Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:58 AM - Re: Solo propping techniques??? (Rcaprd@aol.com)
2. 09:20 AM - Re: Solo propping techniques??? (TomTravis@aol.com)
3. 09:28 AM - Re: Solo propping techniques??? (TomTravis@aol.com)
4. 09:48 AM - At least (Christian Bobka)
5. 10:50 AM - Re: Piper landing gear and wing struts? (Stacy Clark)
6. 10:53 AM - Re: Piper landing gear and wing struts? (Stacy Clark)
7. 10:59 AM - [ Ed Grentzer ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
8. 11:03 AM - [ Matt Naiva ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
9. 11:13 AM - Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites (Stacy Clark)
10. 02:01 PM - Re: At least (TomTravis@aol.com)
11. 02:06 PM - Re: Solo propping techniques??? (Larry Ragan)
12. 04:24 PM - Re: I'm gonna make some copies of the old BPA newsletters... (Jim Markle)
13. 05:12 PM - Re: Solo propping techniques??? (TomTravis@aol.com)
14. 05:35 PM - Re: Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites (Peter W Johnson)
15. 06:10 PM - Re: Solo propping techniques??? (Larry Nelson)
16. 06:37 PM - Hand propping (Craig Lawler)
17. 07:08 PM - Re: Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites (Stacy Clark)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Solo propping techniques??? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
In a message dated 8/20/04 8:18:21 AM Central Daylight Time,
lnelson208@yahoo.com writes:
<< Has anyone devised a safe way to start up a Pietenpol
without any innocent bystanders offering their
assistance? Something that will work anywhere you
happen to land?
I am new to these machines and Chuck wouldn't give me
a ride in his at Brodhead (he indicated that I was way
too fat....but he did give my friend a ride).
I am wondering about the equivilent of a "kill
switch", where rotation of the wheels would yank out a
pin and ground the mag....hey, I am just thinking.
I am interested in what works and what has been done. Thanks. >>
Larry,
Sorry I didn't give you a ride at Brodhead, but I'm still getting used to
the flight characteristics of the heavier weights. The heaviest weight
passenger I've had so far, was 185 lbs, with full fuel. My ship weighs 630 lbs,
and I weigh 200 to 210 lbs. The climb rate is what suffers dramatically, and
while landing, I've learned to leave just a little bit of power in, through the
round out and flair.
I much prefer having an experienced propper (is propper a word ?) handle
the business end, while I'm strapped in, with brakes set. However, I launch
my plane solo, much more often than I have a helper, and I've probably done it
maybe 80 or 100 times. Ya gotta really have a lot of respect for that prop,
and sometimes I even talk to it : "OK, your're not going to hurt me today, are
you ?" Props give me the Hiebie Jiebie's.
As for my solo launching technique, here is how I do it. I always
launch from the grass, when solo. I carry chalks in the glove box, in the front
pit. After a thorough pre-flight inspection, chalk both wheels, pull the stick
back in the seat belt, fuel on, engine idle, mags OFF. While still standing
on the left side, still leaning into the cockpit, I say out loud "Fuel on,
engine idle, stick back, mags off, and it's in the chalks". I then walk around
and pull six blades through, assuming each blade will start the engine.
Whenever you pull a prop through, you MUST assume the engine will START. I then
walk
back around and turn the mags ON, and repeat out loud, as I touch each item
with my finger "Fuel on, engine idle, stick back, mags HOT, and it's in the
chalks". Then I walk back around, and the blade is up on compression, in about
the 11 O'clock position. Left hand pinky finger is half way out the blade, and
just barley let my fingertips go up over the trailing edge of the prop,
maybe just to my finger prints...NOT to the first joint. Feet back, look around
to my right side to be sure the area is clear, swing right leg forward, and as
I swing my right leg back, pull the blade through. The weight of my leg pulls
my body out of the biting range of the prop, as well as allows the first step
back away from the prop. Once the engine starts, usually the first of second
blade, I briskly walk back around the left wing tip, and crouch down to the
cockpit, and allow my right arm pit to rest on the top of the left longeron.
The first thing I do at the cockpit, it to just barley crack the throttle open,
then watch the oil pressure gauge. It seems like forever to get the engine's
blood pumping. Power up to 800 or 1000 for a short period, then go back
around the tail to remove the right chalk, staying behind the front lift strut,
then come back around the tail and remove the left chalk, watching for the plane
to creep...this is why I launch from the grass...it WILL creep on the hard
surface, but not the grass. Stow the chalks, climb in, strap 'er on, and hold
the brakes for another brief power up.
A couple of things that happened to me: Two years ago, I forgot to pull
the stick back in the seat belt, and the engine started, and as I was running
around the left wing tip, the tail was coming up, and I just barley caught it
in time, before the prop tips touched. Two other times, as I was climbing in,
my left knee touched the power lever, and YEE HAAW...we're off to the races,
and I'm not even in the seat yet !!! Luckily, these occasions turned out to
be lessons, and not incidents.
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Solo propping techniques??? |
Guys,
When you decide to hand prop your plane and tie the tail down, just be sure
it isn't to a fuel truck that might drive away in the middle of the night. This
is what happens when you do.
Whitehorse, Y.T.
Tom Travis
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Solo propping techniques??? |
More.
Message 4
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d="scan'217,208"; a="218815642:sNHT16202642"
Tom,
At least the prop is still good.
chris
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Piper landing gear and wing struts? |
Mike,
Based on everyones feedback I'll probably be going the plans route for the sprung
gear. Out of curiosity, why "no" on the gear. My guess is too wide? Too
much work to convert? Weight?
The missive by the way is more about the kids and the hospital that I was originally
doing this project for rather than any cheerleading on my own part. I know
I'll finish, I have to...it's my ride outta here. :-)
Stacy
There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that is
to achieve it -- Stacy Clark
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Luther
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piper landing gear and wing struts?
Stacy,
Used (narrow )inspected Piper Cub struts: Yes
Used Piper Cub gear: No
A65 Continental: Certifiable, Yes, Jack-leg, No
Missive: Attitude, YES YES Enthusiasm YES YES YES
Schedule: 20+ hours/week nonstop for two years with no "Grand Piano" quality.
We know that you can do it!!!!
Mike Luther
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Piper landing gear and wing struts? |
Mike,
Unfortunately mine's a standard Piet fuselage vs. GN-1. From the feedback I've
received it looks like the Piper gear in my case would be an uphill battle, though
I admittedly don't yet know why.
Stacy
There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that is
to achieve it -- Stacy Clark
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike King
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 11:56 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Piper landing gear and wing struts?
Stacy and Chris,
My Grega has Cub gear as well as other Cub parts. I am a believer in Cub
gear...Lord knows it has been given a workout (bounces)
Good luck.
Mike King
GN-1
77MK
Dallas
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Navratil
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 2:00 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piper landing gear and wing struts?
Stacy and Chris
I belive the whole purpose for the creation of the Grega was that it could use
many of the J-3 parts and make the building process easier.
In short I think the gear legs are one of those parts used.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: Stacy Clark
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 1:50 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piper landing gear and wing struts?
Dick,
Thanks for the reply. I'm actually not building the aircraft for here in Alaska.
My goal is to fly the Belle to Washington D.C. via all the lower 48 states.
When I originally started developing this project about a year ago now
(taking it from planning to action in other words) it was for a well known childrens
hospital in the southeast. A few years prior I had heard one of their
radiothons and a letter from a dying boy to his mom...and you might say hit me
where I lived. Anyway, over this past year I've been working with them trying
to get their official nod of approval for the flight. Our litiginous society
being what it is however, the final word came down about a month ago that they
would no longer allow "any" point to point fund rasiers because of insurance
(read: public relations) concerns. That meant planes, cars, motorcycles, boats,
and even bikes. But oh well, life goes on. So, now I'm doing this flight
for any charity the donors desire and the flight will be "officially unaffiliated"
with any charity. There's obviously far more to it than that, but I won't
get into that here. So, going back to the original question, what's your
opinion on using Cub struts and landing gear?
Stacy :-)
There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that
is to achieve it -- Stacy Clark
Message 7
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Subject: | [ Ed Grentzer ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Ed Grentzer <EGrentzer@ptec.pinellas.k12.fl.us>
Lists: Pietenpol-List
Subject: Piet in pregress
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/EGrentzer@ptec.pinellas.k12.fl.us.08.21.2004/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
Message 8
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Subject: | [ Matt Naiva ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Matt Naiva <steamlaunch@softhome.net>
Lists: Pietenpol-List
Subject: A new Piet Engine
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/steamlaunch@softhome.net.08.21.2004/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
Message 9
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Subject: | Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites |
Outstanding site for Piet construction pics....
http://www.saaa.com/SAAA/Pietenpol/pietenpol.htm
Stacy
There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that is
to achieve it -- Stacy Clark
Message 10
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Chris,
You have to wonder what the hell the guy was thinking. I've tied down on that
ramp several times and tie downs are scarce ....but a fuel truck???
You're right, the prop looks good and he won't have to worry about that long
flight he was going to have to make back to California. Wonder if they let him
carry his prop on the airline?
Tom
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Solo propping techniques??? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Larry Ragan" <lragan@hotmail.com>
Truck driver probably thought "Why the hell is that Cub backing up so fast!!"
Larry Ragan
Jacksonville, Fl.
lragan@hotmail.com
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: I'm gonna make some copies of the old BPA newsletters... |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
Oh yeah.....I uploaded maybe two issues....I have a stack of double sided
pages about 1 1/2" high....... there's a load of them....really good
stuff....
J
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: I'm gonna make some copies of the old BPA
newsletters...
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
>
> Is this more pages than what you have already uploaded to mykitplane,
Jimmy?
>
> Clif
>
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: I'm gonna make some copies of the old BPA
> newsletters...
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "John Carmen" <jcar@nefcom.net>
> >
> > Maybe get them converted to PDF for a one time fee and then email this
> > PDF as a file to whoever wants it. They in turn can have the file
> > printed at there leisure with no shipping fee.
> >
>
>
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Solo propping techniques??? |
In a message dated 8/21/2004 4:07:28 PM Central Standard Time,
lragan@hotmail.com writes:
> Truck driver probably thought "Why the hell is that Cub backing up so
> fast!!"
>
The problem was that the pilot roped the wings to regular tiedowns and then
tied the tail to the fuel truck. He apparently did a fine job of securing the
wings.
Tom
Travis
Do not archive
Message 14
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Subject: | Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites |
Thanks Stacy,
Peter
Wonthaggi, Australia
http://www.cpc-world.com <http://www.cpc-world.com/>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stacy Clark
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites
Outstanding site for Piet construction pics....
http://www.saaa.com/SAAA/Pietenpol/pietenpol.htm
Stacy
There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that
is to achieve it -- Stacy Clark
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: Solo propping techniques??? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
Chuck, I know you realize I was "giving you the
business" about your reluctance to give me and my fat
friend rides, when you instead gave our skinny friend
a ride whilst we looked on.
Speaking of propping, I had the pleasure of propping
your airplane for you, just the way I was taught to
prop Champs... which was to pick up and swing my LEFT
leg to the rear, flinging the prop down and my fat
self rearward all at the same time. Was I taught wrong
or are there several ways of doing this? I have been
doing it this way for a long time but hopefully can
unlearn that method. I used it on engines up to my
Comanche 180 when my starter crapped out in Montana.
Thanks for you very good suggestions. Now...I need to
go do my exercises.
--- Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 8/20/04 8:18:21 AM Central
> Daylight Time,
> lnelson208@yahoo.com writes:
>
> << Has anyone devised a safe way to start up a
> Pietenpol
> without any innocent bystanders offering their
> assistance? Something that will work anywhere you
> happen to land?
>
> I am new to these machines and Chuck wouldn't give
> me
> a ride in his at Brodhead (he indicated that I was
> way
> too fat....but he did give my friend a ride).
>
> I am wondering about the equivilent of a "kill
> switch", where rotation of the wheels would yank
> out a
> pin and ground the mag....hey, I am just thinking.
>
> I am interested in what works and what has been
> done. Thanks. >>
>
> Larry,
> Sorry I didn't give you a ride at Brodhead, but
> I'm still getting used to
> the flight characteristics of the heavier weights.
> The heaviest weight
> passenger I've had so far, was 185 lbs, with full
> fuel. My ship weighs 630 lbs,
> and I weigh 200 to 210 lbs. The climb rate is what
> suffers dramatically, and
> while landing, I've learned to leave just a little
> bit of power in, through the
> round out and flair.
> I much prefer having an experienced propper (is
> propper a word ?) handle
> the business end, while I'm strapped in, with brakes
> set. However, I launch
> my plane solo, much more often than I have a helper,
> and I've probably done it
> maybe 80 or 100 times. Ya gotta really have a lot
> of respect for that prop,
> and sometimes I even talk to it : "OK, your're not
> going to hurt me today, are
> you ?" Props give me the Hiebie Jiebie's.
> As for my solo launching technique, here is how
> I do it. I always
> launch from the grass, when solo. I carry chalks in
> the glove box, in the front
> pit. After a thorough pre-flight inspection, chalk
> both wheels, pull the stick
> back in the seat belt, fuel on, engine idle, mags
> OFF. While still standing
> on the left side, still leaning into the cockpit, I
> say out loud "Fuel on,
> engine idle, stick back, mags off, and it's in the
> chalks". I then walk around
> and pull six blades through, assuming each blade
> will start the engine.
> Whenever you pull a prop through, you MUST assume
> the engine will START. I then walk
> back around and turn the mags ON, and repeat out
> loud, as I touch each item
> with my finger "Fuel on, engine idle, stick back,
> mags HOT, and it's in the
> chalks". Then I walk back around, and the blade is
> up on compression, in about
> the 11 O'clock position. Left hand pinky finger is
> half way out the blade, and
> just barley let my fingertips go up over the
> trailing edge of the prop,
> maybe just to my finger prints...NOT to the first
> joint. Feet back, look around
> to my right side to be sure the area is clear, swing
> right leg forward, and as
> I swing my right leg back, pull the blade through.
> The weight of my leg pulls
> my body out of the biting range of the prop, as well
> as allows the first step
> back away from the prop. Once the engine starts,
> usually the first of second
> blade, I briskly walk back around the left wing tip,
> and crouch down to the
> cockpit, and allow my right arm pit to rest on the
> top of the left longeron.
> The first thing I do at the cockpit, it to just
> barley crack the throttle open,
> then watch the oil pressure gauge. It seems like
> forever to get the engine's
> blood pumping. Power up to 800 or 1000 for a short
> period, then go back
> around the tail to remove the right chalk, staying
> behind the front lift strut,
> then come back around the tail and remove the left
> chalk, watching for the plane
> to creep...this is why I launch from the grass...it
> WILL creep on the hard
> surface, but not the grass. Stow the chalks, climb
> in, strap 'er on, and hold
> the brakes for another brief power up.
> A couple of things that happened to me: Two
> years ago, I forgot to pull
> the stick back in the seat belt, and the engine
> started, and as I was running
> around the left wing tip, the tail was coming up,
> and I just barley caught it
> in time, before the prop tips touched. Two other
> times, as I was climbing in,
> my left knee touched the power lever, and YEE
> HAAW...we're off to the races,
> and I'm not even in the seat yet !!! Luckily, these
> occasions turned out to
> be lessons, and not incidents.
>
> Chuck Gantzer
> NX770CG
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Larry Nelson
Springfield, MO
Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
1963 GMC 4106-1618
SV/ Spirit of America
ARS WB0JOT
_______________________________
Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download now.
Message 16
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Craig Lawler <clawler@ptd.net>
Larry,
I like to start the Piet from behind the prop on the right side like
the cub seaplane guys. I can hold onto the strut with my left hand and
prop with my right. If the plane wants to roll some I can just hold it
fine as long as it is on grass. Make sure you are pointed at open space
just for good measure.
Craig
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: Mother of all Pietenpol reference sites |
Peter,
Thank you! Certainly makes a lot of things clearer. I recommend to anyone just
starting, or about to start their project, that they look at your site often.
Stacy Clark
Bethel, Alaska
(i.e.: The Bush)
There is only one greater thing than to believe in the impossible...and that is
to achieve it -- Stacy Clark
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