Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:02 AM - when is Brodhead this year? (Douwe Blumberg)
2. 06:02 AM - Re: Re: CAD programs (Jim Markle)
3. 06:29 AM - Brodhead Dates (Michael D Cuy)
4. 06:31 AM - Re: when is Brodhead this year? (Egan, John)
5. 06:41 AM - error in my posting ! (Michael D Cuy)
6. 07:06 AM - Re: error in my posting ! (Rick Holland)
7. 07:40 AM - Re: CAD programs (Roman Bukolt)
8. 07:54 AM - Re: Re: CAD programs (Sayre, William G)
9. 10:24 AM - Design CAD Express (Michael Turrell)
10. 05:52 PM - Re: (Tom Stinemetze)
11. 06:16 PM - Build or Fly? (Tom Stinemetze)
12. 06:38 PM - Re: (Robison)
13. 06:42 PM - CAD (Rcaprd@aol.com)
14. 08:01 PM - first rides (Oscar Zuniga)
15. 10:11 PM - Making Metal Fittings (Catdesign)
Message 1
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| Subject: | when is Brodhead this year? |
Can someone give me the Brodhead dates for this year?
thanks,
Douwe
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: RE: CAD programs |
RE: CAD programsWOW! Cool stuff Bill! I want THAT CAD program! But....I was
in a local used book chain store yesterday and they had 2 copies of Turbo Cad
V6 for $20 each....that would save me $4,980.....better go with Turbo Cad...
Those hinges look better in the drawing than they did when I made them!
Very interesting....thaks for sharing Bill!
Jim in Plano TX
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Church
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 7:32 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: RE: CAD programs
Jim Markle wrote:
...drawing programs like AutoCad. (Maybe because I'm too lazy to learn one,
but I'll bet there are some good ones out there nowadays.)
Jim (and others),
As an example of the CAD programs "out there nowadays", take a look at the hinge
drawings I was able to produce using the latest in CAD. These are JPG images
of the type of "drawings" done in CAD nawadays. This program, called SolidWorks
(which I am just learning how to use) models everything in 3D. Traditional
"drawings" (i.e. three views, orthagonal projections, etc.) are automatically
produced with the click of a button, once the "model" is built.
As I said, I am just learning how to use the program, so as a form of "practice"
during off-work hours I am slowly building a CAD model of the Air Camper airframe.
When I finally finish, I will share the model with the list. Of course,
that might take a little while - so far I have only completed the horizontal
stabilizer.
Oh yeah, one drawback.the program will set you back about $5000.
<<my hinge assembly 1.jpg>> <<my hinge assembly explode.jpg>>
P.S.
Does the hinge look familiar, Jim? Thanks for sharing your grid paper sketch
of your hinge.
Bill
Message 3
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Douwe--- generally it is the weekend before Oshkosh begins but since this
year's EAA begins on Friday
the 24th of July I'll bet that would be the first of the two to three day
Brodhead gathering. The two events
overlapped in 1998 as I recall also. Maybe we'll hear a more certain date
from someone else.
Mike C.
EAA's web site says this today: 5 Months 2 Weeks 3 Days to EAA AirVenture
Oshkosh 2006! July 24 - 30, 2006
Message 4
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| Subject: | when is Brodhead this year? |
Hi,
Check out the chapter website at www.eaa431.org. The event is July
21-23.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe
Blumberg
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 7:59 AM
To: pietenpolgroup
Subject: Pietenpol-List: when is Brodhead this year=3F
=09
=09
Can someone give me the Brodhead dates for this year=3F
thanks,
Douwe
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Message 5
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| Subject: | error in my posting ! |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Aggggh---what a nucklehead ! I was looking at February's calandar instead
of July for the Brodhead dates.
Thanks, John for the correct dates ! (Friday July 21st, 22nd. & 23rd
with Oshkosh beginning on Monday July 24th)
Mike C.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: error in my posting ! |
No problemo Mike, we all have our senior moments occasionally.
RH
no not archive
On 2/7/06, Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <
> Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>
> Aggggh---what a nucklehead ! I was looking at February's calandar
> instead
> of July for the Brodhead dates.
>
> Thanks, John for the correct dates ! (Friday July 21st, 22nd. & 23rd
> with Oshkosh beginning on Monday July 24th)
>
> Mike C.
>
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: CAD programs |
If you want an easy to learn CAD program that doesn't cost $5000, check out Design
CAD by Upperspace.
It includes a 460 page manual that clearly explains every key stroke. If I remember
right the cost of mine was lest than $300. They also make a cheapy called
Modelcad for designing model airplanes but works fine for any 2D drw. for under
$100.
Do not archive
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: RE: CAD programs |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Sayre, William G" <william.g.sayre@boeing.com>
As an inexpensive introduction to CAD programs (and certainly capable of
2D pattern development) look at CadStd Lite at http://www.cadstd.com/.
The Lite version is free and the complete Pro version is only $25.
CadStd Lite can export files as DXF so you can share your drawings to
your friends with other CAD programs like Autocad.
Bill Sayre
Message 9
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| Subject: | Design CAD Express |
Someone mentioned Design CAD Express at around $300 ,I bought mine at Staples for under $50 Canadian .The close to 400 page manual and training cd that came with the program make it a real buy in my humble opinion.http://www.upperspace.com
2cents,Mike
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List: |
How did you resolve the accuracy of transferring your computer
image to print?
How accurate is it and how accurate do you need it? I've had
difficulties with
the printing process altering the drawing and ending up with odd
dimensions on
at least one axis.
Jim Ash
Jim:
Most of the good CAD programs out there will allow you to either print
out to a specific scale (i.e. 1 inch equals 1 inch for full scale) or
opt to make the print fit a specific size of media. If that is not
working for you then you may have a conflict in communication between
your printer (plotter) and the computer. You can always print to file
and then take the plot file to a nearby facility dealing in commercial
blueprinting to have it accurately plotted out. Most modern print shops
can do this.
As to what CAD software to use - it just depends on who you ask.
Autocad and MicroStation are the two big names but you are talking about
$2,000-$3,000 for a single user license and a BIG learning curve. I ran
across one I learned quickly and easily a few years ago called
DesignCAD. It will draw in both 2D and 3D if desired and is currently
selling new for about $89, See
http://www.imsisoft.com/faminfo.asp?fam=2 for more information. Since I
started drawing in CAD I have about forgotten how to do it with straight
edge and pen.
Tom Stinemetze
McPherson, Kansas
http://www.eaa1344.com/Projects/Stinemetze/stinemetze.htm
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
Message 11
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For those of you who are following my builder's link there will probably
not be a lot going on for a while. I have the fortunate opportunity to
start my flying lessons this week by taking instruction from a family
friend who also taught one of my sons to fly. Won't have the time OR
THE MONEY to build while that is going on. I don't have the time to go
into the hassle of getting my 3rd class medical but I've got it now and
can't wait to get started.
Tom Stinemetze
McPherson, Kansas
http://www.eaa1344.com/Projects/Stinemetze/stinemetze.htm
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List: |
What about the free CAD program that you can download from e-machine shop. It
will let you store files and print from it and it's 3D.
Scott Robison
Message 13
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Yesterday, I bought TurboCAD Deluxe Version 11, at Best Buy, for $100. It
says it has Powerful 2D & 3D CAD. It has one thick manual, and one CD.
Haven't loaded it yet...seems I just added another iron to the fire !!
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Message 14
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Yeah, sure, I'd love to move the hands of the clock back to when I was 9 or
10 years old and our family friend Wally took us out to the old Laredo AFB
Auxiliary Field (later to be Laredo Airport) and gave me my first airplane
ride ever, in a Luscombe. I sat in his lap and I'll never, ever forget the
feeling and the impressions I had as I watched the brown grass disappear
beneath the wheels, as I looked out the side windows. I don't remember what
we saw, or flew over, or what maneuvers we did- but I'll never forget the
feeling of watching the ground melt away beneath the tires of that shiny
airplane as Wally manipulated the controls and we took to the air. And I've
never lost that feeling, that same feeling I get whenever I fly a J-3 or a
Super Cub, or anything with an open cockpit. You hang your head over to the
side and watch the ground melt away under the fat little tires...
This is why I want to fly Pietenpols, and why you do, too...
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 15
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| Subject: | Making Metal Fittings |
All this discussion about CAD has prompted me to speak up and relate my experience
with making fitting per the drawings. I drew up all the fittings using TurboCAD.
I like TurboCAD and will likely upgrade to their 3D version when the
price comes down.
I knew from Mike Cuy's posts on this list that many of the fittings need to be
a bit longer. On some fittings I think this is due to not allowing for the bend
allowance when they were drawn. On others, I just don't know why. So when
drawing each fitting I included the bend allowance (even put in bend lines) as
shown in "Making Fittings" by Tony Bingelis ( The Sport Plane Builder Book
from the EAA [catch that reference Mike?]).
It worked well to glue on the printed fitting templates and cut them out. After
cutting, grinding then sanding you end up with a fitting that is very close
to the drawing. The crosshair in the bolt hole is very helpful in placing a dimple
exactly where the plans show the center of the hole. But there is the problem,
not all the fittings I've made seem to fit my fuselage and tail like I
think they should. Fortunately, a much wiser builder then I told me not to make
the fitting until I need them, just for this reason. I think the problem lies
in the way the plans were drawn and the inaccuracies of building. Now, I
am not saying the plans are wrong. All I am saying is that in places the fitting
could fit the location better.
So here is what I now do. I make a template using cardboard, paper, light aluminum
or whatever is handy, right on the completed structural element. I make
my template large enough to layout the holes where the plans say to do it. Then
I adjust the center of these holes to the best spot on the structure. Usually
this is to the centerline of the wood member or away from a glue joint. I
then adjust the outside dimension of the fitting to maintain the setback away
from the edge. Holes hanging out in space I located per the drawing but a bit
farther away (ie longer tabs, as Mike suggests). I mostly follow the plans
but the CAD drawings were, for me, a waste of time. The thing about fittings
is you need to look at what they are supposed to do and make them fit your plane
not the plans.
If I can, I do all the bending before drilling any holes. As for holes, leave
them undersize clamp them in place and drill the matching holes on the wood member.
Then I do the final trimming down to the correct shape and size. On doubled
up fittings (you know where there is one on the inside and one on the outside)
only drill holes on one then clamp both on the fuselage drill an undersize
hole all the way through the other fitting. Then enlarge the hole to the proper
size and then finish to the shape and size.
That's the way I see it. Now I haven't made that many fittings yet so this might
be my problem and more experienced builders may not encounter this. I'm new
to metal work but I'm finding the learning curve to be fun. My wood construction
is as close as I can come but trust me I know it's not perfect.
Oh, one more thing, because I feel that this advice, to not build the fittings
first, has saved me a bunch of money, I have chosen to not give out the CAD files
because I would feel terrible if someone used them to make the fittings and
they did not fit.
Sorry about the long post
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
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