Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:59 AM - Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. (Michael D Cuy)
2. 06:05 AM - here is the link....... (Michael D Cuy)
3. 06:13 AM - Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. (N925WB1@aol.com)
4. 06:33 AM - Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. (Phillips, Jack)
5. 06:55 AM - Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. (DJ Vegh)
6. 10:20 AM - Aeropoxy over West System? Compatibility? (N321TX@wmconnect.com)
7. 12:51 PM - Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. (N925WB1@aol.com)
8. 01:54 PM - Re: LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements (Frank Metcalfe)
9. 02:27 PM - Re: LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements (DJ Vegh)
10. 03:03 PM - Re: Aeropoxy over West System? Compatibility? (gbowen@ptialaska.net)
11. 03:18 PM - Glue Joints (TBYH@aol.com)
12. 06:59 PM - Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. (Cinda Gadd)
Message 1
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Subject: | Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. |
d2$2c7c8b50$0564a8c0@rdci.az.home.com><423628CC.4050200@dp.net>
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
I like how the seller calls this a Pietenpol Air Camper when it is
not....and the fact that he says "easily repaired"
and "light wing damage". Oh right-----take a look at the photos. I
would steer way clear of this baby.
Mike C.
Message 2
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Subject: | here is the link....... |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4534270000&category=63677&sspagename=WDVW
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. |
Yo Mike,
Looks like an Aircamper to me... I thought the major difference was that
the GN-1 had a steel tube fuselage. This one's wood. I'm no expert, though,
so I readily admit ignorance if I a wrong. ;)
Anyway, I agree that this thing is crazy scary. Definitely NOT worth the
$6,500 buy-it-now price, or the current bid price of $4,000!!! Some people are
just suckers for a "good deal", and don't do their homework before they open
their wallets. Too bad...
-Wayne
In a message dated 3/15/2005 8:00:09 AM Central Standard Time,
Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov writes:
I like how the seller calls this a Pietenpol Air Camper when it is
not....and the fact that he says "easily repaired"
and "light wing damage". Oh right-----take a look at the photos. I
would steer way clear of this baby.
Mike C.
Message 4
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Subject: | Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. |
GN-1s can be built with steel or wood fuselages, just like Pietenpols.
This one is definitely a GN-1. I wouldn't touch this one with a 10'
pole. If the lift strut fittings borke, the spars are definitely
suspect. With a broken prop, I would always wonder about the engine
(even though wood props supposedly take the strain that a metal prop
would impart to the crankshaft).
Jack Phillips
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
N925WB1@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas.
Yo Mike,
Looks like an Aircamper to me... I thought the major difference was
that the GN-1 had a steel tube fuselage. This one's wood. I'm no
expert, though, so I readily admit ignorance if I a wrong. ;)
Anyway, I agree that this thing is crazy scary. Definitely NOT worth
the $6,500 buy-it-now price, or the current bid price of $4,000!!! Some
people are just suckers for a "good deal", and don't do their homework
before they open their wallets. Too bad...
-Wayne
In a message dated 3/15/2005 8:00:09 AM Central Standard Time,
Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov writes:
I like how the seller calls this a Pietenpol Air Camper when it is
not....and the fact that he says "easily repaired"
and "light wing damage". Oh right-----take a look at the photos. I
would steer way clear of this baby.
Mike C.
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. |
the easiest way to tell a GN-1 from a Piet is the landing gear. On the Piet the
front and rear tubes of the gear meet up at the lift struts. On a GN-1 the
rear tube meets the fuselage in front of the rear lift strut. Thats because
GN-1's use a J-3 landing gear.
And yes... this one look spretty scary indeed. I'd give about $3000 for it.
----- Original Message -----
From: N925WB1@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 7:13 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas.
Yo Mike,
Looks like an Aircamper to me... I thought the major difference was that the
GN-1 had a steel tube fuselage. This one's wood. I'm no expert, though, so
I readily admit ignorance if I a wrong. ;)
Anyway, I agree that this thing is crazy scary. Definitely NOT worth the $6,500
buy-it-now price, or the current bid price of $4,000!!! Some people are just
suckers for a "good deal", and don't do their homework before they open their
wallets. Too bad...
-Wayne
In a message dated 3/15/2005 8:00:09 AM Central Standard Time, Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov
writes:
I like how the seller calls this a Pietenpol Air Camper when it is
not....and the fact that he says "easily repaired"
and "light wing damage". Oh right-----take a look at the photos. I
would steer way clear of this baby.
Mike C.
Message 6
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Subject: | Aeropoxy over West System? Compatibility? |
Does anyone have any experience in using Aeropoxy OVER West System? I need to
add a couple of layers of fiberglass cloth on a fuel tank and I've run
bone-dry on West System epoxy resin and hardener but I have a fresh supply of
Aeropoxy PR2032 resin and PH3660 hardener (originally intended for something
else...)
Thanks,
S.B.
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. |
DJ,
Thanks for clearing that up for me. I learn something new all the time from
this list, even if I am just a casual observer!
BTW - I would assume then that the Pietenpol rear LG strut arrangement would
be stonger than that of the GN-1, as the landing loads would be trasmitted
throught the attach fittings, into the wing struts, through the wings, and
then back down on the other side, thereby creating a box (similar to a biplane
wing configuration) ; whereas the GN-1 loads would be completely absorbed by
the lower longeron, putting in it shear between the rear LG attach fitting,
and the rear strut attach point. Just a thought.
-Wayne
In a message dated 3/15/2005 8:56:09 AM Central Standard Time,
djv@imagedv.com writes:
the easiest way to tell a GN-1 from a Piet is the landing gear. On the
Piet the front and rear tubes of the gear meet up at the lift struts. On a
GN-1 the rear tube meets the fuselage in front of the rear lift strut. Thats
because GN-1's use a J-3 landing gear.
And yes... this one look spretty scary indeed. I'd give about $3000 for it.
Message 8
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Subject: | LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Frank Metcalfe" <fmetcalf@bellsouth.net>
Yes he will have to have and endorsement and if you have a tailwheel
endorement with your CFI you will be able to sgin him off...But only in LSP
aircraft
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Subject: Pietenpol-List: LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
My uncle is currently a Student Pilot with about 12 hours.
He wants to stop training for a Private Pilot certificate, buy a LSA and
get a Sport Pilot certificate. We were talking and I told him that I am
seriously looking into getting my Sport Pilot Instructors certificate. If I
did I'd teach him in his aircraft.... BUT,
I'm wondering.... if he gets a taildragger (like a Kolb or Kitfox, etc.)
will he need a tailwheel endorsement?? and if so, would I (being a Sport
Pilot Instructor) be able to endorse him for tailwheel flight in his
airplane?
I'll give 1 minute of free advice (estimated value $.02) to anyone who can
answer my question ;)
DJ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
N74DV
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
thanks that's what I was thinking. I do have my endorsement so it looks
like all will be good.
DJ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Metcalfe" <fmetcalf@bellsouth.net>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Frank Metcalfe"
<fmetcalf@bellsouth.net>
>
> Yes he will have to have and endorsement and if you have a tailwheel
> endorement with your CFI you will be able to sgin him off...But only in
LSP
> aircraft
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
> Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 3:13 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: LSA regs and tailwheell endorsements
>
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" <djv@imagedv.com>
>
> My uncle is currently a Student Pilot with about 12 hours.
>
> He wants to stop training for a Private Pilot certificate, buy a LSA and
> get a Sport Pilot certificate. We were talking and I told him that I am
> seriously looking into getting my Sport Pilot Instructors certificate. If
I
> did I'd teach him in his aircraft.... BUT,
>
> I'm wondering.... if he gets a taildragger (like a Kolb or Kitfox, etc.)
> will he need a tailwheel endorsement?? and if so, would I (being a Sport
> Pilot Instructor) be able to endorse him for tailwheel flight in his
> airplane?
>
> I'll give 1 minute of free advice (estimated value $.02) to anyone who can
> answer my question ;)
>
> DJ
> www.imagedv.com/aircamper
> N74DV
>
>
Message 10
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Subject: | Aeropoxy over West System? Compatibility? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "gbowen@ptialaska.net" <gbowen@ptialaska.net>
I've used both these systems over the years plus analyzed them as
competitors for composites applications. There would not be any problem of
using either of these two systems. Aeropoxy was one of the two systems
approved by Rutan for integral fuel tanks on his canard-pusher designed
homebuilts, and has functioned for close to 15 years. West is used mainly
in the marine industry and is used for fuel tanks. One tip- if the
epoxy/glass laminate you're trying to bond something to is shiny, you gotta
sand the surface to about 80 grit to get the next layer of epoxy/glass to
bond properly.
Gordon Bowen
Original Message:
-----------------
From: N321TX@wmconnect.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aeropoxy over West System? Compatibility?
Does anyone have any experience in using Aeropoxy OVER West System? I need
to
add a couple of layers of fiberglass cloth on a fuel tank and I've run
bone-dry on West System epoxy resin and hardener but I have a fresh supply
of
Aeropoxy PR2032 resin and PH3660 hardener (originally intended for
something
else...)
Thanks,
S.B.
Message 11
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|
Another thing that I do when gluing joints, using West System epoxy, is to
make a series of little indentations on each side of the joint using the corner
edge of my wood chisel. This gives the joint some more surface area and
"teeth." Seems to work very well.
When I started building my Piet I made a test joint of 1-inch by 1-inch
spruce in a typical longeron and upright joint with 1/8-inch ply gusset on=20both
sides. After only 24 hours I could not break the joint and so gave it to my
powerlifter son. Understand that he can squat or dead lift 500 pounds seemingly
easier than I can lift 50 pounds! He could not separate the joint. I then took
a
hammer to the joint and only succeeded in breaking away the unsupported
gusset material. I have determined that this glue and method is airworthy --- not
to mention that thousands of homebuilders have been using West System for years
under all kinds of conditions. But I've found that with all things having to
do with airplanes, it doesn't hurt to be a little nervous...
I started making the landing gear struts out of white ash the other day. What
made it special is that I'm using my great-grandfather's 1882 drawknife to
rough shape the leading and trailing edges of the white ash=E2=80=94basically just
rounding off the corners but with a little more taper to the rear. (Wonder what
great-gramps would think of building an airplane=E2=80=94or airplanes in general!)
A drawknife works very well for this task as long as it is sharp and you work
with the grain. (White ash will tell you very quickly if you're going against
the grain.) I really felt a connection with the "old timers" using this method
=E2=80=94no shrieking, growling power tools. Just a quiet swish, swish of sharp
steel. Very relaxing. But don't relax with a drawknife -- you wouldn't want=20to
cut
off an important body part -- or stain that beautiful wood by bleeding all
over it!
Just think! Only four months, one week and a day or so to Brodhead '05! "Git
'er done!"
Fred B.
Message 12
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s=test1; d=earthlink.net;
b=kL+3b98ITazK1DZJZ/yUUiwHYSavmsZWq4If13VEIYY57WtxFJUv0emRmJSlto23;
Subject: | Re: Scary GN-1 on ebay now......in Texas. |
Wayne,
You have hit on another way you can tell a GN1 from a Piet.
Use the ebay link below and check out the picture of the inside of the cockpit.
You will see an extra upright about 6 or 8 inches from another upright. Grega
had to put the extra upright in so there would be an upright intersecting the
lower longeron at both L/G and lift strut locations.
GN1s also have 2 fairing strips down the side of the fuselage where Piets only
have one.
Skip
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4534270000&category=63677&sspagename=WDVW
BTW - I would assume then that the Pietenpol rear LG strut arrangement would be
stonger than that of the GN-1, as the landing loads would be trasmitted throught
the attach fittings, into the wing struts, through the wings, and then back
down on the other side, thereby creating a box (similar to a biplane wing configuration)
; whereas the GN-1 loads would be completely absorbed by the lower
longeron, putting in it shear between the rear LG attach fitting, and the rear
strut attach point. Just a thought.
-Wayne
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