Left some samples outside, and sure enough, the manufacturer is right! The samples delaminated in about 3 months! I would not use Titebond in a plane unless you could keep the part well protected with varnish etc. John ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > C'mon guys, I have been posting a number of questions on here with minimal > responses! Here is the latest: > > Before I put saw to ash, has anyone with a Model A powered Piet had any > reason to extend the engine mount forward? I have my engine mount bearers > which are a couple of inches longer, and before I cut to the length given in > the plans I want to make sure. > > As a side story, yesterday I was at a friend's house doing some Piet > woodwork. He is doing trim work on his house (he builds wooden aircraft, > too). He had some trim work he had glued together with Titebond glue. We > took a scrap that was basically three 2" square pieces edge glued together, > so the piece was 6" by 2". I tried to break it apart by hand, nothing > doing. I placed it on the floor with a block under each end and stood on > it, nothing (I weigh about 200). Only when I used the edge of my shoe and > jumped up and down on it did I finally make it break . . . nowhere near a > glue joint. We took another scrap and placed it in a vise and hit it with a > hammer. Broke the wood, never the glue joint. We also found some scraps > that had been out in the rain for several days . . .same result. > > This is some stuff! > > Gene > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:38:36 AM PST US From: del magsam Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: del magsam Bend it dry, its not even getting close to the point of cracking. Del --- Ken Rickards wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > > > > I will be getting into the fuselage within the next > couple of months. > Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a > curve on it from the > firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear > cockpit. My question is: > How many people did the bend dry and how did it work > out. And for those that > soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need > to get this right, as I > don't want to end up cracking the piece. > > > Ken > > GN1 2992 > > Canada > > > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > latest messages. > List members. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > ===== Del-New Richmond, Wi "farmerdel@rocketmail.com" __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:00:36 AM PST US From: "DJ Vegh" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" Dry is fine.... You'd have to bend it much tighter to cause any sort of cracking... DJ Vegh N74DV Mesa, AZ www.imagedv.com/aircamper - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Rickards" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Longeron > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > > > I will be getting into the fuselage within the next couple of months. > Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a curve on it from the > firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear cockpit. My question is: > How many people did the bend dry and how did it work out. And for those that > soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need to get this right, as I > don't want to end up cracking the piece. > > > Ken > > GN1 2992 > > Canada > > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:27:25 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-85 temperature bulb adapter From: "Sayre, William G" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Sayre, William G" Looking for the adapter that fits in the oil-screen of a C-85 for the temperature bulb. The one I have fits a 3/8 inch capillary tube and I need one for 7/16 diameter. Help in locating one would be appreciated. Bill Sayre ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:05:22 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weld 4130 steel From: cat_designs@juno.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: cat_designs@juno.com Just goes to show I am not an expert. I always thought the Chrome-moly on bikes was 4130. Now I don't. Thanks Chris Sacramento, CA --- Mike wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mike Chris Tracy's admonition to avoid brazing 4130 should be underscored. Everything Chris says is true, save one. Many, if not most, steel bike frames are brazed, it's true, but those that are, even though they may be called "chrome-moly," are not generally made from 4130, but from some other high-molybdenum, medium-carbon, steel. Brazed bike tubing material generally is made with much more manganese than 4130, around three times as much, and less chromium. Bike frames that are successfully built with 4130 are rare, and either over-built or welded. I don't know if the manganese is what enables successful brazing of bike frame tubing, but a high failure rate is to be avoided, even if your likely outcome is "only" disfiguring injury. Mike Hardaway chris a Tracy wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: chris a Tracy > > I think it needs to be said again so no one else has to learn the hard > way like Carl did. > If you use 4130 steel it is prone to cracking if you braze it. Do not > braze 4130. Yes I know bike frames are built out of 4130 and they are > brazed with a lot of success but if they brake you will most likely not > be killed. Ever book on aircraft welding I found says not to braze 4130. > These same books also say you should not weld a joint that has > previously been brazed. The braze material will contaminate the molten > metal and make a weaker weld. Now, if you use 1020 steel like the plans > call for you can braze it just fine and it will be good joint. There is > nothing wrong with using 1020 steel to build an airplane as long as the > plane was designed to use it. A lot of the antique airplane are built out > of it. The only part that BHP calls out as needing to be made out of > 4130, that I can find, is the rudder bar. Remember, even though most > people are using 4130 for everything IT IS A CHANGE FROM THE PLANS so you > need to due your homework on how this change will affect your building > process. And my study of this change is to weld 4130 in a draft free > area using a welding method that heats up an area of approximately one*~ half to one inches on each side of the weld bringing the temperature up > slowly and after welding you should allow the material to cool slowly in > a draft free area. Knowing this I choose to gas weld all my parts and > reheat the weld as well as an area around the welds to release any built > in stress. I do all me welding in my garage with the doors shut to keep > the drafts down. I'm not an expert on any of this so you should do your > own homework to satisfy your own fears. > > Sorry, I don't mean to step on any toes but his is one of the things that > comes up often in the list archives and I just wanted to make sure any > new people out there get this valuable information. > > Chris > Sacramento, CA > > On Sat, 7 Jun 2003 21:54:11 -0400 "Carl Loar" > writes: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Loar" > > > > > > Del,,, Originally,, the control tubes were brazed, then I redid them > > after > > learning that was a no no. That was another pain in the butt lesson > > I > > learned but the knowledge never stops on here. So what do you think > > about the tire deal? > > Carl > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "del magsam" > > To: > > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: knobby tires > > > > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: del magsam > > > > > > > > Carl > > > the pics of the torque tube looks almost like the > > > parts were brazed, not so, I hope. > > > Del > > > --- Carl Loar wrote: > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Loar" > > > > > > > > > > > > There seems to be a concern about the knobby > > > > motorcycle tires I have on my > > > > piet. > > > > I know most aircraft have smooth tires and it lets > > > > you slide on the grass. > > > > But those same > > > > smooth tires don't slide much on asphalt runways. > > > > Maybe later I will opt for > > > > smoothys but > > > > I think that there shouldn't be a problem with the > > > > ones I have now. I don't > > > > plan on doing a > > > > lot of heavy cross wind landings for a while. My > > > > early flights will be in > > > > calm weather. And if > > > > I do get a cross wind, I'll land like it was > > > > asphalt. I thought I would > > > > throw this out and get a > > > > feel for the groups opinions. Thanks as always. > > > > Carl > > > > check out my webpage at > > > > http://members.core.com/skycarl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Contributions > > > > any other > > > > Forums. > > > > > > > > latest messages. > > > > List members. > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > > > > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > > > > > > > Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list > > > > http://www.matronics.com/archives > > > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > > > > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===== > > > Del-New Richmond, Wi > > > "farmerdel@rocketmail.com" > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:54 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron From: cat_designs@juno.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: cat_designs@juno.com I did mine dry with no problems at all. I have heard that someone had trouble with doing it dry. I you want to soak them first wrap the portion to be bent in towels then poor hot water over the towels. Keep the towels hot with more hot water. Eventually you will have a softened the wood to allow them to be bent. Chris Sacramento, CA --- Ken Rickards wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards I will be getting into the fuselage within the next couple of months. Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a curve on it from the firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear cockpit. My question is: How many people did the bend dry and how did it work out. And for those that soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need to get this right, as I don't want to end up cracking the piece. Ken GN1 2992 Canada The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:39:44 AM PST US From: "Alex Sloan" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Alex Sloan" Ken, I drew out the form on my work table which is 24" wide and 16' long. I drove large nails at the point of the bends where the vertical pieces were to be glued in. No soaking or steaming. Dry bends on all and I used the large size I" longerons as shown on the 1932 plans. No problems with cracking or breaking. Fuselage is now glued with both sides connected and all plywood glued on. Hope you have the same good results. Alex Sloan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Rickards" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Longeron > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > > > I will be getting into the fuselage within the next couple of months. > Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a curve on it from the > firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear cockpit. My question is: > How many people did the bend dry and how did it work out. And for those that > soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need to get this right, as I > don't want to end up cracking the piece. > > > Ken > > GN1 2992 > > Canada > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:03:13 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Travel Air Model A aero engine From: rhartwig11@juno.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: rhartwig11@juno.com Here is the information on the Travel Air Aviation -Model A Ford conversion that was pictured in Sport Aviation. Their price seems reasonable for a very complete engine (does not include prop flange.) The only thing that I would question is the 7:1 compression ratio. I have read from other builders that for crank and rod longevity 6:1 is about max. They do seem flexible though and may be willing to build to your specs. Their address is 1380 Flightline Blvd., DeLand Airport, Deland FL 32724. Cell phone 407-497-1090. Dick Hartwig THE MODEL A ENGINE People ask the question, why would a person want to use a 70-year-old design in a modern homebuilt aircraft? The answer is that the Model A is a simple, well designed, low priced, four cylinder engine with good weight to torque ratio. The engine also has a long stroke and develops maximum torque at low RPM. The Model A engine was used in several aircraft during the 1930's and currently powers many aircraft of the Pietenpol line. Probably the biggest advantage of the Model A is that a multitude of high performance equipment was developed in the past and is still available today as new production. Model A powered sprint cars and jalopies are now active in numerous races and hill climbs across the country. As an example, there are several different cylinder heads currently available, some aluminum some cast iron, with various compression ratios. For our particular configuration, we use a cast aluminum head with dual spark plugs in each cylinder. There are also various ignition systems available from pure electronics to the older points and condenser. We use a dual electronic distributor for our set up. Carburetors are another area with lots of choices. We use a dual set up with twin Solexes. Many of the racers prefer either a single or dual model 94 or 97 Stromberg. Several types of up-drafts are also available. A selection of different camshaft grinds are also available to enhance performance. With various up-grades in performance equipment, it is possible to achieve torque ranges over 160 lbs./ft at crankshaft speeds as low as 2000 RPM. This little engine will put out half the torque at 2000 RPM that the Chevrolet 350 engine puts out at 3000 RPM, at less than one half the weight. Torque at low speeds is important when choosing an efficient propeller. There are numerous other mods that we incorporate in our engines such as pressure oil systems, inserted bearings, aluminum radiators, etc. Specifications: Engine basic weight including dual carbs, dual ignition, exhaust pipes, alternator 196 lbs. Aluminum radiator and coolant - 22 lbs Starter Assembly - 10 lbs. Note - Weight can be reduced by using single ignition, single carb. and manual start. MODEL A "AERO" By Travel Air Aviation Basic Engine Package 1. Reconditioned original Model A block 2. Cylinders bored .080 over standard. 3. Block line bored and machined for modem insert bearings. Block modified for full pressure oil system. 4. Crankshaft reconditioned, balanced and drilled for full oil pressure system. 5. Connecting rods balanced and machined for modem inserts. 6. New pistons, rings, valves, springs, guides, tappets, seats, keepers, oil pump kit and water pump. 7. Camshaft machined for high performance, (special grind) 8. Custom made light weight aluminum oil pan. 9. Light weight aluminum cylinder head with dual spark plugs and 7/1 compression. 10. Custom dual electronic ignition with top mounted distributor. 11. Dual Solex carburetors with associated intake manifold. 12. Custom exhaust - "straight pipes" 13. High torque starter including drive pulley/ring assembly and starter mount. 14. Light-weight alternator. (30 amp) Complete package includes spark plugs, ignition wiring, drive belt, break in oil and oil filter installation. All engines pre-run on test stand prior to delivery. Price complete $4,880.00 (plus sales tax for Florida residents and shipping) Deposit on complete engine - $2,000.00. Balance on delivery. Delivery time - generally 30 to 60 days depending on work load. 30 to 60 days depending on work load. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:32:03 PM PST US From: "John Dilatush" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Rickards" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Longeron ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Ken, Leave the longerons about a foot longer at the front end and cut them off later. This will give you leverage to bend them to the contour that you want and will allow you to bend them dry. Hope this helps, John ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > > > I will be getting into the fuselage within the next couple of months. > Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a curve on it from the > firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear cockpit. My question is: > How many people did the bend dry and how did it work out. And for those that > soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need to get this right, as I > don't want to end up cracking the piece. > > > Ken > > GN1 2992 > > Canada > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:36:51 PM PST US From: Ken Rickards Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > Thanks for all the replies on the longeron issue. As no one seems to have had a problem doing it dry, that's what I will do. Although, if you are lying in bed one night and you hear a load scream coming form the north, you'll know what happened!! Thanks again to everyone for their input. > > Ken > > GN1 2992 > > Canada > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 03:45:04 PM PST US From: "Larry Neal" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Larry Neal" Yes, and bend it slowly. Spruce will do just about anything if you take your time. ----- Original Message ----- From: "del magsam" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: del magsam > > Bend it dry, its not even getting close to the point > of cracking. > Del > --- Ken Rickards wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > > > > > > > > I will be getting into the fuselage within the next > > couple of months. > > Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a > > curve on it from the > > firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear > > cockpit. My question is: > > How many people did the bend dry and how did it work > > out. And for those that > > soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need > > to get this right, as I > > don't want to end up cracking the piece. > > > > > > Ken > > > > GN1 2992 > > > > Canada > > > > > > > > Contributions > > any other > > Forums. > > > > latest messages. > > List members. > > > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > > > Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list > > http://www.matronics.com/archives > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===== > Del-New Richmond, Wi > "farmerdel@rocketmail.com" > > __________________________________ > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:56:43 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" I have a name ... resorcinol. It will withstand immersion for 24 hours in boiling water (at least according to the Mil-Spec). I built most of my Pietenpol with it, the rest with T-88. Jack -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rambog@erols.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: questions --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "rambog@erols.com" I didn't mean to suggest that I am using Titebond, just that it is strong stuff, stronger than I would have thought. Name a glue that does not break down after several months outside without any protection. Aircraft plywood does not last through one good wetting without delaminating. I am, however, using titebond for small non-structural items like filler blocks. If it is well varnished, it could probably be used for everything NOT THAT I AM DOING IT. Gene ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 05:30:13 PM PST US From: "Ken & Lisa Rickards" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ken & Lisa Rickards" Thanks John, Good tip... definately one for the keeper drawer. Ken GN1 2992 Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Dilatush" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Longeron > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ken Rickards" > To: > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Longeron > ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Ken, > > Leave the longerons about a foot longer at the front end and cut them off > later. This will give you leverage to bend them to the contour that you > want and will allow you to bend them dry. > > Hope this helps, > > John > ++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken Rickards > > > > > > I will be getting into the fuselage within the next couple of months. > > Looking at the plans, the lower longeron has quite a curve on it from the > > firewall back to almost the inst panel on rear cockpit. My question is: > > How many people did the bend dry and how did it work out. And for those > that > > soaked or steamed the wood how did you do it. Need to get this right, as > I > > don't want to end up cracking the piece. > > > > > > Ken > > > > GN1 2992 > > > > Canada > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 08:19:37 PM PST US From: "Brants" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: modified the rudder bar with GREAT results --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Brants" I wouldn't mind getting your plans on this... I may make the very same modification. Tom Brant Brooklyn Park, MN ----- Original Message ----- From: "w b evans" Subject: Pietenpol-List: modified the rudder bar with GREAT results > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "w b evans" > > Just to let everyone know that with all my complaining about the rudder bar, I had to do something. Thought of putting my heels in "sturrups" to ride with the bar, but would be hard getting to the brakes. Besides it's uncomfortable. > Desided to build the mod around the fact that I like to keep my heels on the deck and use the rudder with my flipper feet. > So I picked a design and went with it,,,,I tried by putting some tubing cut to give a rectangle above the rudder bar that my toes could push on. This brought the top of the tube to about where the forward rudder pedals are. Made them 3" wide, and about 3 1/2" high, starting about 1" in from the center line hole of the cable connecting point on the end of the tube. This wouldn't interfere with the stops, or the seat, or anything. > Anyway, if anyone wants more details, I'll send it to you. > Now I can feel the rudders with my toes, and the landings are not a mystery, wondering if I'll make it OK. Now I have much better feel of the plane, and control on landing. > "My toes were trained,,,my legs were not" > I'm happy as a clam. > walt evans > NX140DL > >