---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 11/26/04: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:31 AM - Re: cables (Mike Luther) 2. 02:35 AM - List Contributors Lagging By 38%... (Matt Dralle) 3. 07:07 AM - Re: Douwe's construction photos NX799DB (john s) 4. 08:26 AM - Ping Pong Balls (Isablcorky@aol.com) 5. 11:50 AM - Re: Ping Pong Balls (Rcaprd@aol.com) 6. 11:58 AM - Varnishing Alternatives (Prange Larry J PSNS) 7. 12:09 PM - Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Michael D Cuy) 8. 12:20 PM - dain't cheap----- Ping Pong Balls (Michael D Cuy) 9. 04:32 PM - Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Mike Luther) 10. 06:30 PM - Buoyancy (Isablcorky@aol.com) 11. 06:36 PM - Re: Buoyancy (Jim Markle) 12. 06:55 PM - Re: Buoyancy (DJ Vegh) 13. 06:57 PM - Re: Buoyancy (DJ Vegh) 14. 07:18 PM - Re: Buoyancy (Isablcorky@aol.com) 15. 07:29 PM - [ Douwe Blumberg ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares) 16. 10:28 PM - Re: Buoyancy (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:31:05 AM PST US From: Mike Luther Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: cables Hi Jeff; I just finished reading ac43131b concerning cables and the NTSB reports for the Fly Baby and a web site concerning the Fly Baby's wing failure concerns. No, I am not going to replace my Piet's stainless steel cables with galvanized cables. If a fellow wants to save a few dollars and use galvanized, ok, but I do not buy into this particular safety- issue discussion at all. Mike Luther Jeff Hill wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jeff Hill" > Well I'll try this again. This is for you tech guys. Is there a long > term fatigue problem with stainless cables? I know of a flybaby that > crashed when a flying wire - stainless steel - broke due to fatigue > after a few years. So much for inspections and pre-flt checks. Is it > better to use galvanized for cables exposed to the slipstream? > > Jeff in sunny Texas > Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:35:37 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Pietenpol-List: List Contributors Lagging By 38%... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Matt Dralle Dear Listers, The percentage of people making a Contribution to support the Lists this year is currently lagging behind last year by approximately 38%! I'm hoping that everyone is just waiting until the last minute to show their support... ;-) Please remember that its solely your direct Contributions that keep these Lists up and running and most importantly - AD FREE! If the members don't want to support the Lists directly, then I will likely have to start adding advertisements to offset the costs of running the Lists. But I *really* don't want to have to start doing that. I really like the non-commercial atmosphere here and I think that a lot of the members appreciate that too. Won't you please take a moment to make a contribution today in support of the continued ad-free operation of all these Lists? http://www.matronics.com/contribution I want to send out a word of appreciation to all of the members that have already made their generous contribution to support the Lists! Thank you! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:07:43 AM PST US From: "john s" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Douwe's construction photos NX799DB Jim and Cliff: Thanks for the instruction. I'm really enjoying the photos. John S. ----- Original Message ----- From: Clif Dawson To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:10 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Douwe's construction photos NX799DB Try this and scroll down as the photo links don't appear until you do so. This page lists all the photos posted from Oct 1999 ( That was in the last century!). Douwe's pics haven't appeared so far though. http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ Remember, when you sit down to that turkey, that you are, or plan to be, flying a Pietenpol. :-) :-) :-) Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Douwe's construction photos NX799DB How I can view photos posted on this site? When I click on the links I've been able to find, the info only describes how to submit photos. Thanks, and Happy Thanksgiving, everyone. John S ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:26:25 AM PST US From: Isablcorky@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ping Pong Balls Do Not Archive Would anyone on this list know of a source for purchasing a LARGE quantity of Ping Pong balls? Corky, giving Thanks for the good life along the bayou ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:50:00 AM PST US From: Rcaprd@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Ping Pong Balls --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com In a message dated 11/26/04 10:26:53 AM Central Standard Time, Isablcorky@aol.com writes: << Do Not Archive Would anyone on this list know of a source for purchasing a LARGE quantity of Ping Pong balls? >> Corky, I just typed in Ping Pong Balls in the aol search engine and several possible sources came up. Dare I ask what these are for ? Wasn't it Fisherman who came up with the idea of filling the wing with ping pong balls, for a flight over the ocean, to Belize ? Idea: safety precaution in the event of ditching in the ocean. Aw, well...if you're going, I'm going...order a few crates for me, too !! :) Chuck G. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:58:00 AM PST US From: Prange Larry J PSNS Subject: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS Hi Gang! Years ago, Mike Cuy started a thread by saying that he had done an end run around the high cost of using two-part varnishes by applying Minwax Helmsman urethane varnish to his structure. Mike then applied a light coat of Dupont 222S sanding sealer over that and waited two months for the stuff to cure before covering. He said that the combination of products and the cure time provided resistance to the MEK used in the covering materials. Great! Save a zillion dollars! I'm for that! Later in the same thread someone asked Mike if the Dupont 222S step was necessary. He said that he didn't know because he hadn't tried it that way. So, therein lies my question. Has anybody experimented with using Minwax Helmsman urethane varnish (or similar) by itself and let it cure for months before covering? Did it resist the MEK? What was your process? What's the current knowledge in this subject? Does anyone know if POR-15 Blackcote will resist MEK after it has had months to cure? Larry Prange - Getting ready to cover, in the rain, on the Olympic Peninsula .. . . NX1929A ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:09:16 PM PST US From: Michael D Cuy Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy Larry--- Yes sir, the Dupont 222S sanding sealer I got at the auto paint store worked well but I'm not sure how it would have worked had I not used it or if I had not let it cure as long. You may only have to wait a few days or less, after spraying the 222S over the airframe. I think the big factor is that I had let my wings and fuse sit for a while before spraying with the sealer and then the MEK didn't attack the varnish. I do know that I rushed my center section in varnish AND in applying the sanding sealer and whala, when I tried to cover the MEK softened the varnish so I had to backup, let the center section dry in the house a few days in a warm bedroom (unused room) and then re-applied the sealer, let it sit for a day, then the MEK didn't attack the varnish. Hope this helps, Mike C. At 11:57 AM 11/26/2004 -0800, you wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS > > >Hi Gang! > >Years ago, Mike Cuy started a thread by saying that he had done an end run >around the high cost of using two-part varnishes by applying Minwax Helmsman >urethane varnish to his structure. Mike then applied a light coat of Dupont >222S sanding sealer over that and waited two months for the stuff to cure >before covering. He said that the combination of products and the cure time >provided resistance to the MEK used in the covering materials. Great! Save >a zillion dollars! I'm for that! Later in the same thread someone asked >Mike if the Dupont 222S step was necessary. He said that he didn't know >because he hadn't tried it that way. So, therein lies my question. Has >anybody experimented with using Minwax Helmsman urethane varnish (or >similar) by itself and let it cure for months before covering? Did it >resist the MEK? What was your process? What's the current knowledge in >this subject? > >Does anyone know if POR-15 Blackcote will resist MEK after it has had months >to cure? > >Larry Prange - Getting ready to cover, in the rain, on the Olympic Peninsula >.. . . >NX1929A > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:20:59 PM PST US From: Michael D Cuy Subject: Pietenpol-List: dain't cheap----- Ping Pong Balls 0.37 FORGED_QUALCOMM_TAGS QUALCOMM mailers can't send HTML in this format Corky-- I found a few for you. My wings are full of them for long overwater flights:) Mike C. Lion Bulk 144 practice balls 1d78a51.jpg1d78aca.jpg Practice balls without logo printing. Box of 144 ping pong balls. White or yellow. $28.99/Case1d78b1a.jpg http://www.ballsonline.com/ or------ PING-PONG.COM 40mm box of 144 US$46.95 Price: US$46.95 CAN$56.34 Weight: 3.70 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 04:32:11 PM PST US From: Mike Luther Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mike Luther Larry: How about this for an idea: Urethane varnish all of the wooden surfaces that don't touch the covering and then brush on the two part Epoxy varnish to the surfaces that touch the covering. Then you will be ready to cover in one week assuming you have maintained the proper temperature and humidity ( according to the Poly-Fiber manual.) That was the best compromise that I could come up with that saved some money, time and worry about the covering process. Mike Luther covering in Anchorage, Alaska NX1933M Prange Larry J PSNS wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS > > Hi Gang! > > Years ago, Mike Cuy started a thread by saying that he had done an end run > around the high cost of using two-part varnishes by applying Minwax Helmsman > urethane varnish to his structure. Mike then applied a light coat of Dupont > 222S sanding sealer over that and waited two months for the stuff to cure > before covering. He said that the combination of products and the cure time > provided resistance to the MEK used in the covering materials. Great! Save > a zillion dollars! I'm for that! Later in the same thread someone asked > Mike if the Dupont 222S step was necessary. He said that he didn't know > because he hadn't tried it that way. So, therein lies my question. Has > anybody experimented with using Minwax Helmsman urethane varnish (or > similar) by itself and let it cure for months before covering? Did it > resist the MEK? What was your process? What's the current knowledge in > this subject? > > Does anyone know if POR-15 Blackcote will resist MEK after it has had months > to cure? > > Larry Prange - Getting ready to cover, in the rain, on the Olympic Peninsula > .. . . > NX1929A > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:30:00 PM PST US From: Isablcorky@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy Pieters, I can't find the buoyance table to determine how much weight can be supported in salt water with one (1) 1 gal plactic milk container. Would anyone in the know please send me that figure. Corky, on the bayou ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:36:46 PM PST US From: "Jim Markle" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy How much rain have you been getting????? ----- Original Message ----- From: Isablcorky@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 8:29 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy Pieters, I can't find the buoyance table to determine how much weight can be supported in salt water with one (1) 1 gal plactic milk container. Would anyone in the know please send me that figure. Corky, on the bayou ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:55:36 PM PST US From: "DJ Vegh" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy well it depends on the salt concentration. You need the specific gravity of salt water... about 1.03 now you need to know the weight of a gallon of water - 8.35lbs. so multiply the weight of 1 gal of water by the specific gravity of saltwater to get how much weight can be supported by a gallon jug in salt water roughly 8.6lb this will only make an 8.6lb weight neutrally buoyant. You'd need more volume of air in the bouy (the milk jug) to make something rise and/or stay on top of the surface of the water. DJ ----- Original Message ----- From: Isablcorky@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 7:29 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy Pieters, I can't find the buoyance table to determine how much weight can be supported in salt water with one (1) 1 gal plactic milk container. Would anyone in the know please send me that figure. Corky, on the bayou ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:57:06 PM PST US From: "DJ Vegh" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy another point of interest is that 82 one gallon milk jugs filled with air will keep a typical empty weight Piet from sinking DJ ----- Original Message ----- From: Isablcorky@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 7:29 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy Pieters, I can't find the buoyance table to determine how much weight can be supported in salt water with one (1) 1 gal plactic milk container. Would anyone in the know please send me that figure. Corky, on the bayou ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:18:46 PM PST US From: Isablcorky@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy Thanks DJ and Jim. Now I can proceed with my planning ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:29:44 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: [ Douwe Blumberg ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! From: Email List Photo Shares --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: Douwe Blumberg Lists: Pietenpol-List Subject: Construction Photos of NX799DB http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/douweblumberg@earthlink.net.11.26.2004/index.html o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures@matronics.com ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:28:51 PM PST US From: Clif Dawson Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy <004d01c4d42c$bf087ab0$0100a8c0@Desktop> That's a lot of jugs! How much do the girls weigh? Clif PS. How long can they tread water? Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Buoyancy another point of interest is that 82 one gallon milk jugs filled with air will keep a typical empty weight Piet from sinking DJ