---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 02/03/06: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:45 AM - Re: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? (Peter W Johnson) 2. 03:50 AM - Re: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? (Peter W Johnson) 3. 04:38 AM - Re: Re: Steel tube fuselage (Sterling) 4. 04:59 AM - Re: (DETAILS ABOUT) ribs, etc. on Barntormers.com (Eric Williams) 5. 05:07 AM - More about the Barnstormers stuff (Eric Williams) 6. 07:02 AM - www.cpc-world.com (robison@mchsi.com) 7. 07:12 AM - Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! (Glenn Thomas) 8. 07:16 AM - Re: Steel tube fuselage (Glenn Thomas) 9. 07:25 AM - Re: Re: Steel tube fuselage (robison@mchsi.com) 10. 08:11 AM - Re: Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! (RAMPEYBOY@aol.com) 11. 08:33 AM - Re: Re: Steel tube fuselage (John Hofmann) 12. 09:05 AM - EAA quilt contest (Oscar Zuniga) 13. 09:23 AM - Re: EAA quilt contest (Jim Markle) 14. 10:07 AM - Re: EAA quilt contest (DJ Vegh) 15. 04:13 PM - Re: Stromberg NA-S3 Carb manual (BARNSTMR@aol.com) 16. 06:17 PM - Re: Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! (Glenn Thomas) 17. 06:45 PM - Re: EAA quilt contest (Sterling) 18. 09:44 PM - fuel tank sealer (Dick Navratil) 19. 11:07 PM - Re: fuel tank sealer. (Gary Gower) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:45:19 AM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? Scott, I am in Hanoi at the moment and my ADSL when down and won=92t re-sync. I shall be back home on Tuesday so all will be working then. Sorry for temporary loss of the site. Cheers Peter Wonthaggi Australia HYPERLINK "http://www.cpc-world.com/"http://www.cpc-world.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott S. Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2006 11:26 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? Does anybody know anything about Peter's Pietenpol website? It's one of the best I've seen with construction pics, even has a materials list. It's been down for like two weeks now. Think it's HYPERLINK "http://www.cpc-world.com"http://www.cpc-world.com. Somebody let me know if I've got it wrong. Scott in TN -- -- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:50:47 AM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? Sterling, What do you need to know? Answer off list if you like. Cheers Peter. vk3eka@yahoo.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2006 8:08 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? DO NOT ARCHIVE This is off-topic and of no interst to the rest of the list, but is there anyway I can get some info from Peter in regard to his trip to Hanoi? I "worked" in Vietnam in 1971-1972 and I've always wanted to do a third tour (without people shooting at me) in the Hanoi area. Thanks, Sterling Brooks Knot-2-Shabby Airport ----- Original Message ----- From: HYPERLINK "mailto:covertspecialops@gmail.com"Scott S. "mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com"pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2006 9:16 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? Thanks for the info. On 1/31/06, Mike Green wrote: Scott, Just got an email from Peter and he's in Hanoi ,Vietnam on holidays at the moment. Just keep checking back, I'm sure he'll have it up and running again when he gets back. Mike Green Romsey, Victoria AUSTRALIA ----- Original Message ----- From: HYPERLINK "mailto:covertspecialops@gmail.com" \nScott S. \npietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 3:25 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Pietenpol website info?? Does anybody know anything about Peter's Pietenpol website? It's one of the best I've seen with construction pics, even has a materials list. It's been down for like two weeks now. Think it's HYPERLINK "http://www.cpc-world.com/" \nhttp://www.cpc-world.com. Somebody let me know if I've got it wrong. Scott in TN -- -- ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:38:31 AM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Steel tube fuselage --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Sterling" DO NOT ARCHIVE A friend of mine, Jim Raeder the former R&D Director at Avid Aircraft did exactly this on an Avid Magnum he built. He did this to keep rust from forming on the inside wall of the steel tubing. I'm not certain there is any good way to treat the inside wall of the tubing other than this method and it seems if you live in a "rusty" climate like on the Gulf Coast, it would be a good idea. Sterling Brooks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenn Thomas" Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 10:09 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Steel tube fuselage > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas" > > > Hi, > This is not based on any practical experience but from reading the > Aircraft Welding book I got from the EAA site. They talk about > pressurizing the tube frame with nitrogen, waiting a few minutes for the > nitrogen to dilute the air and then purging, and repeating that process a > few times and finally leaving 50 lbs of nitrogen in the frame. Seems like > a good safety check as well as a rust inhibitor. > > -------- > Glenn Thomas > N????? > http://www.flyingwood.com > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=9257#9257 > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:59:25 AM PST US From: "Eric Williams" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: (DETAILS ABOUT) ribs, etc. on Barntormers.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Eric Williams" Hi Hans, This is an old project that I am selling. I had put a message about it on this list a few weeks ago with all the details. I'll go ahead and re-insert it below. Please feel free to ask me any questions. Thanks, Eric. *****(original message)************* Hello you guys, I have been sitting on a Piet project for 3 years that I have realized I will likely never get around to finishing. I love Pietenpols but had to finally admit to myself that, at this time, it just isn't the right project for me. I have a new job that requires a lot of time and with two kids, there just isn't a whole lot of extra time to go around. I do have an old straight-tail C-150 so at least there's something to fly. So anyway, let me describe the project. First of all, I didn't build it. I bought it from a friend who knew the builder and I did get to talk with him (the original builder) once. It includes a completed fuselage with just the wood parts - no metal fittings at all and no gear. It is the original type short fuse with the bottom side that has the greater curvature. The best that I can recall is it's 13'-6" long. There is a full set of completed wing ribs and a complete set of tail surfaces (tail, rudder, horiz. stab., elevators - no fabric). One thing I want to be clear about is that the fuselage and all other parts were made from Douglas Fir. The thing about the fuse is that the builder decreased the longeron dimensions from 1" x 1" to 3/4" x 3/4". He said it was due to the greater strength of Doug Fir. This is true but it always concerned me because I felt it was a little too much of a dimensional reduction. He said that he and a friend built two projects at the same time and the other guy completed his and apparently it is flying fine - I don't really know. I just want to be honest about it all. Also, he used doorskin type ply on the fuse sides and one side got wet during my move from Illinois to Florida and delaminated. I had always planned to strip off the doorskins and replace it with real A/C ply. So that's the story. I figure if I get $300 for the whole thing I'll be happy. I live in Northeast Florida and since it's not a high-dollar project I would really prefer that the buyer picks it up but I could help out for a short distance. I hope you guys don't mind me trying to sell this on this forum but I figured the real Piet enthusiasts are you guys so I'd give you all first crack at it. Probably emailing me privately would be the best way to handle responses so the list isn't tied up. Thanks. Eric W. >From: Hans Vander Voort >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ribs, etc. on Barntormers.com >Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 14:49:25 -0600 > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Hans Vander Voort > > > >Mike, > >Delaminated plywood sides? >Sounds like Home depot stuff, could the original builder be your >"Fisherman" > >Hans. > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:28 AM PST US From: "Eric Williams" Subject: Pietenpol-List: More about the Barnstormers stuff --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Eric Williams" I also added some pictures of the project to the Barnstormers ad last week. Eric (do not archive) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:02:33 AM PST US From: robison@mchsi.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: www.cpc-world.com --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: robison@mchsi.com Peter said he'd be back on Tuesday and his website will be up and running then or soon after. Scott Robison ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:43 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! From: "Glenn Thomas" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas" Finally got around to reading the archives. Wow! Not sure what his goal with this plane was. Doesn't seem like anyone I've ever talked to on the list. The good news is the folks in the forum seemed to have made a full recovery from the angry days, (I'm new and never saw anthing like that in my few months here). If I ever start making dillusional sounds like the Fisherman please be as blunt with me. I consider this list more of a resource than a source of entertainment (although it's fun to read). I think he liked to just pose a dumb idea and anxiously await the responses. -------- Glenn Thomas N????? http://www.flyingwood.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=9331#9331 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:16:44 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Steel tube fuselage From: "Glenn Thomas" --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas" Again, I'm referring to the Aircraft Welding book. The alternative to filling the tubing with a rust inhibiting gas is to put linseed oil inside the tube and rotate it to coat it and then pour out the excess. (Messy) Checking the pressure will be a heads-up on a cracked weld though. -------- Glenn Thomas N????? http://www.flyingwood.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=9334#9334 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:25:43 AM PST US From: robison@mchsi.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Steel tube fuselage --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: robison@mchsi.com If you read some of the articles by EAA, boiled linsead oil has been used for years to treat the inside of steel tubing. I treated my entire fuselage by drilling a small pinhole in each tube. I then inserted the warm oil into each tube with a syringe that I purchased from my local feed store. I closed then hole with a gas torch and filler rod. After consulting with a few tech counselors I've concluded that next time I will only do the longerons since they are the only tubes that will likely collect mpisture. Just my opinion for what it's worth. If you decide to pressurize the tubing and you get a pinhole or crack in one joint that can't be seen by the naked eye will you then disassemble the aircraft to find the crack? Sounds expensive. For what we do and the planes we build. In my opinion this is over kill. You can purchase boiled linsead oil from your local hardware or farm supply store. It's cheap, quick, and easy. Treat your tubing with it and it will not rust in our life time. Scott Robison Steel Tube GN-1 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:11:44 AM PST US From: RAMPEYBOY@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! Nice website Glenn. Also good links, and photos of other Piets! Boyce ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:33:28 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Steel tube fuselage From: John Hofmann --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: John Hofmann Yes, boiled linseed oil has been the standard. Also, Polyfiber (Stits) makes a tubing sealer which is about the same. In restoration work it has been common practice to drill a small hole in the front and rear of a fuselage, and plug one of them with a PK screw. Insert a liberal amount of sealer (a quart or so) Then rotisserie the fuselage around for a couple of days and drain out from the opposite end and replug with the PK screw or a spot weld. I have found that manufacturers of yore used to plan for this and made holes in the tubing for oil travel in weld clusters so it is easy to get good penetration throughout. Sometimes, too good, as you can get bleeding of the oil through the clusters that can make primer almost impossible to stick without liberal doses of reducer. I have cut into old fuselages and still found them wet, sticky and rust free on the inside after 50+ years. -john- > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: robison@mchsi.com > > If you read some of the articles by EAA, boiled linsead oil has been used for > years to treat the inside of steel tubing. I treated my entire fuselage by > drilling a small pinhole in each tube. I then inserted the warm oil into each > tube with a syringe that I purchased from my local feed store. I closed then > hole with a gas torch and filler rod. After consulting with a few tech > counselors I've concluded that next time I will only do the longerons since > they are the only tubes that will likely collect mpisture. Just my opinion > for > what it's worth. If you decide to pressurize the tubing and you get a pinhole > or crack in one joint that can't be seen by the naked eye will you then > disassemble the aircraft to find the crack? Sounds expensive. For what we do > and the planes we build. In my opinion this is over kill. You can purchase > boiled linsead oil from your local hardware or farm supply store. It's cheap, > quick, and easy. Treat your tubing with it and it will not rust in our life > time. > > Scott Robison > Steel Tube GN-1 > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:05:40 AM PST US From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" Anybody here a quilter, or know of someone who is? They could submit the AirCamper graphic, or the TACO logo, or similar graphic as an entry in the EAA's quilt block contest: http://www.airventure.org/2006/events/quilt_contest.html The Pietenpol logo at http://users.aol.com/bpanews/index.html , with bright colors, would be a good one. Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:23:23 AM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle Hey, my wife quilts....good idea. I would caution against using anything from the Grant MaClaren site (users.aol.com/bpanews) below. He's VERY sensitive to people reproducing what he has published. Jim in Plano -----Original Message----- >From: Oscar Zuniga >Sent: Feb 3, 2006 11:04 AM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" > >Anybody here a quilter, or know of someone who is? They could submit the >AirCamper graphic, or the TACO logo, or similar graphic as an entry in the >EAA's quilt block contest: > >http://www.airventure.org/2006/events/quilt_contest.html > >The Pietenpol logo at http://users.aol.com/bpanews/index.html , with bright >colors, would be a good one. > >Oscar Zuniga >San Antonio, TX >mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com >website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:07:35 AM PST US From: "DJ Vegh" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "DJ Vegh" I've got the high resolution file for the TACO logo I created if anyone wants it DJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Markle" Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 10:22 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle > > Hey, my wife quilts....good idea. > > I would caution against using anything from the Grant MaClaren site (users.aol.com/bpanews) below. He's VERY sensitive to people reproducing what he has published. > > Jim in Plano > > > -----Original Message----- > >From: Oscar Zuniga > >Sent: Feb 3, 2006 11:04 AM > >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > >Subject: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest > > > >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" > > > >Anybody here a quilter, or know of someone who is? They could submit the > >AirCamper graphic, or the TACO logo, or similar graphic as an entry in the > >EAA's quilt block contest: > > > >http://www.airventure.org/2006/events/quilt_contest.html > > > >The Pietenpol logo at http://users.aol.com/bpanews/index.html , with bright > >colors, would be a good one. > > > >Oscar Zuniga > >San Antonio, TX > >mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > >website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 04:13:11 PM PST US From: BARNSTMR@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Stromberg NA-S3 Carb manual Kirk, I have it in my copy of the Continental A50, A65, A75, A80 maintenance and overhaul manual. My scanner at home is down, but I can take it to work on Monday to scan it. If you need it before then, check on the Sky Ranch website or the flybaby website. Sorry I dont remember the URL, but if you'll GOOGLE it they should pop up. Terry B. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:17:31 PM PST US From: "Glenn Thomas" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! Thanks, I made it to share ideas and get comments on things I'm building when I'm not sure if it's right. There's nothing there yet but hopefully that will change. How far along are you with yours? (or are you already flying it) Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: RAMPEYBOY@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:06 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: The Fisherman Surfaces !!! Nice website Glenn. Also good links, and photos of other Piets! Boyce ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 06:45:04 PM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Sterling" I'm sure DJ's design for the TACO logo would win and I'm happy DJ was so gracious to design the logo for us and offer it for the quilt contest. Thanks DJ for your contribution... Sterling (P.S. Y'all who have never been to DJ's house would be very impressed by all his handywork! Super, super stuff. ;) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Oscar Zuniga" Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:04 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: EAA quilt contest > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" > > > Anybody here a quilter, or know of someone who is? They could submit the > AirCamper graphic, or the TACO logo, or similar graphic as an entry in the > EAA's quilt block contest: > > http://www.airventure.org/2006/events/quilt_contest.html > > The Pietenpol logo at http://users.aol.com/bpanews/index.html , with > bright colors, would be a good one. > > Oscar Zuniga > San Antonio, TX > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:44:52 PM PST US From: "Dick Navratil" Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuel tank sealer Since my plane is down for the winter I am doing some maint and upgrades. One of the items on my checklist was to remove the fuel tank and rinse out. Doing this I got a big suprise. I had used a fuel tank sealant when I built the tank out of aluminum. I used a boreoscope to check the inside of the tank and all is holding up well, but, when I rinsed out the tank some good sized pieces of sealant washed out. This didn't come from the ends where I had sealed but from where the liquid had dribbled on the sides when I poured it into the tank. Many of the pieces of debris could easily have clogged the fuel line. A couple of major points here. Is a tank sealant relly a good idea? I havent resolved that for myself yet, but I'm thinking no at this point. In order to prevent any future problems, I tapped out the 1/4" fuel bushing to 3/8" and ordered a finger strainer for inside the tank. The strainer is approx 2" high. When building a new tank it might be good to install that strainer to start. Having said that, it is an item that also should be removed and cleaned with each annual. Dick N. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:07:22 PM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: fuel tank sealer. Hello Dick, Here in our factory, my brother Larry is a good welder, so as we fly and build airplanes, once in a while we get some weld jobs for friends pilots... A friend brought once an alu wing tank from a Kitfox to see if can be fixed, the idea of the owner was to make an "inspection window" in the tank to see why it cloged often and didnt transfer to the header,... later close-weld the window. Not easy to do, with the thin aluminum used in that tank, We though was better to make a new one, so we opened it (cut, no heat), what we found was that all the sealer inside was peeling off. This was a factory demo, that the owner bought in the spot. so (I think) was sealed well... Was a white material. Also I read from the VW conversion list by Mr. Bob "the other" Hoover, by the way a very experienced home builder, that the sealant should be used only when the tank was riveted instead of welded, using the sealant as a "gasket" betwen the two areas to rivet. Also he uses only one brand of sealer, but cant remember the name now. We never have used sealer, we weld and check twice all the welds in the tanks. Just for what is worth, hope it helps you. Saludos Gary Gower. Dick Navratil wrote: Since my plane is down for the winter I am doing some maint and upgrades. One of the items on my checklist was to remove the fuel tank and rinse out. Doing this I got a big suprise. I had used a fuel tank sealant when I built the tank out of aluminum. I used a boreoscope to check the inside of the tank and all is holding up well, but, when I rinsed out the tank some good sized pieces of sealant washed out. This didn't come from the ends where I had sealed but from where the liquid had dribbled on the sides when I poured it into the tank. Many of the pieces of debris could easily have clogged the fuel line. A couple of major points here. Is a tank sealant relly a good idea? I havent resolved that for myself yet, but I'm thinking no at this point. In order to prevent any future problems, I tapped out the 1/4" fuel bushing to 3/8" and ordered a finger strainer for inside the tank. The strainer is approx 2" high. When building a new tank it might be good to install that strainer to start. Having said that, it is an item that also should be removed and cleaned with each annual. Dick N. ---------------------------------