---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 01/06/04: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:00 AM - Test, Please Ignore. (Matt Dralle) 2. 04:46 AM - Auto Cad Pietenpol drawings (rhartwig11@juno.com) 3. 07:23 AM - Re: Corvair engines in AL (Robert Haines) 4. 08:54 AM - Re: Re: Corvair engines in AL (Jim Markle) 5. 06:53 PM - Re: Re: Corvair engines in AL (Kip and Beth Gardner) 6. 08:50 PM - Corvair engines in AL (Jim Markle) 7. 10:30 PM - mid- air collision (Christian Bobka) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:00:24 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Pietenpol-List: Test, Please Ignore. This is a test. Please ignore. Matt #4 Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:46:05 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Auto Cad Pietenpol drawings From: rhartwig11@juno.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: rhartwig11@juno.com Rick, I like the idea of the AutoCad Piet drawings. First time aircraft builders would really benefit from this. This project is something that Pietenpol Listers could finance and put the results in public domain. There would have to be an agreement with the Pietenpol family so that they would continue to get compensation and so the planes would be "real Pietenpols." The KR group launched a new airfoil project, financing it with donations from their list. A new airfoil was designed specifically for the KR series and is now in the public domain (free download.) I understand that most new KR's are using it. Dick Hartwig ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:23:35 AM PST US From: "Robert Haines" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Corvair engines in AL --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Robert Haines" Jim, One note about loading a pickup truck... four engines will fit nicely in the bed of a full size truck, except the wheel wells are in the way. Before I left, I used the notches in the bed liner to set 2x6's (2x4's will work as well) from side to side, put short feet midway down to the bed, and set a 1/2 sheet of plywood over the top. This made a table about eight inches off the bed over the wells, which is what the notches are there for in the first place. The feet were there since I didn't trust the 1/8" ABS molded bed liner to support over 1000lbs of engines; it surely would have cracked. The nice thing was that I was able to slide the extra heads and stuff underneath, it was a beautiful thing. The drive for me was almost six hours one way, but the weather was nice, the window was down, and I now don't have to worry about finding cores anymore. Now the following may get under some skins but I'll share anyway. :) Yesterday afternoon, I received an email from a local member of CORSA who knew I was looking for a 110 engine core. He had found a local guy who was getting rid of his parts car which had an engine in it, the asking price for the whole car was $100 and it was 10 minutes from where I work. I of course immediatly called and went by after work last night to take a look. It was a '66 smog 110 (-RA) but otherwise was a really nice core. I have already passed the torch to Jon Jones in MO since I already have all I need. I guess when it rains, it pours. Robert Haines Du Quoin, Illinois > From: Jim Markle > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Corvair engines in AL > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle > > I have a Silverado if anyone wants to work together to look into what's left and > maybe go load up my truck (and share expenses), let me know.... > > Jim in Plano..... > > And thanks Robert! > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Haines > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Corvair engines in AL > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Robert Haines" > > There was a guy from Alabama that left a brief post a few weeks ago on the > Yahoo Corvair group stating that he had engines. He wasn't an airplane guy, > he just had a lot of junk. So after a few emails with him, I decided to > drive down last weekend. I got four 110hp engines, all were complete, three > were '65-'68, one was a '64. I got an extra crank, an extra set of heads, > three 12 row fin oil coolers, an extra set of pushrod tubes, an extra set of > valve covers, two side draft motorcycle carbs, and a gascolator for my > Model-A. It was $400 for the engines, the rest he just loaded into my > truck. At $400, I didn't have the heart to pay him any less. > > He still has five 110hp engines in the barn, one '65-'68 (suffix RH), and > the rest are '64 (suffix YN if memory serves me, I was a little overwhelmed > at the time). On the loft of the barn, he said there were additional heads > up there, but I didn't go up to look (the floor was falling through). He > also has an old van parked out back with six engines, two were partial > (missing at least one head), and at least one was low HP. I couldn't check > the others without emptying the van. He also had at least a dozen Corvairs > on his property. My guess is there are a couple of the right cores in > those. The nicest Car on the property, which is not to far off of being > drivable, had a 110 badge on the trunk. > > This gentleman is just a good-old-boy who's partied a little hard in his > life. His property was a mess. All the Corvair stuff was from his dad and > he had no interest in it other than selling it. I think he had in the past > twice the quantity of engines but has recently been tearing them down and > selling the aluminum for scrap. What I'm saying here is if you are > interested, you probably should act fast. > > A note about the barn. It's full of stuff. There are Corvair cylinders > lying all over the place. There's a few cranks, distributors, pistons and > rods, and other miscellaneous parts just lying around. This doesn't count > the flathead Ford engines parts, old fenders, radios, and countless other > non-Corvair parts that were interesting. The barn is falling apart with > holes in the roof and only about half of it was dry. Don't expect to walk > into a clean shop and have perfect engines sitting on engine stands; wear > boots and get a Tetanus shot first. > > Just up the interstate from where he lives is a large utility trailer > manufacturer/retailer. I had a hard time not buying a 16 footer and going > back for more. By the way, four engines in the back is about all a Ford 150 > can manage, I white knuckled it all the way home. He wanted to give me a > couple of extra Corvair blocks in case one of my cranks were bad or wrong, I > couldn't take them simply due to the weight in the truck already. > > His name was Eric Lippert in Cullman, AL. He's got no phone, but he does > have satellite internet and his email is justeric1agn@yahoo.com. He's a > nice guy, looks like he could use the money, and would like to see these > engines being used as opposed to melted down. > > > Robert Haines > Du Quoin, Illinois > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:54:26 AM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Corvair engines in AL --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle Thanks Robert, I have a big flatbed trailer and will probably (if this all comes together) use that. It's going to be about 10-12 hours of driving for me but if I can pick up enough cores for 3 or 4 or us, that's not bad. (Well, it is bad but worth it!) So we'll see. I sent an email but haven't heard anything yet.... And yes, when it rains it pours! You gotta love it.... Thanks again, JM -----Original Message----- From: Robert Haines Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Corvair engines in AL --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Robert Haines" Jim, One note about loading a pickup truck... four engines will fit nicely in the bed of a full size truck, except the wheel wells are in the way. Before I left, I used the notches in the bed liner to set 2x6's (2x4's will work as well) from side to side, put short feet midway down to the bed, and set a 1/2 sheet of plywood over the top. This made a table about eight inches off the bed over the wells, which is what the notches are there for in the first place. The feet were there since I didn't trust the 1/8" ABS molded bed liner to support over 1000lbs of engines; it surely would have cracked. The nice thing was that I was able to slide the extra heads and stuff underneath, it was a beautiful thing. The drive for me was almost six hours one way, but the weather was nice, the window was down, and I now don't have to worry about finding cores anymore. Now the following may get under some skins but I'll share anyway. :) Yesterday afternoon, I received an email from a local member of CORSA who knew I was looking for a 110 engine core. He had found a local guy who was getting rid of his parts car which had an engine in it, the asking price for the whole car was $100 and it was 10 minutes from where I work. I of course immediatly called and went by after work last night to take a look. It was a '66 smog 110 (-RA) but otherwise was a really nice core. I have already passed the torch to Jon Jones in MO since I already have all I need. I guess when it rains, it pours. Robert Haines Du Quoin, Illinois > From: Jim Markle > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Corvair engines in AL > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle > > I have a Silverado if anyone wants to work together to look into what's left and > maybe go load up my truck (and share expenses), let me know.... > > Jim in Plano..... > > And thanks Robert! > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Haines > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Corvair engines in AL > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Robert Haines" > > There was a guy from Alabama that left a brief post a few weeks ago on the > Yahoo Corvair group stating that he had engines. He wasn't an airplane guy, > he just had a lot of junk. So after a few emails with him, I decided to > drive down last weekend. I got four 110hp engines, all were complete, three > were '65-'68, one was a '64. I got an extra crank, an extra set of heads, > three 12 row fin oil coolers, an extra set of pushrod tubes, an extra set of > valve covers, two side draft motorcycle carbs, and a gascolator for my > Model-A. It was $400 for the engines, the rest he just loaded into my > truck. At $400, I didn't have the heart to pay him any less. > > He still has five 110hp engines in the barn, one '65-'68 (suffix RH), and > the rest are '64 (suffix YN if memory serves me, I was a little overwhelmed > at the time). On the loft of the barn, he said there were additional heads > up there, but I didn't go up to look (the floor was falling through). He > also has an old van parked out back with six engines, two were partial > (missing at least one head), and at least one was low HP. I couldn't check > the others without emptying the van. He also had at least a dozen Corvairs > on his property. My guess is there are a couple of the right cores in > those. The nicest Car on the property, which is not to far off of being > drivable, had a 110 badge on the trunk. > > This gentleman is just a good-old-boy who's partied a little hard in his > life. His property was a mess. All the Corvair stuff was from his dad and > he had no interest in it other than selling it. I think he had in the past > twice the quantity of engines but has recently been tearing them down and > selling the aluminum for scrap. What I'm saying here is if you are > interested, you probably should act fast. > > A note about the barn. It's full of stuff. There are Corvair cylinders > lying all over the place. There's a few cranks, distributors, pistons and > rods, and other miscellaneous parts just lying around. This doesn't count > the flathead Ford engines parts, old fenders, radios, and countless other > non-Corvair parts that were interesting. The barn is falling apart with > holes in the roof and only about half of it was dry. Don't expect to walk > into a clean shop and have perfect engines sitting on engine stands; wear > boots and get a Tetanus shot first. > > Just up the interstate from where he lives is a large utility trailer > manufacturer/retailer. I had a hard time not buying a 16 footer and going > back for more. By the way, four engines in the back is about all a Ford 150 > can manage, I white knuckled it all the way home. He wanted to give me a > couple of extra Corvair blocks in case one of my cranks were bad or wrong, I > couldn't take them simply due to the weight in the truck already. > > His name was Eric Lippert in Cullman, AL. He's got no phone, but he does > have satellite internet and his email is justeric1agn@yahoo.com. He's a > nice guy, looks like he could use the money, and would like to see these > engines being used as opposed to melted down. > > > Robert Haines > Du Quoin, Illinois > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:53:47 PM PST US <28114268.1073408050367.JavaMail.root@wamui08.slb.atl.earthlink.net> <28114268.1073408050367.JavaMail.root@wamui08.slb.atl.earthlink.net> From: Kip and Beth Gardner Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Corvair engines in AL --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip and Beth Gardner At 10:54 AM -0600 1/6/04, Jim Markle wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle > >Thanks Robert, > >I have a big flatbed trailer and will probably (if this all comes >together) use that. > >It's going to be about 10-12 hours of driving for me but if I can >pick up enough cores for 3 or 4 or us, that's not bad. (Well, it is >bad but worth it!) > >So we'll see. I sent an email but haven't heard anything yet.... > >And yes, when it rains it pours! You gotta love it.... > >Thanks again, >JM Jim, You are moving up this way sometime soon if I remember correctly? If so, I may want to be on the receiving end of one of these cores. Sorry, I can't help retrieve them, but I just used up all my vacation time over the Christmas holidays. Might also be a good tie-in for an OH Corvair College to have some cores available, if/when I get one set up with William. Regards, KIp Gardner -- North Canton, OH ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:50:26 PM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Pietenpol-List: Corvair engines in AL --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle Hi Kip, Nope, it was someone else that was moving up that way. Too much snow for me! I'll add your name to the list in case there's some way to get a core to you. So far there are 4 of us that want 2 cores each, but I have yet to hear back from the fellow in Alabama....so who knows.... Hey, I'm in no hurry..... :-) jm Jim, You are moving up this way sometime soon if I remember correctly? If so, I may want to be on the receiving end of one of these cores. Sorry, I can't help retrieve them, but I just used up all my vacation time over the Christmas holidays. Might also be a good tie-in for an OH Corvair College to have some cores available, if/when I get one set up with William. Regards, KIp Gardner -- North Canton, OH ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:30:54 PM PST US From: "Christian Bobka" Subject: Pietenpol-List: mid- air collision --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" This is from our brothers and sisters on the tailwind list. It is a little off topic but it makes a great story... Chris Bobka ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Rick and Cindy" > > To: "Tom Poberezny" ; "Tom and Renee Crosslin" > > ; "Tailwind Discussion" ; > > ; "Howard Grimes" ; > "Gary > > Parrish" ; "E'town Flying Service" > > ; "Scot Crosslin" ; "Paul > Poberezny" > > ; "DAVID SOUTHARD" ; "Allan > > Jackson" > > Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 4:10 PM > > Subject: Tailwind-List: Fw: mid- air collision > > > > > > > --> Tailwind-List message posted by: "Rick and Cindy" > > > > > > > > Ladies and Gentlemen: I sold my Wittman Tailwind a couple of months ago. > I > > > didn't meet the man who bought it until he showed up to pick it up. When > > Jim > > > arrived, turns out he was a WWII veteran of aerial combat in P-38s. A > real > > > living, breathing hero! > > > Jim shared part of this amazing story of a mid air collision in his P-38 > > > verbally while he was here, > > > and here's 'the rest of the story'. > > > Rick Crosslin > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim & Louise Irby" > > > To: ; ; ; > > > ; ; ; > > > ; ; ; > > > ; ; ; > > > ; ; ; > > > ; ; ; > > > ; ; ; > > > ; ; > > > ; ; > > > ; > > > Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 4:38 PM > > > Subject: mid- air collision > > > > > > > > > > i have been urged to write this story for years, by many, before i > get > > > > any older > > > > i had a mid-air collision with my wing man while flying patrol > > > > over Remagen bridge in early 1945.the germans were trying to dive bomb > > > > the bridge and the 474fg and my 429fs of p-38s were trying to keep > them > > > > from itour sqdn comdr maj james cobb was sqdn lead as red 1, > > > > i was 2nd element leader as red 3 and lt ralph byres was red 4, my > wing > > > > man. > > > > we were circling at about 18000 when a flight of 4 FW-180s > crossed > > > > below at about 15000. they split in twos, maj cobb > > > > dove on the right pair and i took after the left pair.i was closing > fast > > > > began scoring a few hits when "WHAM", > > > > byers hit me from behind and above. the impact was so great, i > > > > couldnt breathe. my seat back had knocked the breath out of me even > with > > > > a backpack parachute on. our two aircraft were stuck together. i > couldnt > > > > see out side,all i could see was the greasy belly of an engine nacell > > > > that had crushed my canopy down on my head. while my left prop was > > > > chewing on his airplane , the vibration was terrible. i instictively > > > > yanked all the power off. throttles, prop & mixture. this caused us to > > > > break apart. i never saw the other P-38 again. others in the sqdn > > > > watched it tumble, burning, to the ground. > > > > byers never got out. > > > > when we broke apart, we weregoing straight down in a left > spiral. > > > > i pulled up to a shallow glide with the left engine on fire,quickly > > > > turned off gas and ignition and prepared to bail out.the big old rhine > > > > river under me and i assumed everything west of it was friendly > > > > territory. to be sure, i punched up 9th TAC fighter control,they came > > > > right back with a YES. > > > > now the left engine fire was almost out. i had tried to feather > it > > > > but the prop blades were bent up into grotesque shapes and kept > flipping > > > > around, causing the airplane to sort of corkscrew thru the > > > > air. > > > > all the while, the right engine and prop > > > > were windmilling smoothly. iturned on the gas and ignition, put the > > > > mixture back up > > > > and that sweetheart was running like a top, so i headed west toward > home > > > > base, > > > > A-78 at florenes, belgium with the mag-compass swinging from side to > > > > side > > > > as the bent prop continued to flip over and over. > > > > soon the sqdn caught up and lead me home.maj cobb stayed with me > > > > while i dropped the gear. he flew under and said it looked ok. now i > > > > worried about how the left wing damage would behave in a stall. > > > > after everone else was on the ground, i pulled up and got a wicked > stall > > > > at about > > > > 130. a pleasant tho, the prop and engine quit turningover and i had a > > > > stable platform. > > > > i smoked it on at about 150,climbed on the brakes as hard as i > > > > dared and slowed > > > > enough to make the turn-off at the end. > > > > now coasting, the first hardstand was empty, so with a little left > brake > > > > i spun around and parked it onthe spot. > > > > "WHAT A RIDE" this beautifull P-38 > > > > had saved my but one more time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >