---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 11/18/03: 27 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:29 AM - Re: leather (Kip & Beth Gardner) 2. 05:37 AM - Re: GN-1 web site (Gnwac@cs.com) 3. 05:43 AM - Re: Rib profile question (Gnwac@cs.com) 4. 05:59 AM - Re: flew up to "strutland" (Gnwac@cs.com) 5. 06:00 AM - Re: flew up to "strutland" (Gnwac@cs.com) 6. 07:16 AM - standby one....... (Michael D Cuy) 7. 08:31 AM - an answer for Chris Bobka (Michael D Cuy) 8. 08:32 AM - Re: standby one....... (Christian Bobka) 9. 08:34 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 (Craig Lawler) 10. 08:34 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 (Craig Lawler) 11. 08:42 AM - L for Langley Research Center (Michael D Cuy) 12. 10:06 AM - Re: an answer for Chris Bobka (Leo Gates) 13. 10:13 AM - LOC? - What's That? (Matt Dralle) 14. 10:16 AM - Re: standby one....... (Christian Bobka) 15. 11:36 AM - Re: an answer for Chris Bobka (BARNSTMR@aol.com) 16. 11:50 AM - New owner ZS-VJA (Norman Stapelberg) 17. 12:37 PM - correct plans? (Eric Williams) 18. 01:05 PM - Re: flew up to "strutland" (w b evans) 19. 01:19 PM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 (w b evans) 20. 01:55 PM - report direct (Michael D Cuy) 21. 06:59 PM - Re: report direct (Clif Dawson) 22. 07:16 PM - Fw: New System Three Website (Clif Dawson) 23. 07:35 PM - Re: New owner ZS-VJA (Clif Dawson) 24. 07:38 PM - Re: leather (Richard Navratil) 25. 09:07 PM - Piet Fuel tanks (Peter W Johnson) 26. 09:10 PM - Re: standby one....... (Christian Bobka) 27. 09:51 PM - Re: an answer for Chris Bobka (Christian Bobka) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:29:30 AM PST US From: Kip & Beth Gardner Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: leather --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip & Beth Gardner At 11:07 PM -0500 11/17/03, Richard Navratil wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil" > > >I would like to challange the collective knowledge and limits of the >group. My appologies in advance. >After a great week of deer hunting I have 2 nice large buck hides. They >will make nice trim and seats if I tan them properly. >Does anyone have any experience with leather? I know some of the basics. >So far I have covered them in salt and stretched them on a rack and >started scraping them. Iknow the old indian method would be to pee on it >for the salt, scrape and work in beef or pork fat. >I've tried the sporting good and western stores but havent found any info >on this. >Dick N. Dick, It is hard, but not impossible, to tan your deer hides at home. I've tried it twice & once I wound up with rawhide (suitable only for making a drum head) & the other time a servicable, but not very pretty leather. It takes a lot of time & attention. After salting & scraping (& you have to get ALL the meat & fat off - I used an old hacksaw blade expoxied lenghthwise into a slotted piece of wood), you have to soak it in a tanning solution for a couple of weeks (shredded oak bark mulch 'tea' is a good 'traditional' choice). Then you have to 'work' the leather a LOT over a wooden thing that looks sort of like the narrow end of an ironing board & you have to do this for quite a while every day as the hide dries. Or you could do it the way the Sioux Indian women tanned buffalo hides for their teepees & CHEW on the hide until it's tanned :). I'd say the professionals do it. There is a leather shop very near here that tans lots of hides for hunters every Fall. I don't remeber the price, but the last time I had it done (about 4 years ago) I think it ran about $35 per hide. You get your hides tanned & returned, it's not a swap. They will also do them in one of 3 colors: natural tan, brown or black. The leather looks very nice - I plann on using some of my hides for the cockpit coamings My suggestion is take them off the stretchers, cover the flesh side with a 50-50 mix of salt & borax, roll them up, bag them & stick them in a refrigerator until you can ship them off to be professionally tanned. I'll find the address of the local shop if you want it. I used to use a shop in FL, but the local folks turn out a nicer product & were cheaper. Kip Gardner (OH deer season coming up - maybe I'll get lucky again this year) North Canton, OH ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:37:22 AM PST US From: Gnwac@cs.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: GN-1 web site --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gnwac@cs.com In a message dated 11/14/03 10:12:44 AM Eastern Standard Time, jvydra@sbcglobal.net writes: > www.gregagn-1.com Great site for GN 1 builders. Looks fantastic Greg ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:43:04 AM PST US From: Gnwac@cs.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib profile question --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gnwac@cs.com Thanks Javier for the drawings Greg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:59:28 AM PST US From: Gnwac@cs.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flew up to "strutland" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gnwac@cs.com Let us know how we can get a hold of a couple Thanks Greg 302 462 5251 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:00:10 AM PST US From: Gnwac@cs.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flew up to "strutland" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gnwac@cs.com By the way, is that Sussex airport in Delaware? Greg ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:16:57 AM PST US From: Michael D Cuy Subject: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" >Mike Cuy: >It is not there. It is not report 767 nor TN 767 but it appears that the WR >means Wartime Report and I have no idea about the L. >Any chance you can see if they have it where you work? >Chirs Chris-- you are correct. Upon further research here with my morning coffee, I have learned that the WR does signify, like you say, a Wartime Report.....and the L stands for Lewis Research Center (which is right here--now called Glenn Research Center) and the 767 has been cross-referenced to a new numbering system which is being looked up as I type by one of our librarians. This report may very well be in the basement of our library. I will report back to you when I find out more. Mike ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:31:55 AM PST US From: Michael D Cuy Subject: Pietenpol-List: an answer for Chris Bobka --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy Chris-- I have the document you need and will be e-mailing it directly to you in a .pdf format. Otherwise, the report may be found by following this procedure: go to: http://techlib.grc.nasa.gov/ Choose Reserach Databases Choose NACA Digidoc System Choose Wartime Reports (WR) Scroll down to Doc# (ex: 767) Mike C. do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:32:00 AM PST US From: "Christian Bobka" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" Literally sitting on all that history....and information.... Chris do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D Cuy" Subject: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > > > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" > >Mike Cuy: > >It is not there. It is not report 767 nor TN 767 but it appears that the WR > >means Wartime Report and I have no idea about the L. > >Any chance you can see if they have it where you work? > >Chirs > > > Chris-- you are correct. Upon further research here with my morning > coffee, I have learned that the WR does signify, like you say, a Wartime > Report.....and the L stands for Lewis Research Center (which is right > here--now called Glenn Research Center) and the 767 has been > cross-referenced to a new numbering system which is being looked up as I > type by one of our librarians. This report may very well be in the > basement of our library. I will report back to you when I find out more. > > Mike > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:34:11 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 From: Craig Lawler --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Craig Lawler Walt, The noise problem with your mic's can be solved with a 35m film container. Drill a small hole in the side and cut the top so it will just slide over the mic. Leave the foam on inside the container when you put it on. Craig ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:34:13 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 From: Craig Lawler --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Craig Lawler Walt, The noise problem with your mic's can be solved with a 35m film container. Drill a small hole in the side and cut the top so it will just slide over the mic. Leave the foam on inside the container when you put it on. Craig ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:42:59 AM PST US From: Michael D Cuy Subject: Pietenpol-List: L for Langley Research Center --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy Only mis-information I gave you is that L in the report stands for Langely Research Center........named after the guy who with $$$$$backing from the Smithsonian flopped off his houseboat (Samuel Langely) in attempts at being the first to fly. Course Gustav Whithead didn't have the presence of mind have a photo taken of his famous flight......like those brothers from Dayton did. do not archive, but let the debate begin ! Mike C. do not archive do not archive, please..... ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:10 AM PST US From: Leo Gates Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: an answer for Chris Bobka --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Leo Gates Mike, I too am interested in this report. Trying your URL I get the msg. "Connection refused by ...". As you appear to work for NASA, maybe that is why you can access the site and I can not. Do not archive. Leo Gates Michael D Cuy wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > >Chris-- I have the document you need and will be e-mailing it directly to >you in a .pdf format. Otherwise, the report may be found by following >this procedure: > >go to: http://techlib.grc.nasa.gov/ > >Choose Reserach Databases >Choose NACA Digidoc System >Choose Wartime Reports (WR) >Scroll down to Doc# (ex: 767) > >Mike C. > >do not archive > > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:13:02 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Pietenpol-List: LOC? - What's That? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Matt Dralle Dear Listers, The List of Contributors (LOC) is a directory of everyone's name that made a Contribution during this year's List Fund Raiser. Its kind of my way of publicly thanking everyone that so generously made a Contribution to support the continued operation and upgrade of these Email Lists. This year's List of Contributors is just around the corner; I'll be posting the it on or about December 1. Support your Lists today and make sure that your name is on the upcoming LOC! Your friends will be checking, no doubt, to see if YOU make your Contribution because THEY did! :-) Support Contribution Info - http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft do not archive ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:16:53 AM PST US From: "Christian Bobka" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" Mike, thanks a lot. I got it ok and am printing it out now. A cylinder is a cylinder... Chris do not arcive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D Cuy" Subject: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > > > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" > >Mike Cuy: > >It is not there. It is not report 767 nor TN 767 but it appears that the WR > >means Wartime Report and I have no idea about the L. > >Any chance you can see if they have it where you work? > >Chirs > > > Chris-- you are correct. Upon further research here with my morning > coffee, I have learned that the WR does signify, like you say, a Wartime > Report.....and the L stands for Lewis Research Center (which is right > here--now called Glenn Research Center) and the 767 has been > cross-referenced to a new numbering system which is being looked up as I > type by one of our librarians. This report may very well be in the > basement of our library. I will report back to you when I find out more. > > Mike > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:36:41 AM PST US From: BARNSTMR@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: an answer for Chris Bobka --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com Mike... I couldn't get to the webpage you posted. could you please email me the report directly? Sounds like an interesting study. Thanks, Terry B In a message dated 11/18/2003 11:31:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov writes: > http://techlib.grc.nasa.gov/ Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:50:25 AM PST US From: "Norman Stapelberg" Subject: Pietenpol-List: New owner ZS-VJA --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Norman Stapelberg" Hi Everyone Just became a proud owner of a pietenpol aircamper TTSN 114hrs model 1989 Lycoming 0-235 eng SMOH 10.25hrs Airframe SMOH 0.25 hrs Regards Norman Stapelberg South Africa ZS-VJA (114.25hrs) ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:37:37 PM PST US From: "Eric Williams" Subject: Pietenpol-List: correct plans? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Eric Williams" I'm just checking to see if I got a complete set of plans with the project I acquired a couple weeks ago. I know I need to order the supplemental plans for the long fuselage but I didn't want to also order the original plans unless I need to. This is the list of sheets I have along with the date on the title block: #1 - Fuselage details, 1-19-33 #2 - Stabilizer and rudder details, 3-23-33 #3 - Split axle landing gear, 1-25-34 #4 - Dual control assembly, 2-26-34 #5 - Wing details, 3-3-34 #6 - Struts, tailskid, motor mount, 3-?-34 #7 - Cowling and 3-view of plane, 3-20-34 #8 - Model A conversion, (no date) There is also an additional, undated sheet showing the steel tube fuselage. Is this a complete set of the original plans? Also, in addition to the long fuse plans I would assume I should order the Builder's Manual and the 3-piece wing plans that the Piet family website sells. Is the Manual helpful and accurate? Thanks. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:05:38 PM PST US From: "w b evans" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flew up to "strutland" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "w b evans" Greg, No , it's in northern NJ walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flew up to "strutland" > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gnwac@cs.com > > By the way, is that Sussex airport in Delaware? > Greg > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 01:19:58 PM PST US From: "w b evans" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "w b evans" Craig, Great!!! I love it. In the past I've covered the mic with sponge, then the clear "egg" that kids get prizes out a gum machine in, then cut the bulb from a turky baster, and glued that to form a cup over your mouth. It seemed to work pretty good. ( but got alot of wierd looks at fly-ins) But I like this better. I'll try it. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Lawler" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 15 Msgs - 11/17/03 > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Craig Lawler > > Walt, > > The noise problem with your mic's can be solved with a 35m film > container. Drill a small hole in the side and cut the top so it will > just slide over the mic. Leave the foam on inside the container when > you put it on. > > Craig > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 01:55:19 PM PST US From: Michael D Cuy Subject: Pietenpol-List: report direct --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy >Mike... >I couldn't get to the webpage you posted. could you please email me the >report directly? Sounds like an interesting study. >Thanks, >Terry B Terry, Leo, others-- you bet. As long as you have adobe you will be able to open the report. I'll forward the report to anyone (directly) who would like it. It's really cool to see-----like in the old days when the whole report was typed by a secretary on a typewriter with a ribbon and all. When the phones were all black and had a rotary motion instead of touch-tone. Before they had beepers, cell phones, palm pilots, cad/cam, graphics packages, laser mouses, and pills for lowering your cholesterol and raising your........well.....enough. Mike C. do not archive ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 06:59:01 PM PST US From: Clif Dawson Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: report direct --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson I'd like that report too, Mike. All I got was a time out gateway error, twice. Thanks, Clif> > > Terry, Leo, others-- you bet. As long as you have adobe you will be able > to open the report. I'll forward the report to anyone (directly) who would > like it. It's really cool to see-----like in the old days when the whole > report was typed by a secretary on a typewriter with a ribbon and > all. When the phones were all black and had a rotary motion instead of > touch-tone. Before they had beepers, cell phones, palm pilots, cad/cam, > graphics packages, laser mouses, and pills for lowering your cholesterol > and raising your........well.....enough. > > Mike C. > > do not archive ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 07:16:09 PM PST US From: Clif Dawson Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fw: New System Three Website --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson Just in case anybody wants to access the engineering specs on T-88. Or a dealer near at hand. Clif Subject: New System Three Website Our new website is now live! In it you'll find many new features including a dealer locator, members section, discount coupons, MSDS, product data sheets as well as all our other published literature including catalog and price list. Just click on the link below. http://www.systemthree.com You have received this email because you downloaded literature from the old SystemThree.com website. This database will be destroyed after this transmission. If you wish to receive further communication from System Three Resins, please register as a member on the new site. ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 07:35:35 PM PST US From: Clif Dawson Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New owner ZS-VJA --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson So, do we get pictures??? Welcome to the list. Clif > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Norman Stapelberg" > > Hi Everyone > > Just became a proud owner of a pietenpol aircamper TTSN 114hrs model > 1989 Lycoming 0-235 eng SMOH 10.25hrs Airframe SMOH 0.25 hrs > > Regards > > > Norman Stapelberg > South Africa > ZS-VJA (114.25hrs) ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:38:07 PM PST US From: "Richard Navratil" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: leather --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil" Thanks Kip and Del I found a good book today at a local Indian trading post that goes through all of the methods. I'm going to ask my wife about that chewing thing, we'll see. They are soaking in water with bleach for now. Dick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kip & Beth Gardner" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: leather > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip & Beth Gardner > > At 11:07 PM -0500 11/17/03, Richard Navratil wrote: > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil" > > > > > >I would like to challange the collective knowledge and limits of the > >group. My appologies in advance. > >After a great week of deer hunting I have 2 nice large buck hides. They > >will make nice trim and seats if I tan them properly. > >Does anyone have any experience with leather? I know some of the basics. > >So far I have covered them in salt and stretched them on a rack and > >started scraping them. Iknow the old indian method would be to pee on it > >for the salt, scrape and work in beef or pork fat. > >I've tried the sporting good and western stores but havent found any info > >on this. > >Dick N. > > Dick, > > It is hard, but not impossible, to tan your deer hides at home. I've tried > it twice & once I wound up with rawhide (suitable only for making a drum > head) & the other time a servicable, but not very pretty leather. It takes > a lot of time & attention. After salting & scraping (& you have to get ALL > the meat & fat off - I used an old hacksaw blade expoxied lenghthwise into > a slotted piece of wood), you have to soak it in a tanning solution for a > couple of weeks (shredded oak bark mulch 'tea' is a good 'traditional' > choice). Then you have to 'work' the leather a LOT over a wooden thing that > looks sort of like the narrow end of an ironing board & you have to do this > for quite a while every day as the hide dries. > > Or you could do it the way the Sioux Indian women tanned buffalo hides for > their teepees & CHEW on the hide until it's tanned :). I'd say the > professionals do it. > > There is a leather shop very near here that tans lots of hides for hunters > every Fall. I don't remeber the price, but the last time I had it done > (about 4 years ago) I think it ran about $35 per hide. You get your hides > tanned & returned, it's not a swap. > > They will also do them in one of 3 colors: natural tan, brown or black. The > leather looks very nice - I plann on using some of my hides for the cockpit > coamings > > My suggestion is take them off the stretchers, cover the flesh side with a > 50-50 mix of salt & borax, roll them up, bag them & stick them in a > refrigerator until you can ship them off to be professionally tanned. I'll > find the address of the local shop if you want it. I used to use a shop in > FL, but the local folks turn out a nicer product & were cheaper. > > Kip Gardner (OH deer season coming up - maybe I'll get lucky again this year) > > > North Canton, OH > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 09:07:27 PM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Piet Fuel tanks --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Peter W Johnson" Hi Guys, What guage aluninum are you using for the front mounted fuse fuel tank. I am about ready to make mine up. Cheers Peter Wonthaggi, Australia http://cpc-world.cable.nu ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 09:10:16 PM PST US From: "Christian Bobka" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" Are we to argue over how to say Whithead? Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D Cuy" Subject: Pietenpol-List: standby one....... > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > > > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" > >Mike Cuy: > >It is not there. It is not report 767 nor TN 767 but it appears that the WR > >means Wartime Report and I have no idea about the L. > >Any chance you can see if they have it where you work? > >Chirs > > > Chris-- you are correct. Upon further research here with my morning > coffee, I have learned that the WR does signify, like you say, a Wartime > Report.....and the L stands for Lewis Research Center (which is right > here--now called Glenn Research Center) and the 767 has been > cross-referenced to a new numbering system which is being looked up as I > type by one of our librarians. This report may very well be in the > basement of our library. I will report back to you when I find out more. > > Mike > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 09:51:08 PM PST US From: "Christian Bobka" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: an answer for Chris Bobka --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" Leo, I tried to send a copy of the file obtatined from the piper library but it seems that it exceeds the max message size for your email. I think that the file mike has is smaller so we will try that. Chris bobka ----- Original Message ----- From: "Leo Gates" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: an answer for Chris Bobka > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Leo Gates > > Mike, > > I too am interested in this report. Trying your URL I get the msg. > "Connection refused by ...". As you appear to work for NASA, maybe that > is why you can access the site and I can not. > > Do not archive. > > Leo Gates > > Michael D Cuy wrote: > > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > > > >Chris-- I have the document you need and will be e-mailing it directly to > >you in a .pdf format. Otherwise, the report may be found by following > >this procedure: > > > >go to: http://techlib.grc.nasa.gov/ > > > >Choose Reserach Databases > >Choose NACA Digidoc System > >Choose Wartime Reports (WR) > >Scroll down to Doc# (ex: 767) > > > >Mike C. > > > >do not archive > > > > > > > > > >