Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:53 AM - Corvair questions (Oscar Zuniga)
2. 06:21 AM - Re: [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Kent Hallsten)
3. 06:52 AM - Wrights TV shows (Robert Haines)
4. 07:06 AM - Re: Corvair College in Ohio? (Gadd, Skip)
5. 07:37 AM - Re: [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (catdesign@intergate.com)
6. 10:18 AM - Free copy of "To Fly".... (Jim Markle)
7. 10:24 AM - Re: Free copy of "To Fly".... (Bruce __)
8. 12:17 PM - Free copy of "To Fly"....it got snapped up pretty quickly (Jim Markle)
9. 12:26 PM - Re: [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (w b evans)
10. 03:55 PM - capstrip and Gusset plates (William Rives Young)
11. 04:14 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Jack Phillips)
12. 04:36 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Isablcorky@aol.com)
13. 04:45 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (hjarrett)
14. 04:48 PM - Re: Corvair questions & OH Corvair College (Kip & Beth Gardner)
15. 04:52 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Lauritz Larsen)
16. 05:30 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (TomTravis@aol.com)
17. 05:42 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Richard Navratil)
18. 06:20 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Kip & Beth Gardner)
19. 07:01 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Christian Bobka)
20. 07:12 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (Christian Bobka)
21. 07:49 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (hjarrett)
22. 07:59 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (del magsam)
23. 08:39 PM - Re: capstrip and Gusset plates (JamesJboyer@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Corvair questions |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
First, the disclaimer (sorry Gene; I just had to do that ;o)- Jon wrote:
>after checking the #s I found that one is a pre '65, and
>I don't recall the exact hp, but it is less than 110 hp.
It is a nominal 95 HP. Still plenty good for the Pietenpol, but if you're
going to go to the effort of converting a Corvair, it's the same cost and
labor to convert the 110 HP as it is the 95 HP (some might say it's even
more, since parts for the 95 HP are less common).
>Will this have any parts usable on the 110?
Yes, very many. If the engine is complete, by all means pick it up!
>so far all I could find was the difference in cranks (pre 65's are weaker?)
The crank on the 110 HP has a longer stroke to increase the displacement,
and the inside of the crankcase is relieved in order to clear the crank
throws and rods. That's the main drawback to trying to convert a 95 HP...
you have to do all the interior relieving yourself (assuming you're using an
8409 crank from a 110 HP in your conversion). Not a deal-breaker by any
means, but it depends on your comfort level doing engine work.
>and bore size.
Right. Different cylinders.
>I am also wondering if I need to get some sort of bell housing
Yes, the bell housing is what is used to make the front cover for the
engine. The 'bell' part is cut off to leave simply the front cover. There
are excellent photos of all of this on D.J. Vegh's and Pat Panzera's
websites, so if you need more guidance don't feel like you're out there on
your own.
>I do plan on getting William's conversion manual
Don't just plan on it... do it! The conversion manual will answer all your
questions and more. But for now, don't pass up this 95 HP engine if it's
complete and if it can be turned by putting a socket on it and turning it
over (or if it was running when removed from the car).
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 2
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| Subject: | [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Kent Hallsten" <KHallsten@Governair.com>
Corky,
She's a beauty! I really like the paint job. This is great inspiration.
Kent
do not archive
> A new Email List Photo Share is available:
>
> Poster: Claude Corbett <Isablcorky@aol.com>
>
>
> Subject: Pietenpol NX41CC completed 9/28/02 by Claude Corbett
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Isablcorky@aol.com.12.17.2
> 003/index.html
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Wrights TV shows |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Robert Haines" <robertsjunk@hotmail.com>
Spent most of last evening flipping back and forth between the History
Channel and the Discovery Channel. One thing that got me was the story
about Beuford over in Indiana who already built his 1903 replica but
couldn't fly it without a license. He couldn't get a license without a
medical. But his friends convinced him to try and fly it anyway, which he
did.
That's the part of the story that I think pertains to this list. (Corky?,
wink wink nudge nudge)
Robert Haines
Du Quoin, Illinois
Message 4
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| Subject: | Corvair College in Ohio? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gadd, Skip" <Skip.Gadd@ssa.gov>
166 total days
>Hey Skip
>How's the count down to retirement coming along?
>Dick
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "catdesign@intergate.com" <catdesign@intergate.com>
Nice Corky, very nice.
Chris T.
Sacramento, Ca
do not archive
Quoting Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares
> <pictures@matronics.com>
>
>
> A new Email List Photo Share is available:
>
> Poster: Claude Corbett <Isablcorky@aol.com>
>
>
> Subject: Pietenpol NX41CC completed 9/28/02 by Claude Corbett
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Isablcorky@aol.com.12.17.2003/index.html
>
>
> o Main Photo Share Index
>
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
>
> o Submitting a Photo Share
>
> If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
> following information along with your email message and files:
>
> 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
> 2) Your Full Name:
> 3) Your Email Address:
> 4) One line Subject description:
> 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
> 6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
>
> Email the information above and your files and photos to:
>
> pictures@matronics.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-------------------------------------------------
Message 6
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| Subject: | Free copy of "To Fly".... |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
I just got my membership package from the Sport Aviation Association (if you
haven't joined...do it now!!!) and it included the Winter 2003 issue of To
Fly.....
Well, I got a copy several weeks ago so now I have 2.......
So who wants it?
It's still in the envelope (I've removed the membership card, etc) and all I
need to do is re-address it and say "not at this address" and have the post
office deliver it again for free!!!!...hehehehe...just kidding....I can use
the same envelope though......
If you aren't familiar with the SAA and/or To Fly....well, you're in for a
treat! Alan Wise told me 2 years ago at Brodhead to join the SAA and like a
dummy I waited.....I shouldn't have.....
I'll be glad to send it to the first (NON SAA member) response with an
address...........
Jim in Plano.......
Message 7
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|
| Subject: | Free copy of "To Fly".... |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bruce __" <bruce___@hotmail.com>
Hello,
I'd like it if it's still available.
Thanks,
Bruce
>From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Free copy of "To Fly"....
>Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 12:19:47 -0600
>
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle"
><jim_markle@mindspring.com>
>
>
>I just got my membership package from the Sport Aviation Association (if
>you
>haven't joined...do it now!!!) and it included the Winter 2003 issue of To
>Fly.....
>
>Well, I got a copy several weeks ago so now I have 2.......
>
>So who wants it?
>
>It's still in the envelope (I've removed the membership card, etc) and all
>I
>need to do is re-address it and say "not at this address" and have the post
>office deliver it again for free!!!!...hehehehe...just kidding....I can use
>the same envelope though......
>
>If you aren't familiar with the SAA and/or To Fly....well, you're in for a
>treat! Alan Wise told me 2 years ago at Brodhead to join the SAA and like
>a
>dummy I waited.....I shouldn't have.....
>
>I'll be glad to send it to the first (NON SAA member) response with an
>address...........
>
>Jim in Plano.......
>
>
Tired of slow downloads? Compare online deals from your local high-speed
providers now. https://broadband.msn.com
Message 8
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| Subject: | Free copy of "To Fly"....it got snapped up pretty quickly |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
Wow, I should have SOLD it!!!! :-)
Quite a few responded and it's in the mail already.....
Jim in Plano
> >From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Free copy of "To Fly"....
> >Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 12:19:47 -0600
> >
> >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle"
> ><jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >
> >
> >I just got my membership package from the Sport Aviation Association (if
> >you
> >haven't joined...do it now!!!) and it included the Winter 2003 issue of
To
> >Fly.....
> >
> >Well, I got a copy several weeks ago so now I have 2.......
> >
> >So who wants it?
> >
> >It's still in the envelope (I've removed the membership card, etc) and
all
> >I
> >need to do is re-address it and say "not at this address" and have the
post
> >office deliver it again for free!!!!...hehehehe...just kidding....I can
use
> >the same envelope though......
> >
> >If you aren't familiar with the SAA and/or To Fly....well, you're in for
a
> >treat! Alan Wise told me 2 years ago at Brodhead to join the SAA and
like
> >a
> >dummy I waited.....I shouldn't have.....
> >
> >I'll be glad to send it to the first (NON SAA member) response with an
> >address...........
> >
> >Jim in Plano.......
> >
> >
>
> Tired of slow downloads? Compare online deals from your local high-speed
> providers now. https://broadband.msn.com
>
>
Message 9
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"Email List Photo Shares" <pictures@matronics.com>
| Subject: | Re: [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "w b evans" <wbeevans@verizon.net>
Corky,
Great pics!!
Plane looks great!
Ain't life grand!
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Email List Photo Shares" <pictures@matronics.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: [ Claude Corbett ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares
<pictures@matronics.com>
>
>
> A new Email List Photo Share is available:
>
> Poster: Claude Corbett <Isablcorky@aol.com>
>
>
> Subject: Pietenpol NX41CC completed 9/28/02 by Claude Corbett
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Isablcorky@aol.com.12.17.2003/index.html
>
>
> o Main Photo Share Index
>
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
>
> o Submitting a Photo Share
>
> If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include
the
> following information along with your email message and files:
>
> 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
> 2) Your Full Name:
> 3) Your Email Address:
> 4) One line Subject description:
> 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
> 6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
>
> Email the information above and your files and photos to:
>
> pictures@matronics.com
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young" <wry22@drexel.edu>
I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time school
interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to make gusset
plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells plywood that tin.
I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps strips. I have
tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir. The reason that
I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is because I will only
be able to afford to do this a little at a time until I am out of college. Any
suggestions?
Will
Message 11
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| Subject: | capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
For the plywood, you might try a hobby shop. Many of them carry aircraft
grade thin plywood for building model airplanes. As for the douglas fir,
you can get it at home depot. Ask for it, and be prepared to be very
selective in choosing you pieces. If using Douglas Fir, I would make the
capstrips smaller than the plans call for. Most planes using spruce only
make the ribs 1/4" thick - The Piet is the only small plane I know of with
1/2" wide capstrips. DOuglas Fir is substantially heavier than spruce, and
also stronger, but the extra strength is of no advantage if you make the
pieces the same size.
Good Luck,
Jack Phillips
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William
Rives Young
Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
<wry22@drexel.edu>
I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time
school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to make
gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells plywood
that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir.
The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is
because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time until I
am out of college. Any suggestions?
Will
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Isablcorky@aol.com
Will,
I've heard that if there is a Will, there's a way. ( Corny isn't it)
You asked for suggestions and if you were my son in college this is what I
would answer.
1 Put your mind and efforts on the books
2 Finish with the highest possible GPA
3 Get a good job then you can order what you want when you need it
4 Build your Piet
5 Then after all the Piet stuff is done, then think about getting married
Corky in La where all the mistakes have been made
PS Sure hope some of you Pieters pull for the Tigers in the Sugar Bowl
Do Not Archive
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
WOAH!! Don't go to Home Depot or Lowe's for your wood unless you know
exactly what you are looking for and can insure it's what you want without
help from them. I tried to get some Doug Fir at Home Quarters (or one of
those places anyway) and the guy in the lumber section told me they didn't
sell fir there, that I would have to go to a sewing place to get it!!! I
asked to speak to the lumber manager and found out he was! These guys DON'T
KNOW SQUAT about wood. Your best bet is to talk to some of the local boat
or furniture builders and find out where there is a REAL lumber yard. As
for 1/16 ply you will probably be best off to get that at the same place.
There are places you can mail order but the shipping is pretty steep. Read
up on the grain requirements for the wood you will need on the internet and
you might want to get some cheap stuff and build a couple of ribs from it to
start. Might as well learn to rip the strips and make good glue joints on
some cheap pine while you are looking for the good wood.
Where are you located? Maybe somebody is close enough to point you to a
good source of raw material. Are you anywhere in the South East VA area?
Hank J
----- Original Message -----
From: "William Rives Young" <wry22@drexel.edu>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
<wry22@drexel.edu>
>
> I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time
school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to make
gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells plywood
that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir.
The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is
because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time until I
am out of college. Any suggestions?
>
>
> Will
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair questions & OH Corvair College |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip & Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
At 8:50 AM -0500 12/18/03, Oscar Zuniga wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
>
>First, the disclaimer (sorry Gene; I just had to do that ;o)- Jon wrote:
>It is a nominal 95 HP. Still plenty good for the Pietenpol, but if you're
>going to go to the effort of converting a Corvair, it's the same cost and
>labor to convert the 110 HP as it is the 95 HP (some might say it's even
>more, since parts for the 95 HP are less common).
>>I do plan on getting William's conversion manual
>
>Don't just plan on it... do it! The conversion manual will answer all your
>questions and more. But for now, don't pass up this 95 HP engine if it's
>complete and if it can be turned by putting a socket on it and turning it
>over (or if it was running when removed from the car).
>
>Oscar Zuniga
Group,
As an historical aside, I believe that the 95 hp was what Bernie put on his
first Covair-powered Piet, the one that's at Oshkosh. He put a 110 hp on
the second one - "The Last Original", the one that Andrew P. owned until
last year when he sold it to the group at Brodhead.
By ALL means get WW's manual, it's really the only way to go at this point,
although there are still many Piets flying on some variant of Bernie's
original conversion plans.
In the past 2 days I've had a very good response to the idea of a Corvair
College in OH, both from this list and the CorvairCraft folks (about 14
positives or 'definite maybes'), so I'll get back in touch with William
about it. Right now, based on responses, I'm inclined to ask him if he can
come during the Aeronca Fly-In, which in the past three years has been on
the weekend FOLLOWING the last weekend of Oshkosh (August 8,9,10 thios
year). This would make it possible for William to stop here on his way home
from Oshkosh. the TaylorCraft Fly-in always falls very close to July 4th, &
I got the impression form a few people that this would be a problem.
I'll let everyone know how it all shapes up.
Merry Christmas everyone!
Kip Gardner
North Canton, OH
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Lauritz Larsen" <pietlars@earthlink.net>
Re; Douglas Fir
I have found that Home Depot and Lowe's do carry a limited stock of 'clear'
fir trim stock; it usually 1" stuff though and fairly high priced.
Try a lumber yard that caters to contractors and ask to see their clear fir.
I found a good selection at a couple of yards. 84 Lumber has it in this
area.
When you find some fir , pick out the clear, straight grained pieces and
then "heft" them. There is a wide variation in the densities of fir stock.
Using this method I have found some fir pieces that are only about 10%
heavier than the nominal spruce density. I prefer to buy 2" sticks, gives
more flexibility in utilizing to best advantage.
I have built my piet using all fir for structural members and some red cedar
and white pine for the rest .
Putting the last color coat on the fuselage and when thats done, I'm done
painting!!
Lou Larsen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips"
<pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
>
> For the plywood, you might try a hobby shop. Many of them carry aircraft
> grade thin plywood for building model airplanes. As for the douglas fir,
> you can get it at home depot. Ask for it, and be prepared to be very
> selective in choosing you pieces. If using Douglas Fir, I would make the
> capstrips smaller than the plans call for. Most planes using spruce only
> make the ribs 1/4" thick - The Piet is the only small plane I know of with
> 1/2" wide capstrips. DOuglas Fir is substantially heavier than spruce,
and
> also stronger, but the extra strength is of no advantage if you make the
> pieces the same size.
>
> Good Luck,
>
> Jack Phillips
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William
> Rives Young
> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 4:26 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
> <wry22@drexel.edu>
>
> I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time
> school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to
make
> gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells
plywood
> that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
> strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir.
> The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is
> because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time until
I
> am out of college. Any suggestions?
>
>
> Will
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: TomTravis@aol.com
For 1/16" plywood for gussets you might try a place that sells plywood for
doors. Here in Dallas there is a place called Plywood Door that sells just what
you need. Since it isn't labeled "Airplane" the price is reasonable too.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
It would be very helpful to know where you are located.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "William Rives Young" <wry22@drexel.edu>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
<wry22@drexel.edu>
>
> I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time
school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to make
gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells plywood
that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir.
The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is
because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time until I
am out of college. Any suggestions?
>
>
> Will
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip & Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
At 8:42 PM -0500 12/18/03, Richard Navratil wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
><horzpool@goldengate.net>
>
>It would be very helpful to know where you are located.
>Dick
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "William Rives Young" <wry22@drexel.edu>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
>
>
>> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
><wry22@drexel.edu>
>>
>> I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time
>school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to make
>gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells plywood
>that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
>strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir.
>The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is
>because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time until I
>am out of college. Any suggestions?
>>
>>
>> Will
Will,
Ribs are a good college project. I used to build R/C sailplanes in my
college room - about the same scale operation. Access to a 'real' workshop
for making your jig, ripping boards, etc. would be nice, however. Do that
stuff when you are home on break.
Both ACS & Wicks sell 1/16" plywood, but it is expensive, I think the
smallest piece they'll sell is 2'x2' & you pay alot for shipping. Hobby
Shops usually sell aircraft grade ply - mostly birch ply, in my experience.
The advantage is that someone on a budget can buy a little at a time, the
R/C guys use a lot less for one of their birds than we do for ours.
Locally, our shops sell pieces that are about 9x18". The price is
reasonable.
I don't know about other places, but when I tried to get good ply from REAL
lumber yards (the best ones locally), all they carried was what they called
'Baltic' or 'Furniture' grade - interior use only, the glue is not
waterproof.
Any place that caters to boat builders is a good choice. Marine-grade is
almost, if not as good as aircraft grade, especially the stuff used for
'molded' boat construction using WEST System epoxy. To meet the specs for
that application, the wood has to pass tests similar to aircraft grade
(waterproof glue, immersion &'boil' tests, no between-ply gaps, etc.).
Good luck, like Corky said, don't let it get in the way of school. I told
my nephew many, many times not to cut classes, be he kept saying "it's all
in the books, I'll just study them, I'm too busy working". It's taken him
an extra 2 years to graduate & he pissed away an academic scholarship by
letting his grades slip. Now he's finding out that the engineers being
hired are the ones who kept their GPA's up.
Cheers,
Kip Gardner
North Canton, OH
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" <bobka@compuserve.com>
Tom,
Is the door skin waterproof?
Chris Bobka
----- Original Message -----
From: <TomTravis@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: TomTravis@aol.com
>
> For 1/16" plywood for gussets you might try a place that sells plywood for
> doors. Here in Dallas there is a place called Plywood Door that sells just
what
> you need. Since it isn't labeled "Airplane" the price is reasonable too.
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" <bobka@compuserve.com>
Hank,
That is as funny as it comes.
I remember looking to "cut my own" capstrips but when you look at how LITTLE
it costs for the stuff, you can't do it for less.
Even a Stearman uses capstrips smaller than the Piet at 3/8 x 3/8 and the
Stearman is a real clunker i.e. heavy and way overbuilt.
So you use 3/8 x 3/8 in the piet and that is .27 a foot at wicks. Figure
three 5 foot sticks per rib and you are at 5 bucks per rib, You can't do
better than that at Home Depot.
You need a planer to plane down the 3/4 to a 1/2, etc.
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
>
> WOAH!! Don't go to Home Depot or Lowe's for your wood unless you know
> exactly what you are looking for and can insure it's what you want without
> help from them. I tried to get some Doug Fir at Home Quarters (or one of
> those places anyway) and the guy in the lumber section told me they didn't
> sell fir there, that I would have to go to a sewing place to get it!!! I
> asked to speak to the lumber manager and found out he was! These guys
DON'T
> KNOW SQUAT about wood. Your best bet is to talk to some of the local boat
> or furniture builders and find out where there is a REAL lumber yard. As
> for 1/16 ply you will probably be best off to get that at the same place.
> There are places you can mail order but the shipping is pretty steep.
Read
> up on the grain requirements for the wood you will need on the internet
and
> you might want to get some cheap stuff and build a couple of ribs from it
to
> start. Might as well learn to rip the strips and make good glue joints on
> some cheap pine while you are looking for the good wood.
> Where are you located? Maybe somebody is close enough to point you to a
> good source of raw material. Are you anywhere in the South East VA area?
> Hank J
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "William Rives Young" <wry22@drexel.edu>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
> <wry22@drexel.edu>
> >
> > I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last
time
> school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to
make
> gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells
plywood
> that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
> strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir.
> The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is
> because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time until
I
> am out of college. Any suggestions?
> >
> >
> > Will
> >
> >
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
I'm not saying don't buy your material at a home improvement place, I'm
saying don't trust the employees to give you the right stuff. If you are
going to buy wood there you need to know enough about how to inspect and
grade it to choose what you need. You also can't count on the labels on the
bins. It's all just wood to the kid working after school. Know what you
need, know what it looks, smells and even tastes like, and know what the
grain is supposed to be. The Piet is way overbuilt (in most places) but
that is why so few people kill themselves in them. I don't remember
anything ever failing that was put together like it was designed if the
pilot didn't do something dumb (not many planes survive encounters with
"Cumulo Granitus").
I'll stand by my statement "Don't go to Home Depot or Lowe's for your wood
unless you know exactly what you are looking for and can insure it's what
you want without help from them."
Hank J
Should have heard his answer to "Got any Ash?"
----- Original Message -----
From: "Christian Bobka" <bobka@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka"
<bobka@compuserve.com>
>
> Hank,
>
> That is as funny as it comes.
>
> I remember looking to "cut my own" capstrips but when you look at how
LITTLE
> it costs for the stuff, you can't do it for less.
>
> Even a Stearman uses capstrips smaller than the Piet at 3/8 x 3/8 and the
> Stearman is a real clunker i.e. heavy and way overbuilt.
>
> So you use 3/8 x 3/8 in the piet and that is .27 a foot at wicks. Figure
> three 5 foot sticks per rib and you are at 5 bucks per rib, You can't do
> better than that at Home Depot.
>
> You need a planer to plane down the 3/4 to a 1/2, etc.
>
> Chris
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
> >
> > WOAH!! Don't go to Home Depot or Lowe's for your wood unless you know
> > exactly what you are looking for and can insure it's what you want
without
> > help from them. I tried to get some Doug Fir at Home Quarters (or one
of
> > those places anyway) and the guy in the lumber section told me they
didn't
> > sell fir there, that I would have to go to a sewing place to get it!!!
I
> > asked to speak to the lumber manager and found out he was! These guys
> DON'T
> > KNOW SQUAT about wood. Your best bet is to talk to some of the local
boat
> > or furniture builders and find out where there is a REAL lumber yard.
As
> > for 1/16 ply you will probably be best off to get that at the same
place.
> > There are places you can mail order but the shipping is pretty steep.
> Read
> > up on the grain requirements for the wood you will need on the internet
> and
> > you might want to get some cheap stuff and build a couple of ribs from
it
> to
> > start. Might as well learn to rip the strips and make good glue joints
on
> > some cheap pine while you are looking for the good wood.
> > Where are you located? Maybe somebody is close enough to point you to a
> > good source of raw material. Are you anywhere in the South East VA
area?
> > Hank J
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "William Rives Young" <wry22@drexel.edu>
> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: capstrip and Gusset plates
> >
> >
> > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
> > <wry22@drexel.edu>
> > >
> > > I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last
> time
> > school interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to
> make
> > gusset plates. The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells
> plywood
> > that tin. I am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps
> > strips. I have tried home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas
fir.
> > The reason that I haven't ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks
is
> > because I will only be able to afford to do this a little at a time
until
> I
> > am out of college. Any suggestions?
> > >
> > >
> > > Will
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: del magsam <farmerdel@rocketmail.com>
Hi Will
another good wood for the cap strips is western cedar. they make house siding out
of this. so you might be able to find this at home depot. I havn't personally
looked for it. but a guy by the name of charles makes ribs for other people,
a lot of them flying. and thats what he uses. try a local wood supplier that
sells to cabinet shops for the 1/16 plywood. or call aircraft spruce or wicks
and see if they have a bunch of scraps that will work for the rib gussets.
Del
William Rives Young <wry22@drexel.edu> wrote:
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "William Rives Young"
I am getting ready to try and start making my wing ribs again. Last time school
interfered. I am having trouble finding plywood thin enough to make gusset plates.
The plans call for 1/16 inch plates and nobody sells plywood that tin. I
am also having trouble finding Douglas fir to make the caps strips. I have tried
home depot and Lowe's and neither carry Douglas fir. The reason that I haven't
ordered spruce from aircraft spruce or wicks is because I will only be able
to afford to do this a little at a time until I am out of college. Any suggestions?
Will
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel@rocketmail.com"
---------------------------------
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: capstrip and Gusset plates |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: JamesJboyer@aol.com
Will,
Go to a model shop that handles Radio Control model and materials. They will
have 1/16'' plywood that is good for rib gussets; its what I used on all 32
ribs and about 100 plus RC models over the years.
Go to a regular lumber yard that has Douglas Fir flooring S4S. Select the
planks you want based on number of growth rings per inch and also for being
quarter sawn (not all will be). Also select for comparable densities (by weight)
of
planks to be used for wing ribs, longerons, etc. If the lumber yard is not
willing to let you select the wood you want go to another lumber yard.
My Piet is entirely built of Doug Fir and RC model ply for rib gussets and
3mm and 6mm Marine Mahogany plywood for the fuselage. Its every bit as good as
aircraft graded plywood, much easier to find and 1/3 the price.
I was able to select planks that met the growth ring and quarter sawn
requirements in lengths of 12, 14, and 16 footers (16 footers were used to cut
the
fuselage longerons). I got the help from two members of my EAA chapter 124 to
help with the cutting to size. Only cost a couple of six packs and some hot dogs
after the milling session.
Don't try to cut the pieces under size due to Doug Firs greater strength.
Look at the entire airplane; very little of the final weight is in the wood (not
counting all the plywood components). You will add far more weight in the
decisions you make to paint, cover, add equipment, etc. The most critical weight
decision is your tailwheel/spring combination due to its weight being so far
aft of the CG.
Use your native common sense Will and get some help from an EAA chapter guy
who has either built a wood plane or rebuilt an Aeronca Champ, J-3 Cub, etc.
Good Luck. Read what's listed on the web but use your common sense to
evaluate it, or an airplane nerd as I mentioned in sentence above. Listen to what
Mike Cuy, Eldridge (sp) and others like Corky, but they're only experts based on
the airplane they built.
Well, I've probably burned myself up with this message, but if you have
questions just email.
My caveat is my Piet is not yet flying. Its wood construction is done, and
over 100 4130 steel parts as of today. My Corvair engine is also about ready for
assembly but still have some case oil passages to clean. See DJ's messages
for info on Corvairs assembly, his is spotless.
Cheers, Jim
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