Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:23 AM - List of Contributors Coming Soon! (Matt Dralle)
2. 05:43 AM - Re: Carb Heat (Rcaprd@aol.com)
3. 05:44 AM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/27/04 (Ed Grentzer)
4. 06:38 AM - Re: Carb Heat (Mike Luther)
5. 07:22 AM - Re: Carb Heat (alexms1@comcast.net)
6. 07:35 AM - Re: Icarus Plummet has Plummeted (Isablcorky@aol.com)
7. 07:51 AM - Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals (Michael D Cuy)
8. 08:03 AM - Re: Carb Heat (Phillips, Jack)
9. 08:38 AM - Douwe's photos (Michael D Cuy)
10. 08:49 AM - axle ideas (Michael D Cuy)
11. 09:51 AM - Re: Carb Heat (N321TX@wmconnect.com)
12. 10:05 AM - Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Prange Larry J PSNS)
13. 12:51 PM - [PLEASE READ] Lists Pummelled by Cashette.com Debacle... (Matt Dralle)
14. 01:46 PM - A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa (Michael D Cuy)
15. 01:59 PM - Re: Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Carl Vought)
16. 02:59 PM - Re: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa (DJ Vegh)
17. 03:06 PM - Re: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa (Michael D Cuy)
18. 04:02 PM - Re: Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Jim Markle)
19. 05:26 PM - Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. (Bert Conoly)
20. 05:29 PM - Re: Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Bert Conoly)
21. 05:35 PM - Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. (bike.mike)
22. 05:44 PM - Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. (Jim Markle)
23. 06:08 PM - Weight of salt water (Jim Cooper)
24. 06:22 PM - Re: Carb Heat (Jack Phillips)
25. 06:55 PM - Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. (Eric Williams)
26. 07:18 PM - Re: Carb Heat (alexms1@comcast.net)
27. 07:31 PM - Icarus Plummet (Oscar Zuniga)
28. 08:11 PM - Re: Carb Heat (Clif Dawson)
29. 08:16 PM - Re: Re: Varnishing Alternatives (Clif Dawson)
30. 09:03 PM - Re: Re: Varnishing Alternatives (alexms1@comcast.net)
31. 09:15 PM - Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. (N321TX@wmconnect.com)
32. 09:28 PM - MEK warning (N321TX@wmconnect.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | List of Contributors Coming Soon! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
There are only a couple more days left until the official end of this
year's Matronics List Fund Raiser. At the end of the month I compile and
post a list of all the members that made a Contribution to support the
Lists. Won't you take a moment and make sure your name is on that
list? Its your support that keeps these Lists up and running 24x7x365.
The List Contribution Site is easy and fast and most importantly
secure. You can make your donation with a credit card, PayPal, or by
sending in a personal check. For complete information, please see the URL
below:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you!!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
do not archive
Message 2
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
In a message dated 11/28/04 10:34:25 PM Central Standard Time,
lesmith@roanokeinternet.com writes:
<< I have seen examples of heat exchangers (that's what a heat muff is)
where the exhaust tubing that is encased in the muff has fins welded to
it. >>
Ed,
I really like that idea. I thought about doing that, but I've never seen, or
heard of it. However, nothing is free. The problems I see with this set up,
besides the extra work, is that the muff will chafe on the fins, and the
engine will ingest the chafe, or any rust that builds up as a result of the
welding. I suppose one could solve these challenges by very carefully setting
up
the outer muff so there is no way for it to ever touch the fins, and by doing
some type of ceramic coating on the exhaust pipe, before installing the outer
muff.
Does anyone know if there is fins on any certified exhaust pipes ?
Chuck G.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/27/04 |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed Grentzer" <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
Don ...I made my tail hinges from the 14 gauge X 5/8" material from A/C
spruce for the exact same reason that you have mentioned with the same
reasoning that the 4130 is stronger .. They came out nice and they are way
stronger than the spruce spars that they are bolted to...That was before I
knew that A/C spruce or Wicks would custom cut the 13ga into strips for a
small charge..And before I knew that you can buy ready made aluminum
hinges..making the hinges takes a lot of work and time with each hinge
having four little pieces plus bending, welding and drilling times 9
hinges...And if I had it to do again I would fit the hinges to the spars
before assembling the Stabilizer and elevators ...Hope the input helps but I
would be interested in other builder's opinions on the 14 ga hinges....Ed G.
in Fl....Just finished my female mold and Ready to lay up my composite 12
gallon cowl tank...Sorry to hear about your plummet Jack...But glad you
missed those wires!!!
>From: ADonJr@aol.com
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/27/04
>Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 00:53:05 EST
>
>Hey, Group,
> I am ready to build the tail surfaces and have a question about the
>steel fittings. The plans call for 5/8 x 13 gauge steel. The chart says
>that 13
>gauge is .09". Aircraft Spruce sells 5/8 inch strap up to .08" thickness.
>My understanding is that 4130 is stronger than the mild steel Pietenpol
>had
>available. If this is correct, would it be reasonable to use the .08"
>steel?
>It involves a considerable savings in labor if it is safe. What say you?
> Don Cooley
Message 4
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mike Luther <luther@gci.net>
Hi guys:
I know of a couple of ways to get some extra heat from your muff: One way is to
stuff your muff with some stainless steel scrub bud pads, like the ones used for
doing dishes or another way is to use some door spring and wrap the exhaust pipe
before putting on your muff.
Mike Luther
NX1953M
Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 11/28/04 10:34:25 PM Central Standard Time,
> lesmith@roanokeinternet.com writes:
>
> << I have seen examples of heat exchangers (that's what a heat muff is)
> where the exhaust tubing that is encased in the muff has fins welded to
> it. >>
>
> Ed,
> I really like that idea. I thought about doing that, but I've never seen, or
> heard of it. However, nothing is free. The problems I see with this set up,
> besides the extra work, is that the muff will chafe on the fins, and the
> engine will ingest the chafe, or any rust that builds up as a result of the
> welding. I suppose one could solve these challenges by very carefully setting
up
> the outer muff so there is no way for it to ever touch the fins, and by doing
> some type of ceramic coating on the exhaust pipe, before installing the outer
> muff.
> Does anyone know if there is fins on any certified exhaust pipes ?
>
> Chuck G.
>
>
Message 5
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On the carb ice heat muff thing, I recall reading Tony Bingelis suggesting wrapping
door springs around the exhaust stacks under the heat muff. Has any one
tried this?.
Alex S.
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 11/28/04 10:34:25 PM Central Standard Time,
> lesmith@roanokeinternet.com writes:
>
> << I have seen examples of heat exchangers (that's what a heat muff is)
> where the exhaust tubing that is encased in the muff has fins welded to
> it. >>
>
> Ed,
> I really like that idea. I thought about doing that, but I've never seen, or
> heard of it. However, nothing is free. The problems I see with this set up,
> besides the extra work, is that the muff will chafe on the fins, and the
> engine will ingest the chafe, or any rust that builds up as a result of the
> welding. I suppose one could solve these challenges by very carefully setting
> up
> the outer muff so there is no way for it to ever touch the fins, and by doing
> some type of ceramic coating on the exhaust pipe, before installing the outer
> muff.
> Does anyone know if there is fins on any certified exhaust pipes ?
>
> Chuck G.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
On thecarb ice heat muff thing, I recall reading Tony Bingelis suggesting wrapping
door springs around the exhaust stacks under the heat muff. Has any one tried
this?.
Alex S.
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
In a message dated 11/28/04 10:34:25 PM Central Standard Time,
lesmith@roanokeinternet.com writes:
I have seen examples of heat exchangers (that's what a heat muff is)
where the exhaust tubing that is encased in the muff has fins welded to
it.
Ed,
I really like that idea. I thought about doing that, but I've never seen, or
heard of it. However, nothing is free. The problems I see with this set up,
besides the extra work, is that the muff will chafe on the fins, and the
engine will ingest the chafe, or any rust that builds up as a result of the
welding. I suppose one could solve these challenges by very carefully setting
up <B
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Icarus Plummet has Plummeted |
Chuck,
Since you and others have asked HOW I altered the heat muff for better
efficiency, honestly I had to stop to remember exactly how I did it. My memory
is
much like that ole grey mare.
That supply house muff for the 7AC has the intake and outlet air flanges
opposite the other. Air is free to pass through without picking up much heat from
the stacks. I took a piece of sheet metal, SS or alum I don't remember,
drilled some holes for the bolts of the muff and tried to block that direct in
to
out passage so the air flow would pass over more stack. I'll ask Oscar to take
a
look at the muff to be sure. Anyway, I think we all agree that it's
inadequate heating whether flying along the Rio Grande, North Carolina, Colorado
or a
flight to Beliese.
Corky, trying to get the wheels turning on the bayou
Message 7
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| Subject: | Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Corky & Group-- A small item of BIG importance that some omit in the carb
heat setup on Champ-type stacks
is a sheet metal triangle that is fixed in between the "Y" of the exhaust
stacks prior to the heat muff being installed.
This triangle of metal forces the fresh air (from a scoop fixed to the side
of the muff) around the stacks and increases
the 'travel time' of the air to make sure the temp. is up where you need
it. A tab or three can be welded to the stacks
to hold this triangle in place. Would not have known this had I not done
annuals w/ my partner on our old Champ.
I asked Joe what the plate/triangle was for and he explained.
Jack-- many thanks are being given here for your safe return to mother
earth and a repairable Pietenpol.
Also I'm having concerns now about my big idea to keep the axle from
turning under braking action. I know my axle is
the same wall thickness as Frank Pavliga's Sky Gypsy as I pirated as much
info/ideas from him as possible.....and it's a very
thick wall. My guess is approximately 0.20-0.25" thick.
Mike C.
Message 8
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <jphillip@alarismed.com>
Those stainless steel scrub pads are what I used, that I suspect caused
my forced landing. I had packed them tightly in the heat muff, but when
I checked yesterday they were gone. I will pull the carburetor tonight
and expect to find them scrubbing the inside of my carburetor's throat.
I would humbly suggest using something else to increase heat transfer.
Jack
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Luther [mailto:luther@gci.net]
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Carb Heat
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mike Luther <luther@gci.net>
Hi guys:
I know of a couple of ways to get some extra heat from your muff: One
way is to stuff your muff with some stainless steel scrub bud pads, like
the ones used for doing dishes or another way is to use some door spring
and wrap the exhaust pipe before putting on your muff.
Mike Luther
NX1953M
Rcaprd@aol.com wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Rcaprd@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 11/28/04 10:34:25 PM Central Standard Time,
> lesmith@roanokeinternet.com writes:
>
> << I have seen examples of heat exchangers (that's what a heat muff
> is) where the exhaust tubing that is encased in the muff has fins
> welded to it. >>
>
> Ed,
> I really like that idea. I thought about doing that, but I've never
> seen, or heard of it. However, nothing is free. The problems I see
> with this set up, besides the extra work, is that the muff will chafe
> on the fins, and the engine will ingest the chafe, or any rust that
> builds up as a result of the welding. I suppose one could solve these
> challenges by very carefully setting up the outer muff so there is no
> way for it to ever touch the fins, and by doing some type of ceramic
> coating on the exhaust pipe, before installing the outer muff. Does
> anyone know if there is fins on any certified exhaust pipes ?
>
> Chuck G.
>
>
Message 9
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Wow Douwe--- some beautiful craftsmanship and details ! Post more photos
anytime. They were a real pleasure to see !
thanks !
Mike C.
do not archive
At 07:29 PM 11/26/2004 -0800, you wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares
><pictures@matronics.com>
>
>
>A new Email List Photo Share is available:
>
> Poster: Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
>
>
> Subject: Construction Photos of NX799DB
>
>
>http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/douweblumberg@earthlink.net.11.26.2004/index.html
>
>
> o Main Photo Share Index
>
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
>
> o Submitting a Photo Share
>
> If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
> following information along with your email message and files:
>
> 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
> 2) Your Full Name:
> 3) Your Email Address:
> 4) One line Subject description:
> 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
> 6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
>
> Email the information above and your files and photos to:
>
> pictures@matronics.com
>
>
Message 10
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Jack----I suspect that your .120" wall thickness might have played a part
in your axle difficulty.
Mine are .20 to .25" and I only welded the guide tube to the bottom of the
axle--no holes drilled in
the axle itself at all. I didn't like the idea of drilling and weakening
the structure there.
Mike C.
Message 11
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I visited with my dad today and mentioned this rash of forced landings due to
carb ice. (My dad retired with 5 type ratings, 25,000 hours and an A&P
license and was a crop duster after WW2) I figure anyone who has flown this long
and
lived to tell about it has some merit in their observations about flying
experience and things mechanical.
Although he is 85, he remembers problems associated with carb ice as being
more prone to car gas and he said that 100LL tends to be safer than mogas when
humidity levels are high. He started mentioning something technical, but I had
to dodge a deer on the road and my mind wandered off the subject matter...
I wonder if the previous problems of the last few months with downed Piets
were associated with folks who were using mogas?
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Varnishing Alternatives |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS <prangel@psns.navy.mil>
Hey Carl!
Did you use 'Minwax Helmsman Urethane Varnish' (in the green can, cleans up
with paint thinner) or did you use 'Minwax Polyurethane Varnish' (in the
blue can, cleans up with water)?
Thanks,
Larry Prange - Still think'n about it.
NX1929A
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
I have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the fuse
and wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty with
lifting...My $.02..Carl Vought
Message 13
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| Subject: | [PLEASE READ] Lists Pummelled by Cashette.com Debacle... |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Listers,
Just a quick note to say that I've caught the great Cashette.Com debacle of
2004 and have tried to clean out all of the pending List email queues of
all the "you are not yet on my Approved List" messages. There were about
117 of them queued when I noticed what was going on.
In a nutshell, this guy signed up for all of the Lists and had a "register
with my site" spam filter enabled on his account. When his account started
receiving List messages, it started sending back, "you need to register"
messages back to the various Lists which in turn went to the Lists which in
turn got sent to the same spam filter which in turn sent back a message
indicating that the List needed to register, and so on and so on until, I
suppose, the Internet just blew up! Sheeze, some of these spam systems are
so brain dead!
Anyway, I've cleaned out all of the messages generated by this thing and
put in a permanent block from this cashette.com website so that this
shouldn't be a problem any longer.
Back to Airplane Discussions! :-)
Matt Dralle
List Administrator
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
do not archive
Message 14
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| Subject: | A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa |
0.26 UPPERCASE_25_50 message body is 25-50% uppercase
Well I'll be-----check this out !
http://www.ahasa.org.za/members_pics.htm
and http://www.ahasa.org.za/
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Varnishing Alternatives |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
The "Helmsman" part doesn't show up on the can. It thins and cleans up with
mineral sperits..no water involved and the can is golden colored. Otherwise,
the product nomenclature is as shown in my previous email....good
luck.....Carl
----- Original Message -----
From: "Prange Larry J PSNS" <prangel@psns.navy.mil>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS
<prangel@psns.navy.mil>
>
> Hey Carl!
>
> Did you use 'Minwax Helmsman Urethane Varnish' (in the green can, cleans
up
> with paint thinner) or did you use 'Minwax Polyurethane Varnish' (in the
> blue can, cleans up with water)?
>
> Thanks,
> Larry Prange - Still think'n about it.
> NX1929A
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
>
> I have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the
fuse
> and wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty with
> lifting...My $.02..Carl Vought
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
wow... look how long that engine mount is!
I wonder how it performs
DJ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa
> Well I'll be-----check this out !
>
> http://www.ahasa.org.za/members_pics.htm
>
> and http://www.ahasa.org.za/
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
DJ-- upon closer inspection of that airplane it's actually a single seat
Pietenpol Scout.
Mike C.
At 03:59 PM 11/29/2004 -0700, you wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
>
>wow... look how long that engine mount is!
>
>I wonder how it performs
>
>DJ
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D Cuy"
><Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 2:44 PM
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa
>
>
>>Well I'll be-----check this out !
>>
>>http://www.ahasa.org.za/members_pics.htm
>>
>>and http://www.ahasa.org.za/
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Varnishing Alternatives |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman
Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can, cleans
up with paint thinner).....
I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for a
while....
No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....
Looks fine to me.....
Jim Markle
Senior Sales Engineer
Art Technology Group - ATG
:jim@atg.com
*+1.469.371.0669
'+1.972.447.8330
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Prange Larry
J PSNS
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS
<prangel@psns.navy.mil>
Hey Carl!
Did you use 'Minwax Helmsman Urethane Varnish' (in the green can, cleans up
with paint thinner) or did you use 'Minwax Polyurethane Varnish' (in the
blue can, cleans up with water)?
Thanks,
Larry Prange - Still think'n about it.
NX1929A
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
I have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the fuse
and wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty with
lifting...My $.02..Carl Vought
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bert Conoly" <bconoly@earthlink.net>
Speaking of carb heat. I've had a problem with my engine going dead when I
pull carb heat for several weeks. That is, during normal run-up (1500 RPM),
I switch to left mag, then right mag. All's fine and normal with 50-75 RPM
drop. Reach up and over the throttle, grab the carb heat and pull - -
engine drops to idle and nearly quits before I recover by pushing in carb
heat. I checked everything. The heat box is fine, SCAT tubing fine, damper
in the airbox works fine.... What's going on here?
I asked 3 different A&Ps and they scratched their heads, too. Figured it
out today - so simple it's embarrasing. But it shows how easy it is to
fixate on something and miss the easy answer.
Anybody want to guess what it turned out to be?
Bert
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
<Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>
> Corky & Group-- A small item of BIG importance that some omit in the carb
> heat setup on Champ-type stacks
> is a sheet metal triangle that is fixed in between the "Y" of the exhaust
> stacks prior to the heat muff being installed.
> This triangle of metal forces the fresh air (from a scoop fixed to the
side
> of the muff) around the stacks and increases
> the 'travel time' of the air to make sure the temp. is up where you need
> it. A tab or three can be welded to the stacks
> to hold this triangle in place. Would not have known this had I not done
> annuals w/ my partner on our old Champ.
> I asked Joe what the plate/triangle was for and he explained.
>
> Jack-- many thanks are being given here for your safe return to mother
> earth and a repairable Pietenpol.
>
> Also I'm having concerns now about my big idea to keep the axle from
> turning under braking action. I know my axle is
> the same wall thickness as Frank Pavliga's Sky Gypsy as I pirated as much
> info/ideas from him as possible.....and it's a very
> thick wall. My guess is approximately 0.20-0.25" thick.
>
> Mike C.
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Varnishing Alternatives |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bert Conoly" <bconoly@earthlink.net>
C'mon Jim. You know that Helmsman is not NEARLY expensive enough to protect
against MEK....
Therefore it should not be used on airplanes
;>)
Bert
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle"
<jim_markle@mindspring.com>
>
>
> I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman
> Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can,
cleans
> up with paint thinner).....
>
> I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for
a
> while....
>
> No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....
>
> Looks fine to me.....
>
> Jim Markle
> Senior Sales Engineer
> Art Technology Group - ATG
>
> :jim@atg.com
> *+1.469.371.0669
> '+1.972.447.8330
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Prange
Larry
> J PSNS
> Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 12:05 PM
> To: 'pietenpol-list@matronics.com'
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Prange Larry J PSNS
> <prangel@psns.navy.mil>
>
> Hey Carl!
>
> Did you use 'Minwax Helmsman Urethane Varnish' (in the green can, cleans
up
> with paint thinner) or did you use 'Minwax Polyurethane Varnish' (in the
> blue can, cleans up with water)?
>
> Thanks,
> Larry Prange - Still think'n about it.
> NX1929A
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Carl Vought" <carbarvo@knology.net>
>
> I have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the
fuse
> and wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty with
> lifting...My $.02..Carl Vought
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "bike.mike" <bike.mike@verizon.net>
Were you bumping the throttle, Bert?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bert Conoly" <bconoly@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved.
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bert Conoly"
<bconoly@earthlink.net>
>
> Speaking of carb heat. I've had a problem with my engine going dead when
I
> pull carb heat for several weeks. That is, during normal run-up (1500
RPM),
> I switch to left mag, then right mag. All's fine and normal with 50-75
RPM
> drop. Reach up and over the throttle, grab the carb heat and pull - -
> engine drops to idle and nearly quits before I recover by pushing in carb
> heat. I checked everything. The heat box is fine, SCAT tubing fine,
damper
> in the airbox works fine.... What's going on here?
>
> I asked 3 different A&Ps and they scratched their heads, too. Figured
it
> out today - so simple it's embarrasing. But it shows how easy it is to
> fixate on something and miss the easy answer.
>
> Anybody want to guess what it turned out to be?
>
> Bert
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:51 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
> <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> >
> > Corky & Group-- A small item of BIG importance that some omit in the
carb
> > heat setup on Champ-type stacks
> > is a sheet metal triangle that is fixed in between the "Y" of the
exhaust
> > stacks prior to the heat muff being installed.
> > This triangle of metal forces the fresh air (from a scoop fixed to the
> side
> > of the muff) around the stacks and increases
> > the 'travel time' of the air to make sure the temp. is up where you need
> > it. A tab or three can be welded to the stacks
> > to hold this triangle in place. Would not have known this had I not
done
> > annuals w/ my partner on our old Champ.
> > I asked Joe what the plate/triangle was for and he explained.
> >
> > Jack-- many thanks are being given here for your safe return to mother
> > earth and a repairable Pietenpol.
> >
> > Also I'm having concerns now about my big idea to keep the axle from
> > turning under braking action. I know my axle is
> > the same wall thickness as Frank Pavliga's Sky Gypsy as I pirated as
much
> > info/ideas from him as possible.....and it's a very
> > thick wall. My guess is approximately 0.20-0.25" thick.
> >
> > Mike C.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
Hmmm, interesting. You reach UP and OVER the throttle cable...how close are
they to each other? TOO close? Cables rubbing? Shirt sleeve hanging on
the throttle cable?
What's happening to the air getting to the carb when the damper moves?
I would LOVE to get my hands on it and see for myself!
I for one have GOT to know what's up!!! :-)
Maybe an offline answer so I can sleep tonite?????
:-)
Jim Markle
Senior Sales Engineer
Art Technology Group - ATG
:jim@atg.com
*+1.469.371.0669
'+1.972.447.8330
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bert Conoly
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved.
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bert Conoly" <bconoly@earthlink.net>
Speaking of carb heat. I've had a problem with my engine going dead when I
pull carb heat for several weeks. That is, during normal run-up (1500 RPM),
I switch to left mag, then right mag. All's fine and normal with 50-75 RPM
drop. Reach up and over the throttle, grab the carb heat and pull - -
engine drops to idle and nearly quits before I recover by pushing in carb
heat. I checked everything. The heat box is fine, SCAT tubing fine, damper
in the airbox works fine.... What's going on here?
I asked 3 different A&Ps and they scratched their heads, too. Figured it
out today - so simple it's embarrasing. But it shows how easy it is to
fixate on something and miss the easy answer.
Anybody want to guess what it turned out to be?
Bert
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
<Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>
> Corky & Group-- A small item of BIG importance that some omit in the carb
> heat setup on Champ-type stacks
> is a sheet metal triangle that is fixed in between the "Y" of the exhaust
> stacks prior to the heat muff being installed.
> This triangle of metal forces the fresh air (from a scoop fixed to the
side
> of the muff) around the stacks and increases
> the 'travel time' of the air to make sure the temp. is up where you need
> it. A tab or three can be welded to the stacks
> to hold this triangle in place. Would not have known this had I not done
> annuals w/ my partner on our old Champ.
> I asked Joe what the plate/triangle was for and he explained.
>
> Jack-- many thanks are being given here for your safe return to mother
> earth and a repairable Pietenpol.
>
> Also I'm having concerns now about my big idea to keep the axle from
> turning under braking action. I know my axle is
> the same wall thickness as Frank Pavliga's Sky Gypsy as I pirated as much
> info/ideas from him as possible.....and it's a very
> thick wall. My guess is approximately 0.20-0.25" thick.
>
> Mike C.
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Weight of salt water |
Claude Corbett <Isablcorky@aol.com>
Corky: I'm not sure what the weight of salt water is per gallon because it depends
on the salinity - possibly as much as 9 pounds. Fresh water weighs about 8.34
pounds per gallon. Those familiar with drilling oil wells (and dry holes)
may be able to back me up on this ( I have been involved with both, mostly the
latter). Mud weights used in drilling are based on pounds per gallon. Normal
subsurface pressures equal the weight of fresh water per gallon times the depth.
82 gallon jugs filled with 9 pound salt water would weigh 738 pounds. 82 gallon
jugs with 8.34 pound fresh water would weigh 684 pounds. Both figures are
in the ball park for the empty weight of a Piet.
Hope this helps. Jim Cooper
Message 24
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Here is what those stainless steel wool scrubbing pads look like after you
pull them out of your carburetor:
Jack Phillips
Icarus Plummet
* > Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mike Luther <luther@gci.net>
Hi guys:
I know of a couple of ways to get some extra heat from your muff: One way
is to stuff your muff with some stainless steel scrub bud pads, like the
ones used for doing dishes or another way is to use some door spring and
wrap the exhaust pipe before putting on your muff.
Mike Luther
NX1953M
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Eric Williams" <ewilliams805@msn.com>
Pulling the Mixture knob?
>From: "Bert Conoly" <bconoly@earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved.
>Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 20:25:44 -0500
>
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bert Conoly" <bconoly@earthlink.net>
>
>Speaking of carb heat. I've had a problem with my engine going dead when I
>pull carb heat for several weeks. That is, during normal run-up (1500
>RPM),
>I switch to left mag, then right mag. All's fine and normal with 50-75
>RPM
>drop. Reach up and over the throttle, grab the carb heat and pull - -
>engine drops to idle and nearly quits before I recover by pushing in carb
>heat. I checked everything. The heat box is fine, SCAT tubing fine,
>damper
>in the airbox works fine.... What's going on here?
>
> I asked 3 different A&Ps and they scratched their heads, too. Figured
>it
>out today - so simple it's embarrasing. But it shows how easy it is to
>fixate on something and miss the easy answer.
>
>Anybody want to guess what it turned out to be?
>
>Bert
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Michael D Cuy" <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:51 AM
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
><Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
> >
> > Corky & Group-- A small item of BIG importance that some omit in the
>carb
> > heat setup on Champ-type stacks
> > is a sheet metal triangle that is fixed in between the "Y" of the
>exhaust
> > stacks prior to the heat muff being installed.
> > This triangle of metal forces the fresh air (from a scoop fixed to the
>side
> > of the muff) around the stacks and increases
> > the 'travel time' of the air to make sure the temp. is up where you need
> > it. A tab or three can be welded to the stacks
> > to hold this triangle in place. Would not have known this had I not
>done
> > annuals w/ my partner on our old Champ.
> > I asked Joe what the plate/triangle was for and he explained.
> >
> > Jack-- many thanks are being given here for your safe return to mother
> > earth and a repairable Pietenpol.
> >
> > Also I'm having concerns now about my big idea to keep the axle from
> > turning under braking action. I know my axle is
> > the same wall thickness as Frank Pavliga's Sky Gypsy as I pirated as
>much
> > info/ideas from him as possible.....and it's a very
> > thick wall. My guess is approximately 0.20-0.25" thick.
> >
> > Mike C.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 26
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|
Pieters,
My experience with mogas in my RV-3 was vapor lock. When it got near 72 this occurred.
Found that 5 gal. of avgas with 20 gal of mogas stopped it. Never had
carb ice with the Lycoming 0-320.
Alex S.
-------------- Original message --------------
I visited with my dad today and mentioned this rash of forced landings due to carb
ice. (My dad retired with 5 type ratings, 25,000 hours and an A&P license
and was a crop duster after WW2) I figure anyone who has flown this long and lived
to tell about it has some merit in their observations about flying experience
and things mechanical.
Although he is 85, he remembers problems associated with carb ice as being more
prone to car gas and he said that 100LL tends to be safer than mogas when humidity
levels are high. He started mentioning something technical, but I had to
dodge a deer on the road and my mind wandered off the subject matter...
I wonder if the previous problems of the last few months with downed Piets were
associated with folks who were using mogas?
Pieters,
My experience with mogas in my RV-3 was vapor lock. When it got near 72 this occurred.
Found that 5 gal. of avgas with 20 gal of mogas stopped it. Never had
carb ice with the Lycoming 0-320.
Alex S.
-------------- Original message --------------
I visited with my dad today and mentioned this rash of forced landings due to carb
ice. (My dad retired with 5 type ratings, 25,000 hours and an AP license and
was a crop duster after WW2) I figure anyone who has flown this long and lived
to tell about it has some merit in their observations about flying experience
and things mechanical.
Although he is 85, he remembers problems associated with carb ice as being more
prone to car gas and he said that 100LL tends to be safer than mogas when humidity
levels are high. He started mentioning something technical, but I had to
dodge a deer on the road and my mind wandered off the subject matter...
I wonder if the previous problems of the last few months with downed Piets were
associated with folks who were using mogas?
Message 27
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|
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Jack;
Lift a cold mug with me and join the "Clipped Wing Club". But we shall fly
another day, and learn in the process. At the moment, I'm looking at a set
of Cessna 120/140 exhausts that should bolt right onto 41CC. I'll report on
what I find out.
Meantime, just recall how many "experiments" Mr. Pietenpol endured as he
developed this airplane. Forced landings, engine-outs, experiments, and
teaching himself how to fly the airplane... at least we have the benefit of
shared knowledge, "how to land a Pietenpol" narratives, flight sequence
videos, and all the rest to minimize the number of unplanned excursions from
controlled flight!
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 28
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
So now we know that scrub pads don't work! I've now erased
that stuff out of my muff drawings.
If you want to go the door spring route it might be better to go
to your local potter's supply and check out the nichrome element
coils used in electric kilns, expensive but virtually indestructible
at exhaust temps. You could also use the coils out of older driers
like Speed Queen but the alloy is not as tough although still good
into the light orange heat range.
Clif
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Carb Heat
> Here is what those stainless steel wool scrubbing pads look like after you
> pull them out of your carburetor:
>
> Jack Phillips
> Icarus Plummet
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Varnishing Alternatives |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make
sure you specify the one below.
Clif
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
>
> I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman
> Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can,
cleans
> up with paint thinner).....
>
> I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for
a
> while....
>
> No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....
>
> Looks fine to me.....
>
> Jim Markle
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: Varnishing Alternatives |
My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, will the glue
hold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?
AlexS
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson
>
> I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make
> sure you specify the one below.
>
> Clif
>
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
>
>
> >
> > I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman
> > Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can,
> cleans
> > up with paint thinner).....
> >
> > I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for
> a
> > while....
> >
> > No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....
> >
> > Looks fine to me.....
> >
> > Jim Markle
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, will the glue
hold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?
AlexS
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@SHAW.CA>
I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make
sure you specify the one below.
Clif
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman
Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can,
cleans
up with paint thinner).....
I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for
a
while....
No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....
Looks fine t
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Carb heat w/ 65 Continentals - Mystery Solved. |
Are you running Mogas or 100LL?
Message 32
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When my father met with his second oncologist (after having had colon cancer
last year and now liver cancer) the doctor asked him if he had a history of
being exposed to solvents, especially MEK. I started looking around on a few
websites, and found a lot of "smoking guns" in regard to a link between MEK and
cancer. Needless to say, I use MEK impervious gloves and PPE when working
with this stuff and I try and keep a good flow of fresh air going in and out of
my hanger when around this stuff. No wonder everyone charges a substantial
hazmat fee when shipping MEK.
S.B.
5TA6 San Antonio Sectional
(NOTAMS... fresh cowchips on runway, land at your own risk)
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