Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Thu 08/05/04


Total Messages Posted: 46



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 05:03 AM - Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
     2. 05:23 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Michael D Cuy)
     3. 05:32 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (baileys)
     4. 06:17 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Richard Navratil)
     5. 06:30 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Textor, Jack)
     6. 07:16 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
     7. 07:35 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Ron Hargrove)
     8. 07:40 AM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (Michael D Cuy)
     9. 08:02 AM - Re: Magneto stuff (Michael D Cuy)
    10. 08:08 AM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (Textor, Jack)
    11. 08:10 AM - Re: Magneto stuff (Carl D. Vought)
    12. 08:14 AM - Re: Magneto stuff (Christian Bobka)
    13. 08:44 AM - Re: Magneto stuff (Christian Bobka)
    14. 09:19 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (DJ Vegh)
    15. 09:20 AM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (Ron Hargrove)
    16. 10:02 AM - Re: gn-1s. (baileys)
    17. 10:56 AM - Re: Magneto stuff (Michael D Cuy)
    18. 11:04 AM - Tailwheel steering (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
    19. 11:38 AM - solar charger (Douwe Blumberg)
    20. 11:49 AM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Stacy Clark)
    21. 12:08 PM - Re: gn-1s. (Carl D. Vought)
    22. 12:12 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Gary Gower)
    23. 12:17 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (TomTravis@aol.com)
    24. 12:35 PM - Re: Pietenpol-Lists: Mountain Piet is wounded!  (Gary Gower)
    25. 12:57 PM - Re: Tailwheel steering (Isablcorky@aol.com)
    26. 02:06 PM - Wire wheels (Richard Carden)
    27. 02:20 PM - Re: gn-1s. (Dennis Engelkenjohn)
    28. 02:23 PM - Re: Wire wheels (Jack Phillips)
    29. 02:35 PM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (hjarrett)
    30. 02:47 PM - Re: Wire wheels (Mike)
    31. 03:26 PM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (hjarrett)
    32. 03:33 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (walt evans)
    33. 03:59 PM - Re: Wire wheels (Carl D. Vought)
    34. 04:07 PM - Re: gn-1s. (Carl D. Vought)
    35. 06:07 PM - Re: Wire wheels (Jim Malley)
    36. 06:19 PM - Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
    37. 06:24 PM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (Gary Gower)
    38. 06:26 PM - Re: Wire wheels (Gary Gower)
    39. 06:40 PM - Re: Wire wheels (Gary Gower)
    40. 07:34 PM - Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member (Mike Whaley)
    41. 07:41 PM - Re: solar charger (Richard Navratil)
    42. 07:42 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Lynn Knoll)
    43. 08:15 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Mike Whaley)
    44. 08:26 PM - More hangar space (Christian Bobka)
    45. 08:27 PM - Re: hinged / removable turtledeck (tmbrant1@netzero.net)
    46. 11:34 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Rcaprd@aol.com)
 
 
 


Message 1


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:03:22 AM PST US
    From: "John Dilatush" <dilatush@amigo.net>
    Subject: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    Pieters, Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop in Marshalltown, I arrived in Jefferson IA. Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It was a beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over the horizon. I was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb configuration at about 500 feet when the engine quit, just like someone turned off the ignition. I only had one choice, which was a small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of town. At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so I headed there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. The terrain was uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly short, but still dicey whether or not I could get the plane stopped before the barn, so I decided to ground loop Piet. As I started to swing around to the right, the left wing struck some large posts about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around to the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around the left side of Mountain Piet. I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one of the nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the camera out and decided to take a few pictures of the plane along with the offending posts. Still no one! I put the camera away and walked up to the house which was located behind the barn and found a small shop with the radio going and a sign that read, "Rug Weaving". Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him that I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the phone. "Over there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of my wallet and called the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that he was up. He answered and said he would come out right away, "What's the address?" I asked the man who was still weaving and he said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the airport manager. The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I said no, he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as if the crash was an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about how he got into the rug weaving business, where he sold them and how he made them etc. Finally he said, "Well, let's go take a look." We went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied he went back to the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the house waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive. Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us went to the airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. Kirk phoned a friend who had a trailer and he said he would help. Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his house along with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just respectfully looking things over. We took the wings off, loaded the plane, I went back to the shop and thanked the Weaver for the use of his pasture and then we headed for the airport. There was a tight hangar and we put Piet in there. Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and then die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged up. No water in fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl and start trouble shooting. Locked up hangar and called friend who was at Oshkosh on his cell phone. He said would come in his new RV-8 and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will spend a few unplanned days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday. The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I would also pull the center section and take a close look at it. The front spar of the center section shows slight damage where the metal fitting attaches to the wing panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet seems OK. I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the plane so am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. Anyone interested? John


    Message 2


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:23:39 AM PST US
    From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> Gosh John, I'm really glad to hear that you were not hurt in the off-airport landing. I respect your judgement and skill in executing that landing and really saving yourself and 85% of the airplane. I'm not so sure how I'd perform given a sudden engine stoppage. Something to think about and be prepared for more in my flying I think. Mike


    Message 3


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:32:18 AM PST US
    From: "baileys" <baileys@ktis.net>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John, I'm very sorry to learn of the accident. Sure I might be interested but I would say don't sell it until you have given it some more thought. In six months you may be kicking yourself and saying "Why did I ever let it go?" Heck I still regret selling a little Farmall Cub I didn't need at the moment. It looks like parts of the wing might be salvageable. Maybe others could give you a hand, I know I would be willing to build a few ribs or at least cut some parts for you. Kind regards, Bob B. - Missouri P.S. The brighter side is they could have taken you out of there on a stretcher. 8 )


    Message 4


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:17:01 AM PST US
    From: "Richard Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John Glad to hear you walked away ok. Do you need a place to store the plane for a while? I am in Mpls, Mn and have some spare hangar space and a trailer. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Dilatush To: Pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 6:56 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded! Pieters, Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop in Marshalltown, I arrived in Jefferson IA. Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It was a beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over the horizon. I was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb configuration at about 500 feet when the engine quit, just like someone turned off the ignition. I only had one choice, which was a small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of town. At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so I headed there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. The terrain was uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly short, but still dicey whether or not I could get the plane stopped before the barn, so I decided to ground loop Piet. As I started to swing around to the right, the left wing struck some large posts about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around to the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around the left side of Mountain Piet. I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one of the nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the camera out and decided to take a few pictures of the plane along with the offending posts. Still no one! I put the camera away and walked up to the house which was located behind the barn and found a small shop with the radio going and a sign that read, "Rug Weaving". Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him that I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the phone. "Over there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of my wallet and called the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that he was up. He answered and said he would come out right away, "What's the address?" I asked the man who was still weaving and he said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the airport manager. The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I said no, he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as if the crash was an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about how he got into the rug weaving business, where he sold them and how he made them etc. Finally he said, "Well, let's go take a look." We went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied he went back to the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the house waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive. Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us went to the airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. Kirk phoned a friend who had a trailer and he said he would help. Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his house along with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just respectfully looking things over. We took the wings off, loaded the plane, I went back to the shop and thanked the Weaver for the use of his pasture and then we headed for the airport. There was a tight hangar and we put Piet in there. Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and then die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged up. No water in fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl and start trouble shooting. Locked up hangar and called friend who was at Oshkosh on his cell phone. He said would come in his new RV-8 and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will spend a few unplanned days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday. The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I would also pull the center section and take a close look at it. The front spar of the center section shows slight damage where the metal fitting attaches to the wing panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet seems OK. I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the plane so am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. Anyone interested? John


    Message 5


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:30:10 AM PST US
    Subject: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    From: "Textor, Jack" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com>
    John, Glad you got out unhurt! I'm in Des Moines which is about an hour from Jefferson. If I can assist with any ground work here just let me know. Jack Textor 515-225-7000 work _____


    Message 6


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:16:39 AM PST US
    From: BARNSTMR@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com John, Sorry to hear about your difficulty. How far is the airplane from Ottumwa and Blakesburg IA? This is the home of the Antique Airplane Association, which has a Pietenpol group of its own. These guys are Pietenpol friendly and may be able to offer assistance. Glad you walked away without injury. -- Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805


    Message 7


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:35:08 AM PST US
    From: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com> I certainly am glad you weren't hurt in the landing. I also hate to hear about the Mountain Piet, as it is a remarkable piece of workmanship. Dollars to donuts, I would bet you lost oil pressure to the turbo, and the auto computer shut down the engine to save turbo damage, not knowing you weren't on the ground anymore... ----- Original Message ----- From: Textor, Jack <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded! John, Glad you got out unhurt! I'm in Des Moines which is about an hour from Jefferson. If I can assist with any ground work here just let me know. Jack Textor 515-225-7000 work ________________________________


    Message 8


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:40:19 AM PST US
    From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
    Subject: Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> Hey Jim-- what an idiot this guys is.......luckily he's only getting about $30 bucks for it with 10 minutes to go. Here is what I just wrote to the guy Dear mgp60, Having purchased the plans from the Pietenpol family and building and flying my own Pietenpol, I was sorry to see that you have copied the plans and have them for sale on ebay. The entire Pietenpol e-mail list is aware of what you are doing and are encouraged not to bid on your item. Best regards, Mike


    Message 9


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:02:58 AM PST US
    From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
    Subject: Re: Magneto stuff
    <001001c47a65$2548a560$ccf20bd0@user0dl3n2ruzo> <000e01c47a67$85c3fa50$2cc5fea9@home> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> From memory on my Continental, each mag spins the opposite of each other off the cam gear and thus the firing order has to match so they mark them either left or right so they fire the right plugs at in the right sequence. (if you hook up the plug wires in the correct order !) Mike C.


    Message 10


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:08:34 AM PST US
    Subject: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    From: "Textor, Jack" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com>
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Textor, Jack" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com> Good letter Mike! Do not archive


    Message 11


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:10:55 AM PST US
    From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
    Subject: Re: Magneto stuff
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net> Hi Don...Thanks to you and the others for your responses. The nameplate that is now on the mag indicates that it was rebuilt at the Slick factory in Rockford, IL. The model number is given as 4250R (presumably the "R" stands for "REBUILT") and the SN is 3070088. No lag is listed on the plate, presumably because it was not and is not equipped with an impulse coupling. Interestingly, an "L" is stamped on the plate by the legend "ROT.", but a hand-painted arrow painted on the case indicates clockwise rotation as viewed from the rear of the case. My application is on a Model-A engine. The mag will be side-mounted and will be rotated in the same direction as the prop....Thanks again...Carl On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 21:43:50 -0500, Don Morris <pietbuilder@donsplans.com> wrote : > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Don Morris <pietbuilder@donsplans.com> > > > Hi. > > Two things - there is the right and left magneto on the engine > (obviously). However, the RH and the LH does not refer to this, if I > understand correctly.>


    Message 12


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:14:04 AM PST US
    d="scan'217,208"; a="170663843:sNHT21425604"
    From: "Christian Bobka" <sbobka@charter.net>
    Subject: Re: Magneto stuff
    In addition to what Don says, the impulse coupling, if you have one cannot be reversed. You would have to find one that operates in the direction you want. The pawl that the impulse engages with at low RPM would have to be relocated to one of the other holes as well. Looking at mag will let you know what I mean. The cam that opens and shuts the points has to be flipped over end for end so that the points open at the proper time. The mark on the gear on the rotor has to be remeshed with the bigger gear that distributes the spark, aligning the LH markings for a LH rotating mag, etc. Then it is best to remark the mag on the outside so you don't ball yourself up thinking that the mag spins the other way when it does not! BTW, a mag will not create a spark if it is spun backwards. A good thing to know when handproping and needing to reposition the prop... Chris Bobka ----- Original Message ----- From: Don Morris To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 9:43 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Magneto stuff Hi. Two things - there is the right and left magneto on the engine (obviously). However, the RH and the LH does not refer to this, if I understand correctly. This is actually the direction of spin of the magneto. Both mags on the engine will be either RH or LH, because you are correct - they both spin the same direction. Inside the mag, there will be two sets of timing marks on the distributor gear, and one will be marked RH and the other LH. The internal timing is set differently. I am not sure if the timing is the only difference - there may be other small physical changes. What type of mag are you working with? I may be able to look it up, as we have a number of books at the A&P school that I attend. -Don > Can anyone out there enlighten me/us as to the physical difference between > one magneto marked "right hand" and another marked "left hand"??? I know > that's a dumb question, but sometimes one has to expose his ignorance in > order to eradicate it. My understanding is that both mags turn the same > direction. On a slightly different track: can a mag marked "LH" be reworked > to a "RH" configuration? walt evans wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "walt evans" <wbeevans@verizon.net> Something to add about magnetos,,,Since the "flat" gear on the Eisemann magneto is so expensive, for the impulse side, my Mentor built me a mag with an impulse and the "deep" gear. Then he made a collar with "fits" the thickness of the difference, so everything would run true. Just needed two gaskets and long studs to secure it. It's fine on an Experimental, and works great. Now with 50 or so hours on the engine, it starts with a simple flip with the left mag selected. PS Think the flat gear is over $500.00 retail, while the deep gear is a dime a dozen. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Smith" <lesmith@roanokeinternet.com> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Magneto stuff --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed Smith" <lesmith@roanokeinternet.com> Usually, the left hand mag has an impulse coupling that retards the spark timing for starting. This is normally evident by an additional mechanism on the drive end. -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of BARNSTMR@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Magneto stuff --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com On a Continental and most other aircraft engines...theres no difference....except one fires the bottom and the other fires the top plugs. If you have an engine with staggered timing...the mags are still the same...just one is "clocked" at a slightly different angle. Perhaps some uninformed mechanic marked them this way thinking there was some difference. -- Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805 Matronics Forums.


    Message 13


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:44:16 AM PST US
    d="scan'208"; a="176143254:sNHT24563556"
    From: "Christian Bobka" <sbobka@charter.net>
    Subject: Re: Magneto stuff
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" <sbobka@charter.net> Michael! Both mags spin the same way on the A-65 or with almost any engine! Your A-65-8 would use RH rotation mags. The mags are driven off of the gear on the back of the crank. This is the same gear that drives the cam. This gear is rotating the same direction as the prop which is CW when in the cockpit and anti CW when looking at the prop from the front. This would mean that the gears on the mags and cam would have to turn the other way which would be anti CW if you were holding the mag with the gear pointing away from you. Convention says that you determine the mag rotation by looking at the mag from its driven end and the way the top of the gear rotates. So if it is anti CW when the gear is pointed away, then it is is CW when the gear is pointing at you. CW means the top moves to the right, hence the RH rotation. Mags used on the A-65 include SF4R, S4RN, AM-4 with a RH and an arrow, or with Slicks you will have an RH stamped on the data plate. That is why the R in the names. If you have a C series or an O-200 that is starter equipped, then the mags are driven by the cam gear rather than the crank gear. This is to accomodate the starter and the generator pads on the accessory case. We saw above that the cam gear rotates anti CW when you are sitting in the cockpit. Therefore the mags go the other way from the cam gear that they are driven by. This is the same way as the prop. LH would be the rotation at the top when you look at the mag from its driven end. Mags used on these engines include the S4LN, AM-4 with an LH and an arrow, or with Slicks, you will have an LH stamped on the data plate. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Magneto stuff > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> > > From memory on my Continental, each mag spins the opposite of each other > off the cam gear and thus the firing order has to match so they mark them > either left or right so they fire the right plugs at in the right > sequence. (if you hook up the plug wires in the correct order !) > > Mike C. > >


    Message 14


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 09:19:43 AM PST US
    From: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    damn John, that really sucks. You did good with what you were handed. I am always fearful of the dreaded dead-stick at low altitude. I hope I never have to experience it first hand. I can understand your feeling about not wanting to fool with fixing it, but maybe a little time might change your mind. When I lose one of my large scale RC planes or helicopters to a crash I feel the same way. Sometimes those crashes can cost me well over $1500. Right after I feel sick about it and claim that I'm just gonna sell all my RC stuff and move on. Eventually I get past it and recover, but it does affect my mood big time. Maybe just sit tight for a couple weeks.... let the initial shock wear off and then reevaluate your thoughts on selling. In any case I'm VERY glad you came away from this intact. DJ ----- Original Message ----- From: John Dilatush To: Pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 4:56 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded! Pieters, Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop in Marshalltown, I arrived in Jefferson IA. Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It was a beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over the horizon. I was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb configuration at about 500 feet when the engine quit, just like someone turned off the ignition. I only had one choice, which was a small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of town. At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so I headed there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. The terrain was uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly short, but still dicey whether or not I could get the plane stopped before the barn, so I decided to ground loop Piet. As I started to swing around to the right, the left wing struck some large posts about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around to the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around the left side of Mountain Piet. I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one of the nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the camera out and decided to take a few pictures of the plane along with the offending posts. Still no one! I put the camera away and walked up to the house which was located behind the barn and found a small shop with the radio going and a sign that read, "Rug Weaving". Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him that I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the phone. "Over there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of my wallet and called the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that he was up. He answered and said he would come out right away, "What's the address?" I asked the man who was still weaving and he said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the airport manager. The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I said no, he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as if the crash was an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about how he got into the rug weaving business, where he sold them and how he made them etc. Finally he said, "Well, let's go take a look." We went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied he went back to the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the house waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive. Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us went to the airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. Kirk phoned a friend who had a trailer and he said he would help. Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his house along with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just respectfully looking things over. We took the wings off, loaded the plane, I went back to the shop and thanked the Weaver for the use of his pasture and then we headed for the airport. There was a tight hangar and we put Piet in there. Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and then die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged up. No water in fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl and start trouble shooting. Locked up hangar and called friend who was at Oshkosh on his cell phone. He said would come in his new RV-8 and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will spend a few unplanned days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday. The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I would also pull the center section and take a close look at it. The front spar of the center section shows slight damage where the metal fitting attaches to the wing panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet seems OK. I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the plane so am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. Anyone interested? John


    Message 15


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 09:20:53 AM PST US
    From: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com> Unfortunately, I did buy plans from this guy thinking they were unused originals. I think I will destroy them just on the principal of the thing. I have also sent an email to Don Pietenpol informing him of the situation. Ron On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:08:27 -0500, Textor, Jack <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Textor, Jack" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com> > > Good letter Mike! > Do not archive > > > > > >


    Message 16


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:02:27 AM PST US
    From: "baileys" <baileys@ktis.net>
    Subject: Re: gn-1s.
    Dang no one answered your question. I didn't get to go this year, but I would be surprised if there were no GN-1's at the fly-in. Bob B. Did anybody on this list go or is there anyone out there??? ----- Original Message ----- From: lanny bissell To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 3:56 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: gn-1s. Doc, Any GN-1s at Broadhead? I'm new to the list and Pietenpols in general, but I wonder why I never see much about the GN-1 which I understand is a "modern" version of the Piet. Howard Bissell


    Message 17


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:56:46 AM PST US
    From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
    Subject: Re: Magneto stuff
    <001001c47a65$2548a560$ccf20bd0@user0dl3n2ruzo> <000e01c47a67$85c3fa50$2cc5fea9@home> <5.1.1.5.2.20040805110054.02962828@popserve.grc.nasa.gov> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> Chris-- opps ! The sketch I drew on my yellow sticky note before I mailed that off was wrong ! You are right--- both mags spin in the same direction. Mike At 10:47 AM 8/5/2004 -0500, you wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" <sbobka@charter.net> > >Michael! > >Both mags spin the same way on the A-65 or with almost any engine! Your >A-65-8 would use RH rotation mags. The mags are driven off of the gear on >the back of the crank. This is the same gear that drives the cam. This >gear is rotating the same direction as the prop which is CW when in the >cockpit and anti CW when looking at the prop from the front. This would >mean that the gears on the mags and cam would have to turn the other way >which would be anti CW if you were holding the mag with the gear pointing >away from you. Convention says that you determine the mag rotation by >looking at the mag from its driven end and the way the top of the gear >rotates. So if it is anti CW when the gear is pointed away, then it is is >CW when the gear is pointing at you. CW means the top moves to the right, >hence the RH rotation. Mags used on the A-65 include SF4R, S4RN, AM-4 with >a RH and an arrow, or with Slicks you will have an RH stamped on the data >plate. That is why the R in the names. > >If you have a C series or an O-200 that is starter equipped, then the mags >are driven by the cam gear rather than the crank gear. This is to >accomodate the starter and the generator pads on the accessory case. We saw >above that the cam gear rotates anti CW when you are sitting in the cockpit. >Therefore the mags go the other way from the cam gear that they are driven >by. This is the same way as the prop. LH would be the rotation at the top >when you look at the mag from its driven end. Mags used on these engines >include the S4LN, AM-4 with an LH and an arrow, or with Slicks, you will >have an LH stamped on the data plate. > >Chris >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> >To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> >Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 10:02 AM >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Magneto stuff > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy ><Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> > > > > From memory on my Continental, each mag spins the opposite of each other > > off the cam gear and thus the firing order has to match so they mark them > > either left or right so they fire the right plugs at in the right > > sequence. (if you hook up the plug wires in the correct order !) > > > > Mike C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 18


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:04:47 AM PST US
    From: BARNSTMR@aol.com
    Subject: Tailwheel steering
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com Group, I sent this email awhile back and never had any responses. I am trying again (now that everyone but Chuck is home from Broadhead/Osh). Anyone ever have experience with this? -- Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805 ==================== Subj: Tailwheel Cable Geometry Date: 7/27/2004 11:46:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time From: BARNSTMR To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Last week I was showing Chuck my plan for tailwheel steering. We got into a discussion about geometry and the leverage and throw required for steering. Chuck showed me how he attached tailwheel steering cables very close inboard from his feet near the center of the fulcrum on the rudder bar. His logic is that the 'throw" (or travel) is a shorter distance on the tailwheel steering arms than on the rudder horns. I am getting ready to design the attachments for tailwheel steering on mine and have been thinking more about this. First of all....our plane does not have a rudder bar...but instead has pedals similar to a J3 cub. I could accomplish the same effect of Chucks design by welding a tab onto the pedal closer to the pedal fulcrum. This way the tailwheel steering travel will be shorter than the rudder cable travel. But after thinking this over... I am not so sure that this is the best way to set this up. I am planning to use compression springs at the tailwheel steering arms to dampen shimmy. But I am thinking that the springs will also compensate for the difference in "throw" if I choose to tie the rudder and tailwheel cables together with the same travel. In addition....I am thinking that this should allow more steering authority with less input when the tailwheel is on the ground. Does anyone have any experience and comment on this? I am not knocking Chucks design. He is a whiz at all things mechanical. But I am just trying to think this through before I make more parts. One thing I did notice is that 'ol NX770CG's rudder seems to swipe back and forth a lot on 3-point landing as it is steered down the runway. I don't notice nearly that much rudder input required to steer the Taylorcraft. TLB


    Message 19


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:38:23 AM PST US
    From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
    Subject: solar charger
    Hey guys, I saw Chuck Ganzer's solar panel he uses to charge a small battery which in turn powers his GPS, radio etc. I thought this was a great idea but am not electrically minded enough to figure it out. I can get a small solar panel and install it in my top wing. Then some wiring to a small battery, which goes back to some plugs for my intercom and gps etc. My question is what is the voltage we need? will these items run off a 12v battery? I can get a nice small 1lb 12v. Also, how do you keep it from overcharging without much weight? or do you just have a disconnect switch when the battery is full? This would clearly be for when one is away from home, but it's clean and always ready. Any electric experts out there? thanks, Douwe


    Message 20


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:49:57 AM PST US
    From: "Stacy Clark" <stacy@unicom-alaska.com>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John, Just as another person said, give yourself a couple day to think it over. Don't set yourself up for any "woulda, shoulda, coulda's" later. I bought my spruce kit from AS&S and I "had to" take the rib material (i.e.: package deal) even though I didn't need it because I already have the pre-built ribs from Charles. I've been wondering what the hell I was going to do with all that extra wood. About all it's good for up here to me is a small bonfire. Tell you what, the rib material is yours if you'll accept it. All you have to do is pay for the shipping... Now the bad news, I live in the Alaskan Bush so shipping will no doubt be a little more than the lower 48, however, I have a solution for that too. I might suggest to others reading this that someone manage a small fund to get the wood to John. (I don't have time to do that). When I shipped the material up here it cost me $350.00 (the entire spruce kit plus some extra wood and T-88 that is) [5 boxes at 150 lbs total]. I still have the long boxes the material came in. So, I would guess just shipping the rib material would be less than $50.00 Ground. (For reference I'm in area code 99559). Maybe someone else could donate the spar material, and so on... John, this isn't charity by any means. This is just guys gathering around in a "virtual hanger" scratching their collective heads figuring out how to get Mountain Piet flying again. Your aircraft is an inspiration to a lot of us (though I won't be using a Subaru anytime soon :-)). All I ask in return is that you lead me through your neck of the woods as I fly from here in the bush to Washington D.C. in a couple of years, but that's another story. Stacy The Bethel Belle Project Bethel, Alaska There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that is to achieve it -- Stacy Clark ----- Original Message ----- From: John Dilatush To: Pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 3:56 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded! Pieters, Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop in Marshalltown, I arrived in Jefferson IA. Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It was a beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over the horizon. I was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb configuration at about 500 feet when the engine quit, just like someone turned off the ignition. I only had one choice, which was a small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of town. At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so I headed there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. The terrain was uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly short, but still dicey whether or not I could get the plane stopped before the barn, so I decided to ground loop Piet. As I started to swing around to the right, the left wing struck some large posts about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around to the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around the left side of Mountain Piet. I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one of the nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the camera out and decided to take a few pictures of the plane along with the offending posts. Still no one! I put the camera away and walked up to the house which was located behind the barn and found a small shop with the radio going and a sign that read, "Rug Weaving". Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him that I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the phone. "Over there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of my wallet and called the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that he was up. He answered and said he would come out right away, "What's the address?" I asked the man who was still weaving and he said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the airport manager. The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I said no, he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as if the crash was an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about how he got into the rug weaving business, where he sold them and how he made them etc. Finally he said, "Well, let's go take a look." We went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied he went back to the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the house waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive. Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us went to the airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. Kirk phoned a friend who had a trailer and he said he would help. Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his house along with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just respectfully looking things over. We took the wings off, loaded the plane, I went back to the shop and thanked the Weaver for the use of his pasture and then we headed for the airport. There was a tight hangar and we put Piet in there. Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and then die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged up. No water in fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl and start trouble shooting. Locked up hangar and called friend who was at Oshkosh on his cell phone. He said would come in his new RV-8 and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will spend a few unplanned days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday. The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I would also pull the center section and take a close look at it. The front spar of the center section shows slight damage where the metal fitting attaches to the wing panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet seems OK. I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the plane so am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. Anyone interested? John


    Message 21


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:08:45 PM PST US
    From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
    Subject: Re: gn-1s.
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net> Sorry for not responding..I got to B'head on Thursday and left on Sunday. I counted 16 Piets during those days. I say a Jenny (Glory!) and I saw a beautiful round-engine Hatz and others, but no GN-1...Carl Vought/Huntsville, AL On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 12:02:11 -0500, "baileys" <baileys@ktis.net> wrote : > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "baileys" <baileys@ktis.net> > > > > Dang no one answered your question. I didn't get to go this year, but I would be surprised if there were no GN-1's at the fly-in. > Bob B. > Did anybody on this list go or is there anyone out there??? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: lanny bissell > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 3:56 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: gn-1s. > > > Doc, Any GN-1s at Broadhead? I'm new to the list and Pietenpols in general, but I wonder why I never see much about the GN-1 which I understand is a "modern" version of the Piet. > Howard Bissell >


    Message 22


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:12:33 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> Hello John, Glad you are OK and even the damage looks impressive the landing was succesfull, first check the plane maybe is easy repairable than you think. I like your Piet a lot, I have all the photos in my computer. I will gladly buy it from you... BUT NOT NOW! A friend never takes advantage of a friend in problems. I know you can get some asitance from EAA'ers near there. If you cant get a better option in taking it back home, Yellow Freight uses (at least here) 20' trailers that might be not as expensive as 46fts... Now you might feel very bad, but I am sure that in a few months you will be glad of all the friends you made in the way and retriving was not that expensive. One more time, glad that you are OK. I know all of us will keep track of this incident, and I am sure that you will find some help, from some of us fisicaly closer to you and Montain Piet, than myself. Saludos Gary Gower Guadalajara, Jalisco, Mexico. --- John Dilatush <dilatush@amigo.net> wrote: > Pieters, > > Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop > in Marshalltown, I arrived in Jefferson IA. > > Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It > was a beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over > the horizon. I was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb > configuration at about 500 feet when the engine quit, just like > someone turned off the ignition. I only had one choice, which was a > small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of town. > > At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so > I headed there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. > The terrain was uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly > short, but still dicey whether or not I could get the plane stopped > before the barn, so I decided to ground loop Piet. As I started to > swing around to the right, the left wing struck some large posts > about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around to > the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around > the left side of Mountain Piet. > > I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one > of the nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the > camera out and decided to take a few pictures of the plane along with > the offending posts. Still no one! I put the camera away and walked > up to the house which was located behind the barn and found a small > shop with the radio going and a sign that read, "Rug Weaving". > > Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him > that I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the > phone. "Over there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of > my wallet and called the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that > he was up. He answered and said he would come out right away, > "What's the address?" I asked the man who was still weaving and he > said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the airport > manager. > > The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I > said no, he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as > if the crash was an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about > how he got into the rug weaving business, where he sold them and how > he made them etc. Finally he said, "Well, let's go take a look." We > went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied he went back to > the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the house > waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive. > > Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us > went to the airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. > Kirk phoned a friend who had a trailer and he said he would help. > > Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his > house along with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just > respectfully looking things over. We took the wings off, loaded the > plane, I went back to the shop and thanked the Weaver for the use of > his pasture and then we headed for the airport. There was a tight > hangar and we put Piet in there. > > Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and > then die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged > up. No water in fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl > and start trouble shooting. Locked up hangar and called friend who > was at Oshkosh on his cell phone. He said would come in his new RV-8 > and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will spend a few unplanned > days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday. > > The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I > would also pull the center section and take a close look at it. The > front spar of the center section shows slight damage where the metal > fitting attaches to the wing panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet > seems OK. > > I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the > plane so am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. > Anyone interested? > > John > ATTACHMENT part 2 image/jpeg name=P1020361.jpg __________________________________ http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail


    Message 23


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:17:32 PM PST US
    From: TomTravis@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John, I'm sorry to hear of your engine failure and forced landing but am glad to hear you're OK. You obvioulsy did a fantatic job of getting it in that field. I'll be glad to make you some replacement ribs or whatever else I can do to help get you back in the air. Don't give up on your beautiful Piet just yet. Tom Travis


    Message 24


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:35:18 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Pietenpol-Lists: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> Hi Michael, In our club, twice a year since about 8 to 10 years ago, we make a deadstick landing contest in a dry lake near our landing strip. It beguined since the time of the old ultralights (2 cycle engines), now all, even 912 Rotax have to participate, also we have participats from other little clubs near here (is getting famous). The lake is 20 x 50 miles long of hard sand, we make a white line and each pilot has 3 chances, the engine is shot down 1,500 ft (800 ft in ultralights) above when we pass over the mark. All the pilots that land farther from the line (short or passed) in each category, pays for a round of Corona beer in the next sunday barbacue in the club. I had this idea when we lost a good friend of the club in a hard landing about 11 years ago. We dont do more practice because the lake is flooded with mud about six months a year. We sometimes have big surprices from proficient pilots that land real far, even one with lots of hours experience, landed 90 degrees off course in his spam cam. Saludos Gary Gower. --- Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> > > Gosh John, I'm really glad to hear that you were not hurt in the > off-airport landing. I respect your judgement and skill in > executing that > landing and really saving yourself and 85% of the airplane. I'm not > so > sure how I'd perform given a sudden engine stoppage. Something to > think > about and be prepared for more in my flying I think. > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 25


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:57:13 PM PST US
    From: Isablcorky@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Tailwheel steering
    Terry, I had a small problem when I first began taxiing 41CC. I had a few months before flown a Christian Eagle and I was all over the runway because of the short arm on the steering tail wheel. ( That's different from the Army's short arm). 41CC felt the same as the Eagle. It has a 6 inch steerable Scott. Both the t/w and rudder horn cables terminate on the ends of the rudder bar. I decided to fab two strips of 4130 3/4X 6 .080 to extend the t/w steering arms. Drilled extra holes in the Scott steering arms for mounting screws and 2 holes for cable spring mountings. I found that the fartherest holes outboard were too wide and made turning difficult so I came back to the hole nearer inboard and found it perfect. Felt like an Aeronca steering reaction. You might wait until it's taxiing time to try this as the FEEL of a plane is a very personal thing. Also, as I became accustomed to the plane it would have been natural to have flown it with the first configuration. You have to learn to fly those little dudes as well as build them. Hopes this helps Corky, still in La living the good life with his bride.


    Message 26


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 02:06:16 PM PST US
    From: Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com>
    Subject: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com> I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle wheels are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if used on a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) with motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from builder to builder? Dick Carden


    Message 27


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 02:20:47 PM PST US
    From: "Dennis Engelkenjohn" <wingding@usmo.com>
    Subject: Re: gn-1s.
    There was a GN-1 and it was camped at the back side of the airport. It was yellow and black. I talked with the owner, he was hangered at Cairo, Illinois (southern tip) and had flown up to Brodhead. He said he sometimes felt like some Piet people were prejudiced against GN-1's and he was leery of taking up passengers right now. He has been to Brodhead in the past and given rides though. Forgot his name, though, damn this old age stuff. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: baileys To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:02 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: gn-1s. Dang no one answered your question. I didn't get to go this year, but I would be surprised if there were no GN-1's at the fly-in. Bob B. Did anybody on this list go or is there anyone out there??? ----- Original Message ----- From: lanny bissell To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 3:56 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: gn-1s. Doc, Any GN-1s at Broadhead? I'm new to the list and Pietenpols in general, but I wonder why I never see much about the GN-1 which I understand is a "modern" version of the Piet. Howard Bissell


    Message 28


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 02:23:47 PM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> I don't have any actual data, but it makes sense. If you look at automotive wire wheels, or aviation wire wheels (like the Jenny in the EAA museum), they invariably have a much wider hub than motorcycle wheels do. Having occasionally made less than perfect crosswind landings, I would rather err on the side of safety. I made my hubs 6" wide, and adapted them to accept Cleveland disc brakes. To each his own. Jack Phillips -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Carden Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 5:04 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com> I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle wheels are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if used on a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) with motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from builder to builder? Dick Carden


    Message 29


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 02:35:44 PM PST US
    From: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
    Subject: Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net> I thought long and hard about bidding on the plans. The thing is I am looking for a set as a REFERENCE ONLY. I have several sets of plans I have gotten as copies and when I was ready to start on a Graham Lee Nieuport I bought a set of serial numbered plans to make it legal. It is extremely unethical to build a second plane off of the same plans and deprive the designer of the meager income they generate. After thinking about it I felt that buying them would only encourage him to sell additional copies and didn't bid. Of course I am still in the position that I would really like to study the plans and don't have access to a set. How would I go about getting a set to study and NOT build from? I have a pant load of projects and don't have time to add another but the engineer in me really wants to look at how BP solved a bunch of design problems. Hank J ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: Question from eBay Member > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> > > Hey Jim-- what an idiot this guys is.......luckily he's only getting about > $30 bucks for it with 10 minutes to go. Here is what I just wrote to the guy > > Dear mgp60, > Having purchased the plans from the Pietenpol family and building and > flying my own Pietenpol, I was sorry to see that you have copied the plans > and have them for sale on ebay. The entire Pietenpol e-mail list is aware > of what you are doing and are encouraged not to bid on your item. > > Best regards, > Mike > >


    Message 30


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 02:47:06 PM PST US
    From: "Mike" <bike.mike@verizon.net>
    Subject: Re: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mike" <bike.mike@verizon.net> With a sidecar, a motorcycle's wheels are subject to the same axial (side) loads as automobile wheels. There are literally thousands of motorcycles that have run with sidecars successfully. Some have even raced. I don't think that would be the case if no motorcycle wheels could take axial loads. Mike Hardaway ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > > I don't have any actual data, but it makes sense. If you look at automotive > wire wheels, or aviation wire wheels (like the Jenny in the EAA museum), > they invariably have a much wider hub than motorcycle wheels do. Having > occasionally made less than perfect crosswind landings, I would rather err > on the side of safety. I made my hubs 6" wide, and adapted them to accept > Cleveland disc brakes. To each his own. > > Jack Phillips > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard > Carden > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 5:04 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com> > > I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle wheels > are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if used on > a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) with > motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from > builder to builder? > > Dick Carden > >


    Message 31


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 03:26:02 PM PST US
    From: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net>
    Subject: Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" <hjarrett@hroads.net> I don't think I would destroy the plans, just insure they are never used to build from. There is nothing wrong with having an extra set in the shop to build from and keeping the "legal" set at home for study and a permanent record is there? It's a real pain when you knock a can of paint over on your plans ant you only have the originals! Hank J ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Hargrove" <ronhargrove@gmail.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: Question from eBay Member > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com> > > Unfortunately, I did buy plans from this guy thinking they were unused > originals. I think I will destroy them just on the principal of the > thing. I have also sent an email to Don Pietenpol informing him of the > situation. > > Ron > > On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:08:27 -0500, Textor, Jack > <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com> wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Textor, Jack" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com> > > > > Good letter Mike! > > Do not archive > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 32


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 03:33:55 PM PST US
    From: "walt evans" <wbeevans@verizon.net>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John, "any landing that you can walk away from...." well you know the rest. Count your blessings, and think about the instructor that did the engine outs with you. Anyway,,,glad to hear your OK, and I think that all the advice that the guys are giving is good. Don't be too quick to sell. I think it's good advice. It's a bittersweet feeling, that in a weird way you can be proud that you made a landing that we all think of and wonder, when the time comes, how it will turn out. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: John Dilatush To: Pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 7:56 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded! Pieters, Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop in Marshalltown, I arrived in Jefferson IA. Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It was a beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over the horizon. I was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb configuration at about 500 feet when the engine quit, just like someone turned off the ignition. I only had one choice, which was a small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of town. At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so I headed there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. The terrain was uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly short, but still dicey whether or not I could get the plane stopped before the barn, so I decided to ground loop Piet. As I started to swing around to the right, the left wing struck some large posts about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around to the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around the left side of Mountain Piet. I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one of the nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the camera out and decided to take a few pictures of the plane along with the offending posts. Still no one! I put the camera away and walked up to the house which was located behind the barn and found a small shop with the radio going and a sign that read, "Rug Weaving". Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him that I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the phone. "Over there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of my wallet and called the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that he was up. He answered and said he would come out right away, "What's the address?" I asked the man who was still weaving and he said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the airport manager. The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I said no, he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as if the crash was an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about how he got into the rug weaving business, where he sold them and how he made them etc. Finally he said, "Well, let's go take a look." We went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied he went back to the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the house waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive. Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us went to the airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. Kirk phoned a friend who had a trailer and he said he would help. Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his house along with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just respectfully looking things over. We took the wings off, loaded the plane, I went back to the shop and thanked the Weaver for the use of his pasture and then we headed for the airport. There was a tight hangar and we put Piet in there. Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and then die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged up. No water in fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl and start trouble shooting. Locked up hangar and called friend who was at Oshkosh on his cell phone. He said would come in his new RV-8 and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will spend a few unplanned days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday. The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I would also pull the center section and take a close look at it. The front spar of the center section shows slight damage where the metal fitting attaches to the wing panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet seems OK. I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the plane so am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. Anyone interested? John


    Message 33


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 03:59:38 PM PST US
    From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
    Subject: Re: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net> This is like waving a red flag in front of a bull. This has got to be my pet pieve! People will say "motorcycles can't take sideloads,(which is true) so the wheels must not be able to take side loads". There's no logical connection between those two statements! One has to eventually answer the question "how much strength do I need?" I can't answer that question, but I can tell you what the maximum force to which the wheels could be subjected in practice. Everybody knows that the straight-axle gear is as strong as a bridge! If the wheels can withstand the sideload strength limits of the straight-axle gear, you've gotta believe in those wheels! What gives the straight-axle gear it's strength are two crossed cables..that's all! All those little sheetmetal fittings do an admirable job on fore and aft forces but they have almost NO sideload strength. I drew a freebody diagram showing the static forces and concluded that the side force required to fail the gear is around 1200 pounds. You've gotta remember that there's a turnbuckle in those cables which might or might not have a failure strength equal to that of the cables. I intend to test a representative wheel at these force levels and I'll post the results. Carl Vought/Huntsville, AL On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 17:03:47 -0400, Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com> wrote : > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com> > > I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle wheels > are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if used on > a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) with > motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from > builder to builder? > > Dick Carden > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 34


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:07:21 PM PST US
    From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
    Subject: Re: gn-1s.
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net> I saw the airplane you're referring to. I thought it was a Piet! It had a paint job that showed some age and I took satisfaction in that because when I saw it I said to myself "an airplane does not have to be glossy to be beautiful." I don't think the paint job I'm planning to put on my Piet will be very different. That airplane spent a lot of time near the treeline. I'm sorry we didn't make him feel more welcome...Carl Vought On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 16:20:21 -0500, "Dennis Engelkenjohn" <wingding@usmo.com> wrote : > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dennis Engelkenjohn" <wingding@usmo.com> > > > > There was a GN-1 and it was camped at the back side of the airport. It was yellow and black. I talked with the owner, he was hangered at Cairo, Illinois (southern tip) and had flown up to Brodhead. He said he sometimes felt like some Piet people were prejudiced against GN-1's and he was leery of taking up passengers right now. He has been to Brodhead in the past and given rides though. Forgot his name, though, damn this old age stuff. > Dennis > ----- Original Message ----- > From: baileys > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:02 PM > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: gn-1s. > > > Dang no one answered your question. I didn't get to go this year, but I would be surprised if there were no GN-1's at the fly-in. > Bob B. > Did anybody on this list go or is there anyone out there??? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: lanny bissell > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 3:56 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: gn-1s. > > > Doc, Any GN-1s at Broadhead? I'm new to the list and Pietenpols in general, but I wonder why I never see much about the GN-1 which I understand is a "modern" version of the Piet. > Howard Bissell >


    Message 35


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:07:46 PM PST US
    From: "Jim Malley" <jgmalley@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Malley" <jgmalley@comcast.net> You asked for actual experience, so here goes: I had put motorcycle wheels on my Pietenpol in the late 80s. It took off, flew and landed well even in crosswinds that I know I shouldn't have been in. In the mid 90s, while trying to land during a rainstorm, I went off the end of a down-sloping runway. To avoid hitting the upcoming trees, I intentionally ground looped the plane while still traveling at a pretty high speed, which I estimate to have been about 25 mph. With the plane moving forward but facing 90 degrees sideward, the wheels dug into the earth. The stop was quite abrupt, but the trees were not touched. The holes formed by the wheels were over 12 inches deep. One wheel bent, one did not. There was no other damage on the side that had bent; however on the intact side, the metal fittings were ripped out, an AN bolt sheared and the wood longeron cracked. While making repairs, I couldn't find a matching replacement wheel so I made up some hubs; I made them wider hoping for innate strength, but I still view those original wheels as having been plenty strong. Perhaps they were too strong: if both wheels had collapsed there may not have been any other damage. Jim Malley ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Carden" <flywrite@erols.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden <flywrite@erols.com> > > I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle wheels > are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if used on > a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) with > motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from > builder to builder? > > Dick Carden > >


    Message 36


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:19:53 PM PST US
    From: "John Dilatush" <dilatush@amigo.net>
    Subject: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    Pieters, I can't thank you all enough for your concerns about both "Mountain Piet" and myself. When I started this project in 1995, I wanted to build a Pietenpol with enough horsepower at my field elevation (7000 ft msl) that I could fly it safely and get it in and out of primitive strips here in the Rockies at higher elevations. In this, I feel that I have succeeded. A Pietenpol is a fine, simple design that will handle more horsepower even at a higher gross weight and can perform on a par with even a 180 hp super cub up here in our rarified air. Your advice to wait a little while before making a decision to sell the bird is good advice, but I had already decided before the accident to sell the plane. The project, in my mind anyway, was completed and I had proved my point. Not only has the project succeeded, but other factors have entered into my decision to sell the plane. My age for one, I am 77 years old and have been flying since 1946 (Damn'd, I just realized that is 58 years!). Also entering the decision to sell, I have found that an open cockpit here in the Rockies at altitude is darned cold, limiting the use of the plane to only a few months of the year. And then there is the family, I had promised to build some new furniture over 10 years ago for my wife and never seemed to get around to it. I have a whole lot of deferred maintenance to do around the house. Kids and grandkids are urging granddad to "give it up, you have cheated death enough times in those airplanes". It just the right time to sell "Mountain Piet" and get to doing some of the other things that need doing around here, the decision to sell was not precipitated by the accident. I have mentioned this accident to participants on the list first because I would rather the plane go to someone who is knowledgable, enthusiastic, will do a good job of repair and appreciate the design and it's heritage. I hope you all will understand this. Thanks again for your concerns and comments, it is good to feel all the support that you offer. John


    Message 37


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:24:31 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> Hank, I will talk about my personal experience. Buy the originals, they dont cost "that" much, and is like building a plane using good materials. What I do is this, I have lots of airplane plans divided in 3 groups: The ones I just like, The ones I build and The ones that call my atention in design. I buy myself at least 2 sets of plans a year, one in my bithday (June) and one for Christmas. Sometime during the year I buy another one I really like, If I think I have been a good boy :-) I have built now (with 4 partners) a Volksplane, a KR-1, a Ramsey Bathtub (that I gave to a friend ready to cover), a Zenith 701 just finished, a Pouchel (ladder Flying Flea) and helped rebuild two trikes (delta wing type) one for me and another one for a friend, also a Teman Monofly and a Falcon XP. In engines and stuf a built 3 VW engine conversions a 1/2 VW, several propelers, etc. Now I am loooking for a good core to build a Corvair engine... I can hardly remember all the plans that I have now, and plan to buy a set of "Suris Bulle" plans (French wooden Motorglider) that looks like a great thing, this Christmas. Of Course I have a set of original Pietenpol and GN-1 plans... My personal limit is US$ 300.00 a set, but I have made a few excepcions ;-) I am not fan of the fiberglass projects, to much sanding and dust. Hope you build a Piet. Saludos Gary Gower. --- hjarrett <hjarrett@hroads.net> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "hjarrett" > <hjarrett@hroads.net> > > I thought long and hard about bidding on the plans. The thing is I > am > looking for a set as a REFERENCE ONLY. I have several sets of plans > I have > gotten as copies and when I was ready to start on a Graham Lee > Nieuport I > bought a set of serial numbered plans to make it legal. It is > extremely > unethical to build a second plane off of the same plans and deprive > the > designer of the meager income they generate. After thinking about it > I felt > that buying them would only encourage him to sell additional copies > and > didn't bid. Of course I am still in the position that I would really > like > to study the plans and don't have access to a set. > How would I go about getting a set to study and NOT build from? I > have a > pant load of projects and don't have time to add another but the > engineer in > me really wants to look at how BP solved a bunch of design problems. > Hank J > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 10:40 AM > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: Question from eBay Member > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> > > > > Hey Jim-- what an idiot this guys is.......luckily he's only > getting about > > $30 bucks for it with 10 minutes to go. Here is what I just wrote > to the > guy > > > > Dear mgp60, > > Having purchased the plans from the Pietenpol family and building > and > > flying my own Pietenpol, I was sorry to see that you have copied > the plans > > and have them for sale on ebay. The entire Pietenpol e-mail list > is > aware > > of what you are doing and are encouraged not to bid on your item. > > > > Best regards, > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 38


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:26:34 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> Good point Saludos Gary Gower Do not archive. --- Mike <bike.mike@verizon.net> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mike" <bike.mike@verizon.net> > > With a sidecar, a motorcycle's wheels are subject to the same axial > (side) > loads as automobile wheels. > There are literally thousands of motorcycles that have run with > sidecars > successfully. Some have even raced. > I don't think that would be the case if no motorcycle wheels could > take > axial loads. > > Mike Hardaway > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 2:22 PM > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" > <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > > > > I don't have any actual data, but it makes sense. If you look at > automotive > > wire wheels, or aviation wire wheels (like the Jenny in the EAA > museum), > > they invariably have a much wider hub than motorcycle wheels do. > Having > > occasionally made less than perfect crosswind landings, I would > rather err > > on the side of safety. I made my hubs 6" wide, and adapted them to > accept > > Cleveland disc brakes. To each his own. > > > > Jack Phillips > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Richard > > Carden > > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 5:04 PM > > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden > <flywrite@erols.com> > > > > I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle > wheels > > are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if > used on > > a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) > with > > motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from > > builder to builder? > > > > Dick Carden > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 39


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:40:25 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Wire wheels
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> This mail is a "keeper", Thanks Mr Malley, great plane of yours, I still have the photos from the EAA magazines... Saludos Gary Gower Do not archive. --- Jim Malley <jgmalley@comcast.net> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Malley" > <jgmalley@comcast.net> > > You asked for actual experience, so here goes: I had put motorcycle > wheels > on my Pietenpol in the late 80s. It took off, flew and landed well > even in > crosswinds that I know I shouldn't have been in. In the mid 90s, > while > trying to land during a rainstorm, I went off the end of a > down-sloping > runway. To avoid hitting the upcoming trees, I intentionally ground > looped > the plane while still traveling at a pretty high speed, which I > estimate to > have been about 25 mph. With the plane moving forward but facing 90 > degrees > sideward, the wheels dug into the earth. The stop was quite abrupt, > but the > trees were not touched. The holes formed by the wheels were over 12 > inches > deep. One wheel bent, one did not. There was no other damage on the > side > that had bent; however on the intact side, the metal fittings were > ripped > out, an AN bolt sheared and the wood longeron cracked. > While making repairs, I couldn't find a matching replacement wheel so > I made > up some hubs; I made them wider hoping for innate strength, but I > still view > those original wheels as having been plenty strong. Perhaps they were > too > strong: if both wheels had collapsed there may not have been any > other > damage. > Jim Malley > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Richard Carden" <flywrite@erols.com> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 5:03 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wire wheels > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Richard Carden > <flywrite@erols.com> > > > > I've read a few anecdotals about claims that spoked motorcycle > wheels > > are not designed to take side loads and are sure to collapse if > used on > > a Piet/GN-1. Does anyone have any ACTUAL experience (good or bad) > with > > motorcycle wheels, or is this simply an old saw handed down from > > builder to builder? > > > > Dick Carden > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 40


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:34:29 PM PST US
    From: "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: Fw: Question from eBay Member
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com> Good for you, Jim. He can't say "I didn't know..." There's a guy (ebay alias of "Uncle Willie") that's doing this on a wholesale basis (and making a fortune at it) with model airplane plans. Even worse than copying other's plans, he "fixes" them. Apparently, eBay really doesn't care to take action on wholesale copyright fraud taking place on it's site, especially if the original copyright owner isn't making the complaint. http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=155971&highlight=w illie Not all future Piet builders would go for this, fortunately. Heck, I have a copied set of plans that a Piet-building friend gave me. I couldn't afford to buy the real ones, so I got them as a head start to look over while I dream about my future project. Yet even though I probably could build from them, I won't do it, nor will I give them to someone else. When I get ready to start, I will buy a new set from the Pietenpol family. Not only will I be sure to have all the right plans, but I can rest at night knowing that I've helped make it worthwhile to Bernie's family to go to the trouble to continue the fine tradition that he gave to us all. They aren't getting rich on the plans, I'm 100% sure of that. Then the copies will make functional wallpaper for the shop bathroom or something. Shame on these people. It's sad that they have no respect for those who make this airplane a viable option. Fortunately they're the exception and not the rule. -Mike Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association http://www.ov-10bronco.net/ ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com> Subject: [piet] Pietenpol-List: Fw: Question from eBay Member > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com> > > If anyone knows of anyone thinking about buying the Piet plans advertised on > eBay.....please don't....without EVEN discussing the legalities, it's just > not right to make copies of these plans and sell them.....just ain't > right.... > > I usually manage to stay out of stuff that isn't any of my concern but I > just couldn't keep quiet about this one.... > > This is the reply I got to an inquiry about where he was getting the > plans..... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <mackpaul60@hotmail.com> > To: <jim_markle@mindspring.com> > Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 3:36 PM > Subject: Question from eBay Member > > > Dear dfwplt, > > All the Pientepol plans I have for sale are copies of the originals. Hope > this helps. > > > To respond to this eBay member go to: > > http://contact.ebay.com/ws1/ebayISAPI.dll?ReturnUserEmail&requested=mgp60&fr m=-1&iid=-1&de=off&redirect=0&contactsubmit=Contact+Member > > Thank you, > mgp60 > >


    Message 41


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:41:03 PM PST US
    From: "Richard Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
    Subject: Re: solar charger
    Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp per hour at about 18 volts. Not enough to fry a battery but enough to replace what a handheld radio would use. How many trips away from home will you fly? And for how many flight hours, with what size battery? If the current draw for the round trip is less than 1/2 the capacity, why bother? On the other hand, the worst possible thing will always happen at the worst possible time, so if you have the space, why not? Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: Douwe Blumberg To: pietenpolgroup Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 1:48 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: solar charger Hey guys, I saw Chuck Ganzer's solar panel he uses to charge a small battery which in turn powers his GPS, radio etc. I thought this was a great idea but am not electrically minded enough to figure it out. I can get a small solar panel and install it in my top wing. Then some wiring to a small battery, which goes back to some plugs for my intercom and gps etc. My question is what is the voltage we need? will these items run off a 12v battery? I can get a nice small 1lb 12v. Also, how do you keep it from overcharging without much weight? or do you just have a disconnect switch when the battery is full? This would clearly be for when one is away from home, but it's clean and always ready. Any electric experts out there? thanks, Douwe


    Message 42


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:42:09 PM PST US
    From: "Lynn Knoll" <dknoll@cox.net>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John, It hurt to look at the picture of your wounded Piet but we are all thankful you were not wounded. I met you at Brodhead and I appreciate you taking time to answer several questions I had about your plane. It is certainly a beautiful Piet. Based on the outstanding workmanship of your Piet the furniture you build for your wife should be strictly "blue ribbon" quality. Stay in touch with us and send us a picture of the completed furniture. Lynn Knoll Wichita Piet/Vair in the works


    Message 43


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:15:22 PM PST US
    From: "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    John, glad you're OK. Mountain Piet will be too, someday. Are you building the furniture as a Light Sport Sofa to hold two people at a time? <G> Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association http://www.ov-10bronco.net/ ----- Original Message ----- From: John Dilatush To: Pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:16 PM Subject: [piet] Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded! Pieters, I can't thank you all enough for your concerns about both "Mountain Piet" and myself. When I started this project in 1995, I wanted to build a Pietenpol with enough horsepower at my field elevation (7000 ft msl) that I could fly it safely and get it in and out of primitive strips here in the Rockies at higher elevations. In this, I feel that I have succeeded. A Pietenpol is a fine, simple design that will handle more horsepower even at a higher gross weight and can perform on a par with even a 180 hp super cub up here in our rarified air. Your advice to wait a little while before making a decision to sell the bird is good advice, but I had already decided before the accident to sell the plane. The project, in my mind anyway, was completed and I had proved my point. Not only has the project succeeded, but other factors have entered into my decision to sell the plane. My age for one, I am 77 years old and have been flying since 1946 (Damn'd, I just realized that is 58 years!). Also entering the decision to sell, I have found that an open cockpit here in the Rockies at altitude is darned cold, limiting the use of the plane to only a few months of the year. And then there is the family, I had promised to build some new furniture over 10 years ago for my wife and never seemed to get around to it. I have a whole lot of deferred maintenance to do around the house. Kids and grandkids are urging granddad to "give it up, you have cheated death enough times in those airplanes". It just the right time to sell "Mountain Piet" and get to doing some of the other things that need doing around here, the decision to sell was not precipitated by the accident. I have mentioned this accident to participants on the list first because I would rather the plane go to someone who is knowledgable, enthusiastic, will do a good job of repair and appreciate the design and it's heritage. I hope you all will understand this. Thanks again for your concerns and comments, it is good to feel all the support that you offer. John


    Message 44


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:26:03 PM PST US
    d="scan'217,208"; a="181421917:sNHT16479436"
    From: "Christian Bobka" <sbobka@charter.net>
    Subject: More hangar space
    John, I have a very nice heated hangar about 60 north of the IA-MN border right on Interstate 35 in Faribault, MN that you are welcome to use for any repair work to Mountain Piet and it is free. The airplane could always be fetched for you. Chris Bobka


    Message 45


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:27:34 PM PST US
    From: "tmbrant1@netzero.net" <tmbrant1@netzero.net>
    Subject: Re: hinged / removable turtledeck
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "tmbrant1@netzero.net" <tmbrant1@netzero.net> Dick, Is yours 1/16"th ply over the t.d.? I'd like to take a closer look at how you did that if you wouldn't mind. Tom B.


    Message 46


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:34:19 PM PST US
    From: Rcaprd@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Mountain Piet is wounded!
    I just checked some of the 877 e-mails I have, and saw the misfortune that John had. Thank God, it didn't turn out any worse. John, one of the things I've discovered is that there are lots of folks, not just in the Pietenpol comunity, but airplane people in general, who are ready, willing, and able to help you. Even anxious to help. Airplane people are the greatest !! I hope you kick back and think about it for a while, before you sell 'Mountain Piet'. Chuck Gantzer




    Other Matronics Email List Services

  • Post A New Message
  •   pietenpol-list@matronics.com
  • UN/SUBSCRIBE
  •   http://www.matronics.com/subscription
  • List FAQ
  •   http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
  • Full Archive Search Engine
  •   http://www.matronics.com/search
  • 7-Day List Browse
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Pietenpol-List Digests
  •   http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Other Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse
  • Live Online Chat!
  •   http://www.matronics.com/chat
  • Archive Downloading
  •   http://www.matronics.com/archives
  • Photo Share
  •   http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
  • Other Email Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
  • Contributions
  •   http://www.matronics.com/contributions

    These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.

    -- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --