Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Thu 04/22/04


Total Messages Posted: 11



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:42 AM - Re: Horizontal stab question (Ed Grentzer)
     2. 05:37 AM - Re: Horizontal stab question (At7000ft@aol.com)
     3. 06:28 AM - Re: Horizontal stab question (Ed Grentzer)
     4. 07:28 AM - continental engines (Les Schubert)
     5. 09:19 AM - Re: continental engines (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
     6. 09:20 AM - Re: continental engines (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
     7. 10:30 AM - Re: Model A Ignition  (Prange Larry J PSNS)
     8. 11:11 AM - Re: Re: Model A Ignition  (DJ Vegh)
     9. 03:11 PM - Wheels and axels (HOEVELMANN)
    10. 07:14 PM - Re:Dual points for the Corvair engine (Alex Sloan)
    11. 09:52 PM - Re: Horizontal stab question (Clif Dawson)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 04:42:56 AM PST US
    From: "Ed Grentzer" <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Horizontal stab question
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed Grentzer" <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> Yes ..they go top and bottom...the top one on the center beam supports the verticle stab. even with the fabric and the bottom one supports the horizontal stab on the longerons which gives you the zero degree incidence of the stabilizer. on the leading edge they support the screws which hold it down. If you don't do routed out end pieces for the horizontal stab then you need to add the strips in between the gussets to bring the fabric up even with the gussets. That's the way I did mine. I found it easier than trying to make them in one piece. >From: At7000ft@aol.com >Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Horizontal stab question >Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 22:42:23 EDT > >Interesting, of all the tail feather pictures I have seen on the net none >of >them have had wood strips glued between all the gussets. Has anyone else >had >to do this? > >What I am trying to confirm is if the 2 8" x 1" x 3/16" plywood pieces >glued >to the center of the horizontal stab go on both the bottom and the top. > >I'm not sure if I read your problem right? But you >do put the plywood gussets on top, but if you use Poly >Fiber like I did, you have to cut strips of wood to go >around the stabilizer to fill in the gaps between >plywood gussets, as Poly Fiber dacron heat shrink >covering, needs a constant perimeter level piece of >wood to glue to, so when you shrink it, it shrinks >evenly. If you have a gap on the perimeter your >dacron will sag in the gap without a surface to glue >to and shrink distorted. I learned the hard way! >Ray > > > > Just to make sure before I start glueing, does the > > 3/16" ply that goes on the > > leading edge and center beam go on top and on the > > bottom of the horizontal stabilizer?


    Message 2


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    Time: 05:37:09 AM PST US
    From: At7000ft@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Horizontal stab question
    Thanks for the info Ed, which end pieces are you refering to here? Rick H If you don't do routed out end pieces for the horizontal stab then you need to add the strips in between the gussets to bring the fabric up even with the gussets. That's the way I did mine. I found it easier than trying to make them in one piece.


    Message 3


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    Time: 06:28:55 AM PST US
    From: "Ed Grentzer" <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Horizontal stab question
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed Grentzer" <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> the outer end pieces for the horizontal stabilizer and the elevators are the ones I'm refering to. The plans show cross sections for the leading edge, center beam and trailing edge then after I scratched my head for a few days I figured out that the same cross sections are used for the elevators only the leading edge is now the trailing edge. But there are no details for the end pieces which taper from the main beam to the leading / trailing edges so your kind of on your own there.So rather than try to taper them and route them in one piece which I would have no problem with now but back then it seemed overwhelming. So I tapered a piece of spruce from the small inner thickness of each, installed my gussets and then filled in between the gussets with 1/8" spruce so everything is the same thickness and being laminated they are at least as strong as one piece. Hope you can follow that. Ed >From: At7000ft@aol.com >Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Horizontal stab question >Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:36:53 EDT > >Thanks for the info Ed, which end pieces are you refering to here? > >Rick H >If you don't do routed out end pieces for the horizontal stab then you >need to add the strips in between the gussets to bring the fabric up even >with the gussets. That's the way I did mine. I found it easier than trying >to make them in one piece. Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN Premium!


    Message 4


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    Time: 07:28:19 AM PST US
    From: Les Schubert <leskarin@telus.net>
    Subject: continental engines
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Les Schubert <leskarin@telus.net> Hi Can some one explain to me the differences internally between the 65, 75 and 85 continental engines. As near as I can see they all have the same bore and stroke and are just reved up more. I think I read once that the 75 had oil holes drilled in the rods to squirt oil on the opposing piston. I see there are various carburators listed for these engines but I have no specifications for them. Why do I want to know? Well I have a A65 in nice shape, at least that is what the tag on the crankcase says, but when I ordered the prop and said I had a crank with the integral flange the prop maker said he had never heard of a 65 having the integral flanged crank. I also see I have oil squirt holes in the connecting rods. Help???? Les


    Message 5


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    Time: 09:19:19 AM PST US
    From: BARNSTMR@aol.com
    Subject: Re: continental engines
    Attached is a good article on the subject. I have found it to be closely accurate. Be sure and pay close attention to the differences between the A series and the C series. The C series has a completely different bore and stroke. The A75 and the A80 engines have to turn high RPM to make their horsepower. The C75 and C85 turn quite a bit slower. The Type certificate data sheets also contain the details. Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:20:47 AM PST US
    From: BARNSTMR@aol.com
    Subject: Re: continental engines
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com OH...and about the flange... Even though your prop man had never heard of it, A65s can have either a tapered or flanged cranckshaft...per TCDS. Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805


    Message 7


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    Time: 10:30:17 AM PST US
    From: Prange Larry J PSNS <prangel@psns.navy.mil>
    Subject: Re: Model A Ignition
    Old-X-N-Score: scored 0 --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS <prangel@psns.navy.mil> Hey Les et al, Thanks for your thoughts. I'm under the impression that William Wayne's Corvair engine conversion uses two ignition system wired to a single set of plugs successfully. Does he use some kind of high-voltage isolation diodes or something to prevent the two systems from interfering with each other? Or maybe the two ignition systems don't care about each other. Would a magneto and a conventional battery system be okay to use together in this configuration? Maybe some of you Corvair guys could weigh in on this please. About the 'fouled plug'. I'll just have to take my chances with that. I am more concerned about a catastrophic failure of a single magneto system than about loosing one plug out of four. I am hoping that a prudent maintenance schedule will fend off the 'fouled plug' scenario. You are correct about my 'former starter position' statement. My error. (The 'ol brain just ain't what it used to be.) I meant to say that I have seen magneto adapters/mounts that position the magneto under the exhaust manifold, next to the aft cylinder on the port side of the engine (as the engine sits in a Piet). I have an after-market oil filter kit mounted there. This prevents me from putting a magneto in that area. So, I was asking if there is another way to mount a second ignition system other than putting it there or putting it in the distributor hole where it is exposed to the prop blast? Larry NX1929A --- From: Les Schubert <leskarin@telus.net> Larry Here is my take on it. 1.The problem with trying to fire one plug with two sources is that the odds of ever getting both systems to fire at the EXACT same time is more or less impossible, especially for all four plugs. If they don't fire at the same time the high voltage will follow back down the none energized plug wire instead of firing the plug. 2. The other thing to remember is that most likely a misfire will be caused by a fouled plug which this will do nothing for. 3. I here there are twin plug heads available for model A's. 4. I don't understand your comment about the "former starter hole" being taken up by a oil filter. I was sure that the starter mounted to the bell housing adapter that bolted to the block which you certainly don't want or need on a airplane. Les -------------------------------------------- Dear 'A' Ford Engine Gurus, On my ('31) Ford I am currently using a single magneto per The Plans. However, I would like to add a second ignition source (magneto or battery) and wire both systems to one set of plugs. I have the engine's (former) starter location taken up by an oil filter, so that type of conversion is out. I guess that I will be adding something in the original distributor hole or . . . . ? Ideas Please! I am looking for some sage advice about what would be some good equipment choices and maybe even sources for same. Are there any known problems with using two ignition systems with one set of plugs? Thanks, Larry Prange NX1929A


    Message 8


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    Time: 11:11:38 AM PST US
    From: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
    Subject: Re: Model A Ignition
    My Corvair engine has the dual points/coil setup like WW suggests. I use an MSD Coil Joiner. 2 coils plug into it and it has one output which goes to the distributor DJ ----- Original Message ----- From: Prange Larry J PSNS Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A Ignition --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS <prangel@psns.navy.mil> Hey Les et al, Thanks for your thoughts. I'm under the impression that William Wayne's Corvair engine conversion uses two ignition system wired to a single set of plugs successfully. Does he use some kind of high-voltage isolation diodes or something to prevent the two systems from interfering with each other? Or maybe the two ignition systems don't care about each other. Would a magneto and a conventional battery system be okay to use together in this configuration? Maybe some of you Corvair guys could weigh in on this please. About the 'fouled plug'. I'll just have to take my chances with that. I am more concerned about a catastrophic failure of a single magneto system than about loosing one plug out of four. I am hoping that a prudent maintenance schedule will fend off the 'fouled plug' scenario. You are correct about my 'former starter position' statement. My error. (The 'ol brain just ain't what it used to be.) I meant to say that I have seen magneto adapters/mounts that position the magneto under the exhaust manifold, next to the aft cylinder on the port side of the engine (as the engine sits in a Piet). I have an after-market oil filter kit mounted there. This prevents me from putting a magneto in that area. So, I was asking if there is another way to mount a second ignition system other than putting it there or putting it in the distributor hole where it is exposed to the prop blast? Larry NX1929A --- From: Les Schubert <leskarin@telus.net> Larry Here is my take on it. 1.The problem with trying to fire one plug with two sources is that the odds of ever getting both systems to fire at the EXACT same time is more or less impossible, especially for all four plugs. If they don't fire at the same time the high voltage will follow back down the none energized plug wire instead of firing the plug. 2. The other thing to remember is that most likely a misfire will be caused by a fouled plug which this will do nothing for. 3. I here there are twin plug heads available for model A's. 4. I don't understand your comment about the "former starter hole" being taken up by a oil filter. I was sure that the starter mounted to the bell housing adapter that bolted to the block which you certainly don't want or need on a airplane. Les -------------------------------------------- Dear 'A' Ford Engine Gurus, On my ('31) Ford I am currently using a single magneto per The Plans. However, I would like to add a second ignition source (magneto or battery) and wire both systems to one set of plugs. I have the engine's (former) starter location taken up by an oil filter, so that type of conversion is out. I guess that I will be adding something in the original distributor hole or . . . . ? Ideas Please! I am looking for some sage advice about what would be some good equipment choices and maybe even sources for same. Are there any known problems with using two ignition systems with one set of plugs? Thanks, Larry Prange NX1929A = This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.


    Message 9


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    Time: 03:11:32 PM PST US
    From: HOEVELMANN <hoevelmann@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Wheels and axels
    I am going to have St. Croix aircraft build my landing gear soon and was wondering what size axles I should use and the best wheels 5'' or 6''. Thanks for your help. James J. Hoevelmann


    Message 10


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    Time: 07:14:23 PM PST US
    From: "Alex Sloan" <alexms1@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re:Dual points for the Corvair engine
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Alex Sloan" <alexms1@bellsouth.net> Regarding the dual point system Willaim Wynn has to offer. There are two sets of points mounted within the distributor. With this arrangement each set of points require a coil and condensor. Only one set of points will be used at any given time. An electronic switch is required to select which set of points will be in use at a time. The redundancy is in having that extra set of points if the other fails, and that rarely happens. This is the arrangement I will be using with my Corvair engine. \Hope this helps. Alex Sloan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Prange Larry J PSNS" <prangel@psns.navy.mil> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A Ignition --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS <prangel@psns.navy.mil> Hey Les et al, Thanks for your thoughts. I'm under the impression that William Wayne's Corvair engine conversion uses two ignition system wired to a single set of plugs successfully. Does he use some kind of high-voltage isolation diodes or something to prevent the two systems from interfering with each other? Or maybe the two ignition systems don't care about each other. Would a magneto and a conventional battery system be okay to use together in this configuration? Maybe some of you Corvair guys could weigh in on this please. About the 'fouled plug'. I'll just have to take my chances with that. I am more concerned about a catastrophic failure of a single magneto system than about loosing one plug out of four. I am hoping that a prudent maintenance schedule will fend off the 'fouled plug' scenario. You are correct about my 'former starter position' statement. My error. (The 'ol brain just ain't what it used to be.) I meant to say that I have seen magneto adapters/mounts that position the magneto under the exhaust manifold, next to the aft cylinder on the port side of the engine (as the engine sits in a Piet). I have an after-market oil filter kit mounted there. This prevents me from putting a magneto in that area. So, I was asking if there is another way to mount a second ignition system other than putting it there or putting it in the distributor hole where it is exposed to the prop blast? Larry NX1929A --- From: Les Schubert <leskarin@telus.net> Larry Here is my take on it. 1.The problem with trying to fire one plug with two sources is that the odds of ever getting both systems to fire at the EXACT same time is more or less impossible, especially for all four plugs. If they don't fire at the same time the high voltage will follow back down the none energized plug wire instead of firing the plug. 2. The other thing to remember is that most likely a misfire will be caused by a fouled plug which this will do nothing for. 3. I here there are twin plug heads available for model A's. 4. I don't understand your comment about the "former starter hole" being taken up by a oil filter. I was sure that the starter mounted to the bell housing adapter that bolted to the block which you certainly don't want or need on a airplane. Les -------------------------------------------- Dear 'A' Ford Engine Gurus, On my ('31) Ford I am currently using a single magneto per The Plans. However, I would like to add a second ignition source (magneto or battery) and wire both systems to one set of plugs. I have the engine's (former) starter location taken up by an oil filter, so that type of conversion is out. I guess that I will be adding something in the original distributor hole or . . . . ? Ideas Please! I am looking for some sage advice about what would be some good equipment choices and maybe even sources for same. Are there any known problems with using two ignition systems with one set of plugs? Thanks, Larry Prange NX1929A


    Message 11


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    Time: 09:52:31 PM PST US
    From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
    Subject: Re: Horizontal stab question
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> Go here and look through all the Piet photo galleries. There's quite a few pics of the tail parts made by a number of builders http://www.mykitplane.com/ Clif Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Horizontal stab question > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed Grentzer" <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> > > > the outer end pieces for the horizontal stabilizer and the elevators are > the ones I'm refering to.




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