---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 12/04/05: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:31 AM - Re: grade 8 bolts (Harvey Rule) 2. 07:19 AM - Flying NX770CG - Video (Rcaprd@aol.com) 3. 08:11 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 (Tim Willis) 4. 08:11 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 (Tim Willis) 5. 01:05 PM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 (w b evans) 6. 04:30 PM - Re: Grade 8 vs AN (gbowen@ptialaska.net) 7. 05:42 PM - Re: Flying NX770CG - Video (John and Phyllis Smoyer) 8. 06:02 PM - Re: Flying NX770CG - Video (Rcaprd@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:31:22 AM PST US From: Harvey Rule Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: grade 8 bolts --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Harvey Rule Douwe Blumberg wrote: > I wonder how much one really saves avoiding AN hardware... maybe the > cost of a couple of nice dinners? > > Douwe MAYBE your life might depend on it;think about that! ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:19:02 AM PST US From: Rcaprd@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Flying NX770CG - Video First of all, I would like to thank the many folks who responded about the first video I made. Your help was extremely valuable in the making of this final version. This has been a HUGE project for me, but I'm glad I did it. It's one of those things that seems like it's never done. I finally finished 'Flying NX770CG', (I'm close to finishing 'Building NX770CG'). For those that have never seen a Pietenpol fly, or for those who have never been in one, this video is for you !! I put the viewer in the Pilot seat to give the sight, sound, and feel of what it's like flying Low & Slow. It's 1hr 50min long, and here are some of the scenes: Engine start, taxi, and Detailed take off & landing sequences, with 8 or 9 camera angles. Some special effects. Lots of Smokin' scenes. Air to Air footage. Background music to accompany many scenes. Lots of Voice Over, explaining what's going on. In air video of Cutting the Toilet Paper, Windmills, Lakes, Hot Air Balloons, Chasing trains, pacing the shadow on the interstate. Some of my 3100 mile cross country flight in '04. River Run - down on the deck. Detailed landing sequence. $20 e-mail me direct, if you are interested. Chuck G. NX770CG ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:11:18 AM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 Pietenpol-List Digest List Source of AN bolts I think one of our site members directed us to a good source for inexpensive new AN bolts and other hardware. Take a look at www.airpartsinc.com in Kansas City, KS. While their catalog only shows sizes up to AN6-20 (3/8"-24), an obscure note on p.11 of their 2005 catalog says they stock up to AN10 (5/8" dia.). I would try them for bolts first. On the subject of hardness, you don't want steel parts that are tempered to great hardness. I recall dropping a 3 inch dia. tool steel form tool (it made the shape of a unique part). I had the tool hardened professionally to maximum (Rockwell) hardness. It shattered on the concrete from a three foot drop. That's a good argument for not hardening your own stuff, or considering the application very thoroghly. It was great for my app., but required special handling. Case hardening the first few thousandths of any bolt can be a good idea, though, for you don't want the threads to be soft and work against each other. As pointed out, rolled threads are stronger than cut threads, in part because they are "work hardened" by the process. I suspect that AN bolts are not only rolled threads, but may be case hardened, as well. At a practical level, while all this discussion is worthwhile, I plan to leave it to the pros and buy AN parts. In a pinch I would not hesitate to use other quality bolts for a while. The practice of changing specific bolts annually is a new thought for inexpeienced me. Is that considered "good practice" or is that someone's (e.g., the FAA) requirement? Tim --------------------------------- Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:11:18 AM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 Pietenpol-List Digest List Source of AN bolts I think one of our site members directed us to a good source for inexpensive new AN bolts and other hardware. Take a look at www.airpartsinc.com in Kansas City, KS. While their catalog only shows sizes up to AN6-20 (3/8"-24), an obscure note on p.11 of their 2005 catalog says they stock up to AN10 (5/8" dia.). I would try them for bolts first. On the subject of hardness, you don't want steel parts that are tempered to great hardness. I recall dropping a 3 inch dia. tool steel form tool (it made the shape of a unique part). I had the tool hardened professionally to maximum (Rockwell) hardness. It shattered on the concrete from a three foot drop. That's a good argument for not hardening your own stuff, or considering the application very thoroghly. It was great for my app., but required special handling. Case hardening the first few thousandths of any bolt can be a good idea, though, for you don't want the threads to be soft and work against each other. As pointed out, rolled threads are stronger than cut threads, in part because they are "work hardened" by the process. I suspect that AN bolts are not only rolled threads, but may be case hardened, as well. At a practical level, while all this discussion is worthwhile, I plan to leave it to the pros and buy AN parts. In a pinch I would not hesitate to use other quality bolts for a while. The practice of changing specific bolts annually is a new thought for inexpeienced me. Is that considered "good practice" or is that someone's (e.g., the FAA) requirement? Tim --------------------------------- Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:05:41 PM PST US From: "w b evans" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 "Pietenpol-List Digest List" My understanding is that there is hardness and toughness. I read where AN bolts can be bent into a knot , cold, without breaking. Don't think a grade 8 will do that. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Tim Willis To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com ; Pietenpol-List Digest List Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 11:10 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 Source of AN bolts I think one of our site members directed us to a good source for inexpensive new AN bolts and other hardware. Take a look at www.airpartsinc.com in Kansas City, KS. While their catalog only shows sizes up to AN6-20 (3/8"-24), an obscure note on p.11 of their 2005 catalog says they stock up to AN10 (5/8" dia.). I would try them for bolts first. On the subject of hardness, you don't want steel parts that are tempered to great hardness. I recall dropping a 3 inch dia. tool steel form tool (it made the shape of a unique part). I had the tool hardened professionally to maximum (Rockwell) hardness. It shattered on the concrete from a three foot drop. That's a good argument for not hardening your own stuff, or considering the application very thoroghly. It was great for my app., but required special handling. Case hardening the first few thousandths of any bolt can be a good idea, though, for you don't want the threads to be soft and work against each other. As pointed out, rolled threads are stronger than cut threads, in part because they are "work hardened" by the process. I suspect that AN bolts are not only rolled threads, but may be case hardened, as well. At a practical level, while all this discussion is worthwhile, I plan to leave it to the pros and buy AN parts. In a pinch I would not hesitate to use other quality bolts for a while. The practice of changing specific bolts annually is a new thought for inexpeienced me. Is that considered "good practice" or is that someone's (e.g., the FAA) requirement? Tim Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:30:49 PM PST US From: "gbowen@ptialaska.net" pietenpol-list-digest@matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Grade 8 vs AN INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.0000 1.0000 -4.4912 --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "gbowen@ptialaska.net" I think I remember reading in the Sacramento Sky Ranch tech book that AN bolts have the threads actually pressed into the bolt vs store bought grade 8's that have the threads cut into the bolt shank. Think the tensile, elongation and hardness are the same but this issue of how the threads are cut or pressed is critical for failure. Sky Ranch also has a good section on the amount of torque needed to get the bolt to right elongation for maximum clamping without overstressing to failure. Recommend this book to anyone building a homebuilt. Gordon Bowen Homer AK Original Message: ----------------- From: w b evans wbeevans@verizon.net Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 My understanding is that there is hardness and toughness. I read where AN bolts can be bent into a knot , cold, without breaking. Don't think a grade 8 will do that. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Tim Willis To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com ; Pietenpol-List Digest List Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 11:10 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 12/03/05 Source of AN bolts I think one of our site members directed us to a good source for inexpensive new AN bolts and other hardware. Take a look at www.airpartsinc.com in Kansas City, KS. While their catalog only shows sizes up to AN6-20 (3/8"-24), an obscure note on p.11 of their 2005 catalog says they stock up to AN10 (5/8" dia.). I would try them for bolts first. On the subject of hardness, you don't want steel parts that are tempered to great hardness. I recall dropping a 3 inch dia. tool steel form tool (it made the shape of a unique part). I had the tool hardened professionally to maximum (Rockwell) hardness. It shattered on the concrete from a three foot drop. That's a good argument for not hardening your own stuff, or considering the application very thoroghly. It was great for my app., but required special handling. Case hardening the first few thousandths of any bolt can be a good idea, though, for you don't want the threads to be soft and work against each other. As pointed out, rolled threads are stronger than cut threads, in part because they are "work hardened" by the process. I suspect that AN bolts are not only rolled threads, but may be case hardened, as well. At a practical level, while all this discussion is worthwhile, I plan to leave it to the pros and buy AN parts. In a pinch I would not hesitate to use other quality bolts for a while. The practice of changing specific bolts annually is a new thought for inexpeienced me. Is that considered "good practice" or is that someone's (e.g., the FAA) requirement? Tim -- Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:42:59 PM PST US From: "John and Phyllis Smoyer" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Flying NX770CG - Video Dear Chuck, I'd be very interested in the "building of" video. Please let me know whenever it's available. Thanks. John Smoyer jpsmoyer@verizon.net ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:02:13 PM PST US From: Rcaprd@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Flying NX770CG - Video In a message dated 12/4/2005 7:43:38 PM Central Standard Time, jpsmoyer@verizon.net writes: Dear Chuck, I'd be very interested in the "building of" video. Please let me know whenever it's available. Thanks. John Smoyer John, I will try to remember to let you know when it's done, but it probably not be done before Christmas. I'm going into great detail about the construction. Ya just can't imiagine how much time it takes me to do this video stuff !! I will certainly post it to the Matronix Pietenpol Group, when it's done. Chuck Gantzer