---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 04/07/04: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:09 AM - Spam can (rhartwig11@juno.com) 2. 10:04 AM - Re: Spam can (Steve Eldredge) 3. 10:05 AM - Re: Spam can (Steve Eldredge) 4. 06:49 PM - Flop or not to flop? (Peter W Johnson) 5. 07:36 PM - Re: Flop or not to flop? (John Dilatush) 6. 08:06 PM - Re: Flop or not to flop? (DJ Vegh) 7. 08:28 PM - Re: Flop or not to flop? (Peter W Johnson) 8. 08:45 PM - Re: Brodhead 2004 (Rcaprd@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:14 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Spam can From: rhartwig11@juno.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: rhartwig11@juno.com Garth, You have my condolences! Study that metal, the rivets and screws, Forsaking wood doesn't mean you lose, One advantage to those new planes of aluminum, Compared to a Piet most have more room-in-um. But, OH! the sound of a rivet when you smack it, Your next door friends will not like the racket. Yes! There is nothing as quiet as curing glue, Remember that when your neighbors sue. Dick Hartwig Waunakee, WI rhartwig11@juno.com Time: 10:14:25 AM PST US From: Gsrth@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: to the peit "We might make just a little change on one little part, in one little place, And hope it won't ..................." Sorry guys, you'll have to finish this up. I've decided to build a spam can. Garth Dawson ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:04:16 AM PST US Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Spam can From: "Steve Eldredge" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Eldredge" Clever Garth,,,, very clever. :) Steve e -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rhartwig11@juno.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Spam can --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: rhartwig11@juno.com Garth, You have my condolences! Study that metal, the rivets and screws, Forsaking wood doesn't mean you lose, One advantage to those new planes of aluminum, Compared to a Piet most have more room-in-um. But, OH! the sound of a rivet when you smack it, Your next door friends will not like the racket. Yes! There is nothing as quiet as curing glue, Remember that when your neighbors sue. Dick Hartwig Waunakee, WI rhartwig11@juno.com Time: 10:14:25 AM PST US From: Gsrth@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: to the peit "We might make just a little change on one little part, in one little place, And hope it won't ..................." Sorry guys, you'll have to finish this up. I've decided to build a spam can. Garth Dawson == == == == ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:05:36 AM PST US Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Spam can From: "Steve Eldredge" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Eldredge" I meant Dick. Sorry about that slic opps I mean slip. Steve e -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of rhartwig11@juno.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Spam can --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: rhartwig11@juno.com Garth, You have my condolences! Study that metal, the rivets and screws, Forsaking wood doesn't mean you lose, One advantage to those new planes of aluminum, Compared to a Piet most have more room-in-um. But, OH! the sound of a rivet when you smack it, Your next door friends will not like the racket. Yes! There is nothing as quiet as curing glue, Remember that when your neighbors sue. Dick Hartwig Waunakee, WI rhartwig11@juno.com Time: 10:14:25 AM PST US From: Gsrth@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: to the peit "We might make just a little change on one little part, in one little place, And hope it won't ..................." Sorry guys, you'll have to finish this up. I've decided to build a spam can. Garth Dawson == == == == ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:49:57 PM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Peter W Johnson" Hi Guys, I am about to glue up the center section and was wondering as to what performance/handling concerns are there over the permanent circular cut out in the center section for easy pilot access, or the flop (temporary access panel of the complete centre section from the aileron spar position back to the trailing edge). I think the circular center section cutout would be easier to build and one less item on the take off check list. Any comments? Cheers Peter Wonthaggi, Victoria, Australia. http://www.cpc-world.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:36:35 PM PST US From: "John Dilatush" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Peter W Johnson" ============================ Peter, I've heard both pro and con regarding this cutout. In one case, the pilot forgot to latch the flop and took off. The only thing that happened was that the flop rose up a couple of inches and then rode in that position with no change in handling characteristics of the plane. In another instance, a Piet with a cutout was modified by the builder by putting a temporary foam insert into the cut out so as to compare flight characteristics with and without it. There was no change except a slightly higher rate of climb he thought------ but it was so slight that he really wasn't sure! I suppose that it really depends upon if you are using a Model A engine and where you mount the radiator. I suspect the airflow is really disturbed over the center section of the wing. In my own case, I don't have a cut out or a flop and getting into the plane is a real bear! However, once in, the shade is great on a hot day! Hope this helps to in your decision. Cordially, John ============================== > Hi Guys, > > I am about to glue up the center section and was wondering as to what > performance/handling concerns are there over the permanent circular cut out > in the center section for easy pilot access, or the flop (temporary access > panel of the complete centre section from the aileron spar position back to > the trailing edge). > > I think the circular center section cutout would be easier to build and one > less item on the take off check list. > > Any comments? > > Cheers > > Peter > Wonthaggi, > Victoria, Australia. > http://www.cpc-world.com > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:06:56 PM PST US From: "DJ Vegh" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" my flop is hinged at the rear spar. It's a big flop but provides ALOT of room to get into and out of the plane. It has two latches (actual AN latches) that secure it. lots of pics here http://imagedv.com/aircamper/log/image-pages/01-26-04.htm DJ Vegh N74DV Mesa, AZ www.imagedv.com/aircamper - ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:28:15 PM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Peter W Johnson" John, Perhaps the easiest way is to do without either flop or cut out and just keep fit getting in and out! Thanks for the comments Cheers Peter. -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Dilatush Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" --> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Flop or not to flop? > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Peter W Johnson" ============================ Peter, I've heard both pro and con regarding this cutout. In one case, the pilot forgot to latch the flop and took off. The only thing that happened was that the flop rose up a couple of inches and then rode in that position with no change in handling characteristics of the plane. In another instance, a Piet with a cutout was modified by the builder by putting a temporary foam insert into the cut out so as to compare flight characteristics with and without it. There was no change except a slightly higher rate of climb he thought------ but it was so slight that he really wasn't sure! I suppose that it really depends upon if you are using a Model A engine and where you mount the radiator. I suspect the airflow is really disturbed over the center section of the wing. In my own case, I don't have a cut out or a flop and getting into the plane is a real bear! However, once in, the shade is great on a hot day! Hope this helps to in your decision. Cordially, John ============================== > Hi Guys, > > I am about to glue up the center section and was wondering as to what > performance/handling concerns are there over the permanent circular > cut out > in the center section for easy pilot access, or the flop (temporary > access panel of the complete centre section from the aileron spar > position back to > the trailing edge). > > I think the circular center section cutout would be easier to build > and one > less item on the take off check list. > > Any comments? > > Cheers > > Peter > Wonthaggi, > Victoria, Australia. > http://www.cpc-world.com > > > > advertising on the Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:45:38 PM PST US From: Rcaprd@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Brodhead 2004 --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com In a message dated 4/6/04 10:11:49 AM Central Daylight Time, steve@byu.edu writes: << How come I've heard so little about the event this year. Everyone knows that it is the 75th Anniversary right? For the 70th we had a mass fly-in and center stage parking for 20 or so of us. Is there something going on or in the works and I've just missed it? Or do we need a volunteer? >> I heard the Hatz airplanes are also going to be there this year. Can anyone confirm this ? Chuck G.