Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:39 AM - Re: homebuilt power (Clif Dawson)
2. 03:54 AM - Re: serious smoke advice (Jack Phillips)
3. 05:17 AM - Re: serious smoke advice (Galen Hutcheson)
4. 05:17 AM - Re: serious smoke advice (Galen Hutcheson)
5. 05:19 AM - Re: homebuilt power (Galen Hutcheson)
6. 05:50 AM - Re: serious smoke advice (Rcaprd@aol.com)
7. 06:39 AM - Smoke System (Rcaprd@aol.com)
8. 07:25 AM - Re: serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) (Eric Williams)
9. 01:12 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) (N321TX@wmconnect.com)
10. 05:53 PM - Re: Scimitar Prop (Wizzard187@aol.com)
11. 07:30 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (Galen Hutcheson)
12. 07:46 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) (Galen Hutcheson)
13. 08:02 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) (Galen Hutcheson)
14. 08:25 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (Galen Hutcheson)
15. 08:25 PM - Re: Scimitar Prop (Rcaprd@aol.com)
16. 08:35 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (Rcaprd@aol.com)
17. 08:36 PM - Re: Scimitar Prop (Galen Hutcheson)
18. 08:50 PM - Re: serious smoke advice (Galen Hutcheson)
19. 09:46 PM - N74DV's first passenger (DJ Vegh)
20. 10:34 PM - Re: N74DV's first passenger ()
21. 10:41 PM - Re: N74DV's first passenger (Galen Hutcheson)
Message 1
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: homebuilt power |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
I know where DJ lives. Where do you live Doc?
Clif, Vancouver, B.C. Canada.
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson
<wacopitts@yahoo.com>
>
> OOHHH...I'm not mentioning any names, but if the shoe
> fits, you know the rest. Doc
> --- DJ Vegh <djv@imagedv.com> wrote:> >
> > hmmm... kinda like the Canadian Gov't does?!
Message 2
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
Doc, if you've never flown a plane you didn't like, you've obviously never
flown a Piper Tomahawk.
Jack Phillips
Fixin' to leave for the airport to meet "The Man" for the airworthiness
inspection of NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Galen
Hutcheson
Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:05 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Thanks Mike, just thought I would pass that along. I
never want to ruin anyone's party, but I have heard of
several cases where the smoke oil had caused some
pretty severe in-flight fires. The airshow community
is rather small (when I was flying, there were only
about 320 or so active airshow pilots) so word gets
around rather quickly. This is well known among
airshow pilots. Have fun with it, just be careful.
I loved the Pitts. I first had a "C" model (flat wing
with an 0320 which I practiced acro in for about four
and a half years before I even flew my first airshow.
I flew for my first low altitude wavier in front of
the FAA in that plane. Suprisingly, he gave me a 500'
wavier on the first go. I later had the super Pitts,
highly modified S-1S with the symmetrical wings, with
a highly modified IO-360 that was rated a around 240
HP. It operated between 3000 and 3200 rpms. It had
10:1 pistons as well as many other things.
I have been fortunate to have flown many different
types of A/C in the past 30 odd years. Ranging from
the low and slow antique biplanes to the super
performing Pitts. Each plane had its own thrills and
challenges, all of which had to be mastered. I can't
say which of those planes I loved the best because
they all were so different. (Right now I would have
to say that the Pietenpol is my favorite :). I have
never flown an airplane I didn't like. I had made the
first test flights in many experimental homebuilts for
pilot/builders who were a little concerned with their
own flying skills. I still love the adrenalin rush I
always got when I made that first flight in an
unproven design! Well, enough rambling...
I am now doing a first in aviation for me...and that
is to build my very own airplane. I am enjoying it
very much. I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his Model
A powered Piet. I can't wait for that and will take
lots of pics.
Doc
--- Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
> <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>
> Galen--- that is some great advice on the possible
> fire hazard that the oil
> on the belly
> could cause at low rpms/backfire. Hmmmm....I'm
> glad I only use it at
> cruise or full power.
>
> Interesting career you had. Can't imagine what
> flying a Pitts would be like !
>
> Mike C.
>
> do not archive
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
__________________________________
Message 3
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Your right about that Jack, I haven't. I have heard
things about the Tomahawks though. Guess I've been
lucky. Good luck on the inspection.
Doc
--- Jack Phillips <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack
> Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
>
> Doc, if you've never flown a plane you didn't like,
> you've obviously never
> flown a Piper Tomahawk.
>
> Jack Phillips
> Fixin' to leave for the airport to meet "The Man"
> for the airworthiness
> inspection of NX899JP
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]
> On Behalf Of Galen
> Hutcheson
> Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:05 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen
> Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks Mike, just thought I would pass that along.
> I
> never want to ruin anyone's party, but I have heard
> of
> several cases where the smoke oil had caused some
> pretty severe in-flight fires. The airshow
> community
> is rather small (when I was flying, there were only
> about 320 or so active airshow pilots) so word gets
> around rather quickly. This is well known among
> airshow pilots. Have fun with it, just be careful.
>
> I loved the Pitts. I first had a "C" model (flat
> wing
> with an 0320 which I practiced acro in for about
> four
> and a half years before I even flew my first
> airshow.
> I flew for my first low altitude wavier in front of
> the FAA in that plane. Suprisingly, he gave me a
> 500'
> wavier on the first go. I later had the super
> Pitts,
> highly modified S-1S with the symmetrical wings,
> with
> a highly modified IO-360 that was rated a around 240
> HP. It operated between 3000 and 3200 rpms. It had
> 10:1 pistons as well as many other things.
>
> I have been fortunate to have flown many different
> types of A/C in the past 30 odd years. Ranging from
> the low and slow antique biplanes to the super
> performing Pitts. Each plane had its own thrills
> and
> challenges, all of which had to be mastered. I
> can't
> say which of those planes I loved the best because
> they all were so different. (Right now I would have
> to say that the Pietenpol is my favorite :). I have
> never flown an airplane I didn't like. I had made
> the
> first test flights in many experimental homebuilts
> for
> pilot/builders who were a little concerned with
> their
> own flying skills. I still love the adrenalin rush
> I
> always got when I made that first flight in an
> unproven design! Well, enough rambling...
>
> I am now doing a first in aviation for me...and that
> is to build my very own airplane. I am enjoying it
> very much. I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
> to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his
> Model
> A powered Piet. I can't wait for that and will take
> lots of pics.
>
> Doc
> --- Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> wrote:
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D
> Cuy
> > <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> >
> > Galen--- that is some great advice on the possible
> > fire hazard that the oil
> > on the belly
> > could cause at low rpms/backfire. Hmmmm....I'm
> > glad I only use it at
> > cruise or full power.
> >
> > Interesting career you had. Can't imagine what
> > flying a Pitts would be like !
> >
> > Mike C.
> >
> > do not archive
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/chat
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 4
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Good luck Jack, "May the force be with you."
Doc
--- Jack Phillips <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack
> Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
>
> Doc, if you've never flown a plane you didn't like,
> you've obviously never
> flown a Piper Tomahawk.
>
> Jack Phillips
> Fixin' to leave for the airport to meet "The Man"
> for the airworthiness
> inspection of NX899JP
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]
> On Behalf Of Galen
> Hutcheson
> Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:05 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen
> Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks Mike, just thought I would pass that along.
> I
> never want to ruin anyone's party, but I have heard
> of
> several cases where the smoke oil had caused some
> pretty severe in-flight fires. The airshow
> community
> is rather small (when I was flying, there were only
> about 320 or so active airshow pilots) so word gets
> around rather quickly. This is well known among
> airshow pilots. Have fun with it, just be careful.
>
> I loved the Pitts. I first had a "C" model (flat
> wing
> with an 0320 which I practiced acro in for about
> four
> and a half years before I even flew my first
> airshow.
> I flew for my first low altitude wavier in front of
> the FAA in that plane. Suprisingly, he gave me a
> 500'
> wavier on the first go. I later had the super
> Pitts,
> highly modified S-1S with the symmetrical wings,
> with
> a highly modified IO-360 that was rated a around 240
> HP. It operated between 3000 and 3200 rpms. It had
> 10:1 pistons as well as many other things.
>
> I have been fortunate to have flown many different
> types of A/C in the past 30 odd years. Ranging from
> the low and slow antique biplanes to the super
> performing Pitts. Each plane had its own thrills
> and
> challenges, all of which had to be mastered. I
> can't
> say which of those planes I loved the best because
> they all were so different. (Right now I would have
> to say that the Pietenpol is my favorite :). I have
> never flown an airplane I didn't like. I had made
> the
> first test flights in many experimental homebuilts
> for
> pilot/builders who were a little concerned with
> their
> own flying skills. I still love the adrenalin rush
> I
> always got when I made that first flight in an
> unproven design! Well, enough rambling...
>
> I am now doing a first in aviation for me...and that
> is to build my very own airplane. I am enjoying it
> very much. I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
> to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his
> Model
> A powered Piet. I can't wait for that and will take
> lots of pics.
>
> Doc
> --- Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> wrote:
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D
> Cuy
> > <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> >
> > Galen--- that is some great advice on the possible
> > fire hazard that the oil
> > on the belly
> > could cause at low rpms/backfire. Hmmmm....I'm
> > glad I only use it at
> > cruise or full power.
> >
> > Interesting career you had. Can't imagine what
> > flying a Pitts would be like !
> >
> > Mike C.
> >
> > do not archive
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/chat
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
Message 5
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: homebuilt power |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
I live in a small city called Harrison, Arkansas. Its
about 30 miles south of Branson, MO.
Doc
--- Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson
> <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
>
> I know where DJ lives. Where do you live Doc?
>
> Clif, Vancouver, B.C. Canada.
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen
> Hutcheson
> <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
> >
> > OOHHH...I'm not mentioning any names, but if the
> shoe
> > fits, you know the rest. Doc
> > --- DJ Vegh <djv@imagedv.com> wrote:> >
> > > hmmm... kinda like the Canadian Gov't does?!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
_______________________________
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
Message 6
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
In a message dated 10/4/04 9:05:51 PM Central Daylight Time,
wacopitts@yahoo.com writes:
<< I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his Model
A powered Piet. >>
Hey Doc,
If you're flying a fast plane up there, or whatever, maybe you would like to
make a stop in Wichita KS - Cook Airfield, for a lookover my plane. I have
over 300 detail pictures of the construction.
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
Wichita KS
Cook Airfield (K50)
Message 7
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
This smoke system seems like a lot of fun. How does it work? Is it easy to
build and fit one? Or do you just buy one to bolt on?
regards
Tug
Tug,
My smoke system consists of an after-market windshield washer pump and tank,
plumbing to each exhaust pipe, and wiring to the switch on the power lever. I
isolated / mounted the tank on the upper left motor mount tubing, with a
couple layers of rubber strap. I routed the clear tubing to a Tee fitting secured
in rubber, to the engine mount, then used 1/8" brass tubing to each of the
fittings in the exhaust pipes. I laid out the route of the tubing, marked the
pipes, and removed both exhaust pipes. I cut a 1/8" pipe coupler in half,
radiused each half to the radius of the pipe, and oxy / accy welded them to the
aft pipe of each side. After welded, I drilled one #60 hole through the exhaust
pipes. I placed these holes toward the bottom edge of the fittings,
theorizing that if oil would lay in there it would gum up. The switch is a push
on /
push off button, that is mounted right to the throttle handle. This location
allows me to work the smoke without taking my hand off the throttle. I
originally thought it would only smoke good at full power, but came to find I don't
need much over 1/4 throttle to Smoke 'Em Up !! I can smoke 'em while taxiing,
without any problem !! My exhaust pipes point down and away from the
fuselage, and even when all the oil doesn't vaporize, the fuselage hardly gets
anything on it.
I have a couple of squawks on the system, that I have taken care of.
1.) I mounted the tank at about the same level as the fittings on the
exhaust pipes, and it always dribbles out the pipes, with a little bit of smoke
as a
result. Over a period of a couple of hours, it will drain the tank, but I
usually 'Smoke em up' before that happens.
2.) When I ran the tank empty, and refill it, the pump would cavitate
because of the way the line ran from the bottom of the tank to the pump, and I
would always have to prime the pump, by blowing in the top of the tank. I got
some strange looks from folks, while I performed this operation !!
3.) The tank was too small. It only was big enough to do about 3 smoke
runs. I would like to put about a 5 gallon bucket up there on the firewall, but
I don't have enough room !!
4.) I had to remove the top cowling to re-fill the tank.
I'm building a new tank out of fiberglass / West System resin, with a fill
tube out to the right side of the cowling. I'll mount it lower on the
firewall. This will take care of all the squawks.
5.) I now have been using the new smoke tank, but I have a small leak in
the tank. I used West Systems resin for the fiberglass tank, and evidently I
didn't get the seam sealed up good enough. I've never had that problem when I
used polyester resin, but it kicks very quickly. The West System gives some
time, but it is also quite a bit more expensive. After the warnings about the
stuff catching on fire, I'll be repairing the tank before my next flight.
Chuck G.
Message 8
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Eric Williams" <ewilliams805@msn.com>
My first 13 hours of instruction were in a Tomahawk and it really wasn't all
that bad. Maybe that's because I didn't have much else to compare it to.
Since I moved a few months ago I'm now flying a Diamond Eclipse which is,
let's say, much nicer. Kind of like going from a dump truck to a Ferrari.
Eric
(Do not archive)
>From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
>Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2004 06:51:25 -0400
>
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips"
><pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
>
>Doc, if you've never flown a plane you didn't like, you've obviously never
>flown a Piper Tomahawk.
>
>Jack Phillips
>Fixin' to leave for the airport to meet "The Man" for the airworthiness
>inspection of NX899JP
>
> -----Original Message-----
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Galen
>Hutcheson
>Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:05 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
>
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
>
>Thanks Mike, just thought I would pass that along. I
>never want to ruin anyone's party, but I have heard of
>several cases where the smoke oil had caused some
>pretty severe in-flight fires. The airshow community
>is rather small (when I was flying, there were only
>about 320 or so active airshow pilots) so word gets
>around rather quickly. This is well known among
>airshow pilots. Have fun with it, just be careful.
>
>I loved the Pitts. I first had a "C" model (flat wing
>with an 0320 which I practiced acro in for about four
>and a half years before I even flew my first airshow.
>I flew for my first low altitude wavier in front of
>the FAA in that plane. Suprisingly, he gave me a 500'
>wavier on the first go. I later had the super Pitts,
>highly modified S-1S with the symmetrical wings, with
>a highly modified IO-360 that was rated a around 240
>HP. It operated between 3000 and 3200 rpms. It had
>10:1 pistons as well as many other things.
>
>I have been fortunate to have flown many different
>types of A/C in the past 30 odd years. Ranging from
>the low and slow antique biplanes to the super
>performing Pitts. Each plane had its own thrills and
>challenges, all of which had to be mastered. I can't
>say which of those planes I loved the best because
>they all were so different. (Right now I would have
>to say that the Pietenpol is my favorite :). I have
>never flown an airplane I didn't like. I had made the
>first test flights in many experimental homebuilts for
>pilot/builders who were a little concerned with their
>own flying skills. I still love the adrenalin rush I
>always got when I made that first flight in an
>unproven design! Well, enough rambling...
>
>I am now doing a first in aviation for me...and that
>is to build my very own airplane. I am enjoying it
>very much. I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
>to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his Model
>A powered Piet. I can't wait for that and will take
>lots of pics.
>
>Doc
>--- Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
> > <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> >
> > Galen--- that is some great advice on the possible
> > fire hazard that the oil
> > on the belly
> > could cause at low rpms/backfire. Hmmmm....I'm
> > glad I only use it at
> > cruise or full power.
> >
> > Interesting career you had. Can't imagine what
> > flying a Pitts would be like !
> >
> > Mike C.
> >
> > do not archive
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/chat
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>__________________________________
>
>
Message 9
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) |
The first airplane I purchased was a Tomahawk, back in the 1980s. I loved
that plane. Although I learned to fly in a Twin Bonanza Excalibur, the Tomahawk
was a darned good trainer. If you stalled the Tramahawk, and went into a spin
(many folks did, and sometimes instructors and their students didn't recover
and a few augured in.) You had to be on your toes, literally and figuratively.
It helped if you had spin training in something tame like an Aerobat 152, and
then tried spinning a Tramahawk when you had developed some kind of skill.
Also, some folks got buggered in Tramahawks because the tail shook like hell
during the stall and the break could happen very suddenly, pealing off to the
left or right very fast. When the tail shuddered, it sounded like the thing
was breaking up in mid-air and Cessna pilots not accustomed to this often would
land, wipe their be-hinds and go back to their predictable and docile 152s or
172s.
For those who originally trained in a forgiving Cessna or other old-lady
airplanes, sure, they lament the Tomahawk, but in fact it's like guys who drink
Light Beer or Real Beer, depends on what your taste is. The Cessna is less
filling, but the Tramahawk is better tasting. Now, let's talk about ribbon cutting,
upside down in a Decathalon... that's a serious pucker factor I won't soon
forget, not to mention sore shoulders in a harness... Makes the stall in a
Tramahawk look very tame.
S.B.
Message 10
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Scimitar Prop |
Gang, What are you guys using for leading edge protection on your carved
props.?
Ken Conrad, in sunny Iowa with the beans in the bin
Message 11
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Thanks Chuck, but I went the most discusting way a
human can travel...by ground. I flew an antique
Mustang up there and back. Made it a one-day, round
trip too. Would have loved to had seen your plane
though. Maybe at Broadhead. I plan to go next year.
I went up to check out Ken's engine and was impressed.
I think I am going to have one of those Henry Ford
products! I sure would like to see some of your
construction pics though. Could you email me a few?
Thanks.
Doc
--- Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/4/04 9:05:51 PM Central
> Daylight Time,
> wacopitts@yahoo.com writes:
>
> << I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
> to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his
> Model
> A powered Piet. >>
>
> Hey Doc,
> If you're flying a fast plane up there, or whatever,
> maybe you would like to
> make a stop in Wichita KS - Cook Airfield, for a
> lookover my plane. I have
> over 300 detail pictures of the construction.
>
> Chuck Gantzer
> NX770CG
> Wichita KS
> Cook Airfield (K50)
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Tell me about the ribon cut in a Decathalon, I'd like
to hear that. It was the ribon cut in the Pitts that
led my family to FORCE me out of the airshow business.
But I was doing it a 25 feet inverted, kinda "woose"
for serious airshow pilots...
Doc
--- N321TX@wmconnect.com wrote:
> The first airplane I purchased was a Tomahawk, back
> in the 1980s. I loved
> that plane. Although I learned to fly in a Twin
> Bonanza Excalibur, the Tomahawk
> was a darned good trainer. If you stalled the
> Tramahawk, and went into a spin
> (many folks did, and sometimes instructors and their
> students didn't recover
> and a few augured in.) You had to be on your toes,
> literally and figuratively.
> It helped if you had spin training in something tame
> like an Aerobat 152, and
> then tried spinning a Tramahawk when you had
> developed some kind of skill.
>
> Also, some folks got buggered in Tramahawks because
> the tail shook like hell
> during the stall and the break could happen very
> suddenly, pealing off to the
> left or right very fast. When the tail shuddered, it
> sounded like the thing
> was breaking up in mid-air and Cessna pilots not
> accustomed to this often would
> land, wipe their be-hinds and go back to their
> predictable and docile 152s or
> 172s.
>
> For those who originally trained in a forgiving
> Cessna or other old-lady
> airplanes, sure, they lament the Tomahawk, but in
> fact it's like guys who drink
> Light Beer or Real Beer, depends on what your taste
> is. The Cessna is less
> filling, but the Tramahawk is better tasting. Now,
> let's talk about ribbon cutting,
> upside down in a Decathalon... that's a serious
> pucker factor I won't soon
> forget, not to mention sore shoulders in a
> harness... Makes the stall in a
> Tramahawk look very tame.
>
> S.B.
>
__________________________________
Message 13
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | serious smoke advice (now Tomahawk) |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Well, I've never flown a Tomahawk, so I can't speak
with any authority on that airplane. I have heard
many pilots say bad things about the Pitts Special
(and some of them had even flown the airplane!!) and I
at once, when I was first learning to fly the thing,
had thoughts of how skitish this little devil was.
But as time went on and I gained more experience
flying the Pitts, I found it to be a very fun airplane
and very versitile. I had even flown it cross country
from Arkansas to Georgia and on to southern Florida.
Really, its not the flying the Pitts that is the
problem. Almost any pilot can fly a Pitts very
easily. It's the LANDING of a Pitts that seperates the
Spam Canneres from the real pilots (grin). Pappy
Curtis Pitts once said, "there is no such thing as a
squirrley airplane...just squirrley pilots." Now
those were Curtis Pitts feelings. The Pitts was a
challenge to land and sometimes, take-off, espically
in any cross winds, but with lots of practice and a
pinch of luck once in awhile, any serious pilot can
learn to master one. Now, I have never flown a
Tomahawk but...
Doc
--- Eric Williams <ewilliams805@msn.com> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Eric
> Williams" <ewilliams805@msn.com>
>
> My first 13 hours of instruction were in a Tomahawk
> and it really wasn't all
> that bad. Maybe that's because I didn't have much
> else to compare it to.
> Since I moved a few months ago I'm now flying a
> Diamond Eclipse which is,
> let's say, much nicer. Kind of like going from a
> dump truck to a Ferrari.
>
> Eric
>
> (Do not archive)
>
> >From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
> >Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> >Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
> >Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2004 06:51:25 -0400
> >
> >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack
> Phillips"
> ><pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
> >
> >Doc, if you've never flown a plane you didn't like,
> you've obviously never
> >flown a Piper Tomahawk.
> >
> >Jack Phillips
> >Fixin' to leave for the airport to meet "The Man"
> for the airworthiness
> >inspection of NX899JP
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]
> On Behalf Of Galen
> >Hutcheson
> >Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:05 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: serious smoke advice
> >
> >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen
> Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
> >
> >Thanks Mike, just thought I would pass that along.
> I
> >never want to ruin anyone's party, but I have heard
> of
> >several cases where the smoke oil had caused some
> >pretty severe in-flight fires. The airshow
> community
> >is rather small (when I was flying, there were only
> >about 320 or so active airshow pilots) so word gets
> >around rather quickly. This is well known among
> >airshow pilots. Have fun with it, just be careful.
> >
> >I loved the Pitts. I first had a "C" model (flat
> wing
> >with an 0320 which I practiced acro in for about
> four
> >and a half years before I even flew my first
> airshow.
> >I flew for my first low altitude wavier in front of
> >the FAA in that plane. Suprisingly, he gave me a
> 500'
> >wavier on the first go. I later had the super
> Pitts,
> >highly modified S-1S with the symmetrical wings,
> with
> >a highly modified IO-360 that was rated a around
> 240
> >HP. It operated between 3000 and 3200 rpms. It
> had
> >10:1 pistons as well as many other things.
> >
> >I have been fortunate to have flown many different
> >types of A/C in the past 30 odd years. Ranging
> from
> >the low and slow antique biplanes to the super
> >performing Pitts. Each plane had its own thrills
> and
> >challenges, all of which had to be mastered. I
> can't
> >say which of those planes I loved the best because
> >they all were so different. (Right now I would
> have
> >to say that the Pietenpol is my favorite :). I
> have
> >never flown an airplane I didn't like. I had made
> the
> >first test flights in many experimental homebuilts
> for
> >pilot/builders who were a little concerned with
> their
> >own flying skills. I still love the adrenalin rush
> I
> >always got when I made that first flight in an
> >unproven design! Well, enough rambling...
> >
> >I am now doing a first in aviation for me...and
> that
> >is to build my very own airplane. I am enjoying it
> >very much. I am going up to Kansas tomorrow
> morning
> >to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his
> Model
> >A powered Piet. I can't wait for that and will
> take
> >lots of pics.
> >
> >Doc
> >--- Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> wrote:
> >
> > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D
> Cuy
> > > <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> > >
> > > Galen--- that is some great advice on the
> possible
> > > fire hazard that the oil
> > > on the belly
> > > could cause at low rpms/backfire. Hmmmm....I'm
> > > glad I only use it at
> > > cruise or full power.
> > >
> > > Interesting career you had. Can't imagine what
> > > flying a Pitts would be like !
> > >
> > > Mike C.
> > >
> > > do not archive
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Contributions
> > > any other
> > > Forums.
> > >
> > > http://www.matronics.com/chat
> > >
> > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> > > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >__________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
=== message truncated ===
Message 14
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice |
I took some photos of Ken's plane (see attachments).
I really like that Ford installation.
Doc
--- Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/4/04 9:05:51 PM Central
> Daylight Time,
> wacopitts@yahoo.com writes:
>
> << I am going up to Kansas tomorrow morning
> to visit with Ken Perkins and have a look at his
> Model
> A powered Piet. >>
>
> Hey Doc,
> If you're flying a fast plane up there, or whatever,
> maybe you would like to
> make a stop in Wichita KS - Cook Airfield, for a
> lookover my plane. I have
> over 300 detail pictures of the construction.
>
> Chuck Gantzer
> NX770CG
> Wichita KS
> Cook Airfield (K50)
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
_______________________________
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
Message 15
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Scimitar Prop |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
In a message dated 10/5/04 7:54:16 PM Central Daylight Time,
Wizzard187@aol.com writes:
<< Gang, What are you guys using for leading edge protection on your carved
props.?
Ken Conrad, in sunny Iowa with the beans in the bin >>
Ken,
After all the carving, sanding, balancing and re-checking blade track and
blade angle at each station, I use Kevlar tipping on the leading edge, and put
fiberglass cloth on the entire blade. I could go into more detail of this
process, if you like.
Chuck G.
Good to hear the beans are in...that leaves the fields open for a possible
off field landing !!
Message 16
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
In a message dated 10/5/04 9:30:55 PM Central Daylight Time,
wacopitts@yahoo.com writes:
<< I sure would like to see some of your
construction pics though. Could you email me a few? >>
Doc,
What portion of the construction would you like to see ? I got most of them
scanned in, before my scanner started going 'grrwl click click click'. Now I
have a digital camara. I really need to put up a web site. I could e-mail
them direct to you.
Chuck G.
Got my first taste of aerobatics at Brodhead this year...No, not in the Piet.
Banjo Bob took me up in his Starduster Two. WAY COOL !!!
Message 17
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Scimitar Prop |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Chuck, need to talk to you about carving a prop
sometime, I'm planning to carve mine and need some
info. Thanks.
Doc
--- Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/5/04 7:54:16 PM Central
> Daylight Time,
> Wizzard187@aol.com writes:
>
> << Gang, What are you guys using for leading edge
> protection on your carved
> props.?
> Ken Conrad, in sunny Iowa with the beans in the bin
> >>
>
> Ken,
> After all the carving, sanding, balancing and
> re-checking blade track and
> blade angle at each station, I use Kevlar tipping on
> the leading edge, and put
> fiberglass cloth on the entire blade. I could go
> into more detail of this
> process, if you like.
>
> Chuck G.
> Good to hear the beans are in...that leaves the
> fields open for a possible
> off field landing !!
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
_______________________________
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
Message 18
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: serious smoke advice |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Acro is great isn't it? We'll just have to see what a
little ole' Piet can do with a Ford engine someday...
I am working on the fusleage right now, so any pics
you could lend would be of help. My email is
wacopitts@yahoo.com. I would love to see them.
Thanks.
Doc
--- Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/5/04 9:30:55 PM Central
> Daylight Time,
> wacopitts@yahoo.com writes:
>
> << I sure would like to see some of your
> construction pics though. Could you email me a
> few? >>
>
> Doc,
> What portion of the construction would you like to
> see ? I got most of them
> scanned in, before my scanner started going 'grrwl
> click click click'. Now I
> have a digital camara. I really need to put up a
> web site. I could e-mail
> them direct to you.
>
> Chuck G.
> Got my first taste of aerobatics at Brodhead this
> year...No, not in the Piet.
> Banjo Bob took me up in his Starduster Two. WAY
> COOL !!!
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
_______________________________
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
Message 19
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
"Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft" <corvaircraft@mylist.net>
Subject: | N74DV's first passenger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
So........ today was an awesome day. I finally got the engine running
smoothly on the airframe. Firewall forward is complete. Fired it up an all
was well. Oil pressure was good, oil temps kept cool. CHT's within
limits....
so.. here I have this 95% complete fuselage with engine running... brakes
work, tail wheel hooked up.. how could I resist some taxi tests. I employ
my neighbor (who happens to be an airline pilot) to wach for cars and
spectators on my street. I then pull it out on the street and start some
taxing.... did about 4 runs up and down and slow speed, maybe 8-10 mph.
Then the neighbor kid comes out... I think he's about 9yrs old... he had a
smile from ear to ear just watching. I shutdown and yell over at him
"Brady.... go ask your mom if it's ok if you take a taxi ride in the
Aircamper" he darts inside like a lightning bolt. 10 seconds later he
comes outside... " She's says I can go! yeeeehawww!" I help him into the
front seat, buckle him in with the 1969 Brantly B-2 Helicopter seat belts I
have installed. I tell him he can move the stick all he wants but don't
play with the throttle lever.
We then commence to driving up and down the street about 4 times. he loved
it... me too! Then all the sudden the fun came to a stop when I look
behind me to see a Mesa Police Dept. car behind me with it's lights on
PULLING ME OVER!!! it was hilarious! I shutdown and hop out. the cop is
the nicest guy and he's laughing saying he's never pulled a plane over. He
looks the plane over asks the typical questions and then politely tells me I
need to put the "toy" away cause I'm on a city road and my plane is not
exactly licensed to drive on it. I tell him thanks and I push it into the
garage.
What a hoot! My first passenger ride and a cop pulls me over.... how
funny!
Today N74DV was loaded with fuel and physically moved 2 souls under it's own
power.... I'm stoked!!!
DJ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
_
Message 20
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: N74DV's first passenger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <stacy@unicom-alaska.com>
Hilarious story DJ.
You got a Corvair engine in it right? Should have told
him it was a rebodied Corvair and the registration blew
away when you started it up...
Stacy
Message 21
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: N74DV's first passenger |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
Loved the story DJ.
Doc
--- DJ Vegh <djv@imagedv.com> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh"
> <djv@imagedv.com>
>
> So........ today was an awesome day. I finally got
> the engine running
> smoothly on the airframe. Firewall forward is
> complete. Fired it up an all
> was well. Oil pressure was good, oil temps kept
> cool. CHT's within
> limits....
>
> so.. here I have this 95% complete fuselage with
> engine running... brakes
> work, tail wheel hooked up.. how could I resist some
> taxi tests. I employ
> my neighbor (who happens to be an airline pilot) to
> wach for cars and
> spectators on my street. I then pull it out on the
> street and start some
> taxing.... did about 4 runs up and down and slow
> speed, maybe 8-10 mph.
>
> Then the neighbor kid comes out... I think he's
> about 9yrs old... he had a
> smile from ear to ear just watching. I shutdown
> and yell over at him
> "Brady.... go ask your mom if it's ok if you take a
> taxi ride in the
> Aircamper" he darts inside like a lightning bolt.
> 10 seconds later he
> comes outside... " She's says I can go!
> yeeeehawww!" I help him into the
> front seat, buckle him in with the 1969 Brantly B-2
> Helicopter seat belts I
> have installed. I tell him he can move the stick
> all he wants but don't
> play with the throttle lever.
>
> We then commence to driving up and down the street
> about 4 times. he loved
> it... me too! Then all the sudden the fun came
> to a stop when I look
> behind me to see a Mesa Police Dept. car behind me
> with it's lights on
> PULLING ME OVER!!! it was hilarious! I shutdown
> and hop out. the cop is
> the nicest guy and he's laughing saying he's never
> pulled a plane over. He
> looks the plane over asks the typical questions and
> then politely tells me I
> need to put the "toy" away cause I'm on a city road
> and my plane is not
> exactly licensed to drive on it. I tell him thanks
> and I push it into the
> garage.
>
> What a hoot! My first passenger ride and a cop
> pulls me over.... how
> funny!
>
> Today N74DV was loaded with fuel and physically
> moved 2 souls under it's own
> power.... I'm stoked!!!
>
> DJ
> www.imagedv.com/aircamper
>
> _
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|