Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:06 AM - fraud on ebay (Michael D Cuy)
2. 05:24 AM - nothing new (Michael D Cuy)
3. 05:32 AM - copied plans being sold on ebay (Michael D Cuy)
4. 05:45 AM - wire wheel myths (Michael D Cuy)
5. 06:17 AM - Mountain Piet (Oscar Zuniga)
6. 06:23 AM - older pilots- off topic (Oscar Zuniga)
7. 06:36 AM - wire wheels (Douwe Blumberg)
8. 06:42 AM - Re: wire wheels (Jim Markle)
9. 07:04 AM - Re: solar charger (Carl D. Vought)
10. 07:32 AM - Tw steering-wire wheels (lshutks@webtv.net (Leon Stefan))
11. 07:44 AM - Re: solar charger (Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers)
12. 08:16 AM - Re: solar charger (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
13. 08:22 AM - Piet electronics (Isablcorky@aol.com)
14. 09:10 AM - Re: solar charger (DJ Vegh)
15. 10:01 AM - Re: wire wheels (James Dallas)
16. 10:53 AM - Re: solar charger (Hubbard, Eugene)
17. 11:18 AM - Re: solar charger (DJ Vegh)
18. 12:38 PM - Re: solar charger (Carl D. Vought)
19. 12:49 PM - Piet electrics (Oscar Zuniga)
20. 12:51 PM - a small 12 volt battery (Michael D Cuy)
21. 01:48 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (Hodgson, Mark O)
22. 02:19 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
23. 02:23 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
24. 02:29 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
25. 02:32 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
26. 02:35 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
27. 02:43 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
28. 02:52 PM - Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! (John Dilatush)
29. 02:53 PM - Re: solar charger (Don Morris)
30. 02:56 PM - Re: Magneto stuff (Don Morris)
31. 03:16 PM - Re: Magneto stuff (Carl D. Vought)
32. 03:18 PM - Whoops!, didn't mean to use up all the bandwidth. (John Dilatush)
33. 06:42 PM - Vacuum Bagging (Jim Markle)
34. 07:15 PM - Data Plate Location ()
35. 07:17 PM - Re: Vacuum Bagging (Dave and Connie)
36. 07:20 PM - Forward CG limit ()
37. 07:25 PM - Re: Vacuum Bagging (Jim Markle)
38. 08:15 PM - Data Plate Location (Christian Bobka)
39. 08:26 PM - Re: Forward CG limit (Richard Navratil)
40. 08:27 PM - Re: Forward CG limit (Cory Emberson)
41. 08:29 PM - Re: solar charger (Richard Navratil)
42. 08:30 PM - Re: Forward CG limit (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
43. 08:32 PM - Re: Forward CG limit (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
44. 08:35 PM - Re: Forward CG limit (Cory Emberson)
45. 08:35 PM - Re: hinged / removable turtledeck (Richard Navratil)
46. 08:37 PM - Re: Forward CG limit (Christian Bobka)
47. 09:11 PM - I.M. Dialogue with Chuck (long) (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
Message 1
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
What is nice guys, is that when you order your plans from.......and here is
the Pietenpol Family Web Site where
you can also learn lots about the plane's
history, http://www.pressenter.com/~apietenp/ Donald Pietenpol he (or at
least he did when I ordered my plans from him) sent a typed letter, signed
and noted with a plans number at the bottom of the page. That is nice to
have, for me at least.
Turns out that the guy on ebay has sold other sets of these copies of the
Pietenpol plans and as expected, he did not respond to my e-mail telling
him of our collective disappointment in his actions.
When I rec'd my plans, another would-be builder in the area that has huge
bucks, offered to "take my plans and make copies of them" so that I could
have a "working set and a reference set". That was total BS because I
knew this cheap #$%
SS would make a second set for himself in the
process. I told him no and gave him the address of Donald Pietenpol and
Donald's number. I guess to each his own on this issue, but I know where
I stand. Let others decide as they will.
PS-- these are about the least expensive plans out there I have ever seen
too, even if you order the supplementals, etc.
Mike C.
PS-- good eye, Jim Markle for rooting this guy out for us to know about.
Message 2
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
This guy has sold 3 sets of fake/copied Pietenpol plans so far. On July
7th he sold a set for $51, on July 15th for $31, and July 29th for
$31. Looks like he's got the hang of it.
Mike C.
Message 3
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PietenpolDon@juno.com
| Subject: | copied plans being sold on ebay |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Dear Don & Andrew-- I just thought I'd let you know that the guys on the
Pietenpol e-mail discussion group just made note that a seller on
ebay, mgp60 is selling a 23 page copied set of plans from YOUR
originals. He's sold three sets since July 7th for $51, $31, and another
$31. I e-mailed him telling him that the entire Pietenpol e-mail list is
onto him and that we are disappointed in his actions. He didn't respond
to me. Evidently this guy is doing this with model and ultralight plans
as well. I regularly post where the listers can obtain plans-- your
Family Web Site. I know it's difficult to stop people from doing this,
but at least I thought I'd let you know we are trying to help you out and
stop fakes like this from selling fraudulent plans. Hope all is well on
your end,
Best regards,
Mike Cuy
Ohio
Message 4
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| Subject: | wire wheel myths |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Another guy besides Jim Malley (nice to see you on the list, Jim) who has
run motorcycle wheels for a long time is Wil Graf
of Wadsworth, Ohio. Wil has flown his Piet to Brodhead many times and
Oshkosh too. Never a wheel problem in gusty crosswind landings. I was
sold on this widening of the hubs for years but the more time passes, the
less I ever hear of anything about wire wheel failures-- stock or
built-up. I did hear of one guy in WA who made up his own wheel hubs
wider and one collapsed on a 2nd or 3rd landing since new. He thought, as
I recall, that the spoke tension was not equal or enough to support the
loads. I say go with whatever looks/effort/resource you are happy with in
the wire wheel dept.
Mike C.
Message 5
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Howdy, low and slow fliers;
The truth is, as John said, he was ready to sell "Mountain Piet" even last
year when I visited him. He had proven that he could build what he set out
to build, and wanted to pass the airplane on to someone who would fly it and
show it and use it more than he is able to. But as far as the rebuild of
the bird, I recall the old days (older than me, even) when a farmer would
lose a barn in a fire or storm and the neighbors would all pitch in to have
a barn-raisin' and have fun while helping out a friend in need. Same seems
to be happening with the Piet folks here... somebody has some ribs, somebody
has spar material, some fabric, dope, worktable... and over a week or so
this bird could be back in the air and headed home for a paint job. All the
metal fittings should be re-usable, the majority of the AN hardware, and so
forth. I've balled up motorcycles in my earlier years and felt that same
feeling, push the thing into a dark corner and never want to ride again.
Give it to somebody who wanted to mess with it, for free or very cheap. We
all know Mountain Piet (and John) deserve better than that.
The engine is a whole 'nother thing, but John knows his engine too... and
I'm sure that will get sorted out.
Since I'm on the digest I didn't get any pictures of the injured bird (if
any were posted). I'd appreciate seeing the pictures, if someone could
email them to me direct.
And I do like the concept of the "Sport Pilot Sofa" that will be John's next
shop project... pilot and passenger only... but in my case there would have
to be a baggage allowance of at least 65 lbs. for "Squeaker", our pit bull.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 6
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| Subject: | older pilots- off topic |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Pieters- a little news about Charlie Avaritt, my CFI who is also the person
who ferried my new Piet from Corky's place in Louisiana back down here to
Texas.
Charlie flies corporate charter for some impressive clients. Lately he's
heard scuttlebutt that they are thinking they need a younger pilot... that
Charlie may have torn a few too many pages off his calendar for their
corporate image or something.
So I told Charlie he could be my corporate Pietenpol pilot... because in the
Piet world, older is better! (Sterling: how's that for another idea for a
shirt?! ;o)
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 7
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I have personally witnessed two wire wheel failures on WWI reproductions. Both
were motorcycle wheels. One did collapse sideways during a ground loop and the
other collapsed the rim during a huge bounce, which might have happend to anything.
I made up a set of wheels with brakes for a WWI replica (1800lbs) and tested them
on a utility trailer loaded to actual plane weight and roared around bends,
with no failure or problems. These were the standard six inch hub, but with
the "offset" used during WWI and mentioned below.
Some observations.
1. Most antique wire wheels have an "offset" to the rim so that the outside of
the hub protrudes farther. This is because the sideloads experienced from the
inside are neglegable while the outside takes most of the sideloads from landings.
The larger the angle the spokes take, the stronger they will be at resisting
sideloads. You don't see most wheels set up anymore, but we probably should.
2. If you're not using brakes, don't use a cross pattern when lacing them up,
use a straight pattern. IF you're using brakes you absolutely must use a cross
pattern since your brake hub wants to spin inside the wheel when brakes are
applied.
3. THE place most bike shops send their wheels to is Buchannans spoke and rim
in Azusa, CA. They have laced up countless wheels for planes and bikes and know
their stuff.
Motorcyles do not experience sideloads, and my guess is that sidecars experience
sideloads far less dramatic than an airplane. People knew a lot more about
wire wheels on airplanes and horse buggies 80 years ago than they do now, so their
designs are probably based on much more experience than our own. It's not
a big job to make up some hubs and have them spoked, and well worth the piece
of mind.
$ .02
Douwe
douweblumberg@earthlink.net
Message 8
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Motorcyles do not experience sideloads, and my guess is that sidecars experience
sideloads far less dramatic than an airplane.
Hey wait just a minute!!! Evil Kneivel might disagree!! His motorcyclyes have
experienced side loads and the tires have gone one way when the motorcycle
went another way......wait, it was his rear end that went the other way.....never
mind......
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
(sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of? Carl
Vought
On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
<horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
<horzpool@goldengate.net>
>
>
>
> Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp per
hour at about 18 volts. >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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ETAsAhQA/VIdtm1ociUL3VZkti0SI4RD2AIUPJqcVBT3LYDic3Mw0arYWSukZ+s=
| Subject: | Tw steering-wire wheels |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: lshutks@webtv.net (Leon Stefan)
Like Corky, I made 3" extension arms for my tail wheel to slow down the
steering. I haven' flown yet, so I can't comment on how it works. In
an old issue of the Int. Piet. news letter Chad Willie wrote a note on
how his dad went sliding down the runway sideways from 50 mph with no
damage to his stock motorcycle wheels. This was years ago, so the wheels
may have been borrowd from Fred Flintstone. I always wondered if the
stories about side load failures were just tall tales. Leon Stefan.
Having Wisconsin weather in Kansas.
Message 11
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| From: | "Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers" <wayne@engravers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers" <wayne@engravers.net>
Model airplane propellers are made to be going quite a few thousand of RPM's
not a few hundred at best, so the pitch would not be correct for your idea.
What are the winds at your location? You will have to make this unit
weathervane to stay into the wind to get the most from it. I would check out
what they have for boating, they have been doing it for years and you won't
have to reinvent or prototype a new design.
With a solar charger they can be left right in the cockpit on the glare
shield or in front of any solar reflector.
Wayne
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
<carbarvo@knology.net>
>
> I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
> model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
> (sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
Carl
> Vought
>
>
> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
> <horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
> <horzpool@goldengate.net>
> >
> >
> >
> > Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
> smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp per
> hour at about 18 volts. >
> >
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com
Most of the portable 12V electronics like GPS and handheld transcievers can have
neat little re-chargeable Nickel-Metal-Hydride (NmH) batteries or Ni-CAD storage
batteries that are not too big... Like cell phones have. These batteries
outlast energizers and duracells by a long shot. I think the solar panel idea
is a great way to keep a continual charge going on these. I believe this is
what Chuck has...he can confirm this. One thing I would like to learn is how
much current can you get per square inch of solar panel... and if a reasonably
small one has enough juice to keep up with the load of the desired equipment.
For my cell phone in my car, I have a great little $10 cig. lighter charge adapter
that has a stand-by feature to prevent continual charge if the battery is
full. That might be a solution to the worry of over charging.
In Chucks system, he also has a little 12V motorcycle battery installed on the
firewall to run his smoke pump. I am not sure if he has the solar panel wired
in to charge this battery or not. But it makes me wonder if such a battery could
be wired in as an effective backup power supply for GPS and handheld.
One other note....It was interesting for me to see Chuck's little LED charge indicator.
It was indicating a 5V charge from that little solar panel well after
sundown into dusk.
Whenever Chuck gets back home and has a chance to wade thru all his emails, we
need to urge him to give us a report on his little charging system. He may have
a good solution there.
--
Terry L. Bowden
ph 254-715-4773
fax 254-853-3805
Message 13
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| Subject: | Piet electronics |
Pieters,
While the list is thinking solar voltage etc I will ask a few questions.
I wish to install a solar charger on 311CC. I wish to install a Transponder.
I too was impressed with Chuck Gantzer's avionics. I will wire it for nav
lights and strobe. Not for me but maybe for a future owner. Will have a handheld
com radio and GPS with internal supply sourse.
For the xponder operation, what size battery would be needed? What size solar
panel would be needed for the operational recharge of Transponder drain? What
drain from nav lights and strobe?
Limited night flying of course. Forget the weight factor I'll be solo 99% of
the time. I vision the xponder mounted vertically angled back on the right
side of cockpit in that 1 inch space against the ply side. The xponder is about
1
1/2 inches high.
It hit 100 here yesterday. Maybe I was out in the sun too long. Anyway I
would appreciate any feedback on this subject. Thanks
Corky, in La planting orange, grapefruit and satsumas trees today.
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
I was going to do the same thing. I did tests using an RC airplane engine
starter bolted to a 12" prop. I managed to get about 13 amps out of it.
The only problem I found was that a standard RC prop would begin to spin
until wind hitting it was over 40mph.
A homemade prop made from 1/8" aluminum with a coarse pitch would do much
better.
you will also need a voltage regulator to keep the voltage down and to
dissapate the extra energy as heat.
DJ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
<carbarvo@knology.net>
>
> I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
> model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
> (sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
Carl
> Vought
>
>
> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
> <horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
> <horzpool@goldengate.net>
> >
> >
> >
> > Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
> smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp per
> hour at about 18 volts. >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 15
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Seal-Send-Time: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:58:41 -0500
Douwe, You would not believe the loads put on a sidecar wheel. The sidecar wheel
on the right side of a bike takes tremendous punishment in left hand turns,
so much that the rear wheel of the bike actually unloads itself. With a sidecar
the bikes wheels take the punishment in right turns. Unlike an airplane
the bike spends a lot of time in the cornering mode with power applied. Don't
underestimate the forces a sidecar rig handles. Normal driving with a bike
no sidecar the tire will last close to 40 thousand miles, with a side car I'm
happy if I get 8 to 10.
Jim Dallas
An avid Sidecarist
Avid corvairist
But building a Piet and a Hatz not an Avid
----- Original Message -----
From: Douwe Blumberg
To: pietenpolgroup
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 8:47 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: wire wheels
<SNIP>
Motorcyles do not experience sideloads, and my guess is that sidecars experience
sideloads far less dramatic than an airplane. People knew a lot more about
wire wheels on airplanes and horse buggies 80 years ago than they do now, so
their designs are probably based on much more experience than our own. It's
not a big job to make up some hubs and have them spoked, and well worth the piece
of mind.
$ .02
Douwe
douweblumberg@earthlink.net
Message 16
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Hubbard, Eugene" <ehubbard@titan.com>
DJ,
Any recommendations on which motor/generator to use? I'm using a C-75 on my
Piet and would love to dispense with the "engine driven electrical system"
but also don't want to depend on separately recharging radio and GPS.
Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
I was going to do the same thing. I did tests using an RC airplane engine
starter bolted to a 12" prop. I managed to get about 13 amps out of it.
The only problem I found was that a standard RC prop would begin to spin
until wind hitting it was over 40mph.
A homemade prop made from 1/8" aluminum with a coarse pitch would do much
better.
you will also need a voltage regulator to keep the voltage down and to
dissapate the extra energy as heat.
DJ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
<carbarvo@knology.net>
>
> I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
> model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
> (sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
Carl
> Vought
>
>
> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
> <horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
> <horzpool@goldengate.net>
> >
> >
> >
> > Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
> smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp per
> hour at about 18 volts. >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
the RC engine starter is probably not the optimum but it's been used before
by others with good results. It's cheap to at about $35.
You have to experiment with the proper pitch of the prop (on the generator)
to get the rpms where they need to be at cruise flight.
From there any tractor 12V regulator would work fine. The regulator I'm
using on my engine driven generator is from John Deere. Has large aluminmum
heat sink fins to get rid of the heat.
check this link...... it shows how a guy used an RC engine starter as a
generator on his Cub
http://www.pipercubforum.com/windgen.htm
DJ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hubbard, Eugene" <ehubbard@titan.com>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Hubbard, Eugene"
<ehubbard@titan.com>
>
> DJ,
>
> Any recommendations on which motor/generator to use? I'm using a C-75 on
my
> Piet and would love to dispense with the "engine driven electrical system"
> but also don't want to depend on separately recharging radio and GPS.
>
> Gene
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
> Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:11 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
>
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
>
> I was going to do the same thing. I did tests using an RC airplane
engine
> starter bolted to a 12" prop. I managed to get about 13 amps out of it.
>
> The only problem I found was that a standard RC prop would begin to spin
> until wind hitting it was over 40mph.
>
> A homemade prop made from 1/8" aluminum with a coarse pitch would do much
> better.
>
> you will also need a voltage regulator to keep the voltage down and to
> dissapate the extra energy as heat.
>
> DJ
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 7:01 AM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
> <carbarvo@knology.net>
> >
> > I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
> > model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
> > (sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
> Carl
> > Vought
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
> > <horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
> >
> > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
> > <horzpool@goldengate.net>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
> > smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp
per
> > hour at about 18 volts. >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
I guess I didn't express myself very carefully. I was suggesting the
generator/prop as a substitute for the solar cells. Even a small perminant
magnet DC motor connected as a generator, mounted on the airplane and
driven by a prop could out-charge a modest solar cell array and would be a
lot cheaper. I would mount it somewhere on the fuselage, in the propwash. I
posed the question because I suspect that there's a lot of drag associated
with it. Your thought about the pitch suggests that drag might be minimized
by an optimum choice of pitch and diameter...Carl Vought
On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:44:14 -0400, "Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers"
<wayne@engravers.net> wrote :
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers"
<wayne@engravers.net>
>
> Model airplane propellers are made to be going quite a few thousand of
RPM's
> not a few hundred at best, so the pitch would not be correct for your
idea.
> What are the winds at your location? You will have to make this unit
> weathervane to stay into the wind to get the most from it. I would check
out
> what they have for boating, they have been doing it for years and you
won't
> have to reinvent or prototype a new design.
>
> With a solar charger they can be left right in the cockpit on the glare
> shield or in front of any solar reflector.
>
> Wayne
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
> <carbarvo@knology.net>
> >
> > I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
> > model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
> > (sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
> Carl
> > Vought
> >
> >
> > On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
> > <horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
> >
> > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
> > <horzpool@goldengate.net>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
> > smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp
per
> > hour at about 18 volts. >
> > >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Regarding the wind-driven generator thing, Bill Bronson (writes for Engine
Q&A in what used to be EAA Experimenter) sells a complete how-to on making
one. Try him at onehalfvwguy@worldnet.att.net or look in the classifieds in
the back of any past issue of Experimenter from recent years.
Regarding current draw of various things, Mark Langford has good
documentation on the items in the panel of his KR, at
http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kpanel.html ; just scroll down past the
listing of cost of the items he has in his panel and you'll find his numbers
for amp draw, how he sized his battery, etc... or read the whole page on his
instrument panel. It's good info.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 20
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| Subject: | a small 12 volt battery |
<>
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
A friend of mine rigged up a small 12 volt battery (4"x3"x3") that he wired
a cig. pigtail lighter socket too
to run the gps off of. I got the cig. adapter for the gps and he rigged up
a 110vdc charger that I charge
the battery with before I go on a trip. Works fine for hours and hours
unless you have one of those big
screen color Garmins.......you just charge the battery wherever you happen
to stay that night. I charged mine
in the hangar at Brodhead last year.
Mike C.
PS-- I have a little carrying case for the battery and charger and just
strap it in the front seat while flying.
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Hodgson, Mark O" <mhodgson@bu.edu>
I saw Mountain Piet at Brodhead and was blown away by the workmanship.
Just want you to know that your work is an inspiration for this builder
and your handling of the engine-out a good example for pilots. Your
story will be in the back of my mind when I do run-ups now--thanks on
all counts. We're all lucky that you were able to walk away.
Mark Hodgson
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
----- Original Message -----
From: baileys
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 6:32 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
Bob,
Thanks, I appreciate your offer to help and make a few ribs for me, but have
really decided to let "Mountain Piet" go.
I now consider the project complete and a satisfying part of "my former life".
Time for someone else to take over now
Thanks again for the offer, I appreciate it.
John
John,
I'm very sorry to learn of the accident. Sure I might be interested but I would
say don't sell it until you have given it some more thought. In six months
you may be kicking yourself and saying "Why did I ever let it go?" Heck I still
regret selling a little Farmall Cub I didn't need at the moment.
It looks like parts of the wing might be salvageable. Maybe others could give
you a hand, I know I would be willing to build a few ribs or at least cut some
parts for you.
Kind regards,
Bob B. - Missouri
P.S. The brighter side is they could have taken you out of there on a stretcher.
8
)
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Navratil
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 7:16 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
Dick,
Thanks for your offer but the plane is safely tucked away in a tight T-Hangar
in Jefferson IA.
The folks there were wonderfully helpful, I can't do enough to ever repay them.
Thanks again though, for your offer.
John
John
Glad to hear you walked away ok.
Do you need a place to store the plane for a while? I am in Mpls, Mn and have
some spare hangar space and a trailer.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: John Dilatush
To: Pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 6:56 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
Pieters,
Sad news to report. After I left Brodhead and with an overnight stop in Marshalltown,
I arrived in Jefferson IA.
Early the next morning, I took off and headed west over the town. It was a
beautiful morning, slightly hazy wih the sun just coming over the horizon. I
was just over the west edge of town in a cruise climb configuration at about
500 feet when the engine quit, just like someone turned off the ignition. I only
had one choice, which was a small backyard pasture of a home on the edge of
town.
At one end of the field, there was a gap in between some trees and so I headed
there, "threaded the needle" and put Mountain Piet down. The terrain was
uphill and so the rollout was going to be fairly short, but still dicey whether
or not I could get the plane stopped before the barn, so I decided to ground
loop Piet. As I started to swing around to the right, the left wing struck some
large posts about 1/2 way out on the span. The impact swung the plane around
to the left and next thing I knew, I had a crumpled wing wrapped around the
left side of Mountain Piet.
I climbed out and looked around expecting someone to come out of one of the
nearby houses. Dead silence! No one showed up. I got the camera out and decided
to take a few pictures of the plane along with the offending posts. Still
no one! I put the camera away and walked up to the house which was located
behind the barn and found a small shop with the radio going and a sign that read,
"Rug Weaving".
Went inside and found an older gentleman working on a loom. Told him that
I had just crashed my plane in his pasture, and asked to use the phone. "Over
there" he said. and kept on weaving. Got a card out of my wallet and called
the manager of the Jefferson Airport hoping that he was up. He answered and said
he would come out right away, "What's the address?" I asked the man who was
still weaving and he said "811 West South Street" and I repeated it to the
airport manager.
The man weaving stopped, looked me over and asked if I was hurt, I said no,
he went back to weaving the rug he was working on. Acted as if the crash was
an everyday occurance. We talked for awhile about how he got into the rug weaving
business, where he sold them and how he made them etc. Finally he said,
"Well, let's go take a look." We went out and looked the situation over. Satisfied
he went back to the shop, I went out and sat on the curb in front of the
house waiting for Kirk, the airport manager, to arrive.
Kirk arrived and we figured out the tools required and both of us went to the
airport to get them. Still no one around the plane. Kirk phoned a friend
who had a trailer and he said he would help.
Went back to the pasture and found a neighbor had come out of his house along
with several kids standing around the Mountain Piet just respectfully looking
things over. We took the wings off, loaded the plane, I went back to the shop
and thanked the Weaver for the use of his pasture and then we headed for the
airport. There was a tight hangar and we put Piet in there.
Tried to start engine and it would start right away, run a moment and then
die. Fuel pressure OK, but acted as if the filter had clogged up. No water in
fuel when we checked, I was in no mood to pull cowl and start trouble shooting.
Locked up hangar and called friend who was at Oshkosh on his cell phone.
He said would come in his new RV-8 and retrieve me. Good, I guess that I will
spend a few unplanned days at the show! We flew home in the -8 monday.
The damage to Piet is confined to the wing which is toast, but I would also
pull the center section and take a close look at it. The front spar of the center
section shows slight damage where the metal fitting attaches to the wing
panel. Everything else on Mountain Piet seems OK.
I simply don't have the heart to build another wing panel for the plane so
am going to sell it where is and as is, for the best offer. Anyone interested?
John
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
----- Original Message -----
From: Textor, Jack
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 7:29 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
Thanks Jack,
I plan to sell "Mountain Piet" where is and as is. Although I will fly in when
the purchaser comes in to pick it up so as to make sure he is satisfied and
the plane is loaded properly for transport.
I appreciate your offer!
John
John,
Glad you got out unhurt! I'm in Des Moines which is about an hour from Jefferson.
If I can assist with any ground work here just let me know.
Jack Textor
515-225-7000 work
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
----- Original Message -----
From: Textor, Jack
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 7:29 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
Jack,
Thanks for your offer.
I plan to fly in and help the purchaser load "Mountain Piet" for transport and
to make sure that he is satisfied with his purchase.
If we should run into problems, I'll sure give you a call though!
John
John,
Glad you got out unhurt! I'm in Des Moines which is about an hour from Jefferson.
If I can assist with any ground work here just let me know.
Jack Textor
515-225-7000 work
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" <dilatush@amigo.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: <BARNSTMR@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
==============================
Terry,
Thanks for your concern and the reference, I'll certainly keep this in mind.
John
==============================
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com
>
> John,
> Sorry to hear about your difficulty. How far is the airplane from Ottumwa
and Blakesburg IA? This is the home of the Antique Airplane Association,
which has a Pietenpol group of its own. These guys are Pietenpol friendly
and may be able to offer assistance.
>
> Glad you walked away without injury.
> --
> Terry L. Bowden
> ph 254-715-4773
> fax 254-853-3805
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" <dilatush@amigo.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Hargrove" <ronhargrove@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
============================
Ron,
Good thought! Next time I'll design a ground proximity sensor to override
the computer!
Serously, I think it was something fuel related, and even though we checked
for water in the fuel after the accident, it may be some physical
contamination that plugged up the filter. My pickup for the fuel pressure
guage is located between the pump and filter. I think it should have been
located someplace on the fuel rail instead.
Thanks,
John
===========================
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com>
>
> I certainly am glad you weren't hurt in the landing. I also hate to
> hear about the Mountain Piet, as it is a remarkable piece of
> workmanship. Dollars to donuts, I would bet you lost oil pressure to
> the turbo, and the auto computer shut down the engine to save turbo
> damage, not knowing you weren't on the ground anymore...
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Textor, Jack <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com>
> Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 08:29:57 -0500
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>
>
> John,
>
> Glad you got out unhurt! I'm in Des Moines which is about an hour
> from Jefferson. If I can assist with any ground work here just let me
> know.
>
> Jack Textor
>
> 515-225-7000 work
>
>
> ________________________________
>
>
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Mountain Piet is wounded! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Dilatush" <dilatush@amigo.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Hargrove" <ronhargrove@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Mountain Piet is wounded!
===============================
Ron,
Thanks for the suggestion, next time I'll design a ground proximity sensor
which will override the computer!
Seriously though, we think it was a fuel problem although there was no water
in the fuel when we checked. There was fuel pressure showing on the gauge
after the landing, however if the filter was blocked, the guage would still
show pressure since the pickup is located between the pump and the filter.
Should have been located on the fuel rail instead.
Thanks again for your concern and suggestion.
John
==============================
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ron Hargrove <ronhargrove@gmail.com>
>
> I certainly am glad you weren't hurt in the landing. I also hate to
> hear about the Mountain Piet, as it is a remarkable piece of
> workmanship. Dollars to donuts, I would bet you lost oil pressure to
> the turbo, and the auto computer shut down the engine to save turbo
> damage, not knowing you weren't on the ground anymore...
>
>
>>
>
> ________________________________
>
>
Message 29
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|
Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax)
| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
Hi.
Try buying one of those little rubber band powered "skeeter" balsa wood
models. The little 4 inch prop is quite coarse in pitch. You will want
to turn it around backwards to drive your little motor. Take a 12 volt
motor (small - try radio shack or mouser.com) and push the prop onto
it. You will need to slightly drill out the hub. Mount this little
fellow on a stick, and hold it out the car window while your copilot
drives down the freeway at the legal limit in your area - a good
headwind would also help this test. Test it for voltage and for
amperage output. This will let you know if it will work as a power
input device. Unless the voltage is excessively high, I wouldn't bother
with a regulator for so small a current - the battery will absorb the
extra voltage. A person could use a transistor circuit that
automatically took the motor off-line while it was not spinning, but a
simpler solution would be to just hook it up to a simple switch (your
ignition switch???) so that it is on when you are flying.
If interested, I could probably draw up a zener diode and transistor
"voltage regulator" that would handle a couple of watts of power and
cost about 5 bucks to build. I just got done with a magneto timer
circuit that was a lot more difficult.
-Don
Carl D. Vought wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
>
>I guess I didn't express myself very carefully. I was suggesting the
>generator/prop as a substitute for the solar cells. Even a small perminant
>magnet DC motor connected as a generator, mounted on the airplane and
>driven by a prop could out-charge a modest solar cell array and would be a
>lot cheaper. I would mount it somewhere on the fuselage, in the propwash. I
>posed the question because I suspect that there's a lot of drag associated
>with it. Your thought about the pitch suggests that drag might be minimized
>by an optimum choice of pitch and diameter...Carl Vought
>
>
>On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:44:14 -0400, "Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers"
><wayne@engravers.net> wrote :
>
>
>
>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Wayne @ Aircraft Engravers"
>>
>>
><wayne@engravers.net>
>
>
>>Model airplane propellers are made to be going quite a few thousand of
>>
>>
>RPM's
>
>
>>not a few hundred at best, so the pitch would not be correct for your
>>
>>
>idea.
>
>
>>What are the winds at your location? You will have to make this unit
>>weathervane to stay into the wind to get the most from it. I would check
>>
>>
>out
>
>
>>what they have for boating, they have been doing it for years and you
>>
>>
>won't
>
>
>>have to reinvent or prototype a new design.
>>
>>With a solar charger they can be left right in the cockpit on the glare
>>shield or in front of any solar reflector.
>>
>>Wayne
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
>>>
>>>
>><carbarvo@knology.net>
>>
>>
>>>I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
>>>model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
>>>(sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
>>>
>>>
>>Carl
>>
>>
>>>Vought
>>>
>>>
>>>On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
>>><horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
>>>>
>>>>
>>><horzpool@goldengate.net>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
>>>>
>>>>
>>>smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp
>>>
>>>
>per
>
>
>>>hour at about 18 volts. >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 30
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|
Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax)
| Subject: | Re: Magneto stuff |
Hi.
Tried to find the documentation on the magneto, but didn't have any
luck. Perhaps someone else on the list has a manual...
-Don
Carl D. Vought wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
>
>Hi Don...Thanks to you and the others for your responses. The nameplate
>that is now on the mag indicates that it was rebuilt at the Slick factory
>in Rockford, IL. The model number is given as 4250R (presumably the "R"
>stands for "REBUILT") and the SN is 3070088. No lag is listed on the plate,
>presumably because it was not and is not equipped with an impulse coupling.
>Interestingly, an "L" is stamped on the plate by the legend "ROT.", but a
>hand-painted arrow painted on the case indicates clockwise rotation as
>viewed from the rear of the case. My application is on a Model-A engine.
>The mag will be side-mounted and will be rotated in the same direction as
>the prop....Thanks again...Carl
>
>
>On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 21:43:50 -0500, Don Morris <pietbuilder@donsplans.com>
>wrote :
>
>
>
>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Don Morris
>>
>>
><pietbuilder@donsplans.com>
>
>
>>
>>Hi.
>>
>>Two things - there is the right and left magneto on the engine
>>(obviously). However, the RH and the LH does not refer to this, if I
>>understand correctly.>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Magneto stuff |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
Thanks for trying...I'm satisfied I'll get this thing going, one way or
another...Carl
On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:56:15 -0500, Don Morris <pietbuilder@donsplans.com>
wrote :
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Don Morris
<pietbuilder@donsplans.com>
>
>
> Hi.
>
> Tried to find the documentation on the magneto, but didn't have any
> luck. Perhaps someone else on the list has a manual...
>
> -Don
>
> Carl D. Vought wrote:
>
> >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
<carbarvo@knology.net>
> >
> >Hi Don...Thanks to you and the others for your responses. The nameplate
> >that is now on the mag indicates that it was rebuilt at the Slick
factory
> >in Rockford, IL. The model number is given as 4250R (presumably the "R"
> >stands for "REBUILT") and the SN is 3070088. No lag is listed on the
plate,
> >presumably because it was not and is not equipped with an impulse
coupling.
> >Interestingly, an "L" is stamped on the plate by the legend "ROT.", but
a
> >hand-painted arrow painted on the case indicates clockwise rotation as
> >viewed from the rear of the case. My application is on a Model-A engine.
> >The mag will be side-mounted and will be rotated in the same direction
as
> >the prop....Thanks again...Carl
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 21:43:50 -0500, Don Morris
<pietbuilder@donsplans.com>
> >wrote :
> >
> >
> >
> >>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Don Morris
> >>
> >>
> ><pietbuilder@donsplans.com>
> >
> >
> >>
> >>Hi.
> >>
> >>Two things - there is the right and left magneto on the engine
> >>(obviously). However, the RH and the LH does not refer to this, if I
> >>understand correctly.>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Whoops!, didn't mean to use up all the bandwidth. |
Pieters,
Sorry, I felt that each of you deserved a individual reply to your E-Mails about
Mountain Piet. I didn't realize that I was sending each reply to the entire
list rather than to each individual. I have now changed to individual replies.
I'll try to be smarter in the future.
John
Message 33
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I just gotta share this....I'm doing ash pieces for the straight axle landing gear....Didn't
have a 1 1/4" piece so I'm laminating two 3/4" pieces and will plane
that down to size.
Just realized I haven't done any vacuum bagging in over 10 years and now I remember
why I did in the first place! Perfect pressure all around....NO clamps!
Sometime in the near future I'll do a quick article with pictures explaining the
simple and cheap process.
Jim in Plano.....
Message 34
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| Subject: | Data Plate Location |
I need some info on acceptable locations for the aircraft dataplate.
FAR 45 indicates it needs to go on the exterior of the aircraft near the tail surfaces
yet I've seen many with the dataplate in the cockpit.
What has been an acceptable location for the inspectors?
My preference is to mount it on the glovebox door.
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Vacuum Bagging |
Jim,
What are you using for a pump? The wife used to use a car vac tester for
her marquetry. Vac bagging is really impressive on clamping pressure.
Dave
N36078 '41 BC-12-65
At 09:41 PM 8/6/2004, you wrote:
>I just gotta share this....I'm doing ash pieces for the straight axle
>landing gear....Didn't have a 1 1/4" piece so I'm laminating two 3/4" pJim,
>ieces and will plane that down to size.
>
>Just realized I haven't done any vacuum bagging in over 10 years and now I
>remember why I did in the first place! Perfect pressure all around....NO
>clamps!
>
>Sometime in the near future I'll do a quick article with pictures
>explaining the simple and cheap process.
>
>Jim in Plano.....
>
>
>---
>Version: 6.0.734 / Virus Database: 488 - Release Date: 8/4/2004
Message 36
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| Subject: | Forward CG limit |
I know the aft most CG location is 20" aft of the wing LE. That info is on the
plans. What about the recommended maximum forward CG location? I don't see it
on the plans and can't recall any discussions about it.
I'm getting all of the paperwork together for the final inspection and this bit
of info is needed.
Thanks,
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Vacuum Bagging |
I went to the city dump and pulled a (free!) refrigerant (freon maybe?) pump out
of a refrigerator......I left the rubber shock obsorber feet on it and can barely
tell when it cycles on and off......
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave and Connie
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:17 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Vacuum Bagging
Jim,
What are you using for a pump? The wife used to use a car vac tester for her
marquetry. Vac bagging is really impressive on clamping pressure.
Dave
N36078 '41 BC-12-65
At 09:41 PM 8/6/2004, you wrote:
I just gotta share this....I'm doing ash pieces for the straight axle landing
gear....Didn't have a 1 1/4" piece so I'm laminating two 3/4" pJim,
ieces and will plane that down to size.
Just realized I haven't done any vacuum bagging in over 10 years and now I
remember why I did in the first place! Perfect pressure all around....NO clamps!
Sometime in the near future I'll do a quick article with pictures explaining
the simple and cheap process.
Jim in Plano.....
---
Version: 6.0.734 / Virus Database: 488 - Release Date: 8/4/2004
Message 38
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d="scan'217,208"; a="108676546:sNHT18419216"
| Subject: | Data Plate Location |
No speculation here fellas. Greg needs to know what the data plate looks like,
exactly where it is and this is on airplanes that are already inpected by the
feds with their airworthiness certificates issued.
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: gcardinal@mn.rr.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:15 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Data Plate Location
I need some info on acceptable locations for the aircraft dataplate.
FAR 45 indicates it needs to go on the exterior of the aircraft near the tail
surfaces yet I've seen many with the dataplate in the cockpit.
What has been an acceptable location for the inspectors?
My preference is to mount it on the glovebox door.
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Forward CG limit |
Hi Greg
On both of your questions;
15 inches is the most forward CG
For my inspection I put mine on the panel of the forward cockpit, citing the rule
on antique models. That didnt get by with the inspector. I had to mount a
second one on the left side under the horiz stab.
Would you like a copy of the Piet operations manual? The inspector seemed to like
it. I posted it to the Matronics pic file.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: gcardinal@mn.rr.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:20 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Forward CG limit
I know the aft most CG location is 20" aft of the wing LE. That info is on the
plans. What about the recommended maximum forward CG location? I don't see it
on the plans and can't recall any discussions about it.
I'm getting all of the paperwork together for the final inspection and this bit
of info is needed.
Thanks,
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
Message 40
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| Subject: | Forward CG limit |
Hi Greg (Slightly off-topic)
Did you see the writeup in Kitplanes magazine about your panel? I think the
photos came out great! Your panel sure is a beauty.
best, Cory
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
gcardinal@mn.rr.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 7:21 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Forward CG limit
I know the aft most CG location is 20" aft of the wing LE. That info is on
the plans. What about the recommended maximum forward CG location? I don't
see it on the plans and can't recall any discussions about it.
I'm getting all of the paperwork together for the final inspection and
this bit of info is needed.
Thanks,
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
Message 41
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|
| Subject: | Re: solar charger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
DJ
How many volts were you putting out at 13 amps? You will need to have about
15-18 volts to charge a 12 volt battery.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
>
> I was going to do the same thing. I did tests using an RC airplane
engine
> starter bolted to a 12" prop. I managed to get about 13 amps out of it.
>
> The only problem I found was that a standard RC prop would begin to spin
> until wind hitting it was over 40mph.
>
> A homemade prop made from 1/8" aluminum with a coarse pitch would do much
> better.
>
> you will also need a voltage regulator to keep the voltage down and to
> dissapate the extra energy as heat.
>
> DJ
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Carl D. Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 7:01 AM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: solar charger
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl D. Vought"
> <carbarvo@knology.net>
> >
> > I've been thinking about a small wind-driven DC motor/generator using a
> > model airplane propeller mounted in the prop stream. It looks good to me
> > (sort of). Is there a latent problem there that I need to be aware of?
> Carl
> > Vought
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:40:43 -0500, "Richard Navratil"
> > <horzpool@goldengate.net> wrote :
> >
> > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil"
> > <horzpool@goldengate.net>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Dont expect too much from a small solar charger. On most of these
> > smaller units you won't get more than a trickle charge, maybe 1/4 amp
per
> > hour at about 18 volts. >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: Forward CG limit |
Recommended Piet CG range is
25% to 33% chord
or in other words....15 in. to 20 in. aft of the wing L.E.
TLB
Message 43
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| Subject: | Re: Forward CG limit |
What issue of Kitplanes??? I'll need to look for that!
Message 44
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| Subject: | Forward CG limit |
It's the June issue, which is a few issues old. It's the Builder's Report
that's bannered across the top of the cover.
It's a *beautiful* panel!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
BARNSTMR@aol.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 8:32 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Forward CG limit
What issue of Kitplanes??? I'll need to look for that!
Message 45
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| Subject: | Re: hinged / removable turtledeck |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Richard Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
Hi Tom
I used 1/8 in ply. I pre bent the wood wetting it occasionally for a week.
I have made some changes to that fuse. I wasnt happy with the clouded
appearance. It hopefully will be better now.
I am going out to Montana for a week, starting tomorrow. Give me a call
after I get back 612-805-1742
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: <tmbrant1@netzero.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: hinged / removable turtledeck
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "tmbrant1@netzero.net"
<tmbrant1@netzero.net>
>
>
> Dick,
>
> Is yours 1/16"th ply over the t.d.? I'd like to take a closer look at how
you did that if you wouldn't mind.
>
> Tom B.
>
>
Message 46
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d="scan'217,208"; a="178665128:sNHT19113860"
| Subject: | Re: Forward CG limit |
Dick,
I thought the instrument panel location for the data plate would not fly with Mr.
Norris.
What did your plate by the tail say on it? What is it attached to? What is it
made of?
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Navratil
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 10:26 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Forward CG limit
Hi Greg
On both of your questions;
15 inches is the most forward CG
For my inspection I put mine on the panel of the forward cockpit, citing the
rule on antique models. That didnt get by with the inspector. I had to mount
a second one on the left side under the horiz stab.
Would you like a copy of the Piet operations manual? The inspector seemed to
like it. I posted it to the Matronics pic file.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: gcardinal@mn.rr.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:20 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Forward CG limit
I know the aft most CG location is 20" aft of the wing LE. That info is on
the plans. What about the recommended maximum forward CG location? I don't see
it on the plans and can't recall any discussions about it.
I'm getting all of the paperwork together for the final inspection and this
bit of info is needed.
Thanks,
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
Message 47
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|
| Subject: | I.M. Dialogue with Chuck (long) |
Dear Gang,
I just had a few minutes with Chuck in AOL I.M. Here's our dialogue.
Fri. 8-6-04 11pm CDT
TLB
BARNSTMR: Chuck...where the heck are you?
Rcaprd: Hey Terry !!
I'm still at home, with my two sons, in Sherrard WV
Rcaprd: What an adventure !!
BARNSTMR: cool...I won't bug you...I know you must have a LOT of email.
Rcaprd: I've given 14 rides since I've been here !!
Rcaprd: I'm heading out tomorrow morning...270 heading
BARNSTMR: We are heading down to LaGrange Tcraft Factory tomorrow for EAA
BBQ. Plan to meet up with Mike King (GN-1) and his Brother (BC-65) there.
BARNSTMR: Hope your compass has little error...."wrongway"
Rcaprd: the plane is packed, and fueled, so I'm going to see if I can get
up early...lol
BARNSTMR: Ha! Early??? What 11:30?
Rcaprd: well, the fog kinda hangs in there...:)'
BARNSTMR: Best of luck and God's care.... Keep us informed.
Rcaprd: that's my stroy, and I'm sticking to it !!
Rcaprd: k, I will
BARNSTMR: where's your first nite destination?
BARNSTMR: Too bad about Mountain Piet, eh?
Rcaprd: I'm going to try to make it through to the south west of Indy
tomorrow
Rcaprd: then in to Creeve Core on Sunday
BARNSTMR: OK...well don't take too many chances
Rcaprd: there is a VFR corridor on the west side of St. Louis
Rcaprd: talk about chances...flying this area of the country there is
almost NO out, if the engine quits. It takes some getting used to, to accept that
fact about this area of the country.
Rcaprd: big change
BARNSTMR: can't have too much altitude
Rcaprd: gives me the Hiebie Jiebie's !!
BARNSTMR: when do you have to be back to work?
Rcaprd: a week from this sunday. midnight shift.
BARNSTMR: That will suck going back in after all this
Rcaprd: I figure 4 days to get back to Wichita
Rcaprd: yeah, for sure !!
BARNSTMR: or 6 days if you swing back thru TX
Rcaprd: I'm tempted...
Rcaprd: later this fall, I'm planning a cross country weekend trip to Mt.
Rushmore
BARNSTMR: that will be awesome
Rcaprd: yeah, I wonder what happened to John's engine...
BARNSTMR: hes saying he suspects fuel contamination
Rcaprd: it set a somber mood with me
BARNSTMR: I'll bet
BARNSTMR: But this is a good thing about continentals....they are reliable.
BARNSTMR: How many hours have you totaled since you left KS?
Rcaprd: my son read it, and is scares them both. Yeah, I let them know
about the reliable ol A65
BARNSTMR: what ages are your sons?
Rcaprd: I've been keeping lousy records on my hours. I'm going to estimate
it, by the hours meeter on the tach.
Rcaprd: 23 & 26
BARNSTMR: How old are you, Chuck?
Rcaprd: feb I'll be a half century old !!!
BARNSTMR: WOW...I would have guessed a lot younger
BARNSTMR: are you a grandpappy yet?
Rcaprd: I feel like a teenager !! No, I'm too young to be a grandfather !!
BARNSTMR: Well.... you are having the trip of a lifetime! I am glad it is
going well.
Rcaprd: they put my story in two of the local newspapers
BARNSTMR: cool.....are these going to be put online?
Rcaprd: I don't know.
BARNSTMR: Hows your solar panel working? Do you have it charging your
smoke battery?
Rcaprd: the solar panel doesn't keep up with the smoke pump. I had to
charge the battery last night. that was the first time I charged it. I've gon
through about 25 bottles of baby oil !!
Rcaprd: I think it would keep up with the gps, though.
Rcaprd: I can't get the plug for the handheld radio to work, so it is still
with the AA batteries.
BARNSTMR: Hey...I need to run....I have one last Question
Rcaprd: ?
BARNSTMR: would you mind if I post this dialogue to the list?
Rcaprd: yes, that would be great !!
Rcaprd: that would let them know.
BARNSTMR: cool...well...friend...
I wish you a great trip home and Godspeed!
Rcaprd: thanks !! yeeee Haaaaa WWW !!!!
BARNSTMR: :)
BARNSTMR: Bye
Rcaprd: cya
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