Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:00 AM - T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans (Oscar Zuniga)
2. 07:02 AM - Re: T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans (Larry Ragan)
3. 07:10 AM - Re: T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans (Jim Markle)
4. 03:43 PM - Re: Costs of Fabric Covering (Steve Eldredge)
5. 03:59 PM - Re: T-88 - now way, way OT - Dixie Cups, brushing teeth & ove... (Waytogopiet@aol.com)
6. 05:55 PM - Re: T-88 - now way, way OT - Dixie Cups, brushing teeth & ove... (DJ Vegh)
7. 06:49 PM - Re: Re: wing strut static testing (Bert Conoly)
8. 06:58 PM - Tolerances and T-88 (Jake Nichols)
9. 09:46 PM - Re: Costs of Fabric Covering (dave rowe)
Message 1
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Subject: | T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Chris; my statement did specify "plain" cups, not waxed. I'm very careful
about any waxed products or waxes in my shop... epoxy and fiberglass do not
like wax. However, we have had plenty of rain here in south-central Texas,
our aquifer seems to be nearing its record high, and we welcome people who
want to move here (unlike DJ, who has to use a rinse cup rather than letting
the water run while brushing and avoiding his 7,000 new neighbors). Just
remember that San Antonio has received notoriety as being the sweatiest and
fattest city in the U.S., whether or not its inhabitants brush their teeth.
As opposed to North Texas, where people brush regularly, get more tornadoes,
and often have mysterious boxes in their shops. So, Jim- where exactly is
your shop and where is "home" for the North Texas Piet Builders? Can Texans
from other parts of the state visit your shop? And do you brush after
eating at the Purple Cow? (We won't even go into waxed vs. unwaxed dental
floss).
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 2
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Subject: | T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Larry Ragan" <lragan@hotmail.com>
Let me see if I have this right......sweatiest, fattest, and don't brush their
teeth. I got a feeling that S.A.'s population may stay about the same, if not
drop off.
Larry Ragan
Jacksonville, Fl.
lragan@hotmail.com
Check out the coupons and bargains on MSN Offers!
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
I was wondering how long it would take for someone to drag the North Texas
club into this......
North Texans and Dixie cups???....even THAT defies "6 degrees of
separation".....well, maybe not.
Mysterious boxes in my shop (located in Plano TX)....if you only knew! Come
to think of it, I'M not even sure what's in some of those boxes! I have a 4
year old son and a 6 year old son, so looking in unfamiliar boxes (before
they start to smell....) is just not a good idea....that box could be full
of roley-poleys, legos or half eaten pop tarts ("hop-tarts" as my 4 year old
calls them)....so who knows, I'M not opening any box unless I'm SURE what's
in it!
And I've decided that in all FUTURE pictures, we should include something
placed strategically in the background to give everyone something to REALLY
look for.......I'm intrigued with everyone's fascination with "things not
Pietenpol related" in these pictures.....but why not step up to the
challenge? Give em' something to hunt for!
Ok, just to move a tiny bit closer to REAL Pietenpol related stuff.....I'm
making the straight axle landing gear parts this week. Laminated some ash
last night (I was very careful to buy slightly undersized ash at the wood
place rather than getting 4/4 or 5/4 like I needed!) and will cut the front
vertical pieces hopefully tonite. I'm amazed as how heavy ash is but with
all the concentrated loads on the landing gear, I'm sure some
weight/strength is a good thing. I had struggled for weeks over how to make
the cuts and then Max Davis showed up with a compound miter saw.....duh, why
didn't I think of that? The job will be a LOT easier now than the
trimming/sanding/trimming/more sanding/fitting/etc I had in mind......
Ok, enough for now......
JM
----- Original Message -----
From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: T-88, Dixie cups, and North Texans
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga"
<taildrags@hotmail.com>
>
> Chris; my statement did specify "plain" cups, not waxed. I'm very careful
> about any waxed products or waxes in my shop... epoxy and fiberglass do
not
> like wax. However, we have had plenty of rain here in south-central
Texas,
> our aquifer seems to be nearing its record high, and we welcome people who
> want to move here (unlike DJ, who has to use a rinse cup rather than
letting
> the water run while brushing and avoiding his 7,000 new neighbors). Just
> remember that San Antonio has received notoriety as being the sweatiest
and
> fattest city in the U.S., whether or not its inhabitants brush their
teeth.
>
> As opposed to North Texas, where people brush regularly, get more
tornadoes,
> and often have mysterious boxes in their shops. So, Jim- where exactly is
> your shop and where is "home" for the North Texas Piet Builders? Can
Texans
> from other parts of the state visit your shop? And do you brush after
> eating at the Purple Cow? (We won't even go into waxed vs. unwaxed dental
> floss).
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> San Antonio, TX
> mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
Message 4
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Subject: | Costs of Fabric Covering |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Eldredge" <steve@byu.edu>
In 1997 I used Sherwin Williams gloss house paint. No problems with
fading or cracking. It even spent two years outside. I'd do it again,
just not with an airless sprayer in 85 degree weather. Brush or roll in
cool weather, and it rivals poly fiber. As for repairability, I just
got my first chance to try it and I'll let you know. Minor touch-ups
have been invisible after a week. I did it because I was young and poor
at the time. I'd do it again because it has stood up fine, and it is
cheap.
Steve Eldredge
NX7229R
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack
Phillips
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Costs of Fabric Covering
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips"
<pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
I agree Walt. I did the same thing - PolyFiber all the way. Why scrimp
and
take the chance of having house paint flake off in a couple of years?
Yes
the PolyFiber products are expensive, but they are the best quality
paints
I've ever seen, and their support staff is wonderful. Even spending the
big
bucks for Aerothane, I will have in this project, which has taken me
over
seven years, the same amount of money (about $14,000) that a two pack a
day
smoker would spend on cigarettes in the same time frame.
Jack Phillips
Spraying some of that expensive PolyFiber stuff this morning.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt
evans
Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 4:41 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Costs of Fabric Covering
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "walt evans"
<wbeevans@verizon.net>
I used the thin dacron (1.? oz) with Poly Fiber. Second project with
Poly
Fiber. Wouldn't use anything else. Got the dacron from AS&S ,,the
economy
stuff for just over $3.00 per running yard. Everyone I talk to , even
the
old timers tell me that ALL of the dacron comes off one loom. they
take
the certified stuff off and then make the uncertified stuff. And for
the
home builder, it's all the same. If you hold the uncertified stuff up
to
the light, you can see dark lines every once in a while. That's where
they
join threads. That's no good for certified. But you know darn well
that
when the Poly Fiber gets into it, it's not going anywhere.
As far as the Poly top coats, I did mine right to the manual, and even
at
$70.00+ per gallon of the non reds, I did my Piet for lots less than
$500.00
I couldn't see putting house paint on a project that I put my life into
for
years.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: <BARNSTMR@aol.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Costs of Fabric Covering
> OK...I am going to throw this out there. Please hold the wolves back
from
attacking me for beating a dead horse.
>
> I am attaching a picture of a very nice little airplane. It was built
by
Hank Stynes in Texas. On Tuesday, Max Davis met me and my wife in
Grandview
TX. We drove out to Hanks place and had a nice visit looking over his
nice
Piet. Since Max and I are both near ready for fabric, we got into a
discussion about fabric finishing. Ol' Hank (his hangar sign actually
reads
O'FART's HANGAR) talked with us about his fabric job and relayed some of
his
difficulties. I was never really clear on what he had used on his Piet,
but
he was not happy with the finish. If he had it to do over again, he
swears
that he would use spar varnish for clear penetration coat on ceconite...
Then mix varnish with silver powder for UV resistance. Then use house
paint
for color finishing.
>
> Now I have already purchased 2.7 oz. fabric for my fuselage and tail.
I
have been planning to go with the Poly Fiber process all the way through
because I am familiar with it, because I am confident I can achieve a
nice
finish, because it is repairable and durable. But I understand that I
am in
for quite a bit of $$ by the time I am through. Does anyone have a
TOTAL
cost for the a complete Piet job with Poly-Fiber?
>
> I am all for finding cheaper alternatives. But I am a skeptic when it
comes to departing from the tried-and-true methods. I have seen Bob
Siebert's Latex paint and it is beautiful. But I have often wondered
how it
will look five years down the road. So I am writing this looking for
some
hard FACTS about the pros and cons of various finishes that have been
done.
I want to hear from people who have used Latex or other finishing
products.
I want to hear how good or bad it has weathered the elements over
time...how
easy or difficult it is to repair and blend. What about hangar rash,
gasoline spills, patching, fading, etc...
>
> Somebody out there convince me that theres a cheaper and equal or
better
alternative to the STCd fabric finishing systems. Otherwise.... I am
sticking with the PF process and my wallet will suffer the consequences.
>
> Max...I know you're lurking out there and am sure you are interested
in
this too.
>
==
==
==
==
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: T-88 - now way, way OT - Dixie Cups, brushing teeth |
& ove...
In a message dated 5/9/2004 9:05:30 PM Central Standard Time, djv@imagedv.com
writes:
T-88 connects to Dixie Cups connects to water conservation connects to
Maricopa county growth rate connects to DJ Vegh's ire for newcomers to The Valley
of
the Sun.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
Doggone it DJ, here I was considering moving myself and the Piet to your part
of the world. I guess the reception wouldn't be all that great. Suppose next
month's population increase will just have to be 6,999 :)) Don
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: T-88 - now way, way OT - Dixie Cups, brushing teeth |
& ove...
well.... come one now! If your a Piet lover I say the more the merrier! I
was primarily speaking of all the yuppie California transplants.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
-
----- Original Message -----
From: Waytogopiet@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, May 10, 2004 3:59 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: T-88 - now way, way OT - Dixie Cups, brushing
teeth & ove...
In a message dated 5/9/2004 9:05:30 PM Central Standard Time, djv@imagedv.com
writes:
T-88 connects to Dixie Cups connects to water conservation connects to
Maricopa county growth rate connects to DJ Vegh's ire for newcomers to The
Valley of the Sun.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
Doggone it DJ, here I was considering moving myself and the Piet to your part
of the world. I guess the reception wouldn't be all that great. Suppose next
month's population increase will just have to be 6,999 :)) Don
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: wing strut static testing |
Thanks, Clif! I think I see how they did it..
BC
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, May 09, 2004 3:33 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing strut static testing
Seeing as how I don't have your addy I'll give you this here:
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoDisplay.cfm?PhotoNameIMG_0592.jpg&PhotoID1397
This is the lift distribution of a hershy bar wing across the semispan.
You can inject the position of the lift strut and find the lift ( or lack
thereof) at the cabane and strut tension etc.
Three aspect ratios are charted. 6 is close to ours.
Clif
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing strut static testing
I'm not redesigning anything but I was interested in doing a static load
test (to check those fork ends and welds, you know) on my lift struts and I am
curious what loads are acceptable. One way produces about twice the required
as the other.
Please respond off line.
Thanks, Bert (who heads off to the paint shop next weekend)
do not archive
Message 8
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Subject: | Tolerances and T-88 |
I now have cut the pieces for my test stabilizer and am going to be using the T-88
to put it together. My question is, how large a gap will T-88 safely fill?
The largest is about 1/16th". Would T-88 safely fill a gap that large? When
I start building to fly I will be using better tools and able to keep the tolerances
much tighter.
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Costs of Fabric Covering |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: dave rowe <rowed044@shaw.ca>
Had to put my 2 cents worth in. Check Kitplanes, there was something a
whileago about latex paint. It has all the desireable qualities for
fabric. Just because something is expensive doesn't make it better. If
it's certified, it's expensive. Not necessarily quality, a lot of the
stuff on the local clubs 152s and 172s is garbage. But it's certified
garbage. If you built a Piet exactly the way it was designed, from
period materials, there wouldn't be much that would meet certification,
but it flew, and quite fine thank you. Do some research, find out what
others have tried, and make up your mind based on that. Build a test
piece, cover it, and try different materials. Bake it in the hot sun,
hit it with the hose, try it all and see what happens. Top quality
latex exterior house paint is flexible, UV resistant, and has long
guarantees. Industrial Plastics and Paints here in canada sells an
excellent polyurethane with flex agents, specifically for fabric
homebuilts. Because it's a derivative of a marine paint, it didn't cost
a lot to modify it for aircraft. Not certified, thus not expensive.
Remember the whole experimental thing?
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