Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Mon 11/01/04


Total Messages Posted: 16



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 03:01 AM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Jack Phillips)
     2. 03:22 AM - Matronics 2004 Email List Fund Raiser [PLEASE READ] (Matt Dralle)
     3. 07:54 AM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Galen Hutcheson)
     4.  PM -  ()
     5. 08:41 AM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (BARNSTMR@aol.com)
     6. 08:52 AM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Graham Hansen)
     7. 09:05 AM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Galen Hutcheson)
     8. 09:13 AM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Galen Hutcheson)
     9. 09:35 AM - Aluminum spars (LAWRENCE WILLIAMS)
    10. 02:40 PM - Piet Photos (TBYH@aol.com)
    11. 04:08 PM - Re: Piet Photos (Galen Hutcheson)
    12. 07:33 PM - Air Camper project for sale (N321TX@wmconnect.com)
    13. 09:17 PM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Rcaprd@aol.com)
    14. 10:59 PM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Clif Dawson)
    15. 11:11 PM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Galen Hutcheson)
    16. 11:19 PM - Re: "Skinny Piet" (Galen Hutcheson)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 03:01:35 AM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> Hi Doc, A few thoughts on widening the fuselage. I did that on my Pietenpol, and if I were to do it over I would still make it wider than plans. I widened mine by 1", making it 25" wide. Mine is the long fuselage version. I'm 6'2" and 200 lbs and felt I needed the extra room in the cockpit. I have flown short fuselage, standard width Piets, and they are just a little too tight for me. There are downsides to widening it, though. They are: 1. Weight. Long fuselage Piets tend to be heavier than standrd length Piets, most weighing in around 700 to 750 lbs according to Doc Mosher's survey at Brodhead a few years ago. Making it wider adds more weight. Mine weighs 735 lbs, which is a tad over 100 lbs heavier than Mike Cuy's. It shows in its climb performance. 2. Cost. Ol' Bernard knew what he was doing, designing the plane to be as economical as possible. the stand width allows a 48" sheet of plywood to be plit lengthwise and make two pieces that will fitthe fuselage. Making it any wider requires two sheets, with lots of waste. 3. Complexity. Widening the fuselage means the cabane struts are spaced further apart, which requires modification to the wing. One little change snowballs into several changes, rippling throughout the airframe. As I can recall, those changes included: a. Making the centersection spar longer (I went ahead and made mine 6" longer to give me more fuel capacity) b. Making the fuselage taller, to keep the proportions with the wider fuselage (not a bad thing - it gives more room in the instrument panel) Again, if I had it to do over, I would still make it wider. Just realize there are downsides to it, most notably weight. Sure makes it nice on those cold mornings when I have to wear a heavy leather jacket to fly it comfortably, though. Jack Phillips NX899JP -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Galen Hutcheson Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 2:37 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: "Skinny Piet" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Hello Gang, Just for curosity sake, has anyone tried or even considered a little wider fuselage for that skinny little Piet. Surely in all the hundreds of Piets built or started, at least someone has thought about it or maybe even done it. Say maybe 2" or so at the most. That would make for a lot more squirming around room inside the cockpit on those long voyages cross country...you know, with those long range fuel tanks installed. I realize that everything would have to be sized up to accomodate the change and there would be some extra weight, but it's an interesting thought. The rear cockpit on the Piet is going to be about as wide as my 1940 Porterfield, and it sure was a little tight for comfort. Doc __________________________________ Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.


    Message 2


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    Time: 03:22:47 AM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: Matronics 2004 Email List Fund Raiser [PLEASE READ]
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com> Dear Listers, Each November I hold a PBS-like Fund Raiser to support the continued operation and upgrade of the Email List servers at Matronics. The Lists sponsored here are supported solely though the direct contributions of its members each year during the Fund Raiser. As you have likely noticed, there is no commercial advertising on any of the Lists or on any of the List-related web sites such as the List Browser and List Search Engine. That doesn't mean they're free to operate, however. To run a first class, high-performance, highly-available service such as the Forums at Matronics, its take resources. These resources fall into the categories of financial and personnel. As far as "personnel" is concerned, its a one-man show and I perform all of the work required to operate and upgrade the Lists without being directly compensated for my work. But that's a labor of love. The financial resources required, on the other hand, are covered primarily though the generous contributions of the List members. Direct costs include, for example, a commercial-grade T1 line Internet connection dedicated primarily to serving the Lister Community. This T1 Internet connection provides a high-performance, dedicated connection to the Archive and Browsing Tools and assures the quickest, most reliable delivery of List messages. It seems like there's always an upgrade required and this year I've added an all new online backup system to automatically backup all of the Lists Archives as well as provide for complete system disaster recovery. This new system would enable me to restore the email and/or web server systems to 100% in only a couple of hours if one of them were to blow up. The number of messages processed by the Matronics Forums continues to increase as well. In the last 12 months, there have been over 70,000 unique messages posted across the various lists, amounting to well over 32 MILLION messages that have been redistributed to List members in that same period! The List web site also sees an equally high level of traffic with some 148,000 Archive searches performed last year and a staggering 13 million web site hits! During the month of November, I will be sending out a Fund Raiser reminder message a couple of times a week and I ask for your patience and understanding during this time. The Fund Raiser is the sole means of support for the Lists, and the existence and longevity of the Lists hinges directly its success. This year once again, Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore has provided a number of great incentive gifts during the Fund Raiser. Andy provides these items to me at a substantial discount and they have proven to be very popular among the Listers. Thank you Andy for your extraordinary generosity and support of the Lists again this year! Please visit Andy's web site, the Builder's Bookstore: http://www.buildersbooks.com If you use the Matronics Email Lists and enjoy the quick and easy access to one of the best resources on the Internet for Homebuilt and General aviation discussion forums, please make a Contribution today to support the continued operation. Remember, its *your* Contribution that keeps these Lists running. The Contribution web site is freshly updated with a list of all new incentive gifts! Transactions are SSL secured and you can make your Contribution using a credit card, Paypal, or a personal check. The Contribution web site can be found at: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you for your support!! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft do not archive


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:54:35 AM PST US
    From: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
    Subject: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Hi Jack, That was a well written response. I just knew that someone had to have widened the fuselage some over the years. I realized it would add some weight, but with enough horsepower, that shouldn't be too much of a problem. I am now fitting up my fuselage halves and I formed them up on 26" instead of the 24" called for in the plans. I tapered everything back accordingly. It looks good and proportional to other aircraft I have seen. I plan to adjust the centersection to accomodate the wider cabane strut, ect. I am going to ponder over this a couple of days before I decide whether to do it or not, but, right now I'm leaning toward the wider model. I plan to do a lot of cross country flying and don't like being cramped up. Plus, I like to carry some baggage with me. I just talked to a very good friend of mine by the name of Dennis Yates from Illinois. I know he has been to Broadhead many times and he said he has seen widened Piets before too. Again Jack, thanks for your response. Doc --- Jack Phillips <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack > Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > > Hi Doc, > > A few thoughts on widening the fuselage. I did that > on my Pietenpol, and if > I were to do it over I would still make it wider > than plans. I widened mine > by 1", making it 25" wide. Mine is the long > fuselage version. I'm 6'2" and > 200 lbs and felt I needed the extra room in the > cockpit. I have flown short > fuselage, standard width Piets, and they are just a > little too tight for me. > > There are downsides to widening it, though. They > are: > > 1. Weight. Long fuselage Piets tend to be heavier > than standrd length > Piets, most weighing in around 700 to 750 lbs > according to Doc Mosher's > survey at Brodhead a few years ago. Making it wider > adds more weight. Mine > weighs 735 lbs, which is a tad over 100 lbs heavier > than Mike Cuy's. It > shows in its climb performance. > > 2. Cost. Ol' Bernard knew what he was doing, > designing the plane to be as > economical as possible. the stand width allows a > 48" sheet of plywood to be > plit lengthwise and make two pieces that will fitthe > fuselage. Making it > any wider requires two sheets, with lots of waste. > > 3. Complexity. Widening the fuselage means the > cabane struts are spaced > further apart, which requires modification to the > wing. One little change > snowballs into several changes, rippling throughout > the airframe. As I can > recall, those changes included: > > a. Making the centersection spar longer (I went > ahead and made mine 6" > longer to give me more fuel capacity) > b. Making the fuselage taller, to keep the > proportions with the wider > fuselage (not a bad thing - it gives more room in > the instrument panel) > > Again, if I had it to do over, I would still make it > wider. Just realize > there are downsides to it, most notably weight. > Sure makes it nice on those > cold mornings when I have to wear a heavy leather > jacket to fly it > comfortably, though. > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] > On Behalf Of Galen > Hutcheson > Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 2:37 AM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: "Skinny Piet" > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen > Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> > > Hello Gang, > > Just for curosity sake, has anyone tried or even > considered a little wider fuselage for that skinny > little Piet. Surely in all the hundreds of Piets > built > or started, at least someone has thought about it or > maybe even done it. Say maybe 2" or so at the most. > That would make for a lot more squirming around room > inside the cockpit on those long voyages cross > country...you know, with those long range fuel tanks > installed. I realize that everything would have to > be > sized up to accomodate the change and there would be > some extra weight, but it's an interesting thought. > The rear cockpit on the Piet is going to be about as > wide as my 1940 Porterfield, and it sure was a > little > tight for comfort. > > Doc > > > > __________________________________ > Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download > now. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Click on the > this > by the > Admin. > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > __________________________________


    Message 4


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    Message 5


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    Time: 08:41:11 AM PST US
    From: BARNSTMR@aol.com
    Subject: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: BARNSTMR@aol.com I think Corky and Max Davis have built their airplanes wider. I saw some photos of Corky's re-piet and it looks great and like it is a lot roomier. I wonder how some of the things like the aileron cables come out in relation to the backside of the instrument panel. Also does this end up lengthening your rudder bar and widen your leg stance? How about the angles on your engine mount structure? How does it affect the loads in the tubing? Do you assume they increase and go with a heavier wall thickness. More added to overall weight. Hmm...is it still a Piet? I think I'll stick to the plans on mine. -- Terry L. Bowden ph 254-715-4773 fax 254-853-3805


    Message 6


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    Time: 08:52:19 AM PST US
    From: "Graham Hansen" <grhans@cable-lynx.net>
    Subject: Re: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Graham Hansen" <grhans@cable-lynx.net> Doc, I built my Pietenpol with the fuselage 2" wider from the firewall aft to the rear instrument panel, and tapered the sides from there to the tailpost . The fuselage length was unchanged from Orrin Hoopman's drawings for the "Improved Air Camper". On the 15th of this month, I shall fly it to commemorate the 34th anniversary of its first flight, weather permitting. Over the years some of these flights have been pretty chilly here in Alberta, Canada--and I have appreciated the ability to wear lots of clothing due to the widened cockpit. It seems the widening of the fuselage has not resulted in much weight increase. My Piet weighed 630 pounds dry in 1985 after recovering. A C85-8 engine and wooden propeller were installed together with an absolute minimum of fixed equipment. Today, it is a little heavier with a C85-12 engine and some very lightweight seat cushions to ease my old bones--but is still lighter than several other Piets in our area. If I were to build another (which I won't), I'd go with the widened fuselage. Cheers, Graham Hansen (Pietenpol CF-AUN)


    Message 7


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    Time: 09:05:47 AM PST US
    From: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
    Subject: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Hi Terry, Thanks for your response. I don't know if I will end up with a "Piet" or not, but I hope to end up with an airplane I can enjoy and use. I am kind of building my "dream" airplane so I want to make it fit many of the things I have always wanted in an airplane. The cables you mentioned can be engineered without too much bother. Of course the angles of the engine mount will be different but the moment arm of the force the engine exerts on the mount is going to be the same so I think the same guage will work. The Piet is way over built for strength so there is plenty of room for inovation. There would be a little wider stance on the rudder bar, but it would be about the same as I had with the Bird biplane (which also had a rudder bar) and that was actually real comfortable. The top fuselage cowlings will have to be sized up but that is what I had planed to do anyway. I have flown aircraft long distances that were cramped and uncomfortable and by the time you get to where your are going you are just worn out. The Aeronica Champ and the Chief are examples where the fuselage was widened with good results. My adding 2" in width to the Piet certainly isn't as drastic a change as in the Aeronicas. Each person has his (her) own individual likes and dislikes about what an airplane should be and since I plan to build only one airplane I want to make it as much to my liking as I can. Again, thanks for your response. Doc --- BARNSTMR@aol.com wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: > BARNSTMR@aol.com > > I think Corky and Max Davis have built their > airplanes wider. I saw some photos of Corky's > re-piet and it looks great and like it is a lot > roomier. I wonder how some of the things like the > aileron cables come out in relation to the backside > of the instrument panel. Also does this end up > lengthening your rudder bar and widen your leg > stance? How about the angles on your engine mount > structure? How does it affect the loads in the > tubing? Do you assume they increase and go with a > heavier wall thickness. More added to overall > weight. Hmm...is it still a Piet? I think I'll > stick to the plans on mine. > -- > Terry L. Bowden > ph 254-715-4773 > fax 254-853-3805 > > > > > > > Click on the > this > by the > Admin. > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > __________________________________


    Message 8


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    Time: 09:13:52 AM PST US
    From: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Hi Graham, That was a great response! It seems like there are several wider Piets out there. I agree with everything you wrote about the needs for a wider fuselage. The narrow fuselage is alright if you are just going to go out and play in the air or take short trips in, but if you are going to do some serious traveling (and I plan to follow my old "barnstorming" routes) you need something more useful. I think I too will widen the fuselage the 2" and taper everything back proportionally. I can't see it adding all that much extra weight and since I'm not building an ultralite anyway, I want to make this little airplane useful. Again, thanks for your wonderful response. Doc --- Graham Hansen <grhans@cable-lynx.net> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Graham > Hansen" <grhans@cable-lynx.net> > > Doc, > > I built my Pietenpol with the fuselage 2" wider from > the firewall aft to the > rear instrument panel, and tapered the sides from > there to the tailpost . > The fuselage length was unchanged from Orrin > Hoopman's drawings for the > "Improved Air Camper". > > On the 15th of this month, I shall fly it to > commemorate the 34th > anniversary of its first flight, weather permitting. > Over the years some of > these flights have been pretty chilly here in > Alberta, Canada--and I have > appreciated the ability to wear lots of clothing due > to the widened cockpit. > > It seems the widening of the fuselage has not > resulted in much weight > increase. My Piet weighed 630 pounds dry in 1985 > after recovering. A C85-8 > engine and wooden propeller were installed together > with an absolute minimum > of fixed equipment. Today, it is a little heavier > with a C85-12 engine and > some very lightweight seat cushions to ease my old > bones--but is still > lighter than several other Piets in our area. > > If I were to build another (which I won't), I'd go > with the widened > fuselage. > > Cheers, > > Graham Hansen (Pietenpol CF-AUN) > > > > > > > Click on the > this > by the > Admin. > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > __________________________________


    Message 9


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    Time: 09:35:21 AM PST US
    From: "LAWRENCE WILLIAMS" <lnawms@msn.com>
    Subject: Aluminum spars
    Seal-Send-Time: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 12:35:44 -0500 Someone (Ted Brusseau???) wrote an article in the latest Brodhead Pietenpol Association Newsletter about a plans change to aluminum spars and the attendant problems that an "improvement" to the plans can cause. Seems like we've been fighting this battle for years and years. Anyway..... I have a friend who has built a one-piece wing and he used aluminum spars so, after reading the article, he's really concerned. He has no computer so I am writing on his behalf. Will the author of the article please contact me directly to answer some questions regarding the spar material that was used in the Piet (NOT) that you tested. Thanks- Larry


    Message 10


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    Time: 02:40:01 PM PST US
    From: TBYH@aol.com
    Subject: Piet Photos
    Fellow Piet Builders: I've got a dandy workbench built, I've got an engine (Model A -- to be rebuilt), wing ribs from Charlie Rubecks, and enough spruce and ply to build the fuselage. And so I'm going to start actually gluing wood together in the next few days. I'm also going to be writing a series of articles about the project as it progresses for a regional monthly magazine serving the Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota area (The Tapestry published in Lansing, Iowa). In the initial article I'm going to talk about the history of the plane and BHP and I'd also like to include some photos of completed Pietenpols -- especially in-flight photos -- just to show the Tapestry readers what kind of "kite" we'll be building. Here's my request: Could some of you send me a pic or two of your Piet? We can work with digital but they must be 300 dpi at full size (say 3x5 or 4x6). Or, if you can snail-mail me some traditional film prints that would be terrific. I'll be glad to send you a copy of the magazine that your plane appears in. I plan to write an article every three months or so as the plane progresses. I'll be happy to share the articles with this group, too. We're thinking that the article series will kick off in January. Hope to hear from some of you soon! Fred Beseler 1619 Cass St. La Crosse, WI 54601 _TBYH@aol.com_ (mailto:TBYH@aol.com)


    Message 11


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    Time: 04:08:49 PM PST US
    From: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Piet Photos
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Good luck with the project Fred. Don't have any flying photos as yet, but I'm putting the fuselage together right now and my engine is being built for me. I have most of my ribs done too. Sounds like a good bunch of flyers up your way. I used to barnstorm up to Neilsville and the towns around. Never did stop in La Crosse though, nice flying country up there too. Doc --- TBYH@aol.com wrote: > Fellow Piet Builders: > > I've got a dandy workbench built, I've got an engine > (Model A -- to be > rebuilt), wing ribs from Charlie Rubecks, and enough > spruce and ply to build the > fuselage. And so I'm going to start actually gluing > wood together in the next few > days. > > I'm also going to be writing a series of articles > about the project as it > progresses for a regional monthly magazine serving > the Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota > area (The Tapestry published in Lansing, Iowa). In > the initial article I'm > going to talk about the history of the plane and BHP > and I'd also like to > include some photos of completed Pietenpols -- > especially in-flight photos -- just > to show the Tapestry readers what kind of "kite" > we'll be building. > > Here's my request: Could some of you send me a pic > or two of your Piet? We > can work with digital but they must be 300 dpi at > full size (say 3x5 or 4x6). > Or, if you can snail-mail me some traditional film > prints that would be > terrific. I'll be glad to send you a copy of the > magazine that your plane appears in. > > I plan to write an article every three months or so > as the plane progresses. > I'll be happy to share the articles with this group, > too. We're thinking that > the article series will kick off in January. > > Hope to hear from some of you soon! > > Fred Beseler > 1619 Cass St. > La Crosse, WI 54601 > > _TBYH@aol.com_ (mailto:TBYH@aol.com) >


    Message 12


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    Time: 07:33:59 PM PST US
    From: N321TX@wmconnect.com
    Subject: Air Camper project for sale
    I've listed my GN-1 Air Camper on Barnstormer. My still picture with the ad is lousy, and vastly better pictures of this project can be seen on DJ Vegh's site at http://imagedv.com/aircamper/log/image-pages/03-02-04b.htm. I bought this Air Camper project from DJ in March and it has been stored in my hanger under a couple of canvas tarps. The workmanship is extraordinary. DJ bought this fuselage from someone in Mesa, AZ and I believe I am the 4th owner. The fuselage is 80% complete and I think I have 15 completed ribs (originally built by DJ). The project also includes all the wood necessary to complete the project. The fuselage is mounted on J3 Cub landing gear and it has a Maule tailwheel, minus the actual wheel. Also included are a rib jig that DJ built and another jig that I think is used for the nose ribs. The torque tube is already mounted in the fuselage with sticks installed. I can send a few more photos showing the airplane in a hanger in Abilene, TX. There are some very minor mildew issues that can be removed with light sanding using a 400 grade sandpaper. We had a serious drought until I brought this project home and about as soon as I parked it in the hanger under the canvas tarps, it became VERY humid, thus the mildew. There is one small stain on the exterior right side of the fuselage where condensation drained off the low spot on the tarps. This is only cosmetic. I cannot deliver. This project needs to be picked up at Abilene Regional Airport, located about 2 hours West of Fort Worth on I-20. Thanks, Sterling Brooks 325-754-4609


    Message 13


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    Time: 09:17:07 PM PST US
    From: Rcaprd@aol.com
    Subject: Re: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com Doc, I have a short fuse, to the Improved AirCamper plans. It has the standard plans width, and I don't have any problems with having enough room, now that I am used to it. However, I suppose my biggest problem, is reaching down to buckle the 4 point harness. I'm 6' tall, and weigh 205 lbs. Mounted next to my left hip, I keep a small personal fire extinguisher, the ELT, fuel sump cup, camera, cell phone and fuel quantity indicator (dip stick with calibration marks) on the seat. On the right side I have the Pietenpol Oporation Manual, four way screwdriver, Leatherman Tool, and other paperwork. I also keep a bottle of water there, for cross country trips. I keep all this stuff secured with Velcro. The fire extinguisher is mounted with the bracket that came with it. Once I'm all strapped in, it is comfortable. I made a seat pad that supports the forward portion of my thighs, but is very thin in the middle portion where I sit, to keep me down in the pit as far as possible. Talk about cross country trips... Last summer, I flew Wichita to Brodhead and Oshkosh. This past summer, my cross country trip was for 26 days, from 7/17/04 to 8/11/04. I flew down thru Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, Louisiana, Missouri, Arkansas, Illinois, Wisconsin (Brodhead), Indiana, Ohio, east to Wheeling W Va, and back to Wichita, covering 3100 miles, and logged 69.7 hours !! That was the biggest adventure I've ever had !! I burned 288 gal. fuel, 32 bottles of baby oil, made 62 landings, gave 35 rides, spent 8 nights in a tent, 10 nights with family in Wheeling, 4 nights with friends, and 5 nights in motels, spent $1270, and had an average speed of 66 mph. Chuck Gantzer NX770CG


    Message 14


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    Time: 10:59:00 PM PST US
    From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
    Subject: Re: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> Doc, Make up a 'mockpit' out of scrap material and play with it. Dress in your winter flightsuit and move your arms around with a broomstick and see what your elbows do. I've made my fuse 1" wider as a result. Everything else is normal except for lengthening the tail 6". Here's my mockpit. http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=27 I moved the throttle quadrant 9 times to get it where it's comfortable for me as well. Clif Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Skinny Piet" > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com > > Doc, > I have a short fuse, to the Improved AirCamper plans. It has the standard > plans width, and I don't have any problems with having enough room, now that I > am used to it. However, I suppose my biggest problem, is reaching down to > buckle the 4 point harness. I'm 6' tall, and weigh 205 lbs. > > Chuck Gantzer > NX770CG > >


    Message 15


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    Time: 11:11:36 PM PST US
    From: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Hey Chuck, That sounded like one heck of a trip! Now that is my kind of flying. When I get my Piet built (heaven help me when) let's hook up and do a trip like that one. I used to barnstorm from upper Wisconsin to southern Florida depending on the season. I would be "on the road" 3-4 months at at time with just what I could pack in the biplane. Most of my stuff was 60 wt. oil, extra fuel cans, tent, sleeping bag, tool bag, grease guns and extra tubes of grease, spare parts, a few clothes, and of course the indespensible food bag. I sure miss those days of pure freedom, some depradation but lots of great people to meet and there is nothing like a biplane for being a people magnet. I almost forgot how to drive a land vehicle I was flying so much. So when I get that Piet finished... I am sticking with the 26 inch wide fuselage. I have it all plumbed up and ready to glue. I just like the way it looks and it will be nice a roomy. I like to squirm around while I am on long trips and I don't stop much except for fuel (and most of the time that was to drop into a hay field or grass strip and dump two 6 gallon cans of fuel into the tank). I'm planning a few other changes if I can engineer them. I plan to build "Jenny" style tail feathers, of course the wooden Jenny style gear as well as the raked back Jenny style wing tips. There may be a few other things I will do as I go along. I am really enjoying building this project, I always thought I would but never took the time before to do so. Thanks for the response and I am serious about hooking up sometime in the (near?) future for a marathon flight. Doc --- Rcaprd@aol.com wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com > > Doc, > I have a short fuse, to the Improved AirCamper > plans. It has the standard > plans width, and I don't have any problems with > having enough room, now that I > am used to it. However, I suppose my biggest > problem, is reaching down to > buckle the 4 point harness. I'm 6' tall, and weigh > 205 lbs. Mounted next to my > left hip, I keep a small personal fire extinguisher, > the ELT, fuel sump cup, > camera, cell phone and fuel quantity indicator (dip > stick with calibration > marks) on the seat. On the right side I have the > Pietenpol Oporation Manual, four > way screwdriver, Leatherman Tool, and other > paperwork. I also keep a bottle > of water there, for cross country trips. I keep all > this stuff secured with > Velcro. The fire extinguisher is mounted with the > bracket that came with it. > Once I'm all strapped in, it is comfortable. I made > a seat pad that supports > the forward portion of my thighs, but is very thin > in the middle portion where > I sit, to keep me down in the pit as far as > possible. > Talk about cross country trips... > Last summer, I flew Wichita to Brodhead and Oshkosh. > > This past summer, my cross country trip was for > 26 days, from 7/17/04 to > 8/11/04. I flew down thru Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, > Louisiana, Missouri, > Arkansas, Illinois, Wisconsin (Brodhead), Indiana, > Ohio, east to Wheeling W Va, and > back to Wichita, covering 3100 miles, and logged > 69.7 hours !! That was the > biggest adventure I've ever had !! I burned 288 > gal. fuel, 32 bottles of baby > oil, made 62 landings, gave 35 rides, spent 8 nights > in a tent, 10 nights > with family in Wheeling, 4 nights with friends, and > 5 nights in motels, spent > $1270, and had an average speed of 66 mph. > > Chuck Gantzer > NX770CG > > > > > > Click on the > this > by the > Admin. > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > __________________________________ www.yahoo.com


    Message 16


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    Time: 11:19:08 PM PST US
    From: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: "Skinny Piet"
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson <wacopitts@yahoo.com> Hi Clif, Thanks for the response. Boy, that "mockpit" looks good enough to strap some wings and engine to and fly. I have flown from the micro cockpit Cassut racer to the big and roomy Cessna 210. The size of the cockpit I now have on the Piet (two inches wider than plans) is about the same size cockpit I had on the Bird biplane. That was one of the most comfortable cockpits I had ever flown. It wasn't too big nor was it too small. Everything was within easy reach without being too cluttered. I am going to try to copy that cockpit as much as possible. Those were some great pics on your website. I will spend some time going over them. Again, thanks for your response. Doc --- Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson > <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> > > Doc, Make up a 'mockpit' out of scrap material and > play > with it. Dress in your winter flightsuit and move > your arms > around with a broomstick and see what your elbows > do. > I've made my fuse 1" wider as a result. Everything > else is > normal except for lengthening the tail 6". Here's my > mockpit. > > http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=27 > > I moved the throttle quadrant 9 times to get it > where it's comfortable > for me as well. > > Clif > > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Skinny Piet" > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: > Rcaprd@aol.com > > > > Doc, > > I have a short fuse, to the Improved AirCamper > plans. It has the standard > > plans width, and I don't have any problems with > having enough room, now > that I > > am used to it. However, I suppose my biggest > problem, is reaching down to > > buckle the 4 point harness. I'm 6' tall, and > weigh 205 lbs. > > > > Chuck Gantzer > > NX770CG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Click on the > this > by the > Admin. > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > __________________________________ www.yahoo.com




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