---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 07/21/05: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:34 AM - Re: more on Continental A-65/75 prop hub torque (Steve Ruse) 2. 09:18 AM - Hello everyone!! () 3. 10:11 AM - Fw: More Bombings in London (Christian Bobka) 4. 12:24 PM - engines (was Hello everyone!) (Oscar Zuniga) 5. 02:49 PM - Re: Rudder issue appears solved (walt evans) 6. 03:45 PM - Gantzergram #1 (Isablcorky@aol.com) 7. 08:12 PM - Re: Hello everyone!! (Dick Navratil) 8. 08:14 PM - Re: What kind of pulleys to use? (Dick Navratil) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:34:06 AM PST US From: "Steve Ruse" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: more on Continental A-65/75 prop hub torque --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Ruse" There are two rows of small "safety screw size" holes on the end of the crank. There are four holes in the aft row, the front row is too far forward to accept a safety screw, it won't line up with the hub nut holes. I installed the hub last night, although my torque wrench doesn't go all the way to 200ft/lbs, so I only torqued it to about 150-160ft/lbs. Interestingly enough, that is where the holes in the hub and crank lined up. I am planning on going to a prop shop today to have them torque it to 200ft/lbs, but I am nearly positive that will just make the holes NOT line up. How do you deal with something like that? I should have marked the hole the safety bolt was in before I took it apart. I bet that is the hole that lined up at 150ft/lbs, as there are only two holes in the crank that this bolt will fit in, and it was in one of them before I took it apart. I don't think adding another 50ft/lbs is going to turn the hub exactly 90 degrees, which is what it would take to line up the other holes. Hope that makes sense without reading it eight times... I did coat the threads and tapered surface with anti-seize compound. That was used last time it was assembled, and I saw that in a service manual somewhere too. There were no cracks that I could see with the naked eye, I did check it closely. Next time I'll probably magnaflux it. Thanks for the tips, I'm not sure what to do at this point. Hopefully the prop shop or someone here will shed some light on it. Steve Ruse N6383J - KFTW -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Christian Bobka Subject: Pietenpol-List: more on Continental A-65/75 prop hub torque --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Christian Bobka" Steve, Make sure you inspect the hub for cracks as the link below says to do. A crack will go from the aft side of the key way to the nearest bolt hole it can find... Also, if you can, tell me how many holes are in the the end of the crank for you to put the safety screw into. It is either 4 or 5. Make sure you look at the end of the crank and not the hub nut... Chris Braumeister, Baumeister, und Inspektor der Flitzer und Flitzermotoren ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Ruse" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Continental A-65/75 prop hub torque > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Ruse" > > I've now heard from several sources that the hub nut should be torqued to > 200 to 225 FOOT/lbs. Everything is back on the plane now, except my wimpy > torque wrench only goes to 150 ft/lbs. I weigh 170lbs, I guess if I hung at > the end of a 14" rod, that should do the trick. Seems to be a popular way > to take care of it. > > http://www.luscombesilvaire.info/pop_topics/propellertorquestandards.htm > > Max, I'm going to go to a prop shop on the field tomorrow to have them do > the final torquing. I might take you up on that welder sometime though. > > My solution was to go buy a cheap 1/2" socket, I was going to drill a hole > through the business end, then insert a rod that could also be inserted > through the hub nut. Should work well, but I'm not sure if I would be able > to drill a 7/16" or larger hole through a socket. The easy solution would > be to just weld a 1/2" or so nut to a bar that will fit in the hub. If you > think you'll need one in the future Max, maybe we should get together and > make a couple of them. I'm probably going to swap props again in a couple > of months. Maybe the prop shop has a smarter tool than that, I'll see > tomorrow. > > Thanks for the help everybody! I have a 6hr cross country flight to make > this weekend! Need to get it done by then. Once again, couldn't have done > it without help from a lot of nice people. > > Steve Ruse > N6383J - KFTW > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dick > Navratil > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 8:47 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Continental A-65/75 prop hub torque > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dick Navratil" > > > I just spent a bit of time with the A-65 manual and couldn't find thatat > torque spec. When I did mine we put a heavy tire iron thru the holes and > had a 6' piece of 1 1/2" pipe sleeve it. It was hard to remove. > Putting it back on we again cranked down pretty hard on it. I don't think > we ever came up with a figure for torque then either. I'm not aware of a > official tool for doing this. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Steve Ruse" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 1:39 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Continental A-65/75 prop hub torque > > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Steve Ruse > > > > > > This evening I'm going to install a cruise prop on my plane (the climb > > prop was > > damaged when the spinner departed the plane in flight, thanks to a sorry > > A&P). > > The cruise prop needed a different size bolt, so I had to remove the hub > > entirely. The only thing I don't know is how much I need to torque the > > hub > > when I put it back on. This is a standard A-65 style tapered shaft hub, > > what > > is the torque spec on the retaining piece that threads onto the engine > > crank? > > > > Also, since there is no nut or bolt on this piece, is there an easy way to > > make > > an adapter that will allow me to use my torque wrench on the hub? How is > > the > > hub typically torqued onto the engine? I don't have access to a welder to > > make > > an adapter. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Steve Ruse > > N6383J - KFTW > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > -- > > -- -- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:18:08 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Hello everyone!! 0.01 SUB_HELLO Subject starts with "Hello" Hello Pieters: I am new in this list and I participate from Uruguay in the South of South America. Pietenpol is a fantastic machine. Since it can take a great weight in its nose I think about using a modern diesel engine with reduction drive. Somebody in the list has proven something similar? Greetings from the sunny and cold south. Juan D. Goyen ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:11:23 AM PST US d="gif'147?scan'147,208,217,147"; a="1195129105:sNHT49482348" From: "Christian Bobka" "Pietenpol" , "Flitzer" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fw: More Bombings in London London attacked again; police confirm 4 blasts 3 subway stations, bus hit by small explosions; Blair appeals for calm MSNBC News Services Updated: 11:51 a.m. ET July 21, 2005 LONDON - Explosions struck three London Underground stations and a bus at midday Thursday in a chilling but less deadly replay of the suicide bombings that killed 56 people two weeks ago. Only one person was reported wounded, but the lunch-hour explosions caused major shock and disruption in the capital and were hauntingly similar to the July 7 bombings by four attackers. The London police commissioner confirmed Thursday that four explosions took place in what he described as =93a very serious incident.=94 =93We=92ve had four explosions =97 four attempts at explosions,=94 Metropolitan Police Commissioner Ian Blair said outside police headquarters at Scotland Yard. =93At the moment the casualty numbers appear to be very low ... the bombs appear to be smaller=94 than those detonated July 7. At a news gathering, Prime Minister Tony Blair appealed for calm. He said the people behind the incidents are trying to "scare people" and "make them anxious." Blair said police were hoping to get the city's transit system "back to normal as quickly as possible." Chase Minutes before the prime minister spoke, police with their weapons drawn escorted a man away from the gates at the end of Downing Street. A police officer drew a firearm and aimed it at a target beyond the range of television cameras. Another officer then led away a man whose black shirt was undone. The man also wore black trousers and appeared to be of Asian or Middle Eastern origin. Meantime, police were searching a London hospital Thursday for a man wearing a blue shirt with wires protruding from a hole in the back, a TV report said. An internal memo at University College Hospital in north London urged staff to watch for the man, described as a black or Asian male, about 6-feet-2, Sky News television reported. No chemicals One witness told Sky TV that a fellow subway passenger told him a backpack exploded at the Warren Street station and there were reports of smoke. Sky TV reported that police said no chemical agents were involved in the explosions. Explosions also were reported at the Shepherds Bush and Oval stations. Emergency teams were sent to all three stations after the incidents, which began at 12:38 p.m. Witnesses said they had seen what could have been a would-be bomber running away after dropping a rucksack on one of the trains. =93We all got off on the platform and the guy just ran and started running up the escalator,=94 one witness who gave her name as Andrea told the BBC. =93Everyone was screaming for someone to stop him. He ran past me...and he ran out of the station. In fact he left a bag on the train,=94 she said. Bus blast Passengers were evacuated off a bus in Hackney, east London, and police cordoned off streets nearby. The bus company said a blast blew out the windows of the bus but a police officer on the scene said there were no signs of damage. A police officer told Reuters: =93The bus driver heard a bang at the back of the bus. He thought it was probably a vehicle that had hit him. =93He stopped at a nearby bus stop and saw a suspect package at the back of the bus.=94 The fire brigade put on protective clothing before moving towards the bus. Closed-circuit TV cameras on Hackney Road showed the No. 26 bus immobilized at a stop with its indicator lights flashing. The area around the bus had been cordoned off. Haunting similarities The incidents paralleled the blasts two weeks ago, which involved explosions at three Underground stations simultaneously =97 quickly followed by a blast on a bus. Those bombings, during the morning rush hour, also occurred in the center of London, hitting the Underground railway from various directions. Thursday=92s incidents, however, were more geographically spread out. London Ambulance said it was called to the Oval station at 12:38 p.m. and Warren Street at 12:45 p.m. The July 7 attacks began at 8:51 a.m. =93People were panicking. But very fortunately the train was only 15 seconds from the station,=94 witness Ivan McCracken told Sky news. McCracken said another passenger at Warren Street claimed he had seen a backpack explode. The bombs which killed 56 people on board three underground trains and a bus in London on July 7 were carried in backpacks, police said. Smell of smoke McCracken said he smelled smoke and that people were panicking and coming into his carriage. He said he spoke to an Italian man who was comforting a woman after the evacuation. =93He said that a man was carrying a rucksack and the rucksack suddenly exploded. It was a minor explosion but enough to blow open the rucksack,=94 McCracken said. =93The man then made an exclamation as if something had gone wrong. At that point everyone rushed from the carriage.=94 Services were shut across the Underground system, which serves 3 million Londoners daily. =93I was in the carriage and we smelt smoke -=97 it was like something was burning,=94 said Losiane Mohellavi, 35, who was evacuated at Warren Street. =93Everyone was panicked and people were screaming. We had to pull the alarm. I am still shaking,=94 Mohellavi said. He told The Associated Press he did not see smoke but rather smelled something similar to an electrical fire. The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:24:47 PM PST US From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: Pietenpol-List: engines (was Hello everyone!) --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" Juan wrote- >I am new in this list and I participate from Uruguay in the South of South >America. Bienvenido! Welcome! >Pietenpol is a fantastic machine. Since it can take a great weight in its >nose I think about using a modern diesel engine with reduction drive. >Somebody in the list has proven something similar? Don't know if anybody has tried a diesel, but they have tried everything up to a Warner 145, which weighs 306 lbs. As a comparison, the "Dieselis" (French conversion of a diesel for experimental aero use) will put out something like 60 HP at 2600 RPM and weighs 298 lbs. If you run it at 3600 RPM and use a reduction drive, it only puts out another 5 HP but moves the power peak. Good luck! Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 02:49:30 PM PST US From: "walt evans" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rudder issue appears solved Jack, Assuming that you have the original rudder bar in the back and pedals in the front,,,the springs are only to keep the cables from flopping down between the bar and forward to the pedals. Ain't life Grand! walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Phillips, Jack To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 7:39 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Rudder issue appears solved Good that you found it! I was wondering about all the right rudder you were having to hold. I have to hold a tiny bit to keep mine straight, but certainly not enough to cause a cramp. If I fly it feet off, the nose will slowly wander off to the left. Not enough to warrant "uglying it up" with a trim tab on the rudder. Finished my 25 hours last night. No squawks on the airplane. I leave for Brodhead via Cleveland tomorrow morning. I'm looking forward to meeting a bunch of the folks I've corresponded with over the years I've been building this thing. Jack Phillips "Icarus Plummet", NX899JP Raleigh, NC Subject: Pietenpol-List: Rudder issue appears solved We have only a few more hours to fly off on the Pietenpol. Then off to Brodhead on Thursday. I have been wrestling with the right-rudder-needing- to-be-held problem now for 36 or so flight hours. The answer was still elusive until today. My leg was cramping from always having to hold right rudder. Anyway, I fly today from Stanton down to Faribault and notice that Cliff Hatz was down below so now knowing I could get a start when it was time to leave, I elected to land and chat with him. While there, I decided I would grab the tiedown kit, folding chair, and pillow from the Cessna 140 as I would need the stuff at Brodhead. I wedged the pillow down to the left of the stick assembly in the front cockpit and then folded the left rudder pedal aft and put the chair down on the pillow fore and aft with one end at the firewall and the other end just forward of full extension on the left rudder input for the aft cockpit's rudder bar. I took off and there was no need to hold right rudder. Like magic, the need to hold it disappeared. I then flew over to Stanton and started to unload. And then I found them. Dale had put springs between the front cockpit's rudder pedals and the firewall. They were incredibly big too. No wonder! As it turns out, he sized them to match the size of spring normally found between the rudder and the tailwheel arms! Yikes! We disconnected the cables between the rudder bar and the front rudder pedals and there must have been a 5 pound pull on the cable due to the spring. Could you imagine if one rudder cable broke or otherwise became disconnected? You would have had a hard over rudder with no way for it to aerodynamically streamline itself. Yikes! I told him "no springs at all". I should have looked sooner. I am embarrassed! Chris ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:45:26 PM PST US From: Isablcorky@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Gantzergram #1 Pieters and Interested, We all received Chuck's early morning e mail telling of his thorough preparations for his flight to Brodhead. I received a call from Chuck at 1043CDT when he told me he was preparing to leave Wichita but still had a few things to do. Had his Baby Oil and 50 lbs of baggage, full tanks of fuel and oil. Increased tire pressure to 15# as he was to use the hard runway. Said he would probably gross out at about 1000#. Told him to hurry before it got too hot but he won't. Received another call from Chuck at 1610CDT from Atchison, Kansas. He had to hanger his Piet for an afternoon thunderbumper for about 1 1/2 hrs. Said he had called ahead and the folks at Blakesburg will save him a ham sandwich and leave the lights on. Said the people at Atchison were great and helped him with everything he needed. He has about 4 hrs to fly tomorrow to get to Brodhead. Attached is a pic of Chuck before take off from Bluebird Hill last July on his way to Brodhead. Corky ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:12:38 PM PST US From: "Dick Navratil" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Hello everyone!! --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dick Navratil" Hi Juan Welcome to the list. I dont have any info on the deisel but I think it would be a good idea. Please keep us informed on what you find. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan D. Goyen" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Hello everyone!! > > > Hello Pieters: > I am new in this list and I participate from Uruguay in the South of South > America. > Pietenpol is a fantastic machine. Since it can take a great weight in its > nose I think about using a modern diesel engine with reduction drive. > Somebody in the list has proven something similar? > Greetings from the sunny and cold south. > Juan D. Goyen > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:14:06 PM PST US From: "Dick Navratil" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What kind of pulleys to use? --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dick Navratil" If you are going to have a radio, you will need headsets. The wind alone is loud. I couldnt imagine a open cockpit without one. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What kind of pulleys to use? > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mark > > >> >>Also, Do people use head sets in a Piet? I have 5 David Clark head >>sets, and need to know if I should try to sell all five in the EAA Fly >>Market, or keep two of them. I plan to hear Corvair noise from my Piet >>if that makes a difference. >> >>John >> > John If you value your hearing you should use a headset in anything. > Noise levels are enough over time to do a great deal of damage. David > Clarks are excellent in noise cancellation and will protect you from that > problem. There are kits out there that can make them an active noise > cancelling and some offer greater comfort. The trick to making a David > Clark comfortable is to pick you out a set and never let anyone else wear > them. The band for me actually seemed to conform to my head and was > comfortable for a very long time. If someone else happened to wear them > for one reason or another, it would bother me for a flight or two. > > What's confortable is so personal its up to you. Check out the new > Lightspeeds. For me they were very comfortable. If I were you though Id > keep 3 David Clarks (just in case one goes bad) and use the cash I got > from selling the two headsets to invest in a good intercom to go in the > Piet so you can enjoy some conversation to who ever happens to get a ride. > > >